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Greetings,
I am from germany and new on this forum, though I keep peeking in here for quite some time now and today is the time, where I believe I should post my very own impressions about the HTC Prophet.
I was using my old S25 (Siemens) cell for nearly 6 years now and since today I was quite happy about it. It was functional, worked, never let me hung and still works fine (I only changed the service provider to go for the HTC Prophet and let the contract for it run out).
At my new job I met a bunch of people who had that HTC Magician. They primarily bought it for the same reasons as most of us. It was a small device, had PocketPC capabilities, you could listen to sound files, watch movies, navigation, phoning and keeping contacts.
Sadly my reality looks quite differently than I initially had in mind. After some real life scenarios I realized that going for this smartphone was a big and really expensive mistake and I start to regret it now.
I also have a good history of PDA's and PocketPC's (Palm, Casio E125 etc.).
Problems that I have with the HTC Prophet (That I initially never thought about).
Speaker on the back side is the most supid thing that I ever have seen. Sure once you see these little machines you don't think about any problems that it might have.
You get it demonstrated by your colleagues and you see that it's an awesome device (on the first looks). But that thing is simply too silent. Sure loudness is quite a subjective thing and everyone of us hear differently.
But the HTC Prophet with its speaker on the back side is silent. In real life scenarios that thing is either laying on the table (where the speaker will be hidden by the table plate) or laying on a book or on a surface that keeps hiding the speaker. Or you keep carrying it around in that belt case that you receive with that thing. It's too silent.
I was on a trade show not long ago and I kept carrying that thing in that black belt case around my belt. With a smoking jacket around it. The trade show was well visited and therefore quite noisy (not loud but similar as if you go into the mensa at university). The thing is I kept missing one call after another, needless to say that I missed all SMS or schedules that my kalendar kept. I started to look at it at random times only to notices whether I missed something or if new SMS arrived.
A coleague of mine had another smartphone WM5 device carrying around with him, that thing otoh was quite loud. It yelled around that even I could realize it even meters ahead. Also the speaker, microphone and earspeaker was quite boosted.
Then at night during that few days trade show I slept in a motel where I used that device as a alarm clock. It was silent. Luckely I had a quite nervous sleep so I was able to wake up correctly in the morning but the alarm was quite silent. You've been able to hear it but not if you had a well sleep.
Earphone and Microphone. I have big issues listening to the person on the other end and the person has issues listening to my voice and the normal conversation goes on in multiple "pardon can you repeat" sentences. Specailly if you leave the office to go outside on the street for talk (so your colleagues don't need to follow your private conversation) it's even worse. I need to stick a finger in my other ear only to hear the person on the other end.
I think this is quite inacceptable for a device that is sold primary as "phone". I must say that I have the original rom on it, it's as I received it from this german company with the one letter and one number. With all the junk and stuff on it. Nothing touched, it's maximum loud, nothing flashed - as is.
Now a few days ago I went to another colleague of mine and compared his HTC Magician with my HTC Prophet. We set the devices to maximum loudness and played this "alouette.mid" file at the same time. His HTC Magician was drowning my HTC Prophet in all aspects. It was noticable louder than my HTC Prophet. It had better speakers and microphone. Sure it has the speaker on the backside as well but both devices were on the table head at head and his one nearly lifted off of the table while mine was silently sitting there playing "alouette.mid".
I mean, my old Siemens S25 was loud, I was able to hear it even outside of the office room on the floor, or in the kitchen (to jump back to it to pick it up) but this thing (the HTC Prophet) can't be left out of sight. If you move away more than a few meters in a silent office building then you keep missing everything.
I really don't know how this thing can be sold as phone. It misses any quality assurance during manufacturing. From that stupid backside speaker till any real life scenarios. It's more or less a play toy for geeks but rarely something for people doing business or need to keep schedules.
Otherwise that device is quite ok. Sure it has a slow CPU (yes it is slow. There was a few articles I read where people keep saying that it's not slow and that everyone who tells that it's slow are ignorants or something) but take my word. It's slow but it's ok for a phone. It's not the biggest problem since it works smoothly enough as PocketPC for adresses etc.
I started to dig around on many forums after I realized some of the problems on my own and realized that a lot of people complained about silent speakers and microphones and I must confirm this. There are many other problems with that device as well like speaker breaking quickly or the pluging jack for the headphones. I can not confirm this but I bet my pants that these issues are there for real.
I also realized (like on most forums) that people seem to be doing nothing else with it than flashing random XYZ kind of roms onto it in hope something changes (what, most people don't know either - so my impressions - and a few seem to have bricked their devices as well). But can this be ? Can this be the purpose of this device ? To flash it because it sucks in all other aspects ? People who hope to get a new rom version with news inside it, other people who hope that it boots faster (works faster) or whatever their aim is.
But for business people who only want to use the device to keep their contacts, get in touch with people, receive notices and keep schedules it's just a waste.
I started complaining to the new service provider and hope that they're going to replace that device with something that works. No play toy or something. I changed from my old service provider to the new one only for this smartphone and now I regret it. They already informed me that they are going to take it back and fine me what I have paid for it but this is not solving the problem. The problem is that I am stuck with a new contract and no phone to use or no suitable alternative to go. But taking it back without any complaints is just a sign that they might have received plenty of complaints from others.
