Hey guys, while this information may be redundant to some, this is my first 2A charging phone having come from a GS2. A few note's i thought i'd share about fully utilizing the maximum charging of this phone. Using Elixer app, i was able to determine a few tips when charging
CABLE LENGTH MATTERS
I went out and bought some nice long monoprice cables, 10' and 15', i hated the feeling of being sucked to the nearest wall when you wanted to charge and use your phone. Plugged it into my nice new S4 wall port with a 10' cable, and checked the amperage being sucked in, to my surprise it was no where near the 1900mA max i should be getting. Went to the 15', even lower current (duh, for those who weren't able to put that together), went back to my 6' cable, boom, back up to 1900mA.
TLDR: 6' max for maximum charging
PAY ATTENTION TO 3rd PARTY SPECS
often times these specs are misleading on amazon and such. Often times you will see a 2A car charger with two ports! Awesome, but sadly each port is usually rated for 1A each. This will not be enough to output a full 1.9A (1900mA) for your device. You need to look for 3.1A rated two port items (2.1A and 1A port), or 2/2.1A output for single port chargers, or for true dual charging, a 4.2A rated with each port rated for 2.1A. They do exist.
Also, pay attention to whether the device is iPAD (or any dumb iDevice) certified or marketed to the iCommunitiy. Often times even though the dual port chargers with the 2.1 and a 1 amp port, the 2.1 amp port does NOT have the correct data ports shorted out. What this means is how the phone detects the power source. When you hook your phone up to a computer, there are channels in the USB cable that tell the phone it will be using data, this then limits the amount of power it will draw. The iPAD chargers are set up this way where the data ports are not shorted out, so your phone will not suck the full amount of power. To bypass this, you either need 'CHARGING ONLY' USB cables, which short out this channel for you, or you need to mod the charger with some light soldering. Often times i find this iPAD issue on the ones rated for 2.1A, the 2A chargers generally do not have this issue (just a generalization on the marketing of the chargers, not a fact)
do some reading on the spec's before you blast the product, i hate it when people bash it when they buy the wrong thing and it's their own fault for not taking the time to research it. And if it's not clear, don't buy it!
Ok, that's all i have for now, hopefully this helped some people out there. make sure you do your reading before you write up posts about your phone charging slow, or bash a product you bought because you didnt understand what it was truly designed for.
Related
why? why did motorola use a proprietary charging cable? it would of been so nice to have a micro usb cable to charge the xoom. im very worried one day that needle proprietary cable going to break and it wont charge my xoom anymore.
it seems like motorola is a HUGE fan or proprietary cables, especially the v60 series flip phones.
fondoo said:
why? why did motorola use a proprietary charging cable? it would of been so nice to have a micro usb cable to charge the xoom. im very worried one day that needle proprietary cable going to break and it wont charge my xoom anymore.
it seems like motorola is a HUGE fan or proprietary cables, especially the v60 series flip phones.
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All the latest tablets have proprietary cables...
fondoo said:
why? why did motorola use a proprietary charging cable? it would of been so nice to have a micro usb cable to charge the xoom. im very worried one day that needle proprietary cable going to break and it wont charge my xoom anymore.
it seems like motorola is a HUGE fan or proprietary cables, especially the v60 series flip phones.
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Simple, many recent tablets use proprietary cables to allow higher current and faster charge times.
The average usb cable hooked up to your pc provides about 500mA
The proprietary cable for a modern tablet like the XOOM can deliver around
1.5A
With a micro USB cable it would take forever to charge the XOOM. Then people would be complaining about why the XOOM takes so incredibly long to charge, and bashing motorola for the problem. Instead Motorola chose to do it the intelligent way, by separating the charge function to a proprietary cable to allow very fast charging, and including the usb cable for data transfer.
When I see a proprietary cable I don't think - crap why do they do it this way. Instead I think wow great, that means this thing was designed for fast charges.
Digital Man said:
Simple, many recent tablets use proprietary cables to allow higher current and faster charge times.
The average usb cable hooked up to your pc provides about 500mA
The proprietary cable for a modern tablet like the XOOM can deliver around
1.5A
With a micro USB cable it would take forever to charge the XOOM. Then people would be complaining about why the XOOM takes so incredibly long to charge, and bashing motorola for the problem. Instead Motorola chose to do it the intelligent way, by separating the charge function to a proprietary cable to allow very fast charging, and including the usb cable for data transfer.
When I see a proprietary cable I don't think - crap why do they do it this way. Instead I think wow great, that means this thing was designed for fast charges.
