Database Users

HTC threatens handset hackers with legal action for distributing ROMs

READ YOUR HOMEWORK PEOPLE http://www.mobilecrunch.com/2010/06...kers-with-legal-action-for-distributing-roms/

I guess I know what i'll be downloading all day till I got work

That's for Windows Mobile.
hTC can't stop anyone distributing AOSP ROMs, but they could throw the hammer down on distributing their Sense ROMS.

Because of all that nonsense (no pun intended ), I've commited myself to getting this. I'll be more than satisfied.

wcdisciple said:
Because of all that nonsense (no pun intended ), I've commited myself to getting this. I'll be more than satisfied.
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Man, i think you're not getting tired of emphasise how good apple is. Please don't take it offensive, but why are you in this forum if you will buy / have bought an iPhone?
HTC is only one company of many building phones with Android. Whether you like Sense or not is your decision. G1 and MT3G (with google) were never intended to run with Sense. And no one can sue us for using AOSP ROM's. So i have no problem with it compared to apple, who will preselect the software for you...
Jailbreaking the iPhone isn't legal by the way...
PS: don't want to start an Apple/Android war, but leaving one company suing others for another company suing people since years and taking it for the reason why, seems a bit curious to me...

hudl said:
Man, i think you're not getting tired of emphasise how good apple is. Please don't take it offensive, but why are you in this forum if you will buy / have bought an iPhone?
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He's been on a rampage with it.
On a better note: I don't think this will stop ROM development. Didn't xda go through the same thing, but HTC didn't care about the actual developed ROMs?
Edit: Can't find anything to support that. :/ Remember reading it somewhere - might have been bs, but I swear it was on xda news.

HTC threatens handset hackers with legal action - WORST MISTAKE EVER
HTC is seriously making a mistake with that one.
Ive only been satisfied with my purchase of anything they have come with AFTER flashing a Rom into it.
If this continues I promise you they will regret it.
They will lose customers that WILL choose to go to other manufacturers.
The Devs and all who create on a constant basis are not hackers.
They innovate to make HTC a better phone than the competitors because of the work that are done by these fine people.

legend221 said:
HTC is seriously making a mistake with that one.
Ive only been satisfied with my purchase of anything they have come with AFTER flashing a Rom into it.
If this continues I promise you they will regret it.
They will lose customers that WILL choose to go to other manufacturers.
The Devs and all who create on a constant basis are not hackers.
They innovate to make HTC a better phone than the competitors because of the work that are done by these fine people.
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But they didn't take it down because of them being custom ROMs. They were all just the basic stock ROMs that came with the phone. Honestly, there's not much of a difference as both custom and stock contain IP. However, I think they would've taken down xda a long time ago if they were worried about custom ROMs.

r3s-rt said:
Honestly, there's not much of a difference as both custom and stock contain IP.
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There is a HUGE difference between stock and Custom Rom, anyone that has ever flashed a Rom will tell you this.
r3s-rt said:
However, I think they would've taken down xda a long time ago if they were worried about custom ROMs
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A similar C&D almost stopped the progression of a certain legendary Dev on the android scene.
Luckily, there was a workaround and everyone was happy flashing and seeing for themselves how much better our phones have been on a customized, fast and stable Rom.

legend221 said:
There is a HUGE difference between stock and Custom Rom, anyone that has ever flashed a Rom will tell you this.
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Are you serious? So you're telling me all HTC widgets involved in a sense ROM aren't IP? Or Google Apps included in most ROMs aren't IP? Google Maps? Market? Anything? That's actually pretty funny. No THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE between a stock ROM and a custom ROM on the IP subject with the exception of JUST a few. Like.... 2 or 3? Do you even know what intellectual property is?
A similar C&D almost stopped the progression of a certain legendary Dev on the android scene.
Luckily, there was a workaround and everyone was happy flashing and seeing for themselves how much better our phones have been on a customized, fast and stable Rom.
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And no, the similar C&D did NOT almost stop ROM development. If that was the case, NO ROM would come with Google Apps included. However, they DO, and are they are NOT getting C&Ds. If you think Google isn't looking at XDA to see what's happening, you need to start thinking a bit more.
Edit: Also, not every ROM is based off of cyanogen. While there are A LOT that are, not ALL are.

r3s-rt said:
Are you serious? So you're telling me all HTC widgets involved in a sense ROM aren't IP? Or Google Apps included in most ROMs aren't IP? Google Maps? Market? Anything? That's actually pretty funny. No THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE between a stock ROM and a custom ROM on the IP subject with the exception of JUST a few. Like.... 2 or 3? Do you even know what intellectual property is?
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Not everyone even cares about widgets. I only use the calendar one for example. Widgets are not the issue, we are talking about Roms overall because if HTC starts implementing a stricter enforcement of people not having the ability to use or host the Rom of their choice and preventing Devs to freely distribute their work then we are all held mercy to whatever HTC has pre-installed from the factory. A major FAIL for them.
r3s-rt said:
And no, the similar C&D did NOT almost stop ROM development. If that was the case, NO ROM would come with Google Apps included. However, they DO, and are they are NOT getting C&Ds. If you think Google isn't looking at XDA to see what's happening, you need to start thinking a bit more.
Edit: Also, not every ROM is based off of cyanogen. While there are A LOT that are, not ALL are.
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Google knows its in their best interest to keep letting everyone that wants to flash a custom Rom. Some people buy specific phones (the past phones of mine as well) only if they are rooted or can install a custom SPL and flash their flavor of a Rom. The Cyanogen reference was an example not for every case, we are aware of the Windows Mobile, etc sections of xda.

