Database Users

IPhone 0 - HTC 1!

Just had to post this somewhere (sorry!)
In all comparison reviews & tests between the Iphone and HTC - they always bring up that Apple has thousands of apps available in their store and WM doesnt. Someone should tell them that there are thousands of applications for Windows Mobile out there - and for free!!
And they are actually usefull stuff, compared to Apples costy gimmicks (which according to
studies people only use once or twice then ditch them).
Spread the word!

Then it's Apple 1 Microsoft 0 for Microsoft's failure to get all these apps into the marketplace where they can be easily accessed and impress the reviewers.
Absolutely no relevance to HTC.

Let's leave it 1-1 then and not start an Apple vs HTC/MS discussion/flamewar again.
Don't think this thread was necessary - but jannen is right when he says "spread the word". Bashing Windows Mobile for no good reason is a recent trend among bloggers that's really sad.

I've just got to say, if most of the WM apps are placed into WM MarketPlace then a large proportion of them won't be free.
Apple makes it easier for consumers by having them all in one place else no one would find anything for the iPhone. Most WM users are quite adept at hunting down useful applications so it doesn't really bother most of the users.

Can people please post links to these so called good apps? As I have searched and found little that I think is nice to look at as what free ones I have seen look like the old BBC game "Elite"
I'm not an XDa Dev boff, have no idea where to look.
Tried to search WM 6.5 apps/widgets/games, HD2 apps, games... all come up with poo apps
Links please? (if allowed, cant see why they wouldnt) and obviously not warez.

cobnut said:
Can people please post links to these so called good apps? As I have searched and found little that I think is nice to look at as what free ones I have seen look like the old BBC game "Elite"
I'm not an XDa Dev boff, have no idea where to look.
Tried to search WM 6.5 apps/widgets/games, HD2 apps, games... all come up with poo apps
Links please? (if allowed, cant see why they wouldnt) and obviously not warez.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I used to have a BBC and played a lot of Elite. I'd LOVE it if you could get a version for windows mobile!
Edit:
DAMNIT!!! I found it on Handango, but it's no longer available
Edit:
YES!!!! http://www.eliteppc.com/

jannen said:
Just had to post this somewhere (sorry!)
In all comparison reviews & tests between the Yellow pages and my Outlook- they always bring up that yellow pages has thousands of numbers available in their book and my Outlook doesnt. Someone should tell them that there are thousands of phone numbers for people out there - and for free!!
And they are actually usefull people, compared to Outlooks boring people (which according to
studies people only call once or twice then ditch them).
Spread the word!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Edited for accuracy. Worst pro WM argument ever!

LOL, me too.
BTW, I just spotted the themes and applications section tit

Sorry
Didnt want to start a war here. Iphone has its merits as does Nokia as does many other phones. We all have a phone we love, mine is WM.
Just dont think its fair Windows Mobile gets bad rep for not having apps available, which is not true. There are many out there and most are free. If they were put to a marketplace... well, obviosly they wouldnt be free...
Sorry if I upset any... (think you guys are still cool! this is still the best forum)

jannen said:
Didnt want to start a war here. Iphone has its merits as does Nokia as does many other phones. We all have a phone we love, mine is WM.
Just dont think its fair Windows Mobile gets bad rep for not having apps available, which is not true. There are many out there and most are free. If they were put to a marketplace... well, obviosly they wouldnt be free...
Sorry if I upset any... (think you guys are still cool! this is still the best forum)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If that was because of my post, I apologise. It's not always easy to tell when someone is just pulling someones leg on forums I agree M$ must improve its marketplace and correlate all worthy apps in one place, or it will not stand a chance in the coming months.

OP has a point, this is my first windows phone and the marketplace is (currently) crap!
Any links like this one:
http://www.freewarepocketpc.net/
where I can get some decent win mo software would be nice

what bugs me is that most of the apps (especially games) i found are for qvga devices, so look TERRIBLE on my lovely HD2 screen
thats the advantge of the iphone, like consoles, developers know Exactly what hardware they have to work with.

docchris1980 said:
thats the advantge of the iphone, like consoles, developers know Exactly what hardware they have to work with.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The iPhone still has a ****ty HVGA screen. That needs to change soon, otherwise competitors will extend the lead even more in terms of hardware. The screen of the HD2, for example, already is a huge advantage, it makes everything from web browsing to reading mail, books etc. a lot more pleasant.
What happens then? Games developed for the 2G/3G/3GS iPhone may not work anymore, developers will have to develop for different hardware just like they have to do on Windows Mobile.
And by the way, there are lots of games for WVGA available. Really lots of them, and good ones.

The debate around AppStore v Marketplace is entirely spurious and makes about as much sense as saying my six month old child can't walk or talk as well as my neighbour's three year old.
There are a host of excellent, mature applications available for the PPC platform that are entirely independent of Marketplace (and I hope they remain so). A significant percentage of the best PPC apps were also around long before the iPhone was even a bulge in Steve Job's trousers.
In those terms the iPhone is still miles behind, although I admit that if you are looking for a fluffy little puffball of pointless visual nonsense with which to amuse the hard of thinking, the iPhone has to be the platform of choice.
While I admire the OP's intentions in trying to balance out the pointlessly negative threads posted by those with a suspiciously pro-iPhone agenda, I suspect we are all just going over the same old ground and should simply agree to disagree before it all decends into another flame war.
I'd therefore propose that we close this thread and get on with some of the business that concerns the device that brought us all here in the first place, rather than fretting about how it stacks up against other devices.

Gustopher said:
if you are looking for a fluffy little puffball of pointless visual nonsense with which to amuse the hard of thinking, the iPhone has to be the platform of choice.
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Click to collapse
sorry but I cant help my response to that...
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maati said:
The iPhone still has a ****ty HVGA screen. That needs to change soon, otherwise competitors will extend the lead even more in terms of hardware. The screen of the HD2, for example, already is a huge advantage, it makes everything from web browsing to reading mail, books etc. a lot more pleasant.
What happens then? Games developed for the 2G/3G/3GS iPhone may not work anymore, developers will have to develop for different hardware just like they have to do on Windows Mobile.
And by the way, there are lots of games for WVGA available. Really lots of them, and good ones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Forget the screen just plug the fluffy puffball into the telly

custardo01 said:
Forget the screen just plug the fluffy puffball into the telly
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry, but buying an iPhone for playing games on the TV is stupid. There are PCs and consoles for that which are much more fun.
For gaming on the go, the HD2 is at least as good, if not better. I really enjoy playing all my SNES games on the HD2, those alone are already more than the total amount of games you find in the iPhone AppStore
Soon there's a new version of FPSCE and we can play our PSX games on the HD2, all of them being better than anything you can find in the AppStore.
Just look at that: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n5JoNUFHbJY
There's absolutely NOTHING in the AppStore that can compete with that.
And there are also lots of good standalone games for the HD2, like NFS undercover, Asphalt 4, POP, ..............

maati said:
Sorry, but buying an iPhone for playing games on the TV is stupid. There are PCs and consoles for that which are much more fun.
For gaming on the go, the HD2 is at least as good, if not better. I really enjoy playing all my SNES games on the HD2, those alone are already more than the total amount of games you find in the iPhone AppStore
Soon there's a new version of FPSCE and we can play our PSX games on the HD2, all of them being better than anything you can find in the AppStore.
Just look at that: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n5JoNUFHbJY
There's absolutely NOTHING in the AppStore that can compete with that.
And there are also lots of good standalone games for the HD2, like NFS undercover, Asphalt 4, POP, ..............
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I know what you mean and I am far too old for playing these sort of games but it is nice to have a working option. Spent thousands of pounds on HTC devices and they all have the registry entry but no function - very frustrating. You could always do some serious browsing or emailing or anything. Just an option.

TP2 has TV out if you want that. I don't get why someone would want to connect the phone to a TV for browsing or playing games... TV out for presentations: Yes, but for games?! Doesn't make sense, there's much better devices than phones for this.
Anyway, the HD2 is really the best phone for gaming.

