Related
sorry , i'm really apologize
what is it ?
yeah, I have seen it the whole day now, but I will not touch it until I now what it is and what it does
Scary stuff :wink:
It's Novosec Smartfilter 1.1, cracked, and it should not be here. Mods, could you take this off?
For anybody interested in testing this software and is unsure of the operator code for their service provider, which is needed to make this work, go to this link where you will find a list of provider codes.
http://www.techbitz.co.uk/mobile/secrets/servicecodes.htm
This is an interesting piece of software, it comes with little information but once it is working it does what it says. I tested it by putting my home number on block, tried ringing my xda from my (blocked) home number and got the response, "it has not been possible to connect your call, please try later", if my answer service was enabled it would have switched over to that. You can have lots of different profiles with diferent numbers blocked or allowed, you can also block unknown numbers, witheld numbers etc.
Its a great post and a great software i suggest keeping it plz. We need such posts...
thanks
Compleet list of Operator codes
If you try it on my phone it activates the the ignor button is that correct?
Looking for the compleet list look here:
http://www.funsms.net/service_provider_code_list.htm
:wink:
Greatings and keep up the good work 8)
Hey all...
this program looks like just wut I need (some old lady won't stop calling me)
Im in the US...and all i seen on the Service Provider List were PCS....I have Tmobile...is there a way for me to utilize this prog?
ThanX
Hi all,
It's nice s/w ... However there are 2 missing features:
1. How can you add a number not in your contact list ?
2. There is no context menu either in contact list or calls history like"Add to Smart Filter" .... CallerFirewall has this one.
one minor comment ... Magic Button actually close the application instead of only keep it in the back ground. I think the author should have developed it to use system thread instead of normal application thread.
The display of a blocked call as a missed call is great idea ... I thought I won't be informed in any way but found it useful ... at least to apologize later when I 'm reachable
Yeah does anyone have it working on TMobile US?
Actually got mine to work....just put in 1 in country code and left provider blank.
COPYRIGHT INFRIGEMENT
COPYRIGHT INFRIGEMENT
Dear webmasters of xda-developers.com,
:arrow: REMOVE THE FILE ABOVE IMMEDIATELY.
You haven't responded to any of our emails. This is your last chance. In case this file is not removed within the next 24 hours we have to report an offence to the police in order to close your site.
If you are going to provide any of our software (which is under copyright) in future we will proceed this necessary step without any further notice.
It is not our problem, that your users can upload anything. You have to ensure that your site will not infringe our copyrights.
In addition to this we will proceed against the user who uploaded this file.
Maik Stohn
NOVOSEC
[email protected]
Re: COPYRIGHT INFRIGEMENT
stohn said:
COPYRIGHT INFRIGEMENT
Dear webmasters of xda-developers.com,
:arrow: REMOVE THE FILE ABOVE IMMEDIATELY.
You haven't responded to any of our emails. This is your last chance. In case this file is not removed within the next 24 hours we have to report an offence to the police in order to close your site.
If you are going to provide any of our software (which is under copyright) in future we will proceed this necessary step without any further notice.
It is not our problem, that your users can upload anything. You have to ensure that your site will not infringe our copyrights.
In addition to this we will proceed against the user who uploaded this file.
Maik Stohn
NOVOSEC
[email protected]
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LOL!
Here is free speech forum!
If you don't like the forum, please go away! Or filing legal action again the India guy who posted the software!
Who cares your copyright!
Copyright means everybody has Right to Copy!
Hello,
FREE SPEECH, hopefully not a WAREZ SITE!
Maik Stohn
NOVOSEC
Maik - A PR genius
Message e-mailed to the brainiac:
Maik,
You aren't the brightest, obviously. Somebody posted your software to a site that has very targeted very significant traffic... of all people that carry an expensive device and are interested in software enhancements, incidentally the market you are trying to pursue.
Oh so let's see what your PR genuis does... (PR = public relations, an entirely foreign concept to you, no doubt):
So you go on there and post threatening messages. Instead of turning the challenge into an opportunity (ie. implementing better copy protection, releasing a new version, getting user feedback, etc) your minimal amount of cranial content came up with just posting threats. I had looked at your site and entertained the possibility of trying out your product but after reading that abnoxious post I decided otherwise.
I advocate against funding beligerent dimwits who go put threats on a community board that's supported by a bunch of guys at no cost and in their spare time. Again, in case the general tone of my message didn't convey my personal sentiments... I think you are a complete moron.
Good Day.
you tell him wayandrs :twisted:
The more we speak about it, the more it will be downloaded, any proper feedback on this software - any bugs :lol:
I'm very sorry about it, but now I'm realy sure.
The main intention of this board is to tell developers to kick the XDA/MDA platform.
I wonder what NAH6.com will say about hosting
XDA-(WAREZ)-DEVELOPERS.COM
Maik
to wayandrs:
You are right. I'm not the brightest. I should be glad that my software is here for free. It doesn't matter if I can't pay my bills. But I have to be glad that you take my work and use it. How can I use this scheme to build a house? Please teach me.