Anyways that's so far all I have to say. I was new here before I bought the HTC Prophet and I really hope that my little review could help the one or other in making his decisions. Before you blindly jump in buying this HTC Prophet be sure that you go and inform yourself on all kind of forums and news sites. The HTC Prophet is a nice machine - no doubt - but it's useless in a couple of areas and one of them is phoning and getting notices (speaker). This is a big no go for me.
greetings,
Spatzm
I really like my Prophet.
Yes the rear speaker is a problem but it's the only problem. Just wait till it stops working completely. There is a workaround for this. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=281331
Also, yes it was a bit slow but a helpful chap called Ikarus produced an excellent overclock utility which has really helped. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=270751
I will upgrade when the time comes though - maybe a Hermes or an Artemis.
I wrote quite a long post to explain in detail why I seem to disagree with you on almost every point you try to make. But I'd rather keep it short. (and I don't mean this in a nasty way, my experience is just totally different than your 'review')
Speaker: no problem at all for me. I mainly use it in loud areas. Also use it as alarm clock too and it's loud enough (believe me when I say I'm not a light sleeper). I do however use PocketZenPhone for my phone profiles (volume, call volume, ringtone stuff etc etc) and SPB Time (alarm clock).
Upgrading: Have a look on what forum you are here. Most people come here because they seem interested in upgrading the thing with a rom. For possible free extra's. Who doesn't want to have free extra's? (hell, why do people upgrade their computer, their software, their bios? Because it's all crap? I don't think so at all).
There are loads of phones on this forum, from your perspective they are all crap because people are trying to upgrade them? And yes, upgrading is difficult at times and if you do it wrong, you brick your device. Can't blame HTC for those people pusing the upgrade button...
But all with all, I'm sorry to see you are so dissapointed in your Prophet phone. Perhaps the thing just isn't your thing. And it doesn't meet up to your expectations.
For me the thing lived up all too good to my expectations and even more than that.
For me it's loud enough (maybe with the help of some programs I don't care) it's fast enough and even though I have been 100% happy with it all along I even upgraded it with a newer ROM.
I use it for phoning/smsing, calendar/appointments, adresses, car-navigation, games, watching movies, wireless internet etc. etc. and that all works flawlesly for me...
TheBrit said:
I really like my Prophet.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=281331
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=270751
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Thanks for providing these links. I'm a technican myself and am used to many pocketpc's and pda's back in the years. I also did development for those devices so I am skilled enough to know what to do.
But the primary point of mine is differently. My workday looks like this. Starting morning at 7:00 and come back at home around 20:30. A lot of traveling from A to B. Basicly a fulltime job. Now you might imagine that business people don't want to play around with their PDA.
They simply don't have time to do so. They expect that the device they bought "simply works". The terminoloy "simply works" means. You turn it on and you start working with it. There is no time and also no intentions to mess around with the hardware. Like opening it and fix what HTC had failed to solve on their own.
I am also aware of the overclocking utilities that exists but this can't be the point either. But as I said it's probably the last problem that I care for now.
I think that HTC miserabely failed with their products due to bad engineering and bad QS. I only hope that some of their engineers are reading this forum so they can think about the stuff they build.
Re My advise don't go for it - you'll regret it.
RaptorRVL said:
I wrote quite a long post to explain in detail why I seem to disagree with you on almost every point you try to make. But I'd rather keep it short. (and I don't mean this in a nasty way, my experience is just totally different than your 'review')
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Hello RaptorRVL, thanks for your reply. I really appreciate your feedback and I would like to raise a few further points to explain the situation.
First of all, not everyone is a technican. Most people don't know about Registry, they don't know about OmapClock, they also don't know howto flash ROM, they also don't know what AKU is.
They simply want to use the thing they paid money for. I have the feeling that you see everything as the expert kind of person that fully controls his device in all areas like knowing every DLL, knowing every Registry entry, knowing the hardware and much more. But you shouldn't forget those who bought a small device and who wants to use it. We are simply too busy with work rather than having all the time digging in all places to seek for answers where HTC has failed.
Speaker: no problem at all for me. I mainly use it in loud areas.
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But the speaker seems to be a problem by many other people. You only need to fire up Google and search for "HTC Prophet loud" or similar keywords. You can hear a lot of complaints about silent speakers, broken speakers, silent microphone or earphone, broken headphone jacks etc. You can even use search on the whole forum here and find similar complaints by others. I must admit that this is something I initially wasn't aware about but I wished someone would have told me before I was going for it.
And that's why I am here writing my second message on this forum to inform those new readers here who use this forum as a starting point to read about the pros and cons about the HTC Prophet.
Upgrading: Have a look on what forum you are here. Most people come here because they seem interested in upgrading the thing with a rom. For possible free extra's. Who doesn't want to have free extra's? (hell, why do people upgrade their computer, their software, their bios? Because it's all crap? I don't think so at all).