Gustopher said:
The debate around AppStore v Marketplace is entirely...
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Click to collapse
Hear...hear!
The truth is that all this hype abot the iPhone having more apps than windows mobile is as specious as it is purely PROPAGANDA! I know at least 4 people who get paid specifically to start a "blogging" campaign for or against whatever you want. This WinMo bashing campaign does look suspicious!
Just because the iPhone has a centeralized "marketplace" for alllll their fart apps doesn't mean that their measely 25,000 apps collection meets or exceeds what's available for CE. I personally have 2.8 Gigabytes of apps just for winmo 5+ (after cleaning and deleting old versions etc...).
In reality, it is just impossible to account for the windows mobile application base; software developers have been enriching windows mobile for more than 10 years, and they market their software independantly.
Personally, I bought, used, and gifted away my iPhone in a month! Yes, smooth animation, slick UI, a thin base of useful apps ( the rest are over-polished iFarts really), but no utility beyond that of an iPod whatsoever. The damn thing couldn't even handle basic "Cut-n-Paste" until it was later introduced as an "advanced update", let alone lack of multitasking, customizability, and its uselessness as a business phone -author & edit documents, spreadsheets, presentation, fax, OCR, exchange mail, etc... forget it! You want advanced functionality, enterprise mobility, a business solution? There really is only one way ----> The WinMo way.
For all its hype, the iPhone is a "chick-flick"; a fluffy darling you take to the manicure parlor! Its made for simplicity not multitasking, streamlined experience, not customizability; BASIC simple-minded FUNCTIONALITY!
And if you're here to start a flame-war, so be it; this is, and has been, an HTC/WinMo forum from day 1... You've brought your iPhone to the wrong shop honey!

is it just me or Windows 7 looks ugly

I am not sure whats all the fuss about.
reason I moved from iphone to wm is because of multitasking, running skype \ messenger and other apps in the background.
I am not a big fan of zune interface. but to be honest I didnt use it.
can some one explain why he sees win7 as a good thing?

mmmalas said:
I am not sure whats all the fuss about.
reason I moved from iphone to wm is because of multitasking, running skype \ messenger and other apps in the background.
I am not a big fan of zune interface. but to be honest I didnt use it.
can some one explain why he sees win7 as a good thing?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Couple of things:
• Still a prototype (room for lots of change)
• supposed to be really fast
• better integration
• more finger friendly
• however agreed, at this stage, it's quite plain but very
Some more info. <<HERE>>.

i dont like it at all
i think MS is thinking way too much social network capabilities. something we already have currently for which i personally hardly ever use. also the layout doesnt look straight forward and looks confusing or i just didn't seem to pay attention to it. i wont upgrade if that is how it gonna look like.

Just an FYI, It's Windows Phone 7 Series (WP7S) not Windows 7.
dwizzy130

Why do people have to moan so much? No-one has even tried the f*cking OS yet and they're already moaning about it. I suppose these people are all running Windows 1.0 and driving around in Austin Ambassadors.
There's nothing wrong with Microsoft integrating social network as this is the way of things: people are finding new ways to communicate all the time and phone OS's are adapting to this; you don't HAVE to use these facilities and they won't be obtrusive if you don't. You also have the option of sticking with Windows mobile as Microsoft will continue to supply it as they supply XP to netbook manufacturers.
Stop moaning about it: would you rather Microsoft just patched up the current Windows Mobile some more so that it finally dies the death that it is currently heading towards?? The new OS means better hardware support, meaning greater performance and speed. Don't like it? Get an iPhone, Android phone or stick with Windows Mobile 6...
The great thing is that now there is so much CHOICE. There is no point whingeing because the OS doesn't conform with your exacting standards, Microsoft I'm sure have worked hard to please as many people as possible as obviously this is a solid business model to conform to. If you don't like it, don't buy it....but at least give it a chance.
I was scornful of Windows 7 until I tried it.

It's really ugly, especially the screen with square and rectangle boxes of sms/call/mail info

Really?
I think it looks really good. If it has the responsiveness of my Zune HD then I think MS may have a real winner here.

it's just the backbone.. it will probably just have (a new version) of sense running on top of it...

bel_z_bub said:
it's just the backbone.. it will probably just have (a new version) of sense running on top of it...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The bigger question at this point is...does WinPhone 7 really need HTC Sense running on top of it? I could understand running on top of 6.5 (very easy to replicate the existing functionality for a much better looking UI) but replicating the hubs and functionality in 7 would be a much harder job.

lordcanti86 said:
The bigger question at this point is...does WinPhone 7 really need HTC Sense running on top of it? I could understand running on top of 6.5 (very easy to replicate the existing functionality for a much better looking UI) but replicating the hubs and functionality in 7 would be a much harder job.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I hope not, I hate the double functionality it has now.. and I think it looks quit good already (wm7).. but maybe a little simple for our large screen hd2.. which I also find quit useless at the moment.. the home screen in Sense is just a big version of a small resolution screen phone.. why not use that space..? in this case finger friendly is just a poor excuse for hasty release in my opinion.. luckely we have developers here who finish htc's job (co0kie's home tabs is a good example, it makes your phone feel like what htc promises in their commercials but doesn't deliver)
let's face it, the default windows mobile 6.5 home screen (the scrolling finger friendly one, don't know the name) is not bad at all.. it just looks ugly on our big screen..

not moaning but just saying as how i feel about it as the subject pertains. if u dont like how i feel about it maybe you should get the F**K out of this thread if you cant handle it. why are you so pissed off about such an opinion from others. are you the developer of it or something that offended you? i would consider trying it out once it is close to the release date and see what it really looks like then. ciao!

c4Lvin said:
not moaning but just saying as how i feel about it as the subject pertains. if u dont like how i feel about it maybe you should get the F**K out of this thread if you cant handle it. why are you so pissed off about such an opinion from others. are you the developer of it or something that offended you? i would consider trying it out once it is close to the release date and see what it really looks like then. ciao!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The point is that you haven't tried it yet. Do you criticise movies based on their trailers?
It's impossible to know for sure whether you're going to like an OS just by basing your opinion on a few pictures and videos. Besides which who really thinks the stock Windows Mobile 6 is a gorgeous user-friendly masterpiece; it's only with the addition of Sense that the experience is improved to the point of desirability. Microsoft haven't holistically written off Windows Mobile 6 so fans can still stick with it for the foreseeable life of their devices and expect updates to Sense, SPB Mobile Shell and Opera.
The point is that now there is greater choice, which can only be a good thing. I'm not a developer and I have no affiliations which might bias my opinion here, but I have made the mistake of writing off things before ive tried them in the past and just think people shouldn't be so keen to spit their dummies out when things don't look exactly how they'd expect them to. Given the limited knowledge we have of WP7's hands-on experience I think this poll might be a little premature.

Well, we haven't really seen much
In fact we have not seen much more than a proof of concept. (Although I'm quite sure it is more than that). I, for one, will hold off judgment until I learn more about the functionality and possibilities for customizations. As shown it does not meet my personal needs for my "Home Screen". IF, as I have read, MS is locking down the UI then the rest better be pretty damn fantastic for me to put up with the UI I saw. But if we can change it around to fit our needs then I will consider it.
As for now, although speculation is fun, I feel it's just too early to make any determination based on the little we know. Next month will give us more info. After that it will be a case of "wait and see" what the devs come up with once they get their hands on the OS etc. I keep thinking about that old adage "Don't judge a book by it's cover".

I wouldn't put too much criticism on the layout as I do about the functionality. People needs to realize that the layout is not set in stones and i'd be hard pressed if MS would keep the blue block as their UI. As long as it is fast, smooth, and finger-friendly, skinning it would be a piece of cake. Give it some time until close to release time and we'll see a more polish product that will appeal to everybody.

i completely agree..
how come people always criticizing something that has not been even tested in real life?
it's always "oooh it's ugly and i still like the current one or the older one", but yet after a while, we then accept the fact that it is actually better and fit our needs.
i guess thats why there are old people that will very likely to use an old typewriter Compare with the more civilized older ones who get the use and capabilities of computers. So much critics that now, they dont even know how to use it.