Stohn, believe it or not, it can be a good idea to have a program out that has no restrictions so that a potential user can fully evaluate it and discover its usefulness, if it is found to be useful I know many people that will then buy the full retail version because they can be sure that the software fits the purpose. Crippled and time limited software prevents this evaluation process. I know that some people will never pay for something they can get for free, that is a fact of life but there are also many that will pay because they are thankful that their tasks are made easier by the programmer/author of the software.
cruisin-thru said:
Stohn, believe it or not, it can be a good idea to have a program out that has no restrictions so that a potential user can fully evaluate it and discover its usefulness, if it is found to be useful I know many people that will then buy the full retail version because they can be sure that the software fits the purpose. Crippled and time limited software prevents this evaluation process. I know that some people will never pay for something they can get for free, that is a fact of life but there are also many that will pay because they are thankful that their tasks are made easier by the programmer/author of the software.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Stohn,
I agree with, and respect your right to protect your intellectual property. My own livelihood depends upon it, as I develop web-based applications which are in use by thousands of people. However, the way you have publically handled this scenario is, IMHO, not the best way to have done it. Similar incidences that have occured in the past have taught me that privately contacting the parties concerned meets with positive results.
just take a look at PocketZenPhone to see what we mean by free software http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=6162 - this is free and being developed/ improved daily (even hourly) by the developer (Zendrui) from the feedback the users are providing to him; of which, I am one (very happy one, as well)... I have little doubt that Zendrui will come to a point where he will provide features in a Pro version that we would gladly pay money for.
Perhaps providing a lite version would be a way of collecting useful feedback about your product, which can then be built into a Pro version. This has been done for years, and has likely been done so because it works; for the users and developer alike.
To use a collective term such as Warez, or even hint that we all are interested in this line of illegal activity is very dangerous for you, and opens you up to legal proceedings for slander. Sure, we are hackers, but not crackers, warez junkies or any other descriptive for which your comment was intended.
We meet here because we like the technology, we like to see how it works, what makes it tick, and to see how much further we can utilise the technology that we hold in our hands.
Hey,
As most of you know, I am the sole owner of touch innovation. I have done alot to this website (and I still have more to come). THe problem is, over the next half year I have alot of work ahead of me, that affects my future. But I don't particulary want to go into it.
I want someone that can look after and keep the site going for up to 6 months. I know you're thinking "What's the point in this, what do I get out of it?". Well, you get experience.
You'll get a weekly number of emails, submissions etc from people that use the website, you can monitor these, and help out there questions.
You can add programs from here etc.
Why Am I asking this?
I have spent months and months of coding this website (considering the website is only 4 months old, it's a lot of work). And I've hit a niche in the market, people want a website like this, and I am supplying them with one, but I need it to be updated while I am gone. Maybe some marketing (aka advertising) as well, so everything is running peak, and more users are coming.
This is a non-profit organisation, I make no money out of it.
I will pay the guy at the end (maybe), dependant on how much they have done to the website. And I want them to take it upon them self to make any adjustments. The site will potentially be yours for the half year (I will be checking up on it, and If there are some changes that are iffy, I will contact you about it).
It's good experience, and maybe helping me + the community out for a while.
Thanks guys,
-------------------
Okay, another idea, A team of people can request to be part of the team, and keep the site running well and keep it updated for the time I'm gone
Touch Innovation team (to-be's):
nir36
jackkkkk
Kenshino
jdiperla
AkshayGenius
Hannigan174
churka
Thanks for anyone who helps in advance, I will be up for giving a little price tag at the end, dependant on whether they've applied effort to maintain the site
No one?
I think it would be awesome to have this opportunity but I have no experience in html coding. Just the basics.
I thought I had replied to this :/
Erm, you dont need any html coding skills. You just need to know how to keep a website updated (using xda, and others) using my simple but easy and clever admin panel. Also advertise to keep hits up etc.
Napbree, I would gladly take this website, but i'm MEGAbusy with studies and work.
I suggest that instead of granting this website to another "sole" person, you create users in your admin panel and grant them to a few people who will keep it updated. I build websites and I can tell you that there's no way i'd be able to handle even one of those i've built, myself.
If a group of people are willing to help, I will be one of them.
I'll also try creating commercial opportunities for the website - profitwise.
I'd usually say "This is not the place to post these kind of posts.. use the Q&A section".. which comes naturally nowadays..
but considering the importance of this... I think we need this thread bumped up until you manage to get what you wish for.
Yes, that would be great. You've given me an awesome idea. A team of people that can mointor and keep the site up and running well, and content updated etc.
I'll start making a list of people who want to become part of the team
And if you could get a commercial opportunity, that would be amazing. I'd be up for selling it as well (maybe). It's just I want to keep the site of my hands for a while. Because my dad died only a week ago, and i'm entering a state of depression, and I need to get out into the world and keep myself busy.
Thanks
Someone?
I really like this site, and would like to see it continue.
Nathan has done such great job on developing this site, it would be shame, to see it gone waste!
So anyone who has motivation and some time to take this site under ownership, please contact nathan!
Ps. I'm one of admins of this site, and can tell you that it's really easy to update site, because of the nathan's clever admin panel. I would do it myself if i had the time, but my studies and and other projects takes too much time.
All friends of this site, let's get this thread bumped until we get some help for nathan
Firstly.. i'm sorry. Be well.
Secondly, I have some connections.. I can't promise anything but i might be able to get some advertisments going.. we'll see how it goes.
Also, if manage to get some time off .. sometime.. I'll create flash banners and put them up.
