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Why does Sprint continually lose money every quarter?

Just read over on Engadget how Sprint lost $760 million last quarter. Why do you think they continually do so bad? Is it because of poor sales or poor business/financial decisions (debt left over from merger or otherwise)? Their coverage is awesome, their 3G speeds are often better than Verizon's, they have 4G on tap, customer service has never given me any trouble, I can upgrade my phone annually, and the plans offer way more features and are still cheaper than the competition. The list is endless, there's really no other carrier I'd rather be on. Do others not feel the same way? Is their marketing failing?

I feel the same way. Their advertisements always seem good. I feel like they don't advertise as heavily as any of the other carriers here.

Maybe from all the expanding and changes they've done? Don't know though. I haven't had any problems at all. Their customer service always corrects problems, even crediting a lot of charges back.. and coverage is good. A lot happier then I was with at&t
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I'm sure the cost of upgrading to 4G has a lot to do with it. Plus I am ripping them off with my unlimited everything for $65 a month!!

Profit for a business is bad...profit=have to pay taxes!

tgruendler said:
Profit for a business is bad...profit=have to pay taxes!
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(Yoda voice)
Sound your logic is not..

Sprint screwed themselves and are still recovering from that terrible decision to merge with nextel.

It's because Sprint spends billions of dollars on Nascar instead of it's network.

UrbanMuppet said:
It's because Sprint spends billions of dollars on Nascar instead of it's network.
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ROFL!!!!!!!

UrbanMuppet said:
It's because Sprint spends billions of dollars on Nascar instead of it's network.
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Couldn't have said it better myself.

It wasnt until recently that they had good phones. I remember a few years back, most of their phones were garbage. Everyone jumpped ship and moved to ATT due to the fact that you could pull the sim card, and switch phones as you pleased. All the phones from Asia were flocking over to the US and everyone had some new Nokia, Ericson, or some other great phone.
Sprint had junk. Some of us probably rode that out, and FINALLY they are getting some good phones...I've been on Sprint for almost 12 years now. I did move to VZW for 2 years, but ended up coming back to Sprint.

makes you wonder how they are even sustainable loosing that type of money every quarter.

The Nextel merger is STILL hurting them badly. Plus, they offer the cheapest plans but for the longest time they did not have the devices people wanted. Now they have the devices but people are stuck in contracts with other carriers. Another thing is advertisement and word of mouth. Sprint has never had the most eye-catching commercials. Us former Palm Pre users know the effect bad or no advertisement can hurt you. And I agree, the Nascar thing is wasted money when you have to spend more money rolling out 4G nationwide.

nukedukem said:
I'm sure the cost of upgrading to 4G has a lot to do with it. Plus I am ripping them off with my unlimited everything for $65 a month!!
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They're ripping you off charging you $65 a month for what cost them >$10 a month actually (after negating handset subsidies of course).

davebu said:
They're ripping you off charging you $65 a month for what cost them >$10 a month actually (after negating handset subsidies of course).
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Yeah, it's obvious Sprint is making a killing off of their subscribers since they are rolling in profits *eyeroll*

DanBergundy said:
ROFL!!!!!!!
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Has ANYONE even clicked on the Nascar icon on their phone?
I suspect no one.
Nascar fans are not technology nerds like us.

Customer service is complete garbage where I'm at.
Compared to other company's there plans are pretty cheap 10 for data with smartphone (or is it 4g) and mostly everyone else is 25-30.
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My opinion is that when they took nextel under their wing, nextel was bleeding money like a stuck pig. I think nextel is still bleeding, and now they are siphoning sprint dry.
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You gotta be careful when trying to rescue a drowning person. They might pull you under while trying to save themselves.
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1. Inexpensive plans
2. Good customer service
3. Yearly phone upgrades
Its sad but maybe being a "better" company can actually hurt your bottom line. Don't forget that Verizon lost money last quarter too.

New Explainthefee.com Blog Post!

http://explainthefee.com/2010/10/22/do-you-really-need-premium-data/
Sums up everything so far. I fully believe that the fee really is for nothing that Sprint can actually back - it's like he says, just "smoke and mirrors".
Flame away. ¡

Another one of these? If you dont like it switch companies or get another phone. I can't wait until all these other companies put out and start charging for 4G so everyone can stop complaining.
Sent from my Evo beeesshh

DirtyShroomz said:
Another one of these? If you dont like it switch companies or get another phone.
Sent from my Evo beeesshh
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Okay, well since you're pretty close to being the number one guy on these forums defending this fee, explain it yourself. You work for Sprint, if I recall correctly.

yea like we need another one of these post lol last one was crazy

I don't defend the fee nor agree with it but I also speak with my money and don't pay or buy things I don't agree with. There are plenty other options out there, G2 is one of them.
Sent from my Evo beeesshh

Go to T-Mobile.