Stop Moaning guys,
i say this is the best WM OS those lazy bustard have come out with and compete against the fruit factory.
i like it.... thought it looks awful now, but we have gfreek and other xda superheroes to tweak and style and custom and theme and overclock and whatever you can think of...
cant wait for and unofficial release....
from Singapore
by the way, Singapore just open its first casino...

as stated earlier, if the "book cover" looks better , you got my vote. other than that, NOTHING else so far about wp7s lures me into upgrading for what i have now. i am talking about what we've been shown. even though i use it now based on your judgement, i wont enjoy it cos it is simply not pretty. sorry i cant do an ugly person even if she functions well.

I am holding off to 6.5.1 + ROMs because of cosmetic reasons really. I like the large finger friendly buttons but the fact that the start button is on the left making it look unsymmetrical to me is f-ugly. In my opinion it should be in the middle. Hope this doesn't turn out to be the case for Win phone but from the images i have seen it doesn't look too bad. Im sure it will be skinable to some extent and i think it is a step in the right direction. Win mobile can be complicated and ugly if your used to more "main stream" handsets. As long as it maintains its customisable back bone in a pretty new wrapper i welcome this new os.

optiknerv said:
I am holding off to 6.5.1 + ROMs because of cosmetic reasons really. I like the large finger friendly buttons but the fact that the start button is on the left making it look unsymmetrical to me is f-ugly. In my opinion it should be in the middle. Hope this doesn't turn out to be the case for Win phone but from the images i have seen it doesn't look too bad. Im sure it will be skinable to some extent and i think it is a step in the right direction. Win mobile can be complicated and ugly if your used to more "main stream" handsets. As long as it maintains its customisable back bone in a pretty new wrapper i welcome this new os.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just wait until we get a ROM dump from the HTC HD Mini. That is running an unseen build of 6.5.X that got rid of the start menu icon on the taskbars and has symmetrical softkeys.
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dwizzy130

it actually does look quite hideous, why would anyone want to show off that, or "leak" it,
i mean what the heck?? MAKE A GOD DAMN TOUCH INNOVATED INTERFACE YOU BUNCH OF DIM WITS

Response to Hack-A-Day - Post Screenshots here

This is a thread to show hack-a-day what a unprofessional and outright dumb move they made by posting that article. I think it would be a great idea if everyone dropped a comment on the hackaday site for the 10 missing things for Android / 10 things for Gingerbread article and post the screenshot here. I have attached mine below along with the link to the article.
And yes I am really angered by their dumb approach. How do you not know that Android has folders, I mean co'mmon.
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http://hackaday.com/2010/07/10/top-10-features-wed-like-to-see-in-android-3-0/
Per cxdist, just to show I am not trying to drive hits, Article Below
Top 10 features we’d like to see in Android 3.0
posted Jul 10th 2010 8:00am by Jacob Nahin
filed under: android hacks, rants
Poor Google. Despite its numerous capabilities with smartphones spread across a variety of carriers, Android still struggles to garner the prestige and positive perceptions of iOS 4. Sales continue to rise, but at the end of the day, the average person is still left lusting for an iPhone. Well, here are 10 features that should be added to Android 3.0 that could change the tide.
1. A no-brainer task manager.
Google says Android doesn’t need a task manager, that it closes programs efficiently without any user-intervention, substandard apps often suck memory dry. Because of this, Android users are forced to download complicated task-managers, each with its own odd UI, and weigh which one works the best. Google, please fess up to the problem and put something in there a computer novice could use. Something with big buttons would be nice.
2. Stable Multitasking
Speaking of crashes, multitasking on Android is a mess. A little optimization here wouldn’t hurt. Better yet, while this may run counter-productive to us power-users, why not release a lite version of Android 3.0 that doesn’t support multitasking? Not every user needs it and lower-end phones would appreciate it
3. Swype
Google, your Android keyboard sucks. That’s why the fine folks at Swype Inc developed their product. Sure, some of the newer Android phones like the Droid X are releasing with it built in, but it would be a boon for the OS to come packaged with this software.
4. IR- sender support
On the hardware side of things, an IR-sender support is a “duh.” Imagine a next generation of remotes running on Android. Better yet, how would you like to control your lights and home-entertainment center with your phone without the sometimes-complicated mess of configuring through a network?
5. Universal pinch-to-zoom
Some apps have it. Some apps don’t. C’mon, this should be standard by now.
6. Folders
Google, you copied iOS’s homescreen UI, why not do it again? Many of users have outgrown their limited pages and would like a way to add some organization to their mobile lives.
7. SD-Card support for app-storage
If users are going to download a ton of apps from the Android Market, they need somewhere to put them. Users with rooted phones can already do this, but expandable storage should be standard in app-filled world with insatiable memory lust.
8. Built-in syncing
If the Android is going to succeed as a user-friendly platform, it needs to make it easy for people to add their music, photos, and video to their phones. It’s simple Google. Develop some web-based software and launch it as a beta. You do it for everything else…
9. Standardized UI for all apps
I’m all for artistic interpretation, but the reason so many functional apps get low scores is because they work differently than the rest of the OS. Once again, do what Apple did and come up with better UI guidelines.
10. Better market
Why can’t I queue downloads from the web? That would be awesome. How about a better way to navigate the store from my laptop? Despite the thousands of apps the Android Market hosts, it is stuck with the same problems as Apple’s iOS4. More importantly than any of the above, Google needs to innovate here. Change the way mobile markets work Google and you could win this war.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

They got you driving up site hits. Sounds like a great move to me.

cxdist said:
They got you driving up site hits. Sounds like a great move to me.
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Click to collapse
Oh no dude, I cant stand hackaday, there just punks because they deleted the comment i left on the site. I mean an alternative would be just to post the article here and comment here. F&#K their hits.

I can't agree more that the article was written by a bumbling idiot, but how is this remotely related to development. Don't be a fool too, post in the right section.

isolated_epidemic said:
I can't agree more that the article was written by a bumbling idiot, but how is this remotely related to development. Don't be a fool too, post in the right section.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dude your right. Mod please post in the General Nexus One section. Thanks, Its 4:00am here so my bad.

flak0 said:
Dude your right. Mod please post in the General Nexus One section. Thanks, Its 4:00am here so my bad.
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Great find though, I always enjoy a solid chuckle before bed. Just like Fox News that guy apparently did zero research on his subject matter.

isolated_epidemic said:
Great find though, I always enjoy a solid chuckle before bed. Just like Fox News that guy apparently did zero research on his subject matter.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lol true. i hate fanboys that don't know shiznit!

1. A no-brainer task manager.
Just because Google hasn't integrated it itself doesn't mean it doesn't exist. The article is right that Google hasn't released their own, but a task manager like ATK works perfectly fine. There are plenty of missing things in iOS4 that customers have relied on third party developers to fill the void.
2. Stable Multitasking
I lol'ed. Multitasking on my N1 works wonders compared to the "multitasking" on my iOS4 iPod Touch.
3. Swype
The default keyboard doesn't suck (I personally prefer it over Swype). But it is retarded to not acknowledge that Swype's closed-beta situation right now and limited manufacturer partners is probably the reason. Not Google.
4. IR- sender support
I couldn't care less about IR at this point. Haven't had it on a phone in years and don't miss it one bit. I'd rather have the ability to control devices over WiFi. Devices still relying on IR need to catch up as opposed to Google going backwards.
5. Universal pinch-to-zoom
Has anyone been able to pinch-to-zoom yet on their iOS4 homescreens? 'nuff said.
6. Folders
I didn't realize that the organized folders I have on my stock Android homescreens are figments of my imagination or have been magically created in my sleep by anally organized unicorns.
7. SD-Card support for app-storage
Really? Hi Froyo. Oh and I wish I could move apps to SD on my iPod Touch... (as most know, "storage capacity on an iDevice does not equal the amount of app RAM).
8. Built-in syncing
For media, I will say I do agree. A 1st party sync tool for media would be nice. But for PIM functionality, I much prefer the OTA syncing as opposed to having to remember to tether to my MacBook when I need to move info (except for those on Exchange which doesn't really count in this case because it goes without saying).
9. Standardized UI for all apps
God forbid developers have the right to design their apps the way they see fit instead of being told they all have to look a certain way!! I'm a unique and creative guy. I like my apps the same way.
10. Better market
iOS4's walled garden approach makes sense in many ways and doesn't make sense in many others. Android's approach leaves more of a possibility for trouble. But crap apps fill most of Apple's app store (not saying there isn't tons of crap in Android's market though) and clearly the walled garden approach isn't in place to give users only apps worth needing/buying. My one Android suggestion in this category? Buy AppBrain.

