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I just got a new nexus one swapped 2 days ago from HTC under warranty. I'm running MIUI on the new nexus and I just noticed that my notification bar burned onto the screen. I had MIUI on the last nexus for about a month and nothing happened to the screen, had to get it changed for different reason.
I was thinking it was due to the fact that miui's notification bar is transparent or somehow the screen didn't turn off during the night, but then all of the other things(icon, etc.) would have burned onto the screen.
Im going to call HTC and find out what they have to say. But does anyone have any insight to this. I really dont want to leave MIUI, really like that rom.
This is going to be a risk you run with refurbed Nexus Ones. Most people run them with white notification bars. I have two Nexus Ones and even being careful I have some burn-in. I run my everyday Nexus with a black notification bar and still there is slight burn in(uneven wear). I've never personally seen a Nexus without some form of burn in(uneven wear) from the notification bar. It is the most persistent part of the UI, even when you hide it with something like LauncherPro, etc.., it will pop up when in the market, and other apps that do not have the option to hide it. etc..
I'm running mine with the stock white notification bar as I'm 100% stock. I don't see any burn in on my screen. Any ways to check with an app that makes it more visible?
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App
msavic6 said:
I'm running mine with the stock white notification bar as I'm 100% stock. I don't see any burn in on my screen. Any ways to check with an app that makes it more visible?
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App
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Click to collapse
try going in to the Gmail app, then go in to an email with not much text and scroll down until you have a white screen, and look at the left side of the screen(in landscape) against the white background.
that said, if you do not notice it now, I WOULD NOT GO LOOKING FOR IT...you will most likely find it and it will start bothering you.
I guess thats why gingerbread went with black notification bar.
I only notice the burn in on my N1 when I'm on Google's homepage
Old MuckenMire said:
try going in to the Gmail app, then go in to an email with not much text and scroll down until you have a white screen, and look at the left side of the screen(in landscape) against the white background.
that said, if you do not notice it now, I WOULD NOT GO LOOKING FOR IT...you will most likely find it and it will start bothering you.
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Click to collapse
I'm not gonna look for it as I wont be able to forget about it.
Hopefully gingerbread shows up soon so the black notification bar wont burn into my screen.
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App
Old MuckenMire said:
try going in to the Gmail app, then go in to an email with not much text and scroll down until you have a white screen, and look at the left side of the screen(in landscape) against the white background.
that said, if you do not notice it now, I WOULD NOT GO LOOKING FOR IT...you will most likely find it and it will start bothering you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, I noticed it using Floating Image myself, a nifty program that floats images from your camera dirs and the internet past you. Noticed the notification bar area looked odd, then looked closer and realized it was darker.
I've since started using a ROM with a dark notification bar, maybe mitigate it a bit, although I suspect the clock being in the same place all the time will burn up there too.
Too much for not looking for it. I just went on the Google homepage in landscape and I saw a tiny tiny bit of burn in like barely noticable. So I turned my brightness to Max to see if it was more visible and I couldn't see it on 100% brightness. Only when its on lowest brightness am I able to see the burn in. Good enough for me
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App
khaytsus said:
Yeah, I noticed it using Floating Image myself, a nifty program that floats images from your camera dirs and the internet past you. Noticed the notification bar area looked odd, then looked closer and realized it was darker.
I've since started using a ROM with a dark notification bar, maybe mitigate it a bit, although I suspect the clock being in the same place all the time will burn up there too.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yeah pretty much anything that is persistent is going to possibly cause an issue. I'm glad Google is going with black now. I think it looks better and is safer for our AMOLED screens. As far as I know, this is not an issue for folks with SLCD Nexus ones since LCD phosphors have a much higher half life so do not show this issue until you are pretty much ready to upgrade your device....if it ever shows. LCD tech is much further advanced in this area than AMOLED.
msavic6 said:
Too much for not looking for it. I just went on the Google homepage in landscape and I saw a tiny tiny bit of burn in like barely noticable. So I turned my brightness to Max to see if it was more visible and I couldn't see it on 100% brightness. Only when its on lowest brightness am I able to see the burn in. Good enough for me
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App
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Click to collapse
Just be careful of using high brightness: it will age the pixels quicker and make it even more noticeable. Best thing to do is use a launcher like Launcher pro and hide the bar as much as you can for awhile to "wipe" the worn pixels. Same with any apps that allow for hiding the notification bar in settings. That will improve it some and then you can use the black bar that will come with Gingerbread and you should be good. It wont be gone 100% but will be barely visible at that point.
