Database Users

At&t geting crazy

AT&T wants us to be legit and not steal tether and this and that for Wht? They cap out speeds and when we finally get good Android phones its held down by moto blurr and a bootloader that is locked..... what do we do? How can we protest this? Lol maybe we should spray paint HSUPA AND #UNLOCKMOTO on store windows hahaha. Its wrong but its the only way to hitem how theyed care... financially that's the key to slowing them down financial hits. But really how can we get their attention?
Sent from Atrix ;-)

frankiedizzle87 said:
AT&T wants us to be legit and not steal tether and this and that for Wht? They cap out speeds and when we finally get good Android phones its held down by moto blurr and a bootloader that is locked..... what do we do? How can we protest this? Lol maybe we should spray paint HSUPA AND #UNLOCKMOTO on store windows hahaha. Its wrong but its the only way to hitem how theyed care... financially that's the key to slowing them down financial hits. But really how can we get their attention?
Sent from Atrix ;-)
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I have been wondering this as well. We need to organize or something. It has to start somewhere, I think everyone is aware of how bad corporate America has gotten but where is the breaking point?

project mayhem

frankiedizzle87 said:
AT&T wants us to be legit and not steal tether and this and that for Wht? They cap out speeds and when we finally get good Android phones its held down by moto blurr and a bootloader that is locked..... what do we do? How can we protest this? Lol maybe we should spray paint HSUPA AND #UNLOCKMOTO on store windows hahaha. Its wrong but its the only way to hitem how theyed care... financially that's the key to slowing them down financial hits. But really how can we get their attention?
Sent from Atrix ;-)
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Easy, switch carriers. You're still within 30 days. Return your phone, get out of your contract and switch.

jkrohn said:
Easy, switch carriers. You're still within 30 days. Return your phone, get out of your contract and switch.
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Its not that easy when you have family plans and your kind of trapped. $350 per line is a lot. Yea I might beable to fight with them and get out of it but it doesnt always work.

live4nyy said:
I have been wondering this as well. We need to organize or something. It has to start somewhere, I think everyone is aware of how bad corporate America has gotten but where is the breaking point?
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Corporate America is one thing, but consumers are largely at fault as well. Just look at the 'solutions' people talk about. Vandalism? These are franchises. You think that at&t store down the street is owned and operated directly by the corp? You're hurting local business owners.
The reality is, there's zero creativity on the part of irked consumers. They don't know how to get a message out, they don't know how to start a counter-culture. Today's 'rebels' all depend on 'the man' to keep in touch with each other anyway. They sit around on their thumbs signing contracts they don't read because HAVING service is all that matters at the time. We wait for competitors to sound attractive enough, but in the end brand loyalty and other principles are a higher priority.
We sit around waxing philosophical about open standards and open source and the openness of Android, but what if Android was a Verizon exclusive? Would you completely bend over and submit to everything anticonsumer about VZN just so you can proudly wear at least ONE badge of principles for supporting an open OS? Or is it perhaps better in the long run to support even the most locked down software and ecosystems as long as the carrier and the bigger picture meet ethical standards?
Frankly, I'd rather buy based on carrier FIRST, knowing that even if my platform today isn't brilliant, I'm supporting a network i'd rather see future platforms target.
We get so caught up beating off to open software that we ignore the reality that infrastructure is a 500x more important battle. And then we just betch and sob when the infrastructure isn't the way we want it.
Man up, stop worrying so much about whether something has the almighty GPL stamp of approval, and pay attention to the real war we should be fighting. And not with hashtags.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using Tapatalk

Not defending AT&T by any means but you can't seriously be upset that AT&T doesn't want people to cheat their system and tether for free or can you? I tether for free and I'd expect AT&T to not want users to do this as it takes away from their revenue something any business wants not something they want to lose.

Mustang302LX said:
Not defending AT&T by any means but you can't seriously be upset that AT&T doesn't want people to cheat their system and tether for free or can you? I tether for free and I'd expect AT&T to not want users to do this as it takes away from their revenue something any business wants not something they want to lose.
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I will pay AT&T for anything...
AS LONG AS IT'S NOT SUPPOSED TO BE FREE!!!!!

josidhe said:
Corporate America is one thing, but consumers are largely at fault as well. Just look at the 'solutions' people talk about. Vandalism? These are franchises. You think that at&t store down the street is owned and operated directly by the corp? You're hurting local business owners.
The reality is, there's zero creativity on the part of irked consumers. They don't know how to get a message out, they don't know how to start a counter-culture. Today's 'rebels' all depend on 'the man' to keep in touch with each other anyway. They sit around on their thumbs signing contracts they don't read because HAVING service is all that matters at the time. We wait for competitors to sound attractive enough, but in the end brand loyalty and other principles are a higher priority.
We sit around waxing philosophical about open standards and open source and the openness of Android, but what if Android was a Verizon exclusive? Would you completely bend over and submit to everything anticonsumer about VZN just so you can proudly wear at least ONE badge of principles for supporting an open OS? Or is it perhaps better in the long run to support even the most locked down software and ecosystems as long as the carrier and the bigger picture meet ethical standards?
Frankly, I'd rather buy based on carrier FIRST, knowing that even if my platform today isn't brilliant, I'm supporting a network i'd rather see future platforms target.
We get so caught up beating off to open software that we ignore the reality that infrastructure is a 500x more important battle. And then we just betch and sob when the infrastructure isn't the way we want it.
Man up, stop worrying so much about whether something has the almighty GPL stamp of approval, and pay attention to the real war we should be fighting. And not with hashtags.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using Tapatalk
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Vandalism??? I haven't thought of that....hmmmm....
On a serious note, I agree with what you are saying.
(I would have felt better about agreeing with you if you weren't being so abrasive about it, I don't know what "manning up" has to do with it)
Regardless, there is something wrong with the current system of marketing and commercialism. Trust me, I feel bad when I sit here and complain about upload speeds when there is real tragedies happening in the world (eg. Japan) but when it comes to it, this is beyond cellular carriers and beyond truth in advertising. This is more about a global brainwash. Corporations rule the world, and we are going to regret it.