It's pretty obvious what the fee is for. It's for 4G. If you don't have 4G in your area then it's 1) to have access to it at all because you still can get 4G service if you go to a 4G covered area, and 2) it's to cover the ongoing expansion so that'll eventually reach your area. They don't say this because people expect instant gratification; don't like it? Well, then don't get a EVO or Epic.

Its for uncapped evdo and wimax. Wireless service is a commodity these days so when someone charges more than you want to pay you can shop for a better bargain. Problem is that the others all charge more and cap. Regardless of how poorly they advertise it there really isn't much better a deal out there than sprint if you have coverage. If you don't have coverage then you shouldn't even consider them. Assuming you do then its just capitalism. Companies charge what they need to make a profit as long as people will pay it. If I got a better deal elsewhere I would change carriers. Since I don't I will keep paying for sprint. Whemy do so many people not understand this?

I don't know why Sprint doesn't just tell the truth.. It's to help offset the enormous royalty they surely paid to be the only carrier with the BADDEST phone in the US..
$10/mo is well worth it, imo

I don't defend the fee- I just don't care. It's ten bucks. It's not worth arguing with the theorists like it's not worth arguing with non-tippers. You wont change 'em.
I used to tend bar years ago, and was always amused by people who would complain about the price of a gallon of milk while drinking a three dollar beer.

Even with the fee and insurance, its cheaper than cheapest Verizon plan. No way in hell would I be complaining. Phone is already badass without 4G imo.
Sent from my Evo

Sigh . . . I'm loathe to keep pumping life into a thread like this, but I have to make a couple of points.
1) It's not a 4G fee. It's an extra fee imposed upon users of high-end smartphones that will probably be using a lot more bandwidth than other users. It's basically another tax that can be used to increase infrastructure and expand service, so someday we'll ALL have 4G (or whatever Sprint decides to use in the end). Call it unfair, call it pointless, call it a good thing, whatever . . . just don't call it a 4G fee. You might as well say it's a 4.3" screen fee.
2) When you say something like "$10 is nothing to complain about" you sound like a total douche. To some people, $10 is something. Some people are responsible and keep to a budget. Some people don't have their daddy paying their cell phone bill. Heck, some people are quite well-off but didn't get that way by throwing money around with no thought. I personally switched from T-Mobile to a Sprint family plan and I'm paying almost 40% less for my Evo and my wife's Hero than I was for our two calling-only plans and texting packages at T-Mo. For me, $10 is something, but I'm better off than I was before, so it's worth it. That's not to say I'm making a decision to spend that $10 extra so I can have my Evo, but I understand that it was a choice I made. Maybe $10 is nothing to you, but that's either because you've got plenty of money, have somebody else paying the bill, are on an allowance from your parents (or a trust fund), or you just don't understand how to manage your money - in which case you probably won't have that problem for long.
3) If you have an Evo, pay the fee. If you don't want to pay the fee, don't get an Evo or any other new superphone from Sprint, because they'll all have the fee from here on out. If you want to write something, write to Sprint and petition them to waive the fee in exchange for limited bandwidth or something.
Ah . . . mountain pine.

DirtyShroomz said:
Another one of these? If you dont like it switch companies or get another phone. I can't wait until all these other companies put out and start charging for 4G so everyone can stop complaining.
Sent from my Evo beeesshh
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So instead of Sprint users paying the extra fee, you want everyone else to do also?. "Don't punch me in the stomach, but if everyone else gets punched also, then it's cool." Non thinking selfish tard.

alero said:
I used to tend bar years ago, and was always amused by people who would complain about the price of a gallon of milk while drinking a three dollar beer.
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This is the most quotable phrase I have heard this year. I hope you don't mind if I borrow it.
There is nothing wrong with not wanting to be ripped off, but if your using a 400 dollar phone + 100 dollar service plan and can't afford it, then maybe you should start there instead of *****ing about the price. Its about bang for your buck, and while Sprint isn't exactly cheap, vs. The "Other 3" you certainly get better bang for your buck. I have yet to have anyone show me internet speeds on their phone that are even close to mine. Not to mention they have just upgraded the $7 dollar insurance plan.

SilverZero said:
Sigh . . . I'm loathe to keep pumping life into a thread like this, but I have to make a couple of points.
2) When you say something like "$10 is nothing to complain about" you sound ike a total douche. To some people, $10 is something. Some people are responsible and keep to a budget.
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If $10 is something to you then you shouldn't be buying a high end phone. It like buying a desiel truck and then complaining because desiel is $0.50/gal higher than gas. You should have known that before you bought it.

SilverZero said:
1) It's not a 4G fee. It's an extra fee imposed upon users of high-end smartphones that will probably be using a lot more bandwidth than other users. It's basically another tax that can be used to increase infrastructure and expand service, so someday we'll ALL have 4G (or whatever Sprint decides to use in the end).
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Oh, so it is a 4G fee because that's exactly what you explained. You have access to 4G, maybe not in your area but in others. And you're also paying for the 51% buyout of Clear and it's pending 4G infrastructure roll out so that 4G will eventually get to your area. How is that not a 4G fee?
..and to your second point, you're not being forced to pay for anything. Just don't get a 4G phone. Don't like the fact that all high end phones are 4G? Then go to another carrier. You see how that works? You're not even forced to use Sprint.