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Yes I am in the forum for general Prophet discussions. The one for Prophet upgrading is one further. This was also one of the first places that I came to before I bought my Prophet to inform myself about it from those who are already using it.
There are loads of phones on this forum, from your perspective they are all crap because people are trying to upgrade them? And yes, upgrading is difficult at times and if you do it wrong, you brick your device. Can't blame HTC for those people pusing the upgrade button...
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No! I was only refering to my HTC Prophet here which I had the chance to compare in real life scenarios on that trade show (noisy area), within the motel (as alarm clock), with the colleagues HTC Magician and with another colleagues HTC (dunno what it was called, it has a knob in the middle and looks more like a real phone).
I don't know whether other devices have similar issues but I think that HTC needs to get in here and do something. You only need to google for all the problems it have. There are plenty of forums existing outside and the more people buy one of these devices the more "similar" problem reports you receive.
If one person complains then this is probably a one time issue but if plenty of people start complaining about the same issues then there's something where HTC needs to fix.
You are right that you can not blame HTC for a bricked Prophet, but you can't blame the users either since they expect that a new updated ROM might solve the one or other problem they noticed.
But all with all, I'm sorry to see you are so dissapointed in your Prophet phone. Perhaps the thing just isn't your thing. And it doesn't meet up to your expectations.
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And here lays the problem. I can not know whether this device dissapoints me or not without having tried it out first. I didn't knew about all the hardware related issues. I also didn't put any weight into other peoples complaints for silent speakers and realize now that I better did pay attentions to it since it really is a huge problem.
Look I and probably others didn't buy it for playing or toying around with it (Random today screen tweaking, overclocking and rom flashing) we bought it for our serious daily needs. As sort of companion that helps doing our daily tasks, keeping schedules and do the thing it has to do. Inform us where our brain leaves us alone since we can not remember everything. Of course the OS side of it does the job but the hardware side is failing here due to weak components used.
I didn't read every word of every post, but I don't think you state which version of the Prophet you have. That said I have the Jamin with their latest ROM. I have no reason to play with other ROMs. Reliability is important for my usage.
To be honest I DON'T have the majority of the issues you seem to have. Specifically the front speaker is so loud that I have to set the volume to 50% to prevent hurting my hearing on normal phone calls. With respect to the rear speaker the volume is more that sufficient to use as an alarm clock.
The major issue that I have is the CPU performance in stock form is only just adequate. But remember static high clock rates translate into low battery endurance. I'm using Battery Status to perform automatic clock rate scaling and battery life is good or better than stock, while CPU performance is very good.
From reading I'm of the opinion that not all Prophets are created equal, but might be made so by flashing an alternative ROM.
Spatzm said:
Greetings,
I am from germany and new on this forum, though I keep peeking in here for quite some time now and today is the time, where I believe I should post my very own impressions about the HTC Prophet.
[snip]
greetings,
Spatzm
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but I don't think you state which version of the Prophet you have. That said I have the Jamin with their latest ROM. I have no reason to play with other ROMs. Reliability is important for my usage.
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Normally I would write something like "The user don't know anything about Prophet versions - he/she only uses it". But I have an XDA NEO - G4 and this one doesn't have a front speaker (only a really silent ear speaker).
To be honest I DON'T have the majority of the issues you seem to have.
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I have only one issue with it and not "majority" (which implies dozens of issues). The only issue I have is the weak components used for speaker, ear speaker and microphone.
From reading I'm of the opinion that not all Prophets are created equal, but might be made so by flashing an alternative ROM.
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Yes I have the impression myself now. But that shouldn't be the problem of the end users or customers. That's the big problem of HTC for implementing some sort of quality assurance.
I also doubt that flashing an alternative ROM (there is no official alternative ROM that guarantee fully functionality (but more on this later on) that will solve a hardware issue. Flashing a new ROM don't change the position of the speaker from the back side to the front side.
I also think you should start reading my replies more carefully to understand that not everyone has the time or the geek factor to flash "or want to flash" his Prophet to use it.
By front speaker I mean the speaker that used when the phone is on your ear.
I would comment that the Prophet is a platform and Jamin, XDA Neo, etc are products. In fact the user shouldn't even know or be concerned with the underlying platform. He should buy based upon the end user product's features and performance. Note that HTC doesn't necessary have to manufacture each product to identical specifications. And I say this from a OEM's perspective.
With regard to flashing various firmware and debugging a product one purchased, I only can agree with your position. My only point is that what issues you have doesn't necessary apply to all versions of the Prophet.
Dopod released a patch to increase volume. If your product doesn't have this fix (e.g. running the most current firmware) then I would be thinking about getting my money back or Ebay it if that is not possible.
Spatzm said:
Normally I would write something like "The user don't know anything about Prophet versions - he/she only uses it". But I have an XDA NEO - G4 and this one doesn't have a front speaker (only a really silent ear speaker).
I also think you should start reading my replies more carefully to understand that not everyone has the time or the geek factor to flash "or want to flash" his Prophet to use it.
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Silent but loud, slow but fast ?!
I share all comments claiming weakness of Prophet speakers and slowness of its processor and i'd read too much about these before buying one.