The One feature needed on Iphone 5...
The ability to hold a telephone conversation. Seriously Apple, fix that $***

How hard is it to get a non-biased article? Or at least one that respects the pros and cons of both operating systems. Anyhow I wrote the following, can't see it getting posted though
Seriously? This is the most impressive piece of fan boy horse **** I’ve read in a long time. Both operating systems have their pros and cons but to put zero research into an article is simply embarassing.
1 is nonsense as you can end each application through the settings – applications menu.
2 and 3 are purely subjective and as android is *OPEN* you can replace/hack the default keyboard in mere seconds.
4 While I would like this feature, I can’t see how it’s a DUH! feature. It’s obvious this will be integrated with the release of Google TV and similar.
5 makes zero sense as not all applications need pinch to zoom. Would p2z really be necessary in the calendar application or the music application? No. Also where is iOS’s p2z on the home screen? Oh its missing….
6 Now this is my favorite part, android has had folders since 1.5. That’s right, before iOS 3.
7 Froyo supports this perfectly, nuff said.
8 I agree with this point, a better *MEDIA* syncing experience is necessary. However application and data syncing even after a factory reset is perfect at the moment, I simply sign into my google account and everything is restored.
9 Please don’t restrict Android like iOS, we like originality and uniqueness. Demanding system wide standardization pretty much gives up on any significant advancements in the future.
10 This day in age no-one needs to queue downloads. If you’re using a connection which needs to queue sub 1mb downloads then Android vs iOS is the least of your worries. Admittedly I would like a way to access the marketplace on my laptop.
All in all, there was zero subjectivity in this article. Even on the areas that any Android user would agree to, the attitude used is that of an iOS fan boy. Poor show hackaday.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

adambenjamin said:
The One feature needed on Iphone 5...
The ability to hold a telephone conversation. Seriously Apple, fix that $***
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hold down the mute button for a couple of second and it'll change to hold.

mtl171 said:
hold down the mute button for a couple of second and it'll change to hold.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm pretty sure they were referring to the high rate of call dropping and call failures that many people use as a target of insult towards the iPhone crowd. Not the ability to put the call on hold.

obstacles can kill said:
I'm pretty sure they were referring to the high rate of call dropping and call failures that many people use as a target of insult towards the iPhone crowd. Not the ability to put the call on hold.
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Click to collapse
supposedly the new iphone fixes it. though you lose bars when you hold it(messed up reception algorithm)

We seriously need a new blog site to respond to all of those biased, ignorant, uneducated, and lack of research articles posted in many blog sites (even sometimes the big sites make mistakes too). I think a site like this would be fun to read

ohh, I mean hold, as in not drop the call actually. My iphone could not hold on to a call.

NexusDro said:
We seriously need a new blog site to respond to all of those biased, ignorant, uneducated, and lack of research articles posted in many blog sites (even sometimes the big sites make mistakes too). I think a site like this would be fun to read
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well I turned my rebuttal to it into a blog post on my site. If anyone supports my response to the article, you are more than welcome to share it.
Oh and if linking to my site for this reason is against policy (I don't think it is because I've seen external linking previously), I fully apologize and will remove the link or will understand if a mod does it.
And here is the pic I used for the article:
http://www.erictate.com/2010/07/11/hack-a-day-loses-their-cred-outside-of-ifanboys/

Thanks Everyone for your Input & responses. I agree with building the blog site against this article. Hackaday will not only lose credibility but they will also lose readers. Thats like Engadget saying that Android needs Adobe Flash in 3.0. I mean really, okay I will go back to work now.

The posting: http://hackaday.com/2010/07/10/top-10-features-wed-like-to-see-in-android-3-0/
They have since admitted that the article is not very accurate.
Hello HaD readers,
Sorry for the delay in updating this. I was on probation while the editors worked with Jason to figure out some things.
Clearly, for my recent debut article, I didn’t research Android OS well enough. After reading each of your comments, I realize that the article fell short of HaD’s and its readers standards for high-quality writing and reporting. Every point I made in the article were problems I noticed in my experience with Android, but I should have done more research on others’ experiences and the capabilities of each version of the OS. To each reader, I am sorry and will do better by you in future posts.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1. A no-brainer task manager.
Google says Android doesn’t need a task manager, that it closes programs efficiently without any user-intervention, substandard apps often suck memory dry. Because of this, Android users are forced to download complicated task-managers, each with its own odd UI, and weigh which one works the best. Google, please fess up to the problem and put something in there a computer novice could use. Something with big buttons would be nice.
Included in a OS thats designed to take care of this?
2. Stable Multitasking
Speaking of crashes, multitasking on Android is a mess. A little optimization here wouldn’t hurt. Better yet, while this may run counter-productive to us power-users, why not release a lite version of Android 3.0 that doesn’t support multitasking? Not every user needs it and lower-end phones would appreciate it
Is there anything more stable than the linux kernel? brainwashed by apple?
3. Swype
Google, your Android keyboard sucks. That’s why the fine folks at Swype Inc developed their product. Sure, some of the newer Android phones like the Droid X are releasing with it built in, but it would be a boon for the OS to come packaged with this software.
It does not suck. Again the door is open to install any number of keyboards and choose!
4. IR- sender support
On the hardware side of things, an IR-sender support is a “duh.” Imagine a next generation of remotes running on Android. Better yet, how would you like to control your lights and home-entertainment center with your phone without the sometimes-complicated mess of configuring through a network?
heard of Google TV? You can control it using the network/wifi. An IR sender would be nice and geeky, but not required in a phone.
5. Universal pinch-to-zoom
Some apps have it. Some apps don’t. C’mon, this should be standard by now.
(and again) The OS supports it. Apps that need it can incorporate it.
6. Folders
Google, you copied iOS’s homescreen UI, why not do it again? Many of users have outgrown their limited pages and would like a way to add some organization to their mobile lives.
thats a nice big rock you got there
7. SD-Card support for app-storage
If users are going to download a ton of apps from the Android Market, they need somewhere to put them. Users with rooted phones can already do this, but expandable storage should be standard in app-filled world with insatiable memory lust.
thats a nice big rock you got there
8. Built-in syncing
If the Android is going to succeed as a user-friendly platform, it needs to make it easy for people to add their music, photos, and video to their phones. It’s simple Google. Develop some web-based software and launch it as a beta. You do it for everything else…
best sync in the industry. No need to isntall iToons bloatware. More anti-google statements. Their betas are excellent!
9. Standardized UI for all apps
I’m all for artistic interpretation, but the reason so many functional apps get low scores is because they work differently than the rest of the OS. Once again, do what Apple did and come up with better UI guidelines.
The default UI is standardized, the SDK provides so much scope for customizing . If you want a shiny UI wait for gingerbread.
10. Better market
Why can’t I queue downloads from the web? That would be awesome. How about a better way to navigate the store from my laptop? Despite the thousands of apps the Android Market hosts, it is stuck with the same problems as Apple’s iOS4. More importantly than any of the above, Google needs to innovate here. Change the way mobile markets work Google and you could win this war.
Desktop market browsing is about to be released. (get out from that rock and watch GoogleIO 2010). Downloads DO get queued

Windows Phone loosing momentum?

