Related
I've been a long term HTC fan, having had a Cingular 8125 for over a year. I just got a TyTN and immediately added a 2 G micro SD card and then loaded that up with software: uBook, NewsGator Go for blogs, Egress for podcasts, SBSH Weather, and MortPlayer. It was very unstable, freezing about half a dozen times a day. Doing a little research, I found that the presence of a micro SD card was implicated in freezing. Freezing is where the phone part of the TyTN continues to work (green light continues to blink), but the Windows part is locked up. I've removed the weather and Egress items from the Today screen, and so far that's reduced the freezes to once a day.
I would like the Hermes to be as reliable as the wizard which went weeks without me resetting it. I'm currently on ROM 1.18.255.3. Is moving to a new ROM version likely to fix this freezing problem? Are there people out there using a 2 G micro SD without a freezing problem? I understand there's a new ROM due out at the end of January, should I hold off till that comes out?
I mean to add that I have a HT636 serial number in case it is hardware related.
Aha! evidence indicates micro card
By removing various software from the today screen, there was no reason for any software to look at the micro card. The phone had not crashed, and yet the file manager showed that the micro card was not present.
But this stinks, I got the phone so it would hold a gigabyte of stuff, mostly podcasts.
At least can feel confident in the problem. Any chance it could the SANS micro SD card?
Not sure why your file explorer is saying there is no micro-sd card.
I use the same card as you and do not have as many hangs as you.
Some things to be aware of.
Best practice suggests putting in main memory anything that is used on the today screen or by phone application. In other words anything the device would need on coming out of sleep mode is best placed in Main memory.
Everything else can be placed on the SD card.
If you do not use push email you should carefully apply the "fake server" trick
You probably are, but you must use a task manager (say magic button or the like) to properly shut down applications.
I personally steer clear of today plugins that automatically connect to the net for data - e.g. weather/traffic/news type programmes.
Mike
Thank you for your ideas.
I guess I was spoiled by the 8125. Perhaps that it uses the regular SD instead of the micro-SD is the reason. All my apps on the 8125 were on the storage card, and I didn't force applications to quit.
I guess I just need to accept that the TyTN is more touchy about the card and try working around it.
Thanks for the feedback.
I did the same as you, added a 2 gig card from the start. I have journal bar running for weather and news, loaded in main memory, everything else is on the micro SD card. I had the same lockups as you are seeing but it's not the microSD in my case.
I found that the phone "wakes" often for calls, notifications etc. while in it's holster. When it wakes all keys are "unlocked" and subject to getting pressed. From this forum, I applied all the patches and tweakes like Auto-lock on power up, PTT button re-mapping, and many registery tweaks for bluetooth accys.
Mine almost never hangs now. The main culprit now seems to be when connecting/disconnecting it to a charger sometimes turns off bluetooth or hangs the unit, but it's intermittent.
Overall I'me very happy now, till "Kaiser" comes out...
Thank you for the info. I'm going to move the sensitive applications to the main memory. Do you think the ROM version could be contributing to the failures? I have 1.18 and I believe there is an official 1.35 out that is later.
Thanks
Another Way to Speed Up your Hermes
This Might Help You Making Performance of your Hermes Better
WM5_Tweaks_Performance
Espacially by:
Enable FileSystem cache
Increase FileSystem cache
Increase FileSystem filter cache
NOTE: These Tweaks Helped Me ALOT.....
Thanks for the ideas about tweaks. I'm going to see how stable I can make it before applying any of them.
applied all of them and it does seem significantly faster now.
I'd definitely recommend the ROM upgrade, I have never experienced the silly lock ups that I used to since.
I just experienced my first freeze on my Vario II (UK).
I got the phone on saturday, and used it for the first time as an alarm clock yesterday and everything was great (sunday I forgot to turn it off silent - boo that you have to remember).
This morning my alarm didn't go off, when I woke up the phone had frozen and wouldn't display anything - but the light was still flashing. I haven't got a MicroSD yet.
Would I have the latest ROM as I have only just got the phone? If not, how do I upgrade or find out what version of the ROM I have?
i am on the std rom released by imate in australia 2.3 i think. i have used many including xdaII and the universal.
the current hermes is the most reliable, most stable, and most amount of uptime with the best battery life, so overall i am very happy.
by the same token, i have been here long enough to know exactly what needs to happen to totally rebuild these devices from the basic rom to a device that works efficiently.
it is vital that you apply all things that are required or used during the initial startup, including things in the startup directory, and on the today screen to be present in main memory.
i have also found that icons on today or in start menu that are loaded on an sd card can slow the device down.
having memory readers on the today screen, reading the SD card memory isnt good either.
using and going through a lot of the registry hacks are useful, but not necesarily for the speed, hangs, but for functionality.
also, custom applications that are installed on the sd card i move out of the program directory to a sub directory called custom apps. this is simply to ease the speed of opening, and when i open custom, i accept a minor second or two delay rather than immediate.
i did have (not recently) have problems with the system loosing the sd card directory, which a soft reboot fixes. which is all the more importance of hiding the icons and applications from day to day interaction that use the SD card.
