Database Users

[Q] Sourcing from China (with Android)

I want to source an Android smart watch from China for a project am working on. I want to change the menu interface it comes with and replace with a custom interface specific for my purpose (means no custom control to intended audience).
Thoughts Needed
Does anyone here have a similar experience?
Are they good at customizing ROMs and interfaces according to requirements?
If not, how easy is it to hire somebody to build a custom ROM with custom interface (for say MTK6572)?
Any recommended suppliers you know?
Phase 1 MUST HAVE Minimum Requirements - 100 Units Order
Android OS
GSM/GPS
Touch screen
Mic/Speaker
Charging points on the back side (no micro-usb slot on the side)
Shortlisted AK-S5 or AK-S7
Phase 2 MUST HAVE Minimum Requirements
All from Phase 1
IP67 or IP68
Magnetic based charger point on the backside
Heart rate sensor at the backside
Shortlisted - None available yet

abuduri said:
I want to source an Android smart watch from China for a project am working on. I want to change the menu interface it comes with and replace with a custom interface specific for my purpose (means no custom control to intended audience).
Thoughts Needed
Does anyone here have a similar experience?
Are they good at customizing ROMs and interfaces according to requirements?
If not, how easy is it to hire somebody to build a custom ROM with custom interface (for say MTK6572)?
Any recommended suppliers you know?
Phase 1 MUST HAVE Minimum Requirements - 100 Units Order
Android OS
GSM/GPS
Touch screen
Mic/Speaker
Charging points on the back side (no micro-usb slot on the side)
Shortlisted AK-S5 or AK-S7
Phase 2 MUST HAVE Minimum Requirements
All from Phase 1
IP67 or IP68
Magnetic based charger point on the backside
Heart rate sensor at the backside
Shortlisted - None available yet
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please note: to date no Chinese Android watches are IP67, even the ones that provide proof of IP certification, I've learned that the hard way
AK-55 is the Z01
The AK-S7 is or looks like ZGPAX S7
I'm sure you have experience dealing with Chinese sellers, but if you don't . .. . be extremely careful, even using Paypal, trust no one!

simple1i said:
Please note: to date no Chinese Android watches are IP67, even the ones that provide proof of IP certification, I've learned that the hard way
AK-55 is the Z01
The AK-S7 is or looks like ZGPAX S7
I'm sure you have experience dealing with Chinese sellers, but if you don't . .. . be extremely careful, even using Paypal, trust no one!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks a lot @simple1i.
I have a chicken-egg question ... Which came first - AK-S5 or Z01? Which of these (or among numerous others on Alibaba) is "original" (designed first)? If there is no traceback and everyone is using the same reference design, as long as it works as intended, does it matter? I did get this supplier to show me the watch on skype video (though it doesn't prove anything).
My main question is - if the supplier really has a "fully working version" of S5 or Z01, and is ready to supply - they also say they will do ODM - any experience on their skills to make a custom ROM and change the menu interface to my needs? If not, anyone here willing to build the ROM and interface (paid)?