The evolution underlying the Atrix highlights the problem even more. I have unlimited data on my phone. My phone natively possesses the ability to output to a webtop. But if I dock my phone to use the webtop then I have to pay for tethering? That's absurd. And if a developer creates a workaround then I'm violating my contract? Utter bull****.

The evolution underlying the prosecution's case against me highlights the problem even more. I can buy all of the bullets for my gun that I want. My gun natively possesses the ability to kill people. But if I shoot some guy on the beach because the sun is in my eyes, I'm somehow breaking the law? That's absurd.

Techcruncher said:
I will pay AT&T for anything...
AS LONG AS IT'S NOT SUPPOSED TO BE FREE!!!!!
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I agree with you on that, tethering should be free since you are already paying for the data. Since it isn't though stealing the feature (again not saying anything since I do it too) isn't going to be something they try to not stop.
I'll continue using Barnacle until I see them say something to me.

Techcruncher said:
I will pay AT&T for anything...
AS LONG AS IT'S NOT SUPPOSED TO BE FREE!!!!!
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Err...what's supposed to be free? Tethering isn't supposed to be free at all...it's pretty clearly written in your contract.
And I think it's hilarious/sad that so many people are upset with AT&T that the Atrix has Motoblur, a locked bootloader, and you can't tether for free. Are you kidding? Motorola has complete control over the first 2 things and Tethering isn't free because it's a huge drain on their network and is a service they actually provide for payment.
Would you walk into Walmart and be pissed when they yell at you for stealing a TV? No...because it's something they provide a service for that you'd be trying to evade.

hotleadsingerguy said:
Err...what's supposed to be free? Tethering isn't supposed to be free at all...it's pretty clearly written in your contract.
And I think it's hilarious/sad that so many people are upset with AT&T that the Atrix has Motoblur, a locked bootloader, and you can't tether for free. Are you kidding? Motorola has complete control over the first 2 things and Tethering isn't free because it's a huge drain on their network and is a service they actually provide for payment.
Would you walk into Walmart and be pissed when they yell at you for stealing a TV? No...because it's something they provide a service for that you'd be trying to evade.
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I think the only thing wrong with your analogy is that paying for tethering when you already pay for data use, is NOT similar to stealing a TV from Walmart. It would be like going to Walmart and having to pay to be checked out when you already have to pay for the items in your cart. They do it because people will pay for it, it is that simple. If you don't like it change carriers or become an executive at AT&T and change it.

I don’t really get the tethering for the new plans either. They give an extra 2gb and it is the same price as going over by 2gb. They should just offer free tethering and if yougo over you would still pay the overage (10gb for$ 10).
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robrj said:
I don’t really get the tethering for the new plans either. They give an extra 2gb and it is the same price as going over by 2gb. They should just offer free tethering and if yougo over you would still pay the overage (10gb for$ 10).
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It's actually 1GB per $10, but you're right, it's the same price so why not just give us the tethering and charge $10 for every GB we go over but instead it could only be charged if we use the entire GB. Oh, I know, I'm living in a fantasy world.

iv been with att for a very long time and have suffered with edge for ever,they keep telling me ill have the service i pay for soon,heard that for three years,maybe they should give me a refund or manup and provide the service they charge for i love my atrix and they love my money but dont put out,and they want more ha iv had unlimited data since the release of iphone 3g ,my average is 2 or 3 gigs on there network i use wifi more than there network because its not there,and if i want to teather i will barnical rules,that is when im in an area i can,the only one who should feel riped off is me and you that dont get the service we pay for not the guy who dont want to have an internet plan at home and kill 25 + gigs off there network

Its against the law and its called Theft of service. So if att or any other cellphone provider wants they can come after you.
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Aldiggi said:
Its against the law and its called Theft of service. So if att or any other cellphone provider wants they can come after you.
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So hide yo kidz, hide yo wife, and hide yo huzband, cuz they're ****ing everybody out here

jkrohn said:
Easy, switch carriers. You're still within 30 days. Return your phone, get out of your contract and switch.
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Im already on two years and a family plan I bought off contract
Sent from Atrix ;-)

Interesting speculation. Apple buy Sprint?

http://goo.gl/M16Ct
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iphone5 only at sprint?
http://apple.slashdot.org/story/11/10/03/2114206/sprint-bets-big-on-the-iphone

I hate to say this I really do.
But they have the cash... The cash can easily be spent on making the network the fastest there is. I wish a company with the $$$ would do this.

