Sorry if this isn't the right place, but I didn't want to clutter the Dev forum or the Q&A...
Any post made in a developer thread that isn't reporting a bug/issue or asking a question should be auto-ban, immediately. The developer, or someone who is authorized to speak for him/her can then reply with quotes, addressing individual issues.
I'm sorry, but no one cares if you're flashing, or can't wait to try this out. And if the developers want you to express gratuity to them, it probably won't be in their developer thread, where they have to scour 500+ pages to make sure they address all of the bugs reported.
I am new, but as I learn my way around here, this looks to be a bigger and bigger problem.
auto-ban? Isn't that a bit harsh? We were all annoying noobs with stupid questions at one point, but look at how many of them turned out to be great devs (or at least good file movers). And most devs use IRC or twitter to communicate problems and fixed between themselves, xda is mostly the place where the audience gets a taste of the final product.
Questions and bug reporting are completely understandable in a dev thread. The following things are not, and a complete waste of the dev's time:
"Yay, flashing now"
"Awesome"
"This ROM saved my marriage"
"Flashing as soon as I get home from school"
That doesn't help anyone do anything, and just makes it more work for the dev to have to scroll through 500+ pages to see if anyone needs any actual help.
So, no, considering we have a dev thinking about leaving the forums, I don't think it's a bit harsh at all. We can replace noobs that can't follow rules, developers are hard to come by, good ones are worse.
What is the best build you have found and tell me the reason why. I just want to hear what all yall love about android on the HD2
alucardunit1 said:
What is the best build you have found and tell me the reason why. I just want to hear what all yall love about android on the HD2
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Click to collapse
start flashing and loading then you'll find out what best suits your needs
- - - thread reported - - -
not really asking for my self i am just making a thread that others can understand what one is better for some people.
Your post is equivalent to best car brand and why.
It's redundant and pointless. People can search.
Why don't you just ask that you are too lazy to pick one and try it out? They are all good for me, and change often just for the pleasure.
alucardunit1 said:
not really asking for my self i am just making a thread that others can understand what one is better for some people.
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Not allowed to compare ROM's here because upset developers will just walk out.
It would be nice to read some constructive criticism as to why some people would find one ROM better than another but it could start wars and kill some ROM development.
Okay. Time to intervene.
These threads have caused nothing but nightmares for the Xda staff in the past. There's an old saying... "Opinions are like A$$holes. Everybody has one and they ALL stink."
To make it worse.. Very few people ever really share the same exact opinions and that just causes wars to start. "This build is the best" --- "NO THIS BUILD IS THE BEST"
You see what I'm saying? That's why I'm stepping in here.
From here on out, this thread will no longer be a "best builds" thread. It will be a "I personally use this build and here is why" thread.
This should prevent most of the flaming but because I know that not everybody is willing to exercise self-control when hiding behind a monitor, I'm also warning everybody right now that if they decide to flame anybody in this thread, for any reason, I will be deleting your posts and issuing infractions.
Have fun!!
dharvey4651
(Leo Forum MOD)
I would love to see a poll of "What ROM are you using on your dinc" or What is your favorite ROM".
Can we get a poll on what Rom is the most popular?
overground's post before closing that thread:
The reason we close what's referred to as "Best ROM Threads" is because the vast majority of the type end up a nasty flame fest. The reasons should be obvious. It's really a matter of opinion, and then you get the fanboys of certain devs chiming in, and well, you get it. My advice is try a few and make that choice yourself. It's easy to find the most popular ATM, because they stay on page 1 of the dev sub. That doesn't necessarily make it the best, however. Give some a shot and see what's best for you. To credit this thread, 8 pages and still civil. Seems DINC is growing up.
Thread closed
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byrong said:
Can we get a poll on what Rom is the most popular?
overground's post before closing that thread:
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Click to collapse
I would like to see the poll numbers, period. I'm not interested in the reasons or the debates. I think it would be a mistake not to allow the vote because you want to avoid the discussions you anticipate. What does it matter anyway if people get into a heated discussion?...1- you don't have to read it. 2- that's why we have moderators. A forum should not avoid threads on controversial issues.
marcmarshall said:
I would like to see the poll numbers, period. I'm not interested in the reasons or the debates.