The only point I'll add to this thread is that the fee is NOT for uncapped data (as someone mentioned earlier), the uncapped data is built into the unlimited data plans. The fee just gives you access to the 4g network, not how much data you get on that network.
Sent from my blah blah blah blah

Its a big bull**** fee for sure - these white knight Sprint zealots are mentally incapable of processing some things.
First argument:
Don't like the $10 don't get an Evo.
- Sure this may sound easy and expected but it boils down to more than this. The Evo and the Epic are pretty much the only decent smart phones that Sprint has. We can buy an outdated Pre or Hero but will be limited in our web access and experience. Not only are these phones hardware restricted which will prevent future Android updates, but are also limited in their current capabilities. Correct me if I'm wrong, is the Hero still rocking 2.1? All things considered when Android is open-source, someone is making bank off just supplying PHONES.
Second argument:
Don't like the $10 go with "x" carrier.
- This again is stupid. Sprint is the only carrier that gives service in my area. Need I say more? I had T-mobile prior and was getting 1 bar and constantly dropped calls.
Third argument:
Its for 4G.
- Great. Even removing the fact that MOST of us with Evos don't have 4G and probably won't get 4G - the service itself has proved not to be 4G. You might get lucky but after reviewing Engadgets speed averages Sprints 4G is comparable to ATTs fastest 3G but with a 1mbit upload cap. Nice.
All in all - if the $10 was actually justified aka I could see results from it I would have no problem. So far I have seen a medicre phone with good service and lousy 4G performance. I don't think its justified but seeing as how its Sprint or nothing I don't really have a choice.
Lastly, everyone will say oh well its STILL cheaper. Big deal. Just because America is more ethical than Saudi Arabia does it mean that we do everything ethical? No. I can smell better than a homeless person it does not mean that I don't still smell like ****. The amount of logical fallacies that are present in the arguments of the Sprint white knights is absolutely breath taking. On one hand we have average people asking wtf and getting flamed on the other hand we have people like DirtyShroomz who works for Sprint and pays $0 a month for this crap *****ing about people who actually HAVE to pay for this phone.
Get over it - I'm right you're wrong. Its not a matter of maturity its a matter of education.

werxen said:
Its a big bull**** fee for sure - these white knight Sprint zealots are mentally incapable of processing some things.
First argument:
Don't like the $10 don't get an Evo.
- Sure this may sound easy and expected but it boils down to more than this. The Evo and the Epic are pretty much the only decent smart phones that Sprint has. We can buy an outdated Pre or Hero but will be limited in our web access and experience. Not only are these phones hardware restricted which will prevent future Android updates, but are also limited in their current capabilities. Correct me if I'm wrong, is the Hero still rocking 2.1? All things considered when Android is open-source, someone is making bank off just supplying PHONES.
Second argument:
Don't like the $10 go with "x" carrier.
- This again is stupid. Sprint is the only carrier that gives service in my area. Need I say more? I had T-mobile prior and was getting 1 bar and constantly dropped calls.
Third argument:
Its for 4G.
- Great. Even removing the fact that MOST of us with Evos don't have 4G and probably won't get 4G - the service itself has proved not to be 4G. You might get lucky but after reviewing Engadgets speed averages Sprints 4G is comparable to ATTs fastest 3G but with a 1mbit upload cap. Nice.
All in all - if the $10 was actually justified aka I could see results from it I would have no problem. So far I have seen a medicre phone with good service and lousy 4G performance. I don't think its justified but seeing as how its Sprint or nothing I don't really have a choice.
Lastly, everyone will say oh well its STILL cheaper. Big deal. Just because America is more ethical than Saudi Arabia does it mean that we do everything ethical? No. I can smell better than a homeless person it does not mean that I don't still smell like ****. The amount of logical fallacies that are present in the arguments of the Sprint white knights is absolutely breath taking. On one hand we have average people asking wtf and getting flamed on the other hand we have people like DirtyShroomz who works for Sprint and pays $0 a month for this crap *****ing about people who actually HAVE to pay for this phone.
Get over it - I'm right you're wrong. Its not a matter of maturity its a matter of education.
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You're points are completely.... I can't even find a word for it.
It's as simple as many have said "you are not forced to Sprint, get another phone or switch carriers". Don't have any other carriers in your area, well then damn, you really are in a ****ty position at this point - deal with it, I'm sure there is a reason you live there (and it's not because of a phone). It's almost like that car commercial said "if your winters are tougher than this, you don't need a new car, you need a new place to live."
Asking questions to be educated is completely acceptable but constantly complaining about something you have complete control over (meaning you have CHOOSE something else) is not - it's just a stupid business decision on your part purchasing something you don't agree with. What you're doing is high-fiving your best friend for sleeping with your wife.