COUNT ME IN.
Thank you allevant
And nir36 thanks again, that would be mucho appreciated! very generous
I'm willing to help...
But I'm not sure if I got any use thou as I got no tech experiences or running a website.
My best experience is being a gaming forum moderator and basic computer/pda knowledge.
But, if you think I'm a good canadiate please let me know as I would like to help in anyways.
You don't really need experience in running a site. As long as you can spend some time on the admin panel to add content, it's all good.
I've added you to the to-be team , hope you don't mind.
Thanks! future for the site is looking brighter this is just a bump post
I'll bump your bump
Dear Napbree,
I am an Application Consultant and actually my job consists of making corporate websites for government entities.
Websites I've done include (not exhaustive list)
http://www.infocommsingapore.sg/industry/
and
http://www.infocommsingapore.sg/games
Same domain but totally different things.
So do count me in if you need help running the website.
I am certified in JAVA (Have Sun Certified Java Programmer and Developer certs) and am proficient in both JSP and Applications.
Currently I am writing CMS based websites using PHP, CSS, HTML and Javascript.
I can definitely write some code to add more cool functionality to your website
I'll bumb your bumbing my bumb
Hi Kenshino,
Application consultant heh, nice!
At the moment, I will be able to code up new sections for the site, for example, the new update that will come sooner or later (when I have time to finish it), has live submission, which means users can instantly add applications, as long as it applies with a few of my automated checks.
But if you have any ideas, and you want to code them up, you can definately! But I wouldn't be able to give source code, but you can code it seperately and then I can incoroporate it nicely
Thank you lots for your interest
Nathan
Hey, I volunteer too. I am a PC administrator and had had success in hosting my own sites in the past as well as prior administration duties to games like http://www.swcombine.com
Sounds great
Added you to the list, I will contact you all in the future, once I have a nice big list of contributors
Thanks
let's keep this on top.
Hello!
I´m interrested in Android as well as in the tm G1.
Now the G1 is announced here in Germany for the second of february.
My problem at the moment is, that I have read and heard, that google is collecting data (everything)! So if you read the "terms and conditions", what do you think about that or don´t you care? I mean they have the rights over everything you load/send/post/get....and more!
How do you handle that fact personally for you?
Greetings!
Carter
That's just the nature of the emphasis on cloud computing. Personally my stance is simply to not conduct any business on my G1 that I would mind Google knowing/datamining. Regardless of what companies claim in their privacy policies, the very best way to 100% guarantee your data will be misused is simply to not willingly give it out.
Edit: also keep in mind that the (potentially) datamining portions of Android generally revolve around those apps and services which are closed-source apps provided by Google that are not a part of the Android Open Source Project. These include for example the Market, GMail, GTalk, and so forth.
ok, I get your point, but what is the G1 without Gmail/Calendar etc.
And thats all google.
Because of the poor response on my question I think that the majority doesn´t care about google´s data collecting hype.
In my eyes their acting is scary....imagine the details they know about you and many many other people....
just my opinion...
Greetz!
They don't collect any personal information. Not only that but they don't have people looking at these records. A computer does all the work, and is only used to find keywords.
Look at this site's search (the one on xda not google) it works by taking every word and putting it in a database and when you search the word it shows the corresponding posts. so post1 has wordA and post2 has wordA and wordB, and when you search for wordB you only get post2. The same concept is in place for google... except it goes one step further. The spider takes out words that are not needed. Well they have been using this for your GMail for sometime as well. It is why they have excellent spam control and it is why google is so awesome. They use the same process to check emails when you click links. Basically they are just trying to find out who uses what sites for what reasons. If they figure out all this they can better help you and the company you were visiting.
Chances are if you are on a site that is doing something illegal Google already knows it exisists.
someone can always watch if they want, on a g1 or PC, or anything connected. Just don't do anything dumb.
i think its obscene and absurd how gung hoe they are with it. If you want access to the playstore gawdam they better have every member of your family and every person you've ever met profiled as well as around the clock location tracking with a serial # and every keystroke on your device. And dont you dare make any attempts to disable any of their spyware or you can kiss YouTube apps and the play store goodbye. Its pathetic what they've done to Android and its users. And the reason it pisses me of the most is because I don't even really use free apps. They're all either paid for or open.
so after posting an excerpt of my letter to Dan Morrill, the author of the absolutely idiotic statement regarding what they're doing, i received several PMs asking me to post the whole thing. It's so long it wont fit in a single post, so read it all. if you dont want to read a wall of text, stop here and go to a new thread.
Mr. Morrill,
First, I would like to bid you a good day, as I'm sure this letter is going to effect it. Yes, that is a bold statement to make at the onset, but writings such as these have a way of eating their way into your psyche and leaving a lasting impression that could very well sour your appetite at lunch time.
Perhaps I should introduce myself. My name is XXXXXXXXXXXXX, and I am an amateur developer on the Android platform. I am also a user of many of the custom Android builds that have come out since the release of the source development kit, including the build made by Steve "Cyanogen" Kondik. Ah, yes, now you see what this letter is going to be about.
