Related
See this link for details:
http://www.mypda.com.cn/info/show_info.asp?infoid=1491[/url]
Anonymous said:
See this link for details:
http://www.mypda.com.cn/info/show_info.asp?infoid=1491
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Appreciate the ++ search. One thing I have noticed is the inconsistency in the "Start button icon". Everyimage looked different!
I mean, this could be fake or even made up pics :roll:
Are we ready for another BGates newbie :roll:
You got that right Cyber mate.
Will the companies like FONO, Axiom, Comtel or Plug-ins void our warranty if we do decide to move to 2005 Mobile?
No it won't
Every Pocket PC release since CE2.11 (except for 2003SE) has comeout in the Spring. Along with new devices. This time will be no different.
after the win mobile 2005 comes out - will it be posible to upgrade our devices or they (the phone makers) should fit the win 2005 (by software changes) for the device first?
(as you guessed it - im new and my first device is the mini )
Looks to me like that start button is still the size of a pea - which means if you are using your hand on the home screen, its almost impossible to hit that in the corner. And this suposed to be a serious, native PHONE OS? Wow.....
skagen said:
Looks to me like that start button is still the size of a pea - which means if you are using your hand on the home screen, its almost impossible to hit that in the corner. And this suposed to be a serious, native PHONE OS? Wow.....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You've obviously never used WM2003. It's the same size as current version. You can touch the text or logo to access it and it's perfectly usable.
I would be nice to be proved wrong, but I very much doubt this will be made available on current devices. Their product life is just too short. It also looks like the UI is designed to use extra programmable menu buttons at the bottom of the screen, as on MS Smartphones. Few PPC PE devices have enough hardware buttons to support this.
Wrong. I have an I-mate Jam Phone (WM 2003SE). As I said, it is egnonomically retarded to make the HEART of entry into the device a tiny button crammed in one corner and taking up like 1/50th of the screen space.
If you were trying to make it harder to touch - you couldn't enough said.
And that is the START button? Wow! I'd love to know what Microsoft spends all their millions of dollars on usability budget on. That placement & size of the start button would get you an "F" if you were a student in design school. Its THAT elementary.
Its not just the "Start" button on the whole, the entire Win 2003 PPC OS is just very poorly sized considering that is suppesed to be a phone OS. Look at the notifications. You have to hit a thin ass line if you plan on turning it off. Want to close a windows, its a tiny ass x squeezed in the corner or a screen? I mean, hello.....
The should have tested these things with thumbs as well as styluses. Elementary design principles. Very elementary.
But that is exactly what heppens when you take a blinkered mentality ("we are Microsoft make Windows software for PC's". We must have a "Start" button - and put everything in there.") into the design of a thumb-operated phone.
skagen said:
Wrong. I have an I-mate Jam Phone (WM 2003SE). As I said, it is egnonomically retarded to make the HEART of entry into the device a tiny button crammed in one corner and taking up like 1/50th of the screen space.
If you were trying to make it harder to touch - you couldn't enough said.
And that is the START button? Wow! I'd love to know what Microsoft spends all their millions of dollars on usability budget on. That placement & size of the start button would get you an "F" if you were a student in design school. Its THAT elementary.
Its not just the "Start" button on the whole, the entire Win 2003 PPC OS is just very poorly sized considering that is suppesed to be a phone OS. Look at the notifications. You have to hit a thin ass line if you plan on turning it off. Want to close a windows, its a tiny ass x squeezed in the corner or a screen? I mean, hello.....
The should have tested these things with thumbs as well as styluses. Elementary design principles. Very elementary.
But that is exactly what heppens when you take a blinkered mentality ("we are Microsoft make Windows software for PC's". We must have a "Start" button - and put everything in there.") into the design of a thumb-operated phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
isn't that a matter of taste? i mean.. they COULD make the start button bigger but then maybe someone like I would say "hey its to big it takes up like ALL of the screen and i cant see my today screen" i for one have no problem using either the start button or the"x" button for closing using my thumb.
Maybe the best would be if one could maybe have like a stylus window (kinda like now) and a big button finger layout. just a thought.
It's not a phone OS, it's a PDA OS. I agree though, that the Smartphone Edition cound have an option to enlarge all buttons so that you'd be able to navigate with one hand.
Loboman said:
It's not a phone OS, it's a PDA OS. I agree though, that the Smartphone Edition cound have an option to enlarge all buttons so that you'd be able to navigate with one hand.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I dont know any indusrty analyst who does not agree that these devices are converging - which has clear implications for software and OS makers: phone interface gets used often and requires seamless finger usage. Especially on devices with no physical phone keyboard! No rocket science required there.
And once you start selling OS software tilted "Windows Mobile 2003 Se for Mobile Phone", you're on the hook to delver something that works appropriately as a mobile phone OS! There is no escaping that one.