x201 model
abuduri said:
Thanks a lot @simple1i.
I have a chicken-egg question ... Which came first - AK-S5 or Z01? Which of these (or among numerous others on Alibaba) is "original" (designed first)? If there is no traceback and everyone is using the same reference design, as long as it works as intended, does it matter? I did get this supplier to show me the watch on skype video (though it doesn't prove anything).
My main question is - if the supplier really has a "fully working version" of S5 or Z01, and is ready to supply - they also say they will do ODM - any experience on their skills to make a custom ROM and change the menu interface to my needs? If not, anyone here willing to build the ROM and interface (paid)?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I started looking into smartwatches on XDA from Mar 2014, so my history before then is limited. For me it started with the Omate TrueSmart, their Kickstarter campaign that promised it all and delivered a lie. I could be wrong, but Omate made the watch first (x201) and the rest copied (or someShenzhen firm made it first and Omate copied ) @pizzaman77 - knows the full history of Omate clones x201. But yes, now it does not matter as long as it works.
As for the development, you might get lucky and find that someone is already doing what you want or similar on the Omate forum - search on the Android development threads. I'm not a dev, so I don't if the Chineses sellers have the skills, doubt it. But the Devs on XDA will have. Look at this Omate thread: http://forum.xda-developers.com/oma...rom-omate-truesmart-ironman-firmware-t2998434 - lots of dev going on on the Omate and its clones.
@kuronosan - is a key dev, still active, he might be able to help with paid work. You should start with making a new thread in the Omate Dev forum with your request.
@Lokifish Marz - knows a loooot but is not too actives these days
Please keep me informed on your dev plans (if its not top secret ) - i really really want to also buy a bulk order (maybe only 5 to start with) from China and sell them in the UK, but i need to join someone who is ordering in bulk so that i CAN only buy 5 units to start with. The other issue is i would need to fix any software issues first then sell them and if they sell then buy more. Can PM me if you wish. Thanks.

simple1i said:
I started looking into smartwatches on XDA from Mar 2014, so my history before then is limited. For me it started with the Omate TrueSmart, their Kickstarter campaign that promised it all and delivered a lie. I could be wrong, but Omate made the watch first (x201) and the rest copied (or someShenzhen firm made it first and Omate copied ) @pizzaman77 - knows the full history of Omate clones x201. But yes, now it does not matter as long as it works.
As for the development, you might get lucky and find that someone is already doing what you want or similar on the Omate forum - search on the Android development threads. I'm not a dev, so I don't if the Chineses sellers have the skills, doubt it. But the Devs on XDA will have. Look at this Omate thread: http://forum.xda-developers.com/oma...rom-omate-truesmart-ironman-firmware-t2998434 - lots of dev going on on the Omate and its clones.
@kuronosan - is a key dev, still active, he might be able to help with paid work. You should start with making a new thread in the Omate Dev forum with your request.
@Lokifish Marz - knows a loooot but is not too actives these days
Please keep me informed on your dev plans (if its not top secret ) - i really really want to also buy a bulk order (maybe only 5 to start with) from China and sell them in the UK, but i need to join someone who is ordering in bulk so that i CAN only buy 5 units to start with. The other issue is i would need to fix any software issues first then sell them and if they sell then buy more. Can PM me if you wish. Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks a ton @simple1i. I will start a thread there.
Do you know any Android watches that fit my Phase 2 requirements (couldn't find any on Alibaba or similar sites)?
I did find a few watches fitting my spec without Android (either Nucleus or similar). Is it advisable to build on those platforms given that Android is now into wearables Reason I chose Android is because I want to be able to easily change supplier and/or watch hardware (looks) later easily and just port the code/functionality rather than getting locked. Else it will become an EXPENSIVE affair later. Am I right in thinking so?

abuduri said:
Thanks a ton @simple1i. I will start a thread there.
Do you know any Android watches that fit my Phase 2 requirements (couldn't find any on Alibaba or similar sites)?
I did find a few watches fitting my spec without Android (either Nucleus or similar). Is it advisable to build on those platforms given that Android is now into wearables Reason I chose Android is because I want to be able to easily change supplier and/or watch hardware (looks) later easily and just port the code/functionality rather than getting locked. Else it will become an EXPENSIVE affair later. Am I right in thinking so?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And yes @simple1i, I will definitely keep you in the loop on the bulk ordering.

