Related
http://androidspin.com/2010/08/13/oracle-hits-google-with-patent-and-copyright-infringement-lawsuit/
Could this put halt the development of android? Could this permanently damage android? What will android be without java running it?
Ace42;7667881
Could this put halt the development of android? Could this permanently damage android? What will android be without java running it?[/QUOTE said:
That is just legal speak for, "WE WANT MONEY! GIVE US MONEY!"
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So what?! Sun has been milking Microsoft to the tune of $1 million *a day* about 10 years ago for some java violation.
I think the platform is important enough for Google to settle/pay up. After all, they need more mobile devices with the internet access to generate more ad revenue.
stangri said:
So what?! Sun has been milking Microsoft to the tune of $1 million *a day* about 10 years ago for some java violation.
I think the platform is important enough for Google to settle/pay up. After all, they need more mobile devices with the internet access to generate more ad revenue.
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Click to collapse
Yes but Microsoft as part of their settlement stopped development of their JVM completely. That's why you need to install java on new PC's before running java programs. If this goes the same way as the Microsoft settlement; then I would assume it would put an end to JVM core that makes android work.
That said, I belive Google will find a way through this.
-KAF
Sent from my Rooted T-Mobile myTouch 3G Slide using XDA App running CR_Mod_1.35.531_OTA
GeekBrat said:
Yes but Microsoft as part of their settlement stopped development of their JVM completely. That's why you need to install java on new PC's before running java programs. If this goes the same way as the Microsoft settlement; then I would assume it would put an end to JVM core that makes android work.
That said, I belive Google will find a way through this.
-KAF
Sent from my Rooted T-Mobile myTouch 3G Slide using XDA App running CR_Mod_1.35.531_OTA
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Click to collapse
Java is a vital part to android, if google has to remove it then it will threaten the OS pretty badly. I'm wondering if they waited this long since android is more popular now.
they obviously wanted to see how android did before they did anything about it, and when oracle acquired Sun they decided to say something to google before it got out of hand. android has just surpassed iphone in market share so i would think google would just pay up and maybe even buy some large chunk of sun/java/oracle, if they decide not to pay up then yes we are gonna be hurting real soon for android devices and frankly i don't think i can go back to a winmo device and i will NEVER put in iphone in my pocket as my daily phone. (and then there's symbian but that's a joke anyways)
tubaking182 said:
... i don't think i can go back to a winmo device and i will NEVER put in iphone in my pocket as my daily phone. (and then there's symbian but that's a joke anyways)
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Click to collapse
What about meego? (just curious).
Sent from my Rooted T-Mobile myTouch 3G Slide using XDA App running CR_Mod_1.35.531_OTA
Lets get is strait. Oracle(Sun at that time) open sourced Java runtime environment under GPL 2.0. But with one condition - they promised to sue anyone who will release incompatible version of Java runtime over patent infringements - while promised not to go after those who comply with Suns rules. Sun also reserved and kept full copyright over the code. So anyone (good example is Blackberry/RIM) who want to extend JRE and/or do not wish to release their code/modifications under GPL have to pay royalties to Sun (now Oracle).
Basic definition of open source - it is a freedom to modify source code and distribute modified software free of royalties or any other type of payments. Sun effectively forbidden any modifications of Java using patent threats. Even before this story started, GPL v.3 already addressed an issue (if someone release software under GPL 3 they are giving up patents rights). But the problem that Java is under GPL 2.
Here comes the Google. Google wanted to move into mobile market, but they did not like to pay any royalties. So they come with Dalvik, a Java VM that was written from scratch. Google also took Java libraries from Apache Harmony project. And they come up with their own java bytecode/compiled file format. So they haven't used a single line of code that was written by Sun, but their VM fully support Java syntax (but not .jar files!) plus many standard Java classes. And they don't owe anything to Oracle. Plus from developer point of view porting over most of Java projects relatively simple task. Worst of all for Oracle, Google released Dalvik under non copyleft license, so basically anyone could use it for any purpose - including handset manufacturers who do not wish to open source their code.
Now lets take a look at a bigger picture. There are more then a billion mobile phones were sold last year. Most of them of them do run Java plus most of them were sold on so called emerging markets. So many are relatively cheap handsets and price is an issue. And we are talking about billions $, dozens of billions $ over years to come revenue stream toward Oracle. Plus there are set top boxes etc. And here come absolutely free Dalvik and Apache Harmony. Harmony, another Java VM similar to Dalvik have it own issues: it do use standard .jar file container, some parts of it covered by Oracle's patents. Apache also participating in Java Community Process, and restricted by compatibility requirements set by Oracle. Process itself is under control of an Oracle, for example Oracle have exclusive veto right. And here come Davlik. Dalvik is absolutely free, don't use any patented parts(.jar and/or java bytecode) etc and so on. And legally clean. Sure Oracle don't like it. But what can they do?
