Database Users

Paid Apps the main problem with Android

I am not a developer, but I was reading up on experiences that developers have with the Android Market.
Then I also came across a website that showed some statistics about paid apps and they were shocking. I can't remember the source right now, but it said that the Apple AppStore is a $200 million business per month, where the Android Market is only $5 millions per month. This is very discouraging for developers who are in it for money (usually companies who have the resources to create Games and more Complex Apps and have the ability to Partner with Services).
One developers said that he only got 23 downloads, in the first month. He mentioned then that over half of them used the 24 hour refund (could that be that those were leachers who downloaded the app and threw it on a P2P channel?), eventually he ended up with 11 sales. One guy sent him an email and said that $4.99 is too much to ask for, which I think is not unreasonable considering that there are many apps in the Apple AppStore that cost much more than that. Whether or not his app is useful or not to most users is sadly unknown by me. But looking at his perspective I think I would start developing apps for the iOS, who wouldn't that wants to make money?
The problem with these figures is that developers will eventually stop developing paid apps and the quality of the Android Market (from now on referred to Market) apps vs Apple AppStore (from now on referred to AppStore) apps will extremely decline. And there will be either many low rating apps in the Market or there will be an increase in the amount of Apps submitted the the Market.
We all want good Apps, Apple found out Apps are the number 1 reason a Plattform has success. Android has Google behind it which makes up for a good amount of Great apps and there are very good developers here that are not in it for the money, but eventually it all comes down to making money when it comes to professional businesses offering a product. Look at the games that are offered on the iOS platform vs Android, you can't tell me that an iPhone 3G or a 2nd Gen iPod has better graphics performance than some of the higher-end Android devices.
Also, are there too many free alternatives in the Android Market that the AppStore doesn't have? There are also many free apps in the AppStore.
What can be done about this? - Please post your ideas, since I am not a developer I am not the pro here when it comes to this issue I am asking for your opinion.
However, I am a business student so I have some insights of how companies will react to this as mentioned above.
The few ideas I have would be:
1. Google could increase the quality of design of the API and give different APIs to paid vs free Apps.
2. Sadly I have to mention it because of all the Leachers and then P2P distributors, remove the 24 hour refund policy.
3. Google to hire more developers in house who are paid and create free apps that can compete with the AppStore (which would cost Google a fortune). Maybe then charge a small amount for Google Voice to do some financial damage report.
4. Change the Markets way how people pay for apps? I noticed that in the past on my iPhone the decision to actually PAY for an app was much easier and faster for me, I didn't even bother to look for a free alternative.
5. Try to Market Android more towards people who are less geeks (who know where and how to find a free solution to the app they need), as in change the look of Android and make it much more simple for the average Joe day to day user (which I would hate because that means remove or hide many of the great features that make Android what I like so much about it and go back to a more primitive system like the iOS4). And tell hardware manufacturers to create more shiny phones.
--> Since most people who don't know how to get free alternatives, or who don't know and don't have the time to learn how to find free alternatives are people that are buying a product for the lifestyle and to show off (iPhone).
What are YOUR ideas to fix this issue? - Thank you for everyone posting solutions.

I don't think this is something we should worry about.
First, Android is open-source and many enthusiasts give their applications free of charge, which is not the case with Apple's closed OS. That is why about 65% of all apps in Market are free, and only 35% paid. In Appstore, about 70% are paid, only 30% free. Statistics: http://androidheadlines.com/2010/09/app-store-vs-android-market-how-much-is-paid-for.html.
Secondly, you'll find that Market currently supports purchases in only 13 markets while the App Store does so in 90. These numbers will change as time passes by and more markets will be included, but I'm sure that Android will always be a platform with much more free apps than iOS, and that's the beauty of Android.

As far as I'm aware the developers have a say regarding that 24 hour refund policy. An application can be made to be non-refundable if they choose to.