This is the first thing that I have ever read that involves Apple that sounds like a good idea to me. If Apple does buy the network they WILL put the money into the network to make it much better. Most likely the fastest of ALL networks not just the major 4. I hate Apple, I mean I really hate Apple,but if this does happen we could have a major overhaul of our network and we would actually get great speeds as opposed to the decent speeds in some areas and terrible speeds in other areas. I say for the first time ever to Apple, GO FOR IT!

Antitrust.
KJ

Noncon said:
Antitrust.
KJ
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Yeah, there's just no way this would be allowed.
And to the person that thought this was a good idea... yeeaaaahhhhh not sure what you're smoking.
We think At&t and Verizon [and really the whole industry anymore] are bad with the lock downs and penny pinching?
Let Apple own a carrier.

Evo4eva said:
This is the first thing that I have ever read that involves Apple that sounds like a good idea to me. If Apple does buy the network they WILL put the money into the network to make it much better. Most likely the fastest of ALL networks not just the major 4. I hate Apple, I mean I really hate Apple,but if this does happen we could have a major overhaul of our network and we would actually get great speeds as opposed to the decent speeds in some areas and terrible speeds in other areas. I say for the first time ever to Apple, GO FOR IT!
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I agree but I also have some reservations on this, mainly pricing. Everything apple makes tends to be on the expensive side. I'm on Sprint not because it carries the phone I want or because it's got the best coverage, but because it's the cheapest carrier for high end smart phones that include everything you need. No extra charges for GPS access or unlimited texting or anything goofy like that. Point I guess is that if Apple does buy Sprint I hope the pricing stays the same. Otherwise I'll probably have to move back over to Verizon or T-Mobile.

Evo4eva said:
This is the first thing that I have ever read that involves Apple that sounds like a good idea to me. If Apple does buy the network they WILL put the money into the network to make it much better. Most likely the fastest of ALL networks not just the major 4. I hate Apple, I mean I really hate Apple,but if this does happen we could have a major overhaul of our network and we would actually get great speeds as opposed to the decent speeds in some areas and terrible speeds in other areas. I say for the first time ever to Apple, GO FOR IT!
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Yes...and a 50% hike in your bill. And data throttling. And great data plans like "2GB for 25 bucks a month," And all the crap that goes along with Apple.....
Horrible idea.

RoC1909 said:
Yes...and a 50% hike in your bill. And data throttling. And great data plans like "2GB for 25 bucks a month," And all the crap that goes along with Apple.....
Horrible idea.
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You're a moron. Apple is not the cause of the throttling.

Apple makes hardware, and they've chosen a business model to make hardware for certain carriers, either because it made sense, or because that particular carrier bought exclusive rights. Don't quote me, but I think they sell the iPhone in a lot of countries. I don't think it would make much sense for Sprint, but then again they've been doing a lot of little stuff as side-business/sub-business because there is a market for it.

^^ ^^ Apple makes software. Not hardware. They buy hardware from multitude of companies
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I don't really think that would be a good thing. If Apple buy's sprint then I think Apple will start trying to close the market off for google's Android.

Man Steve must be rolling over in his......Oh wait too soon
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I don't buy it.
As mentioned above, Apple is a software/niche hardware company. They sell an image as much as anything. They would not want to get slogged down with wires and towers and coast-to-coast utility servicing....it just isn't what they do (or would be good at).

Noncon said:
Antitrust.
KJ
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1st off I'll let everyone know that I'm not a complete moron. I admit I can't build my own ROM but I can't see why this would violate any antitrust laws. How would this be any different than when the iPhone was only on AT&T? If you wanted an iPhone then you basically were stuck with AT&T. Plus when you have as much cash as Apple has you can "buy" a waiver from the government. Unless I'm missing something I can't see any way Apple buying Sprint would/could harm other mobile carriers other than those carriers couldn't sell the iPhone.

Antitrust, anticompetition, and a step toward monopolizing the industry. FCC cockblocked the at&t/t-moble merge, making the mere notion of Apple owning it's own carrier ludicrous at best.
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shochu808 said:
Antitrust, anticompetition, and a step toward monopolizing the industry. FCC cockblocked the at&t/t-moble merge, making the mere notion of Apple owning it's own carrier ludicrous at best.
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This
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shochu808 said:
Antitrust, anticompetition, and a step toward monopolizing the industry. FCC cockblocked the at&t/t-moble merge, making the mere notion of Apple owning it's own carrier ludicrous at best.
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A carrier owning their own Network is completely fine under the law. If they wanna pay for it, it's theirs to have. As long as they aren't limiting peoples choice of networks, it's all fine. Clearly Apple would not be doing this. There are other carriers, and nothing Apple can ever do will make you unable to simply switch to one of them. Even if they made future iPhones Sprint exclusives, in the eyes of the law that is their god-given right and there's nothing shady or illegal about it. You *still* have a choice of networks, no one said you have a right to buy an iPhone.
And anyway, Apple will NEVER(mark my words) make an iPhone Sprint exclusive(except maybe for a few weeks at launch). This would be a slap in the face to all the people who support them(literally EVERYONE OF THEM at this point) by buying iPhones while on other networks. Not to mention Sprint is a very small Network and will always be compared to the big two, and nothing Apple can do is gonna change that. So why would they limit themselves in that way?
But despite everything you might read, Apple likely has NO interest in buying Sprint. Why the hell would they? Give me one logical reason? It just makes no sense what-so-ever. But those of you are are using Anti-Trust Law as a reason why it wouldn't be possible really need to look up Anti-Trust in a dictionary because Apple having a foothold in 2 entirely separate but logically linked fields isn't even remotely close to a monopoly. A monopoly of what? Them owning Sprint can't effect your choice of carrier OR handsets. Them owning Apple can't either.

