Related
honestly with the work the dev's have been doin with the 2.1 ports i could care less about the official 2.1 now . do ya really have to wait another month or so just because it says "sprint" on it or would ya rather use all the amazing new features it has now.
nbroneobi said:
honestly with the work the dev's have been doin with the 2.1 ports i could care less about the official 2.1 now . do ya really have to wait another month or so just because it says "sprint" on it or would ya rather use all the amazing new features it has now.
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Click to collapse
I can't wait for the release when like 95 new threads will be made about it lol
Because the Sprint release will have all features working. After that, our dev's can make custom ROM's based on a fully working release, which of course, will be far superior...........
i can't wait till the stupid thing comes out a million people whine beacause its not the holy grail they thought it would be . then we can all move on with our lives
every single feature i need want and use works flawlessly for me i couldnt ask for more. i could care less about the bloatware from sprint other people make better apps on the market anyway
chfields said:
Because the Sprint release will have all features working. After that, our dev's can make custom ROM's based on a fully working release, which of course, will be far superior...........
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Click to collapse
I'd be very surprised if Sprint's official release has all features completely working.
TheSeanTeam said:
I'd be very surprised if Sprint's official release has all features completely working.
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Click to collapse
Why?? My wife's phone is stock and everything works perfectly.....Why should it be any different for 2.1?? They are waiting to release to be sure it works.
I'm a nascar fan and it doesn't work on Damage 1.0, but I don't really care at this point as my wifes is stock and we listen to that one....Everything I need works on Damage and I'm very happy with it, it is my daily.
chfields said:
Why?? My wife's phone is stock and everything works perfectly.....Why should it be any different for 2.1?? They are waiting to release to be sure it works.
I'm a nascar fan and it doesn't work on Damage 1.0, but I don't really care at this point as my wifes is stock and we listen to that one....Everything I need works on Damage and I'm very happy with it, it is my daily.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My father's phone is bone-stock and mine is rooted, running the Beta DC 1.1... and I'd say my phone has less issues than he has.
I'm guessing you didn't get a Hero at launch... there were a few problems that needed addressing.
My thought on the sprint released one:
Hopefully it will run a little smoother than ours does now because things are done "Appropriately" and not hacked together(Kerenel and driver versions are appropriate). I could only imagine this would make things a little better. Then we can have our way with a new one.
My current impression of the 2.1 Roms I have loaded:
They are really good considering all that has to be done to make one work. It seems they are a little slow when you start switching between apps and somethings just act a little funny. Like my browser randomly closes back to the home screen after I click on a link. If I run one game and then move to another its laggy. But all of this stuff is still really great and the devs have done a great job with what is at their disposal. I have run a 2.1 daliy for about the last 2 weeks, and the benefits far out weigh going back to a 1.5. I wish I could get the latest PRL with out going through all the work.
DISCALIMER:
IMHO
Im sure an official 2.1 release will result in a 2.1 kitchen as well... thats something to look forward to!
The official Sprint/HTC 2.1 will just give the community more stuff to build upon and incorporate into current ROM's. Whether starting from source or hacking on a prebuilt or leaked ROM (or some combination of these), something tells me most of the folks on this list won't view ANY Android release as a finished product.
Honestly, if Sprint/HTC they were smart the fixes and extensions to Android found on this forum and elsewhere (example, the kernel optimizations, Cyanogen's updater, the "kitchen" model, themes and skins, etc) would be going the other way and finding themselves in the official releases. But I'm not holding my breath
nbroneobi said:
i can't wait till the stupid thing comes out a million people whine beacause its not the holy grail they thought it would be . then we can all move on with our lives
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think anyone thinks it is the holy grail. People just want things like live wallpapers, accurate location, working bluetooth, working MMS/SMS/etc., working google voice, stability, and other admittedly minor issues that plague the 2.1 roms. It's not going to change anyone's life, but suddenly my latitude might stop showing I'm 30 miles away and I can finally have that cool spinning galaxy wallpaper.
nbroneobi said:
every single feature i need want and use works flawlessly for me i couldnt ask for more. i could care less about the bloatware from sprint other people make better apps on the market anyway
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We're glad that everything that you want works for you. But you must have realized at some point by now that we're not all you, and some of us care about those things that don't work.
Why you would whine and argue that we should just settle for a rom that has less things working and not look forward to a rom that has more things working is beyond me.
gthing said:
I don't think anyone thinks it is the holy grail. People just want things like live wallpapers, accurate location, working bluetooth, working MMS/SMS/etc., working google voice, stability, and other admittedly minor issues that plague the 2.1 roms. It's not going to change anyone's life, but suddenly my latitude might stop showing I'm 30 miles away and I can finally have that cool spinning galaxy wallpaper.
We're glad that everything that you want works for you. But you must have realized at some point by now that we're not all you, and some of us care about those things that don't work.