Anyways, many claims about the OMAP come from users who did not overclock. At 286mhz the baby is fast enough for me and no serious standby time shortening.
Coming to the speakers, using the oldphone ring, i find it loud enough. Of course there's always individual tastes and feelings. Mines are not so negative.
Finally, don't forget to set sound level to maximum for alarms and disable program sounds. This prevents boring sounds when you use menus.
slow or fast its in your hands only
well in my eyes , i had took the S200 (qtek) or whtever name he have, as base for smartphone app. for security usage. like you i had to choose between the stability , quality and speed. the hardware base had all i need, battery and SD, wifi and BT, and all very steady. yes speed stunt me slow at begining, but with the help of jesterz and one of his coocked Roms, i got it fatser, and for the final battery status gave me real overclock of 247-260 which is more than i need. when i load it with streamin video (mpg-2) no it dose not gag nor crash nor hang. thats more than i had with HP/ASUS/ etc pda on the same level. have more trust in your littel device. remember rule 1.
garbadge in-garbadge out. set it correctly and you'll have only fun.
Not loud enough to wake up?
Although the sound quality is not the best I found my old JAMin loud and strong as an alarm, especially with the LB sound file. In fact I am using the same file on my new SE P990i. I sold the JAMin as a trade-in and bought a P990i a month ago and although I am very happy with the new phone as it improves in all areas where I found the Prophet not so good (built-in support for A2DP, camera, sound quality and so on), sometimes I miss my old phone. What I don't miss though is the SCREEN ALIGNMENT PROBLEM. I am amazed how well the touch screen on the P990i works and how it even lacks an Align Screen function.
abubasim said:
Although the sound quality is not the best I found my old JAMin loud and strong as an alarm, especially with the LB sound file.
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I don't know what a LB sound file is. May you post it please ?
What I don't miss though is the SCREEN ALIGNMENT PROBLEM.
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I never had a Screen Alignment problem with my HTC Prophet but I keep reading about these issues on plenty of other news sites and forums.
So to sum it up these are the most known hardware related problems that come along with the HTC Prophet.
* Backside speaker useless and totally misplaced if the phone is placed on the table.
* Ear speaker quite silent, if you are in a noisy area or street then you need to plug a finger in the other ear to hear the other participant clearly.
* Microphone quite silent, the other part is permanently asking to repeat what's said.
* Headphone plug is causing problems when unpluging there's no sound sometimes (not confirmed by me but found on various places).
* Backside speaker is dying at times (not confirmed by me but found on various places).
* Backside speaker is applied at the backside.
* Misalignment of the touchscreen (not confirmed by me but found on various places).
* Battery life ends with 28% and needs recharging (I have the same problem. The device needs to be recharged).
These are the common problems, that I came along so far. Windows Mobile itself is operating normally so far, but the hardware is causing problems. Every company with name by now would have started a call back to replace the faulty systems. My next device will be from an manufacturer with name, who has skills in doing proper devices - no no-name branding.
* Backside speaker useless and totally misplaced if the phone is placed on the table.
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Not much of a problem for me.
* Ear speaker quite silent, if you are in a noisy area or street then you need to plug a finger in the other ear to hear the other participant clearly.
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Not a problem for me.
* Microphone quite silent, the other part is permanently asking to repeat what's said.
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Not a problem for me.
* Headphone plug is causing problems when unpluging there's no sound sometimes (not confirmed by me but found on various places).
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NOt a problem for me.
* Backside speaker is dying at times (not confirmed by me but found on various places).
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Yes this has happened to me twice not. First time it went for a repair - second time I used a workaround - see my first post in this thread. Has anyone had this on a G4 - maybe it's fixed in that version.
* Backside speaker is applied at the backside.
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Same as first issue on this list.
* Misalignment of the touchscreen (not confirmed by me but found on various places).
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Not been a problem for me.
* Battery life ends with 28% and needs recharging (I have the same problem. The device needs to be recharged).
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Not been a problem for me.
I'm sure some people have problems with the phone, which is in fact not really surprising because it's a stuffed up little machine with lots of sensitive electronics in it (made as cheap as possible to position it in the market for a certain price obviously).
But I must say that when looking at forums and people with problems there, you might not get a good idea of what's really going on with a device.
Forums are usually filled with questions and complaints instead of people searching for the forums to say "Hey! My device is working just properly! cheerios!".
It would be much more interesting to know how many devices have been sold and what % of those had faults/problems. Mind you, the prophet is sold world-wide and is a very popular device, which would increase the number of people with complaints on a forum considerably.
I wouldn't exactly call HTC a no-name manufacturer too. It's just that they are not well known because they have always made their hardware for other companies who put on their own brand and name on the device. Yet still it is a HTC product.
I haven't had a single problem with my device and know a lot of people who don't have problems with the thing too. I know someone who works in a store selling them and he says they don't see loads of the devices coming back with the complaints/problems you write.
For example, I have none of the problems you list up there. If the phones would have been so bad, don't you think I should at least have one of the problems here? Or do you think I'm the exception of having a error free phone and faulty devices are the standard?