Old MuckenMire said:
Just be careful of using high brightness: it will age the pixels quicker and make it even more noticeable. Best thing to do is use a launcher like Launcher pro and hide the bar as much as you can for awhile to "wipe" the worn pixels. Same with any apps that allow for hiding the notification bar in settings. That will improve it some and then you can use the black bar that will come with Gingerbread and you should be good. It wont be gone 100% but will be barely visible at that point.
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Click to collapse
I always leave my brightness on automatic and now i hid the notification bar in launcher pro. i'm set until gingerbread
My 2nd hand Nexus One has burn in of the title bar. TBH I'm not that bothered; its very unlikely I'll even still have this phone this time next year. How long do some of you folks really think you'll own this phone for? Its aged well, but in 12 months time, I reckon it'll be a pretty small percentage of people posting now who still use one of these with any regularity.
I just ignore it.
I do use a theme with a black bar now anyway.
I wonder if the SAMOLED stuff suffers this issue?
tameracingdriver said:
My 2nd hand Nexus One has burn in of the title bar. TBH I'm not that bothered; its very unlikely I'll even still have this phone this time next year. How long do some of you folks really think you'll own this phone for? Its aged well, but in 12 months time, I reckon it'll be a pretty small percentage of people posting now who still use one of these with any regularity.
I just ignore it.
I do use a theme with a black bar now anyway.
I wonder if the SAMOLED stuff suffers this issue?
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Click to collapse
I plan to use my nexus one until the end of 2011. I only got my phone in may 2010.
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App
msavic6 said:
I plan to use my nexus one until the end of 2011. I only got my phone in may 2010.
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Click to collapse
Yes, but I bet you'll replace it by then.
Same exact thing happen to me on a swap and the went me another one that was in perfect condition without hassle
Sent from my Nexus One
Buck Shot said:
Same exact thing happen to me on a swap and the went me another one that was in perfect condition without hassle
Sent from my Nexus One
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's been my experience with HTC, they've never hassled me about anything I've wanted help with. I sure wish they were making the next Google phone.
cant we make the notification bar more transparent using some sort of theme or something ??? :S
I just realized my screen has some burned in. I mean, like the clock on the top right side. When I'm viewing video, I could still see the stain of the clock. Does anyone have the problem?? I've switched ROM and still see the burned text/clock..
I repair TVs for a living. And if its true burn in ... its permanent ... however for that to occur you would of had to keep the screen on for quite a while and a steady long period of time
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA Premium App
It can happen. I have the AM/PM burned in on mine, but it's only noticeable if I use Screen Test app.
I suggest you toggle the AM/PM off if your ROM allows it and use a thinner font. It's also a good idea to avoid white or bright themes.
My phone is less than a year old and I've noticed the same thing too. I've noticed letters from the keyboard a few times too.
My Vibrant has the same thing. It's not noticeable most of the time for me so I dont mind. I also had a Captivate last year that had a blue tint burned in around the entire perimeter of the screen.
I've had my phone since august and no burn ins here.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using Tapatalk
Just call tmobile they will send a replacement. Ive sent two phones because of it.
Backup before you call. They will want you to do a factory restore for troubleshooting.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA Premium App
Me too. rush pipe game cause some temporary burn in on my phone. I stop playing the game.
AMOLED = Miniature Plasma's?
If our screens behave anything like a plasma i'm wondering if you can fix it by using a similar "screen wipe" method that is used in plasma's. A lot of plasma owners confuse Image Retention (IR) for Burn In (BI). Burn in will never go away, but image retention will. If you don't want to send your phone back, you may want to try using a flashlight application that turns your screen all white. That way your screen is firing at full brightness and hopefully it can get rid of those ghost images on your screen.
funny to come across this thread...seeing as i just noticed my stain yesterday.....same thing for me, its the clock
could this be grounds for a brand new device??