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That's even more worthless than the arguments. If you just have people clicking a button, how do you know what else they've tried? What use is it to know that Redemptive Revolution is John Smith's favorite ROM if John Smith has never used any other ROM?
That's one of the many reasons that raw numbers from such polls is generally worthless. You don't know whether any given vote is being cast by someone with solid experience, or some guy who is brand new to Android and thinks that the new ROM he just flashed is pretty. Clearly, these two votes should carry different weight, but in a poll they do not.
Besides, I do not believe that the forum software allows for a poll without an open discussion thread. If you would like to set up your own poll using another site's software, nothing is stopping you.
marcmarshall said:
I think it would be a mistake not to allow the vote because you want to avoid the discussions you anticipate. What does it matter anyway if people get into a heated discussion?...1- you don't have to read it. 2- that's why we have moderators.
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I don't care one way or the other. I'm just a member. You're right: I can ignore such a thread.
But the quote I posted was from a moderator here, so your point that "that's why we have moderators" is short-sighted and not your call to make. Just because you think that mods should spend their time looking after an unnecessarily heated discussion does not mean that they want to spend their time that way.
I don't really care about this subject one way or the other: I just thought it would be helpful to provide you with a link to one of the countless "best ROM" threads and a quote directly from a Mod on why such threads are discouraged.
byrong said:
That's even more worthless than the arguments. If you just have people clicking a button, how do you know what else they've tried? What use is it to know that Redemptive Revolution is John Smith's favorite ROM if John Smith has never used any other ROM?
That's one of the many reasons that raw numbers from such polls is generally worthless. You don't know whether any given vote is being cast by someone with solid experience, or some guy who is brand new to Android and thinks that the new ROM he just flashed is pretty. Clearly, these two votes should carry different weight, but in a poll they do not.
Besides, I do not believe that the forum software allows for a poll without an open discussion thread. If you would like to set up your own poll using another site's software, nothing is stopping you.
I don't care one way or the other. I'm just a member. You're right: I can ignore such a thread.
But the quote I posted was from a moderator here, so your point that "that's why we have moderators" is short-sighted and not your call to make. Just because you think that mods should spend their time looking after an unnecessarily heated discussion does not mean that they want to spend their time that way.
I don't really care about this subject one way or the other: I just thought it would be helpful to provide you with a link to one of the countless "best ROM" threads and a quote directly from a Mod on why such threads are discouraged.
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You make good points byrong. I can understand that moderators don't want to spend a lot of time in such a debate, especially if it gets heated.
I also see how some opinions are more experienced and valuable than others. I also know that what makes a ROM attractive to one person another person might not care at all about, and that there there are a tremendous amount of variables to be considered in a single vote. All that said, In the aggregate when there is a large amount (thousands?) of votes, I think the result might be interesting to see. Maybe your right though and it would just be more noise than information.
Certainly if the forum software does not allow for poll vote pages this discussion is moot and maybe a bigger waste of time than the proposed thread might be!
Why didnt you just make this thread a poll? Its weird that you started a thread wanting to see a poll but you could of just made this thread a poll. You still could make this a poll by clicking on Thread Tools. Weird
incubus26jc said:
Why didnt you just make this thread a poll? Its weird that you started a thread wanting to see a poll but you could of just made this thread a poll. You still could make this a poll by clicking on Thread Tools. Weird
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Ha- I remember wondering why I never saw polls on XDA and I thought I had noticed in the past there was no option to start a poll in the thread tools. I see now I could have, duh
At this point I'm almost swayed against it but I am going to try the thread tool and start the poll right after this post.
BTW- thanks for WarmZ, one of the few I've tried and a great ROM imho!
Edit- Never started a poll before. Of course I would I have to list all the ROMS as choices. Going to take a little ahhh...effort, and will have to wait a bit. I have to start on my taxes!