So perhaps a somewhat more subtle approach on the subject might not hurt. I could be reading you the wrong way, but it almost seems like because of your dissapointment of your device you are on a small crusade stating the prophet is a very bad device. A device that only works for geeks with too much time on their hands changing roms, editting the registry and repairing the device themselves.
Which is, ofcourse, not the case at all.
TheBrit said:
Not much of a problem for me.
Not a problem for me.
Not a problem for me.
NOt a problem for me.
Same as first issue on this list.
Not been a problem for me.
Not been a problem for me.
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Yes, but it has been a problem for many others. It's as simple as that. If there are a few geeks really happy with it then be it that way. This thing simply isn't the right device for serious people who simply want to do their work. It's that simple.
LB.wav
Spatzm said:
I don't know what a LB sound file is. May you post it please ?
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If you the open the Clock settings and choose the Alarms tab then you can choose the sound file to be played by tapping the bell icon. LB is one of the provided sound files. In case it's missing on your phone then here it is.
Spatzm said:
Yes, but it has been a problem for many others. It's as simple as that. If there are a few geeks really happy with it then be it that way. This thing simply isn't the right device for serious people who simply want to do their work. It's that simple.
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What is quite funny is the fact that you just called everyone who likes their device (or do not agree with you) a geek and apperantly not a serious person.
Like I said in my other post, it might not be a bad idea to take a somewhat more subtle approach to the whole subject, instead of just reading the forums fast and sum up the first 8 problems you come across and state them as facts.
RaptorRVL said:
What is quite funny is the fact that you just called everyone who likes their device (or do not agree with you) a geek and apperantly not a serious person.
Like I said in my other post, it might not be a bad idea to take a somewhat more subtle approach to the whole subject, instead of just reading the forums fast and sum up the first 8 problems you come across and state them as facts.
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Hello,
This wasn't meant as insult or offense. I was just quite fed up with the device when I replied. The thing is that everyone has a right to like his / her device.
For my personal impression this thing is more a geeks toy rather than something for people like me who are deep into all kind of works and need a serious companion.
One that doesn't need tweaking, fixing or worrying. Something that simply works and does its tasks. I depend on connections with other people, it's my work, my business. I can not offend people by telling them to repeat themselves 20 times just because my cell is failing.
No problems with that but we also need to keep an eye on those people who have serious issues with it and the list is getting longer.
You said (or wrote) that people do not agree with me but I already received replies within this thread from people who confirmed parts of the issues raised.
I think it's just fair to light both sides of the medal. It's not fair to only hype this device and ignore or speak all issues it has to death.
So, just because YOUR Prophet is fine, doesn't mean that other peoples Prophet is as well. You are just the lucky one or your service provider bought working branches rather than getting the monday devices.
I don't ask for much and simply hope that some people from HTC are spending some time reading the contents of this forum and get uphold of these issues.
Thailand and probably most other asian countries are known to not supply the same quality standards that europe requires or that we are used too.
Just my opinion and I believe that I speak many people out of their heart here.
Spatzm said:
So, just because YOUR Prophet is fine, doesn't mean that other peoples Prophet is as well. You are just the lucky one or your service provider bought working branches rather than getting the monday devices.
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Well, we can turn this around and talk about how your device is the bad one and how that doesn't mean all the others suck too. I just don't think this is very productive. You don't like it, but others like it.
I for one am very happy with my Prophet, and guess what: I am from Germany too and I also got my phone from o2. I never had to change ROMs or overclock the processor. The only "geek" thing I've done is to abort the installation of the extended ROM.
My device is working just fine and I've never had any problems. No broken speaker, battery working fine, no screen alignment problems. It's fast, it's smooth, it's loud.
And oh yeah (and I really don't mean this in a smartass way), if I'm in a loud environment and can't hear the phone, the vibration massaging my leg lets me know someone is calling. Not a solution for the earpiece problem but at least for the incoming SMS and organizer alarms.
Well, to sum it up: you're not happy, others are. Simple as that. I don't know if it's very smart to keep discussing this.
RaptorRVL said:
What is quite funny is the fact that you just called everyone who likes their device (or do not agree with you) a geek and apperantly not a serious person.
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So...I'm a Geek!
I'm also a serious user. I use the Diary, Contacts, phone, TomTom etc etc. Bubble-Breaker when on the t.....never mind. Syncing the Diary and Contacts with both my home PC and my work PC a great bonus - so simple and so very useful.
I just got my Aria last week and love it except for the issue of bluetooth sound quality. Coming from a Fuze, using the same H560 earset I was using with the Fuze, the sound is muted with the Aria. It's like the high frequencies have been cut out or bit rate reduced with the link. I notice it as much as people on the other end of the call.
I've searched several different ways for solutions/notes on the issue, but nothing I found has addressed this. Please post a link if you got it or my search skills simply suck, or comment if you have ideas!
Is there a setting that can be changed to improve the quality? Or is this simply an issue of a specific device being only marginally compatible? I'm still on the stock ROM and not opposed to flashing a new one if it will fix the issue, but obviously knowing that there is probably nothing wrong with the H560, I'm reluctant to replace it.