Am I alone when I fell like Windows Phone loosing momentum? I mean Windows Phone is starting to get boring with no major changes to the UI or functionality. I feel like all MS is doing it stringing us along with small updates but never giving us what we want for example we've been asking for the option to use custom tones for notification alerts like for MMS and SMS and still nothing, it's like they don't care what we have to say. Or the notification hub that a lot of people want, ability to create custom theme colors for tiles and I can go on and on.
Another thing is at least to me it seems like they procrastinate on getting things done and then they rush to get it out at the very last minute and we get things like the Lumina 920 and the HTC X8 with their issues with rebooting and freezing and so on. I still have issues on my WP8 that I use to have on my WP7 device, for example when trying to send an email at work with a pic attachment; it seems like it won't send because it doesn't recognize my email password even though it's correct.. I always end up having to delete my email account and recreate it for it to work!!!
Yea I know that WP8 is still young, bla, bla, bla... Well that's my lil rant; I'm sure that there is a lot of you out there that have similar opinions with either the lack of functionality or other problems with the phone and some that are just plain happy with whatever MS dictates that you need or not. If MS says you don't need custom ringtones or MMS or cut and paste some people just agree with them but not me, all I'm asking is for simple / common functions and options that have been around since like Windows Mobile.

I agree with the custom notifications stuff. The built in tones are awful.
I never had any issues with emails and pictures.This is most likely a problem from the email service provider rather than the phone itself.
WP needs more APIs so that developers can actually develop something creative. DirectX and C++ are not enough, and they can only be used for games anyway.

It still has momentum as regards the development of the operating system.
It is just starting from a bad position.
WP7 had a huge number of basic features missing.
WP8 has probably halved this list or better.
With the "blue" update I am expecting WP8 to have all the basic features in place.
If there is compatibility with Windows RT apps that implies big improvements to the Windows Phone APIs.

I don't know how it can be 'loosing momentum'.
WP8 is barely 3 months old...
All this comparison with the Android and iPhone platforms really annoys me. Those particular platforms have been around for years and years, hence the thousands and thousands of apps.
WP is easily the best and most modern mobile OS out there. That includes the 'new' BB OS (which looks like Android to me).
The tweaks to the OS WILL come. Be patient.
I loved my WP7 Omnia 7, and I love my WP8 Lumia 920. Slick and great to use.
If you want customization options galore, then get an Android device...

sinister1 said:
Am I alone when I fell like Windows Phone loosing momentum?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I doubt it, be patient. And if it is in the US, it's not elsewhere. Elsewhere it's only starting. iPhone is so outdated and android is beta, apps keep crashing. Windows Phone is quality.

Looking at my Apps Download numbers it doesn't look like it's losing Momentum in the Marketplace. When WP8 arrived, the numbers increased from 1000 - 2000 Downloads/day to 5000-6000 and have been in that range pretty much ever since. To me at least that looks like a pretty steady influx of users. Especially given that I didn't see a slow-down after christmas sales.
On the API front a lot of stuff was added in WP8. I admit that there are still holes that developers who were part of the early access programm (Windows Phone SDK) have communicated to Microsoft. Still lots of things developers were asking for are now there. Native code perhaps was the biggest part of it (and most requested I guess) and they also have the native APIs looking very similar to WinRT. They will have to bring this to the Managed side as well and it will be interesting to see how they fare in that regard.
Native code does not only provide for easier porting of games but also allows better and faster image and audio processing which some Apps require to make sense on a mobile device, although I don't know too many that take advantage of that.
The ability to integrate Tell Me into Third Party Apps is one of the coolest features they built into WP8 but I have to admit that it has rarely been used so far and not in the best implementations. Bluetooth APIs have also been added which as well was a rather glaring omission in WP7. The ability of Apps to start other Apps or to launch documents in other Apps that support the file type was also added but again: there are not that many Apps supporting it right now. Offline mapping functionality is now available to Apps which to my knowledge similar to the system speech engine integration is also something that currently isn't available on competing platforms.
To cut it short: quite a lot changed under the covers. Not everything people would have wished for has happened but the platform has become a lot more capable. But, it hasn't been available for most developers until launch and doing interesting stuff based on the new features takes time. We've currently mostly seen early adoptions of new features into existing Apps. New concepts have not arrived but I'm pretty sure people have Apps in development that will take advantage of what was added.
Where you are correct is that there are some pretty annoying omissions in improving certain built in features. It starts with custom notification sounds (which should not be to hard to do based on how it was implemented in WP7 homebrew software and continues on in new features that didn't go quite far enough. BitLocker is there but can only be enabled using an Exchange-Servers Security Policies. PDFs are now displayed in the Office Hub but can't be stored there from the Internet or when received through an E-Mail. They'll have to work those kinks out because I honestly believe: there are not that many really big functionality gaps in the OS by now but many, many annoyances that add up.

I think that now that BlackBerry is back in the game, EVERYONE is going to have to step up. I was cleaning and came across my old phones, right now I'm looking at a Nokia Lumia 810, an HD7, a TP2, and an HD2....Microsoft needs to stick with something instead of constantly abandoning things...hell, I have 2 years of Zune content that I can't use on my new phone.
Sent from the fetal position using XDA Windows Phone 7 App

StevieBallz said:
Looking at my Apps Download numbers it doesn't look like it's losing Momentum in the Marketplace. When WP8 arrived, the numbers increased from 1000 - 2000 Downloads/day to 5000-6000 and have been in that range pretty much ever since. To me at least that looks like a pretty steady influx of users. Especially given that I didn't see a slow-down after christmas sales.
On the API front a lot of stuff was added in WP8. I admit that there are still holes that developers who were part of the early access programm (Windows Phone SDK) have communicated to Microsoft. Still lots of things developers were asking for are now there. Native code perhaps was the biggest part of it (and most requested I guess) and they also have the native APIs looking very similar to WinRT. They will have to bring this to the Managed side as well and it will be interesting to see how they fare in that regard.
Native code does not only provide for easier porting of games but also allows better and faster image and audio processing which some Apps require to make sense on a mobile device, although I don't know too many that take advantage of that.
The ability to integrate Tell Me into Third Party Apps is one of the coolest features they built into WP8 but I have to admit that it has rarely been used so far and not in the best implementations. Bluetooth APIs have also been added which as well was a rather glaring omission in WP7. The ability of Apps to start other Apps or to launch documents in other Apps that support the file type was also added but again: there are not that many Apps supporting it right now. Offline mapping functionality is now available to Apps which to my knowledge similar to the system speech engine integration is also something that currently isn't available on competing platforms.
To cut it short: quite a lot changed under the covers. Not everything people would have wished for has happened but the platform has become a lot more capable. But, it hasn't been available for most developers until launch and doing interesting stuff based on the new features takes time. We've currently mostly seen early adoptions of new features into existing Apps. New concepts have not arrived but I'm pretty sure people have Apps in development that will take advantage of what was added.
Where you are correct is that there are some pretty annoying omissions in improving certain built in features. It starts with custom notification sounds (which should not be to hard to do based on how it was implemented in WP7 homebrew software and continues on in new features that didn't go quite far enough. BitLocker is there but can only be enabled using an Exchange-Servers Security Policies. PDFs are now displayed in the Office Hub but can't be stored there from the Internet or when received through an E-Mail. They'll have to work those kinks out because I honestly believe: there are not that many really big functionality gaps in the OS by now but many, many annoyances that add up.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I may have misunderstood you-
but are you saying that one particular app is getting 5000-6000 downloads, per day, on wp8 devices ?

Must be one heck of an app. Frankly I haven't found one great one, yet.

Yes, 1 App 5000-6000 downloads / day. Although it's WP7 AND WP8. I have never bothered to find out if I can filter the data to see WP7 and WP8 separately. And as for it being good: it seems to do what lots of people want it to do although I actually do believe myself that for some an alternative App might be better. I always tried to keep it simple and not overload it with too many features. Other developers of similar Apps have done it differently.
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I've attached the download chart from 1st of September to mid of February as it is provided in the Dev Cenetr. The left scale shows daily Downloads (purple line), the right scale displays total Downloads (black line) just passed the 1.4 Million Download mark).As you can see there have been 664 000 Downloads in that timeframe.

