Related
That's right, blissful viewing on your VGA Athena. How?
Don't expect to run it in a full screen window, that's how. The CPU (powerful as it is) cannot handle native VGA 640x480 full screen encodes. Probably due to the many other things it has to do simultaneously.
For full screen 640x480, we need the ATI Imageon chip acceleration support, which as we all know is not yet available and ATI/AMD have not been forthcoming in helping CoreCodec in revealing the nature of their hard/software embedded implementation. Nuff said.
320x240 resolution with extremely high bitrates won't give you the sharpness a QVGA device can playing the same resolution.
On the Hermes with the ATI chip, they finally got a resolution/fix as there seemed to be some buffering issues regarding Audio (not entirely sure if these reports were accurate), so I've been playing with Audio codecs and lower bit-rates, to some benefit....but not enough.
The best 'in-between' results I have found till we get a fix for our Imageon hardware (if ever) is as follows.
P.S. I've tried playing with H264, X264, DivX 6.xxupwards, Mpeg 4 etc and various encoders from Virtual Dub and Guardian ... to DVDx and too many to mention to be honest (over 20-30 encoders over the last few years).
For movie clips or entire movies to look really good on a VGA screen IMHO and experience, you have to encode higher than QVGA but less than VGA unless like the Dell's you have a accelerator that actually work with TCPMP or Coreplayer. Our only works with the ATI software renderer, which is still miles better than any other option open to us.
So I now encode at:
Video: 480x320 at 850kbps
Audio: AAC @ 44100hz and 128kbps (if music video)
Audio:AAC @ 22050hz and 64kbps (for everything else)
I can only yield benchmark results of around 118% but
I've successfully played over 72500 frames with only 45 frames dropped!
Trust me..that is really good. 0 frames would be nice and very possible by encoding at 320x240 but the video looks to soft whereas at 480x320 it actually looks quite sharp indeed.
If you encode a genuine High def clip or movie at this resolution, the end result will look like the original HD clip or worst way, like a super-bit DVD.
1% frame 'droppage' = 725
45 frames dropped out of 72500 = less than 1/16th of 1% which = Bliss
You do the maths.
Depending on the source video, if it is full screen, so will the encoded video, but if it is in wide screen format, so will your encodes be.
For DVD conversion I got best results vs speed using (freeware) Handbrake v2.25 and Mpeg 4 decoder.
http://handbrake.m0k.org/
For individual files (VOB files), I use Any Video Converter (yeah, that's the name of the application). Same results.
For all other video files I love Smartmovie with the same setup as outlined above, except for the encoder..I use Xvid in Smartmovie.
I'll try to upload a sample video to rapidshare or something if anyone wants to view the quality and performance...but my time is somewhat limited at the moment.
P.S. The above mentioned apps are dummy proof and not too complex for noobs, so why not try it out and let us know how you get on.
Last but not least, in Coreplayer v1.1.1 or even TCPMP , if you suffer from lipsync problems, try adjusting
Menu/Tools/Preferences/Select Page/Advanced...scroll down and adjust the 'Manual A/V offset'. Mine is currently at:
-0.200 but depending on other videos I might have to adjust to -0.600...it works wonderfully (menu navigation in TCPMP might be slightly different to Coreplayer, but the option is still there).
Good luck and if you have better results than these, please post back and share your findings. Thanks
I found that the DiVx converter from DiVx works brilliantly if you set it to 'mobile'... I dont get any of these issues that everyone else seems to have - I use the official DiVx player on the Ameo and its great full screen.
adamelphick said:
I found that the DiVx converter from DiVx works brilliantly if you set it to 'mobile'... I dont get any of these issues that everyone else seems to have - I use the official DiVx player on the Ameo and its great full screen.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I had tried that some months ago and wasn't that impressed, but maybe they have improved it. What version are you using?
mackaby007 said:
That's right, blissful viewing on your VGA Athena. How?
Don't expect to run it in a full screen window, that's how. The CPU (powerful as it is) cannot handle native VGA 640x480 full screen encodes. Probably due to the many other things it has to do simultaneously.
For full screen 640x480, we need the ATI Imageon chip acceleration support, which as we all know is not yet available and ATI/AMD have not been forthcoming in helping CoreCodec in revealing the nature of their hard/software embedded implementation. Nuff said.
320x240 resolution with extremely high bitrates won't give you the sharpness a QVGA device can playing the same resolution.
On the Hermes with the ATI chip, they finally got a resolution/fix as there seemed to be some buffering issues regarding Audio (not entirely sure if these reports were accurate), so I've been playing with Audio codecs and lower bit-rates, to some benefit....but not enough.
The best 'in-between' results I have found till we get a fix for our Imageon hardware (if ever) is as follows.
P.S. I've tried playing with H264, X264, DivX 6.xxupwards, Mpeg 4 etc and various encoders from Virtual Dub and Guardian ... to DVDx and too many to mention to be honest (over 20-30 encoders over the last few years).