I have tried to look for some threads regarding noise cancellation but the only ones i found were recommendations and questions about it.
I am sorry but I feel the urge to open this thread and at the same time surprised by the fact this thread has not been created before.
I constantly get people claiming they can hear background noises almost at the same level as they can hear my voice. It seems like every time I walk down the street, any background noises (bus, cars, people shouting, music, etc) are being passed onto the other person's line. It also holds for when I am at home with friends and someone calls me, the person on the other line claims he can hear practically every word my friends are talking about as if he is on speaker phone.
Also, connecting my Nexus S to my bluetooth speaker in my car is almost not possible as people claim they hear me as if i'm in a 'space shuttle'. I can confirm that its not the bluetooth speaker as I used to have a Blackberry and never had any issues.
Anyone experiences it as well? knows about someone developing a solution for it? or is it just me hallucinating here
This is a widely known problem and unfortunately there seems to be no fix in sight. Samsung does not use a secondary noise cancelling microphone like in the Nexus 1 and their software noise cancellation is simply garbage. I am keeping my fingers crossed that the brilliant devs can figure out a way to improve the noise cancellation with some kernel magic.
generalagony said:
This is a widely known problem and unfortunately there seems to be no fix in sight. Samsung does not use a secondary noise cancelling microphone like in the Nexus 1 and their software noise cancellation is simply garbage. I am keeping my fingers crossed that the brilliant devs can figure out a way to improve the noise cancellation with some kernel magic.
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"their software" .... you mean Google's software? Samsung doesn't touch the firmware whatsoever. They just provide the hardware in coalition with Google.
Simple solution (albeit it costs money). Get a noise cancelling bluetooth device. I have a blueant t1 and I never get background noise complaints. People don't even realize I'm riding on the highway. I wouldn't put too much hope it the devs doing a whole lot with noise cancellation because there's only so much software can do, since the phone lacks the hardware for true noise cancellation.
This has been posted a few times when the phone first released. There's no fix unfortunately, and a deal breaker for some. In noisy places the call quality seems to suffer from the software noise cancel function.
What noise cancellation? Yea, its quite a change from the Nexus One. People hear EVERYTHING that goes on in the background.
You can do a lot of noise cancellation with software only. There are numerous examples of excellent software solutions for noise cancellations.
SoliCall said:
You can do a lot of noise cancellation with software only. There are numerous examples of excellent software solutions for noise cancellations.
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For the Nexus S? can you give an example?
zephiK said:
"their software" .... you mean Google's software? Samsung doesn't touch the firmware whatsoever. They just provide the hardware in coalition with Google.
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Ouch. Pwnd. Everyone knew what I meant
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA Premium App
co0kie said:
For the Nexus S? can you give an example?
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Not for the Nexus S, but other companies have had successful software noise cancellation - for example Motorola CrystalTalk. As for noise on the Nexus S, I've asked friends and my wife when calling from stores, parking lots, in the car with tunes playing, etc., and they all say background noise is virtually non-existant. And I sound just fine as well. I've noticed that people can hear the music in the car when I'm not talking, but as soon as I start to talk the music is silenced. Calls to my own voicemail line confirms this.
Perhaps it has something to do with firmware versions? I have stock 2.3.3 pre-installed, no root.
it may be possible to noisegate out sounds below a certain level which depends on the mean amplitude level of a range of frequencies common to the voice. in otherwords, calculating the average amplitude the voice is, and removing anything significantly below that amplitude.
however without a second out-of-phase microphone, results wouldn't be all that great and would be processor intensive.
interesting project i may look at some time in the future.
bfksc said:
Not for the Nexus S, but other companies have had successful software noise cancellation - for example Motorola CrystalTalk. As for noise on the Nexus S, I've asked friends and my wife when calling from stores, parking lots, in the car with tunes playing, etc., and they all say background noise is virtually non-existant. And I sound just fine as well. I've noticed that people can hear the music in the car when I'm not talking, but as soon as I start to talk the music is silenced. Calls to my own voicemail line confirms this.
Perhaps it has something to do with firmware versions? I have stock 2.3.3 pre-installed, no root.
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I'm not sure weather CrystalTalk stands for a specific feature on Motorola's ROMs but if its a software, on Android, couldn't it be ported to other ROMs?
btw, I'm running NScollab 1.0.17 but always experienced such issues, even when I was on stock 2.3.3 pre-root.
I was not looking for Nexus S. Simply trying to prove a point that software noise cancellation is doable and working great. BTW, the developers of such software can easily port it to different platforms since it does not rely on specific hardware.
Has anyone who has installed the 3.2 OTA update been able to ascertain improvement with microphone input? Very interested for voice input purposes, which as of now is not functioning on my A500.
I would love to know the answer to that as well.
I'm running 3.1, which is known to have mic issues, and I'm barely audible to the person on the other side of video chat. Running the voice recording app confirms mic input is extremely low.
Hopefully 3.2 fixes this. If not, I'll have to dump this tablet on eBay.
Its a hardware problem, the software wont do anything.
You can try to mod it yourself like I did
if is a hardware issue, why connecting an external mic doesn't improve the recording level ?