Why you would whine and argue that we should just settle for a rom that has less things working and not look forward to a rom that has more things working is beyond me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am thinking that, the items that are still not working only affect a small percentage of us out there, and if a feature is broken, but you never use it, then why worry?
He has a point, not everyone is insanely OCD about all features working. Being OCD about isn't a bad thing either. XDA and Android itself is all about choices. He has made his, you have made yours. I don't even understand why there is so much discussion about this.
5tr4t4 said:
Honestly, if Sprint/HTC they were smart the fixes and extensions to Android found on this forum and elsewhere (example, the kernel optimizations, Cyanogen's updater, the "kitchen" model, themes and skins, etc) would be going the other way and finding themselves in the official releases. But I'm not holding my breath
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If sprint were smart they would sell this device unlocked with the ability to download customizations from their store (roms, taskbars, lockscreens, icons, customized rosies, bootscreens etc) for a few bucks a pop, and let everyone customize the phone to their liking. Would prob be tens of thousands of additional income for them from the people who are too lazy to root and do it themselves.
obelisk79 said:
He has a point, not everyone is insanely OCD about all features working. Being OCD about isn't a bad thing either. XDA and Android itself is all about choices. He has made his, you have made yours. I don't even understand why there is so much discussion about this.
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Click to collapse
So you'd have to be "insanely OCD" to want all the features on your phone working? Why did they bother to creating the features in the first place?
I would also point out that I haven't seen anyone who is "insanely OCD" about the official 2.1 rom coming out either.
gthing said:
So you'd have to be "insanely OCD" to want all the features on your phone working? Why did they bother to creating the features in the first place?
I would also point out that I haven't seen anyone who is "insanely OCD" about the official 2.1 rom coming out either.
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Click to collapse
It would seem to me that you are very particular about having all features work on your phone. I can understand this, I even stated that in my post. Perhaps OCD was a bad way to put it. Rather lets call it Nitpicky. In either case, I think you've missed the point I was getting at in my post. That point was that we all have the freedom to choose how to use our phones. 2.1 will come from sprint in due course. Sprint has made no promises on a date for it yet people continue to act overly anxious regardless.
Out of curiosity, what feature(s) is missing from the current 2.1 builds that has you waiting for the official sprint release?
1. No more "beta" ROMs (i.e. all ROMs with some minor issues, each with different ones, less messing with wiping).
2. Less ROMs and just a few really good ones (like with 1.5) which would lead to many more custom themes, and not themes that will be outdated with the new beta releases.
P.S. After the month of 2.1, when people are on their "x 2.1 official ROM" and they've done their themes, the boards will slow down like hell and people will just work on themes. In fact if Sprint has their way, by the time you get "official" 2.1 with the theme you want, you will be moving on to the 4g phones. I really don't see these boards having so much action after all the final ROM releases are out and the major themes are out for them.
The only reason I want the official 2.1 to come is because currently the "hacked together (if you will)" 2.1 ROM's get horrible signal on my phone. If I run 1.5 in the same area, I usually always have about 10-15 less dBa (less is better) than a 2.1 ROM. So hopefully the Sprint 2.1-based ROM's will have this corrected... otherwise I might stick to 1.5 forever
Well for one everything would be working 100%. With no setbacks like the devs make taking out keyboards, sounds, etc etc just to make the rom faster and more stable
You would have all your sprint apps, all google apps along with htcs more widgets and Market will show (as u see in ads) the 30,000+ apps
But i dont think its worth the unroot and root again tho. ill just wait two days or maybe 15hours before a dev make they own version of the rom.
obelisk79 said:
It would seem to me that you are very particular about having all features work on your phone. I can understand this, I even stated that in my post. Perhaps OCD was a bad way to put it. Rather lets call it Nitpicky. In either case, I think you've missed the point I was getting at in my post. That point was that we all have the freedom to choose how to use our phones. 2.1 will come from sprint in due course. Sprint has made no promises on a date for it yet people continue to act overly anxious regardless.
Out of curiosity, what feature(s) is missing from the current 2.1 builds that has you waiting for the official sprint release?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
visual voicemail for starters, not some 3rd party app that only works half the time.
Hey,
I am NOT a dev, but I would like to know what kind of work work is going to be required now that gingerbread is on the forefront?
For example, VPlayer, doesn't work... it FC... How much work is it going to take to get the program back up and running???
Im just asking because, as much as I hate to admit it, fragmentation (as everyone calls it) is going to start causing issues. I get that google wants to offer the best and the latest and greatest, but if everytime a new API get sent out, and devs' have to rewrite their work, how much time is it going to take to get the proggy back up and running??
Thanks!
Theo
theomajigga said:
I am NOT a dev,
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You should've stop right there.
You realize that at this point only 1(!) phone is running official 2.3 Gingerbread and it's Samsung Nexus S. It's a drop in a bucket comparing to all of the phones that are running official 2.x firmware.