Well taxes done but I now realize byrong is right and how pointless this would be. Hopefully this thread will be yanked.
Hi folks,
I've spent a few days looking over the forum and have to say. good work
There don’t seem to be many issues, everyone seems to be getting on in the spirit of XDA.
I'm a firm fan of ‘if it isn’t broken, don’t fix it’ so I'm not going to be flying in making huge changes or swapping things around. this is your forum I'm just here to help keep things nice. if anyone has any ideas of how to improve things in this area - (not XDA as a whole) please drop me a PM, and we’ll put it to a vote. if it’s a good idea I'll change it if i can or I'll push for the changes with the senior team.
While this may be a legacy forum it’s clear there is still a lot of interest and a lot of life in this device still keep up the work and we’ll keep the phone alive I want to start on the right foot so a FEW IMPORTANT REMINDERS
please take the time to read - and for regular users - re-read the forum rules. it’s a good thing to remind yourselves of how we work http://forum.xda-developers.com/announcement.php?f=341
All the rules are important but to focus on a few.
we are here to help and learn. people do make mistakes. I don’t like users being flamed for asking a question. I'd rather we educated and pointed people in the right way to help them for the future. it’s OK to say use search - it’s not OK to abuse people
I also don’t like people putting a lot of work into something and getting flamed either - a lot of the work posted is a work in progress - people share this out of the goodness of their heart and also so they can get positive comments on how to improve. Again it’s not OK to abuse people cos they shared a work in progress.
sharing work - many developers are happy to share their work with others and in some cases one persons work is used as a base by others. - If you want to change someones work and then release it as your own - ASK FOR PERMISSION FIRST AND THEN LINK TO THE ORIGINAL DEV IN YOU RELEASE!!!
don’t post or link to warez - they will be removed.
Please report any issues or concerns to me as soon as you can using the report button or by PM- I'll deal with them.
Thanks
Chris
Apparently, I had stickys of the forum rules placed in over here. Nice to see u work, all the very best. Well I am the outgoing mod over here!
Sent From My HTC Sensation Z710e Using XDA Premium!
How do we get rid of that weird icon after rooting? The one that looks like a tornado/wind/hurricane... LOL
Is it hard to search?
I've been trying to figure that out too!
What icon is that? Lol are you talking about the NFC "N" icon?
Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk
He's talking about this:
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}
It's the RCS icon.
It's been mentioned over 100 times. Now that he knows what to look for, I'll leave it to him to search.
Who knows, perhaps someone has a link for it in his signature?
I love how the search police always come out in force. For goodness sakes, just give the guy a link or move on. For me the only thing more irksome than someone not searching for himself is someone else telling him to search harder, better, more. I've been lurking here for years, contributing when I can. In those years, it seems XDA forums have become a way less friendly place. Just my 2 cents.
dave812 said:
I love how the search police always come out in force. For goodness sakes, just give the guy a link or move on. For me the only thing more irksome than someone not searching for himself is someone else telling him to search harder, better, more. I've been lurking here for years, contributing when I can. In those years, it seems XDA forums have become a way less friendly place. Just my 2 cents.
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Well it gets annoying especially when that is asked in the same topic of how to root.
It's threads like this one that annoys me:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/tmobile-s7-edge/help/best-twrp-root-t3491778
Yet I believe that I handled it pretty well.
Regarding "search policing", it becomes counterproductive to feed the members that don't want to search or read for themselves because those same members will continue to want to be fed information instead of finding it for themselves. They'll post a thread and wait days for the answer instead of spending 10 minutes to find it themselves. They half-ass it and next thing you know they get pissed off because they didn't know that flashing something would wipe their internalsd or they get stuck in download mode or they get stuck with a strange icon (like in this thread) that they desperately want to be rid of. A 10 minute search and 5 minute of reading would have saved time of almost a dozen members replying to this very thread. The OP would have his/her answer and additional knowledge/experience (funny how those go hand in hand) that he/she could not acquire by being given the instructions.
