Related
I tried geocaching over the weekend with the Epic. I love the app (c:geo I think?), but the phone's GPS is spotty at best. Obviously, when geocaching, you're probably in an area with no signal, so I had to rely on whatever info the phone already had downloaded and being able to fix.
About 9/10 times, the phone would see no satellites at all. Not even yellow non-fixed ones. Randomly, it would suddenly see a bunch of them and lock on within 10 seconds. I had no cell signal the entire time so no AGPS here (except for the previous night making sure it had downloaded satellite data). GPS Status was useful in figuring out what was going on.
The accuracy was horrible compared to an old hand-held standalone device. My phone was easily 20-30 feet less accurate. Note that the shown 98 feet accuracy level is BS - i'ts definitely more accurate than that. But whereas a standalone GPS might be within 12 feet, mine would be about 30 feet.
So overall it's mixed. The app for geocaching is really great, but the hardware to run it on is pretty lacking on the Epic. I'll retest sometime if we ever get a GPS fix.
Did you have the Cold Start workaround applied or is this with stock?
I switched to warm. Cold would have sucked without the network. Hot seemed the most problematic from what I've read, but maybe I should have left it on hot?
To be clear my gps works awesome as long as I have a network.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
yes the only drawback to cold start, is if you are outside of network connection of some kind.
We are also not even absolutely confirmed that Epic has true standalone GPS. And if it does, it maybe pretty poor due to the low signal to noise, which may point to attenuation problems at a hardware level, or some other issue. (I am fooling around lately with the settings for SNR threshold rejection)
There is a lot to like about the Epic, and some GPS issues have been reduced by the cold start workaround, but it may not be the best choice of smartphones, notably compared to the EVo's excellent GPS, if you need or enjoy use of GPS.
On accuracy, you have to remember that the real world accuracy is negatively affected by not moving or moving slowly. It is counter-intuitive but this is the result of two factors affecting real and simulated accuracy respectively: Multipath is better rejected when moving as the algorithms to reject and compensate for multipath are facilitated by moment. Secondly, there are all those predictive forward and back axis compensators based on speed (and more recently argumented on smartphones by inertial data from the gsensors) , and road "snap" compensators for lateral movement that help in nav based programs.
Also keep in mind that elevation measurements are not as refined (with inbuilt compensation tables) as far as I know on Andorid as they are on WM applications. I believe there are some apps that will query online elevation tables -- present an data connection.
Thanks for your data on off connection results.
That's why I removed everything but the basics from my Hero and am using it solely as my geocaching GPSr!
Then I don't have to worry about ruining my Epic by getting it wet or dropping it or just getting it dirty!
jirafabo said:
That's why I removed everything but the basics from my Hero and am using it solely as my geocaching GPSr!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea I have a Palm treo pro (designed and made by HTC) that has outstanding GPS, standalone on it is excellent. also it runs both a WM navigon and WM tomtom perfectly with no data connection. Works from Topeka to Timbuktu
I just got the JI6 update and the GPS is definitely much better. However, I was wondering how it matches up to the GPS on other smartphones.
Does anyone have a Nexus One or another android phone to compare it to? Could you please post some results. Only post results from the official OTA JI6 update.
I just got my OTA update this morning.
I am comparing my Vibrant with my BF's Nexus One (running Froyo 2.21) using GPS test.
The result:
Nexus views fewer satellites and locks them much faster than my vibrant on the other hand Vibrant views more satellites locks them a bit slower (Nexus : in view : 8 in use 8 instantly, VIbrant in view : 13 in use 7)
Nexus has better accuracy 9.9 feet VS. 22ish feet on vibrant.
I definitely like the gps on my vibrant much better after the OTA.
I am curious about the GPS performance test among other samsung galaxy s brethren (Captivate, Epic 4G, and Fascinate)
yea my nexus had much better GPS
and got instant lock when any app required gps location
but vibrant works perfectly fine just takes little longer
Just tested against N1 in a real life situation using C:Geo on both phones and the N1 had me rock solid on a Geocache and the Vibrant had me 15 feet off of it plus after trying to get my bearings it decided to start wondering off and I ended up in another county in 3 minutes. The N1 GPS just works and work rock solid, the Vibrants GPS is obviously not a hardware issue but a software issue. The reason I say that is because when I got the Vibrant Geocaching was a no go at all, wouldn't even lock onto enough sat's to be useful. Now at least it has me within 15 feet of my caches.