I had a slight burn in since December of the AM/PM. However since than I changed to Military time and now I can only see the M in the clock area. It also helped that I changed ROMs and such. However It can get annoying. I may just have it exchanged though. Knowing that I will most likely get a refurbished one...
It is because of the AM/PM burn in that I try to use the hide clock option in EDT roms and CM roms. No more burn in!
TopShelf10 said:
funny to come across this thread...seeing as i just noticed my stain yesterday.....same thing for me, its the clock
could this be grounds for a brand new device??
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Click to collapse
Have the same issue, though I only see it with the screen test application.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using Tapatalk
Paging Dr B said:
If our screens behave anything like a plasma i'm wondering if you can fix it by using a similar "screen wipe" method that is used in plasma's. A lot of plasma owners confuse Image Retention (IR) for Burn In (BI). Burn in will never go away, but image retention will. If you don't want to send your phone back, you may want to try using a flashlight application that turns your screen all white. That way your screen is firing at full brightness and hopefully it can get rid of those ghost images on your screen.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hmm, I guess if it isn't true burn in, that would work.
Only way to test that is if your getting a replacement for burn in, go ahead and try that, running your screen at full brightness all white, and see if it goes away.
Hey everyone!
Yesterday I noticed a blue bar at the top of my screen. It's my statusbar which has burned into my display. If I open a complete white screen, it's clearly visible (one can even see the clock, lol).
I didn't use my phone excessively, didn't use it as a night clock or something, I just used it actively ~3 hours a day.
I'm thinking about contacting Samsung as I bought it on 2nd March 2011 - so AFAIK I should still have warranty on it. I'm now asking myself what Samsung would do - either repairing it (I don't think so) or sending me a new device? I'm a bit afraid that they will send me a i9001 since the i9000 is not manufactured anymore.
Has anybody else experienced similar problems with AMOLEDs from Samsung and can tell me something about their warranty regulations?
Best Regards and thanks in advance, guys!
Blue
BlueFlame4 said:
Hey everyone!
Yesterday I noticed a blue bar at the top of my screen. It's my statusbar which has burned into my display. If I open a complete white screen, it's clearly visible (one can even see the clock, lol).
I didn't use my phone excessively, didn't use it as a night clock or something, I just used it actively ~3 hours a day.
I'm thinking about contacting Samsung as I bought it on 2nd March 2011 - so AFAIK I should still have warranty on it. I'm now asking myself what Samsung would do - either repairing it (I don't think so) or sending me a new device? I'm a bit afraid that they will send me a i9001 since the i9000 is not manufactured anymore.
Has anybody else experienced similar problems with AMOLEDs from Samsung and can tell me something about their warranty regulations?
Best Regards and thanks in advance, guys!
Blue
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have not had this problem and my sgs is 2 years old. And I doubt that you will get a new one because it is not made anyway. They will probably just repair it.
Good luck!
Sent from my GT-I9000 using xda app-developers app
The problem is less pronounced with the sgs 1 compared to the sgs 2 but it is definitely there. The status bar displays the same stuff all of the time and it is prone to screen burn in . Try one of the amoled burn in apps on the market and see if they help your device or not. They didnt remove the problem entirely but at least I don't get this obvious blue line across the top of my screen when I watch videos or do anything else in landscape.
I've got the exact same problem . Its mostly on the top left of the screen(status bar area) and very light bluish tint throughout the status bar. Doesn't bother me too much though.
BTW I use my phone a lot.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using Tapatalk 2
The point is that I read a lot of scripts and books on my screen and thus the blue bar is quite annoying. What do I have to consider when I send it back to Samsung?
My idea was to flash a stock ROM from sammobile and wipe everything. Do I have to do more (e.g. downgrade Bootloader or something)?
I havent't faced any issue like this
I really doubt samsung will do anything about it.. They most likely sent it back as "everything is fine" i think it's very rare they switch screens (or phones). I think it's just user traces...
2Pietjuh2 said:
I really doubt samsung will do anything about it.. They most likely sent it back as "everything is fine" i think it's very rare they switch screens (or phones). I think it's just user traces...