Furthermore, if an app is properly developed against 1.x or 2.x SDK then it will work with gingerbreadas as all APIs are future-compliant. The only problem would be is if an app is developed using 2.3 APIs and you would try to use it on earlier roms or if it used undocumented/unofficial APIs that were not supposed to be used and were discontinued in future releases.
We don't know what 's causing vPlayer not to work, could be many things (kernel, unfinished rom development, missing libs) or it could be things in vPlayer that were improperly implemented.
Send a log to developer and see if he/she can help you. Given that you're not running official (or at least stable!) release, you may not get far though.
But please, don't jump on that "fragmentation" train, it's not nearly as bad as people make it out to be.
borodin1 said:
You should've stop right there.
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Click to collapse
First off, I didn't ask for you to be a ****, if I would have posted this in the dev forum that would have prompted you to respond as such.
borodin1 said:
You realize that at this point only 1(!) phone is running official 2.3 Gingerbread and it's Samsung Nexus S. It's a drop in a bucket comparing to all of the phones that are running official 2.x firmware.
Furthermore, if an app is properly developed against 1.x or 2.x SDK then it will work with gingerbreadas as all APIs are future-compliant. The only problem would be is if an app is developed using 2.3 APIs and you would try to use it on earlier roms or if it used undocumented/unofficial APIs that were not supposed to be used and were discontinued in future releases.
We don't know what 's causing vPlayer not to work, could be many things (kernel, unfinished rom development, missing libs) or it could be things in vPlayer that were improperly implemented.
Send a log to developer and see if he/she can help you. Given that you're not running official (or at least stable!) release, you may not get far though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the answer, i guess.
borodin1 said:
But please, don't jump on that "fragmentation" train, it's not nearly as bad as people make it out to be.
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Click to collapse
Now that that is out of the way, can I ask you HOW you can honestly say that Android isn't fragmented. Seriously ask your self... I LOVE android, I really do, G1-cliq-MT3G-Nexus One-HD2(androided)-MT4G, but I can't even lie about that. There is 9 API levels!! 2.3, 2.2, 2.1, 2.0.1, 2.0, 1.6, 1.5, 1.1, 1.0.
NOW I DO UNDERSTAND THAT ALMOST 45% ARE ON 2.2 and 40% ARE ON 2.1.
Ok, so now most apps are going to be working on that 84% of phones running level 7+.
But this ALSO doesn't account for the manufacture API's that are implemented buy some of them, which I KNOW causes some problems. (skype on the Samsung Galaxy Series) just to name one very big one. Skype works on other devices with 2.1, but it doesn't on the Samsung 2.1? as a consumer, I'd ask wtf, even with their limited knowledge of android.
Fragmentation is defined as is the inability to "write once and run anywhere". Rovio complained about this. Albeit not directly, but they said that they were having issues with people on some phones, with some versions of software, and that it wasn't going to work across the board.
I hate to admit it but there are certain things that need to be done to insure that Android will not only be the "Mobile OS" but it will also be the demanded one (IMHO):
1. Cut the bull**** manufacture stuff out, make only ONE set of API's, with 0 proprietary API's. Make it stuff that you can get if you want through the Android Market (custom UI's and such).
2. Control the god-damn market, find spammers, find shady devs re-uploading their apps multiple times to get ad dollars.
3. Get everybody on board to updates, require that all devices with X specifications be updated Y months after a source is released. That will get again get everyone on the same API level, and will make all apps compatible (maybe slow).
4. For the love of all holy, USE THE BEST COMPONENTS YOU CAN FIND! AND MAKE IT A STANDARD At least for the primary functions of the phone. For example, the Nexus One (my fave so far) did NOT have a competent touch screen, 2 point, and a BAD 2 point at that, and that is considered to be the new dev phone. Well who the HELL would want to dev for a platform that can only recognize two points (barely) that doesn't always even get them right? I sure as hell wouldn't. Finally I get the MT4G, the FIRST thing i did was test the touch screen, and guess what... It still is sub-par. 4 points, where my friends Galaxy S can do 6 or something. Now you are going to ask me, who uses 6 points idiot? Some games, do, and to top **** off, if you can't recognize 2 points properly, close together, how can some of the basic multi-touch functions work? (google maps on the N1)
I'm sorry for the rant, but I'm realistic. A mobile platform can't win like this.
http://www.comp.nus.edu.sg/~damithch/df/device-fragmentation.htm
Hi All
Seems to be a bit backward to not be able to post in the development section, but rules are rules I suppose.
I bought a Xoom a couple of months ago and put on Moray on a UK wifi Xoom. Very impressed and jumped onto ICS with the initial ICS release then played about with nightlys up to version twelve today.
OTG still not working for me, it crashes USB watcher OTG as well.
Music app does not get mentioned, but its terrible. Only small icons and no proper options ?
Camera and Mic were not tried as they are obviosly broken due to missing binaries.
