Database Users

HTC Universal - is it slower than HTC Blue Angel?

I have a HTC Blue Angel (also called Qtek 9090, XDA III) and I'd like to buy a HTC Universal (XDA Exec, Qtek 9000) to replace it.
However, I keep hearing that it's slow, and that it's slower than the Blue Angel.
Is this true, or are the people who say it's slow using it in a wrong way (for example using lots of memory-hungry programs at the same time)?
Anything else to look for when buying one?

If you want to get an idea of what it's REALLY going to be like, I suggest you visit the BA Upgrading Forum at xda-dev and download the TuMa v1.4 ROM of WM5 and take the plunge of upgrading your device. It will give you an apples-to-apples idea of how WM5 runs on a device with the same configuration.
There's no easy answer to your question. In short WM2003SE is faster, but the utility gained by moving to the newer OS far surpasses the benefit of speed. That's just my opinion, of course. Your mileage may vary.

But the Universal has a faster processor than the Blue Angel.
Isn't the user experience about similar, because of the faster processor (slowness of WM 5 being compensated by the increased CPU speed)?

I think most people will tell you that the jump from the BA CPU to the Universal CPU is nominal (at best). Certainly under the WM5, this is the case.
Yes, perhaps the bump in speed for the CPU should compensate, but in reality it does so only a bit. This is because of the inherent operation of WM5 (i.e. the stuff is executed out of ROM, which is slower than RAM).
For details see Mike C.'s excellent post http://blogs.msdn.com/windowsmobile/archive/2005/08/19/453784.aspx

Newsminator said:
I have a HTC Blue Angel (also called Qtek 9090, XDA III) and I'd like to buy a HTC Universal (XDA Exec, Qtek 9000) to replace it.
However, I keep hearing that it's slow, and that it's slower than the Blue Angel.
Is this true, or are the people who say it's slow using it in a wrong way (for example using lots of memory-hungry programs at the same time)?
Anything else to look for when buying one?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi,
Upgraded from the BA (Orange M2000) to Universal (Orange M5000)
I can honestly say that the M5000 is slower - i dont think the devices fault but WM5!
After having the M500 for 2-3 weeks now and then going back to look at the M2000's screen there is a massive difference. Due to that I wouldnt consider going back to the M2000.
The M5000 is a fantastic device and is a bit slower than the M2000 but more than makes up for it in other ways.
Just my penneth.
Matt

So it seems
I have both devices both running wm5. The Blue angle seems to have more running memory but I'm not positive how much memory the wm5 OS can handle

Unfortunately:
YES, its slower
Maybe wait for WM5SE (Codename Crossbow).

short answer: It's worth it

Ady is right.
100% Worth it !

My contribution....
I moved from BA to Universal. I use both very simply....phone, email, internet etc...bit of tomtom
No strange apps, no mods, boring old o2 ROMs.....
and I think the Universal is slower....but only slightly and not so it would really bother you. :wink:
And anyway, the Universal looks so much better so just get it!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:
HPJ

I have both and I find the Universal is a lot slower, even when running it at 624MHz.
Blame WM5, though, not HTC.

I bought it
I have just bought a Qtek 9000 (HTC Universal) and a Corsair 133X SD card, so I can access the data quickly.
It's a bit slower than the Blue Angel, indeed. But, for some things, it is faster:
- Pocket IE doesn't lock up for 2 minutes when loading complex web sites
- browsing is faster because of the 3G
- Pocket Word loads complex documents faster
Overall, I'm very pleased with the upgrade.
I think that I don't feel the slowness because I don't use programs which put themselves on the TODAY screen - I configure the PDA to show the date and the calendar, and that's it.

In my view the VGA compensates all drawbacks of the speed issues...
really fantastic with PIE and Adobe Reader PPC 2.0

Does Wizard have same CPU as Universal
I have a Blue Angel running WM2003SE and a Wizard running WM5. BA is MUCH faster. Does the Wizard have the same CPU as the Universal?
If I flashed the BA to WM5 would it be as slow as the Wizard? Could the BA be overclocked with 'Omap..'?
Which ROM would you suggest for running WM5 on the BA?
Thanks.