So all in all it has improved, but it is still not as good as my old N1.
Gps on the vibrant sucks. I honestly believe it's a hardware issue. JI6 update addressed a stupid software issue that prevented the gps to lock onto satellites probably due to wrong time information, but even after that, performance is really lacking.
I have a nexus one, and it gets a fix in less than 5 seconds with an accuracy of 2 m (6 feet). Once it gets a fix, it doesn't wander all over the map. It stays put.
The vabrant ( before and after JI6) doesn't get an accuracy better than 6 meters (20 ft). That's not to bad, but in google maps, it starts jumping all over the map until it settles -usually- at the farthest place from the actual location.
After JI6, the gps locks very quickly, definitely an improvement, but it it's more important the accuracy than the TTF.
In google navigation, when you stop at a red light, the inaccuracies og the gps and its constant jumping from place to place, triggers re-route after re-route. This is uncomfortable and dangerous when you are driving in an unfamiliar area.
The phone is great, but could have been better had some minimal QA been done.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
reddragon72 said:
Just tested against N1 in a real life situation using C:Geo on both phones and the N1 had me rock solid on a Geocache and the Vibrant had me 15 feet off of it plus after trying to get my bearings it decided to start wondering off and I ended up in another county in 3 minutes. The N1 GPS just works and work rock solid, the Vibrants GPS is obviously not a hardware issue but a software issue. The reason I say that is because when I got the Vibrant Geocaching was a no go at all, wouldn't even lock onto enough sat's to be useful. Now at least it has me within 15 feet of my caches.
So all in all it has improved, but it is still not as good as my old N1.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This saddens me. I used to be able to cache almost exclusively off of my G1, unless under heavy cover.
studing
After manually flashing the updated (the OTA bricked my phone), I tested the GPS on its own, as well as side by side with my wife's G2. While JI6 allows the Vibrant to get a satellite lock in seconds, the accuracy of the GPS is virtually nonexistent, with the location bouncing all over the place. Forget about stopping at a red light - the cursor will start jumping around, sometimes placing me 2-3 blocks away from my actual location. While driving on a local highway (with a clear view of the sky), the GPS would frequently lose signal, although it would lock on again in a few seconds. Although the Vibrant can now get a satellite lock, the accuracy has not been fixed. The G2 does not suffer from these issues, reporting accuracy of 4-6 feet and getting a much quicker satellite lock than the Vibrant.
I am starting to think it is definitely a hardware issue. With GPS test I am getting locks on 9 of 10 or 10 of 12 satellites, but the bar is not very high for the signal on any satellite. Driving down the road it losses signal randomly. My G1 and HD2 had much better GPS performance.
I guess I will live with this until it is time to get another upgrade phone for the cheap price. Maybe the new Mytouch when it comes out. I have extra lines on my account just so I can get early upgrades. An extra line using the same minutes is $5 a month. It is worth it to me to keep getting new phones and selling the other phone on ebay.
Just did a side by side test with my Vibrant running Bionix 1.7 with the JI6 modem.bin vs. my wife’s brand new G2. My Vibrant instantly saw 13 satellites and took around 10 seconds to lock 11 of those 13. Initially it showed 90 ft. accuracy and after around 20-30 seconds it was bouncing between 18-25 ft. on accuracy. On my wife’s G2 as soon as I opened up GPS Test it saw 11 satellites and locked all 11. It initially showed 20 ft. on accuracy and then after 2-3 seconds it showed 12 ft. on accuracy. I watched it for about 2-3 minutes and it didn't really move as far as how many satellites it had locked or its accuracy.
Gps will never be as good as other phones lets face it, but it does the job, it haven't failed me yet since ji2 and up..... Not perfect but usable... I'd rather have a not so great gps that still works vs a n1s multi touch bug that don't get real mt......