It also seems backward to have widgets only on the apps page.
Battery options made the battery read zero, then made it disappear from the tray as well.
Browser does seem slicker, but back to Moray and its not a huge difference to be fair.
Have issues with various Apps. This makes sense as they still need to get up to speed with ICS. But it does concern me when people say its the best thing ever, when nothing can work as advertised. HW videos are hit and miss. I am also sure I read a while back that ICS would be all singing, why do I need a Ext mount app to write to an external card, same as OTG ? I thought that this would be part of the main build ?
So from my own personal experience, its a change, but until you have a full package with working apps, hardware, then I think people need to calm down with their plaudits for ICS.
I think I will leave the nightlys for a while, but it was great to try, and thanks for the guys putting the effort in making/updating these things.
I'm going to say this with as much respect as I can:
You have zero idea what the development section is about with statements like that.
Stick to stock software if you want a device that works as intended.
Development and custom roms always have caveats and pitfalls.
Thanks for stopping by!
Regarding not being able to post in dev section - it's for development only not questions and a lot of new users start new threads and ask a lot of questions! It makes sense the way it s.
You have to remember that these are alpha builds which are not supposed to be complete or fully working. A lot of devs wouldn't even put these out at this stage because of instability issues. But I am SOOO glad that the EOS team have decided to share these awesome ICS build with us because it may take weeks or even months to get to a full build release or an official Moto release. I know you aren't trying to bash the devs but I have to disagree with your opinions. I love ICS so far. It's fast, fluid and looks great.
Agreed with the widget option. Think the HC way was better but it's a minor issue compared to the speed improvements.
In essence though, I think if the full product is what you want you should stay away from alpha or even beta builds. Stick with full or official releases. Most people who test these roms understand this.
Sent from my Xoom using xda premium
aside from the camera and the mic i have had zero problems with anything i do on the xoom on a regular basis.
if it's an alpha build, it's a hell of an alpha build.
the only thing was it took me a bit to get all the gapps working and to the most current versions
Hi
Well my point was I don't have to be a Dev to know when things are not working. OTG is not working, and this is not a statement saying it has to, but merely a way of reporting it.
Nobody has mentioned the battery dissapears if you change the settings.
People seemed to be obsessed with Google Maps working, but since this is a great media player the bugs seem to be getting left out of the threads.
Now I know there is a lot missing, but why no OTG support built in ? Is this just a Motorola thing ?
I think there has to be a devils advocate here, everyone saying its fast is great, but if you are just using this as a browser, then its not a great indication about how good ICS is.
And to the chap who said I had no idea about Dev things, you are 100 % correct. But this is not aimed at anyone doing the nightlys, this is an ICS comparison. I am sure if Motorola release a version of ICS! Then it would get mentioned, how there are also some annoying new things not hardware or nightly release related. As I said the Music player is abysmal, the widgets is hidden away. The apps selector looks smaller, and some other little things.
So all I am trying to say is yes it seems faster, but since its only partly there, and we shrug when things don't work correctly, does not mean that is is the best thing ever. When we have a full version and all the binaries are working, then we will see the real speed ?
xoom68 said:
Hi
Well my point was I don't have to be a Dev to know when things are not working. OTG is not working, and this is not a statement saying it has to, but merely a way of reporting it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I haven't tested it but others in the thread have and say it's working.
Nobody has mentioned the battery dissapears if you change the settings.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's in the official bug tracker.
Now I know there is a lot missing, but why no OTG support built in ? Is this just a Motorola thing ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
At this point the ICS builds are all straight from source so not a moto thing but see above.
So all I am trying to say is yes it seems faster, but since its only partly there, and we shrug when things don't work correctly, does not mean that is is the best thing ever. When we have a full version and all the binaries are working, then we will see the real speed ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's all well and good but if that's the way you think then stay away from alpha and beta builds. If you are only interested in the full working product wait for official release.
Sent from my Xoom using xda premium
Worst thread ever.
Alpha build!
Thanks for replying.
I don't know what defines a working OTG, but with Moray I used USB Mount watcher and I mounted a 1tb HD no problem. I thought I would not need an app, but no joy. This time when I tried the App it says it was built in. But it hangs at any attempt to identify the HD. Another mount app sees the HD, but can't mount it.
The battery thing I just noticed in the bug tracker, but no one mentioned it in the thread.
No one mentions the poor ICS music player or widgets.
I just see people obsessed with calendar and Google maps ?
And to all saying Alpha Build....considering Motorola never added OTG support to HC, but the custom roms did. My point is who is to say they will add it to ICS. I thought it was supposed to be standard. If people have to Root their device to get OTG and towrite to External SD. We have not come that far forward. And in fact the threads I readprevious to buying a Xoom had people waiting months for updates, are people really expecting a Motorola Ics within the next 6 months. This alpha build will not get any better until there are binaries, soapart from a few settings tweaks, it will stay Alpha for a long time I reckon.