Dude--the Wizard CPU is a jalopy compared to the Universal's hotrod. That's not a fair comparison at all. The only true comparison would be with a HTC Alpine device which runs the same CPU as the Universal.

monakh said:
Dude--the Wizard CPU is a jalopy compared to the Universal's hotrod. That's not a fair comparison at all. The only true comparison would be with a HTC Alpine device which runs the same CPU as the Universal.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The Wizard is certainly slow but has a useable keyboard and 3G WiFi unlike the BA.
Any response to my other questions?
I am expecting a Prophet in the next week, is it the same CPU as the Wizard (and no keyboard at all)?

This is all off-topic so if you have a question about the Prophet or Wizard or the BA, you should post it in the appropriate forum. The answers to all your questions already exist. Please use the search function. That's why it's there.
On to my reponse:
Useable keyboard? Perhaps, but you will find as many haters of that keyboard, as well--Although I agree it's better than the BA's. And no, the Wizard does not have a 3G radio. It has EDGE (which is more like 2.5G). Yes, it has WiFi, but so does the BA. How is that any different?
The Prophet has no keyboard and has the same '****ty' OMAP CPU as the Wizard. I was using this lame ass CPU with HP's 6315 almost two years ago. It sucks. Software-based enhancements make the new ROMs for the Wizard and Prophet more responsive, but it's still what it is. Which is S.L.O.W.
There are huge threads devoted to the BA WM5 experience. Try the TuMa 1.4 ROM or the newest Ivan release. Please browse through the BA Upgrading forum for details (I suggest this to the OP, as well). I doubt the 'overclocked OMAP' could ever match the raw CPU power of the Xscale CPU. I am not going to get into a war over CPU architecture here.
My .02 hilala as they say here in Saudi Arabia.

Question for People who have upgraded from Wizard to Hermes

How much faster is this new processor compared to the Wizards? Is noticably much faster, or not much?
Is it worth the upgrade?

yes it is, video streaming, usege of phone, bootup all faster but i must say t-mob rom has som glitches. not obvious but still there

The speed increase wasn't as fantastic as I had hoped, but it makes the device definitely more usable.
I'd say if you are a heavy user of the device and have the "Spare" cash, GET ONE, If not, wait for the next Vario III or whatever its gonna be called.

Re: Question for People who have upgraded from Wizard to Her
dangerous_dom said:
How much faster is this new processor compared to the Wizards? Is noticably much faster, or not much?
Is it worth the upgrade?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you want to use Skype and 3G, then yes. Other not really. Don't get me wrong it is the best device for me, but unless you can get a good deal then as has been said already the speed difference isn't onticeable from the latest Wizard ROMs.

TyTN vs Wizaed? No Contest!!
C'mon guys you gotta be kidding!!??!!
The TyTN/VarioII/SPV 3100...and its other guises, is far superior to the Wizard, even with the latest ROM!
Compare:
Does the Wizard have a commendable 2MP camera worthy of taking on SE K750i?
Does the Wizard have A2DP & AKU2 out the box?
Does it Multitask like the TyTN without lag?
Is it as varied in operability i.e. one-handed navigation plus many buttons?
Does it have HSDPA compatibility?
Is the screen as bright and clear?
Does it even have 3G?
Can it Video call?
NO!
The Wizard is good an everything but the TyTN is Great in comparison. Just my 2 cents worth.

Aye but unless you're wanting to use 3G, want to run lots of apps or use the camera then it's not noticeable better than the Wizard. I still have to see the difference in speed between the latest Wizard ROMs and the TyTYN.
As I said it is better, but not worth taking out a new contract to run against your existing one like a lot of people are doing.