For movie clips or entire movies to look really good on a VGA screen IMHO and experience, you have to encode higher than QVGA but less than VGA unless like the Dell's you have a accelerator that actually work with TCPMP or Coreplayer. Our only works with the ATI software renderer, which is still miles better than any other option open to us.
So I now encode at:
Video: 480x320 at 850kbps
Audio: AAC @ 44100hz and 128kbps (if music video)
Audio:AAC @ 22050hz and 64kbps (for everything else)
I can only yield benchmark results of around 118% but
I've successfully played over 72500 frames with only 45 frames dropped!
Trust me..that is really good. 0 frames would be nice and very possible by encoding at 320x240 but the video looks to soft whereas at 480x320 it actually looks quite sharp indeed.
If you encode a genuine High def clip or movie at this resolution, the end result will look like the original HD clip or worst way, like a super-bit DVD.
1% frame 'droppage' = 725
45 frames dropped out of 72500 = less than 1/16th of 1% which = Bliss
You do the maths.
Depending on the source video, if it is full screen, so will the encoded video, but if it is in wide screen format, so will your encodes be.
For DVD conversion I got best results vs speed using (freeware) Handbrake v2.25 and Mpeg 4 decoder.
http://handbrake.m0k.org/
For individual files (VOB files), I use Any Video Converter (yeah, that's the name of the application). Same results.
For all other video files I love Smartmovie with the same setup as outlined above, except for the encoder..I use Xvid in Smartmovie.
I'll try to upload a sample video to rapidshare or something if anyone wants to view the quality and performance...but my time is somewhat limited at the moment.
P.S. The above mentioned apps are dummy proof and not too complex for noobs, so why not try it out and let us know how you get on.
Last but not least, in Coreplayer v1.1.1 or even TCPMP , if you suffer from lipsync problems, try adjusting
Menu/Tools/Preferences/Select Page/Advanced...scroll down and adjust the 'Manual A/V offset'. Mine is currently at:
-0.200 but depending on other videos I might have to adjust to -0.600...it works wonderfully (menu navigation in TCPMP might be slightly different to Coreplayer, but the option is still there).
Good luck and if you have better results than these, please post back and share your findings. Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey Mark,
A couple of things that might work...try running your video's with your advantage plugged in..
another thing...if you have 16:9 video convert it into 532x300
that consistently gives me good result...
and last but not the least...try splitting your video into smaller files...none larger than 600mb
The player on my Ameo is version 0.88 andthe DivX converter is version 6. Hope that helps.
It rips straight from DVD to my Ameo SD card too.... quite quick. Although I am having problems with no subtitles at the mo the rest is fine.
fallenczar said:
Hey Mark,
A couple of things that might work...try running your video's with your advantage plugged in..
another thing...if you have 16:9 video convert it into 532x300
that consistently gives me good result...
and last but not the least...try splitting your video into smaller files...none larger than 600mb
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks my friend. I'll try those suggestions and let you know.
adamelphick said:
The player on my Ameo is version 0.88 andthe DivX converter is version 6. Hope that helps.
It rips straight from DVD to my Ameo SD card too.... quite quick. Although I am having problems with no subtitles at the mo the rest is fine.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Cheers for that mate, Just downloading it now, will try it soon.
I stand by my findings...
1) Divx Converter Using Divx 6.6
1) adamelphick's Divx Encoder
80% Benchmark Result
Resolution 592x448 (original was lower than default VGA 640x480 Portable Profile - so kept orig. Resolution of 592x448)
over 350 frames dropped
Only 20.xxx fps vs mine @ 23.79 out of 23.975 Original
2) I Used Any Video Converter with fallenczar's recommended resolution for widescreen movies for full screen viewing
Benchmark Result 131.28% Excellent.
Resolution 532x300 (slightly vertically stretched, but very viewable)
only 9 frames dropped out of 3842! Excellent!
Superb fps playback of 23.920 out of 23.976
3)I Used Any Video Converter xvid codec!
125.11% Benchmark Result
Resolution 480x320
only 4 frames dropped out of 5690!
Superb fps playback of 23.959 out of 23.976
4)I Used Any Video Converter Mpeg4 codec. Visually not quite as good as xvid, but still very good.
123.06% Benchmark Result but the audio sounded extremely slowed down! ?!??!?
Resolution 480x320
only 5 frames dropped out of 5938!
Superb fps playback of 24.979 out of 25.000 Mpeg4 codec would not allow me to keep NTSC format & I was forced to use 25fps.
Sorry if all that info above is a bit confusing, so here's the bottom line.
I've tested the Divx Encoder and Divx Mobile Player.....sorry, but it's still seriously lacking compared to Coreplayer or TCPMP. Handheld profile encodes at low resolution unfit for VGA device if you're a quality freak.
Portable Profile seriously looks good. No doubt about it and so it should as its native resolution for encoding is VGA (640x480), but then you hit the performance issues related to non accelerated Vids on VGA devices.