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THANK YOU lol finally someone that understands.....
plus, the input voltage in to the tab is 12v, hard to get 12v from a 5v USB supply...
For a bit more info, I too wondered about USB charging. The limit seems to be when the Xoom is running, the current drain can be upwards of 400 mA so I could see a situation where a USB charger at 500 mA would overload if you did too much on the Xoom during charging. That would be good enough reason to avoid that design mess. "Do not use during charging" would not be sufficent protection. The Moto Mains Charger manages 1500 mA for a couple of hours which is wonderful. Now if only I could charge my Nexus S that quickly
xtkxhom3r said:
THANK YOU lol finally someone that understands.....
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right? about time
I am really glad that trickle charging is not possible with the Xoom, saves a lot of problems...I just wish they had used a different connector for the power. Something a bit more durable and commonly included in third party multichargers would have been nice...but one can't have everything.
I still support the seperate power cable choice for all kinds of reasons.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA Premium App
Just amazes me that folks will complain about anything and everything. Good grief, it charges in no time and runs more than a day when it does. What more can you expect?
I like the idea of a separate charger, but the only thing I take issue with is the design of the charger it self. Luckily, I just set mine on the dock before bed. The dock doesn't use that flimsy pin, it uses the two gold plates at the bottom to charge.
Kcarpenter said:
I like the idea of a separate charger, but the only thing I take issue with is the design of the charger it self. Luckily, I just set mine on the dock before bed. The dock doesn't use that flimsy pin, it uses the two gold plates at the bottom to charge.
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going to have to look into that dock cause i'm not to fond of the charger that it has. so the avg. use time is about a day, are you guys mod or heavy users(as you can tell i dont have mine yet ordered and waiting for it to show up)trying to get as much real world use info as i can
i love the proprietary cable. It is SOOO much faster. My Galaxy tab with a 4000 mAH battery took almost 4 hours to charge and i was lucky to get two days usage out of it (standby time and normal usage combined). My Xoom (no idea on mAH size) charges in 2 hours and i get 90 hours usage out of it (mainly standby but still a lot of screen on time, wiht a much larger and brighter screen to power). LOVE it.
Yeah I wouldn't worry about the Cable its seems durable, only thing I AM worried about was how you plug the wires all on the side of the device, I feel like there's abit of give on the wires when holding it sideways, I wish it was more like the iPad.
You know the first time I saw that the tablets used a seperate charging cable I was like, "why?" but then I stopped and think, there's no why a USB (let alone a micro-USB) can charge those suckers, so I'm personally glade that tablet makers did what they did and make it seperate.
I just wish they chose a 30-pin connector instead of this tiny one. The slightest mistake while it's charging (like say you trip over the cord), and there goes your xoom for repair/replacement.
Lets not rule out USB charging. Yes, I love going from 5% to 100% in about an hour. But I also have USB plugged in for hours on end when doing my thang. . That being said, we do not know for certain that USB charge is a hardware limitation. Yes, USB puts out 500mV. But I can tell the kernel to suck in whatever. If the hardware is capable, its doable.
I still think the option should have been given to us. Cuz many if not all of us have micro USB around. I for one only take a single micro USB in my pocket for my phone. So its would have Been nice to be able to charge both device with one charger. But I mean scull charge usually carry me all day. So I don't see it as a major problem right now.
Sent from my Xoom using XDA Premium App
bigrushdog said:
Lets not rule out USB charging. Yes, I love going from 5% to 100% in about an hour. But I also have USB plugged in for hours on end when doing my thang. . That being said, we do not know for certain that USB charge is a hardware limitation. Yes, USB puts out 500mV. But I can tell the kernel to suck in whatever. If the hardware is capable, its doable.
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Its actually 500mA not 500mV. Usb provides 5 volts at 500ma for usb 2.0 and that will be picked up to 900ma in usb 3.0. Even with this in mind it isn't the biggest problem with stoppinh usb charging in the xoom. The issue I believe is in the fact that the current charger is 12 volts and 1.5 amps. That's more than twice the volts at tripl the amperes.
Even beyond the amperage issue charging a battery that is set up to input from a 12 volt source with a 5 volts supply, even if it was possible with existing xoom hardware it would take forever!
I wish there was a way to have both options available for charging. Use the USB if you have no access to a AC adapter, albeit, a slower charge.
It seems that there's a false dichotomy here; the options aren't only trickle charge by usb and wall adapter with the proprietary connection. What about a wall charge via the usb port? I don't see why the usb port couldn't be used for the charge. I can trickle charge my n1 or I can plug it into an outlet, which charges the phone much faster. I'm sure the xoom could have been designed to suck in more power when conected to an outlet.