legend221 said:
Not everyone even cares about widgets. I only use the calendar one for example. Widgets are not the issue, we are talking about Roms overall because if HTC starts implementing a stricter enforcement of people not having the ability to use or host the Rom of their choice and preventing Devs to freely distribute their work then we are all held mercy to whatever HTC has pre-installed from the factory. A major FAIL for them.
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You're not continuing what you originally said. You said there's a huge difference between a custom ROM and a stock ROM. Now, this statement should have been based on IP terms, as this is clearly what the topic is supposed to be about. My point is that IP is still included in any ROM. It doesn't matter what you use - that is completely irrelevant to the subject matter. They clearly are not enforcing all little bits of IP. If that was the case, as I've said multiple times, xda wouldn't be here right now. HTC is WELL AWARE along with Microsoft and Google of what goes on here. I promise you they pay once lucky bastard to sit here and probe this site, along with others, all day everyday and flag anything they see unfit. The main thing they seem to not like is ROM libraries. That's just from my experience.
To sum this up" We are NOT at mercy of what is pre-installed from factory or they would have sent out much more C&D letters much sooner than this. XDA has over 2 MILLION users. That's all I'm saying.
Google knows its in their best interest to keep letting everyone that wants to flash a custom Rom. Some people buy specific phones (the past phones of mine as well) only if they are rooted or can install a custom SPL and flash their flavor of a Rom. The Cyanogen reference was an example not for every case, we are aware of the Windows Mobile, etc sections of xda.
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Best interest? Are you serious, bro? Android is marketed as an open-source platform. That's not in their "best interest." It's in their intents! The unrootable is because of cell phone carriers! Guess what?! The Dream came out as a Development phone! The Google ION (more commonly the myTouch 3g)? Development phone! The cyanogenmod reference was taken for what it was - an C&D from GOOGLE! NOT HTC!

r3s-rt said:
You're not continuing what you originally said. You said there's a huge difference between a custom ROM and a stock ROM. Now, this statement should have been based on IP terms, as this is clearly what the topic is supposed to be about. My point is that IP is still included in any ROM. It doesn't matter what you use - that is completely irrelevant to the subject matter. They clearly are not enforcing all little bits of IP. If that was the case, as I've said multiple times, xda wouldn't be here right now. HTC is WELL AWARE along with Microsoft and Google of what goes on here. I promise you they pay once lucky bastard to sit here and probe this site, along with others, all day everyday and flag anything they see unfit. The main thing they seem to not like is ROM libraries. That's just from my experience.
To sum this up" We are NOT at mercy of what is pre-installed from factory or they would have sent out much more C&D letters much sooner than this. XDA has over 2 MILLION users. That's all I'm saying.
Best interest? Are you serious, bro? Android is marketed as an open-source platform. That's not in their "best interest." It's in their intents! The unrootable is because of cell phone carriers! Guess what?! The Dream came out as a Development phone! The Google ION (more commonly the myTouch 3g)? Development phone! The cyanogenmod reference was taken for what it was - an C&D from GOOGLE! NOT HTC!
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Thanks for giving that one guy the heads up on what goes on and what doesnt go on around here if he indeed does exist. If theres anything we dont need is anyone giving them more fuel to thier fire.
No one said the C&D came from HTC, seeing as you are a reader on xda I knew I didnt have to explain this to you. hahaha. It is in Google's best interest to let the Devs continue thier greatness because guess what many would jump ship to Windows Mobile devices or other OS including the iPhone even though there are not Roms for it I believe. If Android Development was not allowed to continue, at least most people would stop buying Android powered phones I believe.
Yawn........ time for bed now.

Why are you all under the assumption that the majority of HTC sales all run off of custom firmware? Do you really believe that sales are going to be effected that much because of HTC's decision?

legend221 said:
No one said the C&D came from HTC
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Did you even read the article? If you are referring to the one cyanogen got, I never said it did. Seeing as you are just a reader (not) I didn't have to explain this to you. But I did. Please, if you're going to try and get a point across, respect me enough to actually read what I said.
legend221 said:
Thanks for giving that one guy the heads up on what goes on and what doesnt go on around here if he indeed does exist. If theres anything we dont need is anyone giving them more fuel to thier fire.
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I had to edit this is. Really? Have you been snorting cocaine or something? That's pretty damn paranoid. If you don't think that happens, you just need to get off the internet as that's just basic knowledge. If you were HTC, would you not watch us? If you wouldn't - stay out of sales forever.
Binary100100 said:
Why are you all under the assumption that the majority of HTC sales all run off of custom firmware? Do you really believe that sales are going to be effected that much because of HTC's decision?
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I'm not under that assumption; I take you include me in the all. I just stated that at least this won't affect custom ROMs and he went on about how custom ROMs are so different and don't contain IP. That's what I've been trying to get across in all my posts. And no, I don't think their sales will be affected .

r3s-rt said:
Did you even read the article? If you are referring to the one cyanogen got, I never said it did. Seeing as you are just a reader (not) I didn't have to explain this to you. But I did. Please, if you're going to try and get a point across, respect me enough to actually read what I said.
I had to edit this is. Really? Have you been snorting cocaine or something? That's pretty damn paranoid. If you don't think that happens, you just need to get off the internet as that's just basic knowledge. If you were HTC, would you not watch us? If you wouldn't - stay out of sales forever.
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You're still on what I said?
Get over it and realize not everyone is going to agree with you or your thoughts.
The one on drugs is YOU, damn get out of the forums and do something else with your time man. hahaha
That's why its a forum and NOT your personal website.

legend221 said:
You're still on what I said?
Get over it and realize not everyone is going to agree with you or your thoughts.
The one on drugs is YOU, damn get out of the forums and do something else with your time man. hahaha
That's why its a forum and NOT your personal website.
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Any one with intelligence will tell you that 90% of custom ROMs contain IP. The fact that you are swearing up and down that they don't is just.... stupid.

r3s-rt said:
Any one with intelligence will tell you that 90% of custom ROMs contain IP. The fact that you are swearing up and down that they don't is just.... stupid.
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The fact of the matter is that without proprietary IP, you can't even start the thing up. There is more IP than just widgets, launchers, and apps... there are DRIVERS and other such buried nonsense.
SOME of this IP *IS* distributed, have a look at developer.htc.com -- HTC eventually relented and opened their kernel modifications since they were committing a GPL violation, but there is other stuff on that page that is being distributed that IS proprietary IP, specifically, the "HTC Proprietary Binaries for ADP1". And those binaries don't even include all the proprietary binaries needed to make full use of the phone, such as the GPU drivers and the video decoder drivers.
THANKFULLY, the phone's owner IS licensed to use all of those binaries, so they can just keep them. Note that they're also included in the FULL SYSTEM IMAGES that HTC ITSELF distributed from developer.htc.com.
*** and that is a HUGE DIFFERENCE between the android platform and wimo.... the fact that HTC distributes ***all*** of the proprietary binaries straight from their website. It means that it ***IS*** possible to generate fully AOSP (but non-functional) system images, and the USER can combine them with the binaries provided by HTC to make a working system.
From what I've seen, HTC REALLY DOESN'T CARE and/or actually WANTS users to build custom roms for their phones. They send out the cease and desist order for distribution of wimo roms, PROBABLY in accordance with MS's demands. MS probably said to them -- "listen, you either try to put a lid on piracy or we're going to stop sending you MSTRASH." HTC distributes GOOGLE apps in the roms on their website because THAT'S WHAT GOOGLE WANTS.