In comparing developers for iOS and Android, you have to also look at who they are individually. Sure, there are many apps developed across the board for all mobile devices, but I think the core of the Android Market are individuals who develop apps just for the sake of developing apps. They enjoy what they do and they would do it regardless of profit.
Of course you have a few that try to make money, but I believe they are the exception rather than the rule.
I mean no offense when I say this, but I believe that the iPhone attracts a very different type of user than Android does. Most people I personally know that use the iPhone do so more out of status and pretentiousness than its own usefulness. Many do not even know the majority of things they could do with the iPhone. Those I know who use Android use it because they root it and do their own modifications, overclocking, etc.
With this in mind, I believe that Android apps are generally created by a different kind of developer for a different kind of user.

shinji257 said:
As far as I'm aware the developers have a say regarding that 24 hour refund policy. An application can be made to be non-refundable if they choose to.
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We have absolutely no say in whether or not out apps are refunded. If I showed you the numbers of instant refunds you'd puke. And the OP states $200 million to $5 million which is ridiculously off. I believe Google just reported that they passed $1 billion in sales (profit) from the Android Market. Either way, it's way more than $5 million a month.
All that said I personally am happy with what I have been able to do with the Market. I expected a little better on my most recent app but it takes time for people to get word of a new app. That's pretty much the problem I've found. It's hard to get noticed. But I still think it's pretty good. There is a lot I absolutely hate about the Market and a bunch of things I like about it. I'd still rather develop for Android and ironically, none of the apps I have created would even work on iPhone. Two are root apps and one requires a modification of the browser which is not allowed on iPhone (for no apparent good reason, I might add).

I am glad to hear that this isn't as big of an issue as I read online, it would be sad to see a great plattform to be hurten, as you can see with the WebOS.
As for not getting recognized, a few tips I have about that is not to rely too much on people finding your app in the market, but rather advertise it yourself, use your facebook and twitter and even this forum (if the forum policy allow that, I am not sure on that again since I am not a developer). I love the QR codes, I actually see many of them in bathroom stalls and other places, and I always check on them since it's in my curiosity to find out where they get me.

I'm making an extra living off paid apps on the Marketplace.
Oh, and an extra living off free apps with Admob.
So now I'm making 3 livings worth. It's wonderful. I have no complaints.
I mean no offense when I say this, but I believe that the iPhone attracts a very different type of user than Android does. Most people I personally know that use the iPhone do so more out of status and pretentiousness than its own usefulness. Many do not even know the majority of things they could do with the iPhone. Those I know who use Android use it because they root it and do their own modifications, overclocking, etc.
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You're forgetting about Droid users. You'd be surprised how many people own an Android just for status and pretentiousness. It goes both ways. I even know a few people with Androids that don't even know that they have an Android.

1. Google could increase the quality of design of the API and give different APIs to paid vs free Apps.
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Wouldn't that mean closing the source? Or you think people will use opensource platform that only runs free apps over opensource platform that runs both?
I don't think I want closed source OS on my phone, if I did I'd probably use iPhone.
2. Sadly I have to mention it because of all the Leachers and then P2P distributors, remove the 24 hour refund policy.
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Pirates do buy software sometimes, how do you think it gets to P2P networks in the first place? One of them buys it, his friend cracks it and everyone else gets it 4free.
So it wouldn't solve anything, removing the refund would only make legit customers angry if the app doesn't work.
3. Google to hire more developers in house who are paid and create free apps that can compete with the AppStore (which would cost Google a fortune). Maybe then charge a small amount for Google Voice to do some financial damage report.
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I thought google did hire developers and they do create free apps. I don't think competing with appstore is their ultimate goal though, since appstore and iphoneos are completely closed.
Charging for services is something I agree with completely.
They should indeed make certain (not all) services cost money. But they should also keep the software free and open to ensure the quality.
4. Change the Markets way how people pay for apps? I noticed that in the past on my iPhone the decision to actually PAY for an app was much easier and faster for me, I didn't even bother to look for a free alternative.
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It was much easier and faster because apple paid someone to make it easier and faster.
I'm not so sure google is willing to invest money into closed source software, especially when you consider these 3 facts.
1. Closed source software has a limited amount of developers who are working to make it better, faster and more efficient.
2. More developers on a single project means more features, more bugfixes and faster development.
3. Opensource software in general is more secure because everyone can see the source code.
5. Try to Market Android more towards people who are less geeks (who know where and how to find a free solution to the app they need), as in change the look of Android and make it much more simple for the average Joe day to day user (which I would hate because that means remove or hide many of the great features that make Android what I like so much about it and go back to a more primitive system like the iOS4). And tell hardware manufacturers to create more shiny phones.
--> Since most people who don't know how to get free alternatives, or who don't know and don't have the time to learn how to find free alternatives are people that are buying a product for the lifestyle and to show off (iPhone).
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As I don't like being labeled, I think marketing should be focused on pushing Android for everyone, not just specific groups of people.
User knows what works best for him so let him decide what to buy. Wide selection of devices that share the base operating system is great, but user should decide what type of software he wants to use, not google nor apple.
User should also decide what type of service he wants to use and whether that service is free or paid.
Changing the look of Android to make it more simple is something I'd personally hate, but we should always have options.
It would be great to flash an extremely simple android OS for my grandmother's phone for example, while keeping my VNC and SSH on my own device.
Also, don't think there's much difference between android users and iphone users, they're just people anyway. And there's an equal amount of pirated iphone apps and android apps.
Only real difference is about the OS, where one offers you a choice and another forces you to pay and develops restrictions instead of new features.
What are YOUR ideas to fix this issue? - Thank you for everyone posting solutions.
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I don't think there is an issue, devs get paid from pushing ads, users are happy with a wide selection of apps. Some services are free some services cost money. Just my 2c