abuduri said:
Thanks a ton @simple1i. I will start a thread there.
Do you know any Android watches that fit my Phase 2 requirements (couldn't find any on Alibaba or similar sites)?
I did find a few watches fitting my spec without Android (either Nucleus or similar). Is it advisable to build on those platforms given that Android is now into wearables Reason I chose Android is because I want to be able to easily change supplier and/or watch hardware (looks) later easily and just port the code/functionality rather than getting locked. Else it will become an EXPENSIVE affair later. Am I right in thinking so?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes I'd stick with Android, lots of resources available, gives more flexibility. I don't think Nucleus OS is a viable option yet, it would be too expensive.
I take it SIM is a requirement too? I'll look around, the IP67 is not available yet, maybe the Ironman 3rd generation might be IP67, but the company (Unova) is full of liars, I was ripped off with the 2nd generation, I proved it's not IP67. Other then the IP67 the rest might be available, you'll need to search for it on AliExpress.
What country are you from?

simple1i said:
Yes I'd stick with Android, lots of resources available, gives more flexibility. I don't think Nucleus OS is a viable option yet, it would be too expensive.
I take it SIM is a requirement too? I'll look around, the IP67 is not available yet, maybe the Ironman 3rd generation might be IP67, but the company (Unova) is full of liars, I was ripped off with the 2nd generation, I proved it's not IP67. Other then the IP67 the rest might be available, you'll need to search for it on AliExpress.
What country are you from?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, with 2G. 3G really not needed but if it comes with it, cool. Couldn't find any with android and heart rate on back side, keeping IP67 on the side.
Am currently in Boston (originally from India).

simple1i said:
Yes I'd stick with Android, lots of resources available, gives more flexibility. I don't think Nucleus OS is a viable option yet, it would be too expensive.
I take it SIM is a requirement too? I'll look around, the IP67 is not available yet, maybe the Ironman 3rd generation might be IP67, but the company (Unova) is full of liars, I was ripped off with the 2nd generation, I proved it's not IP67. Other then the IP67 the rest might be available, you'll need to search for it on AliExpress.
What country are you from?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
@simple1i ... is Android Wear OS same as Android 4.4 etc running on Z01 (and others) etc?

abuduri said:
@simple1i ... is Android Wear OS same as Android 4.4 etc running on Z01 (and others) etc?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Found the answer ... http://www.makeuseof.com/tag/what-operating-systems-do-wearable-devices-run-on/
Looks like Android Wear needs a compatible Android phone for it to work.
So, I'll stick with just Android.

General rules with Chinese Android smartwatches
Broken firmware
Major security holes
Little to no official support (this includes the phone side app)
English (or any other language other than Chinese) for the phone app is very rare
Incomplete source code (when you can even get it) that is a generic build pulled from a phone
Inconsistent battery life due to broken firmware
IP67 is more like IP54 if lucky
Poor build quality and QC by western standards
Not Lokifish supported (I've walked away from the industry as a whole until they get their collective heads out of their butts)
kuronosan's time is limited so fixes may be slow
Depending on your needs and goals. Talk to Ingenic. The HW is a little slow on the Newton (SmartQ Z uses it), not sure about the Newton 2. Either way they have source (Linux, Android, etc). The package is small enough that you could design and build a smartwatch that's about the same size as a real watch, but the display will need a new "crystal" to pull it off nicely. Find a compatible round display, and you should be able to use off the shelf watch cases with minor modifications giving you a 200m diver's smartwatch if you do it right.
*Side note
Even with a 1/2 million buy in for 3000 units we designed ourselves, Umeox still would not have provided source code, and little to no support. That's what the Chinese ODM's are like. kuronosan can verify this.

@abuduri - I'm not sure if my reply to your PM went thru? I can't see it in my sent folder. Did you get it?

I'm still working on stuff for the Omate. I just haven't actually had any free time as of late. I can't just take off of work to put work into a device that's difficult to troubleshoot. If I can be of any help let me know.