you can also look at reformatting the card.
i also did find that doing a full back (SPB) and doing a restore speeded up the device noticably.
there may also be speed issues if you dont synchronise regularly, and the notifications queue on previous devices also caused problem, but havent found much here.
doing other simple stuff like error reporting, disabling bluetooth auto beam is also a good start.
using ring tones or themes that are on the sd card are also not as reliable than locating in immediate ram.
so rule of thumb, you need to be able to boot up and use your device completely independently of your SD card, and only access the storage card for apps that you call for, and for data that isnt needed immediately on boot up, to store songs, files, documents and related types.
hope it helps. but in answer to your question, if you can get a more updated rom, you will definitely get a benefit, but quantifying the benefit is hard. new roms are released for a reason, so consider them seriously.
that said, if you dont need to wait for a supported rom rather than crossing platforms, this is always difficult and should only be done with extensive knowledge. as such, i dont have that many problems i cant overcome, and so am waiting for the official imate rom to be released....
hope it helps with some ideas and areas to consider
S.
ben2004uk; have a read of the wiki, it's all there should you wish to upgrade. It is fairly simple.
Freeze's gone
Ok, I feel a lot better. I've moved the one critical today add-in (weather) to main memory. I've only occassionally accessed the external storage. But with that configuration I now was able to go about 5 days without a freeze!
So I conclude that the storage card is not waking up quick enough or something like that. Other people have said it, but don't put any "always running" or "today related" software on the storage card.
I'm still on 1.18 ROMs, but I think I'll hold off for a while before upgrading. I just don't feel like rebuilding the machine right now.
how to determine ROM versions.
ben2004uk said:
I just experienced my first freeze on my Vario II (UK).
I got the phone on saturday, and used it for the first time as an alarm clock yesterday and everything was great (sunday I forgot to turn it off silent - boo that you have to remember).
This morning my alarm didn't go off, when I woke up the phone had frozen and wouldn't display anything - but the light was still flashing. I haven't got a MicroSD yet.
Would I have the latest ROM as I have only just got the phone? If not, how do I upgrade or find out what version of the ROM I have?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It took me the longest time to find this as the wiki did not address it. go the start menu, then settings. Then click on the system tab at the bottom. Select the Device Information control panel. Now go to the TyTN wiki: http://wiki.xda-developers.com/index.php?pagename=Hermes_Upgrades
and review your options. At Feb 1, 2007, 1.35 appears to be the latest official one.
Is anyone else getting random lockups on their phone? it seems like no matter what rom i use it locks up at least once or twice a day. it seems that sense is the only thing that does lock up, as i cant hit the home button and have it go back to it.
anyone?
yeah, it happens to me too...to the point I have to remove the battery
Same here, it usually locks up once every 24 hours or so, and most times it's not even a full lockup, just the homescreen does. cause i can hit the windows button, and end button will lock the phone, just the main Today screen. Sometimes time fixes it, and it'll fix itself. but most times i take battery out
It all has to do with sense.....Horrible i know
eosrider said:
Is anyone else getting random lockups on their phone? it seems like no matter what rom i use it locks up at least once or twice a day. it seems that sense is the only thing that does lock up, as i cant hit the home button and have it go back to it.
anyone?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have had the same problem sense I purchased on Mar 24th, after trying to restore the devise 4 times within a 2 week period, I finally took it back and exchanged it for a new one, less than 24 hours, the new one froze up on me too. I searched through many forums such as this, and found that many users are having the same problem, I also read in one that the cause may be in the SD card that comes with the devise (the way it's formatted for use with it), so, 4 days ago, I removed the SD card, and the devise has worked flawless, no freeze ups, and for the last 2 days, I have not turned the devise off, and still no freeze ups. I plan on giving it a week, and if it does not freeze up on me, I'll put the card back in. I reformatted the SD card to get rid of the Double twist program, and the other apps such as the demo games, and put my music, Documents, and Photos back on it, hoping that it will work as a normal SD card when I put it back in.
Give it a try as I did, it just may be that simple fix everyone has been looking for.
Also, just for info, I'm running the stock USTMO ROM, with Cookies Home tab version 1.7 on it, Awesome and Flawless, if you don't want to flash a new ROM, you have got to at least install this add on.
I'll keep you posted on whether or not my test is successful or not
Same here
I've hard reset this thing, seriously, 20 times. Same setup as yours. I will try the sd card removal. Thanks for sharing the info.
depgary said:
I have had the same problem sense I purchased on Mar 24th, after trying to restore the devise 4 times within a 2 week period, I finally took it back and exchanged it for a new one, less than 24 hours, the new one froze up on me too. I searched through many forums such as this, and found that many users are having the same problem, I also read in one that the cause may be in the SD card that comes with the devise (the way it's formatted for use with it), so, 4 days ago, I removed the SD card, and the devise has worked flawless, no freeze ups, and for the last 2 days, I have not turned the devise off, and still no freeze ups. I plan on giving it a week, and if it does not freeze up on me, I'll put the card back in. I reformatted the SD card to get rid of the Double twist program, and the other apps such as the demo games, and put my music, Documents, and Photos back on it, hoping that it will work as a normal SD card when I put it back in.