StevieBallz said:
Yes, 1 App 5000-6000 downloads / day. Although it's WP7 AND WP8. I have never bothered to find out if I can filter the data to see WP7 and WP8 separately. And as for it being good: it seems to do what lots of people want it to do although I actually do believe myself that for some an alternative App might be better. I always tried to keep it simple and not overload it with too many features. Other developers of similar Apps have done it differently.
View attachment 1740415
I've attached the download chart from 1st of September to mid of February as it is provided in the Dev Cenetr. The left scale shows daily Downloads (purple line), the right scale displays total Downloads (black line) just passed the 1.4 Million Download mark).As you can see there have been 664 000 Downloads in that timeframe.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What's the name so we can try it out?
Paid or free? Doesn't matter I'm willing to support.

Connectivity Shortcuts - has been free for most of it's life but I added Ads some months back. I believe it is still getting the fine Download numbers due to the fact of it being one of the first two Shortcut Apps. I'm pretty sure you'll have tried out one of them and that being said: most of them are quite trivial in idea and implementation (so I would guess you will stand by your finding of no nice Apps). But this is getting pretty much Offtopic.
Posting the chart motivated me to look through the more detailed data. I still can't tell WP7 and WP8 apart but according to that sales have scaled back following Christmas in countries like the US or Germany (which kind of is expected given strong holiday sales). The sustained influx of users seems to come from countries where newer devices are still being launched. That spike you can see in mid-January was 4000 sales in China on a single day although I have no idea as to what happened that day (it wasn't the Lumia 920 launch - I looked it up and that was in mid-December).
In the end I believe that my Download data is kinda similar to the Facebook-Metric that several blogs have employed to calculate WP growth due to the fact that the App is part of Microsoft's collection for productivity and is also being featured in Nokia's App Highlights-App. Still this in no way yields us definitive data on how WP is doing but given how the chart reacted to some of the events in WP's life it seems we can still draw some conclussions based on that data.

StevieBallz said:
Connectivity Shortcuts - has been free for most of it's life but I added Ads some months back. I believe it is still getting the fine Download numbers due to the fact of it being one of the first two Shortcut Apps. I'm pretty sure you'll have tried out one of them and that being said: most of them are quite trivial in idea and implementation (so I would guess you will stand by your finding of no nice Apps). But this is getting pretty much Offtopic.
Posting the chart motivated me to look through the more detailed data. I still can't tell WP7 and WP8 apart but according to that sales have scaled back following Christmas in countries like the US or Germany (which kind of is expected given strong holiday sales). The sustained influx of users seems to come from countries where newer devices are still being launched. That spike you can see in mid-January was 4000 sales in China on a single day although I have no idea as to what happened that day (it wasn't the Lumia 920 launch - I looked it up and that was in mid-December).
In the end I believe that my Download data is kinda similar to the Facebook-Metric that several blogs have employed to calculate WP growth due to the fact that the App is part of Microsoft's collection for productivity and is also being featured in Nokia's App Highlights-App. Still this in no way yields us definitive data on how WP is doing but given how the chart reacted to some of the events in WP's life it seems we can still draw some conclussions based on that data.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok now I see why you have so many downloads. One of the most useful apps on the platform.

Enough chaps, no need to make posts personal attacks.
Sent from my Arc using xda app-developers app

I feel more like a disappointed by the WP8 release.
It just feels like a Windows Mobile 2003/5/6 all over again! Where Microsoft overpromised and underdelivered. Where every new major release added very little on the table, and where iPhone added a whole set of new experiences.
I didn't really buy the whole "locked" device for your own good bull****, as you are not "root". I like the Windows Mobile custom builds that improved your experience or even fixed some bugs.
In a sense, the "spirit" of the Windows Mobile (chaos), moved to the Android. There is all sorts of custom builds and apps.
With the recent release of Android 4.2, that improves the animation speed (makes it as smooth as WP), there is no good reason, not to update.
I gave it a chance... it did not lived up to it.

There's an awful lot to say about that post my friend! The changes from 2003 to 5 were massive though, both on the surface and under the hood, 5 to 6 was more like a refinement, what was to come after 6.5 was wrong though, it flew in the face of what was happening with IOS ad android and I for one am glade it got caned. WP isnt supposed to be compared to the others, its different an for good reason, I will admit that the security side is the only reason I haven't got a Wp8 device, but WP7s security (interop unlocked) with root tools is the clear answer to the problem but....
Sent from my SGH-i937 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
---------- Post added at 09:47 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:38 AM ----------
.... As to what made wm good, well again your right, it was the customization factor, it was and still is the best OS pocket PC platform out there, but the sales model was never going to work, and android is starting to see the effect too, MS made the core platform, sent it to OEMs who pissed all over it, it then got sent to the networks who all took a giant dump on it, we ended up with slow, bloated devices with no drivers to support the hardware and MS shouldered the blame! The proof of what wm could have been is here in the real roots of xda dev, what was still lacking from our custom roms was developed drivers that made use of the device. All those android lot may think they are all jazzy and new but wm had similar skins decades ago lol, it just needed some TLC!
Sent from my SGH-i937 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App

dazza9075 said:
There's an awful lot to say about that post my friend! The changes from 2003 to 5 were massive though, both on the surface and under the hood, 5 to 6 was more like a refinement, what was to come after 6.5 was wrong though, it flew in the face of what was happening with IOS ad android and I for one am glade it got caned. WP isnt supposed to be compared to the others, its different an for good reason, I will admit that the security side is the only reason I haven't got a Wp8 device, but WP7s security (interop unlocked) with root tools is the clear answer to the problem but....
Sent from my SGH-i937 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
---------- Post added at 09:47 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:38 AM ----------
.... As to what made wm good, well again your right, it was the customization factor, it was and still is the best OS pocket PC platform out there, but the sales model was never going to work, and android is starting to see the effect too, MS made the core platform, sent it to OEMs who pissed all over it, it then got sent to the networks who all took a giant dump on it, we ended up with slow, bloated devices with no drivers to support the hardware and MS shouldered the blame! The proof of what wm could have been is here in the real roots of xda dev, what was still lacking from our custom roms was developed drivers that made use of the device. All those android lot may think they are all jazzy and new but wm had similar skins decades ago lol, it just needed some TLC!
Sent from my SGH-i937 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
history, repeating?
but then there are the wonderful custom roms. you remember your favorites from wm, they're reincarnated with better hardware (touch screens rock now!) and more mobile centric applications.
the deficiencies of wp8 don't have custom roms to supplement (or did i miss them, sorry) - so what is the natural progression for folks who want a little more of this or that ?
the next step for wp is __________ ?

we can all blame Apple, really, for being so creative..
but more accurately, we can blame HTC for abandoning all of its WinMob users to try and copy the iPhone
but more specifically, we can blame the uncreative doofs at Microcrap for trying to copy the above two companies
or more directly we can blame all the little braindead users out there who think their phones need to be swiped
what is with that swiping crap? its lamest thing i've every done in my entire life.
do you really need to swipe everything? is that really the main purpose of you owning a phone?
because all i'm seeing is different ways to swipe things... and thats because users are apparently so shallow and pathetic, that the best thing they can do with their phone is be seen by others swiping it
and to be extra 1337, they dream of being able to swipe it in some different direction than other people
but really.. lets analyze whats happening.. take away the swiping, and what are they doing? the most useless crap ever to have existed on the face of the planet.. thats what
really?
its like planet of the living braindead around here..
i dont need a phone that matches my haircut, piercings, butterfly tattoos, & painted nails..
and no, no matter how i'm swiping, i'm not going to believe i'm hip, fashionable, advanced, or the slightest bit interesting
screw your swiping.. why dont you make my phone useful & productive, instead.. how about that?

The whole point of this forum is to make our devices better, and share our knowledge about how to do so. This thread does not do that, and does not bring anything positive whatsoever. In fact, this is purely a rant thread, and with that in mind I'm going to close it. Discussion is one thing, but there's nothing positive to be had here.
Thread closed.