I've just started working with smartwatches, but I'm happy to help however I can. I'll be attempting some work on the s8, and I know my way around Android pretty well.

kuronosan said:
I'm still working on stuff for the Omate. I just haven't actually had any free time as of late. I can't just take off of work to put work into a device that's difficult to troubleshoot. If I can be of any help let me know.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
@kuronosan @chainsol - thanks guys.
The thread for the new smartwatch is here, we have 5 people so far: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=3115221 - including an electronic engineering. [emoji818]

firmware files of z01
abuduri said:
I want to source an Android smart watch from China for a project am working on. I want to change the menu interface it comes with and replace with a custom interface specific for my purpose (means no custom control to intended audience).
Thoughts Needed
Does anyone here have a similar experience?
Are they good at customizing ROMs and interfaces according to requirements?
If not, how easy is it to hire somebody to build a custom ROM with custom interface (for say MTK6572)?
Any recommended suppliers you know?
Phase 1 MUST HAVE Minimum Requirements - 100 Units Order
Android OS
GSM/GPS
Touch screen
Mic/Speaker
Charging points on the back side (no micro-usb slot on the side)
Shortlisted AK-S5 or AK-S7
Phase 2 MUST HAVE Minimum Requirements
All from Phase 1
IP67 or IP68
Magnetic based charger point on the backside
Heart rate sensor at the backside
Shortlisted - None available yet
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
need firmware files for z01 (android 5.1)

picking cheap watches for development

Hello all.
Recently looking at all those innovative cheap non-chinese smartwatches I've got an obsession on picking ones for some random development.
How about we gather some little info on devices ready for custom upgrades and firmwares. Certainly this doesn't include android wear devices as they are ready for development.
Almost all cheap smartwatches do not allow installation of custom apps and some can't even show the time without being connected with your phone!
But some of them allow firmware upgrading/flashing... So I'm looking for any device having some native sdk or compatible with arduino toolkit or anything else.
1. A perfect example of what am I looking for is sony smartwatch mn2. They already have:
- open smartwatch project with it's ported arduino toolkit
- star wars game on mn2
I would probably pick those but they're pretty old and lack some sensors.
2. The second one is weloop tommy. (suggested by qkall and raicg)
These have a huge standby time (I guess more than the first pebble), waterproof but they have accelerometer inside only and no touchscreen. I guess the price is huge comparing to others.
Still there is an opensource project around with a custom firmware.
As I understand a huge work is done and the device was carefully examined and all that pin-out stuff was collected to make it working and you're pretty ready to go with development of your own features.
My next possible targets are mt2502 based watches as there are some stuff (mediatek linkit) around on mediatek site.
I'm unsure if this sdk will allow to do something with randomly picked mt2502 watches.
So I'm interested in any info if someone tried this or had any other success on development/moding of their watches.
Thx.

I feel like I'm being a bit slutty with this today... but the Weloop Tommy might be interesting to you:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/sma...s/weloop-tommy-smartwatch-looks-best-t2864444
http://forum.xda-developers.com/sma.../weloop-tommy-smartwatch-faq-updates-t2995858
https://hackaday.io/project/4510-open-source-sportsmart-watch

gvma said:
Hello all.
Recently looking at all those innovative cheap non-chinese smartwatches I've got an obsession on picking ones for some random development.
How about we gather some little info on devices ready for custom upgrades and firmwares. Certainly this doesn't include android wear devices as they are ready for development.
Almost all cheap smartwatches do not allow installation of custom apps and some can't even show the time without being connected with your phone!
But some of them allow firmware upgrading/flashing... So I'm looking for any device having some native sdk or compatible with arduino toolkit or anything else.
A perfect example of what am I looking for is sony smartwatch mn2. They already have:
- open smartwatch project with it's ported arduino toolkit
- star wars game on mn2
I would probably pick those but they're pretty old and lack some sensors.
My next possible target are mt2502 based watches as there are some stuff (mediatek linkit) around on mediatek site.
I'm unsure if this sdk will allow to do something with randomly picked mt2502 watches.
So I'm interested in any info if someone tried this or had any other success on development/moding of their watches.
Thx.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
NO.1 SUN S2 has firmware available new watch with decent specs. Here is some firmwares for it http://en.001phone.cn/download-19.html I bought mine on gearbest.com but right now they're selling a crappier version probably preproduction stuff