Give it a try as I did, it just may be that simple fix everyone has been looking for.
Also, just for info, I'm running the stock USTMO ROM, with Cookies Home tab version 1.7 on it, Awesome and Flawless, if you don't want to flash a new ROM, you have got to at least install this add on.
I'll keep you posted on whether or not my test is successful or not
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
depgary,
Thanks for that bit of information. I went ahead and formatted my my sd card today. (Fat32, 32kb allocation unit size.) the phone hasn't locked up yet. i feel that by this amount of time i would have seen one. i'll post another reply if it locks any time soon. thanks guys!
eosrider said:
depgary,
Thanks for that bit of information. I went ahead and formatted my my sd card today. (Fat32, 32kb allocation unit size.) the phone hasn't locked up yet. i feel that by this amount of time i would have seen one. i'll post another reply if it locks any time soon. thanks guys!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, It's been 6 days and no freeze ups with the SD card removed, tomorrow I'll put the reformatted SD card back in and test it further, so far, so good
Here's a question: Do you think T-Mobile put the fastest SD cards on the market in this phone?
I simply changed the provided card for one that I purchased a week or so before I got the phone on launch day. No problems.
The ones Tmobile put in there are cheap class 2 cards. Reformatting the card has seemed to help. You would probably have better luck with a class 6 card. I'm going to wait till the price of the 32gig cards come down then get one.
EDIT: OK so I reformatted my card and its only showing 14gigs of storage, I know its not going to be exactly 16gigs of storage but I should have more than that. Anyone else have this issue?
depgary said:
I have had the same problem sense I purchased on Mar 24th, after trying to restore the devise 4 times within a 2 week period, I finally took it back and exchanged it for a new one, less than 24 hours, the new one froze up on me too. I searched through many forums such as this, and found that many users are having the same problem, I also read in one that the cause may be in the SD card that comes with the devise (the way it's formatted for use with it), so, 4 days ago, I removed the SD card, and the devise has worked flawless, no freeze ups, and for the last 2 days, I have not turned the devise off, and still no freeze ups. I plan on giving it a week, and if it does not freeze up on me, I'll put the card back in. I reformatted the SD card to get rid of the Double twist program, and the other apps such as the demo games, and put my music, Documents, and Photos back on it, hoping that it will work as a normal SD card when I put it back in.
Give it a try as I did, it just may be that simple fix everyone has been looking for.
Also, just for info, I'm running the stock USTMO ROM, with Cookies Home tab version 1.7 on it, Awesome and Flawless, if you don't want to flash a new ROM, you have got to at least install this add on.
I'll keep you posted on whether or not my test is successful or not
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would like to try this myself. does anybody know what class card comes with the new motorola droids? I'm thinking of switching out my card with girlfriend's.
SEscobedo said:
I would like to try this myself. does anybody know what class card comes with the new motorola droids? I'm thinking of switching out my card with girlfriend's.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
droids come with a 8gb.
Still without issue, no lockups.
I also noticed that it was only 14.x gb free. i think its normal though.
eosrider said:
droids come with a 8gb.
Still without issue, no lockups.
I also noticed that it was only 14.x gb free. i think its normal though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think you are wrong as she just got the phone and it definitely has a 16gb card.
defective phone
i think the ramdom lock-ups are associated with the phone and not the custom ROMs. i've flashed about 6 different TMO-US rom from here and they all lock up my phone. so they all can't be bad, right? well, the other thing i noticed was that when it did lock up, i could feel the bottom-half of the phone was hot, right below the battery cover. i think my phone is defective because if i multi-task, it gets hot then locks up. i'm going to return it for a new one. anyone else have this problem?
nick714
depgary said:
Well, It's been 6 days and no freeze ups with the SD card removed, tomorrow I'll put the reformatted SD card back in and test it further, so far, so good
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well folks, I put the reformatted SD card back in, while I was scrolling through my pictures testing out the card, guess what, the devise froze up, had to reset it, about 4 hours later, while going through the pictures again, it froze up again, reset it. Then, as before, after a long charge, the phone would not wake up, had to reset again, that's 3 times sense I put the SD card back in. To test the card out thoroughly, I watched Transformer part 1 to the end, and no freeze up, so I cannot say if the SD card is bad, I'm getting ready to try a new card now.
The problem may be with the Devise's SD driver. Another thing I noticed is that with the card out, the battery lasted a good 50% longer
This is just my test, but, it seems to me the devise runs better without the SD card installed.
I'll return with an update after the new SD card test run
****Update: Tried the new SD card, the devise froze up while scrolling through the pictures. I don't believe it's the SD cards, seems like a glitch in the SD hardware or the SD driver. My devise works just fine without the SD card installed, who would think that it may be the SD drivers causing the freeze ups. I wonder how long it will take for HTC or WinMo to accept and fix the problem.