So lets start with the basics. Google is a multi-billion dollar corporation that released a supposedly open-source platform onto the mobile device market. Now, I say mobile device as opposed to mobile phone, simply because there are products being released, such as the Zii EGG, which do not support telecommuniations, yet are still running on the Android platform. Now, in any reasonable programmers mind, the reason for making a platform open source, regardless of what the Public Relations people spin it as, is to alleviate some of the burden on the actual in-house development teams. The source code created by thousands of bright minds is doubtless going to yield a much stonger end result than that of a small development squad. Its simple mathematics. Well, that point alongside the fact that the original linux developers made no secret of their intentions by open-sourcing their operating system, which paved the way for Android many many years later.
In addition to that, all of the applications included in the "stock", or unmodified and officially released Android, builds are free. Any user with internet access can use any of these functions through the internet, with the blessings of your employer, free of charge. Yet, somehow, this has caused a sort of hiccup between your supposed idea of free development and that of the general public. Now, before you warp your mind into "this guy doesnt know what he's talking about" mode, think about the principles that your company was founded upon. You wanted to beat out the corporate giants and look out for the little guy. Oh yes, I've done my homework on Google over the years. The benevolent company trying to provide free services for the masses that the "evil-empire" corporations would deny free access to. Ironically enough, this letter is being written to you on Google Docs, another of your free services. Quite troublesome, it would seem.
And now, lest I digress further, I'll shift to the meat of the topic. In your statement regarding the cease and desist letter to Mr. Kondik, you claim that the sales of your free software to be used on mobile platforms being provided to the end user by custom developers for free would hurt the bottom line. Perhaps you should re-examine your own words. Free software being given to the masses by developers whom you claim to encourage is huring your profit share because you cannot sell the use of it to large corporations. Pardon me if I fail to understand the rationale behind such a contradictory and obviously ridiculous statement. But just so that you can understand my position on the matter, lets look at a related position. Google produces an internet browser, Chrome. Mozilla, a competing franchise, produces Firefox, their own browser. Developers for firefox have created applications which borrow on Google's proprietary code to access the functionality of the various features and programs. Are these developers charged for being able to include such features? No. Are these developers caused to halt their activities through threats of legal action for providing end users access to the capabilities that Google readily offers for free? No. So where is the disparity between allowing a competitor to do such things and tying the hands of developers of YOUR open source platform from doing the same?
Before I go further, let me give you a little background on myself to illuminate things. I used to work for XXXXXXXXXXXXXX. I worked in one of their call centers with well over a thousand people, almost a quarter of whom purchased the G1. More than 50% of those users had custom builds running on their phones. How would I know this? I personally installed it on over 300 and gave instructions to many more who wanted to do it themselves. This was one call center. But your apparent attitude on the situation makes it apparent that providing these people with custom software that includes the Google-based programs that were ORIGINALLY ON THE DEVICE AT PURCHASE, is illegal. I'm sorry sir, but that notion is preposterous. All of the Android-based mobile platforms on the market today include the software that caused you to send Mr. Kondik a cease and desist letter. This means that every single end user who purchased one of the devices paid that bottom line you spoke of. Any other rationale is impossible. Non-supporting devices will not run Android, and as such, the only way to use the device is to have purchased one. This brings us to the logical conclusion that those applications, such as GMail and Google Talk are PAID FOR. The situation is equitable to this situation: Joe purchases a computer from a major distributor, say Dell. Dell gives Joe a complimentary piece of free software (available on the Dell website) which updates his drivers on the Dell website, included with his purchase. Joe decides he doesnt particularly like the operating system on the computer, and installs an operating system more to his liking, that also happens to include the Dell software. But lo-and-behold, that free software shouldnt be free to Joe, even though he paid Dell's bottom line through his original computer purchase.
Your flaw is that you are obviously trying to "spin" the situation. Unfortunately, its a thin disguise and everyone can see through it, clear as crystal. These people that I speak of? Developers. The developers whom you claim to encourage. This brings me to my next point. Developers are essentially software hackers. They take the code from a program, rip it apart, improve on it, and then put it back out on the market for other developers to toy with. Perhaps, in your travels as a computer programmer, you have come across a copy of the much fabled "hacker's manifesto". Free access to data. That is what it was about at its core philosophy. You claimed to provide developers with that free access through Android, and then punish the people whom you claim to support.
Have you ever seen "The Devil's Advocate", Mr. Morrill? Al Pacino has an excellent line in which he is describing the way God imbued man with instinct, saying "Think about it. He gives man instincts. He gives you this extraordinary gift, and then what does He do, I swear for His own amusement, his own private, cosmic gag reel, He sets the rules in opposition. It's the goof of all time. Look but don't touch. Touch, but don't taste. Taste, don't swallow." Is this not what you've done here? You've given us, the developers, what you claim to be an open-source platform, written for mobile platforms that contain previously installed versions of the software, and also containing applications that each and every possible user would have purchased through buying the device on which they run. Then you tell us that it is illegal for us to modify any portion of that software which you see fit at any given point in time. Perhaps you should have just kept it closed-source, so that anything innovative wouldnt stir controvversy, as it would have truly been illegal. You give us a gift and then set the rules in opposition as it suits you.