FUD. That is Oracle's only option to postpone Dalvik adoption by cell phone makers. Oracle could not attack fundamentals of Dalvik - Java syntax not patented plus Oracle have absolutely no way to influence what libraries would be implemented by Google. So it sue Google over 7 patents, some attack decoding algorithms of VM (could easily be rewritten, maximum damage new algorithms would be slower then current). Some attack Dalvik compiled code format(.dex files). That is more serious, but maximum damage again won't be mortal for Dalvik or Android - worst case scenario Android 3.0 would not be able to execute .apk that were compiled for Android 1.5-2.2. But I'm sure Google will find a way to update apk that were already uploaded to Market without developers requiring to upload new version themselves. And a last, and very least attack is on Android SDK. That is not even worse discussing.
In my opinion, most likely scenario - Google will win the case. Worst possible outcome - Google would be fined, and will have to rewrite some portions of Dalvik plus make new versions incompatible with currently fielded .dex file structure. But one way or another court would take years, and Oracle would make everything humanly(corporatively) possible to prolong the process. The longer hardware manufacturers are in doubt about fielding Dalvik - the more profit Oracle would make from royalties.
drTestPilot said:
Lets get is strait. Oracle(Sun at that time) open sourced Java runtime environment under GPL 2.0. But with one condition - they promised to sue anyone who will release incompatible version of Java runtime over patent infringements - while promised not to go after those who comply with Suns rules. Sun also reserved and kept full copyright over the code. So anyone (good example is Blackberry/RIM) who want to extend JRE and/or do not wish to release their code/modifications under GPL have to pay royalties to Sun (now Oracle).
Basic definition of open source - it is a freedom to modify source code and distribute modified software free of royalties or any other type of payments. Sun effectively forbidden any modifications of Java using patent threats. Even before this story started, GPL v.3 already addressed an issue (if someone release software under GPL 3 they are giving up patents rights). But the problem that Java is under GPL 2.
Here comes the Google. Google wanted to move into mobile market, but they did not like to pay any royalties. So they come with Dalvik, a Java VM that was written from scratch. Google also took Java libraries from Apache Harmony project. And they come up with their own java bytecode/compiled file format. So they haven't used a single line of code that was written by Sun, but their VM fully support Java syntax (but not .jar files!) plus many standard Java classes. And they don't owe anything to Oracle. Plus from developer point of view porting over most of Java projects relatively simple task. Worst of all for Oracle, Google released Dalvik under non copyleft license, so basically anyone could use it for any purpose - including handset manufacturers who do not wish to open source their code.
Now lets take a look at a bigger picture. There are more then a billion mobile phones were sold last year. Most of them of them do run Java plus most of them were sold on so called emerging markets. So many are relatively cheap handsets and price is an issue. And we are talking about billions $, dozens of billions $ over years to come revenue stream toward Oracle. Plus there are set top boxes etc. And here come absolutely free Dalvik and Apache Harmony. Harmony, another Java VM similar to Dalvik have it own issues: it do use standard .jar file container, some parts of it covered by Oracle's patents. Apache also participating in Java Community Process, and restricted by compatibility requirements set by Oracle. Process itself is under control of an Oracle, for example Oracle have exclusive veto right. And here come Davlik. Dalvik is absolutely free, don't use any patented parts(.jar and/or java bytecode) etc and so on. And legally clean. Sure Oracle don't like it. But what can they do?
FUD. That is Oracle's only option to postpone Dalvik adoption by cell phone makers. Oracle could not attack fundamentals of Dalvik - Java syntax not patented plus Oracle have absolutely no way to influence what libraries would be implemented by Google. So it sue Google over 7 patents, some attack decoding algorithms of VM (could easily be rewritten, maximum damage new algorithms would be slower then current). Some attack Dalvik compiled code format(.dex files). That is more serious, but maximum damage again won't be mortal for Dalvik or Android - worst case scenario Android 3.0 would not be able to execute .apk that were compiled for Android 1.5-2.2. But I'm sure Google will find a way to update apk that were already uploaded to Market without developers requiring to upload new version themselves. And a last, and very least attack is on Android SDK. That is not even worse discussing.
In my opinion, most likely scenario - Google will win the case. Worst possible outcome - Google would be fined, and will have to rewrite some portions of Dalvik plus make new versions incompatible with currently fielded .dex file structure. But one way or another court would take years, and Oracle would make everything humanly(corporatively) possible to prolong the process. The longer hardware manufacturers are in doubt about fielding Dalvik - the more profit Oracle would make from royalties.