Ditto when your OS is designed for devices such as the Moto MPX and the Jam and the Eten 500. These are devices clearly made for those who are phone-oriented and will carry the device in their pocket everywhere - as opposed to the XDA II buyer who is more or a PDA and phone is just tacked on. Its in the Microsoft business plan to attack the market for such phone-like devices to challenge the treo and Blackberry - so they've gotta deliver credible phone ergonomics too!
I'd understand the omissions in 2002, maybe even 2003. But to come out with 2005 (when convergence is patently obvious and they are pushing heavily to be a phone OS) and they are still missing the boat with "Windows for PC" as the bedrock of their ergonomics?
As I said, I'd love to know what their user experience research budget is going on. A bunch of first year designs school students would have picked up on the obvious - as you yourself agree: if its a phone OS, you must have an credible option to go stylus-less, espcially for those primary phone options. As it is we are still at the level where dialers and today screen add-ons are legitamate commercial software. The OS should have presented a legitimate soultion there. That would be live Windows Longhorm coming out and they have a 3rd rate browser and a 3rd rate search engine as default in the OS. That's just not on - it's your primary interface and the OS must offer something up to par there, otherwise you are forcing users into slow and memory-eating add-ons such as Mobi Dial.
Loboman said:
It's not a phone OS, it's a PDA OS. I agree though, that the Smartphone Edition cound have an option to enlarge all buttons so that you'd be able to navigate with one hand.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Errr.. please come back when you know what you are talking about. Smartphone Edition doesn't have on screen buttons - how can it when it doesn't have a touch screen. You *CAN* do everything with one hand. That's the whole point of the programmable menus at the bottom, one of which kicks off the Start menu.
Anonymous said:
Loboman said:
It's not a phone OS, it's a PDA OS. I agree though, that the Smartphone Edition cound have an option to enlarge all buttons so that you'd be able to navigate with one hand.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Errr.. please come back when you know what you are talking about. Smartphone Edition doesn't have on screen buttons - how can it when it doesn't have a touch screen. You *CAN* do everything with one hand. That's the whole point of the programmable menus at the bottom, one of which kicks off the Start menu.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To make this clearer - all the menus on Smartphone Editions are linked to hard buttons on the phone. So the everything can be done one handed, and the size of icons doesn't matter jack sh*t. As for PE 2005 - that's why the new menus have appeared at the bottom - to give the benefits of Smartphone Editione on Phone Edition - so you don't have to touch the screen or dig out your stylus for common operations.
Why the obsession with the start logo, when tapping anywhere on the text will do? And why do you need to do this to get to the "phone" functions you keep banging on about? That's what the Green, Red, Contact and Calendar hardware buttons (and the Smartphone style "soft" keys) are for. What's difficult about that? If that's too complicated for you - maybe you should to go back to a Nokeeeyah!
I said the DEVICE is primarily phone-style one. Therefore the primary mode of use is fingers not stylus. - This means that various programs (which are buried in the start menu) need to be more accessible. Which is not the same thing as saying that its a phone and all you need is phone access.
If you think people buy a £400 PPC phone for calendar and contacts programs alone, then you dont know much about the market. The other programs the device runs need to be better accessible.
I couldn't care less if microsoft groupies are offended - it is a fact that Nokia has a better grips on the software ergonimics. If it makes you emotional, too bad. I'm more concerned with the fact that MS needs to think beyond the cliche and ergonimics of a Windows PC when they are designing a PHONE.
skagen, you are "gay" Go jackoff to your garbage Symbian OS which is buggier than bloody hell.
And Mikee you're an As*Hol* :evil:
Its a phone, dude. If it hs got things wrong with it, that's just the facts. If I though Symbian phones was better, then I'd buy a Symbian phone - duh! The Jam is better hardware than what's available on Symbian, but actually OS is not as intutive as Symbian.
This Win Mobile for PPC phone OS has some major failings and omissions - which is the very reason the XDA Develpers exists: til fill the gaps. And BTW, , we are not here to be teenage PPC fan-boys.That's for the kids on Howard Forums. This website here is about realistic assessment of these devices.
skagen said:
I said the DEVICE is primarily phone-style one. Therefore the primary mode of use is fingers not stylus. - This means that various programs (which are buried in the start menu) need to be more accessible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You just don't get it do you? They ARE accessible without using the stylus using the fully configurable HARDWARE BUTTONS, D-PAD navigation, on some models JOG DIALS and START and CLOSE BUTTONS, and with 2005, the SMART BUTTONS linked to the context sensitive menus at the bottom of the screen. Sheesh!
skagen said:
The Jam is better hardware than what's available on Symbian, but actually OS is not as intutive as Symbian.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have you actually watched someone using a Symbian PDA/Phone combo? Yes, that's right. If you're not dialing a number, it's time to tap tappity tap with the stylus. The P800-910 series have LESS buttons, and so LESS direct access to applications, (not to mention, many 1000 less aplications) than devices using PPC PE!