Now, if I havent struck a nerve yet, perhaps I will in my own belief on the subject. You FEAR us. The android development team put out an initial platform. The developers, using the source code given to us, have turned out platforms on several different versions that utilize more functionality with greater performance, more flexibility and a wider range of features than ANYTHING that the official releases have even come close to. Mr. Kondik's releases are a prime example of this. He has created a version of the platform which utilizes every aspect of the platform infinitely better than the official releases. He has also included functionality from FUTURE releases, constantly and consistently improving on such, in a timeframe that should have your development team in absolute hysterics. That, sir, is what I believe this is about. Fear and shame. Never did you imagine that the Android development community would be able to surpass the Godly heights of the original development team, but we have and continually do so. It's his popularity that earned him the letter. He posed the biggest threat to your team by sharing a creative vision with anyone willing to install it that your team couldn't possibly compete with. But what about all of the other major developers? As of right now, I can count over a hundred different custom builds that include much of the same functionality and applications that Mr. Kondik's software includes. Are you going to attempt to stop them too?
(continued in post #2)
I assume you have been on the internet before. I assume you know that it spans the globe and has absolutely no limits or boundaries. It is freedom at its peak. Anyone, anywhere can express anything they want. The beautiful thing is that it enables people to communicate, and thereby collaborate in real-time. An internet community with thirty thousand people doesnt have to find a meeting room with enough chairs. This is the problem you're facing. You have attempted to cut the head off of a snake that you created. Unfortunately, on the internet, when you cut off the head of a snake, the body doesnt die. A thousand more heads spawn in its place, angrier, defiant and more intent on their purpose. Perhaps that should be a wake up call.
Mr. Morrill, I hope that in reading this letter, you have come to realize the gravity of your position. You have not only hurt yourselves, but angered an entire community, consisting of tens, if not hundreds, of thousands of people. These are the people who write the applications that are sold on the Android Market. These are the people who have the time to spare to ensure that you still have a job by creating works of digital art, using the code that you claim to be "open source". Are you so obtuse as to believe that these people are going to slip silently into the night when their creativity is stifled by the whims of a multibillion dollar corporation? I think not, sir.
You simply cannot give freedom to the masses and then attempt to bind their hands, as you are attempting to do in this case. This has ended in cataclysmic failure for every culture and every authority that has attempted to do so in history. We live in a global society of ingenuity. People WILL find a way. The creative power of the developers of the android community will inevitably break you. History has shown ample evidence that a creative mind cannot be beaten down. No army of lawyers, no amount of cease and desist letters will stop the tide of creativity.
It's like a bear. The choice you had was to embrace this creativity and nurture it or to poke at it with a stick. Mr. Morrill, are you aware of the consequences of poking a bear with a stick? Some thought on that will bring you to an obvious, and quite unpleasant, conclusion.
Had you simply left well enough alone, the damage might have been minimal, but at this point you could be looking at a 2009 reenactment of the Boston Tea Party, with the Android platform playing the part of the British tea. The damage to your "bottom line" was so infinitesimally small as to equate to a mouse burping on a rush hour subway car in New York City. As stated previously, it is simply my belief that your development team was offended by the fact that amateur developers would put them to shame. Does Android come with a complimentary set of swim trunks? Perhaps you might invest. I hear Boston Harbor gets cold in the winter.
In closing, perhaps you should let the immortal words of Japanese Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto echo through your mind as you contemplate the statements made in this letter:
"I fear that all we have done is to awaken a sleeping giant and fill him with a terrible resolve".
Mr. Morrill, the giant is awake now, and his resolve is beyond your wildest dreams. I truly hope you are prepared to reap the consequences of what you have put in motion.
Sincerely,
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
amazing. your right they do fear us and they have woken a sleeping giant. what i dont get is the fact that these roms are making this phone better. as you said you gave over 300 people instructions how to do this at the call center. if anything these devs are helping google make sales, and google doesnt even have to make a better product. they make they same thing tht has been out since 0ct.22.2008 and the devs make it better. you sir are a god among men.
Wow, great letter, really looking forward to hearing the response to this - If you'd post it that is ;-)
You misspelt "purchased" in the eighth paragraph btw
yeah, this was the pre-spell-checked rough draft. the copy that i sent him was clean as a whistle.
Interesting letter. Not to mock you or anything, but it reminds me a lot of Keith Olbermann.
I am a RSA for TMO, and one of the major selling points was that Android was (is?) Open Source. That was a big deal to many customers.
I don't think the folks over a Google realize how tech savvy even the dumbest tech user is.
Had probably a 60 year old man come in the other day and he had put Hero on his G1 by himself.
(No offense to any oldsters.)
The world is changing, and Google just jumped in front of that subway train you mentioned.
this was truly a great letter. i would love to see the response (if you even get one) to this. i feel inspired to go do something now...
Android users, this is your call to arms.
Before you go and write long winded threatening letters to someone, maybe you should look into what you are writing about first. The person you are writing the letter to is an employee of a company that tells him what to do. I doubt after all of the help he has given developers and "hackers" in the Android irc channel, that he was just planning on striking everything down. My guess, and that of many others who know of him (havent chatted a lot, but he is social with us) would be that he was told to write that post. I dont want cyanogen roms to go away either, but I think you are going at it the wrong way. Hate the company, not the developers.
And after re-reading the post, you mention installing this on devices that already have it. The exact same arguement I used but you must also realize that an HTC hero does not get these Google Apps. It is an HTC branded phone and instead gets HTC branded apps. The "With Google" phones are the only ones that come with these apps pre-installed. Even then, apparently (I just found this out today) that your license to these apps does not allow you to copy them OFF of the device they came on. So that cut down another idea we had: copy the apps from the rom to SD, flash image, copy apps back.