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Click to collapse
Nicely said, i learned something new today.
drTestPilot said:
Legal mumbo jumbo...
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Great post by a relatively new member. Thanks
Edit: Now tell us how you really feel
I'm looking at the decompiled source for Phone.apk from my HTC Incredible(2.2) and I notice that the number and contents of the files don't match that of the decompiled source of the Phone.apk I built from the Android open-source project(I made no changes to the source). For example, here's a list of subclasses found in the PhoneApp class from the Phone apk on my Incredible:
PhoneApp.RadioThread
PhoneApp.ContactInfo
PhoneApp.QueryHandler
PhoneApp.CbQueryHandler
PhoneApp.MediaButtonBroadcastReceiver
PhoneApp.PhoneAppBroadcastReceiver
PhoneApp.TimerCallback
PhoneApp.WakeState
PhoneApp.ScreenTimeoutDuration
But the list of subclasses found in the PhoneApp class from the Phone apk I built myself is much shorter:
PhoneApp.MediaButtonBroadcastReceiver
PhoneApp.PhoneAppBroadcastReceiver
PhoneApp.WakeState
PhoneApp.ScreenTimeoutDuration
I'd assumed that all Android OS-based phones used the same code - is that not the case?
AFAIK, no they don't use propietary operating systems. But yes, each manudacturer builds their own apks just like each manufacturer has its own launcher.
Heck, the Chinese decided to use Android to make Ophone OS... Apparently they don't like the Android name. :-D
kschang said:
Heck, the Chinese decided to use Android to make Ophone OS... Apparently they don't like the Android name. :-D
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Click to collapse
Actually, they wanted to avoid licensing GApps support
The Android system itself is open source so it can't be made "proprietary" per se, but different manufacturers make different proprietary customizations to the different elements in the ROM they build.
Just to comment on the license angle:
The Linux kernel that Android uses is licensed under the GPL this means that anyone shipping a binary must provide the source. This allows you to produce an AOSP (Android Open Source Project) build for your device.
The AOSP itself uses the Apache license, meaning that source does _not_ need to be provided when selling a modified version.
Upshot is: its easy to get AOSP compiling on commercial devices. But you'll (almost) never get Android framework modification released as source.
The best working example of that would have to be HTC Sense. Its inner most workings are inserted into the Android library source itself. Good luck getting HTC to release the source of that puppy, or the mods they made to AOSP source to get it working.
I don't understand how if Android is Opensource and borrows code from Linux kernel and other OpenSource projects, how Google can legally hold back the honeycomb sourcecode?
I'm not really interested in Honeycomb source myself, nor the OS dev scene, but what I DO care about, is that some of my favorite apps are broken on my Tablet, and the developers all point the finger at Google, saying the flash API changed in Honeycomb, and they need the source to get it working.
The biggest broken apps for me are:
Opera Mobile 11
BBC iPlayer App
Opera even come out and tell us why Flash does not work on Opera Mobile 11 on Honeycomb:
https://market.android.com/details?id=com.opera.browser&feature=search_result
(What's New Tab)
"Flash not supported on Android 3.x due to Google not releasing necessary platform code"
"Open source" doesn't mean what you think it means.
The Linux kernel source is available under the GPLv2, this mean that is you ship a product you must provide the source, hence its the device manufacturers responsibility to give us the kernel source because it's them we buy the product from.
The Android framework and the Dalvik virtual machine are all available under an Apache licence, this allows anyone to take the source code and make a closed proprietary product and/or addition (Like Blur/Sense/Touchwiz) without this Android would not have caught on anywhere near as fast, but it also means that there is no requirement for future derivative products to have source code released. Even if the person doing that is Google.
All the API's that people _should_ be using are documented, the problem is that the products you mention are trying to mimic the native browser and use internal only method calls, if you step out of the approved API box then you have problems like this.
Why BBC iPlayer needs flash I don't know, all 3.1 tablets can play the flashhigh and flashhd (h.264) iPlayer streams natively I use get-iplayer and transfer the files to my Transformer for viewing and it works beautifully. I guess the Android app team are just lazy (or iPhone developers who don't know Android very well)
SilentMobius said:
The Android framework and the Dalvik virtual machine are all available under an Apache licence, this allows anyone to take the source code and make a closed proprietary product and/or addition (Like Blur/Sense/Touchwiz) without this Android would not have caught on anywhere near as fast, but it also means that there is no requirement for future derivative products to have source code released. Even if the person doing that is Google.