Anonymous said:
skagen said:
I said the DEVICE is primarily phone-style one. Therefore the primary mode of use is fingers not stylus. - This means that various programs (which are buried in the start menu) need to be more accessible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You just don't get it do you? They ARE accessible without using the stylus using the fully configurable HARDWARE BUTTONS, D-PAD navigation, on some models JOG DIALS and START and CLOSE BUTTONS, and with 2005, the SMART BUTTONS linked to the context sensitive menus at the bottom of the screen. Sheesh!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The hardware buttons are already allocated for things that people would use. So its silly to be telling people "you can remap your contacts button to dictionary". Ok then - so how am I gonna get the contacts quickly.
On the Tungsten E, for example hit the center button on the D pad and you can immediately start pagig through your applications. Try that on the Jam- you cant. That's lame.
before we go any further, id like to point out im not a complete luddite and ive thought about this a fair bit before posting...
looking at the iphone vids, i notice that multi touch pretty much means dual touch. i expect their technology allows for more than two fingers, but the space and OS dont really allow for this.
in playing with my univ, i notice it does some kind of averaging between to fingers - so possibly at a low level u could get multi-touch - but logic says if this is possible, sure it would have been done by now.
my logic also says this:
if u get a second touch screen plate (i beleive that the touch screen element is a layer over the screen - if this isnt true, my logic is flawed) and install it over the top of the current screen - but rotated 180 degrees, and there is the provisioning for a second touch screen input (probably unlikely but surely u could hijack something else such as the serial used for irda) then if you can read the top left touch of each screen, u should have fairly accurate multi touch, good enough for the cheesy 'grab photo and resize by stretching'
am i totally wrong here? is there any point looking further into this?
ps. in writing this, it also occurs to me that the iphones biggest use of this is the photos - which are always in the same place, scaled on correct aspect ratio etc - theres no need for two fingers - u could just grab one corner to stretch it and itd be a very similar efect
Nope, sorry.
Dear Alan,
I thank you for your insightful reply. I feel you have bettered the forum and the community as a whole with your intelligent wit and your interesting and thought inducing contradictions to the theories that i presented.
Without your thoughts I may have been tempted to push these ideas further, maybe even get out a soldering iron and a copy of visual studio, but I can clearly see that I am mistaken in where this project could go and will not further waste my time.
I must thank you kind sir, for your thought and advice. You are a squire and a gentleman.
Lol
I don't think DIY hardware upgrades have ever made it far - consider the viability of GPS on the Hermes - it does require one to pop out a soldering iron to play with the idea. So your market is already down to a fraction of a %.
But I'm sure you could wire up a bluetooth or even IRDA multitouch capacitance layer... However, from a theoretical point of view - is it worth it? I considered the idea, and the Universal/Athena might make sense with your bigger screen, but on your average Hermes, I can barely get two fingers on the screen without obscurring most of it.
Like momentum based scrolling, I think multitouch on such a small screen is kinda gimicky - as you said, it's easier to write logic to pin one corner, free rotate with a finger on the other corner, enlarge, zoom etc. Ie ergonomic single touch.
Multitouch, even if possible on HTCs, barely seems to have a practical milieu IMHO on devices with screens <= 3 inches.
V
djboo said:
ps. in writing this, it also occurs to me that the iphones biggest use of this is the photos - which are always in the same place, scaled on correct aspect ratio etc - theres no need for two fingers - u could just grab one corner to stretch it and itd be a very similar efect
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am totally agree with you. and there are some other relatively simple solutions that can be used to simulate "multi touch actions" on photos.
for an instance,
D-PAD can be used for photos enlargement:
press both "left" and "right" - scales photos up
press both "up" and "down" - scales photos down
or other way around, etc.
this one not so difficult to implement.
also, it is quite easy to emulate multi-touch action on single touch display itself.
How? if we have applied layer consisted from interleaved pressure sensitive and non-sensitive spots, then having two fingers moved in opposite directions accros this layer will likely create sequence of pressed spots that can be easily analysed and interpreted in guesture.
my understanding is that while your left finger is moving to the left and crossing pressure non-sensitive spot, there is a good chance that your right finger at the same time will be crossing presure sensitive spot and moving to the right. this creates easy to analyze patern.
I believe that logic behind this idea is simple to primitive and guaranteed to work. "public domain" 20.06.2007.
are there any existing apps to get the raw output from the touchscreen (ive got nothing against coding my own, but no need to re-invent the wheel if it already exists)
the more i play with the univ and more than one finger, the more that it almost seems like its multi touch dumbed down to single touch. the averaging it does is rather uncanny and im sure if we can see whats happening before the os gets a look in we can work something out
The Leo's large screen size, capacitive touch screen, and the fast processors were the three factors that had long attracted me to this device, and I've been patiently waiting for it to come to Australian shore. On the 19th, I rushed to one of the Telstra shops and spent a good few hours playing with this exciting phone. Finally, a capacitive touch screen that would rival iPhone. Finally, I found a good replacement for my beloved 5 inch HTC Athena which I so much loved (See my review.)
I was surprised that I was the only customer in the store having any interest in the device, as I though there must be hugh interest in it. There was a guy wearing an HTC T-shirt ready to help with any questions on the device. I shall call him the shop assistant here. The shop assistant told me he has used 3GS for 6 months, and he thinks Leo beats iPhone in every aspects. He was given a unit more than a month ago, and if I had heard it right, he was sent to Taiwan for training, so I had the chance to clarify my doubt with him whenever a need arises.
Here were my findings:
POSITIVE
Screen size and clarify
=================
The screen size and clarify is amazing. I had expected that to be the case, and I was not disappointed.
I was also not detered by the size of the device. It is really small compared to my Athena. It is extremely pocketable. The device is also very thin and comfortable to hold.
I love the fact that HTC has removed the bezel to this extent. Well done, HTC.
Camera
======
The resolution was good, and the speed was fantastic. Did'nt have to wait for spinning colored wheels while saving.
Speed
=====
This is a fast machine. Absolutely no doubt with that. However, I also find moments when the device seems to be pausing and busy with things instead of responding to me right away. This is on an empty demo unit.
Overall Build
=========
I give it a high mark, based on my initial impression. The screen is grease prone compared to iPhone, but this is expected.
NEGATIVES
Keyboard
=======
Being used to the iPhone keyboard, I have to say that the HTC keyboard performs extremely poorly. This is despite the shop assistant's insisting that it is way way superior to iPhone "because of the larger keyboard".
I typed with the speed that I normally do with my 3GS, and here are samples of what I got:
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}
I invited the shop assistant to demonstrate his typing on his own Leo, and he too was making lots of mistakes. So much for a keyboard that is "way way better than iPhone's".
Camera
=====
Having used so many HTC camera in the past, I was not expecting too much here. I was surprised though that it was extremely fast - in fact faster than iPhone's. BUT, the pictures were all having an ugly pink patch in the centre!
When I discussed this problem with the Shop Assistant, he mentioned that his phone does not have this issue, so may be it is just the demo unit having the problem. He then offered his own Leo to me to try out. When I used his camera, it had exactly the same problem, and yet, the shop assistant insisted that he cannot see any pink patch!!! I spent some time pointing his camera to the floor, asked him to focus on a specific part of the floor, then move the camera from left to right, and it was obvious that the floor which was yellow/brownish in color turned pinkish when the centre of the picture frame moves across it. He was silent after that.
Web browsing
==========
When I used the www.smh.com.au website, I noted that the webpage was still wobbly throughout the rendering and only stabilised toward the end. The top part of this webpage keep changing rather than having the final layout fixed throughout the rending. I found this disconcerting.
When double tapping on a webpage, I was expecting the text to reflow such that it fits exactly to the screen width.
I was disappointed that it does not. I showed this to the shop assistant and he told me that double tapping has been patented by Apple, so HTC is not allowed to make it work!!??? He said I must use pinch zoom to achieve exact fit! Hello???
Finger gestures
===========
Many iPhone imitators tend to think that pinch/zoom, scroll, and double taps are the only gestures required to make their device friendly. I knew that they are way off the mark by such thinking, and wanted to see if HTC Leo understands this.
- The first thing I wanted to know is whether the excel spreadsheet has a way to select cells. In iPhone, we do a double tap, then without lifting the finger, drag the finger. I was trying to see if this has been copied over to Leo. I was disappointed that it has not been. In fact, I could not find any way to select the excel spreadsheet cells. Not out of the box from what I could see. I tried looking for ways to change the scroll mode to selection mode but it does not exist. I tried holding my finder down until the "T" sign appear to see if anything there lets me select the cell, and there wasn't.
- I then tried to see how easy it is to select text precisely. In iPhone, press and hold will bring up a magnifying glass showing where the cursor is so it is very easy to precisely place the cursor. With Leo, my finger covers the text, so I could not see where the cursor is. The only way is to use the keyboard arrow key which is a little clunky. To select text, I noticed that I have choose the text selection mode in the pop up menu, to change from the scrolling mode to text selection mode. A little inefficient and unproductive, I thought. I also has great difficulties selecting the text precisely down to the last character, because my finger covers the texts itself. A rather poor iPhone gesture imitation, I think.
- The traditional scroll bar has been replaced by a more finger friendly opaque scroll handle that only appear during scrolling. This is similar to the quickscroll2 feature in iPhone, but unfortunately it does not work across all applications like in iPhone, where users could instantly jump to any part of the webpages, or applications instead of having to keep swipping to the right spot.