lbcoder said:
The fact of the matter is that without proprietary IP, you can't even start the thing up. There is more IP than just widgets, launchers, and apps... there are DRIVERS and other such buried nonsense.
SOME of this IP *IS* distributed, have a look at developer.htc.com -- HTC eventually relented and opened their kernel modifications since they were committing a GPL violation, but there is other stuff on that page that is being distributed that IS proprietary IP, specifically, the "HTC Proprietary Binaries for ADP1". And those binaries don't even include all the proprietary binaries needed to make full use of the phone, such as the GPU drivers and the video decoder drivers.
THANKFULLY, the phone's owner IS licensed to use all of those binaries, so they can just keep them. Note that they're also included in the FULL SYSTEM IMAGES that HTC ITSELF distributed from developer.htc.com.
*** and that is a HUGE DIFFERENCE between the android platform and wimo.... the fact that HTC distributes ***all*** of the proprietary binaries straight from their website. It means that it ***IS*** possible to generate fully AOSP (but non-functional) system images, and the USER can combine them with the binaries provided by HTC to make a working system.
From what I've seen, HTC REALLY DOESN'T CARE and/or actually WANTS users to build custom roms for their phones. They send out the cease and desist order for distribution of wimo roms, PROBABLY in accordance with MS's demands. MS probably said to them -- "listen, you either try to put a lid on piracy or we're going to stop sending you MSTRASH." HTC distributes GOOGLE apps in the roms on their website because THAT'S WHAT GOOGLE WANTS.
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1. Didn't even think about all that.
2. That's exactly what I thought. Microsoft is so scared of a lonely developer doing better than what their out-the-ass payed developers do. Honestly, why would the manufacturer of the phone give a damn what you do with it when you buy it? No matter what way you look at it: their task is to sell the phones they manufacture.

SE Arc: same HUGE mistake by SE?

I hope SE marketing dudes can read this too!
I was a SE fanboy since the T68 and I only left them last year for the Nexus One, the reason?
HTC didn't lock everything in their Google Android phone and I can change any rom I want whenever I want,keeping me not to get bored by the same UI...
When I saw the presentation of the SE ARC I said to myself ''what a jewel!'' and was convinced to come back to SE,BUT it looks like SE doesn't want me or many many other people to get an ARC because they didn't understand the meaning of Android OS = Rooting and Custom Roms!!
Samsung in another hand understood very well the Android buyers needs and that's why the Galaxy S was a huge success...
In other words: SE is not learning from their errors or they don't want to?

Hahaha, how much do you want to hate a brand to start the 40th of such a topic. If you visit xda often you know there are hundreds of these kind of topics, tell me, why you open a new topic for this. 20 seconds of reading and you found lots of the same....
Mods, please delete this...this whole section will be a mess...just keep the flamers in one topic....
Sent from my X10i using Tapatalk

The arc is rumoured to be more open than X10. Guess we just have to wait and see

The only reason Android has been about rooting and custom roms is because the core OS has been quite crappy up til now.. and the mannfacturer UI's have been dull and not intuitive or simple... this is all moving along rather quickly now and the core OS is significantly better.. close to full dual/ multicore processor support and the UI's are getting better, more friendly..
99% of users won't want to root and install custom ROM's when the preinstalled ones work.. and work really well.... the magic of Android is that there will be lots of UI's to choose from so there'll be plenty to cater for differing tastes.. and you can customise your phone loads anyway, before you get to rooting it..

vegetaleb said:
that's why the Galaxy S was a huge success...
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I do indeed see a lot of Galaxy S's out there, but I havnt seen anyone with a custom rom installed so that isnt the reason that it's a success.. maybe, uh, i don't know.. Clever marketing?

TimMun said:
I do indeed see a lot of Galaxy S's out there, but I havnt seen anyone with a custom rom installed so that isnt the reason that it's a success.. maybe, uh, i don't know.. Clever marketing?
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Quite a few of the Galaxy S's that I have seen had some sort of lagfix applied to correct the messed up filesystem that Samsung implemented but on the custom roms I'm absolutely with you.

im_iceman said:
The only reason Android has been about rooting and custom roms is because the core OS has been quite crappy up til now.. and the mannfacturer UI's have been dull and not intuitive or simple... this is all moving along rather quickly now and the core OS is significantly better.. close to full dual/ multicore processor support and the UI's are getting better, more friendly..
99% of users won't want to root and install custom ROM's when the preinstalled ones work.. and work really well.... the magic of Android is that there will be lots of UI's to choose from so there'll be plenty to cater for differing tastes.. and you can customise your phone loads anyway, before you get to rooting it..
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Exactly. The X10 , like almost all other Android devices, is lacking with the stock software, which is why people root and use custom roms. I think that Sony Ericsson might be the first to deliver a fully satisfying 'stock' experience with the new Xperia series, and so that basically eliminates the need to root/rom.

Ambroos said:
Exactly. The X10 , like almost all other Android devices, is lacking with the stock software, which is why people root and use custom roms. I think that Sony Ericsson might be the first to deliver a fully satisfying 'stock' experience with the new Xperia series, and so that basically eliminates the need to root/rom.
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yes.. for most.. but there will always be the hardcore minority who will want to root it regardless of how good the stock ROM is - to remove apps they don't use, or change the UI in a way that you can't on a non-rooted phone!

im_iceman said:
yes.. for most.. but there will always be the hardcore minority who will want to root it regardless of how good the stock ROM is - to remove apps they don't use, or change the UI in a way that you can't on a non-rooted phone!
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Exactly, but as you said it's only a hardcore minority, and they should try to understand why Sony Ericsson (or other manufacturers) can't always make sure everything is the way they want it to be!