werxen said:
Its a big bull**** fee for sure - these white knight Sprint zealots are mentally incapable of processing some things.
First argument:
Don't like the $10 don't get an Evo.
- Sure this may sound easy and expected but it boils down to more than this. The Evo and the Epic are pretty much the only decent smart phones that Sprint has. We can buy an outdated Pre or Hero but will be limited in our web access and experience. Not only are these phones hardware restricted which will prevent future Android updates, but are also limited in their current capabilities. Correct me if I'm wrong, is the Hero still rocking 2.1? All things considered when Android is open-source, someone is making bank off just supplying PHONES.
Second argument:
Don't like the $10 go with "x" carrier.
- This again is stupid. Sprint is the only carrier that gives service in my area. Need I say more? I had T-mobile prior and was getting 1 bar and constantly dropped calls.
Third argument:
Its for 4G.
- Great. Even removing the fact that MOST of us with Evos don't have 4G and probably won't get 4G - the service itself has proved not to be 4G. You might get lucky but after reviewing Engadgets speed averages Sprints 4G is comparable to ATTs fastest 3G but with a 1mbit upload cap. Nice.
All in all - if the $10 was actually justified aka I could see results from it I would have no problem. So far I have seen a medicre phone with good service and lousy 4G performance. I don't think its justified but seeing as how its Sprint or nothing I don't really have a choice.
Lastly, everyone will say oh well its STILL cheaper. Big deal. Just because America is more ethical than Saudi Arabia does it mean that we do everything ethical? No. I can smell better than a homeless person it does not mean that I don't still smell like ****. The amount of logical fallacies that are present in the arguments of the Sprint white knights is absolutely breath taking. On one hand we have average people asking wtf and getting flamed on the other hand we have people like DirtyShroomz who works for Sprint and pays $0 a month for this crap *****ing about people who actually HAVE to pay for this phone.
Get over it - I'm right you're wrong. Its not a matter of maturity its a matter of education.
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Just because you don't see it, means its not justified? I don't know but, your reaching. Its Sprint and every other's carrier's fault that you chose to live in a place where their cell signals can't penetrate? Every marketing strategy is based off of reaching the most people with the least amount of work. They are not going to cater to every remote hick living in the mountains of Alaska, and to even expect that is ridiculous.
The $10 fee is Sprint's cost of doing business (even if its not, that is how they calculate it). Every company strong arms us helpless consumers, and as it has already been pointed out, speak with your money, its what I do. You could go to Walmart and get a $50 phone plan and save back your Cancellation fee in 4 months, and have Cell/test/data. But you would complain about that too.
I do not think that $10 is chump change, but I want the best bang for my buck and a 500kbps download speed for $35-50 is not what I call bang for my buck.... but then I also live in a 4G area. If you don't live in a 4G area or one that would be getting it soon, then getting a EVO or a EPIC was STUPID. You would have been better off with a DROIDX, BUT GUESS WHAT?!?!? Verizon is more expensive. You could have gotten a G2, AGAIN, MORE EXPENSIVE. Get over it, Sprint is not ripping anyone off, anymore than another carrier. But unfortunately if you bought a EVO or EPIC in hopes of 4G (I hope you read up on this phone), then sorry to disappoint. The smartest thing to do would be cut your losses, sell your phone pay off the ETF and move to a different carrier.
FWIW, My mother, brother, sister in law, aunt, and grandmother are with Verizon. They all have recently bought the Droid (Not the X) and they love it. So if you want to be cutting edge and play with the newest toys. THEN PAY FOR IT AND QUIT CRYING!

Potential Sprint and T-Mobile Merger?

I just read about this on the Washington Post. What are yall thoughts regarding a merger between T-mobile and Sprint?
Washington Post Article

Personally, I think it sucks. Not sure how it could benefit the consumer, or the manufacturers... I don't like the idea of there only being 3 big players.... I dont like the idea of GSM/CDMA joining... not even sure how that would work.
Nothing seems beneficial....

This Will Not Be Good,
for 1, which system are they really going to end up using ? Sprint is CDMA my Bet this will be bad for the consumer
Mergers like these inevitably only benefit the Company not the consumer. Ever notice that when one company raises prices the other do so as well? The only "hold mechanism" that prevents this is rigorous competition. When there is only a duo or tri-opoloy then corporate price fixing becomes a sure thing. Remember when (maybe most are not old enough) cable TV was 10 major players, Now ? 3, and what happened as a result of all the mergers and acquisitions ? higher prices and less selection.
On another note : Do you remember SamsungJohn ? and his Great announcement, I wonder if this is it. If it is .........we're getting HOSED..............