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Click to collapse
While this is true, it is not the real reason why Google can hold back the souce code. Google owns the copyright to DalVik and the Android platform. All contributions checked into the Android tree in the end have their copyright assigned to Google, regardless of who wrote them.
Because they own the copyright, they can do whatever the heck they want with the code, whenever they want. A copyright owner can not violate their own license, the license is only applicable for other people (who have no copyright to the code) to use it in their projects.
It's a subtle but very important distinction, because even if Android was all GPL they still would not have to be releasing any changes, because they own it.
The only part of the code Google is obligated to release, is their kernel changes (because it is Linux, which is GPL and they don't have the full copyright to) - and they do release these, always.
brunes said:
While this is true, it is not the real reason why Google can hold back the souce code. Google owns the copyright to DalVik and the Android platform. All contributions checked into the Android tree in the end have their copyright assigned to Google, regardless of who wrote them.
Because they own the copyright, they can do whatever the heck they want with the code, whenever they want. A copyright owner can not violate their own license, the license is only applicable for other people (who have no copyright to the code) to use it in their projects.
It's a subtle but very important distinction, because even if Android was all GPL they still would not have to be releasing any changes, because they own it.
The only part of the code Google is obligated to release, is their kernel changes (because it is Linux, which is GPL and they don't have the full copyright to) - and they do release these, always.
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Click to collapse
Actually no, just because they hold the rights doesn't mean they don't have to obey the license. It's just that Android is released under the Apache license which states that source must be released, but doesn't say WHEN the source has to be released, so they can hold it back as long as they deem fit.
seshmaru said:
Actually no, just because they hold the rights doesn't mean they don't have to obey the license. It's just that Android is released under the Apache license which states that source must be released, but doesn't say WHEN the source has to be released, so they can hold it back as long as they deem fit.
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Click to collapse
Actually, no!
The ASL is not a copy left licence, so if Google so wish they do not have to release the source code for Honeycomb ever. In much the same way, I can download Android code from AOSP, create my own unique version, and I don't have to contribute my code back to AOSP, nor do I need to supply it to anyone on demand (with the exception of GPL'd kernel code of course).
Regards,
Dave
foxmeister said:
Actually, no!
The ASL is not a copy left licence, so if Google so wish they do not have to release the source code for Honeycomb ever. In much the same way, I can download Android code from AOSP, create my own unique version, and I don't have to contribute my code back to AOSP, nor do I need to supply it to anyone on demand (with the exception of GPL'd kernel code of course).
Regards,
Dave
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Click to collapse
It's correct that it is not copyleft, and I was aware of this. All android releases however are released under the Apache license, which means the source for android itself has to be there, but any further modifications can use whatever they want. So yes google has to make Honeycomb open source eventually since it was released under the Apache license. Any derivatives of honeycomb wouldn't need to provide the source though.
seshmaru said:
So yes google has to make Honeycomb open source eventually since it was released under the Apache license. Any derivatives of honeycomb wouldn't need to provide the source though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No they don't! That is the *whole* point. Honeycomb, at this point in time, is *not* an open source project because no source has been released, and the license of its antecedents is not a copyleft licence.
Honeycomb is, broadly speaking, a derivative of an earlier Android build (Froyo/Gingerbread whatever), and in this respect it is no different to say HTC's Sense builds which are also not open source.
Regards,
Dave
Hey ice cream will be open sourced. I don't think they want honeycomb plopped onto phones so they won't push it to aosp. Ice Cream will be a hybrid.
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA Premium App
Have also wondered this myself.. but reading all of this has made me more confused than I was before.. who's right? :S
It's correct that Google hold the copyright for the bulk of the android framework, and as the copyright owners they are not subject to license terms, so they don't need to release anything but that only works for Google products. If the licence had been GPL then manufacturers would need to supply source with their products, not Google but ASUS/Samsung/HTC/etc/etc.
Short version: Google don't need to release anything, app developers shouldn't use internal APIs and rely on having platform source to make things work.
That said I want to change some of the browser behaviour and plumb back in handling for the .mkv file extension (because the container parsing is already in there) So I'd love to get my hands on the HC source, no matter how messy.
david279 said:
Hey ice cream will be open sourced. I don't think they want honeycomb plopped onto phones so they won't push it to aosp. Ice Cream will be a hybrid.
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA Premium App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And yet, it didn't seem to worry them when the first flurry of tablets came out with a phone (Froyo/GB) OS. Sorry, but to me, that excuse doesn't fly.
Divine_Madcat said:
And yet, it didn't seem to worry them when the first flurry of tablets came out with a phone (Froyo/GB) OS. Sorry, but to me, that excuse doesn't fly.