The minority nowadays are the ones who don't want to root and use custom roms
Even if the stock rom is awesome it's still better to make it faster and enhance some components like camera and audio, now if you are a X10 user and can't enjoy custom roms like we are with HTC it's normal that you live in a world where rooting is like a crime
Oh by the way HTC Sense is awesome that's why I use it from time to time on my N1,now I want speed and smoothness so I am using MIUI,tomorrow when the stock gingerbread will have trackball wake and high def camera I will flash its custom rom
Yes yes most custom roms are based on stock roms so you lose nothing you just get more

vegetaleb said:
The minority nowadays are the ones who don't want to root and use custom roms
Even if the stock rom is awesome it's still better to make it faster and enhance some components like camera and audio, now if you are a X10 user and can't enjoy custom roms like we are with HTC it's normal that you live in a world where rooting is like a crime
Oh by the way HTC Sense is awesome that's why I use it from time to time on my N1,now I want speed and smoothness so I am using MIUI,tomorrow when the stock gingerbread will have trackball wake and high def camera I will flash its custom rom
Yes yes most custom roms are based on stock roms so you lose nothing you just get more
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I beg to differ, think about it, how many members here for the X10 section? 100k? 200K? I don't think we exceed 10k to be honest. Xperia sold in 2010 more than 9 million devices. Calculate that then you'll understand that we are the minorities here, 10% maximum

I'm getting an Arc, and I for instance won't be rooting it or putting a custom rom on it. The X10, I would, just for JIT, but that's about it really... Oh well!

I've just had a look.. and there's current c500 people viewing the X10 forums.. so yeah.. 10k is probably about right.. although alot of them won't have rooted either!

im_iceman said:
I've just had a look.. and there's current c500 people viewing the X10 forums.. so yeah.. 10k is probably about right.. although alot of them won't have rooted either!
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Then 10% is probably too much
Sent from my X10i using XDA Premium App

0.1% of 9 million is 9000... 1% is 90,000.. so I think we can safely pitch in at less than 1% will have rooted the phone. And sadly for them, they're also oblivious of how much more it can do once rooted!

guys i really wanna buy the xperia neo/ arc (havent yet decided ) but the only thing keeping me away from this decision is the locked bootloader question..
does anyone know whether se is still keeping it locked ? or they finally lstarted listening to people ?
thanks in advance

xilw3r said:
guys i really wanna buy the xperia neo/ arc (havent yet decided ) but the only thing keeping me away from this decision is the locked bootloader question..
does anyone know whether se is still keeping it locked ? or they finally lstarted listening to people ?
thanks in advance
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It will remain locked. Same with other companies as they are now asking SE's advice in locking their device. Atrix should be one of the new handsets that are signed locked.

darn fools all of them
but on the other hand, what IS the actual benefit from having the bootloader unlocked ? installing other kernels to implement roms easier ? OCing ? if thats all then im not exatcly impressed
ofc.. the easy rom implement is sweet, but people seem to be getting around the problem and making roms anyway

xilw3r said:
darn fools all of them
but on the other hand, what IS the actual benefit from having the bootloader unlocked ? installing other kernels to implement roms easier ? OCing ? if thats all then im not exatcly impressed
ofc.. the easy rom implement is sweet, but people seem to be getting around the problem and making roms anyway
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well, you're locked to roms which are made for your kernel version, if you have a locked bootloader
anyway I'm not really too fussed regarding locked bootloader tbh, I want a Android phone that has excellent multimedia options, with sleek design and extremely potent camera, that's exactly what Arc is - I bought x8 just to test out Android and honestly I can't say I'm too dissapointed with them deciding not to support old xperia line of products
I'll be super annoyed if they don't provide future support for the arc though, minimum 2+ years support is what all the mobile phone companies should do with their phones

SE has learned that it doesn't matter and that they can get away with it. It's likely that android will stay on the 2.3/4. Xxxx for a while for phones. But I don't think that they will support any phone past a year anymore.
Sent from my X10a using XDA App

[Poll] how many users wanting Windows Phone 7 port ?

I know that many people are too excited after the bootloader is unlocked, so now we can get a windows phone 7 port like that in HD2.
Personally speaking, I was going to trade my beloved X10 for a HD2 so that I can get the goods of both worlds, but now I am going to stay for a long while with the X10.
How many X10 users want a WP7 port?

i'd maybe try it out for a little bit

guys get realistic.....
there are TONS of devices with unlocked bootloaders, and only hd2 has a wp7 port.
It isn't as easy as you think. It is not going to happen

scoobysnacks is right. It isn't going to happen unless you the OP makes it. Most/all of the developers here are android developers...not Windows Mango. Personally I don't want it...I rather want a bootloader unlock that will work with SIM unlocked by third party software. THAT, my friend is more important now. For me atleast...

Thats why i have a samsung focus as well lol.

Even if theoretically some incredible wp7 dev shows up, expect it to take at least six months to a year.
I would be willing to bet it never happens

scoobysnacks said:
Even if theoretically some incredible wp7 dev shows up, expect it to take at least six months to a year.
I would be willing to bet it never happens
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Click to collapse
Of course it will not.
And, if you ask me,
I'd take any real improvement to the device
over a half-*ssed port of another OS any day.

Someone realllly needs to set the record straight on what an unlocked bootloader does and doesn't do. Half of the people on here think it will turn their phone into a spaceship, or something along those lines...

scoobysnacks said:
Someone realllly needs to set the record straight on what an unlocked bootloader does and doesn't do. Half of the people on here think it will turn their phone into a spaceship, or something along those lines...
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Hahahaha
Well, there goes my dreams...thanks alot scooby!

Dont care for W7 as much as unlocking bootloader for 3rd party simunlock and partitioning.

scoobysnacks said:
Someone realllly needs to set the record straight on what an unlocked bootloader does and doesn't do. Half of the people on here think it will turn their phone into a spaceship, or something along those lines...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
"I open booter how no full multi touched?"
Been seeing that question a lot recently...
Sent from my x10, rocking Wolf's 2.3.3 + DooMKernel, overclocked to 1.2 GHz...