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Click to collapse
Well, actually it's not just a trace from usage. If I cracked my display or something similar, THAT would be a usage trace. I see what I can do... Not sure though if I should really send it back since I love my i9000
Blue is known to be the worst color for screen burn in on amoled, which begs the question....why blue ics theme Samsung?
Sent from my GT-I9300 using xda premium
Dammit, my second i9000 got this 2. It ran stock for my friend, and the menu icons like contacts, messaging, browser and apps got burnt in... it's unbearable.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using xda premium
DanielSanchez said:
Dammit, my second i9000 got this 2. It ran stock for my friend, and the menu icons like contacts, messaging, browser and apps got burnt in... it's unbearable.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using xda premium
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Click to collapse
Possibly a defective unit? Under normal circumstances, in no way should this happen unless you leave the screen on at high brightness displaying the same stuff for an extended period of time.
I max out the brightness of my SGS since day 1 and I only notice burn in on the status bar. Although I admit, I have changed from Touchwiz launcher to launcher pro, adw ex, go, zeam, apex, nova, lightning, back to zeam and now Apex, so the icons on my launchers and home screens have shifted quite a bit in position thus eliminating the possibility of burn in. You do have to make sure that you do not display the same stuff for an extended period of time using OLED displays.
Anybody else have this odd screen glitch anywhere on their display. Its like half a second white flash once in a while when I'm on Tapatalk, or the Amazon app or other apps.
Maybe its a bad display of my G4 or a 5.1 bug?
Edit....
I've since replaced my G4 with another new one with zero issues.
Should of added more to the poll, but my G4 is with TMO USA. Maybe the glitch is carrier independent.
Ever figure out the cause? I'm debating returning the phone
I saw this today on an H815 unlocked model on display at Best Buy. Only saw it when looking at a particular photo with a bunch of horizontal lines on it.
dipole said:
Ever figure out the cause? I'm debating returning the phone
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Click to collapse
I think a software update should fix this or apps updated to support LP 5.1. I've only seen the glitch when I'm using an app, never on home page, or dialer, etc.
Hopefully its not a display defect.
gtg465x said:
I saw this today on an H815 unlocked model on display at Best Buy. Only saw it when looking at a particular photo with a bunch of horizontal lines on it.
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Click to collapse
Odd...
Nothing as described on my TMO variant.
could it be because the phone is in game mode which is a battery saving mode.
Here's the image I saw this problem on yesterday. Download it to your device, open it in the LG gallery app, and in portrait orientation, double tap the image to zoom in a bit. I saw the flickering on the stairs in the picture.
http://www.colbybrownphotography.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/Vista-House-HDR-LG-G4.jpg
gtg465x said:
Here's the image I saw this problem on yesterday. Download it to your device, open it in the LG gallery app, and in portrait orientation, double tap the image to zoom in a bit. I saw the flickering on the stairs in the picture.
http://www.colbybrownphotography.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/Vista-House-HDR-LG-G4.jpg
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nope.. mine seems fine..
Am I supposed to scroll around really quickly while zoomed in or something?
Just picked up my white Verizon g4 last night, haven't noticed this problem
Today on an international version, while using internet app to read this site, the screen gently faded really white, then a few seconds later faded back to normal again. It continued like this for prob 30 seconds. Leaving the app didn't help, but getting some black colour on the screen stopped it. No idea why it was happening... Something iffy with the display and maybe power saving though. Nervy now!
Sfkn2 said:
Nope.. mine seems fine..
Am I supposed to scroll around really quickly while zoomed in or something?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, it happens while you are not moving the image or touching the screen at all. Might not work with that exact image I linked because the image on the device, while the same picture, was at a higher resolution I believe.
edit: I'll go back to the Best Buy today and film the issue so people can see what we're talking about.
Well only 3 people with this glitch? Maybe we have a defective display! I have 14 days to exchange it for another new one.
If your having this problem, please do the poll. Thanks
MicroMod777 said:
Well only 3 people with this glitch? Maybe we have a defective display! I have 14 days to exchange it for another new one.
If your having this problem, please do the poll. Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I suspect all have it, but it's hard to trigger. After I get a video of it at Best Buy, I plan to go around to some other stores like AT&T and see if the demo units there also have it.