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Click to collapse
Actually they did worry, that's exactly why they made honeycomb you derptard and exactly the reason they aren't releasing the source to honeycomb.
And yes they don't want manufacturers shoehorning a tablet OS into a phone just so they can say OH OUR PHONE HAS ANDROID 3.0 INSTEAD OF 2.3.
Derptard... certainly a new one for the books. haha
Hi guys I am buying a eee pad but currently I am emailing Eclipse Google and others to try and get support to make developing for Android on Android possible.
I wish to start a foundation or support group toward this end if you want to contribute or help in anyway it would be great I will also add a poll for comparison of votes so please vote it all helps.
As I understand it porting Ubuntu to different devices is well still in beta stages for the most part but we all know that personalized mobile computing is the future and tablets or tf style devices will eventually replace laptops netbooks and the like.
As I understand the biggest problem is new tech!! that fresh out the box smell is still lingering and leaves support and development slim in some more common place computing needs where x86 has rained supreme leaving others to wish for such a client base of great support and programs.
So all in all this is to try push things in the right direction. Who to talk to when to talk to them and how to help the eee pad and other similar devices become fully fledged dual boot Android Ubuntu platforms with the option to develop and do all the other great things Ubuntu can offer.
Please only positive criticism or feedback this is the tech community anything is possible so please no comments of OMG YOU CANT DO THAT!!!! etc etc
Currently, you can compile C program or whatever without problems, using a chroot ubuntu or debian.
But developing for android implies that the android sdk has to be ported on arm platform. This is a paradox, but most android and java tools are working only on x86 platform, probably because at this time, phones was not meant to be dev platforms considering their cpu power.
Openjdk seems to work on arm but the android sdk relies on javac from sun.
There are now powerful tablet devices on the market - including our beloved tf - where we could potentially develop android apps ; I think that google will sooner or later release an arm version of the android sdk. Since then, we are almost pretty stuck : I'm not sure that all the android tools are opensource, and even if it is the case, there is still the problem of javac from sun which does not work on arm platform. However, doing our own dev platform implies that we can port ourselves the sdk on arm, and use openjdk as a replacement of sun-java runtime. Not a piece of cake My advice is to wait several months google next move to see what's going to happen, now that there are more and more tablets on the market.
If we get enough support though maybe we can push for both to be ported and released
Sent from my GT540RR using XDA App
Omg this doesn"t belong in the development forum!!!!!!!
Would love to see more development done on this!
As time progresses, more will be done definitely this is more about making sure that it is pushed as i believe at the moment its being over looked. I think manufacturers and Google and eclipse etc all under estimate there own products possibilities and the abilities of the tech community and in particular the xda community. Even if we had beta releases only for xda devs it would be a step in the right direction for developing android on android.
OK I'm going to bite the bullet and ask why would this be considered a good idea? I write software for Android and using Eclipse on lower screen resolutions isn't that productive IMHO, throw in poor keyboards and miniscule touchpads and it makes little sense. Finally considering the performance differences between a tablet and development laptop (i7, 8 GB RAM, SSD, etc) I just can't see getting the development tools working on an Android device to be all that useful at this point in time.
Nvidia is claiming the T3 will be as powerful as a Core 2. Seems a little exaggerated, but in the near future, it may be possible to dev. on a tab. Eclipse (and real games) are the last things tying me to my PC. Now I would not want to run Eclipse on a T2, but a T4??? Now we are talking.
GeraldNunn said:
OK I'm going to bite the bullet and ask why would this be considered a good idea? I write software for Android and using Eclipse on lower screen resolutions isn't that productive IMHO, throw in poor keyboards and miniscule touchpads and it makes little sense. Finally considering the performance differences between a tablet and development laptop (i7, 8 GB RAM, SSD, etc) I just can't see getting the development tools working on an Android device to be all that useful at this point in time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sent from my Transformer TF101
I tend to agree. I find even a powerful laptop is pretty marginal. I prefer a desktop with at least 2 monitors, one for code and one for the emulator.
All valid points but if no one is looking forward at the glass half full it wont become a reality
What I'm saying is work needs to start now infrastructure then city not a repeat of Auckland central we need the ground work done then the devices can catch up
Sent from my GT540RR using XDA App
I support, its something i would use.
danielmtp.mg said:
I support, its something i would use.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sent from my GT540RR using XDA App
I've a script pack for installing Java's JDK to ARM either hard float or soft float that can be found at the following link
https://github.com/S0AndS0/Debian-Kit-Mods
Check the readme for how to download and enjoy the work I've done to get us this far. Furthermore there are other installers available that may be of interest; such as jMonkey and node.js and NoFlo installers for debian based Linux OS's running on Android.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using xda app-developers app
Anyone alive on this thread?