Task switching and closing
====================
Out of the box, I could not find any easy way to switch between active task. The task manager that the shop assistant demonstrated was way too impractical as a task switching tool. It really needs something like Kirikae or Proswitcher in conjunction with Backgrounder of iPhone for multitasking.
I used to have WKTask but I'm not sure if it still work in this version of winmo. Without something like that, I would find it extremely frustrating as a user, whenever jumping from task to task. Multitasking with my iPhone is fabulous at the moment.
The shop assistant argued that I could only have such a feature if I jailbreak the phone which is too complicated and it also voids the warranty. This, of course is nonsense. Jailbreaking on iPhone is just downloading BlackRa1n.exe, run it and click on a button with iPhone connected to the PC. It takes about 30 seconds to complete. Also, unlike in Android, anyone can completely reverse jailbreaking by merely doing an equivalent of hard reset to factory condition.
Due to time and a phone call from my wife I had to stop looking deeper into the phone. Perhaps I will return another day to take a closer look.
Anyone having advice or comments on the listed negatives are welcome to do so.
Cheers.
You know, your reasons for being attracted to the HD2 is why I bought it. Weighing pros in against WM 6.5, I would hope for 6.6/7 to come along and iron out what I saw a trend was WM 6.5 being the most common negative point with the HD2 in reviews/users. Hell most of them would have been content with Android instead of WM.
For typing, I haven't used a touchscreen device (bar my Zune HD, but no text entry/calling heavy input on that sadly!) since the LG Viewty came out, along side the first Iphone whenever that was. I'm getting used to it but I feel much more competent using the widescreen keyboard by tilting. Did you try it? Predictive text sounds like it would be your thing from the screen you posted, the tutorial is really handy at the start. I can't compare it to using an Iphone but my friends at school say they prefer the HD2 because of the screensize and they make few/no mistakes.
Camera wise, I've made two registry adjustments in connection with Jpeg compression and the MPEG compression, so they are more crisp and detailed. I've seen the pink dot a lot and I can understand why the HTC guy you mentioned doesn't want to admit that's a problem, I haven't noticed it on my device but I've took quite dark pics. You can't really blame the dude, he's just making a living after all! I can't comment on web browsing, as I've done very little but I'm okay to use pinch to zoom, I can imagine you'd be frustrated without double tapping fitting the screen correctly. Atleast HTC are keeping to Patents unlike Apple/Nokia eh?
For task manager, the quickest method I find is pressing Windows button and it opens the programs list, with the task manager being at the bottom left side of the screen I find that quicker than going into settings, I guess you could make it a quicklink if you wanted?
It's begining to feel like i'm the only person that has none of the problems that people are posting about, with the exception of the over sensitive screen. (easily tweaked, no problem now)
Lots of people say 'on an iphone such and such works in every app' - yes, because apple forces every developer into a strict code of practice. Winmo may not be perfect, but there is no orwellian overseer watching everything and discarding anything it doesn't like the look of (plus taking 30% of any sales a developer makes, just for the privelage of being allowed to sell through their insanely tightly controlled 'marketplace', , , marketplace? one shop isn't a marketplace, its a shop, one shop, just one.)
IN answer to eaglesteve's negatives.
1 - Keyboard. You are correct, the default one isn't much cop. BUT, there are a number of excellent alternatives, my favourite being swype, which works fantastically well with just a little practice.
2 - CAmera. SOrry, I just don't have a pink spot, and i've tried to see it, really i have. Lots of different lighting conditions, plain white paper, different distances, and it just isn't there on mine.
3 - Excel. Again, the swype keyboard has a very handy keypad style screen with arrows, cut,copy,past, home, end, and a lovely 'select text' button which when toggled on lets the arrows select not just excel cells, but files in lists, words in documents, etc.
4 - Precision text selection. (Swype's text selection ignored for the moment) The magnifying selection box can be enabled with a simple registry tweak of changing a 0 to a 1.
5 - SCroll bar not being the same in all aps. OK, this one you are correct, BUT, thats because it is an open marketplace, not controlled by one egomaniac forcing the developers to all play by his rules or not at all.
6 - Task switching. It takes a minute or so to set up, but place a shortcut to taskmanager in the start menu, then that alows you to add it as a shortcut on the home screen. Result = press home key to get to home screen, then open taskman from there, two presses admittedly, but still no more than 3 seconds work.
7 - Jailbreaking. Goes back to the orwellian aspect of the iphone, you shouldn't NEED to jailbreak something you have paid good money for, you should be free to do as you please with it, and not have the manufactirer try and thwart you at every software update.
Not that I want to sound like i'm glorifying the HD2, it's all about preference, i just wanted to point out that your 'cons' aren't actually the big deal they may appear at first glance.