The only plus with the proprietary port is that we can charge and have the xoom connected to a computer or peripheral at the same time.
Hey all,
I've been using my N10 for a week now and am wondering why and if it's normal for the tablet to require 8+ hours to recharge?
I'm plugging it into the wall using a generic USB cable and non-Samsung power block. Should that matter at all?
Signed 'confused...'
Yes, the charger matters. The stock wall charger is at 2Amps, while a normal USB connection is at 0.5Amps, for example. All devices will charge more slowly on lower amperages, but since the battery of the Nexus 10 is so huge (9000mAh - about double your average laptop), charging it from 0 to 100 will be dreadfully slow, if you're not using a proper charger.
1. Are there other wall chargers with higher Amp output that are safe to use w/ the N10?
2. Is there any long term damage to the battery using a higher or lower Amp charger?
Another issue is if the charger is made for an Apple product it doesn't short the data pins so the Nexus doesn't see it as a high amperage power supply and only pulls .5 amps.
Use the OEM Samsung charger or get one of these:
Ventev r2200 AC Travel Charger, Dual 2A USB Port 110-220v With MicroUSB Cable
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00BSC7FW0/ref=cm_sw_r_an_am_ap_am_us?ie=UTF8
And if you want a it to charge even faster, use a pogo cable.
Original Pogo Cable for Google Nexus 10 (25% Faster Charge) - MAGNECTOR
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00D7NZLK6/ref=cm_sw_r_an_am_ap_am_us?ie=UTF8
Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2
garberfc said:
1. Are there other wall chargers with higher Amp output that are safe to use w/ the N10?
2. Is there any long term damage to the battery using a higher or lower Amp charger?
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Higher than 2.1 amps? Not commercially that I'm aware of, though you could always jerry rig some contraption to deliver more.
The problem is, however, that the device will not draw the extra power. A device will draw the power it can use, and no more. I haven't tested what the draw is on my Nexus 10, but on my Note 2, it never draws more than 1.8 amps (although that reading may be a little inflated and it really only draws 1.5 amps). I suspect it's more or less the same with the N10 and the stock USB cable and Samsung 2.0 amp charger. So if you went nuts and jerry rigged a 50 amp power supply to the device, it would still only draw 1.5 amps.
Note that the draw can be affected by the USB cable you use. I've seen some USB cables draw less than 500mA where the stock Samsung USB cable draws 1.8 amps.
Bottom line is that you're not going to find a wall charger above 2.1 amps as far as I know, and even if you did, it wouldn't charge the Nexus 10 any faster. The problem is what you identified in your original post -- using some plain vanilla 500mA (0.5 amp) micro USB charger that you've had lying around the house for the past several years and assuming that it should charge just as well as the stock Samsung charger. It won't, as you discovered -- the N10 will only draw about a third of what it's capable of drawing from such a charger.
Be careful buying 2.0/2.1 amp chargers from Amazon or wherever, particularly if they're identified as Samsung chargers. They're almost always counterfeit, and no better than the 500mA chargers I mentioned above.
You might also want to look into the POGO charger cable because it allows the Nexus 10 to draw virtually the full 2.0 amps from the charger rather than 1.5.
JasW said:
Higher than 2.1 amps? Not commercially that I'm aware of, though you could always jerry rig some contraption to deliver more.
The problem is, however, that the device will not draw the extra power. A device will draw the power it can use, and no more. I haven't tested what the draw is on my Nexus 10, but on my Note 2, it never draws more than 1.8 amps (although that reading may be a little inflated and it really only draws 1.5 amps). I suspect it's more or less the same with the N10 and the stock USB cable and Samsung 2.0 amp charger. So if you went nuts and jerry rigged a 50 amp power supply to the device, it would still only draw 1.5 amps.
Note that the draw can be affected by the USB cable you use. I've seen some USB cables draw less than 500mA where the stock Samsung USB cable draws 1.8 amps.
Bottom line is that you're not going to find a wall charger above 2.1 amps as far as I know, and even if you did, it wouldn't charge the Nexus 10 any faster. The problem is what you identified in your original post -- using some plain vanilla 500mA (0.5 amp) micro USB charger that you've had lying around the house for the past several years and assuming that it should charge just as well as the stock Samsung charger. It won't, as you discovered -- the N10 will only draw about a third of what it's capable of drawing from such a charger.
Be careful buying 2.0/2.1 amp chargers from Amazon or wherever, particularly if they're identified as Samsung chargers. They're almost always counterfeit, and no better than the 500mA chargers I mentioned above.