Once again, I do not disagree with you or your anger, I just disagree with who you are directing it at.
irrelevant. "i was just doing what i was told" is never an excuse. it doesnt work in the justice system, and it doesnt work here. i could elaborate more, but i really dont want to invoke Godwin's Law this early in the conversation. he opened his mouth. he made himself the target. everyone is a nice and helpful person until they show their true colors.
perhaps its just me, but i'm one of those people that actually hold to my ideals. if i'm fighting for something and my boss tells me to do otherwise, i'm going to tell him to pack sand. if I get fired, i can always find a new job, but I can do so with my integrity intact. he had a choice. everyone always has a choice.
also, to your second post, the HTC branded phones arent the subject of controversy. the apps are "free". i quote free because it isnt true in this case. how is distributing the official Gmail app for free any different than accessing the same capabilities through another means? if I were to delete the official GMail app off of my phone entirely and instead access my gmail account through a browser, wouldnt that have the same effect on Google's "bottom line"? I'm still using the same service and not paying for it. Similarly, with the hero, if you have access to GMail through any email application or browser, are you not violating the same concept? You're still using the core of google's intellectual property for free. Their only real solution is to make the Google apps paid applications that everyone has access to if they want to shell out the cash, or simply drop the whole thing.
Are they going to stop people from creating custom GMail apps too? Cause if so, they've got a big fish to fry, cause they'd have to go after everyone who wrote a gmail plugin for firefox as well. any way you look at it, they're not going to stop the development community from going on, its simply too big.
If Dell gives you a "free" copy of vista on your laptop, and then you buy a compaq with linux installed on it. Does that mean you have the right to install your "free" vista on the compaq also? It was free! How about you write a new windows shell and you bundle your free windows vista with it. And you also throw in your free copy of Office that came with it.
I understand their point and I realize these examples are not EXACT enough to matter, but the point does. They give you the apps for A SPECIFIC device and they give them to you with rules. Rules that we do not like.
I feel that they instead of C&D'ing him, should have had a little sit down with him. Said "hey, we realize you are doing a lot of good for us by promoting our product and giving those who want more what they ask for when we cannot, but we have some rules for you. A, you must make every attempt you can to make sure the roms you distribute go on authorized "With Google" devices. B, not release stuff you do not have permission to release." This would allow google to control what he releases enough to fit within the rules (keeps carriers from saying "hey, he can release your apps without paying, why cant we?"). They would also benefit from the many thousands of users who flock to these custom roms but realize they are unusable in their bare forms.
And so you do not have to, I will be the first to pull the term nazi out of my hat in this one
I agree completely. As i said in the letter, they could have nurtured creativity (i.e. having a sit down with him and saying "hey look, we know that this is going to non-google devices and we cant have that, so make an attempt to not let it happen") or poke it with a stick. They chose the stick, and now they get to reap the backlash.
I also understand your initial examples, and while they do hold true for the circumstance, windows isnt lauded as being an open-source platform. In addition, i havent heard of microsoft going after people who create custom shells that utilize windows information, so long as they put a disclaimer on it saying that you're only allowed to use them if you're running an authorized copy of the OS. The same should have been done here, as you suggested.
Also, microsoft has specific anti-piracy safeguards in place to keep you from installing that software on your compaq that didnt come with it. Can you get around it? sure. Piracy happens, but its also illegal. But google has no such safeguards on the apps. Is it because they lacked the foresight to see this coming? Absolutely. If they didnt want the apps installed on non-branded/non-approved devices, then perhaps they should have made it impossible to do so. Sure, people would eventually find a way around it, but then they'd have a legitimate piracy gripe. As it is now, they dont. You dont hand a kid a cookie, let him eat half and then snatch it away because he shared the chocolate chips. You keep him away from the cookies from the get-go.
It really is a sad state of affiars. If something is going to be free, such as GMail, then Google shouldnt care how the users access it. How big of a chunk of their profits do you think its really going to hurt if people with the hero get a free copy of the gmail app? I bet their legal team made for handling this "issue" than it would cost them in ten years. If the apps in question were paid apps, then I would completely understand. People shouldnt get something free that they should have to pay for, which is one of the reasons that XDA has such a strict "warez" policy. But thats not the case.
The simplest solution would have been to realize that "oops, we did tell them it was open source, maybe we should clarify a bit and see if we can come to a reasonable understanding". But alas...
Also, to your point that the apps came with a specific device, what about those that purchased a device with those apps? We have a right to be using them as we see fit. When I bought my phone, I never signed anything that said that I couldnt theme the application if I wanted to. Google never made me sign a contract. And they couldnt, it would be ridiculous. What about people that purchased them on ebay or craigslist without a contract? They still bought the device and are the owner, and they certainly didnt have to agree not to modify any content. Is google going to go after every developer and every themer now too? Are they going to go after every end user who modified their content? It's just as illegal as making a rom that allows it to happen in the eyes of the law. Apple is attempting to do the same sort of crap with people jailbreaking the iphone. They're saying that even though you bought it, apple technically still owns it, so anything you do to it is illegal. Theres a huge legal debate going on over it right now and apple looks like theyre probably going to lose.