I understand you saying stick to stock, but the built in things to ICS are poorer in relation to HC, I suppose no one mentions things in case they appear to be rude, but I think its better if people know the negatives as well, as it just seems to be people with Ice Cream tinted glasses at the moment
xoom68 said:
I understand you saying stick to stock, but the built in things to ICS are poorer in relation to HC, I suppose no one mentions things in case they appear to be rude, but I think its better if people know the negatives as well, as it just seems to be people with Ice Cream tinted glasses at the moment
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Again though, this is an alpha build so you cannot expect this to be fully working or all "built in" functions to be bug free.
If the current builds don't work for your daily needs that's fair enough, wait for a more complete build. But you cannot burn ICS on the strengths, or weaknesses, of an alpha build.
Sent from my Xoom using xda premium
Be happy that we are the only tablet that has a ICS build to be bug free enough to be a daily driver for a good portion of users.
(Wifi, GPU acceleration, netflix work perfectly, browser is very much improved)
I can't post in the development section either.
But a thread like this is just the place to boost my post count.
---------- Post added at 08:56 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:55 PM ----------
Ten characters.
Honestly, all I can really say to this... one step at a time, one day at a time.
You, as well as others, must understand and respect the fact that the developers here are putting in their own free time and effort to bring us these ROMs and extras, at absolutely no cost to you, the user.
Trying to tear apart tons code that has already been written to troubleshoot, fix problems, and test is hugely tedious and very time consuming.
Right now, I suggest not trying to put the cart before the horse. Simple things like asethetics, minor functionality (I.e. OTG, etc.) that is not crucial to the operation of the device is going to have to wait.
Important parts, like 3G/4G radio functionality, Google apps, video playback - the essentials come first.
Truthfully, I would not waste my time reporting the smaller issues, we know that they are there. When the developers get the foundation built and stable enough to work with, THEN will they ask for help with bug reporting and suggestions and such. No need to overwhelm the developers at this stage of the game.
Just my 2 cents.
xxspark89xx said:
Honestly, all I can really say to this... one step at a time, one day at a time.
You, as well as others, must understand and respect the fact that the developers here are putting in their own free time and effort to bring us these ROMs and extras, at absolutely no cost to you, the user.
Trying to tear apart tons code that has already been written to troubleshoot, fix problems, and test is hugely tedious and very time consuming.
Right now, I suggest not trying to put the cart before the horse. Simple things like asethetics, minor functionality (I.e. OTG, etc.) that is not crucial to the operation of the device is going to have to wait.
Important parts, like 3G/4G radio functionality, Google apps, video playback - the essentials come first.
Truthfully, I would not waste my time reporting the smaller issues, we know that they are there. When the developers get the foundation built and stable enough to work with, THEN will they ask for help with bug reporting and suggestions and such. No need to overwhelm the developers at this stage of the game.
Just my 2 cents.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for the great work you are doing on this. I can see that it can be slow going but you seem to be making good progress.
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/perlow/on-tablets-android-40-is-an-ice-cream-headache/19643
Here is his previous review of ICS that was leaked.
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/perlow/why-ice-cream-sandwich-wont-be-able-to-save-android-tablets/19584
Thanks,
Meh. Everyone has their preferences, his is obviously iOS.
I haven't had any major issues with ICS, and even the few minor ones have already been addressed. (running EOS nightly 26) And it runs a lot better than HC!
Yeah I really don't agree for the most part. Yes iOS looks and runs nice. But that's how simple things are. If I just wanted a pretty, simple gaming device then I would use an iPad, but since I prefer to get other more complex uses out of my technology an android tablet suits me best. Not to mention ICS runs like a dream. Especially thanks to team EOS.
Sent from my Droid Incredible 2
He should write about the good things of Android. There are alot more good things than bad...
I don't agree because even though Team EOS had builds out before the soak test, they didn't have access to the proprietary moto stuff & drivers... i.e. I'd expect to have problems, and if you read/follow the threads, there were known problems/issues that were being worked on.
The author also doesn't mention if he had updated to the latest Team EOS build, or stuck with an older (probably more buggy) version.
The Soak test only leaked last Friday, Jan 13. The article was PUBLISHED Jan 17. i.e. only 4 Days! Not "TWO WEEKS" as the author proclaims to have been running ICS.
If the author was truly running ICS For two weeks then I would have expected it to be buggy.
One thing I do agree on in the article, is there is no way to tell in the market which apps have been upgraded or optimized for ICS, HC, or even GB. And yes, older apps not meant for newer OS could be the cause of some issues.
I can also somewhat agree with the "when I kill an app, I want it killed. I don't want it to re-spawn itself" thinking, but only because I admit I don't know Android enough to understand why some people might think its ok for apps to do this. I grew up with CP/M, DOS, OS/2, Windows, etc... It has always been "run as few TSR apps as possible" or "clear your startup folder so you have less running" mentality. So letting Android allow apps to restart after you kill them, etc.. just seems wrong to me.