I think its very good. as long as they provide the same plan after merger
anyways, Sprint is starting 4g rollout, which is nice for future.
Rooted Samsung Vibrant with Froyo KA6
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Kernel: Stock+Voodoo

I heard about that a while ago too. Then there would be "the big three ". The question that comes to mind is, how does that benefit us? lower bills? Better phones? Better network?
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Be assured this isn't about what's best for the customers. It's about what's best for the companies staying profitable.
I don't see any personal benefit from it.
Most likely they'll keep the GSM and CDMA networks and gradually migrate everyone over to LTE.

Yeah, there is NO WAY this benefits the consumer. Likely less high-end phones (dont need as many rollouts/marketing involved)... less need for prices to stay low (since if all 3 started raising prices, the consumer has no choice).
I cant articulate just how much I hate the idea of it.

This is the third or fourth time the rumors of this merger have popped up

z0phi3l said:
This is the third or fourth time the rumors of this merger have popped up
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Yeah I've been hearing these rumors for over a year now.
Don't take away the great plans or SIMs and maybe we'll be good.

Oh no, Sprint just likes to ruin my mobile life I remember a few years back when I got my first Nextel and discovered Howard Forums. I loved my Nextels and learned to make some good money selling customized Nextels & parting out the LE phones. Then the rumors came about the Sprint Nextel merger. They destroyed Nextel. I went back to TMobile and now this again! Capitalism at it's best.

Lets see, best customer satisfaction? T mobile
Best prices? T mobile
Acceptable service? T mobile
Family friendly plans? T mobile
Unlimited cheap data? T mobile
Open architecture? Gsm phones, unlocked phones compatibility?
T mobile
yet the company is suffering from losses.
What's wrong with people?
Why would anyone support verizon or at&t
If people supported tmobile, this would never happen
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metro pcs here i come lol

Most people are stuck on tmobile and the voicestream days. Tmobile has always gotten knocked for its service... But honestly ive been a customer since 2000 and have noticed the serice is now on par with verizon. Priblem is people arent smart, and most people stay with verizon because they have that "can u hear me now?" **** and also because they advertise like madmen.
isnt tmo owned by deutschtelecom also?
And also I dont see how a merger between 2 companies using 2 different cell technologies will be beneficial. Ifanything tmobile should juststick with offering the cheapest plans and best customer service and slowly but surely you will see people migrate over slower...
Tmobile really doesnt offer anything special anymore, nd customer service definantly went downhill from what it used to be.
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z0phi3l said:
This is the third or fourth time the rumors of this merger have popped up
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+1
these rumors have been going around for years. it wouldn't really make sense, either. their networks are incompatible, and tmob has been spending a **** ton of money on their network.

Now i know why tmobile isn't bashing sprint in their commercials.
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jwleonhart said:
Most people are stuck on tmobile and the voicestream days. Tmobile has always gotten knocked for its service... But honestly ive been a customer since 2000 and have noticed the serice is now on par with verizon. Priblem is people arent smart, and most people stay with verizon because they have that "can u hear me now?" **** and also because they advertise like madmen.
isnt tmo owned by deutschtelecom also?
And also I dont see how a merger between 2 companies using 2 different cell technologies will be beneficial. Ifanything tmobile should juststick with offering the cheapest plans and best customer service and slowly but surely you will see people migrate over slower...
Tmobile really doesnt offer anything special anymore, nd customer service definantly went downhill from what it used to be.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA Premium App
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Good service is geographical. I live in LA and my service is very spotty. I worked for T-mobile for almost 4.5 years and my reception changed everytime I moved. Right now it is absolutely horrible but I stay on because I have a good price.
After reading a few articles about the potential merger I get the idea that they are not looking to integrate their systems but cut the operations cost that they are incurring, at least for the near short term. In reality it is not written anywhere that if two companies merge they must use one system or another. It would be a major game changer for both of these companies to merge and still use each carriers network (talk about flexibility). Regardless if they companies merge though prices will continue to go up. Data has become such a big commodity that people are willing to pay more for it regardless of who they have.
Cliffnotes: In my opinion they will only be merging operations for the first few years to cut costs, see which provider can retain the most amount of customers and go from there.

Is sprint even as big as tmobile is? Its sad that all these companies are trying to charge as much as possible for data...
And my biggest problem with tmobile is I pay an additional 20 bucks for my data service... And its supposedly unlimited.. But the minute I hit that 5gb cap I get slowed to literally dial up speed... Thanks tmobile!!! So the data really isnt unlimited, and I cant even purchase more bandwith
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jwleonhart said:
Is sprint even as big as tmobile is? Its sad that all these companies are trying to charge as much as possible for data...
And my biggest problem with tmobile is I pay an additional 20 bucks for my data service... And its supposedly unlimited.. But the minute I hit that 5gb cap I get slowed to literally dial up speed... Thanks tmobile!!! So the data really isnt unlimited, and I cant even purchase more bandwith
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Agreed, its tricky advertising regarding unlimited data. But that's the best you can get in USA . At least they don't charge for excess data past 5GB. No one offers unlimited data for that price. For example AT&T offers 2GB for $20 you are paying plus an additional $5, not to mention overage fees...