@ landora, in your honest opinion, do you think this would pass through the FCC?
However, I totally agree with your business angle. It would shock me if Apple ever made an attempt to either merge or takeover one of the existing carriers. Cost would make it a huge risk, and too much capital and attention would be devoted toward raising customer satisfaction levels that meet their high standards.
I never said it was against the law, I listed reasons the FCC might consider if this ever got thrown their way. If this crazy notion ever made it through...and not that it would make business sense, what's stopping them from mailing free iPhones to their competitor's customers offering them better carrier service and pricing. Owning both entities could eventually pay off. Initially take a loss on the phone, a later profit from carrier fees. Existing carriers begin to fold not able to compete as Apple gains market share.
All this said without factoring in the broadband packages they could offer if customers purchasrd their macbooks or macpros.
This analogy is extreme, but how different would this be if say British Petroleum decided to by Toyota or Ford?
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To keep it simple
Hell freaking no.
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Is this a first for Android?

One device all over the world. Available on pretty much every carrier in every country. The internals may be different, but same design.
This is such a huge deal. This means accessories are going to be universal, and allow manufactures to make 1 accessory model, thus increasing the economies of scale and variety.
People can also finally recognize the Galaxy name in the US, no more stupid carrier names nonsense.

ECrispy said:
One device all over the world. Available on pretty much every carrier in every country. The internals may be different, but same design.
This is such a huge deal. This means accessories are going to be universal, and allow manufactures to make 1 accessory model, thus increasing the economies of scale and variety.
People can also finally recognize the Galaxy name in the US, no more stupid carrier names nonsense.
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Click to collapse
May be apart from the nexus devices.
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ECrispy said:
One device all over the world. Available on pretty much every carrier in every country. The internals may be different, but same design.
This is such a huge deal. This means accessories are going to be universal, and allow manufactures to make 1 accessory model, thus increasing the economies of scale and variety.
People can also finally recognize the Galaxy name in the US, no more stupid carrier names nonsense.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think this is what happens when you have a strong product that is gonna sell no matter what, you get to dictate things like telling the carriers not to mess with the design and all that stuff. Like apple.

I can imagine how the conversation went with VZW execs :-
VZW: So we need space for a big Droid name on the front, and a different case
Samsung: No way
VZW: And of course the button has to go
Samsung: Don't think so
VZW: And we'll be sending you a list of features we want deleted
Samsung: Are you crazy?
VZW: We were thinking Oct 21 is when we announce it, our marketing dept needs to create some new ads
Samsung: Look, STFU! You want this phone, you're gonna do exactly what we tell you, and tell you what, you can;t charge $299 for it either. Got it?

ECrispy said:
I can imagine how the conversation went with VZW execs :-
VZW: So we need space for a big Droid name on the front, and a different case
Samsung: No way
VZW: And of course the button has to go
Samsung: Don't think so
VZW: And we'll be sending you a list of features we want deleted
Samsung: Are you crazy?
VZW: We were thinking Oct 21 is when we announce it, our marketing dept needs to create some new ads
Samsung: Look, STFU! You want this phone, you're gonna do exactly what we tell you, and tell you what, you can;t charge $299 for it either. Got it?
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Lol ... I'm really wondering how Samsung managed to pull this off . I mean what's in it for carriers to release as is, I think may be they want a serious apple competitor to just keep apple at check and they believe sgs3 is the one
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ECrispy said:
One device all over the world. Available on pretty much every carrier in every country. The internals may be different, but same design.
This is such a huge deal. This means accessories are going to be universal, and allow manufactures to make 1 accessory model, thus increasing the economies of scale and variety.
People can also finally recognize the Galaxy name in the US, no more stupid carrier names nonsense.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was thinking just the same. This is a paradigm shift. Android has, by far, the greatest market share among smartphone OSes, but Apple still dominates in hardware. I think this phone could change all of that - especially at $199. Add to that unprecedented custom SW development and accessories.
The bigger question looming is what this means for the rest of the Android OEMs. Aside from offering a better display and aesthetics, how do you compete with something like this? Let's face it, a strong ecosystem is more valuable than any feature these days.

More than anything, this signals a shift in power away from the US carriers who are used to getting their own way. Till now, the only company they listened to was Apple.
Hopefully this will encourage HTC etc to let them deliver the phone they designed, and not the carriers. Though some, like Sprint, always managed to make the phone better

I don't live in the US, can someone explain why the carriers do this? What do they gain from releasing a custom device? A competitive edge? The most that happens where I live is the big carriers will sell a device with their logo as the boot animation and a custom app or two. At the extreme their logo is branded on the device.
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US carriers (and ISP's) are basically a monopoly permitted by our govt (via the FCC) so there is very little competition and no choice for consumers. In the rest of the world you have unlocked phones which share the same GSM network, prepaid plans and its easy to switch. Its the exact opposite here, you pick your carrier, pick the phone they offer and sign a contract.

kirdroid said:
May be apart from the nexus devices.
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Even the Samsung Nexus phones have been modified by carriers (don't know about the N1).

kirdroid said:
Lol ... I'm really wondering how Samsung managed to pull this off . I mean what's in it for carriers to release as is, I think may be they want a serious apple competitor to just keep apple at check and they believe sgs3 is the one
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Whats there to wonder? samsung said, "you take it as it is, or leave it." Thats all there is to it. That's all samsung had to say.