I wasn't aware you could connect an external mic. Isn't the headset port for output only?
Sent from my A500 using Tapatalk
Johnny0906 said:
Its a hardware problem, the software wont do anything.
You can try to mod it yourself like I did
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Where is the post describing your mod?
The 3.2 update doesn't change a thing about the mic. Boosting the input level 20db in software also increases the level of the considerable system noise. Only a hardware mod would fix it.
Aside from the minnor 4 ounces weight disadvantage over the lightest tabs out there, the mic is the one major problem with this tab. It seems designed for the near proximity audio source of a mobile phone.
Oh...
In that case, would anyone like to buy an Acer Iconia A500 Tablet? Used but in MINT conditon!
documentaryman said:
Where is the post describing your mod?
...
Aside from the minnor 4 ounces weight disadvantage over the lightest tabs out there, the mic is the one major problem with this tab. It seems designed for the near proximity audio source of a mobile phone.
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The mic response on mine is substantially worse than that on my OG Droid. On the Droid 1, mic and voice input is surprisingly excellent. At the same distance, the A500 is unusable for voice input. Except for that, it's a fine machine, but this aspect has me on the fence about whether to return it or not. So I am looking for any approach to fix it: HW mod, upgrade, bluetooth input, wired mic input. Nothing so far is satisfactory, or even nearly as good as the Droid from 2 years ago.
Are you really selling?
How much and how? Lol
3.2 makes no improvement but I am not sure that it is just a hardware fault. Recording level is better in the camcorder app than in the voice recorder one.
I had a video call to an Ipad the other day, their voice was crystal clear but they complained that mine was very hard to hear. I suspect that when Skype becomes available for Tegra tabs there will be a lot of people complaining about their A500!
I am wondering if anyone has found a mic to use that gives good volume for talk. One of the things I want to use this to do is video chat with my father, it's kind of a let down that this doesn't seem like an easy fix.
The funny thing is that there are reports of people using headphone/headsets from their cell phones (with three strips instead of two strips in normal stereo headphones) as a workaround. It does not work for me and can make the microphone input even worse on voice recorder. I cannot confirm if the device has the hardware for the 3.5mm jack to have 2 output and 1 input.
Others have also said it is a software issue that crept up. It was non-existent in 3.0.1 and appeared in 3.1. Yet, another responded that they downgraded from 3.1 to 3.0.1 and the issue was still there.
I have read on other forums that the Android update to 3.1 had caused the mic to be useless on other brand tablets as well, which lends to something not specific to our A500 hardware.
Now, in this thread more people are convinced it is a hardware issue.
I'm lost as to what to think, and how some people in this forum are satisfied with their Mic performance. (That or they never use video chat)
My experience:
Voice input seems to work perfectly for me (Searching accurately for addresses and stuff on Google) but the microphone in voice recorder barely picks up a recognizable sound, which also translates into chatting with the Gtalk application.
I cannot confirm that 3.0.1 did not have the mic problem, as I updated to 3.1 immediately after getting the tablet.
I would think if the mic input barely registers a sound, how can the voice input search work so well for me from the same speaking distance? If it were a hardware problem, then the voice search would fail to register the specific sounds of my voice to get detailed information on addresses or items i am searching for. Right? Maybe others can confirm that the voice input for google'ing pics up spoken voice loud, clear, and accurately (maybe depending on accent or not).
Based on this, I am hard pressed to believe this is a hardware problem (not that the microphone is A+ quality either, but it should be decent enough). Hardware is the constant, software/driver is what can change the functionality. I dont know if the ROM cookers or Kernel developers can find us a solution, should this be software.
GShyneDM said:
Based on this, I am hard pressed to believe this is a hardware problem (not that the microphone is A+ quality either, but it should be decent enough). Hardware is the constant, software/driver is what can change the functionality. I dont know if the ROM cookers or Kernel developers can find us a solution, should this be software.
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You are correct. Hardware is not an issue, because the mic works well enough in other applications. Either the app us at fault or some plug in.
I can confirm voice input works well but any voice communication like GV is garbage. if I speak directly perpendicular to the mike about 10 inches away it's usable but not great for google voice.
Hmm, thought provoking posts.
One poster was remarking that the video recordings were working OK, but the GV ones were not good. My understanding is that there are mics, one on the front side, top center of screen, and one back side, under the back panel. It's tempting to think that the video recording was OK because it was picked up mostly by the camera-side mic, and GV wasn't because it was picked up by the screen-side mic.
I suspect that the two mics have some noise-cancelling function so it'd be partly the differential signal that would matter, sometimes.
So it would be interesting to try voice input, like GV, on the FF camera side (the wrong side) of the tab, to see if it's better. It'd also be interesting to see whether disconnecting one mic would unconfuse some software confused by the differential signal. So far, I haven't had my case apart, so I'm less inclined to try that. I still don't have my 3.2 update, but sounds like they didn't work on it.
I saw a brief note in the bluetooth section of the user guide that the BT mic portion of the spec wasn't implemented yet, so implementing that is another potential workaround.