Do you guys feel that AdMob advertisement is low quality

Hello all, I have an free Android app which I plan to monetize with advertisement. However, after some observation with Google AdMob, I feel that its advertisement is pretty low quality. I always get those advertisement with "sexual message", which usually appears in free app with adv support. For example, "there is a pretty girl in your room" type of advertisement is not uncommon seen.
Personally, I own a website, which I monetize with Google Adsense. I feel Google Adsense is having much higher advertisement quality than Google AdMob, as I never saw sexual advertisement in Google Adsense.
I expect Google AdMob is having more or less quality as Google Adsense's. In reality, it doesn't.
I do not wish to spoil my app reputation with low quality advertisement. What do you guy feel on Google AdMob advertisement quality? Do we have a better advertisement system for mobile, which is on-par with Google Adsense?

I haven't noticed that with my app so far and I have been using admob. There is also the option to turn on/off age appropriate ads by going to Manage Settings > Category / Type Settings. I have also started using adWhirl and mixing up my ad networks.

How is it going with admob until now? Are you satisfied with your earnings? Or are you using something else now?

Any ad service which puts "hot singles in your area" ads aren't worth it IMO.
How many users does your app have? Depending on your numbers it may be better to use your time/resources to get more users, which will then open the door to higher quality advertising deals. The last thing you want to do when an app is just in its infant stage is turn potential users away with tacky ads.

sharonlewis said:
How is it going with admob until now? Are you satisfied with your earnings? Or are you using something else now?
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I have used Admob. It is kinda low on eCPM. Some of my friends' accounts got banned because Google thinks they was cheating. Admob seems to be very strict on advertíng regulation. Now I combine 2 ad networks: Admob and Adsota. Adsota has much higher eCPM, not so strict, and swift payment. You can find it by googling "ads.appota".
Best of luck, mate!

I would highly recommend you check out our video platform on Teads.tv. We work strictly with the most recognizable, and reputable advertisers out there. We currently have live campaigns with Playstation, Honda, and T-Mobile, just to name a few. What we offer is great advertisers, great CPM's, support team to help with integration, and currently a publisher sign-up bonus.
If you'd like to learn more about our platform, you can head over to our website at www.teads.tv or e-mail me directly [email protected]

[Q] Advertising on Admob brings no conversions. Do you know why?

I have been advertising in admob for a few days and out of nearly 2k ad clicks there was not a single app install. It means that the conversion ratio is less than 0.0005.
1. Does any one of you have any experience in advertising on admob? Have you encountered such situation?
2. If you see the app at Play Store - name: Dessin, package: it.dessin.app, is there anything that drives you off? Maybe those 2k people were repelled by something?
I don't know if this is common but such conversion ratio is making advertising pointless - CPC that would make it profitable should be below 0.003$.