ECrispy said:
One device all over the world. Available on pretty much every carrier in every country. The internals may be different, but same design.
This is such a huge deal. This means accessories are going to be universal, and allow manufactures to make 1 accessory model, thus increasing the economies of scale and variety.
People can also finally recognize the Galaxy name in the US, no more stupid carrier names nonsense.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sounds like you read the article about this exact topic on Android Police and pretty much just highlighted the key points they made. But yeah, big move here. All involved stand to gain nicely from the collaboration so it's a win/win/win/win/win/win/win/win.....you get the point

ECrispy said:
US carriers (and ISP's) are basically a monopoly permitted by our govt (via the FCC) so there is very little competition and no choice for consumers. In the rest of the world you have unlocked phones which share the same GSM network, prepaid plans and its easy to switch. Its the exact opposite here, you pick your carrier, pick the phone they offer and sign a contract.
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Click to collapse
Funny, here we have the exact same situation but with our fixed line telephones. Only one partially state owned company who abuses their monopoly so badly the effect is measurable in our inflation rate.
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The stupidity of our government and the new rules regarding unlocking our devices

I saw this on fb this "mourning" and thought I'd share...
http://www.xda-developers.com/andro...rs/ShsH+(xda-developers)&utm_content=FaceBook

Re: The stupidity of our government and the new rules regarding unlocking our dev
Dude the united States government can blow me. Point blank. **** all their "new and proposed laws" I'm going to do whatever the hell I want because last time I checked I had freedom. This isn't ****ing north Korea. As you can tell I hate our lying ass president Barack Obama and wished someone would take his ass out of office. And the rest of your crooked government
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It's disgusting our government continues to repeatedly enact laws to promote/preserve the bottom dollar of large corporations like this; this promotes monopolies, crushes diversity and goes against the very idea of free Enterprise. How can one alter, root, replace, enhance aspects of a devices firmware and it is perfectly legal, but when it allows the user to switch carriers it becomes illegal? The very idea that this is a copyright issue is ridiculous.

BigSplit said:
It's disgusting our government continues to repeatedly enact laws to promote/preserve the bottom dollar of large corporations like this; this promotes monopolies, crushes diversity and goes against the very idea of free Enterprise. How can one alter, root, replace, enhance aspects of a devices firmware and it is perfectly legal, but when it allows the user to switch carriers it becomes illegal? The very idea that this is a copyright issue is ridiculous.
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Well the whole idea is kinda idiotic anyways... if you get a phone from the carrier you are under contract... the contract is what shields the carrier from loss. What is the purpose of the law other than them being greedy.

But what about the users like me who buy all the phones they use at MSRP? I pay full retail to take my devices with me. With sprint alone I dropped around 1300 on 2 original evos and an evo shift.
So would any of this concern me? Since I did not get a subsidized price on anything?

strapped365 said:
But what about the users like me who buy all the phones they use at MSRP? I pay full retail to take my devices with me. With sprint alone I dropped around 1300 on 2 original evos and an evo shift.
So would any of this concern me? Since I did not get a subsidized price on anything?
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People like you are the only ones this law is really effecting... And its definitely not in a positive way.

Actually it affects all of us. Because believe it or not we all pay Full price for our devices. Because whether they say it or not. We are all paying for our devices. The Carriers have that all factored into the cost of your plan. You never actually get a discount. They make sure that there is at least a 300% mark up on every device.

prboy1969 said:
Actually it affects all of us. Because believe it or not we all pay Full price for our devices. Because whether they say it or not. We are all paying for our devices. The Carriers have that all factored into the cost of your plan. You never actually get a discount. They make sure that there is at least a 300% mark up on every device.
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Yes but if someone pays full price up front they should be able to take the phone where they want No matter what... Any gsm across the world can do that providing the networks are compatible.. it really hurts travelers too
Lol go to Canada or Mexico unlock it and come back... they surely didn't make it illegal to possess an unlocked device... loophole

prboy1969 said:
Actually it affects all of us. Because believe it or not we all pay Full price for our devices. Because whether they say it or not. We are all paying for our devices. The Carriers have that all factored into the cost of your plan. You never actually get a discount. They make sure that there is at least a 300% mark up on every device.
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Well 1299.97 plus tax should allow me to do whatever in the hell I want with my devices.
I wonder how much more popular Google GSM Unlocked Nexus devices are going to become .

strapped365 said:
Well 1299.97 plus tax should allow me to do whatever in the hell I want with my devices.
I wonder how much more popular Google GSM Unlocked Nexus devices are going to become .
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Lol true
Its just at&t and those people complaining about it because in the end, google really doesnt care
I still feel its unnecessary to do this, theyre just trying to lock in customers as much as they can and prevent them from finding better deals where they might pay less monthly or have better coverage in their specific area for less
Sent from my PG06100

strapped365 said:
Well 1299.97 plus tax should allow me to do whatever in the hell I want with my devices.
I wonder how much more popular Google GSM Unlocked Nexus devices are going to become .
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Sony and Nokia sell gsm unlocked phones too... most of the international gsm companies do. Again showing how dumb our government is.

bilgerryan said:
Sony and Nokia sell gsm unlocked phones too... most of the international gsm companies do. Again showing how dumb our government is.
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Biggest disappointment is that while the law allowed for devices to be unlocked, exemptions were made or devices ignored. You couldn't unlock an iPhone, or at least they sure didn't want you to. Maybe I have my facts confused though.