I thought for a while that the inline mics integrated into some wired earbuds with those 4 contact plugs might also be a workaround, but when I tried one, it didn't seem much better than speaking into the mic, so I suspect that maybe it isn't even working, either.
I got mine at Costco, so it can still be returned. But it also occurred to me that Costco ought to be motivated not to have these returned. A Costco-backed straight answer from Acer, with a planned fix, would probably prevent many returns, especially, as one poster pointed out, Skype doesn't work when it's supposed to. Makes me think a strategic call to Costco buyer might uncover something.
oldfordfreak said:
How much and how? Lol
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Sorry freak. Provantage was kind enough to accept my request to return it as a defective device. I'll be picking up the Samsung Tab 10.1 from them. Video chat and Google+ hangouts were a big part of me justifying this purchase.
To those on the fence about returning it:
Try using the Samsung. While I loved all the features of the Acer, the Tab 10.1 is much more satisfying in actual use. I think the $100 premium over the Iconia is well justified once you've used both for more than 10 minutes.
San Pedro said:
I am wondering if anyone has found a mic to use that gives good volume for talk. One of the things I want to use this to do is video chat with my father, it's kind of a let down that this doesn't seem like an easy fix.
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There is one for apple its called like imic or something. It plugs into in headjack about the size of tip of pinky.
Sent from my Transformer TF101 using xda premium
qhinton said:
There is one for apple its called like imic or something. It plugs into in headjack about the size of tip of pinky.
Sent from my Transformer TF101 using xda premium
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Is it this one?
http://touchmic.com/tag/microphone-for-ipad/
Have you used it before? I'm weary to buy something that will not work.
I am finding more people who say that after updating to 3.2 their mic quality dropped considerably.
I have been using Skype and Gtalk as well as attempting to record using the Recorder app ... and all of them record a very poor quality sound in Android 3.2.
In Skype I attempted the test call and was able to hear my recording played back. It was barely loud enough and there were dropouts and pops/clicks etc.
I spoke to an Acer rep about a week ago and he said that the mic issues were addressed in update 3.2 ... which proves that this is most likely a software issue to some degree.
Very frustrating!
I recently installed Tape-aTalk and it records very clearly with the device about half an arms length away from my mouth ... again this points to there being a software issue with some apps ....
the single speaker has a very low volume level. can anyone suggest a solution? (i read the other thread).
phone is difficult to hear in noisy environments. forget playing music on the speaker. it's just a very whimpy monaural speaker.
i have tried 4 apps to boost volume, and only SpeakerBoost made much difference, but the app warns not to exceed a certain volume which is the point you start to gain some volume.
can i actually do physical improvements to the phone, like converting it to stereo w/2 speakers? where could the parts be bought? i'm in USA.
i am not rooted. would there be a solid solution if i rooted? or did 1 + just skimp on the speaker?
the equalizer that was included w/the 1+2 initially is long gone, but it really was not helpful for any significant volume boost.
I am disappointed in the 1+2 (and the retail price has plummeted like a rock), and their poor customer service.
unfortunately, hardware mods is a far fetched idea as there is already very less space, and fitting a whole speaker is, almost impossible. also the power and audio routing is not feasible.
your best bet, IMO is to look into software mods, specially rooted ones. look up the forums, you might find some. check user opinions and you may find one useful enough.
this is what i use. .works quite well:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/android/software/r-s-e-sound-systems-auditory-research-t3379709
Out of the blue 1+ contacted me about a reception issue...
that was not resolved months ago. i would really appreciate any feedback on the following:
I took the opportunity in my response to 1+ to mention the speaker issue. anyway, after owning the 1+2 for months, i believe that the speaker and reception problems are design flaws; that 1+ simply skimped on some portions of the phone and hyped it as a flagship killer.
can anyone offer any input on a way to get significantly more volume out of the phone speaker without damaging it?
a top end tech at att wireless explained to me that someone in my building who has a cheap flip phone likely has better reception than my 1+2. this was the highest i could go up the att tech ladder. Further, i see this as a design flaw, because other immediate neighbors using the same carrier do not have the significant reception issues i experience.
anyway, i sent the phone on about an 8000 mile RT repair trip to some 3rd party repair shop that handles 1+ repairs for 1+. absolutely nothing was done about the reception issue.
Now, a 1+ representative wants me to again send the phone back to repair. they just ignore that i say these issues are design flaws.
when i heard a neighbor using their old samsung phone (speakers) like a stereo, i realized the 1+2 speaker is much worse than i realized.
i asked 1+2 for a refund or an upgrade; they turned me down.
control freak said:
unfortunately, hardware mods is a far fetched idea as there is already very less space, and fitting a whole speaker is, almost impossible. also the power and audio routing is not feasible.
your best bet, IMO is to look into software mods, specially rooted ones. look up the forums, you might find some. check user opinions and you may find one useful enough.
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ok, thank you.
foomanjackel said:
this is what i use. .works quite well:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/android/software/r-s-e-sound-systems-auditory-research-t3379709
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OK, thank you. you and control freaks post did not show up until after the post i just made regarding trying to deal again with 1+ customer service, again.
i guess i best root the phone once again.
+1 for arise sound system, it works well
use v4a