Well crap. It was less noticeable on the G4 at Best Buy today. I could just barely see the flickering with my eyes, and it was impossible to capture on camera, at least without a tripod.
gtg465x said:
Well crap. It was less noticeable on the G4 at Best Buy today. I could just barely see the flickering with my eyes, and it was impossible to capture on camera, at least without a tripod.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But you did see the flicker. I've noticed it could be a super fast flicker barily noticilbe to a 2 second square section looking like a static tv like on the movie poltergeist.
Yeah it's really quick, too quick to get a screenshot. It's mainly on scrollable apps. Just a thought, anyone using nova launcher? Maybe it's an artifact
TMO G4 here and I get a screen glitch occasionally. I can't consistently recreate it. It happens for a split second. The screen static affects about a quarter of the screen.
Sent from my LG-H811 using Tapatalk
MicroMod777 said:
But you did see the flicker. I've noticed it could be a super fast flicker barily noticilbe to a 2 second square section looking like a static tv like on the movie poltergeist.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
mine does that 2 could it be the kernel needs to be optimized a little better. Its like its underclocked to far or something. When I try to underclock and undervolt my nexus 6 i get similar issues. i bet they will be able to fix it with a kernel update im gonna go ahead and exchange it out
My personal G4 arrived yesterday and so far, after using it for about 7 hours screen time, I have not seen this issue. I know what the issue looks like too because I saw it clearly on a model at Best Buy. So maybe it is a defect in some models? Or maybe it only affects some firmware, because I doubt the Best Buy model is running the same firmware as mine, which is from Asia.
Hi guys,
Anyone else notice any uneven screen backlighting? I read forums on the v20, and when reading back text on white background - while scrolling down to read more text I notice dark shades on the screen. I downloaded screen test and lo and behold...dark patch on my screen! I then sent it back to LG and assured me that they replaced the screen module and tested it and all 'voltage' was normal - BUT, dark shades were still present albeit in a different spot!
Can someone here please confirm if this is a normal thing for LG screen as I realise it is LCD backlit and not OLED hence a few bleeding / inconsistency of backlight would be present. Even though I have never experienced this on ANY of my HTC's which were all LCD screens.
cheers guys! sorry for the long post!
Yes, i have it too! H910 variant. Two dark/dim spots that run horizontal from edge to edge. Can be more noticeable/annoying in landscape view than portrait actually.
Exchanged one brand new H910 for another. Same problem. Both manufactured 12/16. Havent had this on any other LG Ive owned (RS988 G5, D850 G3, P930 Nitro HD) or Moto for that matter. Pretty bummed to have this in an $830 USD device.
Edit...seems like the issue can be excaberated by different viewing angles. Also, totally anecdotal, but i looked at my display at a stoplight (wearing polarized shades) and i noticed the screen looked unaffected by the shades compared to other LCDs (cars TFT nav screen, an eIPS tablet, etc) that i have in the car. Wonder if what we are seeing is some type of side effect from a polarizing filter, or maybe lack of, used with this display/panel?
Or, maybe these things are edge-lit and LG used an uneven arrangement of emitters. Not really sure.
Good call...I do think it may be the backlight being edge lit! which could only mean (maybe) the backlight has failed at some spots or LG engineers mis-formulated where to put the lighting. it is very sad to hear that this may not be an isolated problem.
I did however sent it back for repair and the technician advice of a NEW LCD module/screen fitted. was sent back to me the same day!! WOW! BUT...same problem but it a different spot.
If this keeps going I may have to consider a new device altogether!
Then im starting to hear crackling on both earpiece and speakers....but thats a different thread!
arrgg...
I began to notice this on my v20 that I bought at the end of December, at first I thought it was just viewing angle or I messed up the screen. However my mom just got a v20 and hers' has the exact same problem in nearly the same spot. I should add that my phone is an LS997 that is completely stock. Also @D0NZ which screen test application did you use to see the problem better?
I used an app called full screen test...its free and simple. I then took a photo of it with my old htc m8 then sent it to lg for review.
The V10s have this as well. Something to do with the backlight and 2nd screen. Kind of got used to it on my V10. Was hoping that would have been addressed with the build of the V20.