For a paid app I'd expect resulting installations to be low, especially above the $0.99 mark.
I heard a quote the other week that said "expect to put 50% of what you want to make into advertising", demoralising, but unless you are very clever or go viral it's an uphill struggle!
It looks like a great concept and your above the >100 installs mark and rising, I'd worry about about those reviews for the free version. Sometimes it's not necessarily the apps fault and more about bridging the gap between users expectations from your marketing materials and what you actually have.
Do you have a popup 'Get Started' tutorial when the app starts for example

d34d-b33f said:
I have been advertising in admob for a few days and out of nearly 2k ad clicks there was not a single app install. It means that the conversion ratio is less than 0.0005.
1. Does any one of you have any experience in advertising on admob? Have you encountered such situation?
2. If you see the app at Play Store - name: Dessin, package: it.dessin.app, is there anything that drives you off? Maybe those 2k people were repelled by something?
I don't know if this is common but such conversion ratio is making advertising pointless - CPC that would make it profitable should be below 0.003$.
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Hi,
Admob can be efficient when having big budgets. For small budgets, i recommend you Appbrain (CPI) where you pay for installs.
For your app, i think that ratings are behind and maybe it looks a little bit complicated in the screenshots, if you can satisfy the users by giving them what they ask for to get higher ratings, you will get better ratings and more downloads
Translating your app to other languages and its presentation will bring you more downloads
Best wishes

Was your app free when you launched it? That would have been a good start. Also, I agree with the localization part, you should experiment with more languages. It's very important that users who don't know English can also use it.

Baralex said:
Was your app free when you launched it? That would have been a good start. Also, I agree with the localization part, you should experiment with more languages. It's very important that users who don't know English can also use it.
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No it wasn't and it seems that being not-free was the reason of this terrible results.
Lesson learned: the app has to be free.
App is localized into 8 languages. For some time its description was also localized but I do updates every week and keeping all these translation in sync did cost too much. The app is still translated but it seems that users of other languages bounce off the english-only description page.
Maybe do you know any services that could translate app description on Google Play?

Share you paid advertising experience

I've just published my game to Google Play Store and was thinking of purchasing some advertising or pay per install ads. Anyone has any experience using Facebook ads, Admob, appbrain or other ad networks? What would you recommend. I do not have a large budget, for a start I am planning to spend around USD100.

Digitally said:
I've just published my game to Google Play Store and was thinking of purchasing some advertising or pay per install ads. Anyone has any experience using Facebook ads, Admob, appbrain or other ad networks? What would you recommend. I do not have a large budget, for a start I am planning to spend around USD100.
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No experience with ads yet. I was recommended Facebook Lookalike Audience but we'll continue on our own up until 10k users. My fear would be to get a mass of users and disappoint them. Growing 100 at a time provides a good feedback loop to improve the app. Might use the Lookalike Audience then! Good luck!

Digitally said:
I've just published my game to Google Play Store and was thinking of purchasing some advertising or pay per install ads. Anyone has any experience using Facebook ads, Admob, appbrain or other ad networks? What would you recommend. I do not have a large budget, for a start I am planning to spend around USD100.
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I am also interested in this topic. I have a free app with a paid (no ads) counterpart. I was considering using any of the services that charge per install (CPI) on the paid app. If the cost per install is lower than 70% of the price of your app, then that investment would be risk-free.
Has anyone tried something like that? Would you recommend any service in particular? (Ideally, the ones that do not require SDKs to be added to the app, I don't want to add crapware to my app).

Digitally said:
I've just published my game to Google Play Store and was thinking of purchasing some advertising or pay per install ads. Anyone has any experience using Facebook ads, Admob, appbrain or other ad networks? What would you recommend. I do not have a large budget, for a start I am planning to spend around USD100.
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The budget normally starts from $10000. I don't think $100 generates significant data and downloads to help you make further decisions considering that average CPI is about $1.