Thinking of replacing my Note with a windows tablet...

Probably stupid to even suggest this on the note forum, but thought I'd share my feelings of the Note anyway. I had the original Note and thought it was wonderful. It literally changed how I go to school. Once I used to have a twenty pound bag filled with books and notebooks, but now I have one device that I use for ebooks and note taking. It worked so well that once the new note was released, I upgraded. I'm now wishing I applied that money towards a Windows tablet. Don't get me wrong, the Note still rocks at what it does....most of the time. I do find that it can be rather finicky with certain things, but overall it takes notes well. Which is primarily what I use it for. (I have a GPad 8.3 for ebooks now) Once I get home I find that the Note sits in my bag and I pick up my Zenbook Prime for browsing and using full on desktop apps like spotify. I just don't use the note for anything but Note taking. Thats an expensive Notebook! Plus, I've heard tons of great things about Onenote and have seen youtube videos showcasing its awesomeness. And if I really really wanted lecture notes, couldn't I run it via bluestacks? Essentially getting a windows and android tablet in one? Of course everyones needs are different, and I never thought I'd see the day when I'd be a potential windows defector, but am seriously impressed by the slew of tablets pouring out of their camp. I am a die hard android fan ever since my OG Droid, but I just can't help but see the shortcomings of the android OS. I'll never go windows phone, but as far as tablets go.... I think Micro$oft is onto something....Plus Chrome for desktop rocks way more than the mobile version.
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Please don't hate me

Totally agree

supremekizzle said:
I'll never go windows phone, but as far as tablets go.... I think Micro$oft is onto something....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Windows and tablets are kind of an oxymoron. The fate of RT is unknown and with the inability to run legacy Windows apps it's pretty barren from a content perspective. The Modern touch UI is pretty much a failure with MS admitting it by bringing back the start button and allowing the desktop to boot to a standard Windows desktop. I use my N10.1-14 as a laptop supplement. I'll travel with it about half the time when I know I'm not going to be doing heavy duty MS Office editing and creation. If I am, I'll bring my 13" ultra book. Which, even though it's light, is twice as large and three times as heavy to carry when you add-in its accessories. Between RDP, Hancom Office, and a BT mouse/keyboard the N10.1-14 is a fantastic laptop supplement. But I can't imagine using it (or any Android tablet) as a true laptop replacement. For that matter, Windows Pro tablets don't really offer anything that more than an ultra book does so to choose between them I'd pick the latter. Android and iOS are the kings of consumption. Windows tablets (not the RT's) are the kings of productivity. You compromise productivity on Android/iOS and compromise consumption on Windows. So where someone is on the consumption/productivity spectrum and what they're willing to compromise determines which is the better choice for them.
When I'm traveling, especially overseas, consumption, battery life, and portability are important. Windows tablets are pretty poor in all three categories. My whole set-up fits in this bag. Carrying a Windows tablet and all its kit is the same as carrying a laptop.
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To me, this is a non-starter...
As for Lecture Notes<>OneNote<>S Note I used OneNote for years. It's far from optimized for handwriting. Since Samsung introduced S Note for Windows and introduced handwriting search in to S Finder I pretty much always use S Note unless I'm collaborating with folks on MS Office in which case I'll use OneNote. A lot of friends and associates have Samsung Note's though and we'll collaborate using S Note.
No two people here do the same things consumption and productivity wise nor have the same priorities. So it's all really just some interesting discussion.

BarryH_GEG said:
Windows and tablets are kind of an oxymoron. The fate of RT is unknown and with the inability to run legacy Windows apps it's pretty barren from a content perspective. The Modern touch UI is pretty much a failure with MS admitting it by bringing back the start button and allowing the desktop to boot to a standard Windows desktop. I use my N10.1-14 as a laptop supplement. I'll travel with it about half the time when I know I'm not going to be doing heavy duty MS Office editing and creation. If I am, I'll bring my 13" ultra book. Which, even though it's light, is twice as large and three times as heavy to carry when you add-in its accessories. Between RDP, Hancom Office, and a BT mouse/keyboard the N10.1-14 is a fantastic laptop supplement. But I can't imagine using it (or any Android tablet) as a true laptop replacement. For that matter, Windows Pro tablets don't really offer anything that more than an ultra book does so to choose between them I'd pick the latter. Android and iOS are the kings of consumption. Windows tablets (not the RT's) are the kings of productivity. You compromise productivity on Android/iOS and compromise consumption on Windows. So where someone is on the consumption/productivity spectrum and what they're willing to compromise determines which is the better choice for them.
When I'm traveling, especially overseas, consumption, battery life, and portability are important. Windows tablets are pretty poor in all three categories. My whole set-up fits in this bag. Carrying a Windows tablet and all its kit is the same as carrying a laptop.
To me, this is a non-starter...
As for Lecture Notes<>OneNote<>S Note I used OneNote for years. It's far from optimized for handwriting. Since Samsung introduced S Note for Windows and introduced handwriting search in to S Finder I pretty much always use S Note unless I'm collaborating with folks on MS Office in which case I'll use OneNote. A lot of friends and associates have Samsung Note's though and we'll collaborate using S Note.
No two people here do the same things consumption and productivity wise nor have the same priorities. So it's all really just some interesting discussion.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Quite a setup you have. Have you seen the newly announced surface pro 3? Looks pretty sick.

I'm actually in the same situation as you as I find I'm more productive on a Windows machine. I tried using my tablet but always felt I could've done more work had I had my laptop with me. I'm quite impress with the Surface Pro 3, and it looks like it may be a potential buy.

Love that the cigarettes are a part of the essential accessories!
Sent from my Nexus 4 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

Zerogamer100 said:
I'm actually in the same situation as you as I find I'm more productive on a Windows machine. I tried using my tablet but always felt I could've done more work had I had my laptop with me. I'm quite impress with the Surface Pro 3, and it looks like it may be a potential buy.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Totally agree. I'd really like to know how lecture notes and other android apps run on bluestacks with a pen. With google drive and chrome apps available on windows, I'm really starting to question my need to have the Note. It kind of feels like a toy now. Plus, spotify, word, and other full on PC programs available, why use two devices when I can consolidate to one? The only thing about the Surface Pro 3 is the price. Woof, that bad boy is spendy...

Just remember that Microsoft tablets require a good antivirus to be installed since it's the same is as the desktop. Android doesn't have that problem. It is very possible to replace with does with android though. I replaced my Windows 8 laptop with the note and haven't looked back or over 4 months. I can do everything I Need to do on this, and I'm an IT person.
Sent from my SM-P600 using Tapatalk

Looks like nobody used and heard about Asus T100ta.
It replaced my laptop, desktop and tablets(Ipad and nexus).
Why..How..
It does everything a laptop will do with full windows 8. I hardly use any apps. Browser is good enough for me. When I want bigger screen, I just widi into my TV. 60" is always better then 13" laptop screen. I can watch movies on one screen and work on other no problem.
Bought couple of USB hub with ethernet from amazon and used that to configure 3 hotels network using this little bad boy.
Battery is solid 8-9 hours watching videos or document editing, No thinking about what format should i convert it to like ipad. Stand by time is amazing.
You will think why am I here then?? For my 3 year. Her ipad1 backlight gone and T100 is not for kids .
I'm done with Apple and Like samsung thanks to xda developers as it is easier to work on and flexibility it's products provide.