Verdict? No good for Athena but probably excellent for quick encodes using QVGA devices. The Player is also only capable of handling AVI vids and the encoding specs had better match its Players ability else it won't play the file.
For Fallenczar's recommended Resolution for widescreen vids, I can only say..Nice & Thanks for the tip.
If you don't mind the original Video/movie being slightly elongated, you won't notice a performance hit at all. You'll even get slightly Benchmark results than by using my method. But the benchmark results is not the sum of its parts and should only be used as an indicator, not a 'actual playback' performance gauge.
Verdict? Great tip! I'm definitely keeping this in mind for future encodes of wide screen movies & Vids. Thanks again.
Lastly I used an application called 'Any Video Converter', but in all honesty, there are many others that can do the job as well and better if you don't mind the complexity of some of the more advanced apps. But as a quick solution, you'll be hard pushed to beat this for casual and quick video files conversion. For DVD encoding I'd definitely stick with Handbrake...it's bloody fast too and uses MSDOS and no fancy GUI for viewing the video as it encodes, hence it encodes a 90 minute movie in a third of the time of the entire movie. i.e. 90 min video encoded in just under 30mins.
As the results show in no 3 & 4, even though my benchmark results are slightly lower than with fallenczars resolution for widescreen format vids, it's hard to beat how little frames are dropped whilst retaing a visually HQ video/movie.
Verdict? I absolutely stand by my findings until someone finds a way of encoding videos at native VGA at HQ with virtually no hit on performance.
I want HQ with great performance. Don't get me wrong people, we can easily achieve benchmarks in excess of 500 - 600kbps but the quality of sound and video isn't worthy of such high end PPC's. We paid a lot of dough for these devices and I'll be damned if I can't get slick HQ video on the Athena. I refuse to get a dell or Archos or whatever just to accelerate video and games....if that was my priority I'd buy a PSP and a get myself another compact HTC Hermes.
Just wait till we get some support for our Imageon devices. Let the good times roll.
P.S. Divx Encoder can't encode whatever you throw at it, mostly AVI files. Any Video Converter and quite a few others can handle most formats including high def files.
mackaby007 said:
1) Divx Converter Using Divx 6.6
1) adamelphick's Divx Encoder
80% Benchmark Result
Resolution 592x448 (original was lower than default VGA 640x480 Portable Profile - so kept orig. Resolution of 592x448)
over 350 frames dropped
Only 20.xxx fps vs mine @ 23.79 out of 23.975 Original
2) I Used Any Video Converter with fallenczar's recommended resolution for widescreen movies for full screen viewing
Benchmark Result 131.28% Excellent.
Resolution 532x300 (slightly vertically stretched, but very viewable)
only 9 frames dropped out of 3842! Excellent!
Superb fps playback of 23.920 out of 23.976
3)I Used Any Video Converter xvid codec!
125.11% Benchmark Result
Resolution 480x320
only 4 frames dropped out of 5690!
Superb fps playback of 23.959 out of 23.976
4)I Used Any Video Converter Mpeg4 codec. Visually not quite as good as xvid, but still very good.
123.06% Benchmark Result but the audio sounded extremely slowed down! ?!??!?
Resolution 480x320
only 5 frames dropped out of 5938!
Superb fps playback of 24.979 out of 25.000 Mpeg4 codec would not allow me to keep NTSC format & I was forced to use 25fps.
Sorry if all that info above is a bit confusing, so here's the bottom line.
I've tested the Divx Encoder and Divx Mobile Player.....sorry, but it's still seriously lacking compared to Coreplayer or TCPMP. Handheld profile encodes at low resolution unfit for VGA device if you're a quality freak.
Portable Profile seriously looks good. No doubt about it and so it should as its native resolution for encoding is VGA (640x480), but then you hit the performance issues related to non accelerated Vids on VGA devices.
Verdict? No good for Athena but probably excellent for quick encodes using QVGA devices. The Player is also only capable of handling AVI vids and the encoding specs had better match its Players ability else it won't play the file.
For Fallenczar's recommended Resolution for widescreen vids, I can only say..Nice & Thanks for the tip.
If you don't mind the original Video/movie being slightly elongated, you won't notice a performance hit at all. You'll even get slightly Benchmark results than by using my method. But the benchmark results is not the sum of its parts and should only be used as an indicator, not a 'actual playback' performance gauge.
Verdict? Great tip! I'm definitely keeping this in mind for future encodes of wide screen movies & Vids. Thanks again.
Lastly I used an application called 'Any Video Converter', but in all honesty, there are many others that can do the job as well and better if you don't mind the complexity of some of the more advanced apps. But as a quick solution, you'll be hard pushed to beat this for casual and quick video files conversion. For DVD encoding I'd definitely stick with Handbrake...it's bloody fast too and uses MSDOS and no fancy GUI for viewing the video as it encodes, hence it encodes a 90 minute movie in a third of the time of the entire movie. i.e. 90 min video encoded in just under 30mins.