Allow me to step in with a related question: The 3rd party compatible battery charts from Hongkong manufacturers show the HTC batteries from the Wizard and Hermes to be compatible. Can you confirm this?

@Lucas0511
The batteries are completely different.
The Wizard one is much smaller than that of the Hermes.
See attached picture
Cheers,
Drifter

The Wizard was Okay, but not close to the Tytn. I found the Wizard keyboard (Qtek 9100) somewhat unusable, the annoyance of constantly hitting the camera button a nuisance, and the constant speed degredations because it was doing some housekeeping unacceptable, all of these issues are gone with the Tytn. The ability to use Skype on the phone, important to communicate overseas, and other features made this an easy choice. Plus, don't ask me how I did it, but broke the spring holding in the memory card on the Wizard, which made it ready for retirement.

The Vario is a Good Phone, The vario II is definitely a better phone, but the newer version is still very expensive SIM free at the moment and So in my opinion the bottom line is if you use it to its full potentional AND if you have the spare cash.
The Vario II isn't as brilliant as I would have hoped, the 400Mhz processor is FASTER, but you still see abit of lag which I wasn't expecting.
UMTS and HSPDA make the device MUCH faster for downloading, but its still quite slow with internet browsing.
The camera is better but not even in its wildest dreams can it take on the SE K750.
Video calling - How often do people use this ?
You also need to keep in mind that will the pace that phones are being developed and released that the Vario III is possibly going to be released within the next 12 months or less.
So, the bottom line I would say is ..... do you need it and have you got the money.

Hi all,
I've been running the Wizard for almost 9 months now - clocked at 264 MHz thanks to omapclock - without any problem.
I got a TyTN from my job at the end of July and could not see any noticeable difference in terms of latency or execution speed.
The battery lasts only 24 hours when I am under UMTS coverage (48h at least with the Wizard with Edge).
I seriously think I'll get back to the Wizard until a decent french ROM version is available :?
_________________________
HTC TyTN French (HERM200)
ROM: 1.18.256.2 (05/30/06) - ExtROM: 1.18.256.103
Radio: 1.03.03.10 - Proto: 32.34.7010.01H

I think i will stick with my Wizard for now. From what i have read on these forums and elsewhere, the differences, while nice, are not compelling enough for warrent the spend.
Thanks for you input.

I use Slingplayer. Will the tytn make a difference? I also live in Dallas where umts is active.

How fast??

I've currently got an MDA Vario with T-Mobile and thinking of getting the Vario II (TyTN) when my upgrade comes up. The main thing I'm interested in is improved internet browsing, is it much faster than the GPRS speed I have to put up with now? Thanks.

If you get HSDPA (IIRC) enabled, you can get speeds of around 1Mbit/s.

i get 1.7 meg almost all the time now on hsdpa

1.4 here nearly all the time
love this new device...(Vario II)
i just come over from a universal,sony ericsson m600i(what was i thinking) and prophet
i am very happy whith this device
one other thing in the forum index can we get the admins to change it to Hermes i feel like it's a preferential thing for people owning the HTC model

What program do you use to measure the connection speed?

mikechadwick said:
What program do you use to measure the connection speed?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
From the wiki:
You can test your connection speed from Hermes browser here
* http://www.bandwidthplace.com/speedtest/
* http://www.dslreports.com/mspeed

thank you

I'm very suspicious about the accuracy of bandwidthplace
dslreports appears much more realistic
try running both and seeing what he difference is.

mine
I have just used www.bandwidthspace.com to test myMDA Vario II (got yesterday) and itgave me1.1 megbits per second. dont know if itsgood or bad as dont know what I got with gprs.

daddyo said:
I'm very suspicious about the accuracy of bandwidthplace
dslreports appears much more realistic
try running both and seeing what he difference is.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed. I think the latter is the one people should use if they want a realistic measurement.