qkall said:
I feel like I'm being a bit slutty with this today... but the Weloop Tommy might be interesting to you:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They are nice but their price is huge when you think about their hardware.
spriteboost said:
NO.1 SUN S2 has firmware available new watch with decent specs. Here is some firmwares for it I bought mine on gearbest.com but right now they're selling a crappier version probably preproduction stuff
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I didn't mean any watches that have official firmware binaries.
I'm talking about totally customized firmwares, original firmware sources, sdk toolkits for mt6260/2502 soc or arduino toolchain port.
I want to pick some cheap smartwatches like u8/u80/20$-45$ and do some coding.
I wonder if someone who have mt2502 device would check the mediatek sdks on the possibility to build custom firmware (look for mediatek labs linkit one sdk, that SoC has mt2502 cpu and complete IDE).
Also most cheap devices use mt6260 but I didn't find much info about it.
I'm glad that someone answered me and thanks for you replies!

u8 customization
I just received 2 U8's in the mail. I'm keeping one in a new state, but the other is ready for the lab...where do we begin?
Pacman8521

I suggest to you the weloop
The great on weloop smartwatch is the battery time, up to 21 days! And it's waterproof!
One user has a open firmware project of weloop Smartwatch: https://hackaday.io/project/4510-open-source-sportsmart-watch
Take a look, it's open firmware.

I got some infomation about mtk2502
it seems have rtos sdk,I am not sure if we can flash our custom firmware to the target watch
www dot seeedstudio dot com/wiki/Rephone#Eclipse_IDE_for_RePhone_Kit
how do you guys think?

Possible to have android on a U8 smartwatch?

I've ordered a U8 smartwatch off Amazon.co.uk and when I get it I want to toy with it but I am just wondering if anyone has attempted to put android on it?

not possible, specs are way too low for that

What about the u10?
Could you put android on the u10 smart watch?

no
even though RAM is bigger, it's still only 128mb
processor is only 300mhz
chinese smartwatches don't have the specs to run anything but the limited firmware they have preinstalled

JarlSX said:
chinese smartwatches don't have the specs to run anything but the limited firmware they have preinstalled
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
False. There are multiple Chinese smartwatches that run Android.

hmm, i was thinking android wear, android would require a cellular modem, no?

Not necessarily. The cell side in Android can be hidden, like how a lot of tablets have hidden dialers in them even when they didn't have cell radios. I would not be surprised if there's a lot of cellphone specific code in Wear as well.
As far as Wear, if one had full source they could compile a working Wear build for a number of Chinese smartwatches. In fact, Com1 did it on their prototype, but because they were not part of Google's exclusive "Wear Partners" club, Google shut Com1 down.

for both android and android wear you'd need drivers though, to access all hardware, so you would need a kernel specific for the watch
available?

Most Chinese smartwatches are MTK based, so no.

so it's not possible then

Depends. The TS has a custom ROM and git which was cobbled together from multiple bits of sourcecode. It's mostly a matter of how much work one wants to put into it.

Lembird Free3/4 - Android 4.4, 3G, 400x400 Amoled, MTK6572

Two models, slight differences:
Free3 - http://www.lembird.com/Free3/show_31.html
Free4 - http://www.lembird.com/Free4/show_32.html
Price 119.5 USD, shipping cost 28USD, they do not use Paypal. Contact Yeva - [email protected]. "3TM water resistance" - what's that mean?
'Most likely' you buy this watch 'as is', once its delivered then there's no:
1. Warranty, if it arrives faulty you pay for shipping to China and back
2. Software update or support
3. Hardware support or spare parts to buy
The Android version 4.4.2 - would it not cause problems with newer apps? PushBullet doesn't work (even though PushBullet so expensive now). Only one Chinese watch (no SIM) has Android 5.1 - http://www.gearbest.com/smart-watches/pp_260935.html.