VICosPhi said:
Agreed, its tricky advertising regarding unlimited data. But that's the best you can get in USA . At least they don't charge for excess data past 5GB. No one offers unlimited data for that price. For example AT&T offers 2GB for $20 you are paying plus an additional $5, not to mention overage fees...
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And this is exactly why people dont join tmobile... Make the bandwidth unlimited for like 25 buxs... And then advertise that you really give unlimited compared to what att and verizon do...
If you want to suceed you have to stand out... And tmobile barely stands out, and I beieve sprints plans are the cheapest
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jwleonhart said:
And this is exactly why people dont join tmobile... Make the bandwidth unlimited for like 25 buxs... And then advertise that you really give unlimited compared to what att and verizon do...
If you want to suceed you have to stand out... And tmobile barely stands out, and I beieve sprints plans are the cheapest
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Actually it is unlimited. Speed is limited to 3/4-g until 5GB, then throttled, can't really complain for that. I'd take this over $500 or so extra per GB of ATT overage

Leaked document kills AT&T/T-Mobile case

http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/Leaked-ATT-Letter-Demolishes-Case-For-TMobile-Merger-115652
Yesterday a partially-redacted document briefly appeared on the FCC website --accidentally posted by a law firm working for AT&T on the $39 billion T-Mobile deal (somewhere there's a paralegal looking for work today). While AT&T engaged in damage control telling reporters that the document contained no new information -- our review of the doc shows that's simply not true. Data in the letter undermines AT&T's primary justification for the massive deal, while highlighting how AT&T is willing to pay a huge premium simply to reduce competition and keep T-Mobile out of Sprint's hands.
We've previously discussed how AT&T's claims of job gains and network investment gained by the deal aren't true, with overall network investment actually being reduced with the elimination of T-Mobile. While AT&T and the CWA are busy telling regulators the deal will increase network investment by $8 billion, out of the other side of their mouth AT&T has been telling investors the deal will reduce investment by $10 billion over 6 years. Based on historical averages T-Mobile would have invested $18 billion during that time frame, which means an overall reduction in investment.
Yet to get the deal approved, AT&T's key talking point to regulators and the press has been the claim that they need T-Mobile to increase LTE network coverage from 80% to 97% of the population. Except it has grown increasingly clear that AT&T doesn't need T-Mobile to accomplish much of anything, and likely would have arrived at 97% simply to keep pace with Verizon. AT&T, who has fewer customers and more spectrum than Verizon (or any other company for that matter), has all the resources and spectrum they need for uniform LTE coverage without this deal.
For the first time the letter pegs the cost of bringing AT&T's LTE coverage from 80% to 97% at $3.8 billion -- quite a cost difference from the $39 billion price tag on the T-Mobile deal. The push for 97% coverage apparently came from AT&T marketing, who was well aware that leaving LTE investment at 80% would leave them at a competitive disadvantage to Verizon. Marketing likely didn't want a repeat of the Luke Wilson map fiasco of a few years back, when Verizon made AT&T look foolish for poor 3G coverage.
The letter also notes that AT&T's supposed decision to "not" build out LTE to 97% was cemented during the first week of January, yet public documents (pdf) indicate that at the same time AT&T was already considering buying T-Mobile, having proposed the deal to Deutsche Telekom on January 15. In the letter, AT&T tries to make it seem like the decision to hold off on that 17% LTE expansion was based on costs. Yet the fact the company was willing to shell out $39 billion one week later, combined with AT&T's track record with these kinds of tactics, suggests AT&T executives knew that 80-97% expansion promise would be a useful carrot on a stick for politicians.
While the $39 billion price certainly delivers AT&T customers, equipment, employees, and spectrum, most of T-Mobile's network replicates AT&T's existing resources in major markets, and T-Mobile's network is significantly less robust in rural markets where AT&T would want to expand. While the deal provides AT&T with a shortcut to sluggish tower builds in a few select markets, by and large AT&T will be faced with terminating many redundant positions and decommissioning a lot of duplicative equipment. They'll also have to close a large number of retail operations and independent retailers.
Again, the reality appears to be that AT&T is giving Deutsche Telekom $39 billion primarily to reduce market competition. That price tag eliminates T-Mobile entirely -- and makes Sprint (and by proxy new LTE partner LightSquared and current partner Clearwire) more susceptible to failure in the face of 80% AT&T/Verizon market domination. How much do you think wireless broadband market dominance is worth to AT&T over the next decade? After all, AT&T will be first to tell you there's a wireless data "tsunami" coming, with AT&T and Verizon on the shore eagerly billing users up to $10 per gigabyte.
Regardless of the motivation behind rejecting 97% LTE deployment, the letter proves AT&T's claim they need T-Mobile to improve LTE coverage from 80-97% simply isn't true. That's a huge problem for AT&T, since nearly every politician and non-profit that has voiced support for the merger did so based largely on this buildout promise. It's also a problem when it comes to the DOJ review, since proof that AT&T could complete their LTE build for far less than the cost of this deal means the deal doesn't meet the DOJ's standard for merger-specific benefits.
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Wow I hope you're right and that this does throw a monkey wrench in the merger review... AT&T has notoriously wretched customer service & this is purely a power grab to squeeze out competition. These commercials about the merger being necessary to expand coverage to underserved populations looks like & smells like PR-spin BS. But, it seems like a lot of big players are coming out in favor of it... It'd be a great time to be an AT&T lobbyist right now.