I've some links to information and projects relating to developments on Android and Linux Android systems.
For running GNU software on Android (better than busybox perhaps)
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2613243
Some maybe slower than the busybox versions but its a small sacrifice for better compatibility.
For running SDR (software defined radio) with Android or Android Linux
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2108053
https://github.com/martinmarinov/rtl_tcp_andro-
This github is really cool because the drivers are for either.
For running OpenBTS on Android Linux (turn your cellphone into a cell tower)
https://github.com/martinmarinov/rtl_tcp_andro-
Do some digging on this Dev's work; its amazing
For Crypto Currency mining on Android Linux (why buy an app when you'll have more for free here?)
http://bitbiz.io/threads/linux-script-cpu-minerd-installer-android-rpi-vps-32-64bit-pc.138/
Be sure to check out the example scripts I posted too; especially the ones relating to temp. monitoring or ya may blow a battery.
For MPI (message passing interface) on Android Linux (just modify the RPi directions to have the right username and networking options)
http://www.tinkernut.com/2014/04/27/make-cluster-computer/
Be sure to check out TinkerNut's other videos and guides; nearly anything a Raspberry Pi can do we can do on our phones for cheaper and with better specs/built in hardware.
For running Maptools server on Android (software for running custom table top games over a network)
http://forums.rptools.net/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=24082
I play DnD and Pathfinder so having a way to go mobile with it was something I had to do for them
For building Android NDK on Android Linux (step one of writing apps for Android on Android)
http://www.timelesssky.com/blog/building-android-sdk-build-tools-aapt-for-debian-arm
For building Android SDK on Android Linux (step two for writing/modding you phone with your phone)
http://www.timelesssky.com/blog/develop-app-on-android-with-android-sdk
Above two links are fantastic when combined with rdp or vnc for a larger screen size when at home.
For running Linux on Android without root (hidden goodies on FUSE filesystem)
http://www.timelesssky.com/blog/debian-android-with-no-root
There's a narrow window of compatibility but if your apposed to root on Android and still want Linux theses steps might just let you pull it off too.
For modifying Debian Kits' source code so you can have loop files larger than 2 Gigs and install hard floating point instead of soft float
http://www.timelesssky.com/blog/running-debian-armhf-alongside-android#comment-1525580294
If you've not found this Dev's blog then do some digging as there is some really cool guides posted.
For installing GPU drivers to Android Linux (scroll down to Related Projects for the other brands)
http://freedreno.github.io/
The above link and related software should allow for OpenCL/GL support and the added bonus of being able to run Blender on your tablet.
The above links should prove that developments on Android and Android Linux systems is very active; just hard to find sometimes.
I'm currently working at http://bitbiz.io/rf/?c=IGQ3ZLRT with a few other team members to bring together the above subjects into a new mesh-networking crypto coin system that allows users and developers to buy or rent hardware time from networked devices; others have tried and failed to make a AndroidCoin but this one will not as much of the core features have already been tested or scripted up in my other github repo as installers. Feel free to post feature requests and concerns.
http://bitbiz.io/threads/altcoin-taucoin-new-arm-excusive-coin.142/
Sent from: SPH-D700 or myTouch3Gs or Sero 7 Pro
Linux Install guide for Android devices that I'm writing:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2240397
Or
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ssVeIhdBuuy8CtpBP1lWgUkG6fR6oHxP20ToYPPw6zI/edit?usp=drive_web
And my script pack for installing; Java's JDK, node.js and more to your Linux OS
https://github.com/S0AndS0/Debian-Kit-Mods
Note: if you're new to Linux/scripting/command line; check readme file for instructions.
Hello,
I have built my first Android app using Eclipse and I think it was pretty quick and helpful in many ways.
After the first project, my colleague asked me to switch to Android Studio, but my question is: is it better than Eclipse? Which one do you prefer?
Thank you all in advance,
Andrea
Android Studio is "The Way Forward" but still has lots of problems, and runs slow for me.
I'm just trying Studio now with a new app I'm working on. NDK integration isn't good (but better than 2013).
I don't even use Eclipse anymore, just ant etc scripts on command line and default linux GUI editor (Pluma) for editing.
But I'm trying to learn Studio because I think Google will let Eclipse support rot once Studio is officially supported. AND I'm trying to find ways to make myself more efficient. I haven't used IDEs in over 25 years (Turbo C), LOL, but it was fun back then...