The 3 is the K8/K18 round, the 4 is the K8 mini/D5. So both are rebrands and not made by Lembird.
3ATM? I highly doubt it, they are IP67 at best. 3ATM is equal to 30m/100ft water resistance. If you look at smartwatches with that rating or better (a short list), very few have a mic (a very short list) and none have a speaker. So their claim of 3ATM alone is enough reason to avoid them.
They take a SIM card so companion capability would be pretty lacking. Say, basic notifications but little in the way to reply or interact with notifications. They are designed to be standalone devices.

Lokifish Marz said:
The 3 is the K8/K18 round, the 4 is the K8 mini/D5. So both are rebrands and not made by Lembird.
3ATM? I highly doubt it, they are IP67 at best. 3ATM is equal to 30m/100ft water resistance. If you look at smartwatches with that rating or better (a short list), very few have a mic (a very short list) and none have a speaker. So their claim of 3ATM alone is enough reason to avoid them.
They take a SIM card so companion capability would be pretty lacking. Say, basic notifications but little in the way to reply or interact with notifications. They are designed to be standalone devices.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How do you know the free3 is just a k18 rebrand?

kasseen said:
How do you know the free3 is just a k18 rebrand?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The same case design, specifications, UI, watchfaces. When it comes to Chinese smartwatches there are only two circumstances in which this happens. Either it's a rip-off clone (inferior), or it came from the same ODM. Example; If I wanted to, right now I could buy a shipping crate of the Free4/Mini/D5 and have the ODM stamp each watch and box with whatever I want. With that being said, I'm not even sure Zeaplus is the ODM of the K18 but a quick search through sources and announcement dates kinda of stops there.

Lokifish Marz said:
The 3 is the K8/K18 round, the 4 is the K8 mini/D5. So both are rebrands and not made by Lembird. ...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
... I should know better by now, just like the x201 clones, its history repeating, so there will be more round Chinese clones popping up for a year or two. If the large firms (samsung/moto) decide that triangle is a good (money making) shape, we'll see Chinese triangle clones and people will happily wear them thinking its the 'new in thing'.
@Lokifish Marz - is there a generic name for theses round clones or can we give it a generic name, might make life easier? W806 maybe?

simple1i said:
@Lokifish Marz - is there a generic name for theses round clones or can we give it a generic name, might make life easier? W806 maybe?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I say go by the device model number which is W806. That covers the XGODY k18, K8 Round, Zeaplus K18, and Lembird Free 3.

Installing Wear OS in Apple Watch

Hi there!
I know that this is a very weird question, BUT, is not improbable to do, I think.
The existing Android Smartwatches are not so good like the Apple watch, but, this last one doesn't work with Android, what stinks.
So, my questions is: Does exist a method to replace the OS in the Apple Watch for installing Wear OS, or a ROM based on?
Well, just let me know if you think is possible or you know a way to do it.
Cheers!

No, it's not possible.
Apple Watches are just about barely jailbreakable and all that introduces is some custom watch faces. WearOS is made to run on Android-compatible chips such as the Qualcomm 2100, 3100, 3300. It will just plainly not work at all on the S4 chip inside the new Apple Watch, nor the ones prior. That's assuming you even made it as far as unlocking the bootloader or otherwise getting to the low-level bits of an Apple Watch which just isn't possible. Doing it the other way around is also impossible for the reasons stated above and the fact that watchOS source code is proprietary and closed.
What do you mean by "this last one doesn't work with Android"? Did you buy a Galaxy Watch or one of the newer Huawei GT series? They don't run wearOS, but Tizen and LiteOS respectively, as both Huawei and Samsung want to distance themselves from wearOS.
And yes, one could argue that the new Apple Watch is better - specs-wise it smacks anything running the standard Qualcomm 2100 config in the face meaning it's certainly snappier, but it's also worth nothing that it doesn't allow for the "hackability" and customization that's present on the wearOS platform, such as sideloading native Android apps through adb.

are you retarded?