You might also want to look into the POGO charger cable because it allows the Nexus 10 to draw virtually the full 2.0 amps from the charger rather than 1.5.
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Listen to this guy.
@JasW - Wow, thanks for the information / education. It makes a LOT more sense now.
Thanks again, F
@Gearhead_ENG - Thanks for the links! I'm going to go home and scrounge through all my old chargers and see if I have more 2Amp chargers. If not, I'll be following the links again to purchase...
So we just upgraded to Note 3 from our galaxy 3 (wife and I)...
I noticed the charger is a 2 amp charger compared to the SGS 3's 1 amp.
I started reading some threads here and found out the USB 3.0 cable will not charge the phone faster unless it's plugged into the computer.
Apparently the PCM also limits the phone to charging at 900ma. (not verified)
so I'm curious now.... at what amps does this phone charge? I'm trying to get a spare charger to keep in the car, and also trying to get a usb car charger if I can benefit from the 2.1 amp one instead of the 1 amp one that's in there now....
Can anyone tell me if I should get a 2.1amp charger or stick with 1 amp chargers as the spares if it'll still charge at 900ma?
I'm using USB 2.0 cables btw. (unless I can charge faster with the USB 3.0 when plugged to a car charger or the wall, which I apparently won't from my research here)
While I await for responses, I will plug the charger into my voltage/amp reader and we'll see how much power is being drawn, which might give an idea as to how many ma it's charging at.
For whoever that wants to know this information, these are my findings from my meter that is able to measure how much power is being drawn (kill a watt P3)
with the stock charger and USB 2.0 cable (3.0 made no difference) the phone will charge at 900ma with the screen on. If the phone is shut off, or screen is off, it goes to 1500ma. Very steady at those.
with the SGS3 charger that I had, it's a constant 900ma whether screen is on or off... (1.0 amp charger)
now I guess I will have to see if this is the case with any 2.1 amp charger, or if it's specific to samsung's charger with snapdragon's quick charge feature. I believe only certain chargers allow use of this.
I don't know, I'm getting 1800mA by using stock wall charger with USB3 cable and 450 with USB2 cable. I know GS3 would charge at faster rate when using original Samsung wall charger and cable, which had data lines shorted, not sure if it's the same with Note3.
I don't remember for sure, but I think charging rate from computer was pretty much the same 450mA regardless of USB3 or USB2 port or cable. I remember this because I was surprised they didn't take advantage of higher power ratings with USB3, but maybe it was just my particular setup. I used application that shows charging rate, so all is with phone on, but it makes perfect sense, about 2 hours from 0 to 100% charge, if you allow some extra time for trickle charge at the end, losses and usage.
pete4k said:
I don't know, I'm getting 1800mA by using stock wall charger with USB3 cable and 450 with USB2 cable. I know GS3 would charge at faster rate when using original Samsung wall charger and cable, which had data lines shorted, not sure if it's the same with Note3.
I don't remember for sure, but I think charging rate from computer was pretty much the same 450mA regardless of USB3 or USB2 port or cable. I remember this because I was surprised they didn't take advantage of higher power ratings with USB3, but maybe it was just my particular setup. I used application that shows charging rate, so all is with phone on, but it makes perfect sense, about 2 hours from 0 to 100% charge, if you allow some extra time for trickle charge at the end, losses and usage.
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and how did you measure this 1800mA?
razorseal said:
and how did you measure this 1800mA?
program is called galaxy charging current, you can get it in the play store.
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You can't compare that app to a meter that shows you the actual current being drawn
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N900A using Tapatalk
why not? How do you think your meter is working? Phone has similar IC. How did you come up with your numbers first of all? I thought you plug Kill a watt into outlet and it shows what the charger is using at 110v and at about 10 watts(or is it 220-240v for your location), your unit maybe at the limit of accuracy, since the amperage would be somewhere around 100mA, where your device is designed more for larger power consumption like fridge or TV running 300-1000watts and few amps. Is your unit somehow capable of measuring what the charger is outputting and if so, how?
BTW you can't get more than 900mA from PC even over USB3, thats the max limit.
I checked again: galaxy S3 wall charger is giving me 600mA, Note3 charger with USB2 cable gives me 1200mA and Note 3 charger with USB3 cable pumps out 1800mA, computer USB gives 450mA regardless of computer port, but there is something wrong with the USB3 cable that I got, is not connecting properly and I have to wiggle it to connect so maybe bad cable is the reason I don't get higher charge rate from PC USB3.