Is there a developer on this thread that can come up with a fix, or a better SD driver software?
nick714 said:
i think the ramdom lock-ups are associated with the phone and not the custom ROMs. i've flashed about 6 different TMO-US rom from here and they all lock up my phone. so they all can't be bad, right? well, the other thing i noticed was that when it did lock up, i could feel the bottom-half of the phone was hot, right below the battery cover. i think my phone is defective because if i multi-task, it gets hot then locks up. i'm going to return it for a new one. anyone else have this problem?
nick714
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same here, the back of my phone would be hot as well, try removing the SD card for a few days, as I did, and see if your phone stops freezing up, mine seems to work great without the card installed, and the battery last longer.
will buy a new one and see
i def think its the card, maybe it gets hot when you charge/ run heavy apps like wifi and when it goes to read the card it miss reads and freezes, cause i install all apps on my card as to not clutter the fone just yet, i will def be buying a new sdcard and probably swapping out cards hahaha and returning old stock one. hahah thus having a sweet better class 16g card for free
I get frequent lockups with Sense, but when I switch to the standard Winmo interface, it never locks up. I don't think it's the memory card as much as HTC's sense.
lock up exiting messaging
I have had the phone since the 14th, I am running the stock T-Mobile USA rom (not flashing another rom until I decide if I'm going to keep the phone) The only time that I have had the phone lock up is when exiting the messaging tab on Sense.
It seems to have started after I updated the myphone application in order to back up text messages.
I've had the phone for about a week now, and it's been really crash-prone and unstable for the first couple of days. I previously had an HD7 for 4 weeks, so I immediately set up my DVP like I had the HD7 set up.
It was so buggy, I hard reset at least a couple of times in those few days. My most recent hard reset was on Sunday, and lo and behold, I didn't experience any crashes for 4 days!
That started me thinking. The difference between the previous hard reset and the current hard reset was that I hadn't loaded many apps or any mp3s yet - so I loaded the same amount of MP3s as I had before (about 8gb) and immediately any new programs started crashing! In fact, I think just about anything that wrote to the disk exhibited errors, from newly downloaded and installed apps to existing apps which does disk I/O. The marketplace crashed all the time while downloading or installing apps.
My best guess as to the cause of the issue is that the SD card is corrupting data. As long as you are using the internal storage, everything runs fine - but once data is written to the SD card, things are getting corrupted. I'm not sure about this, it's just a guess.
At the OS level, the internal storage is combined with the SD card into a single logical disk - AKA JBOD in RAID terms. I'm not sure about the OS-level algorithm it uses to determine whether or not to save to internal vs SD card, but my guess is that it writes to the internal first, then when that is exceeded, it writes to the SD card. Even after removing some MP3s, I still had crashes, so I'm guessing that it doesn't overwrite the same sectors that previously held data until all the "fresh" sectors have been used (ie it was still writing to the SD card).
If this is the case, then the culprits could be either A) Dell's crappy SD card drivers corrupting the data or B) a crappy quality SD card corrupting the data. Given their recent QC issues i'm inclined to think it's B - but I hope it's A because that would imply a software fix as opposed to having to replace hardware.
Either way, I'll write a program to test my hypothesis: It'll create a test files of a specific size and then read them back and check that the test data is correct.
Thoughts? Has anybody else noticed similar behavior after filling up their storage?
I suspected the SD card as well, which is why I included the remaining storage space in the options in the poll at http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=891295
That being said, some others have said that doing a system reset on their phone did not fix the crashing problems. There are 2 major unknown variables here of course - when the phone is using the SD card vs. internal memory, and whether everyone is experiencing the same type of crashing.
pjfan75 said:
I suspected the SD card as well, which is why I included the remaining storage space in the options in the poll at http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=891295
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if there were multiple causes for the all the crashes people are experiencing - most likely the SD card may be responsible for some of those, while other issues are causing more crashes.
Impossible to tell at the moment, though. But perhaps the reason why people associated wifi with crashing was that they were using the wifi to load more data than they were over 3G?
I've thought about the apps too. AP mobile is one that is involved on my list. Shazam, yelp, where, are others. I an make my hd7 crash with each of them. However, that does not eliminate sd card. Optimal read/write access speed will probably impact crash, lag, and performance.
Based on this thread it sounds like it's probably more of a driver issue.
alodar1 said:
I've thought about the apps too. AP mobile is one that is involved on my list. Shazam, yelp, where, are others. I an make my hd7 crash with each of them. However, that does not eliminate sd card. Optimal read/write access speed will probably impact crash, lag, and performance.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've used those apps on the HD7 and I don't think they ever crashed it - not nearly as often as the DVP crashes.
zaijian said:
But perhaps the reason why people associated wifi with crashing was that they were using the wifi to load more data than they were over 3G?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That and also at a much higher rate than 3G typically.
zaijian said:
Based on this thread it sounds like it's probably more of a driver issue.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't know if I would agree with that. I would hope that drivers would be the same on all devices. To have 1 fail and 20 not fail....is it driver? I would be curious to know what the failure rates would be. Sure we see alot of complaints here on this forum....but there is not a whole lot of traffic about failure of the DVP. All in All, I'm happy with the DVP. I also have a HD7...and I'm happy with that. I have them both sitting here...and when I make a decision to use a phone of my choice...I've chosen the DVP.
With all things being equal, if I get into a fight, the DVP can be used as a weapon.
I've used up quite a bit of storage but the only time I seem to get a crash is when I enable WiFi, otherwise my DVP seems to run stable.
efjay said:
I've used up quite a bit of storage but the only time I seem to get a crash is when I enable WiFi, otherwise my DVP seems to run stable.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have the same results, I went crash free for 2 days without WiFi I wanted to test it and turned it back on and it crashed within a few min.
I have a replacement coming from Dell but I doubt they will have it fixed. I'm hoping it would be something that can be fixed by an update.
Mine crashes too!!
I too am experiencing many of the issues that have been posted on this forum (crashing w/wo wifi, while in MP, or when an app needs data from the internet). Twice I have reached in my pocket, hit the power button to bring up the lock screen and nothing happens - just a blank screen. Hence had to pull the battery and reboot.
A couple of other things I have noticed that I am not sure I have seen on the forums. Does anyone else have a DVP where the top left edge and the bottom right edge are not flush with the bottom of the phone? It is slight, but I noticed it on day one. Also, I have a heck of a time with the accelerometer sticking. Sometimes it refuses to go back into portrait mode. No mater how I turn and twist it (360 deg).
Anyone else experience this?
I used to use the power button to get to the unlock screen, but after fumbling with it a few times in the dark, I switched to flipping out the keyboard, which does the same thing. And while it did often take multiple presses of the power button to wake the DVP, I have never had to pull the battery.
I've had the DVP since November 8th, and had it crash on my severely enough for a battery pull maybe 3-4 times tops. This is both on the "engineering" phone and the "retail" phone. The only difference I have with you guys - and this is pretty significant - is that I hacked my SD card pretty much within the first couple of days of getting it. I've upgraded to a SanDisk class 2 16GB.
Now, I haven't particularly filled it up; in fact, I have tons of space free. But, I'd like to set some facts straight:
1) The DVP has no internal storage. Just a few megs (~16MB or so) just so the OS can run if you pull the SD card. Nothing new here; we've seen this during the first days of the SD card hack thread.
2) If you fill up your storage, and applications request for IsolatedStorage, the request will most likely fail if you have (close to) zero storage free. If applications don't check for that, it will probably crash. I don't know if this is necessarily happening, since I don't have a crashing device to observe this behaviour, but that's one hunch. Some of you have said that the HD7 did not crash when you filled up the storage, which might throw my theory out the window.
3) The SD card used in the DVP is also a SanDisk - I tend to trust them with storage reliability. If it is indeed a driver issue, then Microsoft might have some share in the blame as well - MS writes drivers for the OEMs for WP7.
What we need to do is scientifically reproduce the issue. Instead of general data corruption, another thing to check is to see what happens as storage gets filled up.
kltye said:
What we need to do is scientifically reproduce the issue. Instead of general data corruption, another thing to check is to see what happens as storage gets filled up.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I attempted to do just that - I wrote a storage test app and ran it on my DVP, and it encountered no issues.
The app wrote test data, filling up 95% of available free space (around 13.3GB), then read it back in and verified the data. I'm now fairly confident that it's not the SD card or the storage drivers that are responsible for the crashing.
I did however, encounter issues trying to download the Rise of Glory game. I had turned wifi off, but it's large enough that it requires wifi or sync in order to download and install. Once I turned wifi on and retried the download, the phone crashed on me.
Let's see if we can verify the wifi + marketplace issue:
1) make sure phone wifi is off
2) connect DVP to computer, run Zune
3) via zune sync, verify that you can install a large game or app on your phone. It has to be one which you haven't downloaded before, as I don't think you can force zune to reinstall an app it knows you already downloaded.
4) disconnect the phone
5) verify the game runs correctly
6) uninstall the game on the phone
7) turn phone wifi on
8) go into marketplace on the phone
9) reinstall the same game and see if you have any issues with marketplace while downloading (freezing/hanging/etc)
10) if everything's still ok, verify that the game runs correctly
@Zaijian
I tried reproducing your flow on my DVP and it didn't crash. But, what is strange is mine freezes (only twice so far) @ random right after playing and trying to get to some other app or switching between app. This tends me to side on the memory as being the culprit or some other component being the culprit. Most likely could be memory related and how WP7 manages to kill an app. Is there a memtest kind of thing we could run on this DVP?
I wrote a wifi transfer testing app and ran it overnight - it transferred 4GB over my wifi (from my desktop to the phone) correctly and without incident.
So, i've confirmed that:
A) there's nothing wrong with writing a single large file to the file system
B) there's nothing wrong with transferring data over wifi
My next tests will be:
1) simultaneously writing multiple large files to the file system
2) simultaneoulsy writing files to the file system and transferring data over wifi
3) some sort of memory test to see if memory is getting corrupted
WiFi seems to be the issue
Not much question that mine locks up when WiFi is turned on. I have been experimenting with this issue for the past few days and while having WiFi on causes random lock-ups, not having it on makes it run without any issues.