That being said, if the author had run MOTO's released ICS version for two weeks, and had these same issues, that would be another story...
r I've been running EOS's rom since N5 or so - now on N41 and in all that time I have had very few, if any, apps FC or boxes saying the app isn't responding. Granted, I'm not using a ton of different apps, but I use a fair amount. When I was using HC I was getting them very often.... so in just talking about FC'ings, ICS is a world of difference over HC.
And his comment about the HDMI port or sdcard slot...that just depends on what each person has a need for. On one forum I read people who have the Prime were saying they didn't care that the GPS didn't work.... which they obviously don't use their tablets for navigation whereas someone else who has that need wouldn't be happy with it not working.
I've got a question I tried to answer myself, but I couldn't resist to post it on the forum.
Is the ICS leak a great step forward for all Atrix users ?
For those who wanted HWA, fingerprint scanner, working camera, of course it is... But is it a step forward for the release of a STABLE CM10 with a STABLE kernel ? This question is more open to a debate than a simple answer.
This leak didn't provide any option for those who have the wrong tegrapart (Mine is OK), or a lapdock, or those who use Chrome and want a generally reliable ROM (Stability, I/O perfs, battery life). They have to make a compromise but we still didn't reach THE ROM(s) that makes everybody happy.
The missing thing to get the ROM(s) that will make us all happy is the kernel source... Why didn't we get it with the ICS leak ? Well let's exclude this question from this thread and maybe talk about it after this debate is (almost) closed.
Personally I'm happy to have this new ROM, it's fast, smooth etc. but my lapdock is still borked so I'm really frustrated not to have this awesome tablet display that works with EVERYTHING but not MOTOROLA's own peripheral... Damn it !
So, what's your case ? Of course you may have found satisfaction with the ICS leak, but are you as frustrated as I am to be this close to the ultimate goal ?
The debate is open, I hope I broke the ice for some people who are in my case and feel like forgotten.
I think that leak does not come with the source code. Thus there will not be any practical improvement right now.
Or, most likely ever. I doubt things will go much farther, and I'm usually the optimistic one
no chance
nope, i think the ics leak was just a one off leak from what motorola actually got round to doing before they abandoned the project, which personally is really bad the roms are just crappy (no offence to developers but the lack of resources means they will always be crappy), everyone says the roms are good but every ics rom iv used is awful, overheating, bugs, battery life sucks, cameras lag, and doesnt compare to a stable cm7 which works completely fine and does everything ics can do anyway.. hmm... i guess everyone just keeps giving themselves false hope, although the possibility of a stable ics is much more than the chance of jellybean & as for the cm10/jellybean thing dont get your hopes up the signs of HWA are non existent and i really dont think they ever will be unless somebody makes a kernel from scratch which for a mobile device would take endless hours of work and testing each boot would probably get your through about 50 atrix phones from hard bricks etc... and i dont think our developers have the time or money to do so... even with donations.
its just not worth it, the atrix is a dying breed if you dont like cm7 then buy a new phone, its that simple, confuses me why everyone acts like cm7 is some sort of bugged crappy software that doesnt work? yet its still a very stable software.
i think everyone should stop concentrating on ICS and jellybean until we actually hear news that will be helpful to creating a stable build and in the mean time focus on improving cm7 with mods and other things, right now cm7 is basically abandoned and the thing its been abandoned for has been on hold for around 3 months.
Pixelguy said:
nope, i think the ics leak was just a one off leak from what motorola actually got round to doing before they abandoned the project, which personally is really bad the roms are just crappy (no offence to developers but the lack of resources means they will always be crappy), everyone says the roms are good but every ics rom iv used is awful, overheating, bugs, battery life sucks, cameras lag, and doesnt compare to a stable cm7 which works completely fine and does everything ics can do anyway.. hmm... i guess everyone just keeps giving themselves false hope, although the possibility of a stable ics is much more than the chance of jellybean & as for the cm10/jellybean thing dont get your hopes up the signs of HWA are non existent and i really dont think they ever will be unless somebody makes a kernel from scratch which for a mobile device would take endless hours of work and testing each boot would probably get your through about 50 atrix phones from hard bricks etc... and i dont think our developers have the time or money to do so... even with donations.
its just not worth it, the atrix is a dying breed if you dont like cm7 then buy a new phone, its that simple, confuses me why everyone acts like cm7 is some sort of bugged crappy software that doesnt work? yet its still a very stable software.
i think everyone should stop concentrating on ICS and jellybean until we actually hear news that will be helpful to creating a stable build and in the mean time focus on improving cm7 with mods and other things, right now cm7 is basically abandoned and the thing its been abandoned for has been on hold for around 3 months.