Compare the TyTN and the Wizard - (performance)

I posted this on the TyTN thread, but wanted the input of readers on this thread as well.
What would the major differances be between the TyTN ie Qtek 9600 model phone in the performance area as opposed to the Wizard model phones ie.. cingular 8125/T-Mobile MDA phones? Does the processor speed of the two model greatly affect the running of the phone or is it reduced due to the fact that they really arn't apples to apples on the processor as one is a samsung processor and the other the omap.
Also am considering the HP hw6945 model as well. If any one has any insight on that.
Thanks for any insight.
pschmidt

pschmidt63 said:
I posted this on the TyTN thread, but wanted the input of readers on this thread as well.
What would the major differances be between the TyTN ie Qtek 9600 model phone in the performance area as opposed to the Wizard model phones ie.. cingular 8125/T-Mobile MDA phones? Does the processor speed of the two model greatly affect the running of the phone or is it reduced due to the fact that they really arn't apples to apples on the processor as one is a samsung processor and the other the omap.
Also am considering the HP hw6945 model as well. If any one has any insight on that.
Thanks for any insight.
pschmidt
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Apples and oranges, I'd say. While, in cases, overclocking the Wizard may result in great speed increase (which can help in, say, loading Opera Mobile), I use it witout overclocking and am absolutely happy with it.
That is, don't be afraid of the "slow" 195 MHz Wizard. If you do find it slow, you can always overclock it.

I've had the k-jam since december of 05. I've never been so thilled with a phone in my life (and I've had several hundred easily).
I've never had a time where I really wished the k-jam had more processor. Sure, if offered I'd take it, but I've never had an issue without. I don't overclock at all.
A friend has the TyTN and he loves it (he went from the RAZR to it and it was his first PPC phone). Compared to my k-jam, the menus are a little snappier but all the apps run the same speed. While I'm dying to have a device with UMTS, the TyTN isn't worth the price of upgrading for me.
But, if you don't have either and you're looking for one, ALWAYS get the latest and greatest. Simple rule. But if you have the wizard, hold off because there's much better stuff coming soon. There always is.
-Mc

Moved from Universal to Hermes (Observations)

FYI - Anyone considering upgrading to Hermes
I have been using a universal for the last 18months and have now sold it and upgraded to the HTC Hermes.
The universal served me very well and the only thing I miss is the larger screen and VGA resolution and standard 3.5mm jack - however - I don't miss the bulk.
The hermes is everything the universal is minus the VGA.
My default Rom on the universal was Helmi's v1.3 which was AKU 3.5 and was a very very stable/solid rom.
I later installed PDAVIET 2.04 pro (Crossbow/WM6) which was a little temperamental but solid never the less.
I have installed XDA Live 0.20 which is a Crossbow rom on the hermes and it is very fast, I mean very very fast in comparison to the the universal.
In actual fact the hermes feels like an overclocked blue angel. (Normal operation, responsiveness, games etc)
Before I had the universal I had a blue angel that I used to regularly overclock to 530mhz (XCPUSCHALAR) and I can tell you that the herms feels very close to this.
I actually wonder what the hermes is capable of if overclocked slightly - As I don't have any figures (Pocket Hackmaster performance Index, SPB benchmark, etc) I can only speculate - but I'm looking forward to investigating this further.
Incidently the hermes has the Imageon gpu that was present in the blue angel so it runs films in TCPMP with hardware acceleration something the universal lacks.
Now I'm not sure whether the Universal had slow ram, or it being a VGA device slowed it down or what but I do know that the hermes is orders of magnitude more responsive in every day operation than the universal was...
Wireless connects at 54mbs on the hermes instead of the 11mbs maximum thoroughput the universal supports even with the 802.11g hack.
And the Hermes also supports HSDPA (1.8mbs theoretical - if your network provider supports it). Admittedly this was a deal breaker for me as umts is cool but connecting at 1.8mbs to the internet whilst on the road is edging very close to nirvana LOL!
Now while I will miss browsing servers at 640x480 using ts client in WM6 (WM5 tsc was atrocious BTW - LOL!) I feel the hermes features and performance more than make up for it. Plus I recently purchased a Sony u50 (1st generation umpc circa 2004) which has a 800x600 5 inch screen and the u50 allows me to TS into server using the hermes as a modem (Bluetooth or serial comms)
Last but not least I need to mention the hermes 2MP camera - OMDs - LOL.
It is head and shoulders above any HTC Camera I've ever experienced and I have seen them all...
SPV to wallaby to alpine to blueangel to universal I've had them all and this camera is the 1st USEABLE camera in terms of how responsive the camera app is, the picture quality and the overall experience!
Granted it's no replacement for my Canon SLR BUT (BIG BUT) it's definitely useable and supports typical camera functions such as self timer, darkness controls etc.
All other HTC devices had a fairly decent camera app but a piss poor camera sensor that only operated remotely correctly with good light. The pics I get with the hermes are of comparable quality to recent nokia and sony phones.
Hope this information is of use to anyone considering moving from the Universal to a hermes.