Eh this does bother me so much because all you have to do is get permission to use the phone on another carrier. I HIGHLY doubt they will tell you no. And if they do... Well this is XDA, we do what we want to do. Guides will still be posted on flashing to other carriers. They can't stop us
Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2

Update:
If as many people as possible could sign this, it would be incredibly awesome.
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/make-unlocking-cell-phones-legal/1g9KhZG7
Sent from my PG06100

CNexus said:
Update:
If as many people as possible could sign this, it would be incredibly awesome.
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/make-unlocking-cell-phones-legal/1g9KhZG7
Sent from my PG06100
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I signed it today and forwarded the link.

Look at the petition results... http://www.xda-developers.com/andro...-developers/ShsH+(xda-developers)&utm_content

The article on Android Police HERE might interest a few of you.

Email I received this morning:
It's Time to Legalize Cell Phone Unlocking
By R. David Edelman, Senior Advisor for Internet, Innovation, & Privacy
Thank you for sharing your views on cell phone unlocking with us through your petition on our We the People platform. Last week the White House brought together experts from across government who work on telecommunications, technology, and copyright policy, and we're pleased to offer our response.
The White House agrees with the 114,000+ of you who believe that consumers should be able to unlock their cell phones without risking criminal or other penalties. In fact, we believe the same principle should also apply to tablets, which are increasingly similar to smart phones. And if you have paid for your mobile device, and aren't bound by a service agreement or other obligation, you should be able to use it on another network. It's common sense, crucial for protecting consumer choice, and important for ensuring we continue to have the vibrant, competitive wireless market that delivers innovative products and solid service to meet consumers' needs.
This is particularly important for secondhand or other mobile devices that you might buy or receive as a gift, and want to activate on the wireless network that meets your needs -- even if it isn't the one on which the device was first activated. All consumers deserve that flexibility.
The White House's position detailed in this response builds on some critical thinking done by the President's chief advisory Agency on these matters: the Department of Commerce's National Telecommunications and Information Administration (NTIA). For more context and information on the technical aspects of the issue, you can review the NTIA's letter to the Library of Congress' Register of Copyrights (.pdf), voicing strong support for maintaining the previous exception to the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA) for cell phone carrier unlocking.
Contrary to the NTIA's recommendation, the Librarian of Congress ruled that phones purchased after January of this year would no longer be exempted from the DMCA. The law gives the Librarian the authority to establish or eliminate exceptions -- and we respect that process. But it is also worth noting the statement the Library of Congress released today on the broader public policy concerns of the issue. Clearly the White House and Library of Congress agree that the DMCA exception process is a rigid and imperfect fit for this telecommunications issue, and we want to ensure this particular challenge for mobile competition is solved.
So where do we go from here?
The Obama Administration would support a range of approaches to addressing this issue, including narrow legislative fixes in the telecommunications space that make it clear: neither criminal law nor technological locks should prevent consumers from switching carriers when they are no longer bound by a service agreement or other obligation.
We also believe the Federal Communications Commission (FCC), with its responsibility for promoting mobile competition and innovation, has an important role to play here. FCC Chairman Genachowski today voiced his concern about mobile phone unlocking (.pdf), and to complement his efforts, NTIA will be formally engaging with the FCC as it addresses this urgent issue.
Finally, we would encourage mobile providers to consider what steps they as businesses can take to ensure that their customers can fully reap the benefits and features they expect when purchasing their devices.
We look forward to continuing to work with Congress, the wireless and mobile phone industries, and most importantly you -- the everyday consumers who stand to benefit from this greater flexibility -- to ensure our laws keep pace with changing technology, protect the economic competitiveness that has led to such innovation in this space, and offer consumers the flexibility and freedoms they deserve.
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Well that certainly sounds good. I remain sceptical though. It is our government talking here...

You guys should check the article in the link below. Might be a step in the right direction.
http://www.androidpolice.com/2013/0...locking-phones-for-interoperability-purposes/

HTC financial woes

i hope the One really helps HTC, but the delays are doing no favours
http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/04/08/us-htc-earnings-idUKBRE93706620130408

I don't know what the fuss is all about. They are always posting profits. Less profits yes, but they are always in the black. Many companies go for years posting losses quarter after quarter. HTC has no problems as long as they are in profit each quarter.