As the results show in no 3 & 4, even though my benchmark results are slightly lower than with fallenczars resolution for widescreen format vids, it's hard to beat how little frames are dropped whilst retaing a visually HQ video/movie.
Verdict? I absolutely stand by my findings until someone finds a way of encoding videos at native VGA at HQ with virtually no hit on performance.
I want HQ with great performance. Don't get me wrong people, we can easily achieve benchmarks in excess of 500 - 600kbps but the quality of sound and video isn't worthy of such high end PPC's. We paid a lot of dough for these devices and I'll be damned if I can't get slick HQ video on the Athena. I refuse to get a dell or Archos or whatever just to accelerate video and games....if that was my priority I'd buy a PSP and a get myself another compact HTC Hermes.
Just wait till we get some support for our Imageon devices. Let the good times roll.
P.S. Divx Encoder can't encode whatever you throw at it, mostly AVI files. Any Video Converter and quite a few others can handle most formats including high def files.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey Mark!
Since you seem to have loads of free time why don't you try converting your video to .mov, try it with a small 20-40 mb movie clip first..
if my memory serves me right then you should be able to get better results with it...though converion to mov if time consuming
fallenczar said:
Hey Mark!
Since you seem to have loads of free time why don't you try converting your video to .mov, try it with a small 20-40 mb movie clip first..
if my memory serves me right then you should be able to get better results with it...though converion to mov if time consuming
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Blimey, I haven't used that format for years, except for downloads from Apple.com...thanks for the tip. I'll look into it once I get some more free time.
Test Clip for download...
Just in case you can't be bothered or have the time to test these settings, just download this test video and see what you think...it's about 8.5 MB in size:
DownloadLink: http://rapidshare.com/files/50811286/10000_BC_HD_xvid.avi
Will the Advantage play a 640x480 .wmv in Windows Media Player?
mackaby007 said:
That's right, blissful viewing on your VGA Athena. How?
Don't expect to run it in a full screen window, that's how. The CPU (powerful as it is) cannot handle native VGA 640x480 full screen encodes. Probably due to the many other things it has to do simultaneously.
For full screen 640x480, we need the ATI Imageon chip acceleration support, which as we all know is not yet available and ATI/AMD have not been forthcoming in helping CoreCodec in revealing the nature of their hard/software embedded implementation. Nuff said.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I discovered that TCPMP can not play full screen. As I have installed SmartMovie which can play full screen movie beautifully, therefore I do not bother to try run TCPMP to play movies, just use TCPMP to play music with enlarged lyrics appearing at the same time along with the pace of music. That is a joy forever.
juiceppc said:
Will the Advantage play a 640x480 .wmv in Windows Media Player?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Possibly, if the encoding specs match that of the ones outlined in the Athena Handbook, but I believe you will get better performance from using MP4 under WMP as it will use the Imageon Hardware decoder that Coreplayer cannot use.
However from my experience, WMP is far too restrictive, hence TCPMP/Coreplayer is the best on the market. .wmv is pretty crap for PPC playback IMHO compared other formats. .wmv is fine on Full blown PC though.
panvita said:
I discovered that TCPMP can not play full screen. As I have installed SmartMovie which can play full screen movie beautifully, therefore I do not bother to try run TCPMP to play movies, just use TCPMP to play music with enlarged lyrics appearing at the same time along with the pace of music. That is a joy forever.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No disrespect panvita, but you obviously have no idea what I've been talking about. Take any of those movies that you say is full screen in Smart Movie and run some test with it,(I use the latest version) and the Smartmovie converter cannot even encode at full VGA 640x480 by default and the PPC SmartMovie player doesn't like most videos encoded by other encoders (its limited).
What I'm trying to say is SmartMovie Player on the PPC is inferior by far to TCPMP and Coreplayer. Check the options in SmartMovie player to show framerate whilst a movie is playing and check the actual resolution too. I think you'll find that it is more often than not, Not real VGA res and when it is, your frame-rate will be terribly slow.
Then run the same movie file in TCPMP or Coreplayer and check your property settings after playing your movie file and you'll see again the frame rate achieved and how many frames were dropped.
Don't mean to sound arrogant or like a Mr Know-it-all, but it is pretty much common knowledge that Coreplayer and TCPMP is far superior to all other PPC based Video players on the market to date, even though 'It' still has its shortcomings.
mackaby007 said:
Possibly, if the encoding specs match that of the ones outlined in the Athena Handbook, but I believe you will get better performance from using MP4 under WMP as it will use the Imageon Hardware decoder that Coreplayer cannot use.
However from my experience, WMP is far too restrictive, hence TCPMP/Coreplayer is the best on the market. .wmv is pretty crap for PPC playback IMHO compared other formats. .wmv is fine on Full blown PC though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Core is good but if my main objective is to watch my movies(of which all are .wmv) full screen with no hiccups then why not just use WMP to do that. I like .wmv for it's simplicity. But that's just me.
juiceppc said:
Core is good but if my main objective is to watch my movies(of which all are .wmv) full screen with no hiccups then why not just use WMP to do that. I like .wmv for it's simplicity. But that's just me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can't argue with that at all. Coreplayer is crap for WMV but that is exactly the format WMP likes to play.