Reply From A Guy That Knows The Data
Digitally said:
I've just published my game to Google Play Store and was thinking of purchasing some advertising or pay per install ads. Anyone has any experience using Facebook ads, Admob, appbrain or other ad networks? What would you recommend. I do not have a large budget, for a start I am planning to spend around USD100.
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Great question! While I cannot, and will not give you numbers or estimates in any shape or form, I can give you broad and general advice.
First off, I'll explain my background in a bit more detail. I worked in advertising sales for years at the top companies, and then moved into the mobile app space (I am also a secret coder by night.) I then spent two years working in the mobile app data space - providing performance data in the form of estimates for downloads/revenue. Our job was to sell our vast data sets (on every mobile app and publisher - ranked and un-ranked) which were centered around accurate estimates for downloads/revenue for any given app in every category/subcat, and country for iOS and GP. We worked with mid-market and top publishers to help them forecast how many installs they would need to purchase to reach top rank, how many organic installs they would receive at that rank, and how many installs they would have to purchase on an ongoing basis to maintain that rank.
Based on my experiences, truth be told, most publishers that are actual companies (not small indie or single shop guys)....they are buying downloads. This is not to say that strong marketing campaigns don't come with this (PR, promotions, social media, viral, cross-promotional ads to existing user base, etc.), but in some way or another, most of them will be buying ads. Here is the caveat - it is not a simple process, at all. They have analysts that know exactly how much money they make off of one download....for instance...they know that for every download on xyz game, they make $2.30, and their CPI is $1.95, thus, their actual net rev is $.35 per install. However, this is all also centered around growth potential as well...so in many cases, they need to hit the top ranks for organic growth to generate higher profit margins, so they need accurate forecasting of exactly/roughly how many installs it's going to take to get there...and if they come up short, they don't make top charts and they either have to spend more money to climb up...or they're out of budget and they've lost $$$. Basically, if you want to buy ads...you need to set realistic goals, and understand what the value of your user is...from a financial standpoint. You must know your numbers cold before even considering putting a budget towards ads.
That being said, there are a ton of ways to buy ads out there, as I'm sure you and everyone knows. However, if you do get around to doing some solid analysis on what your users are worth, and want to run some testing with a low budget...nothing to break the bank...I would A) Go with a reputable company, even if the CPI/CPA is higher than you'd like....because you want to avoid fraudulent DL's....many ad networks will turn a blind eye to this for obvious financial reasons, and B) Try Facebook....honestly, I've spoken to many smaller developers that find a fair CPI/CPA, with pretty good ROI and retention.
Hope this helps - KNOW YOUR NUMBERS AND ALWAYS LOOK TO THE DATA
~Geo_Mojito

Some interesting data we are gathering at Thalamus.co, where we have the average CPI rates & Install Volumes of each network broken out by genre/platform/country. There are also contacts and minimum spends so should give you a good sense of what's out there.
A $100 budget is not too large, so it'd be hard to give you a definitive answer as to which network has basically no minimums (unless you want to work with a mobile self-serve DSP like PocketMath). Facebook would be a good place to start, although prices are at a premium due to high demand. I'd suggest really going all in on free methods like PR, reaching out to Bloggers, ASO, Social Fan Pages, Organic/Viral Installs, and Partnerships first.

My experience:
1) Social Networks advertising. I promoted it personally, it was tooooo long and without big results.
2) Youtube videos. Not bad, but you have to attract users to watch your videos and invite their friends to install your app.
3) Buying the marketing services in agencies. I have experience with several agencies, but App-Reviews has the best, I think.
4) Use different tools for advertising. I used AdMob, it had some success...

Digitally said:
I've just published my game to Google Play Store and was thinking of purchasing some advertising or pay per install ads. Anyone has any experience using Facebook ads, Admob, appbrain or other ad networks? What would you recommend. I do not have a large budget, for a start I am planning to spend around USD100.
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After advertising services you can try some low budget app promotion services too. My personal choice is AppRankPRO . why is because it gives the proof of each and every install of the genuine real user and free keyword analysis services too. I think you can have a look at AppRankPRO

Ways to do PPC, for cheap: A Guide.