My dream was always to have an Wm phone...since i was a kid. Unfortunately the only thing i could find before x10 was an OMNIA. God Damn.
sent from MIUI 1.9.2 Rom test with Doom's kernel and bootloader cracked thanks to azuzu

If u see all threats started by FXP/J u see he knows windows phone Developnment as well!!

MAGPC said:
I know that many people are too excited after the bootloader is unlocked, so now we can get a windows phone 7 port like that in HD2.
Personally speaking, I was going to trade my beloved X10 for a HD2 so that I can get the goods of both worlds, but now I am going to stay for a long while with the X10.
How many X10 users want a WP7 port?
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Click to collapse
I doubt it would be possible because WP7 is not open source, and closed source software is not legal to modify and upload to XDA...
Of course, I may be wrong...

This definitely Will not happen. In more excited about hopefully having a proper ported ice cream Rom since the bootloader will allow a new upto date kernel
Sent from my X10i using XDA Premium App

Frosty666 said:
"I open booter how no full multi touched?"
Been seeing that question a lot recently...
Sent from my x10, rocking Wolf's 2.3.3 + DooMKernel, overclocked to 1.2 GHz...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The full multitouch won't apparate outta the blue. Drivers need to be written and that takes time.

Prodigy said:
I doubt it would be possible because WP7 is not open source, and closed source software is not legal to modify and upload to XDA...
Of course, I may be wrong...
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Click to collapse
HTC HD2 did that already.
video just for reference: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NgF0cSUJE4I&feature=related
unlocked bootloader gives us a lot more option to modified our phone as much as we like (but still depend on hardware limit). Any difrent OS on x10 should be fun. not that android is bad. but we can experience a lot of diffrent os without buy another phone.

You still have problems with partition layout - I doubt Windows and Android phones have same system+data+boot partition layout...

Arnold.Alexius said:
HTC HD2 did that already.
video just for reference: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NgF0cSUJE4I&feature=related
unlocked bootloader gives us a lot more option to modified our phone as much as we like (but still depend on hardware limit). Any difrent OS on x10 should be fun. not that android is bad. but we can experience a lot of diffrent os without buy another phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes but HD2 is an exception to the rule, it is the ONLY phone that this has been done on.
Yet how many phones have unlocked bootloaders?
These types of threads are ridiculous and not going to get us anywhere aside from giving people false impressions

I have been living in the HD2 forum for days before I got the Xperia, because I intended to get an HD2. then I got my beloved X10.
Anyway, what I know is that the HD2 and X10 have the same CPU+GPU chipset, which is an advantage to us.
So, if any developer is interested we may contact some guys in the HD2 WP7 forum asking for help.
I know that it may not happen at all, but would we stand still?. Hopes are achieved by positive attitude and work.

Vanilla (stock) ICS vs. Sense 4.0 + ICS

In my recent mental debate over the EVO 4G LTE vs. the Nexus, I've pondered the differences between stock ICS (pure/vanilla/etc) and the ICS we will see on the One series by HTC, including our very own EVO sequel. From the few screenshots I've seen of the One X, it does not remotely resemble the ICS I've learned to know and love with the work our devs our doing to bring the latest and greatest to the OG. Examples include the lockscreen (the Sense ring appears to still be the default one - is there an option to go straight ICS for the lockscreen?), the dock (I'm sure I can switch the launcher to fix this issue...), the notifications pulldown (I've actually not seen the Sense one yet, but I've heard various things indicating it is different from the one I'm no accustomed to), etc. Heck, even the color of the battery meter is green instead of blue!
Does anyone know or at least have an idea if we can change some of those things without rooting our devices? Having a brand new device, I don't plan on needing to root (or at least install custom ROMs, that is) for a while. But I am already missing the slick new interface Google has provided. While many claim that Sense 4.0 is going for the minimalistic approach to the latest iteration of their infamous skin, why do I feel like they have completely altered a widely praised operating system that has barely rolled out? I'm a little saddened when I see the video of the EVO 4G LTE and feel like the look of everything is dated.
But then I look at the hardware, think about the devs who'll inevitably move to this phone, and that excites me about the possibilities. I guess I'm more curious than disappointed, but I was wondering others' feelings on this topic.

Long answer short, you'll get aosp, miui and sense on the HTC which is nice if you get bored and want something different.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA

alaman68 said:
Long answer short, you'll get aosp, miui and sense on the HTC which is nice if you get bored and want something different.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Can you make your short answer slightly longer? Haha how would I get AOSP and MIUI on the EVO LTE? You mean one devs get to work on it? Or stock?
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA

PsiPhiDan said:
Can you make your short answer slightly longer? Haha how would I get AOSP and MIUI on the EVO LTE? You mean one devs get to work on it? Or stock?
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Right. Not stock, would have to be rooted. My bad. The devs will be all over that phone anyway so it will be a blast
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA

It's a *good* thing the phone comes with Sense, its one more option you have, and Sense does add some useful features. Custom rom's will offer all kinds of options including optimized and bloatware free versions of Sense.

alaman68 said:
Right. Not stock, would have to be rooted. My bad. The devs will be all over that phone anyway so it will be a blast
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Completely agree. I'm kind of thinking of galaxy nexus, cuz I'm not fond of sense. But, I'm sure in no time we'll be able to rip sense OFF that SOB and put AOKP or some other variant of vanilla ICS.
Then, if you wanna run sense for a few days, that option will still be there. It's win-win.
Sent from my PC36100 using xda premium

If I'm running Sense 4.0, do you think I'll still be able to get the Quad ICS unlock screen, or something like that? I LOVE that lockscreen - way better than the silly ring that Sense creates. I don't understand why they didn't change that from 3.0 and 3.5 to something fresh. Oh, I would assume I have the "unlock with face" option too on this phone? It's been so long since I ran Sense, I forgot if these things are changeable or not!
My only concern with the custom ROMs is whether things will run okay, like camera and such. Also, if you are running AOSP, you'll miss out on the supposedly amazing camera suite that Sense 4.0 provides, right?
Tough choice!!!