Take the good with the bad
I just flashed the ji6 and although the GPS is improved it is far from being fixed. With my Nexus One and G2 I get a fix within 5 seconds and usually locks on all birds. With the Vibrant it takes much longer and the best it can do is 5 out of 12 birds. This GPS is a real shame as it takes a marvelous phone and makes it less than stellar IMO. I would love to use the Vibrant as my Main Phone but with the GPS still not quite right it is not happening as I use GPS everyday throughout the day/.
For those that have gotten the update, what are your GPS settings now? Is it a different server?
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
Agreed with most comments already posted. The update helped to lock faster, but accuracy really sucks. Google navigation only works about 70% of the time. I find my location drifting to side streets quite often which keeps triggering re-routes all the time. I lose lock randomly (although it does regain lock fairly quickly).
Overall, compared to all other android smart phones I've used, the accuracy/reliability of gps is horrible.
I've also lost all hope in a software fix. With all the press it got and the two plus months to release a fix with marginal improvement...means one of two things.
1-samsung software engineers suck or
2-its a hardware issue and they've done the best they can with software to optimize the broken hardware.
Although both may be true to some degree ... I think we are dealing with case #2...
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
Roomates Nexus one sees 7 satellites, 10 seconds lock.
My vibrant JI6 sees 9 satellites, 4.5 minute lock
GPS is no worse than the other phones I currently have access to.
Google Maps doesn't jump around like Google Navigation. Google needs to implement smoothing software into their navigation program. Copliot works great with JI6 and Google Navigation gets Parkinson's disease at stop lights. Like I said, same place and Google Maps shows me as stationary while Google Navigation is all over the place
heygrl said:
GPS is no worse than the other phones I currently have access to.
Google Maps doesn't jump around like Google Navigation. Google needs to implement smoothing software into their navigation program. Copliot works great with JI6 and Google Navigation gets Parkinson's disease at stop lights. Like I said, same place and Google Maps shows me as stationary while Google Navigation is all over the place
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed. With CoPilot it works perfect. I havnt noticed any jumping around at all. The only problem I have had with the GPS since JI6 is that it sometimes takes 3-5 minutes to get a lock on my location.
Try to delete your GPS Data and make sure it's all stock under lbstestmode. I get locks fairly quickly.
kgbkny said:
While JI6 allows the Vibrant to get a satellite lock in seconds, the accuracy of the GPS is virtually nonexistent, with the location bouncing all over the place. Forget about stopping at a red light - the cursor will start jumping around, sometimes placing me 2-3 blocks away from my actual location. While driving on a local highway (with a clear view of the sky), the GPS would frequently lose signal, although it would lock on again in a few seconds. Although the Vibrant can now get a satellite lock, the accuracy has not been fixed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I got the identical behavior last night. Is the GPS that flawed that it thinks it's moving when it's not? If they could at least have the software not move the pointer when you're standing still that would likely make a huge difference. Instead it moves you onto another street and starts speaking out "corrections".
So after using both DK28 version of FroYo as well as the stock 2.1 release, I have noticed that while actually being able to acquire and use a GPS (satellites, not wireless networks) signal seems greatly improved, the accuracy of the GPS is worse.
As an example, on DI18 (2.1) I can sit at my desk and the GPS will usually pinpoint me within about 3-5 feet based upon the mark on Google Maps with the satellite layer turned on. With DK28, it pinpoints me in my neighbor's house to the south or across the alley behind my neighbor's house (also to the south), so it is off by at least 50 or 60 feet.
Has anyone else seen this behavior?
You're getting a lock through the cell towers, not GPS. Try running GPStest free version on market for a true gauge on how well your GPS is locking.
riceknight said:
You're getting a lock through the cell towers, not GPS. Try running GPStest free version on market for a true gauge on how well your GPS is locking.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That isn't possible, since I never have "use wireless networks" on because I use an Airave at home and if I am using wireless networks for a location it puts me about 25 miles away from my actual location.
I do, however, think it is an issue with the Google LBS. I just re-installed Sprint Navigation and my location was spot on correct.
