Related
Hi guys, there are more news on the HTC shift, it has been official presented on the 28th in Taiwan by HTC. This is the official retail package and it's 100% what you will get in retail store.
Here is a link for some picture: http://www.mobile01.com/topicdetail.php?f=224&t=508252&last=4825702
For those people who can't see the picture, see my attachment of how to show the picture.
My HTC contact was there and he has tested the device, i specific ask him to test on phone and gps function, he report back saying that there is 100% no phone and GPS inside the Shift.
I know a lot of people will say they seen photo of GPS or phone, but that me remind you this, this is the latest official retail version, all device before are prototype. Yes, i have also seen the picture on FCC website showing there is GPS inside, that's the reason I asked my friend to test it! And let me say this again, there will be no GPS or Phone out of the box.
Our hope will be for the developers here in XDA to crack the function to enable full windows mobile, phone, and GPS.
p.s. Another news i got from my friend, HTC is saying the SD slot will only support up to 2GB.
can you getem?
Hi Wu, how are you doing, just wondering like you got me my Dopod, can you get hold of a shift for me? Thanks Dude
faisal.husain said:
Hi Wu, how are you doing, just wondering like you got me my Dopod, can you get hold of a shift for me? Thanks Dude
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Hi Faisal, i am fine thank you. I hope you are doing well too.
Yes i can get the Shift for you, it's currently on pre-order and the device will be available on the 4th of Feb. Price is a bit lower then anywhere else and you will get bonus with it such as GPS and extra battery....etc.
If you are interesting in getting one, please PM me and we can discuss more there !
Hmm.. i´m ordered a sample from our german distributor but now i´m thinking about to cancel the order. We thinking long time ago about a integration of the shift in our company network for our VIP customers. But without gps, without Mobile and without LAN (or can i install Windows over netboot over WLAN??) i should search better for a other solution. there is not really a innovation inside. maybe the better solution with same features is a Toshiba Portégé R400 Series laptop..
but we will see the next on cebit i hope. maybe a other manufactor. we support htc from scratch with their first devices. after over 7000 devices and the problems within it´s time to test a other manufacor i think. maybe asus, samsung
Pre-Order all gone
Please do not ask me any more for HTC Shift, all the 200 unit for pre-order is gone already, first shipment will be on the 4th of Feb, if there is any more stock available, i will let you all know asap.
joy.d said:
Hmm.. i´m ordered a sample from our german distributor but now i´m thinking about to cancel the order. We thinking long time ago about a integration of the shift in our company network for our VIP customers. But without gps, without Mobile and without LAN (or can i install Windows over netboot over WLAN??) i should search better for a other solution. there is not really a innovation inside. maybe the better solution with same features is a Toshiba Portégé R400 Series laptop..
but we will see the next on cebit i hope. maybe a other manufactor. we support htc from scratch with their first devices. after over 7000 devices and the problems within it´s time to test a other manufacor i think. maybe asus, samsung
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Click to collapse
weird comment .. I don't see any device being a half of what the Shift is ... and even without GPS, without Phone, without LAN and without full WM6 .. the shift is still the best device on the market for my needs.
WLAN will replace LAN over the time.. so I don't think it is a big mistake, but it could have been great
GPS "should" be in the SHIFT but not in WM6 (GPS in Vista).. but the choice is not perfect (who whant a GPS that is working only 2 hours..)
The Shift is not the perfect device, for everyone, but we have to see the real potential of the shift before crying for any lack of feature.
HTC has announced a "shift" like device with 5" .. maybe it will have GPS, Phone, etc.. we will see
weird - yes of course.. ;-)
i´m think it´s a new strategy of HTC to make devices without completly knows features.
maybe, LAN is only for Enterprise Customers like us with over 200tsd Users worldwide interesting, (automatic Software distribution) but Phone Functionality is interesting some more users. Is not really practicable with a 7" Device, but with BT Headset and Speak Control - why not. GPS is only a nice Addon for freaks like me, they travel around the world.
But overall: you´re need really a device like this? (i call that "the innovation factor" inside ;-)
But it´s really needed? Sometimes i think about Asus EEE PC, there a many Websites with modding this mini laptop, it´s crazy. when i have a look to this modding sites I see one:
they have much fun with modding her cheap Asus EEE Laptop.
But after 6 Years with HTC devices in all colors I ask me sometimes:
where is the fun - as i start with it..
;-)
joy.d said:
weird - yes of course.. ;-)
...
But overall: you´re need really a device like this? (i call that "the innovation factor" inside ;-)
But it´s really needed? Sometimes i think about Asus EEE PC, there a many Websites with modding this mini laptop, it´s crazy.
...
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Click to collapse
Well well well .. yeah I really need a device like this. I hate laptop (it's almost like bringing my desktop tower ...) because it's too big for me (even 11" ones). The shift has the perfect size for being a good laptop to use everywhere (including when travelling, when being on the bed, ...).
A laptot is not silent at all... mine is making too much noise.. almost the same as my desktop ! And it's warm.. warm... too warm ! I can't keep it on my knees more than 10 minutes ... WAW ! Totally useless to have a laptop.
The shift is quite, cold (not warm I mean ) and I can put it in my pocket (yeah I can... really ... I can ! .. have I tried... not yet.. but I have look the size and it fits well in my pocket... yeah.. really !).
I have bought an HTC Touch to work without any computer with me ... and .. ouch.. impossible to work with the Touch ! No real application on Windows Mobile .... Mobile Office? NOOOO it's too horrible ! On the shift I can use Windows Vista to work .. mmh so nice !
And what about the size .. 40Go is enough to work everywhere I want .. i can plug a VGA cable to my TFT to have a real screen .. and I can do this in so many room (I'm a student, so believe me... I do see a lot of monitor that just want to put their VGA cable in something !).
The only thing that can be bad was the keyboard, but I have tried it.. and WAW it worked well ! Not as well as my own Logitech Media Keyboard with about 80 words per minute... but I can type about 60 words per minute... enough when I'm not @ home.
I do believe the shift is the only solution for me right now, and I'm waiting a little to see all the real features available on the "retail" shift.. but I have great hopes in it !
Supposedly the Shift has the Qualcomm MSM 7200 chipset in it which has voice and gps built in. I can not see them "removing" that from the chipset. It's just a matter of time before this device get's "unlocked" to it's fullest potential.
I still do not see the marketing strategy of HTC leaving these features "out"... You would think that every device you release you would want to sell the hell out of it no? Are they that cocky that they believe they will be around forever to keep selling up their products to us?
i.e. Model Shift II including GPS!!! More money!!!
juiceppc said:
Supposedly the Shift has the Qualcomm MSM 7200 chipset in it which has voice and gps built in. I can not see them "removing" that from the chipset. It's just a matter of time before this device get's "unlocked" to it's fullest potential.
I still do not see the marketing strategy of HTC leaving these features "out"... You would think that every device you release you would want to sell the hell out of it no? Are they that cocky that they believe they will be around forever to keep selling up their products to us?
i.e. Model Shift II including GPS!!! More money!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hard to know... but it's sure that the strategy seems completely wrong .... maybe they want us to buy a Phone and a GPS ... but it's not the right choice.... many people will not buy a HTC device because of it...
It is an odd strategy but not the first time they've done this stuff. Still I think most people who are inclined to buy Windows Mobile devices usually research them. A WinMo device is alot more advanced than your cpl hundred dollar nokias, I think when people are spending over $500 on a phone they are pretty inclined to do some research.
With that said im pretty sure HTC know if they release a shift w/o GPS or phone enabled, good people here can hack it and enable (remember the P3600) and then its on the users onus if things mess up. Actually sounds like a good strategy when you think about it, they only have to meet target "X" in terms of standards for "X" features. If end users decide to try activating features "Y" then they do so at their own risk...
Osir1s said:
It is an odd strategy but not the first time they've done this stuff. Still I think most people who are inclined to buy Windows Mobile devices usually research them. A WinMo device is alot more advanced than your cpl hundred dollar nokias, I think when people are spending over $500 on a phone they are pretty inclined to do some research.
With that said im pretty sure HTC know if they release a shift w/o GPS or phone enabled, good people here can hack it and enable (remember the P3600) and then its on the users onus if things mess up. Actually sounds like a good strategy when you think about it, they only have to meet target "X" in terms of standards for "X" features. If end users decide to try activating features "Y" then they do so at their own risk...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i don't think it's smart.. because about 50% of intersted people will not buy the shift only because of missing GPS and Phone.
hey i was just wondering since iphone has such great g-sensor games would it be possible to create something like a aplication where we would be able to install iphone games and play them on our htc diamond it would be prety cool thanks
i was thinking of something like a iphone game emulator?? what do you guys think would this be possible
Well OsX working on a pc is pretty common so...No, seriously, that would be so "in their face"... Anyone of you talented guys here want to cook this up on a lunch breake?
I just puked a little. On the left side of my keyboard.
Sergio PC said:
I just puked a little. On the left side of my keyboard.
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Click to collapse
lmao, nice one
Yeh We really need one ..Good Idea
iPhysics!
Woud be great indeed to get the only thing the iphone makes better than the rest!!
I mean game wise..... there is quite a huge difference huh
so is anyone going to make something like this??
I kind of laughed when i read this thread title, i doubt this is possible, even through emulation. Miniature version of OSX vs WindowsCE5... whens the last time you seen a non ported OSX app on XP or Vista?
Sergio PC said:
I just puked a little. On the left side of my keyboard.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
only a little?
just when we thought that we have no more gps or mp3 lags, no battery shortage, no album tf3d questions in short we have the perfect device our friend here remind us the cruel truth......we can not play iphone games on our device.....
i would definitely love to have iphone's MonkeyBall on my diamond!!
so is anyone willing to try this??
The iPhone has a faster cpu and a lower resolution.
So how do you think you will be able to play any game written for the iPhone on the diamond?
TDO
but, the iphone have 3d gpu??
Are You On Something?
Tweak Here guys and gals, just wanting to offer my 2cents. First, I think the Diamond is all around a better device than the iPhone. But we wont get into a debate on that now, but I want to make a point here.
If you go to the iTunes App Store , or the Jailbreak Apps , what do you see. There are 50 games (if not more) to every single utility or hack. Now if you come to XDA , PPCgeeks , or any other windows mobile site, what do you see? Now there are 100 (prob may more) utilites & hacks to every game!!!
Why? I understand it on the iPhones side of things. Most wont jailbreak since the App Store is open, and Apple wont let any hacks on the store, and the few utilites they allow, are monitored closley, and can't do anything to compromise apples control over the device. Therefore, all of the 3rd party iPhone Developers, put all there time into games!!
Now, what about the WM developers. With the release of the diamond, having the great accelerometer, and a dang decent screen, why not put all of that time into developing games that compare to the iPhones, or at least more time!!
But I just wanted to raise the question. Thanks for listening. See you guys later
Tweakster!!!
TweakMan said:
Tweak Here guys and gals, just wanting to offer my 2cents. First, I think the Diamond is all around a better device than the iPhone. But we wont get into a debate on that now, but I want to make a point here.
If you go to the iTunes App Store , or the Jailbreak Apps , what do you see. There are 50 games (if not more) to every single utility or hack. Now if you come to XDA , PPCgeeks , or any other windows mobile site, what do you see? Now there are 100 (prob may more) utilites & hacks to every game!!!
Why? I understand it on the iPhones side of things. Most wont jailbreak since the App Store is open, and Apple wont let any hacks on the store, and the few utilites they allow, are monitored closley, and can't do anything to compromise apples control over the device. Therefore, all of the 3rd party iPhone Developers, put all there time into games!!
Now, what about the WM developers. With the release of the diamond, having the great accelerometer, and a dang decent screen, why not put all of that time into developing games that compare to the iPhones, or at least more time!!
But I just wanted to raise the question. Thanks for listening. See you guys later
Tweakster!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Still it would be really good if we could get an iPhone Game Emulator for now, as its games have awesome graphics e.g this game see for urselves
I see people arent getting at what kukuriku was suggesting.
there is a very, very small chance of it happening. take, for example, how long it has taken andoid to get on the diamond. and android is an open source OS. the time and effort it would take would be immense and, in short, not worth it. if you need the iphone software so much, then im afraid to say that you bought the wrong device.
emulation is out of the question - too slow, especially for games. the diamond doesnt even have the correct aspect ratio screen either.
ASK768 said:
I see people arent getting at what kukuriku was suggesting.
there is a very, very small chance of it happening. take, for example, how long it has taken andoid to get on the diamond. and android is an open source OS. the time and effort it would take would be immense and, in short, not worth it. if you need the iphone software so much, then im afraid to say that you bought the wrong device.
emulation is out of the question - too slow, especially for games. the diamond doesnt even have the correct aspect ratio screen either.
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Click to collapse
lolx... im getting what he says, im a WM Developers + Cook, and i didnt buy the wrong device, i hate APPLE and am a gr8 HTC LOVER+FAN, but the thing is tht WM is capable of much more then what we are using it for, im a COLLEGIATE and lack time else maybe i would have asked some1 else to do it and aspect ratio might not be such a big problem
well
I'm sure an OSX emulator would be possible, but it would probably run very slow on our 528mhz processors. Maybe when Snapdragon and Tegra get more popular it would be more viable, but even then I don't think anybody will take the time to do it.
However,
In just over a month the WinMo Marketplace is supposed to be launched, I think when we see an app store for WinMo coming pre-installed on all new devices there will be a lot of the *fun* type apps that *regular* consumers want on their phones.
As of now average joe doesn't come on to XDA-Dev often, if at all, and most of the people writing applications are doing it for free because they're developing apps they want, not apps they're planning on making money off of. Don't worry guys, the Marketplace is coming soon!
Hi Guys,
I am looking for an advise please.
i am not a power user and I am looking for a device with a large display in order to:
50% make calls
40% web browsing
10% emails
I tried the iphone this morning and I must say that I was amazed by the comfort in browsing the websites specially with the multitouch thing.
Know I understand that the Touch HD offers a larger display and more features but do you think that for an average user, this is a good choice compared to the iphone specially keeping in mind the multitouch advantages?
Thank you in advance for your feedback.
For you: iPhone
SiliconS said:
For you: iPhone
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Click to collapse
Hehe same thought.
Think the HD is for people who wants to spend time to configure the device to their needs.
So I also think that for you an Iphone would be best.
iPhone.
You might end up overwhelmed and confused by the sheer endless capabilities of Touch HD. It offers so many tools and things that took me as a pro some hours to even find them (e.g. WorldCard Mobile)! It is not difficult to use, but for the basic tasks you described, iPhone will get you there more quickly and efficient.
Ferator said:
Hi Guys,
50% make calls
40% web browsing
10% emails
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Click to collapse
this tasks you can do good enough with the iPhone. Touch HD seems to be a real high-end device (hardware)... windows mobile is not very comfortable to use by fingers, for this reason htc offers the TouchFlo interface, but behind that you still have WM.
so, I agree with the posts above, iPhone for you!
IPhone
Me too, I'd say IPhone, although I'm rather a IPhone-hater. But the fact that its easily usable with the features from the begining on is really good for non-hardcore-user. But you should know that as you buy it, you'll not be able to configure much or expand the software much, you'll have the phone its whole "life" like it was at the begining. So, if you love the phone as it is in the shop in your hand, than buy it! You'll have meterw a device thats so easy and intuitive to use as the IPhone. I doubt even that wm7 will be a real competitior in usability to the IPhone. Oh my god, I am writing this?? *shocked* anyway, IPhone +1 have fun with it^^ greez, cad
Don't mean to throw a spanner in the works - but how about the G1.
The hardware may not be as savvy as the HD or iPhone, but the user interface is very good and slick.
The google browser is fantastic and quick !
You can also customise the look and feel of your interface more than on the iPhone, plus give it a few months and you'll get loads of juicy apps !
as long as you don't want to copy/paste any thing from your web browsing into an email and can live with deleting yr emails one at a time an iphone is great.
Go for iphone, great for web browsing, texting and calls. I had one few month ago, but for me I love WM and I think thats me
Hi in you place i think i would go to HTC Touch HD. Why?
You say that you use it this way:
50% make calls
40% web browsing
10% emails
That is things that this phone does without any special effort for configuring.
It as a bigger screen. Making web browsing more eye candy and efficient.
But the diference on this phone is that if you want something for future, i meant, if "tomorrow" you want more from the phone, the HD will allow you to more things for free. You can use GPS (with TomTom, etc..), Write/edit word docs, Share files with bluetooth, and lots of other things... anyone correct me if im wrong.
It´s up to you. This phone is really simple if just use the basics, and if you use TouchFlow 3D you wont get any problems with it.
For a Multimedia based phone, games go for iphone.
If you want a Multimedia (but games not like iphone) and also professional phone just go for the HTC Touch HD.
its just my opinion.
Sorry for my english lol
I also say that you should go for the iPhone. Personally i dont like it and i'm facing the same choice atm, but i'll definetly go for the Touch HD, cos i like what WinMo is offering.
Out of the box iPhone will do what you want and that's it.
Out of the box WinMo might not do everything you want but with some configuring, apps and love you can get it to do whatever the hell you want it to do
i vote for the iphone if the user wants
-simplicity
-non-power user
-no need for specialty programs on windows
Thank you guys for your feedback.
Quite clear that out of the box device winner is the iphone and HD for advanced users.
I am going to try to find a shop in France having the HD in test in order to check the web browsing before to buy anything.
Gracias
i get the feeling that Ferator was hoping to hear lots of reasons why he should buy the HD and definately definately not the iphone.
If you want to have a good proxy for your choice, answer the following question:
"do you prefer an Apple personal computer or a PC (windows or Linux)?"
then use the same answer for the Iphone/Touch HD question. In my opinion, the answer will be correct for 99% of the users.
...Who cannot answer should buy the Iphone.
Ferator said:
Thank you guys for your feedback.
Quite clear that out of the box device winner is the iphone and HD for advanced users.
I am going to try to find a shop in France having the HD in test in order to check the web browsing before to buy anything.
Gracias
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As good as the HD appears to be now, WM devices just get better and better especially the first year they are released because of the availability of updated software and new ROMs. If the HD is good now, next year it will be jumping through hoops with all of the tweaks and updated software that will be coming. When I bought my Trinity it was a brand new device and had all kinds of problems, now it is near perfect. It is just the hardware that is getting long in the tooth
Matterhorn said:
As good as the HD appears to be now, WM devices just get better and better especially the first year they are released because of the availability of updated software and new ROMs. If the HD is good now, next year it will be jumping through hoops with all of the tweaks and updated software that will be coming. When I bought my Trinity it was a brand new device and had all kinds of problems, now it is near perfect. It is just the hardware that is getting long in the tooth
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Fully support Matterhorn, really really true....
frustin said:
i get the feeling that Ferator was hoping to hear lots of reasons why he should buy the HD and definately definately not the iphone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Definitly
Since the i-thing (iphone, ibook, ipod... you name it) has been around, I always sticked to the windows environment because I do believe that it is much more efficient.
Perhaps not the best user friendly experience but always getting the max out of your investment and not comdamned to a restrictive environment (itunes, iapp market, last technologies for the best prices, plenty stuff/soft whatever what you are looking for...).
But what works for a laptop, home computer can't simply works the same way for a phone.
Let me explain:
I am a sales director. If I can leave witout a laptop during 1 or 2 days, I definitly have to work with an efficient phone, easy to handle and work with, reliable and fast.
In my company out of 9 sales guys, 7 were using HTC devices.
6 of them changed those HTC for iphones and honnestly they're happy.
So conclusion is that if I can check that this device + few tricks answer my basic needs I will go for it otherwise apple will have a new customer.
Ferator said:
Hi Guys,
I am looking for an advise please.
i am not a power user and I am looking for a device with a large display in order to:
50% make calls
40% web browsing
10% emails
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just be sure you never want to MMS, video call, change the battery or load up some special software you read about.
Oh and you don't need a large display "in order to" make phone calls (50% of the usage).
well, i am not sure what is the best Professional communicator. However, i am answering from the blackstone,without any wap tricks and using the fckeditor by seeing the full typing window EASILY. which other phone can do it?
Ok, so my 2 years are up and I want this phone. Easy pick right? No. I was on youtube researching about this phone and I want it yet someone said the graphics card sucks in the phone so ps1 emu, cod2 accelerated, quake 3 port (what I really want from this phone) wont work because of the "sucky graphics card" yet I don't trust this person and I want a pros help for a descent desiton. I signed up for this forum for my phone if it can run those things because I want to play them. So if it can plese tell or even better maybe a screen shot or video to tell me that it will work.
Thank you for your time from a new phone noob.
mOOOp64 said:
Ok, so my 2 years are up and I want this phone. Easy pick right? No. I was on youtube researching about this phone and I want it yet someone said the graphics card sucks in the phone so ps1 emu, cod2 accelerated, quake 3 port (what I really want from this phone) wont work because of the "sucky graphics card" yet I don't trust this person and I want a pros help for a descent desiton. I signed up for this forum for my phone if it can run those things because I want to play them. So if it can plese tell or even better maybe a screen shot or video to tell me that it will work.
Thank you for your time from a new phone noob.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
the video card itself is fine, the problem your untrusted source was oblivious about was the fact the accelerated video DRIVERS were never released for the video chipset of this phone (HTC Vogue aka Touch)
There are some modified drivers for video and general use that are cooked into the custom ROMs as a standard, but for enulators and full on gaming - dont expect PS3 or even PC style graphics - you wont get it, matter of fact if you google search there is a signup for a class-action lawsuit on a site of people trying to create and port over working drivers, but seeing as the Touch is no longer itself in production I wouldnt hold my breath on HTC responding to it
Detroit Doug
ok that still leaves my question I know the 3 phone games I listed arnt that great graphics even a moded quake 1 port is added to the list of what I wanted but you never answered my question very clearly. Can I run those games? If not is there a way it could? thanks
Sorry about the double post yet what about if I cannot run any of the games I listed even with modifications to the phone software what phone would be better Htc Diamond Htc touch pro or Samsung Omnia. But answer my forst question before a recommendation thx
Sorry I cant really tell you the quality of the games you want to play as I dont use my phone like a Nintendo DS or whatever - its a phone, internet device, texting device and so on, games at best that I do play on it is like Uno, Solitare, breakout clones and the like
When I have tried emulators and SOD and the like I didnt like the weird controls and such so I decided to use this phone as it was intended with lite games included as if I wanted a PSP I would have gotten one LOL
Someone with the time to play the games and fight with them will have to answer those specific questions directly I had the info I shared in regards to the first part of the question about the Hardware/Software of the device in question
Detroit Doug
I do have a cfw psp but I dont intend to use it as a awsome game device I just am wondering do they work like the cod2 that was accelerated would that load or not that was the point
I have made my mind to switch to an Omnia it looks good and is figgin powerful so I dont need help no more
mOOOp64 said:
I have made my mind to switch to an Omnia it looks good and is figgin powerful so I dont need help no more
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My mom has the Omnia, and at first, it seemed very cool. After playing with it, it seems to be very sluggish, and only slows down more and more over time, until you do a soft reset. When you turn the phone on it's side, it takes a good while to catch up with you, and sometimes you have to turn it back and forth before it will even flip orientation. I was jealous at first when she got it, but after playing with it, she couldn't pay me to trade her that Omnia for my Vogue.
yea i just got the vogue as well and my ex's sister has the omnia, and the updates or lackthere of make that thing crap the omnia is still being distributed with a early and buggy 6.1 build i was playing with last summer so far i feal the vogue will end up being the best vzw ppc till the touch pro 2 comes out hopefully w/o crippling its memory
eww the omnia
get any divice thats htc
best thing ever
i recoment the htc touch vogue but for games i guess get the touch pro
or the nintendo ds lol
If you are the kind of person who gets emotionally attached to the gadgets you buy, please stop reading this post.
I'm not trying to start an inflamed discussion about which is the best device or manufacturer.
I’m not an Apple fan, in fact, I hate being “Apple locked” and that’s one of the main reasons I’ve bought the Leo after owning an Eten x500, a Kaiser, a Blackstone and finally, an iPhone 3GS.
I could go over and over describing the differences and the pros and cons of each device but I won’t. I’ll just try to tell you guys a few things we don’t have to accept.
We don’t have to accept …
the endless steps (gold card, hardSPL, regEdit, dictionary hacks, you name it) needed to get the phone speaking your language. You just have to say: I want “THAT” system language and “THAT” input language and that’s it. That’s how it’s done on the iPhone. And I’m not talking 3 or 4 languages. I’m saying over 30 different languages and oh, you also have voice control on YOUR language. You don’t need to hack Voice Command…
an SMS conversation that gets all messages out of order (doesn’t HTC know how to do time calculations?)
a Gigahert processor which can’t smoothly scroll a web page. I know it’s probably due to bad Opera coding but… have you ever scrolled an iPhone Safari?
a whole bunch of bad designed apps which you can’t effectively control / interface with because Windows Mobile programmers really don’t seem to realize that “user friendlier” is better. Have you ever used a same App on both platforms? Take Trapster for example (It’s available at Micrsoft app store). The windows mobile version of it makes me feel sorry for the programmer while the iPhone version feels very nice. Of course this is not the only example…
a lot of small bugs on the first ROM. Apple got it right on the first and they had never (ever) built a phone before! How many phones will HTC have to make before they get a stock ROM right? The small things are often the most annoying...
I could go on but there is something I realized that made me feel really hopeless (yes, I would really like to like a Windows phone). While HTC (and other manufacturers) keeps on launching device after device in a short time frame and thus creating new bugs and issues to deal with, Apple keeps on improving its one and only iPhone OS, for its one iPhone device (ok, different versions but very similar) which keeps getting better and better.
While iPhone developers have to deal with interface and compatibility issues for 3 very similar devices, a Windows Mobile developer has to deal with hundreds of them, some very poorly designed and a few very good (like Leo) but in the end, there is no way to develop a very good app for so many devices without a huge effort (and cost). Also, developing an App exclusively for one Windows phone wouldn’t be cost effective as a single model doesn’t represent a large enough consumer market.
Apple, with the iPhone, didn’t create a device as we are used to. Instead, they created a product with a long roadmap, mature SDK, sufficient market share, providing the necessary ecosystem for developers all around the world to make it even better.
It won’t be possible for any manufacturer, using any OS, to compete with such a mature product if they don’t realize it’s not a device we need. It’s a product.
Sadly, I’m going back to my 3GS… (god I hate iTunes…)
fmcastro said:
a lot of small bugs on the first ROM. Apple got it right on the first and they had never (ever) built a phone before! How many phones will HTC have to make before they get a stock ROM right? The small things are often the most annoying...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Couldn't agree more on that.. Actually some people believed that HTC guys were deaf to provide us with such a loud distorted audio quality. I can't forgive HTC for the SMS bug.. I can't load all my SMS, device becomes really really slow and laggy.. How come they did not run a proper test to ensure their HTC Messaging application was working fine with dozens of SMS? This is really unprofessional. What where they busy with? The weather animation?
HTC support will contact me today to collect some symptoms and bugs I found but they did NOT ( as they claimed ).
Hopefully a hotfix will be available ASAP.
Xeon said:
Couldn't agree more on that.. Actually some people believed that HTC guys were deaf to provide us with such a loud distorted audio quality. I can't forgive HTC for the SMS bug.. I can't load all my SMS, device becomes really really slow and laggy.. How come they did not run a proper test to ensure their HTC Messaging application was working fine with dozens of SMS? This is really unprofessional. What where they busy with? The weather animation?
HTC support will contact me today to collect some symptoms and bugs I found but they did NOT ( as they claimed ).
Hopefully a hotfix will be available ASAP.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, one thing we can safely assume by now is that no one at HTC actually uses their devices. Unless they are all deaf, send and receive SMSs only to/from their one and only imaginary friend and probably spend too much of their time watching the weather channel...
fmcastro said:
Well, one thing we can safely assume by now is that no one at HTC actually uses their devices. Unless they are all deaf, send and receive SMSs only to/from their one and only imaginary friend and probably spend too much of their time watching the weather channel...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Some bugs are bearable.. I had too many with all my previous XDA/HTC phones. But for such basic bugs to be found, the device primary tasks ( phone calls / SMS ) should never be affected because it makes the device useless...
fmcastro said:
the endless steps (gold card, hardSPL, regEdit, dictionary hacks, you name it) needed to get the phone speaking your language. You just have to say: I want “THAT” system language and “THAT” input language and that’s it. That’s how it’s done on the iPhone. And I’m not talking 3 or 4 languages. I’m saying over 30 different languages and oh, you also have voice control on YOUR language. You don’t need to hack Voice Command…
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Uh... you do realise that the reason these hacks exist is because the HD2 probably hasn't been officially launched in the country / language of your choice, and that people are hacking so they can use the HD2 in their country sooner than as decided by the carrier?
fmcastro said:
an SMS conversation that gets all messages out of order (doesn’t HTC know how to do time calculations?)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's Microsoft's fault - having said that, I haven't had the problem with the HD2 itself - only the custom ROMS cooked with Leo packages on a Touch HD.
fmcastro said:
a whole bunch of bad designed apps which you can’t effectively control / interface with because Windows Mobile programmers really don’t seem to realize that “user friendlier” is better. Have you ever used a same App on both platforms? Take Trapster for example (It’s available at Micrsoft app store). The windows mobile version of it makes me feel sorry for the programmer while the iPhone version feels very nice. Of course this is not the only example…
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And this is more due to laziness on the developer's part and nothing to do with Windows MObile or the HD2 in general. Take a look at S2U2 - have you seen how nice the settings page is? Or GAlarm, *the* best alarm program ever.
fmcastro said:
a lot of small bugs on the first ROM. Apple got it right on the first and they had never (ever) built a phone before! How many phones will HTC have to make before they get a stock ROM right? The small things are often the most annoying...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed. Wish HTC would get their act together.