The safeguard they have in place is lack of root access. If you have root access yo have exploited a bug and are acting out of the designed use of the phone. You would not be able to backup or otherwise access these app files. Also, you would not be able to flash the new rom without root, which you gained by exploiting a bug.
Absolutely. But at the same time, the whole "exploiting a bug" argument is similarly null. If the bug never existed, two things would be true:
1. There would be no custom roms for end users, which Mr. Morrill says he supports and looks forward to seeing more of. This would be true since the idea of creating custom software would be idiotic as nobody would be able to install it. The only people utilizing the open-source framework would be major development houses, such as what creative is doing with the plazma stem-cell android that they're putting on the EGG. Application development has nothing to do with open source. The iPhone is not open source, but you can still develop apps for it.
2. The claim that they have about the free distribution of their intellectual property would hold merit, as it would be legitimate software piracy, instead of an unintended side effect of faulty design.
The first point is what makes this a farce. We, as developers, found a way to get custom software onto our devices, something which we were never intended to do. One of two things should have happened at that point: they should have let us continue to do it, which they did (closing the loophole could have been done, they could have found a way to prevent downgrading, seeing as there are no other OS options for the device) or they could have stopped it there and said that exploiting the bug is illegal. Its been a year since the device came out. This has been going on for a YEAR. You mean to tell me that this is an issue NOW and wasnt a year ago when it first started? Its only an issue because they're not the only game in town anymore. Ridiculous. Someone got their feathers ruffled and wanted to take out the little guy.
Ok, I am not going to keep replying to your endless wandering rebuttals. I feel you are wrong in who you are aiming your hate mail at and that is the end of the story.
Thats fine, and I do apologize for being excessively adamant about it. But I still feel I'm right. You only paint a target on yourself if you're prepared for people to shoot at you. Thats all I can say about it.
Darkrift said:
If Dell gives you a "free" copy of vista on your laptop, and then you buy a compaq with linux installed on it. Does that mean you have the right to install your "free" vista on the compaq also? It was free! How about you write a new windows shell and you bundle your free windows vista with it. And you also throw in your free copy of Office that came with it.
I understand their point and I realize these examples are not EXACT enough to matter, but the point does. They give you the apps for A SPECIFIC device and they give them to you with rules. Rules that we do not like.
I feel that they instead of C&D'ing him, should have had a little sit down with him. Said "hey, we realize you are doing a lot of good for us by promoting our product and giving those who want more what they ask for when we cannot, but we have some rules for you. A, you must make every attempt you can to make sure the roms you distribute go on authorized "With Google" devices. B, not release stuff you do not have permission to release." This would allow google to control what he releases enough to fit within the rules (keeps carriers from saying "hey, he can release your apps without paying, why cant we?"). They would also benefit from the many thousands of users who flock to these custom roms but realize they are unusable in their bare forms.
And so you do not have to, I will be the first to pull the term nazi out of my hat in this one
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Click to collapse
About your dell giving you a "free" copy of vista. As long as that CD key is only used on one computer, you can use that CD key on ANY computer. Read their TOS. Your are wrong about a lot, but right about some. Changing the integrity of the windows shell is illegal, because that is microsoft property and NOT open source, but anytime you purchase an OS, or computer, you OWN that cd key of the software, all apps that come included as well. Could you try another example?
nice letter.
not so sure about the whole HTC (not "with google") phone thing- my magic is a HTC magic (32A) and it came will every single google app preinstalled on it.... not sure about hero though...
MontAlbert said:
nice letter.
not so sure about the whole HTC (not "with google") phone thing- my magic is a HTC magic (32A) and it came will every single google app preinstalled on it.... not sure about hero though...
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Click to collapse
Hero did too.
Regards,
Dave
Cyrket is back up
http://www.cyrket.com/
Saurik will be adding back the ability to sort by date when he gets it sorted out.
Nice! It's a much 'cleaner' interface than androlib.com, even if it doesn't have quite as many features. I see they're supporting the Palm catalog now as well. Very cool, as my girlfriend has a Pre Anyone know why they were down for so long? Hopefully Saurik will be able to add more features in the near future.
SpyderMS said:
Nice! It's a much 'cleaner' interface than androlib.com, even if it doesn't have quite as many features. I see they're supporting the Palm catalog now as well. Very cool, as my girlfriend has a Pre Anyone know why they were down for so long? Hopefully Saurik will be able to add more features in the near future.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
From Twitter
About a week ago, it finally hit me: how to run a ~reasonably~ live Cyrket without being rate limited by Google. A week of no sleep later...[/QUOTE]
SpyderMS said:
Nice! It's a much 'cleaner' interface than androlib.com, even if it doesn't have quite as many features.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please send me an e-mail (do not just reply to this forum post: e-mail will be much more useful for me) with a list of features you think are important. The three things on the public todo list (which should be done pretty soon) are: 1) fix the display of permissions, which is simply stupidly broken; 2) get "newest/latest stuff" working again; 3) rewrite the RSS feed mechanism to work with the new site architecture (which requires #2 to be finished first); and 4) allow comments to be browsed in a more meaningful fashion than "show a bunch of comments for this app". There are other features that will likely happen, but those are the only ones I'm saying /are/ to users ;P.
saurik said:
Please send me an e-mail (do not just reply to this forum post: e-mail will be much more useful for me) with a list of features you think are important.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
please share your email address?