The recently announced Surface pro 3 really ups the ante in terms of making Windows tablets attractive. I'd like to see more of the new pen, first, but no doubt that OneNote is well built and useful.
The problem in my view is still weight, battery life, portability. When I carry the note (or a tablet) around, it's so I don't have to carry a laptop. I can't do all I want on a note, but on the road, on the go, it does enough so I can avoid carrying a laptop. But a surface pro 3 is still near double the weight of a note, more with the type cover, and less battery life, and again heavier with a charger too.
Basically, Surface pro 3 is still first a laptop replacement (as the comparison with the MacBook air made), not a tablet/note replacement, for me. I am still looking for the ultimate note taking tablet that can also be my mobile ebook reader and web browser and the note still is the closest there is for me.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

graewulf1 said:
Just remember that Microsoft tablets require a good antivirus to be installed since it's the same is as the desktop. Android doesn't have that problem. It is very possible to replace with does with android though. I replaced my Windows 8 laptop with the note and haven't looked back or over 4 months. I can do everything I Need to do on this, and I'm an IT person.
Sent from my SM-P600 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
An IT person that thinks Android does not have any opportunity for malware? Must be on par with the IT folks where I work.
Back on topic, if Google continues to nerf Android (like the KK SD bug that must be there to make the Nexus more competitive with the alternatives with SD cards) the Windows alternatives will continue to look better and better.

Surface Pro 3 was released.....
with a massive price

I agree on the price and love the specs. I have the Note 10.1-14 in a Poetic Bluetooth keyboard case with a mouse pad and Bluetooth mouse. It does real will, though there are times a Windows laptop cannot be beat. Goodness, that thing is expensive.
Sent via my Note 8

WJThomas said:
An IT person that thinks Android does not have any opportunity for malware? Must be on par with the IT folks where I work.
Back on topic, if Google continues to nerf Android (like the KK SD bug that must be there to make the Nexus more competitive with the alternatives with SD cards) the Windows alternatives will continue to look better and better.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I said anti-virus, not anti-Malware. Two entirely different things. Microsoft has a proven track record of being open to viruses and malware installing themselves. On Windows either can install itself without user interaction. Since android is Linux based, both require the user to install them to get into the system. Installing apps from reliable sources almost ensures a virus and malware free android system. Infected websites and emails cannot infect android without the user's permission, the same is not true on Windows. This is why I said a good antivirus is required on Windows tablets. It's optional on android.
If you want to bash android, take it to a Windows forum. This is an android tablet forum.
Sent from my SM-P600 using Tapatalk

graewulf1 said:
I said anti-virus, not anti-Malware. Two entirely different things.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Splitting hairs a bit there. The industry commonly lumps all malware together and the combined anti-malware software is called antih-virus.
graewulf1;5u2842009 said:
If you want to bash android, tjake it to a Windows forum. This is an android tablet forum.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Who is bashing Android? I am a big Android fan. I am bashing Google for their anti-user and anti-competition polices. They are starting to turn into an Apple/Microsoft. The removal of the SD card write access is the beginning of the end. I just hope the community will be able to overcome Google and keep Android a viable alternative.

Back on topic...
There's a good conversation going on in the N12 forum discussing the Note/Pro's vs. the SP3.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=52847377

I upgrade from an old windows tablet the hp 2730p elite notebook to the sm-p600. I had windows tablet was designed for windows xp but I had 7 installed with 3gb of ram 60gb hard drive and that this new android tablet was better in every way except for storage space which can easily be remedied with a memory card.
Productivity wise the note 10.1 I would say is better in my experience especially since I have a spare wacom pen from my windows tablet that has the eraser on the back end that works perfectly with the note 10.1. Coding is a bit more difficult but I usually just remote desktop to my main pc and run Visual Studios. I have an otg cable with a usb hub for a hardware mouse and keyboard but haven't found a way to have the right mouse button in android to work as one instead of the back key.
Media wise the note 10.1 is better than my old windows tablet little to no lag full hd support and all that and hdmi out beats svideo out.
Gaming wise this is where I would consider upgrading to a windows tablet. As old as my hp 2730p notebook was I could still play minecraft (min settings 15fps), World of Warcraft (min settings windowed mode only 10fps) but at least Terraria played at a decent framerate 25fps+. On the note you have android ports of Minecraft and Terraria with touch controls in mind and being incompatible with the pc version. I would love something like http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2209247 for the sm-p600. I have toyed with LinuxOnAndroid and hoping they make progress with a native gui vs vnc. Hell I would even dual boot with windows if I could.
Don't get me wrong there are great android games out there and the humble mobile bundles help but it seems like the good ports or versions are still on the iphone/ipad and android users are left with inferior products. Chu Chu Rockets for example has 1-4 player multiplayer support through bluetooth wifi and gamecenter and on the ipad 4 players can share one screen. So far on the android port multiplayer consists of 1 human and 3 cpus.
I have a few unrelated Samsung gripes with the note and I am not sure what I would upgrade to in the future.

urtruelove78 said:
Looks like nobody used and heard about Asus T100ta.
It replaced my laptop, desktop and tablets(Ipad and nexus).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Resurrecting an older thread, I know, but I just picked up an Asus Transformer T100ta new and factory sealed for $250 (from Amazon.com). It's running the full desktop version of Windows 8.1 (32-bit), 64GB SSD, 2 GB RAM, keyboard/mouse dock with a USB 3.0 port, HDMI out, micro SD slot (with no limitations on what can be stored/installed/accessed), charges with a standard micro USB phone charger, has the Intel Atom Z3775 processor, 11 hour battery life, and it includes Office 2013. My kids are playing Steam games on it, Minecraft, Halo 1 & 2, etc. These aren't just HD phone games like what's available for the iPad and Android tablets...these are the real deal. I'm also running a real photo editor and desktop versions of browsers, not to mention real Office.
And this device was released in October 2013 -- rapidly approaching 2 years ago. Meanwhile, our Note 10.1 2014 doesn't even have Lollipop yet. I can't even update my tablet with the recent incremental Kitkat update because it fails and says my tablet has been modified simply because it's rooted (with a completely stock ROM and stock recovery). Did I have to root it? No, of course not...but I had to root it if I wanted open access to the SD card after the KitKat update. Not to mention wanting to do the crazy thing of, y'know, backing up my apps and data (I know, it's a lot to ask, but....). I don't have to worry about rooting the Transformer tablet. And Windows 10 is already working on this device and is a free update.
I'm really a big fan of Android and have been since the early days, but it's gotten to the point where I feel it's only really good for use on phones. With being able to load the full desktop version of Windows 8.1 or even Windows 10 on a tablet the same size, I just don't really see the purpose for Android tablets anymore.
graewulf1 said:
Just remember that Microsoft tablets require a good antivirus to be installed since it's the same is as the desktop. Android doesn't have that problem. It is very possible to replace with does with android though. I replaced my Windows 8 laptop with the note and haven't looked back or over 4 months. I can do everything I Need to do on this, and I'm an IT person.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Windows 8.1 includes anti-virus through Windows Defender. That's all I'm running on two Windows 8.1 devices in my house, and on the three Windows 7 machines I"m running...ready? Nothing. You don't get viruses or malware if you know what you're doing, especially if you setup your network and workstations securely. I've been a network engineer for over 25 years, so I don't buy into all the virus/malware hype that non-techs do. No, you can't have that philosophy in the corporate environment, because there are too many unknowledgeable users that are the weak link, but you can definitely (and easily) do that with a home network, and especially a personal tablet.

internetpilot said:
Windows 8.1 includes anti-virus through Windows Defender. That's all I'm running on two Windows 8.1 devices in my house, and on the three Windows 7 machines I"m running...ready? Nothing. You don't get viruses or malware if you know what you're doing, especially if you setup your network and workstations securely. I've been a network engineer for over 25 years, so I don't buy into all the virus/malware hype that non-techs do. No, you can't have that philosophy in the corporate environment, because there are too many unknowledgeable users that are the weak link, but you can definitely (and easily) do that with a home network, and especially a personal tablet.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I concur. As long as you 1) know what you are doing (not running random downloaded exe files), 2) keep system updated, 3) connect to internet that is behind NAT (meaning you always connect via WiFi or router) you should be fine. I use Ubuntu mostly but all my Windows installations have been running nothing beside the default Windows Defenders for years without any issue. In the times of Windows XP it was much more risky though.

not looking back
I retired my note 10.1 2014 for a surface pro 3 and will never look back. Superior quality and functionality.(and im a huge samsung fan) just could not take all the manufacturing flaws anymore