If you hate iTunes so much why not wait a few more months for the Xperia X10, running Android with Snapdragon? Or the Motorola DROID for that matter?
aussiebum said:
Uh... you do realise that the reason these hacks exist is because the HD2 probably hasn't been officially launched in the country / language of your choice, and that people are hacking so they can use the HD2 in their country sooner than as decided by the carrier?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Humm... not exactly. Most people here at XDA were trying to switch from an oficial ROM to another. That said, we're talking about official languages. I was trying to flash a WWE ROM on a french device for example. The HTC excuse for this terrible language mess is, of course, microsoft: "Unfortunately, due to licensing restrictions put in place by Microsoft, it is not legally possible for us the change the language of a device once it has been loaded" - Quoted from an HTC support email I received.
aussiebum said:
That's Microsoft's fault - having said that, I haven't had the problem with the HD2 itself - only the custom ROMS cooked with Leo packages on a Touch HD.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do you realise it shouldn't matter whose fault it is? It's a faulty device sold by HTC, period. I don't feel any better knowing it's an OS fault.
aussiebum said:
And this is more due to laziness on the developer's part and nothing to do with Windows MObile or the HD2 in general. Take a look at S2U2 - have you seen how nice the settings page is? Or GAlarm, *the* best alarm program ever.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I know but I think it's a bit more complicated as I said on the original post. Besides the laziness, WM developers face a too heterogeneous ecossystem that makes things really harder. "Ok, I've finished my app, now I just have to port it to 640x480, 480x640, 480x800, 800x480, 320x200, and who knows what else, despite the fact that standard WM UIs are really crap so every developer has to start from scratch if they want to make something look good. In short, only a few very brave souls will be capable of that.
aussiebum said:
Agreed. Wish HTC would get their act together.
If you hate iTunes so much why not wait a few more months for the Xperia X10, running Android with Snapdragon? Or the Motorola DROID for that matter?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Because Android is not that good also. It seems like a better OS than WM but when it comes to user experience and, most important, a consistent user experience across all apps, it fails for the same reason WM fails. Lack of a product design and roadmap. It's just trying desperately to be installed on as most devices as it can.
Regards
And yet, the reasons people still use Winmo/Android is because the Iphone OS has serious deficiencies in some areas.
There is no perfect phone....all we can do is make the best of each OS.
Honestly you'd be better off with an iphone. I love my HD2 despite some minor problems, because I enjoy messing around with my phone. Also browsing the net on the HD2 is much faster than on the 3GS and you don't have to zoom in in order to read anything on the screen.
Let's not forget that the device is going to be upgradeable to winmo 7 as well.
Solution - keep HD2 and get ipod Touch - best of both worlds. Connect ipod via Wifi to HD2.
I owned iphone 3gs...
I read all you've been writing and i, as former iphone 3gs user, must say that everything you say is corect but... why don't you say to all of us why you gave up your iphone... or why you really hating go back to itunes... and of course why in the close future you'll give up again, and sell the iphone???
The answer, real answer is that with iPhone you have everything right in place as you say but there is no fun... no joy... like trying to have the best sex but not in the mood... if know what i mean...
I had moments when i pulled out my iphone, from my pocket, and i wanted to play arround with it and...come on, really boring!!!
Iphone is the best in terms of everyday use, but if wm 7 will get better in terms of use it's going to be a strong iphone killer!!!
I really like my HD2, in spite of all the hiccups, because it's fun, you can lose yourself for hours doing nothing but looking inside of it... settings, registry, HKLM, HKCU... does ring a bell, than entering here at xda and finding that someone did something and you hold your breath till you see if that is working or not...
I only say that i like playing... and HTC HD2 is giving me that!!! i don't need silly games to have fun from my device...
By the way...
No OS can have better handle of e-mail attachments than wm... for sure!!!
I HAVE NO REGRETS FOR SELLING IPHONE OVER HTC HD2!!!
Cheers!
jimbo29 said:
I really like my HD2, in spite of all the hiccups, because it's fun, you can lose yourself for hours doing nothing but looking inside of it... settings, registry, HKLM, HKCU... does ring a bell, than entering here at xda and finding that someone did something and you hold your breath till you see if that is working or not...
I only say that i like playing... and HTC HD2 is giving me that!!! i don't need silly games to have fun from my device...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for perfectly expressing my thoughts
Toss3 said:
Honestly you'd be better off with an iphone. I love my HD2 despite some minor problems, because I enjoy messing around with my phone. Also browsing the net on the HD2 is much faster than on the 3GS and you don't have to zoom in in order to read anything on the screen.
Let's not forget that the device is going to be upgradeable to winmo 7 as well.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I must say i have had an iphone 3g and i'm more happy with my HTC HD2. One of the reasons is because i simply think you pay way to much for the piece of hardware itself still no 5mpx camera while 8 is almost normal and 12 is high end. The new gs is worth more the money tough but the camera keeps me off and i kept hearing a annoying resonance while calling and the software isn't perfect as well and not that stable after a few days plus the battery life of the HTC HD2 is better as my iphone 3g and way better as the 3gs.
I like the default windows mobile software HTC Sense is annoying, camera flip, weather animations can't be turned off. Emails why show the email in the way it is shown now? i just rather had opened the whole email app so i can view the emails like your supposed to and not like a letter.
While calling you have to slide to get the extra options, why? there is a hang up button on screen wich you can press so why not the other buttons?
HTC tried to make a nice looking skin but not a functional one.
I use the default titanium skin with some modifications like a task manager added to the options and msn and the camera. But the apps for calling and the communications manager work great.