haha funny enough I was looking at the hermes last night.
My contract has run out, im in the UK and o2 are no longer doing free gprs so I need to jump ship as its damn expensive! Three are offering unlimited (1gig) a month for £5 so that's my main option plus they have a HSDPA network. But the downside is they don't offer the hermes so i'd have to get it seperatly I want a hermes
Thanks for the review, I want a hermes more now
Thanks
Stu

actually, just a thought... with WM6 PIE has the option to view in VGA mode, this makes website VERY easy to view as if they were on a desktop pretty much which makes browsing actually possible on these devices. Is that function still available on the hermes ?
thanks
Stu

IE VGA
Hi Stu,
No that feature is not available in WM6 IE for the hermes as it is a qvga device (320x240)
Just checked the menu options in IE and noticed that option was missing whereas it was there in WM6 IE on the universal.
Cheers
q

stualpha said:
haha funny enough I was looking at the hermes last night.
My contract has run out, im in the UK and o2 are no longer doing free gprs so I need to jump ship as its damn expensive! Three are offering unlimited (1gig) a month for £5 so that's my main option plus they have a HSDPA network. But the downside is they don't offer the hermes so i'd have to get it seperatly I want a hermes
Thanks for the review, I want a hermes more now
Thanks
Stu
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
O2 are just about to bring out a new XDA which is similar looking to the Hermes but appears to have a faster processor. It is apparently out on 26 March.

ooo in that case I may hang around to see what it's like.
But saying that the data is a huge issue data costs on o2 are huge plus i'm a student so we can whine more lol
thanks guys
Stu
also :: do you know which device it is ? I presume specs are already out possibly ? or pics ?
thanks

stualpha said:
ooo in that case I may hang around to see what it's like.
But saying that the data is a huge issue data costs on o2 are huge plus i'm a student so we can whine more lol
thanks guys
Stu
also :: do you know which device it is ? I presume specs are already out possibly ? or pics ?
thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's an Asustek apparently. Just Google O2 Zinc and you'll find it.

http://www.msmobilenews.com/content/view/1730/1/
think i'll hold out for this puppy!! looks sweet, shame about the vga though

stualpha said:
http://www.msmobilenews.com/content/view/1730/1/
think i'll hold out for this puppy!! looks sweet, shame about the vga though
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Or you might like to hold out for the I-mate Ultimate 7150 - more ROM, more RAM, faster processor, VGA .....

not made my mind up about the design of the new ultimate series, dont know what it is, they look at a little funny :? will have to see it in flesh.
This is what I hate about these things, its always add a little bit of extra time on and wait for the next device

The very mention of microSD in these devices is enough for me to overlook them and appreciate my Universal even more - despite the superior performance of the new devices over the Universal. Since the Universal is VGA, has a stable performance, and uses SD Cards - I am pleased with it.
Only when SDHC readers start becoming more mainstream in PDA Phones will I start considering a successor to the Universal.