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Its not that simple. Once you've had a taste of Android 4.X, its nearly impossible to go back. I'm stuck on Epinter's CM10 because of that, every time I try switching back to a CM7 based rom I find it randomly jittery and with a lot of small annoyances. Both of which I never noticed before trying Joker's CM9.
Even when I switched from CM7 to CM9, I remember CM7 was more or less perfect in its current state. Work stopped on it because there's not much else that can be done with it. Its hit its peak, and for those not spoiled by the more polished versions of Android it is indeed the ideal rom for our device. That does not mean work should stop on ICS/JB, though. The big issue we have is the kernel, of which there are several projects in the works to port kernels from other devices. Its something that'll take (a lot of) time, but long term it'll be much better for our devices than making barely noticeable changes to Gingerbread roms.
With that said, you are right in that the ICS leak is more or less useless without source code. Crappy battery and display issues on some variants of Atrix completely ruin it.
Having the kernel source would solve many issues, but after Motorola abandoned the device it's very unlikely they'll commit any more resources into releasing the half working source code. Of course we'd like to see the source released as it existed under development, but from what I understand, the the source that gets released isn't always exactly the same as what they work with when they compile it and things like extremely helpful comments in the code get removed because of things like NDA's. And although many of the libs and drivers can be extracted from the ROM, the code to use them has been lost.
As it stands, the Atrix Rebirth Project is probably the best chance for seeing a fully functional kernel source for ICS and beyond. But as has been pointed out already, interest in the device has been dying, and even if the project does manage to make it happen, it's not going to happen overnight.
Jotokun said:
Its not that simple. Once you've had a taste of Android 4.X, its nearly impossible to go back. I'm stuck on Epinter's CM10 because of that, every time I try switching back to a CM7 based rom I find it randomly jittery and with a lot of small annoyances. Both of which I never noticed before trying Joker's CM9.
Even when I switched from CM7 to CM9, I remember CM7 was more or less perfect in its current state. Work stopped on it because there's not much else that can be done with it. Its hit its peak, and for those not spoiled by the more polished versions of Android it is indeed the ideal rom for our device. That does not mean work should stop on ICS/JB, though. The big issue we have is the kernel, of which there are several projects in the works to port kernels from other devices. Its something that'll take (a lot of) time, but long term it'll be much better for our devices than making barely noticeable changes to Gingerbread roms.
With that said, you are right in that the ICS leak is more or less useless without source code. Crappy battery and display issues on some variants of Atrix completely ruin it.
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hmm i used pinters cm10 for a week and went back to MROM cm7 and customised it to my liking with ICS themes and text changers, looks just like ICS runs just as smooth as a buggy JB rom, thats the problem the performance of CM10 roms without HWA is about the same as a good CM7 rom... just with a few features like google now which nobody really uses anyway, although i understand where your coming from when it comes too the UI and animations on JB roms they are very nice but id rather sacrafice them and have a phone that will work 100%
I'm very naive to the inner workings of android
I also returned to mrom from epinters cm 10 and icsrom because of lack of camcorder or terrible battery life.
Now with mrom I have a very smooth launcher and all apps working. I do miss jellybeans nice interface, but what are the more fundamental improvements that gingerbread lacks? Besides feeling outdated and old of course :/
Sent from my MB860 using xda app-developers app
Zero usefulness. Novelty item at best.
It's interesting to read opinion of no-developers is it something useful or not. Only developers could say something about it. Also most of you are so pessimistic, complaining that developing is dying.
xda-developers is for site and forum for developers. If you think that developing is dying, come on, do something about. Join Atrix Rebirth Project, start to learn how to develop kernel and rom. There is a lot of guides here and on Internet. Instead of spending time on forum and waiting that someone else do it for you and for free. If you don't have time to learn, contribute on another way: support developers, donate money or device, try to find solution, use your contacts to get leaked sources...
The easiest way is to buy a new device and start complain after a while
I have been very pleased with the stock GB rom. I have a Nexus 7 and an old HTC Aria, both running the latest version of JB and, other than a more up-to-date appearance, there's really nothing I can't do on the Atrix that I can do on the JB devices.
Its amazing what the developers have been able to do with the HTC Aria. It has very little memory, but they have created virtually unlimited program memory by using an extended partition on the SD card. The Aria also runs JB almost flawlessly.
If JB could run on the Atrix 4G the way it runs on my Aria, I would use it. But from what I've read, it has a long way to go. I am not even sure I would even be able to root my Atrix, which has the latest GB update from Motorola.
Sent from my MB860 using xda app-developers app
Slymayer said:
I've got a question I tried to answer myself, but I couldn't resist to post it on the forum.
Is the ICS leak a great step forward for all Atrix users ?
For those who wanted HWA, fingerprint scanner, working camera, of course it is... But is it a step forward for the release of a STABLE CM10 with a STABLE kernel ? This question is more open to a debate than a simple answer.