Hi guys,
I just wanted to share some tips in how to get into paid marketing with you guys. I know budgets are typically low, so that's why I'm going to focus on cheap ways to do things. I know it's unlikely that any of us here click on online Ads, but I've been doing PPC for different companies (tech and non-tech) for over three years; you'd be surprised at how many people do actually click on these ads.
The first, but most important thing, is that you are going to want to make sure that you are measuring how your campaigns are working with Google Analytics; PPC and Display Marketing doesn't work for every type of app.
I'm gonna do a very brief summary of Google AdWords, but there's a lot more information online that really, I'm just summarising and repeating. If you want more details on how the AdWords system works, I recommend just doing a couple of Google Searches. If you know how AdWords work, feel free to scroll down to the bolded "now".
Google AdWords is where advertisers pay for Ads to appear on keywords. Billing works on a per click basis. That is, you are only charged when someone clicks on your ad. You ad could be shown a thousand times, but as long as it doesn't have anyone clicking on it, you won't be charged.
There are at most, ten positions your ads can appear in on the Google Search pages. Ideally, you want to be in positions 1-3.
You can set a bid for every keyword you put in. The highest bid wins, with very one important exception. So, let's say that Acme is paying $2.50 for the keyword "App", Tyrell Corp $1.00 and IndieDevRUs $0.50. When we look at pure amount paid, Acme's ad would be pos 1, Tyrell pos 2 and IndieDevRUs pos 3.
BUT! There is something called quality score as well. Quality score is a measure of how good your landing page is, how much it is related to your KW, and how related your ads are to the keyword. Acme's Ad is actually linking to their home page, with no mention of their App anywhere. Tyrell Corp is a bit better, and have linked to their app landing page, but they don't actually mention the keyword 'app' in their AdText. IndieDevRUs, however, have an amazing landing page, and have ad text all about apps. What now happens is this: IndieDevsRUs is at position 1, Tyrell Corp is at Pos 2, and Acme is at pos 3. Even better; IndieDevRUs is still only paying $0.50 per click, whereas Acme, even though they are at position 3, are paying $2.50 for that position.
(Again, this was somewhat simplified, feel free to ask me questions or to look up more info online)
Now, how can app developers reduce their costs? Well, first, focus on making sure that your landing page and Ads are optimized for this quality score; include your keywords in both places (without being spammy! Think of it like SEO), test ads until you find wording with good click through rates, etc.
One trick to get cheaper Ads is to also look into location targeting. So, in AdWords, I can actually set down to an area code/postcode level my location. City, however, is normally fine. Even if you aren't an app that offer local features, by targeting cities, you can get cheaper costs per clicks.
Also, mobile targeting: It is possible to only target mobiles, thus avoiding clicks from people at computers all together. I've been shocked at how many companies wanting to just get mobile users haven't found this option (it's under campaign settings)
Another area to look at is time scheduling: You can tell your ads to only run between certain hours, or even certain days. I'd recommend running a campaign for at least a week, and then taking a look at the data. Find the hours that give you the best conversions, or cheapest costs per clicks, and set your account to only show Ads during that time.
Also, when you sign up on AdWords, take a look online for any cupons or vouchers; quite often, Google will offer to match a certain amount of your budget; e.g. pay $25, and actually have $50 budget. This is perfect for testing the waters (again, AdWords PPC doesn't work for all apps!)
You will also want to experiment with how to get the best out of the visitors who land on your page. I've seen that not every user will actually go to the play store on a browser to download an app, but will instead only do it on their phones. For one company, I discovered that if we had an email sign up on a landing page when someone is visiting on a desktop computer, we could get people to download and use the app through email marketing. BUT! This is something to test. Another company I tried the same strategy for, and not only did we get no email subs, but the conversion rates for downloading the apps went down.
And in fact, this is one of the biggest pieces of advise I can give for paid ads. Test. Test. Test. Everything you do. Test it.
Edit: Thought of a couple of additional things: Vouchers and Mobile Targeting