Sense 4.0 + ICS ALL DAY!
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA

I went to tmobile today and toyed with the one s. I will say it isn't the ICS we know from the current development but it is beautiful and sleek. The soft keys are a bit cumbersome but I could get used to it. I am in no way drawn away from the evo lte and am more than anxious to own that device!
Sent from my PC36100 using xda premium

imheroldman said:
I went to tmobile today and toyed with the one s. I will say it isn't the ICS we know from the current development but it is beautiful and sleek. The soft keys are a bit cumbersome but I could get used to it. I am in no way drawn away from the evo lte and am more than anxious to own that device!
Sent from my PC36100 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's awesome, especially considering the One S is inferior to our EVO we're getting...
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA

Well I will answer my own question at this moment, because I stopped into a T-Mobile and played with the One-S for about 10 minutes. It appears that ICS as we know it is VERY coated by Sense, but not necessarily in a bad way. It is still beautiful, just very different. I noticed that there were no quick settings in the notifications menu, which is one thing I was very curious about. But overall, really nice and REALLY amazing! Considering that is the crappy version of our EVOs, I cannot wait for this thing. The One-S screen was awesome, and I know it can't touch the screen (both size and resolution-wise) of our new toy coming out. But the UI was terrifically smooth, the feel was nice (physically), and Sense was overall not intrusive. It was just omnipresent. I'm not disappointed at all - and I know the devs will give us amazing options in terms of removing Sense, or tweaking Sense to give us cool features like quick settings and slide to change brightness.
I can't wait until the One-X is out so that I can play with that one, since it will give a much more accurate portrayal of our experience we can expect. May 18th can't get here soon enough!

I'm posting this everywhere . Its a post by toastcfh over in the oneX forums about how much HTC locked the phone down. Among many things, it is impossible to mount SD from recovery due to their locking, even with custom recovery and HTC dev unlock. If toast says it, it is so, I mean, the guy is an Android/Linux GENIUS. he's the one that had the Evo root method instructions posted before launch day.
Quote.....
no, USB mount does not work in recovery. It appears to be locked out in recovery mode. the workarounds to get it working are one of two things.
(1) fastboot boot awesomeRecovery.img (this works because fastboot then boots recovery on the boot/temporary partition. So the you're not actually in recovery mode
(2) Offmode (this works because again you're again not technically in recovery mode. It uses the recovery ramdisk, kernel, and binaries but its still not technically recovery.
On that note I've seen suggestions that it's possibly a recovery issue with cwm and twrp. Unfortunately it doesn't appear to be the case. If it were then in CWM u wouldn't have usb when u fastboot boot the recovery or in offmode (fair assumption since both these options use the same kernel, ramdisk and binaries as recovery?). Can it be fix? Not that i know of. It looks to me like a total radio or bootloader lockout from using USB in recovery. Which means on a radio or bootloader level USB is disabled in recovery mode.
On that note I think we should raise the point to HTC that this locking down of the device does not suite our needs.Key points of fail would be as follows.
(1) Can NOT flash the boot partition from recovery. I've personally contacted HTC on this numerous times and they seem to just not care. Responding with "It's a security issue" and so forth. I would love to know how this is a security issue of any sort. Every other Android device has this ability except HTC devices since they started the HTC unlock ordeal. It's utter fail IMHO and HTC should listen to our needs .
(2) Can NOT flash recovery or boot partitions from system. This issue is NOT a deal breaker and isn't so bad when it comes down to the nitty gritty. But since the issue above exists, flashing with applications like htc dumlock and such were our only options. These work around apps cant be used to flash now because of the lockpout from system and it wouldn't be such an issue if HTC didnt lock us out in recovery from flashing boot.
(3) Can NOT flash P*IMG.zips in hboot/bootloader anymore. For the unlocked device running a custom firmware this is a must. Specially when radio updates and such are needed from the OEM. We seen a big use of this on the Sensation when HTC updated the device from Gingerbread to Ice Cream Sandwich. The update required new hboots, radios, and partitioning to actually use. So in that instead of having to flash a RUU Which didn't exist the only choice was to flash a custom P*IMG.zip that included all the radios and images need to run the builds. At this point we can't update those image/partitions without flashing an RUU. This makes no since and doesn't seem to do anything but make things more difficult on the unlocker to customize and modify their device.
(4) If all the conditions above HAVE to exist. Then why not give us documentation or utilities to flash fimware.zips from recovery like HTC does? When HTC was the proud Nexus device there was full support and documentation available on how to flash firmware on their devices. This made anyone choosing an HTC device blessed with knowing that their device was not only open and unlocked, but when flashing firmware that it was being flashed correctly to Google and HTC's standards. This code has now been moved out of recovery since right before the move to edify scripting and moved to vendor/htc/ (not arguing this choice as thats where it belongs from a maintaining point of view). But the problem is that vendor/htc is proprietary now. Which means Documentation and support for flashing firmware correctly is not available and left to developers of recoveries for the community to figure out. One would think if HTC was standing behind us that they would step up and give us a PROPER/OPEN/REAL unlock, or if they cant for the lame excuse of security concerns, then give us the documentation and utilities to flash the boot and firmware partitions properly. I mean really... what is there to lose there?
(5) WHAT WAS THE POINT OF HTC UNLOCK? I was to reach out and except us as a community. It was to keep us from having to exploit their firmware and look for holes to gain control of a device we rightfully own. WHAT DID HTC UNLOCK DO? It unlocked the devices at first and with each new revision of the unlock it gets more locked down and harder for us to use it as intended. WHAT DOES THAT LEAD TO? It leads to us hoping someone will take the time out of their life and exploit HTC's firmware so we can have access and control of our devices. I mean, it's bad when u have people poking a device with a paperclip to get a device unlocked to avoid a official unlock.
Bottom line; I'm personally fed up with HTC's unlock. It's absolute crap! It does not serve the purpose it was intended and only makes things harder then they were before. As a devoted HTC customer it has me questioning if my next device will be an HTC. With all the other options that would allow me to spend less time trying to gain proper access to my device and more time actually having fun with it, why choose HTC? Everyone else is shying away for these same issues. Everyone with an HTC unlocked device waits for someone to exploit HTC's firmware and give them a proper unlock. Why not just choose a device without the locked down/unlock instead? IDK but HTC needs to step up and listen to us. Every HTC forum with an HTC Unlock is screaming for these issues to be fixed.
My call to HTC is to fix these issue and/or give us proper documentation on flashing firmware to our devices via custom recoveries. The boot flashing lockout is dumb, pointless, and in NO WAY a security threat AT ALL and is nothing more then a CRAP RESPONSE to something that they sould be working to correct, instead of ignoring. In the end its hurting HTC's relations with developers and is ultimately doing the opposite of what it's original intent.
HTC, PLEASE READ AND LISTEN!!!11ONEone
To everyone else, SPREAD THE WORD!!!ONEone
End quote.........
There has to be a way to petition HTC. Reading this is making me lean galaxy Nexus, ...and I F$%kin HATE Samsung.
Edit: this post is from the One X forum TWRP topic.
Sent from my PC36100 using xda premium