The best test of actual accuracy is to use My Tracks to record GPS tracking both driving and walking -- outdoors. Not only can you zoom in and compare those tracks with the road or path overlaid on the Google maps or sat photos, you can easily post a link to those tracks for peer review in forums such as this.
This actual accuracy is different from the imputed estimate of accuracy reported by GPS Test. In fact, there is a known bug in that imputed estimate in the stock Epic, where the accuracy estimate is always reported at a fixed 30.0 meters (98.4 feet) although the actual accuracy on the ground is pretty good -- assuming that a good multisatellite lock is achieved. That bug is reportedly fixed in the DK28 versions.
Navigation programs are the worst tools for testing, because they impose another layer of post-processing within the app, including a snap-to-road function.
I wouln't pay much attention to indoor performance. Your Android GPS is intended primarily for outdoor use. It might happen to work indoors, depending on building construction, windows, etc., but that is just serendipity.
I've been using Torque to record OBD2 & GPS data and it seems to pretty much always be accurate to within about 10 ft (3 m) or so based off the satellite maps. It was exactly the same in DI18, so I haven't noticed much difference other than faster locking. Running stock DK28.
Never heard of an Epic running Di18 getting a better lock than 98 foot accuracy.
muyoso said:
Never heard of an Epic running Di18 getting a better lock than 98 foot accuracy.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They are not talking about the bogus 98-foot (30.0 meter) estimated accuracy, which is simply a bug that causes the system GPS to lie to the Android OS listeners with an arbitrary, hard-coded value and has nothing to do with how accurate the fix really is. They are talking about actual accuracy relative to the user's position on the ground. That has always been pretty good on my Epic once a good multi-satellite lock has been achieved.
DK17 (Using Quantum 1.4 currently) gets me locked within 1 foot at times. It's extremely accurate and I can even keep wi-fi on when the GPS is on and tracking me (CardioTrainer, Maps, Navigation, GPS Test).
I want to compare Nexus S's GPS to Galaxy S's. So could anyone there make a simple track with Nexus S walking and driving for atleast 2km. If possible do the tracking with a Galaxy S tracking at the same time as well.
Thanks
I actually have both a Nexus S and Vibrant, so I could do this for you. Is there any particular app you have in mind to do it with?
I guess you can use MyTracks.
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App
I did a 14km mountain bike ride with Runkeeper on, yesterday. Was my first try with the app (normally use MyTracks but this was my first ride since switching to the Nexus S). Not sure how to share it but this link is a start.
One thing I did notice is that the beginning of my ride included a 28 mile 'warp' from where I'd been using Google Maps the day before! I guess in future I need to give it a little more time establishing that initial fix before I press start. Luckily I was able to edit out that point to get the real route.
Please someone make a Mytracks tracking With a Nexus S and another phone (preferably HTC cause those have very good GPS units) and upload the results.
There you go.
I just made this one with my Nexus S:
http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=U....555383,-44.264713&spn=0.002128,0.003484&z=19
Keep in mind that the sky was full of heavy clouds so I can't guarantee that the GPS was operating on its full accuracy.
A couple of months ago I made a track recording with my Motorola Milestone, here's the link:
http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=U...900089483924351110.0004990b6c3698b559c65&z=14
When I first saw the Nexus S track i was like "holy sh*t this looks bad". But then I went to my old milestone track and it was almost the same. You can only see how bad it is once you zoom in a lot.
nicholasbgr said:
There you go.
I just made this one with my Nexus S:
http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=U....555383,-44.264713&spn=0.002128,0.003484&z=19
Keep in mind that the sky was full of heavy clouds so I can't guarantee that the GPS was operating on its full accuracy.
A couple of months ago I made a track recording with my Motorola Milestone, here's the link:
http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=U...900089483924351110.0004990b6c3698b559c65&z=14
When I first saw the Nexus S track i was like "holy sh*t this looks bad". But then I went to my old milestone track and it was almost the same. You can only see how bad it is once you zoom in a lot.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Based on these two I would say that the Nexus S GPS is still not good enough or its just the weather. I hope the latter.