Keyboard: I use TouchPal, but the basic keyboard is fine - particularly if you have the predictive text working (it would have given you perfect results). {Note it does support mutli touch on the keyboard.}
Camera: no problems with mine (no pink spot). There was a patch to fix the problem on the HTC website (for those unlucky enough to have the problem)
Brower: Double-Tapping will reflow the text - I had no problems with the Sydney Morning Herald site.
Excel: You can select multiple cells via the Menu -> Edit -> Make selection.
Task switcher: There are quite a few switchers such as Xtask for WM6.5 (and WM6.5.5). The shop assistant is clearly a idiot as they are simple programs and no "Jailbraking" (custom ROM?) is required.
Re "poor imitation of iphone gestures" - text select has been around in the WM world since it began. Yes, it is dated. No it is not an imitation of the iphone.
Lynehammike,
Actually, the predictive text failed to correct the mistake. It appears that the error correction algorithm is not good enough. The only way to type correctly with the HD2's stock keyboard is to type very slowly and look carefully at where you touch the screen.
Are the vast majority of Leo owners having the pink camera problem or only a handful of unluckly ones? I remember vaguely that Nexus' camera also have exactly the same problem, so is this caused by faulty hardware then? I can imagine how costly it would be for HTC to mass recall the phones and replace the hardware. I wonder if they could use the software to manipulate the color in order to eliminate the pink hue?
No, double tapping does not reflow the text correctly. I tried both IE and Opera and know for a fact that they do not reflow correctly.
I'd go back and try the multicell selection the way you describe. Thanks for the tips.
The shop keeper did show me a task switcher, but task switching simply involves too many steps. With my iPhone, I simply double press the home key to immediately see the list of runnig task, and switch to any one, or kill anyone there. This works regardless of whether the taskbar is visible or not. And it would not kill off a process to cause the device to freeze.
There is really nothing to jailbreaking. It is as simple as running a cab file in winmo device, and nowhere near the complexity of Hard SPL and cooked ROM flashing.
Application programmers who detest the tight control of Apple, and do not wish to seek Apple's approval for the program they write can always take the Cydia route, which is itself a hugh application market. Really there is no real issue that needs worrying about. Upgrading from one Apple firmware to another is a piece of cake, and both App Store and Cydia's applications could be reinstalled automatically without any loss of settings or data after re-jailbreaking.
I really like the screen and CPU of Leo. I wish it can run Android OS. Nexus' hardware somehow does not appeal to me enough. Not as much as Leo's anyway.
I just read from this post that
"they(HTC) just covered the (pink hue) problem with some smart image correction settings. Same cannot be said for motion capture where the said algorighm would most likely slow down the capture and result in dropped frames at the highest settings and that's probabbly the reason why the defect is still visible on video captures ie the patch doesn't fix video capture"
I didn't occur to me to test the video also, but looks like the pink hue problem also applies to videos.
My 2 Cents
Hi steve, good to see u after u1000
I can just say that for a fast input and errorfree and most accurate, i use swype.I dont think so iphone can ever compete with that.I can type @ 100 wpm with swype and same goes for android.
well there are many task managers, available to let u switch among the tasks.
iPhone has safari so WM has lot of options with opera 10, which i guess iphone cannot have in near future.
Ability to visit sites like rapidshare.com and download big 100 mb files and save them to 16 gig storage card, i gues no OS can even think of it as of now.
Pich and zoom can work almost everywhere and it is more than perfect in excel, helping browsing, selecting rows, copy paste them, editing formulas(I am a sales head, so have to check lot of sales reports hence i prefer big screen)
Battery life is better thaniphone 3gs and it doesnt get hot loke iphone 3gs.Compass is also awesome, can be used in google maps(I guess in iphone to use compass in maps, a patch is needed and can be done only by jail break)
and of course upgrade to WM7, will make it more than perfect :d
I suggest, have a relook at it, and am sure u will get it
eaglesteve said:
Lynehammike,
Actually, the predictive text failed to correct the mistake. It appears that the error correction algorithm is not good enough.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do u have XT9 on in the first place , judging on the screenshot? I tried doing a test and mine work perfectly well. even if i intentionally key in the wrong keywords provided in your screenshot, they autocorrect-ed for mine.
I agree with Kivine - in the photo you have definately dissabled the predictive text.
for reflow: double tapping works (with a small caveat). If you tap next to a photo - it does appear to reflow only the margins of the text next to the photos. If you double tap below the photo area it will reflow correctly.
Cheers,
Michael
Lynehammike and Kivine,
You mean the XT9 must turn green on the keyboard for it to work correctly? If so, I'd go back to give it another try. Thanks for the tips.
hdubli said:
Hi steve, good to see u after u1000
I can just say that for a fast input and errorfree and most accurate, i use swype.I dont think so iphone can ever compete with that.I can type @ 100 wpm with swype and same goes for android.
well there are many task managers, available to let u switch among the tasks.
iPhone has safari so WM has lot of options with opera 10, which i guess iphone cannot have in near future.