interesting - but I think most of us were already aware of their false info since the get-go

TexasEpic4G said:
interesting - but I think most of us were already aware of their false info since the get-go
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Maybe we knew, but not most people. I hope it gets denied so Sprint can merge and catch up to the big red and at&t.
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Damn that's a lot of typing on an onscreen keyboard..
Edit: I see you just copied the article into the thread. Good info!

shane6374 said:
Damn that's a lot of typing on an onscreen keyboard..
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To be honest, I copy/pasted. But I could do it with my favorite, Swiftkey X keyboard.
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The merger has big tech industry and political support. If it does happen, we need to look at what assets ATT/TMobile will have to divest to meet approval, and which assets Sprint can buy up.

son of a ***** my ATT stock is going to take a dive on monday

murso74 said:
son of a ***** my ATT stock is going to take a dive on monday
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I'd take a look at Sprint's stock if this merger is declined. lol

Overstew said:
I'd take a look at Sprint's stock if this merger is declined. lol
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I'm planning on grabbing handfuls of it on Monday anyway.

The Root said:
I'm planning on grabbing handfuls of it on Monday anyway.
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Makes me wish I had the money to get into stock trading. But I'm sure it doesn't help that I don't know much about it, haha

Sprint's balance sheet is much too bloated with debt and an uncertain 4G future. I would invest in reliable companies like Exxon Mobil, Microsoft, Ford, and Walmart.

I'm glad you posted this not for the info that we already knew but for the fact that this merger should go down in flames now

Reading this made me so happy. I will starting as a retail associate for tmo within the next few weeks (been trying for 3 years!) And I'm def happy about this. **** at&t this merger is horrible and is a completely legit try at market dominance. Sprint needs to pick up tmo, no matter what the outcome of the different tech and spectrum being used is. It would put all 3 companies neck to neck. And since sprint's prices are the **** big red and apples main brown nosers will be force to compete, instead of raping your wallet.
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last thing sprint needs to do is integrate another new tech.

RushAOZ said:
Reading this made me so happy. I will starting as a retail associate for tmo within the next few weeks (been trying for 3 years!) And I'm def happy about this. **** at&t this merger is horrible and is a completely legit try at market dominance. Sprint needs to pick up tmo, no matter what the outcome of the different tech and spectrum being used is. It would put all 3 companies neck to neck. And since sprint's prices are the **** big red and apples main brown nosers will be force to compete, instead of raping your wallet.
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murso74 said:
last thing sprint needs to do is integrate another new tech.
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It's interesting to see both views on the subject. I'm all for Sprint grabbing T-Mobile. If another wireless carrier gets T-Mobile, Sprint will most likely go bankrupt and/or be bought out by another company instead. Sprint's options are to either buy or be bought. (At least that's my view of it).
Sprint's a great company that cares about it's customers, I just wish they were larger because they're the ones that have fair pricing.

Yeap. If I was Google Id pick up sprint and tmo... wasn't there talks about Google acquiring sprint or something. If Google owned its own network apple would be screwed
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RushAOZ said:
Yeap. If I was Google Id pick up sprint and tmo... wasn't there talks about Google acquiring sprint or something. If Google owned its own network apple would be screwed
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http://www.businessinsider.com/sprint-verizon-comcast-google-2011-3
Verizon stated they wouldn't buy Sprint, they're in too much debt (that link I cannot find), however, it was interesting that Comcast might buy Sprint. Then again, same thing. Sprint's too much in debt to be bought out right now. I'm very interested in seeing how this pans out.

Not to mention Google just announced purchasing Motorola Mobile. Verizon carries the most Motorola Products so far so who knows what will happen. What I like is that Motorola also develops and provides set top boxes and cable modems for most cable operators so I think this can help Google bring more into the home tv and internet service area.

that's it... google buys sprint, the att tomobile deal goes through... we have a 3 way race. google undercuts everyones prices, and everyone benifits!
and by everyone i mean me

Sprint is stupid.