This leak didn't provide any option for those who have the wrong tegrapart (Mine is OK), or a lapdock, or those who use Chrome and want a generally reliable ROM (Stability, I/O perfs, battery life). They have to make a compromise but we still didn't reach THE ROM(s) that makes everybody happy.
The missing thing to get the ROM(s) that will make us all happy is the kernel source... Why didn't we get it with the ICS leak ? Well let's exclude this question from this thread and maybe talk about it after this debate is (almost) closed.
Personally I'm happy to have this new ROM, it's fast, smooth etc. but my lapdock is still borked so I'm really frustrated not to have this awesome tablet display that works with EVERYTHING but not MOTOROLA's own peripheral... Damn it !
So, what's your case ? Of course you may have found satisfaction with the ICS leak, but are you as frustrated as I am to be this close to the ultimate goal ?
The debate is open, I hope I broke the ice for some people who are in my case and feel like forgotten.
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Yeah right ! talking about this leak ... is a >small< step foward !
Just imagine Michael Montuori out of here, Or the Bill ?! epinter !? Faux, or jocker that has made a wonderfull job and the other in the early days of the atrix .... all source code builder out of this atrix family at once !
Well ... Motorola doesnt have a great support for the moment ! as their Blur OS is ****ty slow ! :S
I own a Car dock, A HD Multimedia Dock and a great lapdock !
I approve that this is still frustrating (and i know the devs out there are NOT getting Paid enough for a better work than MOTOROLA itself,) that motorola own product doesnt have support yet ! but still have on a direct DHMI cable straight to the tv !! WTF ?!?!!
Well, its not going to change anything here, i mean this thread ... but .. well .. you know ! YEAH its awkward and " fais chier bordel" hahaha
Our devs are GREAT but unfortunately, we still need that damn MOTO support for their drivers source for the new OS :S
Meanwhile
sathelate said:
Well, its not going to change anything here, i mean this thread ... but .. well .. you know ! YEAH its awkward and " fais chier bordel" hahaha
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I would even say "Bordel à couilles de constructeur de mes deux !". I'm writing this using my lapock... On my tiny screen, with my main screen at 45° so I can still read what I'm writing. I dreamt about WT3.0 with working LAPDOCK, it would have been so gorgeous, but it's currently not happening. "Nique cette merde !", I'm buying a Windows Phone next year when the ecosystem gets more apps and stuff. The news are getting warmer for this OS ! The amazing keyboard made in WP7/8 will replace my lapdock I use as a keyboard.
Development IS actually dying, look at the Atrix 4G development section where there used to be several ROMs under active development there are now just a few. Nearly everything that can be done has been done with the exception of what the Atrix rebirth project is doing. But there is no guarantee of success. If you have the money or a device to donate to the rebirth project, great, by all means go for it. Maybe one of the other tegra based moto devices might help a bit too. Unfortanately I think it's pretty hard to hold any level of optimism for the device after such a long string of let downs.
Sent from my MB860 using xda app-developers app
I see the ICS leak as interesting but not overly useful.
Now, if they'd also leaked the source code, I don't doubt that the devs could have created a fully-features and stable ICS/JB within a couple of months. However, with no source for such a buggy leak, we're reliant on a few people trying to create a kernel almost from scratch. I wish them well, but I'm not holding my breath...
When you feel like the development is hopeless , waste all of your time and try fixing things yourself get a new phone.
BravoMotorola said:
When you feel like the development is hopeless , waste all of your time and try fixing things yourself get a new phone.
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Like you? And you think that you're smart. That's exactly what vendors wish, get a new device. Bravo
Edit: With your latest posts in Atrix forum you're the same as maggedo or member with Atrix in name. Ups, you have Motorola
How long N4 will be the best device for you? What I see not so long
I think it's interesting how people work:
First everyone was crying about the fact, that Motorola left us out in the cold and now that we have a actually really good leak, people cry that it's not good enough... That's just sad. The leak is useful and it's a big step into the right direction. A lot of people put in hours of work for you (and for FREE!!!), to make this leak better. All you need is PATIENCE. Be grateful that some devs stick to this EOL-device and provide great work for us.
-Just my 2 cents-
Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk
BravoMotorola said:
When you feel like the development is hopeless , waste all of your time and try fixing things yourself get a new phone.
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And... What about people who can't get a new device ? I bought mine like 6 months ago, it was for my birthday and I can't waste money on a newer phone like this.
But there must be some kind of "break-even" ahead.
How many hours of work and energy may be put from the most "valuable brains" into the leak (without having sourcecode), until they must decide: "enough is enough, it just will never turn out as "stable"?
From what I've understood there exists some good chances that maybe some day valuable parts of the XOOM kernel get migrated to the Atrix (see respective thread under development area).
May the last remaining devs of a dying device - whose work I greatly respect and appreciate! - join forces and turn more efforts into porting the xoom?