The ONLY thing I would like to see on Cyrket would be pretty URLs.
Instead of:
http://www.cyrket.com/search?market=android&category=6953
I would like:
http://www.cyrket.com/m/android/applications
Other than that, I think it's a very useful site!
OrganizedFellow said:
please share your email address?
The ONLY thing I would like to see on Cyrket would be pretty URLs.
Instead of:
/search?market=android&category=6953
I would like:
/m/android/applications
Other than that, I think it's a very useful site!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My e-mail address is on every website I run, including Cyrket's home page.
I go to great lengths to make the URLs on Cyrket readable:
/p/android/net.tastybits.heat/icon
However, this anal attitude towards URLs means that I will not make a URL that I can't support going forward. The category tree is simply not stable at this time, nor do I really want it to be considered "stable". However, the category ID numbers in the search URL actually are stable: those nodes I can rearrange and then guarantee I can support old URLs.
(Out of curiosity: why are you even caring about those URLs? The only URLs I'd expect would matter to anyone would be the URLs for the packages themselves, metadata about the packages, and the URL for "newest stuff", which still hasn't been rewritten into the website yet.)
/Please/, however, send me any and all feature requests via e-mail: it would be difficult to make my e-mail address any more public than it is, and I get hundreds of e-mails a day from users, so I'm surprised you couldn't find it. My address is [email protected] (I had to put the (at) because the forum got mad at me).
Well first off, my apologies if what I said came across as 'anal'. After re-reading what I wrote, I can't find where you get that?!
Second, I admit I did not visit your site to look for your email address. I did view your profile here on XDA, but none was available. So. Sorry for that.
Why do I care about pretty URLs?
I talk to alot of people about Android - DumbPhone friends, Android friends, and iPhone friends.
I have tested & reviewed many apps, and share this information with these friends.
In my talks with them, I often tell them about Cyrket, which I prefer over other sites like androidtapp.com or androlib.com due to their complexity (no disrespect meant to either operator of those respective sites).
In my opinion, I just prefer Cyrket with its simpler layout, basic information, and ease of navigation.
The other sites I find 'too much going on'.
Having a pretty URL makes for easier memorizing of a URL. It's also easier to write down later. All this is just easier, faster, better to share with someone else.
As the 'web master' or 'developer' of Cyrket.com, I would have thought you knew all this. Even if it doesn't change, I'm just saying it's a better user experience for visitors to have Pretty URLs throughout the entire site for uniformity.
On a personal note: I just tend to prefer my reference sites which are easy on the eyes with minimal distraction! Just as SpyderMS said in post#2.
SpyderMS said:
Nice! It's a much 'cleaner' interface than androlib.com, even if it doesn't have quite as many features.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Other than that, I think it's a very useful site!
OrganizedFellow said:
Well first off, my apologies if what I said came across as 'anal'. After re-reading what I wrote, I can't find where you get that?!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was saying that /I/ was "anal". I seriously spend hours fretting over the URL structure of Cyrket, which is why 99% of the website has such a beautiful URL structure. I dare you to find someone who spends as much time thinking about URLs as I do: that's why I used "anal" to describe myself.
*Sigh*... now that that got misinterpreted, though, the rest of your comment has gone down the "let's be hostile" avenue.
OrganizedFellow said:
Why do I care about pretty URLs?
I talk to alot of people about Android - DumbPhone friends, Android friends, and iPhone friends.
I have tested & reviewed many apps, and share this information with these friends.
In my talks with them, I often tell them about Cyrket, which I prefer over other sites like androidtapp.com or androlib.com due to their complexity (no disrespect meant to either operator of those respective sites).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Most of these other sites also have much worse URLs. AppTapp doesn't only because they create vanity URLs for every package they choose to make a review of (which is not practical, nor is it maintainable).
AndroLib:
w~ww.androlib.com/android.application.org-connectbot-BDC.aspx
w~ww.androlib.com/appicon/app-BDC.cs.png
AndroidZoom:
w~ww.androidzoom.com/android_applications/communication/connectbot_rbm.html
c~dn-1.androidzoom.com/logos/8835.png
Cyrket:
w~ww.cyrket.com/p/android/org.connectbot/
c~ache.cyrket.com/p/android/org.connectbot/icon
OrganizedFellow said:
Having a pretty URL makes for easier memorizing of a URL. It's also easier to write down later. All this is just easier, faster, better to share with someone else.
As the 'web master' or 'developer' of Cyrket.com, I would have thought you knew all this. Even if it doesn't change, I'm just saying it's a better user experience for visitors to have Pretty URLs throughout the entire site for uniformity.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What I asked was why you needed fast by-memory URL access to a subcategory sort. You managed to find the /one/ thing in Cyrket that currently has a bad URL, and made it an issue about the entire website.
I then explained the reason that one thing has a bad URL and asked you why you felt that specific page had such high-priority for having a better URL, and now you are acting like I don't consider good URLs important.
Frowny pants.
Oh, and OMG I HATE THIS FORUM, I am not even allowed to post URLs to it: please, for the love of all that is holy, send me e-mails in the future if you wish to continue this discussion.