<sarcasm>
In fact, next time perhaps I'll just quote an entire OP for the next person to inquire. It'll be much faster for them than giving them a link to click on. That might make it easier, then they will be missing out on the comments, replies, feedback, etc that the community has already given. That will also make it better for the OP to get his/her answers. Plus it clutters up the forum which is also a neat thing to do.
</sarcasm>
Bottom line, XDA is a forum of convenience for it's members! They've built a search feature where it helps (not perfect but it IS helpful), threads are stickied, added polls, images, additional links, attachments, you can subscribe to threads, you can vote on their usefulness, etc.
Yet we continue to get posts like:
xxx said:
Hello guys,
my tmo S7 Edge today is at home.
Which is today the best and newer way to Root and Twrp this bad boy ?
Link if you have
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So naturally it's going to get people peeved. People like me that has spent thousands of hours here in the forum helping people, people like the forum administrators and moderators that sacrifice their personal lives by keeping this forum "newb friendly" and operational, people like developers that risk damaging their own devices for the sake of XDA's members then spend an hour making a thread with as simple as possible instructions (often with pictures for those that need them) just for a lazy member to post a new thread asking for all of it to be given to them.
So naturally, it pisses some people off.
See my point?
I'm not defending or condoning being rude towards the members but I honestly do feel that pushing them to do some work for themselves should be expected because otherwise they become a burden and can end up causing more harm than good towards the community (moral wise) and even to themselves due to the lack of knowledge (and experience) which can and often does result in damaged/bricked devices. If I'm not mistaken XDA is a forum where we try to prevent that, not encourage it. So my warped way of thinking is that if we "give" them the method to do something instead of "teaching" them it'll be like a students going to school without tools to learn. 100% lecture. No books, guides, visual aids, etc. Crap... in that case, we might as well have our teachers take the students tests for them too! After all we need them to accomplish their goals, right?
But if I'm wrong then I'm wrong. I'll just set up a PO box and have members send me their phones and I'll do everything for them (for a fee of course) so it'll make it easier for them. But that would probably catch on unfortunately.
Well, to be honest. The best thing to do when someone asks a question like this is to say what the icon is called, that way they can actually search. Instead of trying to be over complicated with things. Cheers
Sent from my SM-G935U using Tapatalk
lunerceli said:
Well, to be honest. The best thing to do when someone asks a question like this is to say what the icon is called, that way they can actually search. Instead of trying to be over complicated with things. Cheers
Sent from my SM-G935U using Tapatalk
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Just like I did in post #5?
I'm shocked..SHOCKED! that in the 8 years I've been on XDA that people haven't started using the search function! *sarcasm*
Just give them the answer and kill their thread. It's not like we're charged by the stupid thread or the stupid 50 posts following scolding the person or the mod that comes in annoyed.
Binary100100 said:
Just like I did in post #5?
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Exactly. I know not everyone has the patience to try to help others properly here on xda. Been here way too long to not understand that. Lol.
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The Root said:
I'm shocked..SHOCKED! that in the 8 years I've been on XDA that people haven't started using the search function! *sarcasm*
Just give them the answer and kill their thread. It's not like we're charged by the stupid thread or the stupid 50 posts following scolding the person or the mod that comes in annoyed.
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Rule 1 is to search before posting. Why is that do you think?
Failing to do so creates clutter and chaos the forum. That makes it HARDER to search because for those that DO use it end up getting a dozen threads created by members not wanting to search or read instead of getting what they were looking for.
Binary100100 said:
Rule 1 is to search before posting. Why is that do you think?
Failing to do so creates clutter and chaos the forum. That makes it HARDER to search because for those that DO use it end up getting a dozen threads created by members not wanting to search or read instead of getting what they were looking for.
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And what do the five pages of everyone making sure they get in to scold the person do for clutter?
The Root said:
And what do the five pages of everyone making sure they get in to scold the person do for clutter?
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How would that happen if they were to search to begin with? They wouldn't post the unnecessary threads thus there would be less clutter and a happier community. Right?