TCPMP on x7501
I am using the TCPMP player on my new Advantage x7501 & it works perfectly!
I advise to use DirectDraw as an output! it's really better than that sucker ATI IMAGEON! Take a look at the configs and Benchmarks! (Configs in both benmarks are the same)
-Video
Video Output: DirectDraw
Video Quality: High
Smooth zoom: ON
Dither: • (on)
Accleration: ◘ (off)
-Buffering
Turned on to Micro Drive mode
Buffer Size: 32000kb
Start at: 2944
-Benchmark Using DirectDraw(File Size: 138 mb)
Average Speed: 183,86 % (!)
Video Frames: 8821
Audio Samples: 15598708
Amount of Data: 14443 KB
Codec: DivX
*PLZ PAY ATTENTION TO ANOTHER BENCHMARK USING ATI IMAGEON AS VIDEO OUTPUT*
-Benchmark Using ATI IMAGEON(File Size: 138 mb)
Average Speed: 58,71%
Video Frames: 8776
Audio Samples: 15488972
Amount of Data: 14354 KB
HOW IS IT MARK????
Try different settings...somethings wrong with yours.
hirad_sabaghian said:
I advise to use DirectDraw as an output! it's really better than that sucker ATI IMAGEON! Take a look at the configs and Benchmarks! (Configs in both benmarks are the same)
-Video
Video Output: DirectDraw
Video Quality: High
Smooth zoom: ON
Dither: • (on)
Accleration: ◘ (off)
-Buffering
Turned on to Micro Drive mode
Buffer Size: 32000kb
Start at: 2944
-Benchmark Using DirectDraw(File Size: 138 mb)
Average Speed: 183,86 % (!)
Video Frames: 8821
Audio Samples: 15598708
Amount of Data: 14443 KB
Codec: DivX
*PLZ PAY ATTENTION TO ANOTHER BENCHMARK USING ATI IMAGEON AS VIDEO OUTPUT*
-Benchmark Using ATI IMAGEON(File Size: 138 mb)
Average Speed: 58,71%
Video Frames: 8776
Audio Samples: 15488972
Amount of Data: 14354 KB
HOW IS IT MARK????
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ooh do I detect a tone of anger or possibly sarcasm in that last statement/question? hehe
OK, the reason is probably that when you use Coreplayer or TCPMP, you have the Imageon Decoder activated...No good, NOT fixed to work with Coreplayer or TCPMP as yet.
Coreplayer: Under your video settings, ensure you have the following settings checked or enabled:
Video Output: ATI IMAGEON
Video quality: High
Smooth Zoom: On
Dither: Ticked
Acceleration: UNticked (else you'll be using the hardware decoder - no good)
Under Preferences select Direct Draw options page and select the following:
Overlay with colorkey - Ticked
Use blitting instead of overlay - Blank
Use device stretching for blitting - Blank
Overlay format - YV12
There you have it. Last but not least, don't encode videos much beyond 480x320 otherwise the Athena cannot handle it.
Try that my friend.
Same set-up for TCPMP:
Video benchmarks on coreplayer 1.25, default options.
Video 1 - Simpsons chapter
Video: XVID 512x384 25.00fps 756Kbps [Video 0]
Audio: MPEG Audio Layer 3 48000Hz stereo 131Kbps [Audio 1]
Average speed: 93%
Video 2 - Friends chapter
Video: XVID 512x384 23.98fps 845Kbps [Video 0]
Audio: MPEG Audio Layer 3 48000Hz stereo 130Kbps [Audio 1]
Average speed: 99%
Video 3 - Futurama chapter
Video: DivX 5 640x480 25.00fps 2097Kbps [Video 0]
Audio: MPEG Audio Layer 3 48000Hz stereo 120Kbps [Audio 1]
Average speed: 73%
Video 4 - Heroes.S03E08.HDTV.XviD-LOL 400mb
Video: XVID 624x352 23.98fps 1147Kbps [Video 0]
Audio: MPEG Audio Layer 3 48000Hz stereo 122Kbps [Audio 1]
Average speed: 90.11%
Video 5 - Californication.S02E07.HDTV.XviD-0TV 250mb
Video: XVID 624x352 23.98fps 1082Kbps [Video 0]
Audio: MPEG Audio Layer 3 48000Hz stereo 128Kbps [Audio 1]
Average speed: 95.57%
Video 6 - Simpsons chapter
Video: DivX 5 720x576 25.00fps 1111Kbps [Video 0]
Audio: MPEG Audio Layer 3 48000Hz stereo 128Kbps [Audio 1]
Average speed: 58%
Videos of the test: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=2M95ZHD4
No 100% on ANY video, but close. Acceptable? Maybe in coreplayer 1.3.