No way I'm buying a Samsung phone.
I'll trust that someone will figure out how to get around the issue at some point. I love how the phone is stock anyway.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA

PsiPhiDan said:
In my recent mental debate over the EVO 4G LTE vs. the Nexus, I've pondered the differences between stock ICS (pure/vanilla/etc) and the ICS we will see on the One series by HTC, including our very own EVO sequel. From the few screenshots I've seen of the One X, it does not remotely resemble the ICS I've learned to know and love with the work our devs our doing to bring the latest and greatest to the OG. Examples include the lockscreen (the Sense ring appears to still be the default one - is there an option to go straight ICS for the lockscreen?), the dock (I'm sure I can switch the launcher to fix this issue...), the notifications pulldown (I've actually not seen the Sense one yet, but I've heard various things indicating it is different from the one I'm no accustomed to), etc. Heck, even the color of the battery meter is green instead of blue!
Does anyone know or at least have an idea if we can change some of those things without rooting our devices? Having a brand new device, I don't plan on needing to root (or at least install custom ROMs, that is) for a while. But I am already missing the slick new interface Google has provided. While many claim that Sense 4.0 is going for the minimalistic approach to the latest iteration of their infamous skin, why do I feel like they have completely altered a widely praised operating system that has barely rolled out? I'm a little saddened when I see the video of the EVO 4G LTE and feel like the look of everything is dated.
But then I look at the hardware, think about the devs who'll inevitably move to this phone, and that excites me about the possibilities. I guess I'm more curious than disappointed, but I was wondering others' feelings on this topic.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There IS PLENTY of apps on the play store that offer home screen and lock screen customization, such as launcherpro, milocker, gosms, as far as changing the status bar and battery bar i'm not so sure, i haven't been on a phone with s-on in a while and can't tell you what rootless tweaks would work

No Custom ROMs on WP8 Devices

Hi I wanted to buy a wp8 device but after reading this article I gave up buying a wp8 device. Because no custom roms is a deal-breaker for me. So looks like its not possible to unlock wp8 devices for now but I don't know is it gonna be in the future. I'm asking because I don't know how unlocking process works because I never used a wp device. I know how android system works but I have no idea about wp devices. So if you guys can explain if it can be done in the future or why we will never be able to unlock wp8 devices. :good:
Edit: Its no longer a deal-breaker for me I thought unlock was important as much as jailbreak on iphone and root on android. But thanks for helping me realise wp devices do not need unlock
Edit2: I bought a lumia 920. You guys were right wp is awesome. Only things I am missing from android is file explorer, rotation lock and notifications.

Yes you definitely dont know much about WP. You never used one, but you know that custom ROMs are dealbreaker for you. Nice.
Just to let you know, custom roms are not important at all in WP. They dont bring much improvement, far less than in android.

martan1981 said:
Yes you definitely dont know much about WP. You never used one, but you know that custom ROMs are dealbreaker for you. Nice.
Just to let you know, custom roms are not important at all in WP. They dont bring much improvement, far less than in android.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can be right, custom roms means a lot on android and jailbreak means a lot for iphone. So I thought unlock is important like jailbreak/root. But if not, I'm definitely gonna buy a wp8 Thanks for the info about roms. I want to ask, can we install local apps like we can do at android without unlocking?

Windows Phones do not need custom ROMs, because all the mess that's happening on base ROMs for android is not present, which is why custom ROMs exist for android in the first place, and not because of customization or whatever else then less enlighten users use ROMs for.

mcosmin222 said:
Windows Phones do not need custom ROMs, because all the mess that's happening on base ROMs for android is not present, which is why custom ROMs exist for android in the first place
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Er, custom ROMs aren't "needed" anywhere.* They exist because developers have an itch for some feature or bugfix not available in stock - in other words, they have something that improves over stock in some way. Perhaps you should read the feature lists of some WP custom ROMs.
No possible improvements over stock is not a good thing no matter how you spin it. That said, I think the OP is overreacting calling it a "deal-breaker". Well, it depends on what you're looking for in "jailbreaking". This jailbreak feature, for one, won't be available.
*Edit: You know this because the users of custom ROMs are always in the vast minority.

Something that needs improvement is messed up in my books sooo....
Yeh the Op is kinda exaggerating with the deal-breaker though.

mcosmin222 said:
Something that needs improvement is messed up in my books sooo....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As I've just pointed out, improvement is not needed. On the other hand, is improvement improvement? Why, yes.

thebobp said:
Er, custom ROMs aren't "needed" anywhere.* They exist because developers have an itch for some feature or bugfix not available in stock - in other words, they have something that improves over stock in some way. Perhaps you should read the feature lists of some WP custom ROMs.
No possible improvements over stock is not a good thing no matter how you spin it. That said, I think the OP is overreacting calling it a "deal-breaker". Well, it depends on what you're looking for in "jailbreaking". This jailbreak feature, for one, won't be available.
*Edit: You know this because the users of custom ROMs are always in the vast minority.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bite your tongue, sir: custom roms are practically necessary for android. Stock ROMs have faulty GPS drivers, crapware, bloatware, SPYWARE even. I have a friend who bought a low end android phone from sprint. Two mistakes: being on sprint and going low end on android. It's getting better, but android is a huge resource hog, and having all the carrier crap on there makes it worse. My friend's phone is quite literally unusable; it locks up very often. Even after I hard reset it for him. On android, stock is [probably] ALWAYS bad.
WP8 however.... I have a custom ROM for my WP7 device, but everything I've done with the custom ROM is natively supported in WP8. So I guess I could live with a stock WP8 ROM. The only thing I'd be missing out on is free tethering.
Carriers, if you charge for tethering... **** you.