I'll try to post one of my old tracks from the same location made with HTC Hero (custom ROM though) and Google MyTracks. I'd do it now but the interface is impossible on this netbook screen!
Anyway - for me the Nexus S gets a fix much faster and seems generally at least as accurate, possibly more so.
You will only get at best about 3.5m accuracy from a regular gps device without dgps (waas/egnos). No phones that I know of, support dgps. With dgps you can get accurate to about 0.9m
If you need more accuracy then there are external gps/bluetooth modules that have dgps and fast refresh rates, for about $80.
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App
Worse GPS than N1
Anecdotally and without any quantifiable experimentation, but based on using mytracks with GPS extremely regularly for running, I can say the GPS in the Nexus S seems a bit worse thanin the Nexus One. I didn't have both in my possession simultaneously for long enough to do the same track with both but I have loads of old Nexus One tracked routes I could re-run with the Nexus S to compare. The N1 gave me trouble every once in a while too though and the clouds have been rowdy lately, possibly contributing, so I'm optimistic. It's bearable in any case other than seeming to take more of a battery drain (again, anecdotally).
OK, here's a bunch of tracks from my HTC Hero if you're interested in trying to compare them.
http://goo.gl/maps/XSG4
(For convenience, the Nexus S link from earlier is this)
As I say, based purely on my observation the Nexus S gets the fix faster. Having a zoomed-in look at the two maps would say to me they're both as accurate as I could wish for.
from what I understand, the gps chip in the ns is good in terms of performance, locks faster, keeps lock longer under low signal conditions etc but isn't necessarily any more accurate than any of the previous models wear. gps accuracy is purposely limited for civilian use and I believe most chips out there can achieve that accuracy as long as they are able to track the required number of satellites.
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App
eahiv said:
Anecdotally and without any quantifiable experimentation, but based on using mytracks with GPS extremely regularly for running, I can say the GPS in the Nexus S seems a bit worse thanin the Nexus One.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree with this. I use my gps and navigation all the time to drive around and the nexus s gps is typically 30 - 50ft behind the positioning marker. With my N1 it felt like the marker was about 10ft within my location.
Also I notice that the gps sometimes misplaces my postioning marker on the map and the compass points in the wrong direction. These arent problems I had with my N1 but perhaps because its cloudier now than when I had my N1.
I'd give the N1 gps a 9, and the NS gps a 6. What makes up for the weird accuracy issues is the bigger screen.
Thank you for all the replies. If at all possible, could someone still make one comparison with an external bluetooth gps, for example the nokia LD-3W. Also the higher update rate GPS's would be nice to compare.
As of the results, I'd conclude that Nexus S definitely has the same GPS chip and almost the same firmware as the SGS's, but antennas have definitely been improved. Atleast now the GPS on all SGS series devices, including the Nexus S, are capable of running a "satnav" properly. Now if I only could get my compass and accelerometer working on my SGS / JPX
I'm planning on getting an external bt GPS module for autocross, I'll report back then.
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App
Hello,
Got a gs2 and still have my incredible s so I tested GPS precision: got 4 meters for the HTC and not stable and lower precision 18/20 meters on gs2.
Is something adjustable with new kernels?
Another two questions : about voice low quality ( someone said that it depends from noise reduction filet) and low volume during a call are these issues already addressed by some roms?
Low volume and quality with earphones is addressed too?
Thanks!
GPS is a disappointment. On my old pda asus a696 precision is much better. I wish gps was working better for me, I use it with sport tracking software. I changed ntp server, played with all kinds of gps apps, updated AGPS data, helped a bit but fix is still slow and precision is almost always more then 30m.
If anybody saw an improvement on some ROM or kernel, please let me know.
Attached my device info.
bzpwhx2 said:
Hello,
Got a gs2 and still have my incredible s so I tested GPS precision: got 4 meters for the HTC and not stable and lower precision 18/20 meters on gs2.
Is something adjustable with new kernels?
No as no reported flaw in GPS so nothing with GPS altered that i have seen.
jje
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i am honestly very disappointed with the sgs2's gps precision. tested it side by side with the HTC Chacha...rebooted, cleared gps data and redownloaded it (Gps status app), then run test on both devices for abt 2-3 mins.