For me, this is a total crap and a big failure of HTC again. BUY THE STUPID ATI DRIVERS F**K, ILL PAY 50$ FOR THEM
disappointment
Yes, I second that,
The poor video performance is a big downer and a very noticable thing watching your favourite smallville episode skipping frames all the time.
and the game of the ball is sloooooow and like playing a 10fps game.
I have to say I'm amazed by this. I remember when the whole Tytn II video debacle broke, we had these silly statements from HTC trying to justify the poor performance by saying it was a business phone, and didn't have video acceleration built in (which was a lie), but that future HTC devices might be "multimedia-centric" or words to that effect... well, surely the Touch HD is exactly such a multimedia device, advertised and sold as just that, so why are we still discussing lacklustre performance?
Is this gross stupidity or carelessness on the part of HTC, or is there something seriously wrong with these Qualcomm chips?
Let's just revisit the blurb on HTC's own website for a moment (before they start rewording it, as they did with the Tytn II) -
HTC said:
Enjoy music videos, films and streaming like you never thought possible on a mobile device. Experience internet browsing so exhilarating... it feels like you never left your laptop at home...
...3.8-inch wide, WVGA (480 X 800 pixel) display offering a cinema experience on the go
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hmm.
I find this quite dissapointing. I was hoping that due to the large screen they would have made sure it can play basic video files. Those sorts of file are exactly what i would be looking to play on it too.
Hmm The more I read the more i am sawying towards an iPhone which i fine frustrating
Guys try playing those files in WMP and you will see that it will play them perfectly thanks to the hardware acceleration which unfortunately still isn't fully used in CP! Wait till CC will crack the software part of the HW acceleration and you then you will be able to watch all those movies without demuxing on Touch HD.
To those who want to know how to make .mp4 from .avi/.mkv without converting PM and I will tell how to do it in 10 minutes and not 1 hour.
How we can play this files on a program that doesnt read that codecs?
xvid/divx are all the same it is simply mpeg4 video. If you take it out of the .avi file and mux it into .mp4 it will be recognised as mpeg4 video file. Its the same with h264/x264 if you take it out from .avi and mux it into .mp4 it will be recognised as h264 video unfortunately wmp only supports baseline profile which is rarely used at all.
Remember that .avi/.mp4/.mkv are all containers that can contain the same type of video or audio stream only .mkv is special cause it can easily contain subtitles stream of different format and almost every audio format which unfortunately isn't the case with .avi and .mp4 that is why .mkv is the most popular container for all those HD rips cause you can put almost every kind of thing.
update !
I hear the sound of a deal breaking....while this is a disappointment for sure the real crunch for me would be if the video suffered in ordinary performance as my polaris did (eg low screen rewrites pretty obvious in TT7).
I am not into benchmarks, just one of those "business users" that likes to have some multimedia on my device. Just watching ep 7 of se 4 of The Unit on Coreplayer 1.2.5 in fullscreen landscape from Divx 624x352, and find it plays really well, with no lag or performance problems. So for the occasional user like me the HD is doing just fine.
Wishmaster89 said:
xvid/divx are all the same it is simply mpeg4 video. If you take it out of the .avi file and mux it into .mp4 it will be recognised as mpeg4 video file. Its the same with h264/x264 if you take it out from .avi and mux it into .mp4 it will be recognised as h264 video unfortunately wmp only supports baseline profile which is rarely used at all.
Remember that .avi/.mp4/.mkv are all containers that can contain the same type of video or audio stream only .mkv is special cause it can easily contain subtitles stream of different format and almost every audio format which unfortunately isn't the case with .avi and .mp4 that is why .mkv is the most popular container for all those HD rips cause you can put almost every kind of thing.
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what???
xvid and divx are codecs, not simply videos, if you mux a xvid/divx video in one container, it will be a mpeg4 container with xvid/divx video, and windows media player will not play it until you convert the video to another codec with loss of quality, bigger size and loss of time, so is not that easy and for us, say that "use windows media player" is a useless comment.
I uploaded the videos with that I made the benchmarks
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=2M95ZHD4
Just tried Heroes Episode 8 on my i780, and here are the results:
GDI - 181,36%
Raw Framebuffer - 206,13%
Intel xScale - 213,59%
Direct Draw - 182,2%
However taking into account the difference in resolution from the older models and the Touch HD i think this could justify the difference in performance.
Also, maybe Core Player is not using effectively the architecture of the Touch HD.
But... this is a new machine and as such it should be ready to play acceptably the videos.
On the Omnia I can play a 700 MB AVI file almost perfectly smoothly without any conversion at all. I can simple place the original high-quality video AVI onto the Omnia and play it.
Is this the same case for the Touch HD? Can you do the same thing and it will play (even if you need to use WMP)? Or do you have to convert it down to a lower quality first like on previous phones?
The Omnia included by default a DivX player, this is not the case of the Blackstone, however with Core Player or the free TCMP you can watch virtually any movie without converting it.