Here again, Google is moving from open source stuff (Eclipse) to proprietary Android specially designed and built stuff (Studio). That has good and bad, and I'll just "go with the flow"...
mikereidis said:
Android Studio is "The Way Forward" but still has lots of problems, and runs slow for me.
I'm just trying Studio now with a new app I'm working on. NDK integration isn't good (but better than 2013).
I don't even use Eclipse anymore, just ant etc scripts on command line and default linux GUI editor (Pluma) for editing.
But I'm trying to learn Studio because I think Google will let Eclipse support rot once Studio is officially supported. AND I'm trying to find ways to make myself more efficient. I haven't used IDEs in over 25 years (Turbo C), LOL, but it was fun back then...
Here again, Google is moving from open source stuff (Eclipse) to proprietary Android specially designed and built stuff (Studio). That has good and bad, and I'll just "go with the flow"...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Eclipse is the best right now.
Google Studio may be in the future.
I really hope Google starts stepping up and helping developers out. Xcode for iOS is really nice to work with when devloping for iOS. It would be nice if Google put that same effort into helping devs build for Android.
jbutewicz said:
I really hope Google starts stepping up and helping developers out. Xcode for iOS is really nice to work with when devloping for iOS. It would be nice if Google put that same effort into helping devs build for Android.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why would they change to being more dev friendly ?
Why would they spend more money on "expenses" when Android is #1 in terms of penetration ?
I'd be happy to see it, but I don't see them changing, and I highly suspect their team of bean counter accountants continue to conclude their profits are best when their development teams are small.
I've been researching/learning everything I can about audio on Android. It's a big mess, though it works, more or less, as in "good enough". But high performance, low latency audio such as IOS has is extremely difficult, hardware/OEM HAL/kernel driver dependent, and effectively impossible to do without at least occasional glitches on many leading devices.
These audio issues have existed for years, along with MANY others. The Android issue tracker is full of such issues. Some improvements have been made, but it's never enough.
Low level stuff like audio is where Android really falls down. The Google perspective seems to be the user perspective, which is closer to higher level Java stuff and farther away from the nuts and bolts of kernels, HALs, C and assembly language. Most of this is left to the OEMs to figure out and many take major shortcuts to reduce time to market.
andreait15 said:
Hello,
I have built my first Android app using Eclipse and I think it was pretty quick and helpful in many ways.
After the first project, my colleague asked me to switch to Android Studio, but my question is: is it better than Eclipse? Which one do you prefer?
Thank you all in advance,
Andrea
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm also interested in what folks are using. I whipped up a poll this morning and posted it on Reddit/r/Android but this seems much more appropriate.
Here is the Poll
And the results so far Results
matt68000 said:
I'm also interested in what folks are using. I whipped up a poll this morning and posted it on Reddit/r/Android but this seems much more appropriate.
Here is the Poll
And the results so far Results
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
wow, these results make me only more confused.
Right now I'm using Android Studio too, and in some ways is better, especially the design views on the right side of the code, but adding libraries was a slowly death inside!!!
IntelliJ is the best. After I first-time used it, I would never switch back to eclipse.
Eclipse as an IDE, Unity3D as an engine.
esoloyu nefs
As along time eclipse user (more then 10 years) I tried out intellij a few month ago and I will never go back. IntellliJ is just the better ide
Well and now since I am using gradle I switched to android studio. Its like intelliJ with more android power
matt68000 said:
I'm also interested in what folks are using. I whipped up a poll this morning and posted it on Reddit/r/Android but this seems much more appropriate.
Here is the Poll
And the results so far
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Great idea! As of now, it looks like the distribution of Android Studio and Eclipse w/ ADT goes head-by-head.
As for me, I prefer Android Studio. The layout previews and the built-in gradle support are the most important advantages for me. And of course the Darcula theme is also a huge plus
Still sticking with Eclipse. Android Studio has more fancy features, but we're hand coding all the XML's or dynamically creating views anyway, so while a better UI editor works for smaller apps, it's not much help for a complex one.
That and redeploying / releasing is easier (for me anyway) with Eclipse, I've heard too many issues with Gradle to make the switch yet with commercial apps. People still complain about compile time, but with DexGuard packing stuff, it's < 10s between clicking "Run" and having it on the phone, not bad for an 6MB .apk full of code.
andreait15 said:
Hello,
I have built my first Android app using Eclipse and I think it was pretty quick and helpful in many ways.
After the first project, my colleague asked me to switch to Android Studio, but my question is: is it better than Eclipse? Which one do you prefer?
Thank you all in advance,
Andrea
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi , I have been using eclipse IDE for long time.It is great software to do android development.But they say that Android Studio is more context aware that eclipse and you have to write very less code.Through predictions it guesses what you want to do.So I have decided to give it try and Will be posting my finding here.