Would now be a great time to buy stocks in HTC?

simba2585 said:
i hope the One really helps HTC, but the delays are doing no favours
http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/04/08/us-htc-earnings-idUKBRE93706620130408
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I hope this thread gets locked, threads likes this really do XDA no favours.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2

aydc said:
I don't know what the fuss is all about. They are always posting profits. Less profits yes, but they are always in the black. Many companies go for years posting losses quarter after quarter. HTC has no problems as long as they are in profit each quarter.
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Public companies like HTC serve their shareholders who buy stock in a company because they feel that stock is going to appreciate over time increasing the size of their investment (profit). Companies reward investors by growing sales, profit margins, and generating cash that's used for reinvestment to further their growth and increasing the market capitalization of the company. Doing so makes their stock appreciate which rewards the investors that placed their faith in them. This is HTC’s 2-year stock performance as of today.
In February, HTC revised their Q1 2013 guidance down to a level so low that it spooked analysts to the point there was a run on HTC's stock that triggered stop-sales on the TW exchange it's listed on (twice) because the amount of volume being sold and the stock's price decline triggered electronic safeguards. The revenue guidance HTC provided for Q1 that caused the stock fall was between NT$50 billion and NT$60 billion. Those are numbers provided by HTC less than eight weeks ago. The number they actually posted today was NT$42.8 billion. So not only did they miss the low-end of their own guidance they've demonstrated an inability to forecast their business. The latter's actually more troubling to analysts than the miss in revenue. And keep in mind that revenue is accounted for when devices are shipped to resellers; not when they are purchased by end consumers. So HTC's shipping rate is what caused the miss, not the sales or popularity of the One. And that they didn't know within an eight week span how deep their component issues were causing them to issue erroneous guidance is indeed troubling.
Operating margin (profit) was 1/10 of 1% of revenue for the first three months of 2013. You don't have to be a finance expert to know that's not sustainable. And the One's delay has put it right up against the launch of the SGS4 which will be accompanied by wider distribution and Samsung's gazillion dollar marketing budget. Apple's also launching the iP5S and possibly a lower-priced device in June according to analyst's speculation. Neither of those things is going to be good for HTC's full-year revenue. The analysts expect HTC to benefit from the One's sales in Q2 but that they'll decline again in the remaining quarters of the year. 30 out of 33 analysts have a "sell" rating on HTC's stock.
Their financial position was 25% better than today last August when the Taiwanese government began talks of bailing HTC out rather than letting them fail. HTC cannot continue to exist the way it does today and a single positive quarter based on the success of single device can't reverse their fortunes enough to change that. So it's highly unlikely they'll go out of business but some type of government intervention accompanied by a restructuring or merger or JV with another company are pretty much a given.
With stiff competition from Apple and Samsung, HTC has posted some less than stellar numbers the past few quarters. The company is still profitable, but its decline in sales and revenue have contributed significantly to Taiwan’s five months of decline in exports which saw a drop in July of 11.6% from a year earlier. HTC may be about to receive help from the Taiwanese government as it looks to turn its fortunes around after slipping away in the smartphone market recently. According to the Commercial Times, Taiwan's Central Bank Governor, Perng Fai-nan raised the issue during a meeting with government officials, suggesting it stepped in and offered assistance to the manufacturer. Perng noted that HTC's declining sales had had a knock-on effect with Taiwan's exports, which have also witnessed a decline in recent months. During the meeting, Perng apparently went on to say that the financial status of HTC is "of vital importance to the islands' gross domestic product". The Taiwanese government is taking this issue seriously, with an unnamed official reportedly saying the Ministry of Economic Affairs is already considering various ways to help out HTC.
http://www.techradar.com/us/news/ph...htc-could-receive-government-bail-out-1091781​These numbers show the production shortage really is that bad, and my sense is that it won’t get much better in the second quarter because many of those issues continue,” said Dennis Chan, an analyst at Yuanta Securities Co. in Taipei, who recommends selling the stock. “For smartphones, timing is everything and the delay means they lose that timing.”
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-...w-profit-after-latest-smartphone-delayed.html​Profit is likely to recover in the second quarter as HTC One sales increase, said Daiwa Securities analyst Birdy Lu. The company has been touting the camera's performance in low light, and plans to more than double advertising spending under a new marketing chief. "HTC's whole schedule was thrown into disarray because of the HTC One, which meant it didn't have the revenue coming in but still had a lot of fixed costs," Mr. Lu said. "There will be some improvement this quarter in terms of the bottom line, but they still face a lot of competition."
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB100...38196.html?mod=WSJ_hp_LEFTWhatsNewsCollection​

htc is dying.
i bet samsung and apple are eager to buy htc for their patents and maybe blueprints

I'm sitting here fully perplexed
some of you call me HTC biggest fanboy
and yet in all honestly i dont care their financial woes
yes if they go away it will be a loss to the smartphone especially since they are the most unique OEM
but really why should I care all I want is the bloody device and 18months of support, the quality of the device and the software is guaranteed so why should I care about their money again?
honestly if anything Samsung's monopoly and money making is not really reflecting in better quality to the product
I prefer a zealous challenged OEM over a relaxed arrogant one

hamdir said:
some of you call me HTC biggest fanboy
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But always in a "good" way. You've helped more people than 90% of those on XDA (including me).
honestly if anything Samsung's monopoly and money making is not really reflecting in better quality to the product
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Being huge doesn't guarantee continued success; at least not at the same historic velocity. Look what Samsung's success has done to Apple's stock. And with more cash in the bank than 2/3 of the world's countries one can't say Apple's not successful. Samsung can't get lazy because if they do there are too many people gunning for them. If Apple does introduce a lower-cost iPhone it's going to kick Samsung in the nuts. And both ZTE and Huawei are gunning for them too. Samsung's only got one target in its sites; Apple. What the other Android device makers do with a collective 30% market share between them doesn't concern them.
If you think about it, there are too many Android manufacturers right now. None on their own is going to catch Samsung because their lead is too wide. If a couple fail or merge leaving Samsung and two strong financially healthy Android competitors it would be much better for competition than having four vendors with fewer than 10% of the market each. The market controls smartphone selling prices. Samsung’s volume makes their component costs significantly lower than their competitors. None of those competitors can continue to offer the same features as Samsung at the same prices and maintain a decent level of profitability on far lower volume. So a “boutique” smartphone maker would end up selling a device with similar functionality at a higher retail price to sustain their profitability. I don’t think that would work that well in such a competitive market. As applies in the jungle, only the strong survive.

cjm1979 said:
I hope this thread gets locked, threads likes this really do XDA no favours.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2
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What's wrong with discussion ?
How is xda affected ?