Fortunately, most of the areas I use my phone have good 3G coverage so WiFi acting up is not a deal breaker but I certainly hope they are able to fix this with the impending update.
One consideration is could there be an app we all have that uses WiFi that is causing trouble? Has anyone had issues with this from a fresh device? I seem to recall having it lock up early on before I put many apps on it.
jetjockgordo said:
Not much question that mine locks up when WiFi is turned on. I have been experimenting with this issue for the past few days and while having WiFi on causes random lock-ups, not having it on makes it run without any issues.
Fortunately, most of the areas I use my phone have good 3G coverage so WiFi acting up is not a deal breaker but I certainly hope they are able to fix this with the impending update.
One consideration is could there be an app we all have that uses WiFi that is causing trouble? Has anyone had issues with this from a fresh device? I seem to recall having it lock up early on before I put many apps on it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My problems seem to occur when I'm going through the marketplace and downloading via wifi.
I verified with my test app that wifi can transfer a large amount of data without errors. This leads me to believe that the wifi itself is not the cause of the issues, but that wifi in combination with other factors may be the cause.
zaijian said:
My problems seem to occur when I'm going through the marketplace and downloading via wifi.
I verified with my test app that wifi can transfer a large amount of data without errors. This leads me to believe that the wifi itself is not the cause of the issues, but that wifi in combination with other factors may be the cause.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I thought so too but I left the WiFi on and rebooting without accessing Marketplace has been causing lockups as well. In fact, I just noticed it was locked up after a reboot 10 minutes ago and, sure enough, I left WiFi on. I didn't so much as unlock the screen after the reboot although I have also had it lock up while accessing Marketplace.
jetjockgordo said:
I thought so too but I left the WiFi on and rebooting without accessing Marketplace has been causing lockups as well. In fact, I just noticed it was locked up after a reboot 10 minutes ago and, sure enough, I left WiFi on. I didn't so much as unlock the screen after the reboot although I have also had it lock up while accessing Marketplace.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'll test using wifi simultaneously with local disk I/O and see if that causes errors.
Hi all,
A few of us on the SD card list thread have tried this and it seems to be stablizing things....the theory as we are working with now is that the problem is due to a power control issue in the Samsung drivers for the phone, not especially in the card itself.
No ill effects have been reported as of yet, and the battery life seems to be on par with before the switch was made. It is a simple fix, and can be reversed easily.
I ran the phone for 2 months without a card, and with these keys toggled, it is actually FASTER than it was. I don't fully believe it, but it has been over a week and rock solid.
First off, you need to dev unlock your phone. See the thread here for simple and complete instructions: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=938106
Next off, you need to toggle the following 3 registry keys in the Registry Editor provided in the above post:
The keys have to do with MMC (internal memory) power management.The big speed improvements is in games/apps (Fruit Ninja opens and operates leaps and bounds faster than it did when the phone did stock!)
Code:
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE>Drivers>SDCARD>ClientDrivers>Class>MMC_Class>DisablePowerManagement (Change to 0)
Code:
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE>Drivers>SDCARD>ClientDrivers>Class>MMC_Class>High_Capacity>DisablePowerManagement (Change to 0)
Code:
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE>Drivers>SDCARD>ClientDrivers>Class>SDMemory_Class>DisablePowerManagement (Change to 0)
One point of note here, do not be afraid if the phone locks up the first time soft resetting after these changes, mine did and it was fine after a battery pull.
Also, I would be interested to hear any theories about why this one made such a big difference when it seemingly affects only the internal storage. Maybe because the two storage devices are "bridged" by WP7?
Comment below with your experiences please!
If this gets enough test results, we will submit it to Microsoft. Thanks!
As I already mentioned:
Up to now I just did the SD card registry hack. The device is now stable for over 3 days, longer than ever before.
Battery life wasn't noticable affected, lasted for around 40h with moderate usage (thumbs up indeed).
In fact without this registry hack I wasn't able to get down to an empty battery without those reboting/dataloss issues.
But I need some more days, then I will change the MMC registry key also.
No speed improvements mentioned up to now.
I applied the hack to all three keys. So far, it is much less laggy. Not sure if that will return after 4+ weeks as before, but here's a pretty cool side effect:
After the hack, my screen does not stop responding to touch when the phone is placed on my desk or a soft surface, like a couch cushon. It was getting really annoying because I often place mu phone on my desk during the day for easy access, but every time I tried to onlock it, it would not respond unless I picked it up. Sometimes, it's nice to leave it lying down and operate it. Couldn't do that before, but I can now! WooHoo! Thank you for this.
I'll report back if it starts up again in a couple weeks.
Sent from my Focus WP7 using Board Express
Whoa! I just tested this and you are correct! More proof that the Samsung power drivers are full of problems. Who would have thought?