Ability to visit sites like rapidshare.com and download big 100 mb files and save them to 16 gig storage card, i gues no OS can even think of it as of now.
Pich and zoom can work almost everywhere and it is more than perfect in excel, helping browsing, selecting rows, copy paste them, editing formulas(I am a sales head, so have to check lot of sales reports hence i prefer big screen)
Battery life is better thaniphone 3gs and it doesnt get hot loke iphone 3gs.Compass is also awesome, can be used in google maps(I guess in iphone to use compass in maps, a patch is needed and can be done only by jail break)
and of course upgrade to WM7, will make it more than perfect :d
I suggest, have a relook at it, and am sure u will get it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey hdubli,
How are you mate. Good to see you here again!
100 wpm?? Are you serious? Sorrry, no offence, you would have to put up a youtube demo for me to believe you.
As to browser, there are at least 10 on the iPhone that I've been using and comparing. You have far better browser on the iPhone, sorry, it's true. Apple does not have 130,000 fart applications you know . You can probably find at least 30 browsers around, whereas you get probably about 5 in winmo platform?
As to saving hugh files from sites such as rapidshare, I do it all the time on my iPhone.
Device getting hot happens to my Athena, Touch HD, and iPhone occassionally. Not really a problem specific to any platform I think.
Compass on googlemap has always been there in 3GS since day one without patch. Did somebody tell you that only jailbroken phone can do that?
Yes, the promise that it will be upgraded to WM7 is a reason why I take an interest in Leo. However, I'm not sure if this is a smart thing, as WM7 is always in the horizon like a mirage in the desert, with availability date that is being pushed back all the time, to be replaced by WM6.X. I now do harbour serious doubt about Microsoft's technical abiliity to deliver, and question what they're doing. Here they have WM7, then there is a zune phone, and a pink phone.... I sure hope they know what they 're trying to do... At the moment, the real competition is between google and apple in the mobile phone area, with MS reduced to a mere pawn swept to the side, IMO. Unless MS comes back with something really good and really soon, they might just completely disappear from the scene, I'm afraid. Apple certainly does not see MS as a rival anymore in the smartphone business. The only credible rival is Google. That's why Apple is now trying to team up with MS, and to use Bing instead of Google as the default search engine in iPhone. You know what they say? The enemy of my enermy is my friend. It's an intereting world.
Hi there.
Well I will not argue and start a debate on WM Vs iphone , but my experience of 3 years of iphone and 8 years of WM and 2 years of android tells me that WM is still a better of all three.More freedom.
I can only say that the users report more and more problems on iphone, and all the iphones magic is on jailbreak else there is nothing.
You can get a youtube video to watch on wmpoweruser.com for hd2 and it is really very fast, i abandoned all my hard keyboard phones.
I suggest look it again from all the angles, basically the freedom which u will get, right from custom roms to apps, and lot of things which u already know, and I hope you will come back to the flavour again
Hey guys. I'm a poster from the HTC Vogue (Touch) Android forums here. I've been working on writing this drum game for a few months now and I wanted to see if I could get a little more attention from the community. Here's the original thread I started:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=672836
You may have seen a post yesterday on the home portal about "Matt's Drum Game," well I added a few cool features, renamed it "Touch Drummer" and uploaded that to the market as well. I'm pretty giddy about it, if only because I created an algorithm for multi-touch on resistive screens in about 4 days. It's not perfect but for the game it works well.
There are really two different aspects of my implementation for multi-touch. If you are clicking very rapidly, sometimes the screen won't recognize that you released the first touch, even as the second touch comes in. As long as they are within 150 ms of each other, the app will recognize two separate touches. This allows for some wicked quick banging on the drums! But if you touch one spot and hold it for over 150 ms, then multi-touch a different spot, my algorithm will not only play the original drum but also the second drum, hence multi-touch. The limitation is that you cannot use two fingers to hit two drums almost at the same time, because on the resistive screen it might only register as one point and I have no way of knowing that it's really two. And the reason for the delay is sometimes you aren't actually trying to touch two spots but it would recognize it as that and the point would end up far away from your intended touch. The delay helps forge a difference in the two methods.
Well I'd love to hear from you guys on what you think about the game and the multi-touch. And please, if you don't mind, download "Touch Drummer - Demo" and give a good ranking. I promise that it is a ton of fun, especially for a drummer like myself.
I think that the game is really good - I can touch two drums nearly simultaneously, due to the very small time interval for registering taps.
I have an idea though - maybe you could add challenges with an online high scoreboard, and add voice recognition through the phone's mic for people who wish to sing when drumming.