SGS2 7/7 satelites, error 40m!!!
HTC Chacha 10/10 satelites, error 6-10m!!!
frm both rooted 2.3.4 and stock firmware ...
I agree that the precision (error) is bad on the S2. However, in my experience, when I open maps and look at the location, it seems to be just about dead on. Meaning, even though there is often a blue circle, the center of the circle is extremely close to my actual position. So, I think the issue may be with how the phone calculates the "error" and not with any real inaccuracy. It feels like the reported error value is double what it should really be based on my position on google maps. This is just my experience, ymmv.
TheSopranos16 said:
I agree that the precision (error) is bad on the S2. However, in my experience, when I open maps and look at the location, it seems to be just about dead on. Meaning, even though there is often a blue circle, the center of the circle is extremely close to my actual position. So, I think the issue may be with how the phone calculates the "error" and not with any real inaccuracy. It feels like the reported error value is double what it should really be based on my position on google maps. This is just my experience, ymmv.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree with this. I was puzzled at first too when I looked at the accuracy reading, but then I realized that the actual positioning was much better than the reported 'error margin'.
The GPS itself is fine, but whatever algorithm they use to report accuracy is flawed..or should I say, could be better.
TheSopranos16 said:
However, in my experience, when I open maps and look at the location, it seems to be just about dead on.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same here.
jimbiye said:
I agree with this. I was puzzled at first too when I looked at the accuracy reading, but then I realized that the actual positioning was much better than the reported 'error margin'.
The GPS itself is fine, but whatever algorithm they use to report accuracy is flawed..or should I say, could be better.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
GPS accuracy is a statistical estimate of the maximum error and many assumptions must be made when calculating this, and I don't think different manufactureres does this in the same way.
So a HTC could very well report better accuracy than SGS2 but provide worse position (or vice versa).
Here is an interesting article about GPS accuracy, it mainly concerns static accuracy (reported accuracy in specifications), but the problems are basically the same for dynamic accuracy.
http://www.romdas.com/technical/gps/gps-acc.htm
When I've logged driving on a highway with SGS2 (with my tracks, i e no map matching or other filtering) the position is often within the correct lane but still SGS2 reports 10 meter accuracy (good GPS reception). But once in a while the position drifts a bit further away, mabe 5-10 meters. I would guess I get similar results with other modern smart phones with good GPS even if they report 4 meter accuracy. What phone is wrong in this case? The one reporting 4 meter accuracy that often is correct or the one reporting 10 meters that is even more often correct?
So please compare the phones by logging routes simultanously with "my tracks" instead. I've seen very few tests doing this, and SGS2 seems to do very well in the few tests I've seen
But not only the accuracy is an issue but initial fix is very slow compared to other phones. Even in hotstart mode when it had fix ten minutes ago it still most times takes over a minute to get a fix vs 7 to 10 secs on my Sgs 1
Sent from my GT-I9000 using Tapatalk
I had this problem and found that disabling wifi with data enabled led to much faster first fixes - I assume because the a-GPS data could be obtained more quickly direct from the carrier rather than over the wifi?
Also my UK phone shipped with a US NTP time server. I have since rooted and used GPS Aids to change this and refresh the other GPS data and now have no problems getting a first fix, usually in under 10 seconds.
Last week i traveled to Bosnia and used GPS on my SGS2 for the first time. I have only good words for it as with IGo it was very accurate (in a meter).But as i see with Google maps app GPS is wrong up to 20m.
I was also concerned about the gps first cause it seemed to show very inaccurate results and I have used gps with running a lot. However after using it to track my tracks I have to say that its 98% perfect. Also used it to navigate while driving and its also perfect. Samsung has just done something which makes it look like it would be more inaccurate but reality it is not.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA Premium App
same here. I tested GPS performance a few times when i was walking (relatively static), the error was never under 10 meters, however it did not have a problem tracking my position.
In the other hand, I did have some long long GPS locks from time to time, once in a while the GPS just cannot seem to find my position, despite the fact that I am standing outdoors with no tall buildings around.
Overall experience, just acceptable.