For testing purpose I changed the MMC Keys also and made some Videos (no I won't upload them). There were absoluteley no differences in app loading times (ok, i know the longer loading apps are pretty much all stored on the sd card, ) and also not in overall performance, although this isn't provable easily.
I changed the keys back to normal, but kept the sd card key change to 0.
I address the positive speed effects to sdcard key for now. Perhaps i will make some tests without any reg change in the next few days.
Still stable as hell!
Edit: Damn I forgot to test the not responding problem (even though i didn't notice it that often and badly)
Sebo1985 said:
For testing purpose I changed the MMC Keys also and made some Videos (no I won't upload them). There were absoluteley no differences in app loading times (ok, i know the longer loading apps are pretty much all stored on the sd card, ) and also not in overall performance, although this isn't provable easily.
I changed the keys back to normal, but kept the sd card key change to 0.
I address the positive speed effects to sdcard key for now. Perhaps i will make some tests without any reg change in the next few days.
Still stable as hell!
Edit: Damn I forgot to test the not responding problem (even though i didn't notice it that often and badly)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As I mentioned above, I'm hoping it's not just a result of resetting something and it still returns in a few weeks. Although, the thing about the screen touch response not working when laying on something is COMPLETELY GONE! That alone is worth the setting change. It really was annoying for me the way I use the phone. Thank you to eveyone involved in finding this setting.
PS: From my perception, I don't believe my battery is behaving any differently. Although, I would imagine if it were scientifically tested, it surely would be using slightly more juice. But it still had the normal amount left in the evening, and I probably used it slightly more testing it out. Maybe getting the screen to perform better uses less power?
For the sake of completeness: I set the sd card key back to 1, and I do not experience any slow down in overall performance or in app loading times. Still I cannot reproduce any of those not responding issues you mentioned.
For today and tomorrow I will stay with this setting an will wait for a random reboot. Let's see what and when it happens.
tried this with a 16gb class2 sandisk... loaded it up to 9.25 left and the reboot monster came... but it was weird... it would rebllt like every 30 sec with no loss then poof all lost...then rendom self reboot all mem would reappear and start the reboot process all over.... now it didnt do this till it was unplugged.... plugged in it was fine... reformatted... re set up did the tweak... loaded and the same as before... so for me no... but im going to test it with another card on the list... heres to hoping....
but it does fix the sitting on the bed and unresponsive gimmick.....
So would this be worthwhile even for someone without an sdcard? For the screen response issue i mean. It's so annoying haha.
edit: Screw it i went ahead and did it hah. It def fixed the touch screen responsiveness issue!
Which cards?
Can you guys post the specific SD cards you are testing this with. I am curious to see if somebody has tested it with the Sandisk class 2 32gb card. Thanks.
knwldg0010 said:
Can you guys post the specific SD cards you are testing this with. I am curious to see if somebody has tested it with the Sandisk class 2 32gb card. Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sebo's testing with a SanDisk Class 4 32GB card which ended up being more stable (before it failed and before he tried the registry stuff) than the Class 2s from Sandisk.
Based on what you have read, would it be best to get rid of the class 2 32gb card or wait to see if there is an actual fix? Since this seems to be a power issue based on the fix, does it really matter what class it is then? Thanks.
knwldg0010 said:
Based on what you have read, would it be best to get rid of the class 2 32gb card or wait to see if there is an actual fix? Since this seems to be a power issue based on the fix, does it really matter what class it is then? Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Something to keep in mind is that this registry hack is relatively new. Some people managed to go for weeks without issues on an unmodified WP7 with a card. It's entirely possible that these hacks are just a stopgap, or a reset, and actually *fix* nothing.
Theoretically, the card shouldn't matter. If I hadn't locked my 32GB Class 4 Kingston to my old (bricked) Focus, I would try it with the current one and see if doing the registry tweaks fixes the slow sync issue on it. Someone in the SD Card List thread claims to have done the registry tweaks and it ended up failing badly too with a 16GB Class 2 Sandisk. However, the 16GB Class 2 Sandisk is one of the more reliable ones (without tweaks) through the limited testing this board has done, so it's possible he has a bad card.
In brief, it shouldn't matter (within reason) what brand/class/capacity you use. If this tweak is the real deal, it should work, especially if your only concern is random reboots. However, you still would want to avoid cards with extremely high class ratings at typically their random read/write is slow (which the most common usage of the storage in WP7). In terms of performance, there's no guarantee as to what these tweaks will do as the only consistent change has been that phones that would constantly reboot due to their cards aren't (yet).
However, to answer your initial question, I don't believe anyone has tested a Class 2 Sandisk 32GB card. I wouldn't put too much faith that your card will have the exact same results as Sebo's class 4 because we aren't certain what the cause is. We believe it's power, but we're not 100% sure. If you're already using the card in your phone, you don't really have much to lose. If you're not using it yet, then you only have something to lose if you, like me, don't have a Nokia/Symbian phone that you can use to reformat the card if it fails.