Yes this is sure that Android studio is still buggy as my team mates using this software often say that.
Let me check and I will get back.
Any one else if find major differences b/w two please explain pros/cons here.
Thanks,
Eclipse
andreait15 said:
Hello,
I have built my first Android app using Eclipse and I think it was pretty quick and helpful in many ways.
After the first project, my colleague asked me to switch to Android Studio, but my question is: is it better than Eclipse? Which one do you prefer?
Thank you all in advance,
Andrea
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Go With eclipse
Eclipse is stable and you will find lot of android video tutorials based on eclipse
Android Studio is still not fully stable ...
aditya.kamble said:
Go With eclipse
Eclipse is stable and you will find lot of android video tutorials based on eclipse
Android Studio is still not fully stable ...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have you got examples of when Android Studio has not been stable?
Just because its still in "alpha" stage doesn't mean its not stable... I've never had any issues with it since switching from eclipse. Remember its based off IntelliJ which is stable.
It is stable enough to develop apps. But we should used to that sometimes studio freeze when we plug second device, or when we trying to do something sophisticated with Gradle. Recording video sometimes generate broken mp4 file.
Another thing is Gradle, which is great tool to simplify building app. Flavors and build types wasn't so easy never before.
Now with 0.5.8 version is almost complete code completion for Gradle files. In upcoming releases we will get proguard completion.
There is several crashes here and there, but it cannot be compared to eclipse. Not the same league.
Big problem is lacking support for native code so you do develop mostly on Visual Studio.
If spending couple minutes from time to time with IDE itself doesn't scare you much, the choice is simple.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using XDA Free mobile app
Hi,
Continuing with my previous post ,
I started using android studio a week ago and following are my findings till now.
Android studio is excellent tool for android I guess because it has so many shortcuts or features etc.Sure it has some learning involved because of gradle.But once you pass basics of setting up project using gradle it is most excellent tool.Following are features
1).It will auto import classes when you write code.
2).It is truely context aware tool becuase It will present you with options relevant to piece of code(function, expression,class etc) you are writing when alt+enter is pressed.Consider alt+enter as right click.eg.If you have written any regular expression in your code then it will automatically identify it as regular expression and present you with dialog to test you regular expression there only.Same goes with SQL,HTML,XML etc it presents option with these only.Means you do not have to tell ide that I have written some regular expression please evaluate.It knows what you want.
3).You can search file using ctrl+N by specifying name of file.You can also specify filename:<line> in search box it will go to that file and to that line.
4).Another cool feature is gui editor.When writing any layout then it shows preview side by side, so you dont have to switch.Cool thing is that you can preview multiple devices at the same time.And device skin is of real device.How cool is that.
5).Now coolest feature is that you can set up multiple versions of project at the same time using build flavours using gradle.It is coolest.Just learn this you will love it.
6).No need to install ADT separately and update it separately.Studio comes with everything preloaded , and if any update comes then it is update for Android studio.
7).Real trick of using Android studio is to learn as many shortcuts as possible , Under Help in android studio there is keymapping , it contains complete list of shorcuts.
8).Code navigation is awesome in android studio.
9).It is stable.
Now I am not saying eclipse is not good IDE, but simply android studio is better than it in every aspect.
I feel that if you are new to learning android then please start using Android Studio instead of eclipse.
Please follow this channel for video tutorials on Android Studio : https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC5fT02o8H1NnGfX7j1CmP6Q
Thanks,Hit thanks if it helped.:good:
I used Eclipse for about 1.5 year. I know almost evry bug there, so after that development was pretty starightforward. Recently, I had to use AS, because of commercial project. It looks great, it's fast and I love it. If you are starting, choose AS.
I got Studio working, but it's still all new to me (so much more in an APK, it seems).
I do like it though, it brings a fresh new UI to the table. Need to figure out how to import libraries in it, though...
bassie1995 said:
I got Studio working, but it's still all new to me (so much more in an APK, it seems).
I do like it though, it brings a fresh new UI to the table. Need to figure out how to import libraries in it, though...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
New Module > Import JAR or AAR or Import Existing Project
For libraries that are in the maven repository you can simply add the project to the build.gradle file, for example add the following to import the Google Play Services library:
Code:
compile 'com.google.android.gms:play-services:+'
Jonny said:
New Module > Import JAR or AAR or Import Existing Project
For libraries that are in the maven repository you can simply add the project to the build.gradle file, for example add the following to import the Google Play Services library:
Code:
compile 'com.google.android.gms:play-services:+'
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah cool, I'll try. Thanks!
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