BarryH_GEG said:
So a “boutique” smartphone maker would end up selling a device with similar functionality at a higher retail price to sustain their profitability. I don’t think that would work that well in such a competitive market. As applies in the jungle, only the strong survive.
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i would love HTC to go this way. willing to pay the premium
i think Sony and HTC are a good match but i dont know how that would work
anyway everyone is downsizing HTC than they really are, regardless of the profits/stock situation, its not really as "wallstreet" black or white as you guys think, its a lot more grey, the same can be said to many of the Asian brands as well
there is definitely a remedy being cooked for their problem but its not really what we are expecting

Great learning on this thread ,its great

@Barry,(didn't wanna quote the whole thesis), you're right, the HTC One success alone cannot bail HTC out of its financial trouble, especially with the iPhone and Galaxy S 4 coming out in Q3 and Q2 respectively. Either they're going to have to be bailed out or merge with another company. 2.8 million in profit is an All time low for HTC. The smartphone industry is a tough one, if you even have 1 off year, it will cost you big time. HTC had 2 off years.

I'm pretty optimistic about HTC with all the positive press on the One. I myself have owned every generation iphone and it took the HTC One to break the cycle. I have another friend who has always owned iphones and he just purchased four HTC Ones for his family and friends. This thing is going to be a dark horse. Samsung won't know what hit them.

grukko said:
I'm pretty optimistic about HTC with all the positive press on the One. I myself have owned every generation iphone and it took the HTC One to break the cycle. I have another friend who has always owned iphones and he just purchased four HTC Ones for his family and friends. This thing is going to be a dark horse. Samsung won't know what hit them.
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I'm in the same boat. Just want my Asda order now !!!

BarryH_GEG said:
Public companies like HTC serve their shareholders who buy stock in a company because they feel that stock is going to appreciate over time increasing the size of their investment (profit). Companies reward investors by growing sales, profit margins, and generating cash that's used for reinvestment to further their growth and increasing the market capitalization of the company. Doing so makes their stock appreciate which rewards the investors that placed their faith in them. This is HTC’s 2-year stock performance as of today.
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Then what would you say about Apple who have lost about $300 Billion worth of shareholder money in this time?
Or the fact that Galaxy S4 is being seen as Samsung's iphone5 moment! Apple played safe with iphone5 and historically it has broken sales records. Apple is flush with money, yet financial markets are unimpressed. Apple is no more innovative!
Samsung has done nothing with S4 but ape Apple iphone5 (that is to say play it safe). Interestingly the day S4 was announced by Samsung, Apple stock rose and investors cheered as S4 is NOT seen as much of a big threat to Apple as it could have been!
HTC is not gonna vanish anytime soon. just chillax. my company has been in huge losses for four years straight (we suppy chipsets to mobile makers) and yet are there (while we are much much smaller than even HTC). somebody always bails you out. Or otherwise also, all it takes is one blockbuster product and you are back in the game. Sony got that with XZ (they were in losses earlier). Very few companies are making any money in this business anyway but they are all hanging in there.

I don't know. I'm reconsidering what to buy after this.

joslicx said:
Then what would you say about Apple who have lost about $300 Billion worth of shareholder money in this time?
Or the fact that Galaxy S4 is being seen as Samsung's iphone5 moment! Apple played safe with iphone5 and historically it has broken sales records. Apple is flush with money, yet financial markets are unimpressed. Apple is no more innovative!
Samsung has done nothing with S4 but ape Apple iphone5 (that is to say play it safe). Interestingly the day S4 was announced by Samsung, Apple stock rose and investors cheered as S4 is NOT seen as much of a big threat to Apple as it could have been!
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The difference is that apple and Samsung have big budgets and lots of money, they can afford some type of loss, HTC cannot. You said it yourself, apple played it safe with the iPhone 5 and yet they broke records sales. Do you think apple care about the lack of innovation? No, not as long as they keep selling they don't. For Samsung, the S4 is getting more preorders than the S3 in the UK alone, those are good signs and remember again both companies have lots of money and are coming from big quarters.
It isn't about them though, it's about HTC. They have a great product with the One, everybody in the tech world recognizes it so there is no doubt. The question is is it too late?

At the end of the day it will be Samsung and apple left. Rest will fold and fail. Of course Google will continue to release nexus line which is stock but always mediocre hardware.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I317 using xda premium

sabre31 said:
At the end of the day it will be Samsung and apple left. Rest will fold and fail. Of course Google will continue to release nexus line which is stock but always mediocre hardware.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I317 using xda premium
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Lets pray that it doesn't happen, it would really make me sick. I love choices and competition.

HTC and Sony should stay alive. Sony will be for sure because they're a strong company. Can't say the same about htc. It'd be a shame if they fail.