Keep going at it; I think your game will become brilliant!
HunteronX said:
I think that the game is really good - I can touch two drums nearly simultaneously, due to the very small time interval for registering taps.
I have an idea though - maybe you could add challenges with an online high scoreboard, and add voice recognition through the phone's mic for people who wish to sing when drumming.
Keep going at it; I think your game will become brilliant!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Cool, what device are you on? Right now I'm working on making it look good on any screen size, right now it's not for 320x240. I've just added a menu, and adjusted what happens when you go home from the app or press back. Once I learn all the basic stuff that every app needs to have, I will start adding more features. Like the multitouch, someone suggested it, so I went ahead and researched it and can add it. So thanks for the feedback.
BTW I realized there is a forum for software development, and one for games and apps. Should I move this over there?
EDIT: Moved to...
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=6388061#post6388061
Please do not respond to this thread.
I was wondering if the HD2 suffers from multi-touch issues like the Nexus One:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsSUqkh8pcI
(contrary to what the comments on that vid say, 2.2 did not fix such issues since it's a hardware problem)
I plan on getting either a HD2 or a HD7 from T-mobile.
For on-screen keyboards, I want to be able to hold down shift with one finger while being able to type with the second finger. On the Nexus One, you cannot do this as demonstrated by the video above; only 1 finger on the screen at a time or you will get an incorrect input!
Hopefully HD2 doesn't suffer from such issues!
nexus14 said:
I was wondering if the HD2 suffers from multi-touch issues like the Nexus One:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsSUqkh8pcI
(contrary to what the comments on that vid say, 2.2 did not fix such issues since it's a hardware problem)
I plan on getting either a HD2 or a HD7 from T-mobile.
For on-screen keyboards, I want to be able to hold down shift with one finger while being able to type with the second finger. On the Nexus One, you cannot do this as demonstrated by the video above; only 1 finger on the screen at a time or you will get an incorrect input!
Hopefully HD2 doesn't suffer from such issues!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The keyboard software is designed for all Android devices, and therefore only single-touch.
johncmolyneux said:
The keyboard software is designed for all Android devices, and therefore only single-touch.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry but you did not answer my question. I am already aware that software dictates the possibility of the multi-touch but hardware is the ultimate bottleneck. Plus, there are 3rd party keyboard alternatives in Android Market that implement multi-touch.
In case I need to rephrase, I asked:
Does HD2 suffer from the same multi-touch issues as the Nexus One?
-----------
Answered my own question:
http://www.htcphones.net/htc-hd2-multitouch-video/ Old vid, but it appears to suffer from some issues. This is done on Windowns mobile so results will vary.
another xda thread: http://www.htcphones.net/htc-hd2-multitouch-video/ (the problem exists similar to the Nexus One but it is not as prominent)
This vid best illustrates the inability of multi-touch if attempting to use a multi-touch keyboard on the evo. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1P9vMAvvkGY
If you were to imagine the finger inputs were on a keyboard, you will see that you will be pressing the letters "zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz" or "mmmmmmmmmmm" quite often. Therefore, you are only able to go one finger at a time, making sure to lift your finger #1 prior to putting down finger #2; otherwise, you will get a "stuck" screen input
no it doesn't , i tried it several times with all multituch applications in android market
More fingers (e.g. 4) multi-touch like on Desire HD
Did some searching on the forum, but can't find a real "answer" to this..
The Desire HD supports even 4 touch points (see youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RID1q92iuL0)
Is this possible on the HD2 with a different touch panel driver? Or is the HD2 limited hardware wise to only 2 touch points (pinch to zoom)?
Hd2 is limited to 2, and it has the problem where if the 2 touches are on axis's close to each other, then they will register on the same axis. Can make using on screen controls or keyboards a problem as it will register pushes in the wrong place a lot.
Sent from my HTC HD2 using XDA App
What about that? http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=651877
I followed that thread while it was active, but it doesn't prove anything. XDA member Scilor also tried to achieve multi touch for more than 2 fingerers, but was unsuccesfull.. This may well be because, also according to him if I understand correctly, the -windows mobile- driver forces 2 touch points only. However according to his information a 3rd finger was recognized, but he could't get the coordinates from the driver.
If you look at the touch panel compared to that of the Desire HD (a friend of mine has one) they look exactly the same (same "dots" in the screen).
That's all I know. It may well be a driver issue, but maybe it's safer to assume that the HD2's touch panel is limited hardware wise.
Well it's not that big of a deal (is there any app on android that uses more than 2 fingers anyway?), but it would be awesome to know that your device supports more than 2 points.
Anyway, anyone have some troubles with touching corners? Sometimes when I'm playing angry birds and i drag slingshot by moving my finger into corner, slingshot get dragged into other way (backwards) like i would drag it on the other side of the screen.
thanks or all informations