Good post fishface.... That's where most are thinking its a fix.. This is just a theory right now.. That's why there's another post wanting testers... my find was it did fix the sensitivity issue...theres no doubt on my end.. But card wise my 16gb class2 SanDisk worked before I tried this until I hit 15gb used... Then it went goofy... I tried it 5 times.. Same thing. Just about 15gb used was where the instability happened. Soon as the reg hack hit I read thru it.. I love reg edits.. Made my Omnia 2 &hd2 quite decent phones... That's when I saw the mention of others thinking this too.. So I took my 16gb class2 SanDisk that I freshly brought back to life, and decided to test it out... I posted the results before... Plugged in no issue.. Unplugged it went goofy at 12.7 used... I was stable at that point before without the edits... Not saying it doesn't help but it made mine worse... I'm still going to try other cards though .. I do think there is something to this... I might try different scenarios of the edit... What's it going to hurt..i mean were here for the same goal to help find a solution... Well except the lurkers..you all know who you are..lol. But again. Great post fishface...
Thanks for all of the info. I guess fix is the wrong word to use, but i was just trying to get an idea of what others have done. Whenever i would pass the 10gb mark, mine would do a full wipe after a couple of restarts. I still have my 32gb card in my phone, because there really is no point of taking it out and possibly loosing it. Plus i was hoping an official fix would come out so i could just apply the patch. I have been waiting to see when the MS update would come out so i could do a full backup before running test. Thank you for your help.
anyone tried messing with block sizes? Default is 128. I'm wondering if maybe your sd card has trouble with that block size its causing the lagginess. Who knows lol....
Sent from my SGH-i917 using Board Express
Also I'm still using my 32gb Kingston class 4. I have all 3 keys set to 0. And its still going strong other than that one reset I had. MMC block size 128 sd block size 128. If my sd card can't handle that large of a block size I would have instability.
Sent from my SGH-i917 using Board Express
Anyone know if this also fixes the song stuttering issue? That's definitely power related since it only happens in the last couple of seconds of a song if the screen is off. One you turn it back on, the music plays perfectly.
jeffgeno said:
Anyone know if this also fixes the song stuttering issue? That's definitely power related since it only happens in the last couple of seconds of a song if the screen is off. One you turn it back on, the music plays perfectly.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I haven't had a chance to test that yet but I'll post if I have any issues
Sent from my SGH-i917 using Board Express
I'm stuck. Made it through the first three downloads and have my phone unlocked.
Followed Registry Editor link and downloaded RegistryEditor 1.1.0.0.xap. My computer will not open up this file because it doesn't know what program to use, so I tried to download it straight to my phone and my phone says it doesn't support xap. What steps am I missing?
How do I get into the registry to change the three tabs?
This sucks. I got a 16 GB model some time ago expecting marshmallow and a good microSD card to be the ticket. I have a Sandisk Ultra 128 Gb class 10 card which is well regarded for speed and reliability. I FINALLY got Marshmallow recently and went through the process of getting my card reformatted for adaptive storage. I was surprised during the process that the phone gave me a warning that the card was slow and I may experience problems, but I pressed on.
Everything seemed to work fine after the 'conversion' and the phone seemed snappy enough. Though I hadn't yet installed any new programs in the new configuration. I merely backed up photos and audio media that was being stored on the card, and then restored them to their proper location after the reformat to integrate the card with internal storage.
I then installed some apps I had removed to make space on internal storage previously. Now the phone is totally unusable. I get about 1-3 minutes of usage after boot before it hangs up on a screen, or with the notification shade pulled down. The phone just totaly freezes; I can't even power it down (need to look up how to force it to shut down).
What have I gotten myself into? Why would that card be considered 'slow and/or inadequate' when I purchased it less than 6 months ago and it is rated a good and fast card?
Any suggestions on how to proceed? I need and counted on the combined storage capability (or I never would have gone or the 16 Gb model).
Thanks for any help.
oh, and random reboots and also the screen going blank but the phone not actually being off (battery died really fast) overnight. I'm trying to get into the bootloader and do traditional things like clearing dalvik cache (is that current? I haven't done much rooting and messing around with the guts of Andriod since Kit Kat), etc.
I had to revert too. Limited TWRP support, very slow apps, couldn't connect via USB to the SD storage. I bought the 16GB thinking the same thing. Was a mistake as of now.
Besides not being able to do anything with the card in TWRP, I'm having no problems using adaptive storage, and I too use a 128GB SanDisk Ultra.
Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk
I'm not worried about TWRP. I'm actually content with the phone non-rooted if adaptive storage works, since it's not carrier locked and I can do things that previously Verizon wouldn't let me. I'm not interested in mucking around with new ROM's and stuff anymore; too busy with other tinkering projects and i have plenty of other viable devices to do that with (amazon phone and tablet, older android phones, etc.). I want this one to be a stock daily driver; but I want it to f'ing work as indicated.
I just got done doing a factory reset, formatting the SD card as internal and restoring (system tool; is that a Moto thing or Lollipop+?). We'll see how it goes. I may just have mucked it up trying to convert to adaptive storage after having used it with Lollipop AND even moving some apps to the SD card.