The Omnia is also based around a different processor, not made by Qualcomm. I suspect that helps as well.
this is so disappointing...
my only wish is that CorePlayer 1.2.5 actually doesn't use the hardware acceleration of the touch hd as it should.
because if this is the actual performance of the hardware then, at least me, i wont spent 700 euro on this device which promises to be multimedia device but actually isn't.
can someone convert a file that is playable with the built-in video player or WMP but this file should be of relatively high resolution say 720x400 (wmv, mp4 whatever) and then see how's the performance?
maybe this is just a coreplayer poor performance issue here are we're just blaming the device for nothing...
ps. I had the omnia for couple of weeks, the video performance of IntelXScale is absolutely amazing even on high resolution videos, also I don't think the 240x400 resolution of the omnia plays a big factor here, i suppose that even if the omnia had 480x800 resolution, the performance would be the same (maybe bit slower, but definitely more than 100%)
Hi, I've just tryied this video: http://downloads.gamezone.com/demos/d24115.htm which is infact an 800x480 wmv file. Coreplayer 1.2.5 benchmarked at 46% with QTv, even less with other methods. Windows Media Player however managed to play it much much better, even if with some dropped frames.. definitely not a smooth playback but at least was not a slideshow like in CorePlayer...
downloading a 640x480 wmv video.. I'll report back with results..
Edit: the second video is this one: http://www.casadolcecasa.com/gallery/video/Natale2004_hig.wmv
WMP: watchable, first part kinda sluggish, then goes better (supposedly because most of the img is dark -> easier to decode)
CP1.2.5: unwatchable, frames slideshow.. 56% with QTv
mkMoSs said:
ps. I had the omnia for couple of weeks, the video performance of IntelXScale is absolutely amazing even on high resolution videos, also I don't think the 240x400 resolution of the omnia plays a big factor here, i suppose that even if the omnia had 480x800 resolution, the performance would be the same (maybe bit slower, but definitely more than 100%)
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and on what facts do you base this opinion? nobody know how fast it would play. the HD resolution has to display 4 times more pixel than the omnia
I'm loving this phone, but I'm struggling with one thing; I can't find a way to play "normal" divx (avi) files with i.e. CorePlayer (1.2.6), on a normal quality. It just skips a few frames now and then.
Is this just me (am I missing a X1 specific option), or are we waiting for some driver magic from the guys at Coreplayer?
use the standalone divxplayer
That plays even slower than Coreplayer
I also found the offical divx player has terrible sound quality as well as its poor framerate.
I am puzzled at the people who claim the X1 plays DivX fine. To me, anything less than 24fps is far from fine and it seems to struggle to handle 15fps.
Alex Atkin UK said:
I also found the offical divx player has terrible sound quality as well as its poor framerate.
I am puzzled at the people who claim the X1 plays DivX fine. To me, anything less than 24fps is far from fine and it seems to struggle to handle 15fps.
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ive got the x1i and coreplayer 1.2.5 and it plays all divx perfectly, nothing skipped and nothing bad , maybe you guys installed something memoryhungry?
other members states that KinomaPlayer is the best player, who knows, try it to rate it, i don't know how good it is since the coreplayer is working great.
the coreplayer 1.3.0 is out, but dont know the news in it though
smaberg said:
ive got the x1i and coreplayer 1.2.5 and it plays all divx perfectly, nothing skipped and nothing bad , maybe you guys installed something memoryhungry?
other members states that KinomaPlayer is the best player, who knows, try it to rate it, i don't know how good it is since the coreplayer is working great.
the coreplayer 1.3.0 is out, but dont know the news in it though
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Coreplayer 1.3.0 doesn't perform much better than 1.2.5 on x1 I can play easly play mp4 movies 400x240 800 constant bitrate at 25fps without dropped frames, DivX movies 320x240 32x240, but the quality of mp4 is much better...
Up till now i could play the DivX 640x480 without any problems only on samung i780 and Dell x51v (720x...)
hi people,
I have encoded some of videos with DiVX, 640 by 360, 780kbps video and 128 kbps audio mp3.
I downloaded the divx mobile player and it plays ok, but there are some vertical tears/anomalies during fast moving scenes.
Is there another player which will work better on the diamond?
I know the TCPMP can play divx but I don't think it will have better performance.
how about the $30 core player? some people recommend this player while others says it is really ****ty, worse the WMP. Another down point is that the core player does not support the Qualcomm processor in the diamond right?
thanks for any help
I'm using TCPMP and its performance is fine. Ugly UI but nice Video experience
For encoding I'm using Pocet Divx Encoder. It also provides presets for the Diamond.
TCPMP is the free version of Coreplayer, as I understand it TCPMP is like Coreplayer Beta. I use Coreplayer on an XDA II/ Himalaya and performance is good, needed to tweak some settings but with more recent phones the experience can only be better.