Sent from my LG-H901 using Tapatalk
But I still have that unwanted effect even if the second screen is off?
D0NZ said:
But I still have that unwanted effect even if the second screen is off?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think so. On the V10 it was really noticeable when the main screen went into immersive mode and the 2nd screen went off.
Sent from my HTC M8 using Tapatalk
this to me is a deal breaker! I read a lot on my phone, tis why I got a large screen! If this is the 'norm' for a flagship...
I pretty much think its unacceptable. They produce their own screens and cant get a flagship right? hmm...which phone to replace it with now that is available locally (for me that is down under)
So here are some pics I sent LG originally!
D0NZ said:
So here are some pics I sent LG originally!
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Click to collapse
Looking at your grey screen, those bands/dim areas are in the exact same locations on my device (and my prior V20)! It must be inherent to this panel. You said the bands/dim locations changed after LG swapped screens/devices for you though?
Either way, it is a bummer. I'm still undecided if I should return mine as well, or just live with it. Almost every recent device has some quirk to live with it seems. I recently traded a Samsung Galaxy S7 that had a beautiful AMOLED display, but the device picked up scratches (on the display *and* body) like I've never seen before. I even took a look over at the dark side (Apple), and they seem to be catching flak for overheating and camera problems in some iPhone 7 devices. Sigh.
I have it on one corner pretty bad, is this because of the IPS screen and how the frame of the phone is pressing on it?
myiphonebroke said:
I have it on one corner pretty bad, is this because of the IPS screen and how the frame of the phone is pressing on it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think its to do with backlight distribution tbh. Ive had a number of HTC's and NONE of them had backlight distribution issues. Im now wondering IF a 3rd party screen module would be better than the original LG produced? OR...if this is an isolated issue only on some devices. My device was manufactured Nov 2016. Maybe a later produced model has better screens? Anyone with a newer produced V20 care to share?
I think its the placement of the 2nd screen backlight. Ill try to find the thread. Someone with a V10 explained it last year.
Sent from my LG-H918 using Tapatalk
Here is the post I remember from the V10 forums that seem to make the most sense regarding backlight being uneven.
https://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=64236798&postcount=45
Both my replacement V20 and original V20 have uneven screen backlighting (at least the replacement has a better back cover mechanism). There is a dark spot in the middle of the status bar on white (or lighter) screens. What is weirder is that it is the exact same pattern and location as the first one. It is present in both stock and LOS. I suppose I'll just wait around a year and warranty it out then because I just want to start using the phone. I included an image for people that were curious how it looked.
^
I think I can live with that...as in...the dim sections are on the edge of the screen. Mine was in the middle of the screen which i cannot stand!
I have sent the replaced screen NOT to LG but to the place where I bought it.
They said that the repairer that LG told me to send it to was the last on their system as 'reliable'. The store said that they will deal with the repairer and LG. I kind of hope the worst happens and they just offer me a refund or a total replacement - but I doubt that would happen!
UPDATE: so i sent it back to jb hifi, on the report, they can replicate the issue. On the repairers report - they couldnt
SO i get it back with all the 'test' that they have done on it being to manufacturer's specs.
Which i think now...was never good to begin with
Too bad i cant unsee what i can see...sux...I wonder if AMOLEDs have these issues? Anyone care to elaborate?
I have this issue with my LG V20 -- only when viewing photos
I have this issue with my LG V20 -- only when viewing photos - see photos -- screen has two long bright lines.
See attached photos - lines are not on the photos themselves --it is just in the backlighting -- and the lines are not there when viewing websites or if testing the screen with an test app. Please cut ans paste links to see photos - remove blank area after http -- I can't post links till I have 10 posts on this site - if any kind poster could repost so others can see them that would be great!
http ://oi64.tinypic.com/24q96aa.jpg
...and these lines stay the same even when you enlarge the photo...
http ://oi68.tinypic.com/331oj0n.jpg
I have the same issue below secondary screen. Only noticeable on white background. Doesn't ruin reading books, it's there, but minor. I have dual sim variant. I'd be very upset if I paid launching price. All those things you only find out when you get the device.