^ in your opinion.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

link68759 said:
Bite your tongue, sir: custom roms are practically necessary for android. Stock ROMs have faulty GPS drivers, crapware, bloatware, SPYWARE even. I have a friend who bought a low end android phone from sprint. Two mistakes: being on sprint and going low end on android. It's getting better, but android is a huge resource hog, and having all the carrier crap on there makes it worse. My friend's phone is quite literally unusable; it locks up very often. Even after I hard reset it for him. On android, stock is [probably] ALWAYS bad.
WP8 however.... I have a custom ROM for my WP7 device, but everything I've done with the custom ROM is natively supported in WP8. So I guess I could live with a stock WP8 ROM. The only thing I'd be missing out on is free tethering.
Carriers, if you charge for tethering... **** you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Free tethering? My experience tells me that only the Dell Venue Pro is incapable of wi-fi tethering because of the chipset. The carriers have disabled the feature but a lot of phones can be interop unlocked and have the feature enabled. Heck, the Quantum requires little effort since it has an onboard reg edit tool. Google be thy friend.

Amazing! (And incredibly stupid!)
This will eventually flood this forum with unhappy users, wishing to mod their devices...after having seen their cool AOS counter parts.

Nothing to mod it works out of the box. I dont even see a point in current custom roms wp7.5..just few added apps & unlocked for piracy (ok "homebrew")

Hacking is by definition something that should be impossible.
Hacking is based on using some unpredicted exploit to workaround security.
If today we knew that Custom Roms would be going to be possible on WP8 then Microsoft could fix the exploit.
Don't blame Microsoft for this of course, you know most (I did not say every) people wants to unlock their phone to sideload pirated apps.
That's simply the truth. This is what happens all around me on iPhone and Android ecosystem.
Now the real question is : how much interesting (or clever) is speaking about the existence of exploits on something you don't even own/know ?
Articles like the linked one looks nothing more than a big flame to me, and this topic is no different.
P.S. It is really funny to find out some users are particularly attracted by this kind of topic, isn't it?

You realize that the place you're posting to caters to the small percentage of people who want / use any flexibility afforded them, right?
The elegance of a closed system (relatively speaking) is the stability you can accomplish. This is the apple model to a tee, and for most people it's fine.
BUT, flexibility is where windows the traditional OS, Android, and Linux shine. There are always optimizations that can be done, always tweaks, custom apps galore. Android ROMs have spoiled us, masses be dammed.
Sent from my LT30p using Tapatalk 2

dragonide said:
Hacking is by definition something that should be impossible.
Hacking is based on using some unpredicted exploit to workaround security.
If today we knew that Custom Roms would be going to be possible on WP8 then Microsoft could fix the exploit.
Don't blame Microsoft for this of course, you know most (I did not say every) people wants to unlock their phone to sideload pirated apps.
That's simply the truth. This is what happens all around me on iPhone and Android ecosystem.
Now the real question is : how much interesting (or clever) is speaking about the existence of exploits on something you don't even own/know ?
Articles like the linked one looks nothing more than a big flame to me, and this topic is no different.
P.S. It is really funny to find out some users are particularly attracted by this kind of topic, isn't it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It has began.

I actually am for Custom ROMs. Sorry, but Devs sometimes just do a better job at things. A Interop Unlocking and Custom ROMs made my Trophy a heck of a lot more enjoyable to use.
And I disagree with all the lock downs MS has in place. Email, messaging clients, browsers, keyboards. We are all stuck with one version. No chance to use versions a Dev could provide that would give us more options and features. Sometimes, Devs just do things better. The MS locked apps I listed, among others, can all be improved upon. Rather than waiting or hoping MS does more to improve them, itd be a lot nicer to have options of 3rd party devs.

lugi93 said:
Nothing to mod it works out of the box. I dont even see a point in current custom roms wp7.5..just few added apps & unlocked for piracy (ok "homebrew")
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So WP8 has a file explorer?

lugi93 said:
Nothing to mod it works out of the box. I dont even see a point in current custom roms wp7.5..just few added apps & unlocked for piracy (ok "homebrew")
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Now that I have WP8 I no longer have custom ROMs, and here's a list of things I'm missing.
-Being able to back up and restore isolated storage (aka game saves and apps with braindamaged devs who don't export to skydrive)
-Setting goddamn custom notification sounds.
-Enabling internet sharing on AT&T
-Bluetooth file transfer for unsupported files
-USB Video out
And the biggest thing was updates to the latest build (7.8), because you either have to wait years to get the stupid thing, or you just never get it. WP8 seems to have solved that issue, but it's a big thing for 7.x
There is significantly more homebrew than apps that can be pirated too... So no, WP8 is not perfect out of the box yet.
Sent from my Windows 8 device using Board Express Pro

IMHO there is stil need for custom roms with WP8. This system for many might need to be changed. For example (I had Lumia 920 but beeing annoyed I've sold it) People Hub. I had Facebook account and LinkedIIn configured and connected with Microsoft Account. Hopefully People Hub allows me to display only those people from my Outlook Account with photos of them from LinkedIn or Facebook. That's good. Where is the problem - mail app which seems not to use People Hub filtering and after I've started writing somebody's email it was trying to suggest me all of the people from my linkedin and facebook. Facebook is a toy for me, email is a tool for work. I dont's wanna havve facebook contacts in my email. What's more - I don't wan't to see non skype contacts on my skype list. How to solve it ? Only custom rom may help with modified People Hub service.

dansus72 said:
So WP8 has a file explorer?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
if you're not being sarcastic, and really asking- i'm taking no offense of malice either way, just answering
no, there is no file explorer. this is hotly debated over and over again as to wether its a needed feature or just a 'gimmie' app on other platforms. some even argue that a file explorer on wp8 makes it insecure. whatever.
i'm seeing fewer and fewer posts here on xda pertaining to wp. even the extremely optimistic wpcentral forum is turning a little more 'real' since MWC turned into a nokia-only festival for wp.
anyway, i'm getting sidetracked. hope i answered your question nicely