Ah. The perfect world. But it'll never happen. Neither will stopping those that get annoyed at those that keep it from being so.
Binary100100 said:
How would that happen if they were to search to begin with? They wouldn't post the unnecessary threads thus there would be less clutter and a happier community. Right?
Ah. The perfect world. But it'll never happen. Neither will stopping those that get annoyed at those that keep it from being so.
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Lesson learned is let's all use search and let's all not make a big deal about helping noobs and annoying people. You're right. In a perfect world...
The Root said:
Lesson learned is let's all use search and let's all not make a big deal about helping noobs and annoying people. You're right. In a perfect world...
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Exactly. But then there will be posts like this:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=69420786&postcount=1288
This person found the thread then posted in it asking if it would be possible to root.
Those kind of posts puzzle me because we can't give them the link to the thread (because they are already there.) You really don't even know if they have the phone to begin with, do they understand English? Perhaps the guide is too complicated for them? Are they asking for someone to do it for them? You just don't know until you probe further. But how to do that without sounding rude? How to keep everyone else from being rude to that person so desperately pleading for guidance (that was already posted in the very first post) on something as simple as rooting?
My perspective is this: I have no technical degree. None. I have experience. Experience from reading, searching and doing. Experience from making mistakes, learning from them and helping others if/when I can. I'm not a genius... but I'm not mentally incapable either. There are members that dive right in and exploit root and develop and ask for nothing in return accept perhaps the occasional expression of appreciation for the hundreds and in some cases thousands of hours dedicated for all of the members that only take them for granted. Then there are members that just want everything read to them, done for them, given to them. The forum is designed for them, not me, not the developers that are technologically proficient. The forum is designed to be newb friendly. We can post pictures, attachments, Youtube videos, links, etc. It has a search feature and it even has a nice feature that brings up possible threads to read when they start to post a new one to prevent duplicate threads from occurring (which is supposed to keep other members from feeling the need to flame the newbs.) Yet... these members STILL pop up. We still get duplicate threads, repeated questions, angry and impatient members ready to "newb-pounce." Then they become the "bad buy" and the newb becomes the innocent victim.
How the hell has it gotten to this? Simple. Laziness. People don't want to research. They want the quick and easy path. They want their questions answered A.S.A.P. without anyone getting pissy at them so they can go on with their lives with the profit that they feel entitled to while the rest of us pound on our desks, beat our keyboards, pull our hair out and (my personal favorite) "the bird" to the monitor with a click on the close button to keep myself from saying something "mean." But it's people like me (that won't spoonfeed the lazy) that are the "forum bullies."
Are we (the entire community as a whole) really expected to just respond politely with the answer to everyone's question without any sarcasm or rudeness? For all of those lazy people that just want to be spoonfed that will inevitably brick or cause damage to something because they skipped a step because they were too lazy or impatient? Those same people will only post another "HELP ME!" thread because they didn't take the time to do something right the first time.
I guess my messed up way of thinking is that tough love is spurring those members to do what they should be doing in the first place. Reading!
I suppose that's just my old fashioned mindset though.
Binary100100 said:
Exactly. But then there will be posts like this:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=69420786&postcount=1288
This person found the thread then posted in it asking if it would be possible to root.
Those kind of posts puzzle me because we can't give them the link to the thread (because they are already there.) You really don't even know if they have the phone to begin with, do they understand English? Perhaps the guide is too complicated for them? Are they asking for someone to do it for them? You just don't know until you probe further. But how to do that without sounding rude? How to keep everyone else from being rude to that person so desperately pleading for guidance (that was already posted in the very first post) on something as simple as rooting?