About windows mobile 7:
Windows mobile can be great. But i still have the idea they haven't learned from their mistakes. Look at the buttons a phone is supposed to have according to microsoft for windows mobile 7. a Pickup, a home, a start, a back and a hang up button. Why so many? Home and start could be one, 1 press to go home another to go to start and press again to go home again, simple and effective. Why a back button? when would you use that? Press the home button and your back in the home screen and applications usually have their own back button when needed. So pick-up home and hang-up would have been enough. Since Microsoft asks for these buttons they still think to complicated and i bet windows 7 will to complicated as well all though it will be more complete compared to 6.x.
But i love how i can change things to the user interface and multitasking is great, the iphone can't do that by default and that really sucks. And backgrounder that does make it possible, makes the phone more unstable as a windows mobile one. It is stupid windows mobile doesn't use it's greatest advantage for marketing and battling the iphone with it, this is where windows mobile could stand out with.
I'm writing this from my macbook on os x snow leopard and even i still prefer my windows mobile HTC HD2.
Windows Mobile 7 will simply use CE7 Kernel, compiled for new ARM CPUs and will use the new ARM instructions.
Now we're running Windows Mobile 6.5 that runs on CE5.2 kernel.
It's like running Windows98 on a Phenom X4 quadcore CPU
Even on other MSM chipsets that has got an ARM11 CPU, that potential isn't seen because of that.
When WM7 will be released, we'll see our device performance unleashed
I've had my HD2 for a week now and I must say I'm more than pleased with it. I did consider the iPhone as an option, but as I want to connect my phone to my Exchange Server then it was a no brainer to opt for a Windows Phone and the hardware specs of the HD2 are way above the iPhone. A big thing that put me off the iPhone was it's reliance upon iTunes to synchronise my calendar & contacts - it's dreadfully buggy toy software and I don't want a music application on my work PC.
If anyone has any doubts as to the iPhone's reliability and stability just Google "iPhone faults" and you'll see the problems users have experienced with their iPhones are considerable, with many being bricked through their hardware faults. Interestingly the most common reported faults are similar to those reported by the HTC dissenters such as slow SMS sending - maybe these are network issues? On top of that there's now the 'Astley' virus which Apple helpfully explain away as "the users' fault".
The emergence of open source Android phones whill hopefully spur the mainstream smartphone OS writers to concentrate their efforts on developing their own platforms. It's true to say that Microsoft haven't trerated their Windows OS as a mainstream product and there's still too much legacy code in 6.5, but it's still a decent OS for its intended purpose Hopefully that will be addressed in Version 7 which looks likely to be available to HD2 users as an (free?) upgrade. There's masses of quality third-party apps avaiable to maximise its smartphone potential for just about all users,.
There isn't a perfect smartphone out there and as we demand ever more features of them I doubt if there is likely to be in the forseable future, but the nice thing about the Windows Phone OS is that it is eminently hackable.
HD2 Simply Put...
Depth & Customization!
iphone got it right???
I remember hearing complaints about iphone for at least the first year, and as omneity says:
"If anyone has any doubts as to the iPhone's reliability and stability just Google "iPhone faults" and you'll see the problems users have experienced with their iPhones are considerable, with many being bricked through their hardware faults. Interestingly the most common reported faults are similar to those reported by the HTC dissenters such as slow SMS sending - maybe these are network issues? On top of that there's now the 'Astley' virus which Apple helpfully explain away as 'the users' fault' ".
fmcastro said:
We don’t have to accept …
5. a lot of small bugs on the first ROM. Apple got it right on the first and they had never (ever) built a phone before! How many phones will HTC have to make before they get a stock ROM right? The small things are often the most annoying...
Sadly, I’m going back to my 3GS… (god I hate iTunes…)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
p.s. I am a former Apple user. Iphone is more of Jobs' controlled user experience.
I couldn't stand it.
I find it ironic that Apple started out supporting open source while Gates worked hard at controlling users choice.
Now it is the reverse.
New things r always trapped in some trouble, and that's why i have paid close attention to leo, but i didn't buy it! im just waiting for a staid one.
To put it simply - the HD2 is the best phone I have ever used. I think it is awesome. I've had an iphone, etc - but the truth is there is no phone that hasn't got problems. The Iphone is falwed because it has no multi-tasking, crap camera, poor messaging (in my opinion), limited configurability, and its tied to iTunes which is horrible. The HD2 has non of the above. Yes it has flaws itself, but in my eyes less than any other phone out there at the moment.
Teneka_Khan said:
To put it simply - the HD2 is the best phone I have ever used. I think it is awesome. I've had an iphone, etc - but the truth is there is no phone that hasn't got problems. The Iphone is falwed because it has no multi-tasking, crap camera, poor messaging (in my opinion), limited configurability, and its tied to iTunes which is horrible. The HD2 has non of the above. Yes it has flaws itself, but in my eyes less than any other phone out there at the moment.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I FULLY agree with you ; I also have a iphone 3G 16 GB but is now in the drawer collecting dust. As saying goes, One man's meat is another man poison . No point debating about how good/bad the HD2 and iPhone and any other PDA. It will never end
As far as I am concerned , the HD2 is my choice now vs iPhone
gavinfabl said:
Solution - keep HD2 and get ipod Touch - best of both worlds. Connect ipod via Wifi to HD2.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yep, I totally agree...and that's just what i've now done