"Let's pay $15 billion for the iphone but be hard pressed to find $2 billion to upgrade and $10 billion to outbuy tmobile"
When is network vision going to bare fruit? All I've seen is a massive drawdown in speeds and sprints stock nosediving due to an $800 million deficit. But yet they can give 15 billion to apple for theiphone...I wonder how much rodgers and us cellular paid to have the iphone on their regional networks?
I hope they atleast leave lte unlimited and eventuallly catch up to verizons lte coverage
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Their hope is that the $15 Billion spent on buying the iPhone itself will lead to more customers especially since they are the only unlimited carrier. It seems to be working and while they are still losing money, they will gain money at the end of these people's contracts most likely.
EDIT: And hopefully that will fund LTE expansion and everything else they need. T-Mobile is the number four carrier partially because it does not have the iPhone and since the EVO, Sprint has had more blockbuster phones than T-Mobile.

xboxfanj said:
Their hope is that the $15 Billion spent on buying the iPhone itself will lead to more customers especially since they are the only unlimited carrier. It seems to be working and while they are still losing money, they will gain money at the end of these people's contracts most likely.
EDIT: And hopefully that will fund LTE expansion and everything else they need. T-Mobile is the number four carrier partially because it does not have the iPhone and since the EVO, Sprint has had more blockbuster phones than T-Mobile.
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Funny to the fact that their whole lets spend 15 Billion for the iPhone was kind of stupid seeing how their most bought phone still is the S2 or aka Epic Touch

XxLostSoulxX said:
Funny to the fact that their whole lets spend 15 Billion for the iPhone was kind of stupid seeing how their most bought phone still is the S2 or aka Epic Touch
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I doubt that. Sprint had sold 1.8 Million iPhones in February, so probably even more now, and I doubt they've sold 2 Million Epic Touches.

xboxfanj said:
I doubt that. Sprint had sold 1.8 Million iPhones in February, so probably even more now, and I doubt they've sold 2 Million Epic Touches.
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ive asked several reps around me those that are smart and knowledgeable unlike others and they have told me all, that the Epic Touch is still the most sold device the iPhone is up their simply "because its iPhone i want one i want one" type of people.

What's extra stupid is them releasing LTE in markets first that already have WiMax instead of getting it out in places with no 4G at all. I live in the biggest city in the state, granted it's no Chicago or NY but there's close to a million people in the metro area. Big blue and red have LTE here, even US Cellular does now. No idea if TMobile does as I don't know a single person who uses them. All my contracts are up in Sept. If they don't at least hint of LTE coming in the next year by then it'll will be real tempting to take my 10 years of business elsewhere even if it is a bit cheaper.

XxLostSoulxX said:
ive asked several reps around me those that are smart and knowledgeable unlike others and they have told me all, that the Epic Touch is still the most sold device the iPhone is up their simply "because its iPhone i want one i want one" type of people.
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It really doesn't matter what type of people they are. There's only one type of person to a business and that's a paying person. The people who buy an iphone every year are exactly the people sprint wants.
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somedude0608 said:
It really doesn't matter what type of people they are. There's only one type of person to a business and that's a paying person. The people who buy an iphone every year are exactly the people sprint wants.
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oh i couldn't agree more because it's money coming in i was stating to the fact that they'll get money from them because of the types of people who are like that, but its still funny that S2 still has sold more units daily rather than the iPhone

xboxfanj said:
I doubt that. Sprint had sold 1.8 Million iPhones in February, so probably even more now, and I doubt they've sold 2 Million Epic Touches.
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Look at that article on engadget... it was a bad move to buy the iPhones they're not making enough to balance out the cost. CEO took a hit for that one.
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If sprint does get some exclusive iphone hardware out of the 15b and that leads to massive customer increases it would be worth it.
Like what if sprint is the only one to get a 4.5inch screen iphone?

They were late to the game with the 4S and Iphone's period. But if the Iphone 5 is released at the same time as the other carriers, it will be playing on an even playing field but the only one with unlimited data.
It's gonna be a sad day when sprint switches to tiered. But then again, if you are already a customer, you should be grandfathered in.

A_Flying_Fox said:
"Let's pay $15 billion for the iphone but be hard pressed to find $2 billion to upgrade and $10 billion to outbuy tmobile"
When is network vision going to bare fruit? All I've seen is a massive drawdown in speeds and sprints stock nosediving due to an $800 million deficit. But yet they can give 15 billion to apple for theiphone...I wonder how much rodgers and us cellular paid to have the iphone on their regional networks?
I hope they atleast leave lte unlimited and eventuallly catch up to verizons lte coverage
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The Network Vision is rolling out on time, in some areas faster.
I think we get a "I Hate", or "Sprint is Stupid" thread about once a month. I know these facts have been covered before, but never the less. Not to necessarily point at this OP, but you'd think some of our users would think of a better title by now. We need a "Just Venting because my 3G is slow" thread and sticky it.
P.S. Check out the site in my Signature. Not only will it answer your questions, but there is a interview with Dan Hesse there where he personally answers questions like above. He also explains why there are going the path that they are. Fun reading...