It might be worth noting that TCPMP and Coreplayer don't support 5.1 audio, if the file is encoded with it there will be no sound
core player has the best video performace and crystal clear quality I definitely recommend this player, i use it daily but you may want to keep TCPMP close also, as core player does not support dolby 5+1 due to licensing issues
PS: there's no problem with diamond's processor not being supported by core player, and do not even dare to compare it with WMP )
all the best
there is a sticky in the diamond forum about converting your movies for use on the diamond.
Sadly it seems the best performance is obtained using the MP4 format and playing through WMP.
Hi everybody. I am running Phiremod 6.2. What I really want is to be able to drop a standard definition video on the sd card, such as a divx or xvid file on the and have it play back smoothly on the nook. It seems that hardware video decryption doesn't work and that is the reason we are stuck using software decryption. What is the best video player? Even with the best video player, do you still need to re-encode the videos to lower resolution for proper playback? What format do you re-encode video to? Do we expect hardware video decryption to be accomplished by the amazing xda hackers?
Thanks!
I use Mobo player for playback. Have encoded several standard def videos from a TV series using Handbrake with the nookcolor preferences created by someone else on this forum, in H.264 format. They look and sound very good this way, except it does not fill the screen which is expected as it is standard def. Have not tried any HD content yet.
waldes said:
Hi everybody. I am running Phiremod 6.2. What I really want is to be able to drop a standard definition video on the sd card, such as a divx or xvid file on the and have it play back smoothly on the nook. It seems that hardware video decryption doesn't work and that is the reason we are stuck using software decryption. What is the best video player? Even with the best video player, do you still need to re-encode the videos to lower resolution for proper playback? What format do you re-encode video to? Do we expect hardware video decryption to be accomplished by the amazing xda hackers?
Thanks!
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Isn't Phiremod just a modded CM7? CM7 suppports hardware decoding, for up to 480p files (max 854x480). Anything beyond that will be soft decoded. Anything that isn't expressly supported by Nook's "supported" video/audio formats are, afaik, also software decoded (the base player will not do this, need something like vitalplayer or rockplayer, etc.)
- If a video is just not a supported format but is 480p and under, it runs very smoothly for me in CM7 as software decoded -- you wouldn't be able to tell that it wasn't hardware accelerated.
- If a video is higher than 480p (720p, etc) or the bitrate is too high, even if it is the supported format, it will also attempt to be software decoded. My experience with this is that it's poor quality (stutters, audio desync a lot of times, etc.)
MP4 container, H.264 baseline codec for video conversion. Anamorphic loose, 854x480. AAC / MP3 (I forget what else is supported) codecs for audio, choose 44.1 khz sampling rate instead of 48khz to avoid problems. Bitrate for video and audio are up to you, but I wouldn't use the lossless setting for H.264 because you'll have issues with it playing (and will be an enormous file). You also really don't need to use it for a 7" screen. For me, video bitrate of 800 kbps (avg) is low but acceptable, 1100 for medium, 1500 is (non-HD) dvd quality. 128-160 kbps audio, your choice.
There's a lot of players out on the market, many free. I like Vital Player Neon a lot but the paid app version failed on me because of their self-copy protection. I use Moboplayer and also installed the Neon codec from the dev's website, it improved my performance noticeably on some more system-intensive videos.
As always, YMMV.
LBN1 said:
I use Mobo player for playback. Have encoded several standard def videos from a TV series using Handbrake with the nookcolor preferences created by someone else on this forum, in H.264 format. They look and sound very good this way, except it does not fill the screen which is expected as it is standard def. Have not tried any HD content yet.
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Is the <-> (vs >-<, etc options) not working for you to expand it to full screen? I have not had any issues getting 480p content to edge-to-edge (provided it's 16:9 aspect ratio, which many shows and movies are. While Nook's resolution isn't true 16:9 it's close enough that you won't notice any real edge). The only videos that display with bars for me are the wider aspect ratio ones.
(On stock rooted firmware, with 1.1Ghz OC)
I also use handbrake... encoding to 1024x576 xvid seems to do the trick with mobo player. (Altough so far I tried only one video file.)
edit: tried an other one, plays almost perfectly in sync. It is about 1 frame out-of-sync that can only be noticed with hard, fast sounds like slapping.
Encoding to h264 with the said resolution results in video being played back slower and of course audio being out of sync.
480p h264 baseline / aac mp4 files can be hardware decoded and play nice, but I'm all for the bigger resolution.
angomy said:
Is the <-> (vs >-<, etc options) not working for you to expand it to full screen? I have not had any issues getting 480p content to edge-to-edge (provided it's 16:9 aspect ratio, which many shows and movies are. While Nook's resolution isn't true 16:9 it's close enough that you won't notice any real edge). The only videos that display with bars for me are the wider aspect ratio ones.
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The ones I did were not in 16:9 aspect ratio, they were 4:3 which is why I believe I could not expand them to full screen. I haven't yet tried a 16:9 video like a movie but will soon.
in addition to the formats/resoluton mentioned try using Vital Player Neon - works with a lot of formats - plays really smooth on my NC (CM7 7.02+1.3GHzOC)
Thanks a bunch!