My perspective is this: I have no technical degree. None. I have experience. Experience from reading, searching and doing. Experience from making mistakes, learning from them and helping others if/when I can. I'm not a genius... but I'm not mentally incapable either. There are members that dive right in and exploit root and develop and ask for nothing in return accept perhaps the occasional expression of appreciation for the hundreds and in some cases thousands of hours dedicated for all of the members that only take them for granted. Then there are members that just want everything read to them, done for them, given to them. The forum is designed for them, not me, not the developers that are technologically proficient. The forum is designed to be newb friendly. We can post pictures, attachments, Youtube videos, links, etc. It has a search feature and it even has a nice feature that brings up possible threads to read when they start to post a new one to prevent duplicate threads from occurring (which is supposed to keep other members from feeling the need to flame the newbs.) Yet... these members STILL pop up. We still get duplicate threads, repeated questions, angry and impatient members ready to "newb-pounce." Then they become the "bad buy" and the newb becomes the innocent victim.
How the hell has it gotten to this? Simple. Laziness. People don't want to research. They want the quick and easy path. They want their questions answered A.S.A.P. without anyone getting pissy at them so they can go on with their lives with the profit that they feel entitled to while the rest of us pound on our desks, beat our keyboards, pull our hair out and (my personal favorite) "the bird" to the monitor with a click on the close button to keep myself from saying something "mean." But it's people like me (that won't spoonfeed the lazy) that are the "forum bullies."
Are we (the entire community as a whole) really expected to just respond politely with the answer to everyone's question without any sarcasm or rudeness? For all of those lazy people that just want to be spoonfed that will inevitably brick or cause damage to something because they skipped a step because they were too lazy or impatient? Those same people will only post another "HELP ME!" thread because they didn't take the time to do something right the first time.
I guess my messed up way of thinking is that tough love is spurring those members to do what they should be doing in the first place. Reading!
I suppose that's just my old fashioned mindset though.
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Ideally I think the best answer might be to use the report button and explain in the comments that the mod might need to directly contact the poster and help with etiquette and answers. Then they can set consequences if the person is reported again for the same issue.
The Root said:
Ideally I think the best answer might be to use the report button and explain in the comments that the mod might need to directly contact the poster and help with etiquette and answers. Then they can set consequences if the person is reported again for the same issue.
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LOL!
As a former moderator I can tell you that this would not work. Sorry.
They receive a notification banner on the top of the screen that you can respond to.
They do not like those kind of reports because that requires giving direct attention to the person that posted the thread.
That person in turn requests assistance from the moderator therefor making the moderator the feeder. So not only does the moderator have to spoonfeed but he also has to get to the other 20+ reported posts that are waiting as well. That's why they kinda turn a blind eye towards the kind of behavior regarding duplicate threads and the members that are so against them. The most they might do is reply in the thread with something like, "Search and read" then close the thread. If the same member posts another thread again, he'll just issue an infraction. Infractions doesn't really mean anything having ten (expired) points myself thanks to another former forum moderator. I've dealt with members that were in the hundreds! A member doesn't take it seriously after a while. Even when they (trolls included) get banned they simply open another account.
There's no easy way to deal with the issue unfortunately. I can assure you that XDA admins and moderators have tried for YEARS with various methods to reduce the problem but will even admit that it will never go away. The most that we can do is shrug, ignore that member (the actual ignore feature built into the forum which I have several people on currently) and move on. Hopefully, they get the message but they will never go without having someone being rude to them.
Seriously, people need to grow up! Stop whining about their hurt feelings. Sorry, but if you can own a phone and use a computer then I would suspect that you have had enough interaction with the real world to know that not everybody wears My Little Pony t-shirts and sings Barney songs! People are selfish, lazy, rude, inconsiderate, ignorant and arrogant but they are also helpful, selfless, smart, and patient. In a world of anonymity where anyone can have any kind of persona they wish you cannot possibly expect them all to be polite. Even if there are rules to require them to do so. It's just not going to happen.
I just give a slow clap. TBH it is easier for someone to post asking about something they know nothing about, like this thread, asking what it is. Then they can search. As a former developer, this makes things easier for the person posting. Not everyone know what everything is and if they don't know what something is then they cannot search for something they don't know about. Even inputting something things into Google won't provide the answer you are looking for. Lol. Another slow clap. Lol
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