I don't see a charger from evga on newegg or on their site. Third party suggestions welcome if necessary. Thanks in advance.
KingPrincess said:
I don't see a charger from evga on newegg or on their site. Third party suggestions welcome if necessary. Thanks in advance.
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My factory charger is rated at 2 amps @ 5V so any charger with those specs should work. I use my Amazon 2A charger without any problems as well as the 2A port on my Ravpower portable battery pack.
TLDR: You get what you pay for. Any 5V charger will charge the device, you do not need a specific "Tegra Note Charger". The larger the current rating the quicker the device will charge. If the psu does not have a USB port in which you can plug in a USB>MicroUSB cable, ensure that the psu has a microUSB plug attached.
There are two main considerations though besides this, first is brand/quality, the second is the charge current available.
Brand/quality - Not all chargers are made equal. Most nowadays are switchmode but component quality and design will vary greatly between chargers of different brands. Whilst the basic buck design that most manufacturers will use is efficient, there is a lot of transient noise introduced as well as voltage ripple depending on the design and components used. The funny thing is that the difference between a "good" psu and a "bad" psu is cents in the dollar but many manufacturers will choose to save those cents. The sense behind it? Most consumers are completely ignorant.
Charge Current - There are two main differences you will see between a 500mA or 2A charger. The first is charge time - if the psu is capable of supplying a higher charge current and the device is capable of drawing that larger charge current then your device will charge quicker. Thing is though, the USB standard requires negotiation to be made between the psu and the device for charge currents larger than 500mA. If you buy a cheap psu that is capable of 2A but does not have the negotiation IC, you will never charge more than 500mA. Once again, the difference between having this IC and not is cents in the dollar.
I just bought some US->Euro AC-adapters so i can use the original charger. A new charger that has decent quality would cost at least 15$ or more, since 2 ampere outputs are rather uncommon (most phones-chargers ones only have 1 ampere).
And 1 ampere is not quite enough to charge the TN7 an use it at the same time (currently using a 1A-charger).
But even with those adapter you don't want the cheapest. Or at least read some comments on amazon before buying. There are a lot of really cheap ones.
I got these ones from amazon and i really hope they're the better ones ...
So with all these posts about USB-c to type a cables not being built to spec with the correct resistor, I figured I'd make a post for questions and answers
A few things..
1a. From what I have observed, do not trust what the phone says. If it says charging rapidly it doesn't necessarily mean its rapidly charging.
1b. If the phone says charging slowly or charging then that is a good indication that the cable is legit.. That is from what I observed. I do not take any responsibility if your phone dies.
I know that this point is..misleading since I said "do not trust what the phone says". But again..this is from what I've tested myself over the past days
2. What does charging slowly and charging mean? I really hope a Google dev or someone knowledgeable answers this
3. Download ampere to see how many amps are getting pulled when it is charging
4. This ties into point 1. If using OEM USB-c to type a cable it will say charging slowly. If a legit cable says that then it seems to be legit. Again.. Not my responsibility if your phone dies
5. There are different stages of battery charging. From 0-80% it is fast . once it hits a certain % it will slowly charge. This is by design for batteries
6. Good cables will use 56k resistors. Bad ones will use 10k resistors
7. Even though a traditional computer USB will only output 500ma max, if you plug in a device that wants 3a, like our phones, the port will give it 3a for a split second and can damage the port. A good cable will stop that with the resistance/resistor
Thats it for me.. I am not an expert but I have been playing with multiple cables and reading up on specs and want to give some answers to the questions I had..
Hope this gets sticked or something
I will update this post as more questions come in.
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk
From what I remember, charging slowly is if it's charging < 1A, charging is between 1A - 2A, and charging rapidly is 2A >. Relying on your phone to tell you if you are charging rapidly isn't the end all to see if the cable is correct, as many can deliver 2.4A which will show as rapid charging, but true rapid charging is 3A.
geoff5093 said:
From what I remember, charging slowly is if it's charging < 1A, charging is between 1A - 2A, and charging rapidly is 2A >. Relying on your phone to tell you if you are charging rapidly isn't the end all to see if the cable is correct, as many can deliver 2.4A which will show as rapid charging, but true rapid charging is 3A.
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That is true but from playing with cables it seems to matter.
When using the same port with non-certified cables it will say charging rapidly. It shouldn't since the port on a computer is only really designed to handle 500ma. The phone is requesting 3a and the cable allows that since it has only 10k/incorrect resistors
The good cable with 56k core will say "hey, the port only allows 500ma, resist me".. This is only from what I've tested with multiple cables
Again like in my OP... This is from my observations
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk