Related
For starters i love this phones hardware. Almost all of the hardware specs of this phone are excellent. The 1ghz CPU by qualcom is a very good choice, but not quite a bleeding edge chip. Having a dedicated gpu would have been a better choice for the resolution and processing requirements of the other parts of the phone (gpu's can accelerate alot more than games).
512MB ram is a good choice and certainly enough for most needs. However ram is super duper cheap these days and i'd much rather have 1gb of good system ram than 1gb of extra storage space(which is what the evo gives us). the 4.3 inch screen is certainly sufficient, and in this space i dont think there really are much better panels resolution and aperture wise available.
I have certainly enjoyed playing with the 8MP camera in video and snapshot mode, but it also has its flaws. Being very sensitive to light the framerate (in video mode) can go from whats looks like(because i have no way of actually checking) lower 20's to less than 10 frames per second. Also while the 8MP sensor allows for nifty resolution it does not make for the cleanest image(in both video and snapshot mode). Due to lower quality optics being used and very little logic. I've found that flash also seems not to fire in correct sync with the (non mechanical IE FAKE)shutter of the camera sensor. Causing blurred images even with the flash on, I even attempted to circumvent this problem by manually setting the iso mode in the camera options to no avail. Also i really love the back facing camera and i would love it if i could actually use it for something.
I dont like fring its ugly and buggy, i dont like QIK. I dont know what it is, i just know i wont like it(J/K). It honestly never even occured to me that skype was not available for android yet (dont even mention that verizon peice of garbage). And it looks like we get it either until the end of the year. If even then (for video). I have had some opportunity to try out video on evo. And while some videos look good they are often not the right ratio and leave the screen largely empty. Some videos had obvious framerate & sound sync issues. Even on youtube. Let me go ahead and say i have not even played with HDMI, fm radio, or bluetooth. None of these do i really use, However i do like lots of extras and you cant go wrong with any of those. I tried only a few games out primarily raging thunder 2. I was not impressed by this games performance in the slightest. I would expect a 1ghz phone to be able to outperform atleast a Nintendo DS. I believe this part calls for a facepalm. I believe im supposed to thank HTC and their infinite wisdom for the 30FPS cap on the phone.
As for the 4G. I live in north dallas inbetween several major urban area in small residential housing area. Before signing up for my evo one quick trip to the sprint website and a little bit of address information would have me believe that im lit up like a christmas tree for miles all directions with 4G connectivity. Only after purchasing and bringing the phone home to realize i have no 4g connectivity at all do i back to the sprint website and go back to my coverage map. Yup see there i am all green, oh wait what is that? when i zoom in all the sudden the maps starts looking like swiss cheese. As i zoom all the way down my exact house do i see im not covered at all. Upon further testing i found that many areas that say they have 4G do not infact have 4G at all. After finding a 4G tower less than a mile away from my home. I drive to the tower to test my phones capability. Speedtest avarage download being 4300kbps or 430Kilobytes per second or about 4mbps. And upload averaging almost exactly 1000kbps or 100 Kilobytes per second or 1mbps. Well bellow the stated peak limit of 10mbps for downloads, and 1.8mbps peak of uploads. Mind you im sitting right beside this tower. I get much further from my home wifi. As i start driving, toward my house. I lose coverage in less than half a mile. Upon further consideration of this 4G technology i dont think its ever gonna work(right). I cant imagine them putting up enough towers to blanket a city yet alone suburbs or rural. There just is'nt enough real estate. I want to love this device, however this phone needs alot of love, and up against the onslaught on new phones just over the horizon, it needs it quick. Otherwise this could easily end up a dead end long before it ever reachs maturity. I have only owned my phone for 10 days. I will return it(if major upgrades dont happen soon) and go back to a peice of crap metroPCS phone for another six months while i wait for either this phone to get its act together or jump on one of the new LTE phones from the competition. Also i'd like to ask, what would you guys prefer a new single network connection combining all voice and data functions like the new LTE network verizon/metropcs is designing with possibly less bandwidth or a multiple network IE seperate voice and data connections with possibly more bandiwidth. Please consider all the known implications before replying. Lets keep this critiquing unbiased as possible please. If theres anything major please feel free to let me know.
And all i wanted was video conferencing.
Metathias
How did you locate the 4g tower closest to you?
notmike said:
How did you locate the 4g tower closest to you?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I drove around till i got 4g signal Then meandered my way around following signal strength til i could see it. Never got full bars for 4g until i had line of sight. It was a big tower too. Still only covered about 1/2 to 3/4 of a mile.
4g upload is capped at 1mb
where is the map you can zoom on? can't seem to find it.
supdawg said:
4g upload is capped at 1mb
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Where does it say that? Mine is 1.3-1.6 normally
I can't believe I read...
that entire message. I must be off to wash my eyes!
Don't post stuff like this without an industry source. As far as I know, this is not true. I often get 1.7 in downtown Chicago.
supdawg said:
4g upload is capped at 1mb
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
Read it.
GumboChief said:
Don't post stuff like this without an industry source. As far as I know, this is not true. I often get 1.7 in downtown Chicago.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's been mentioned by Sprint, Most Blog Sites, and Many other People. It has been shown on upload tests through SpeedTest, DSLReports, etc that its capped at 1MB or very close to it.
Please provide a screen shot of 1.7Mb/s upload as I have not seen that either and I have fast 4G where I live.
Here is from the developers site about cap.
http://developer.sprint.com/site/global/home/4g/wimax_experience/wimax_experience.jsp
Next time I am on Michigan & Randolph, I will run a test. I dont have it in my current log as I blanked my phone last week for whitslack rom.
mrmomoman said:
It's been mentioned by Sprint, Most Blog Sites, and Many other People. It has been shown on upload tests through SpeedTest, DSLReports, etc that its capped at 1MB or very close to it.
Please provide a screen shot of 1.7Mb/s upload as I have not seen that either and I have fast 4G where I live.
Here is from the developers site about cap.
http://developer.sprint.com/site/global/home/4g/wimax_experience/wimax_experience.jsp
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For those getting > 1mb, that may change in the future. I know 4G is capped at 1mb here.
supdawg said:
For those getting > 1mb, that may change in the future. I know 4G is capped at 1mb here.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My speedtest was on June 17th, when going to see my eye doctor. I am really curious to check, now.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
I know all Atrix users are having problems with slower data connections than using, say the iPhone 4. So I went ahead and did a quick video of, iPhone 4 and Verizon LG Vortex to show the speed difference. Clearly you can see that the Atrix is very slow in uploading, but overall was pretty close in download speeds with the iPhone 4. I have been averaging around 2.2 Mps down and .31 upload. Overall when using the Atrix phone to look up anything in the Market place or web browsing, and or using a app that requires data, it feels much faster overall. Could be that the Dual-Core is helping in this. My next video will be, comparing on the phone browsing and using data apps to compare.
Here is the link to the video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yA72kfo856w
Ya shouldn't run both ATT phones at the same time.
zephxiii said:
Ya shouldn't run both ATT phones at the same time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why its a fair real work comparison that way. No one is going to be the only one running a connection at any give time.
Sent from my Delorean using a flux capacitor!
compumasta said:
Why its a fair real work comparison that way. No one is going to be the only one running a connection at any give time.
Sent from my Delorean using a flux capacitor!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you are interested in testing the device's ultimate speed, you shouldn't be running the test at the same time right next to each other period. That causes channel interference (if on same carrier) which degrades performance, not to mention you are cutting available air interface resources in half in on the same channel/sector. That is not going to tell you jack **** about how the device performs (as far as above average potential) in comparison to another device on the same network...it only really shows how each device handles data in a crappy signal situation....interestingly ATT was better than VZW.
It has been demonstrated that the Atrix lacks HSUPA and will generally not perform as well as iPhone4 (or other HSUPA enabled device) until this problem is resolved.
zephxiii said:
If you are interested in testing the device's ultimate speed, you shouldn't be running the test at the same time right next to each other period. That causes channel interference (if on same carrier) which degrades performance, not to mention you are cutting available air interface resources in half in on the same channel/sector. That is not going to tell you jack **** about how the device performs (as far as above average potential) in comparison to another device on the same network...it only really shows how each device handles data in a crappy signal situation....interestingly ATT was better than VZW.
It has been demonstrated that the Atrix lacks HSUPA and will generally not perform as well as iPhone4 (or other HSUPA enabled device) until this problem is resolved.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think you misunderstood what he's saying. In the real world, you could be standing next to someone else using an AT&T phone, so that interference isn't unexpected. How the device handles that kind of interference is absolutely relevant information.
Ririal said:
I think you misunderstood what he's saying. In the real world, you could be standing next to someone else using an AT&T phone, so that interference isn't unexpected. How the device handles that kind of interference is absolutely relevant information.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In the real world, he probably isn't running a speedtest right when you are.
It's still pointless as if you are trying to compare device speeds on the network, you need to give them ideal conditions....otherwise you aren't comparing the devices really. This is obvious because it isn't showing the Atrix's crippled network interface.
zephxiii said:
In the real world, he probably isn't running a speedtest right when you are.
It's still pointless as if you are trying to compare device speeds on the network, you need to give them ideal conditions....otherwise you aren't comparing the devices really. This is obvious because it isn't showing the Atrix's crippled network interface.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not even sure I understand what you're arguing. Someone next to you is not using a data connection if they're not running a speedtest? Because that's what it sounds like you're saying. The speed of the phone next to you is irrelevant. A phone pulling down 1000Mbps as opposed to 100Mbps won't magically decrease the surrounding signal. In modern devices, channel interference like that isn't really a problem anyway.
Ririal said:
I'm not even sure I understand what you're arguing. Someone next to you is not using a data connection if they're not running a speedtest? Because that's what it sounds like you're saying. The speed of the phone next to you is irrelevant. A phone pulling down 1000Mbps as opposed to 100Mbps won't magically decrease the surrounding signal. In modern devices, channel interference like that isn't really a problem anyway.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Based on that statement, it looks like you really don't understand how WCDMA (or CDMA based) networks work. Channel noise, noise floor, neighboring interference etc. plays a huge part in network performance. So yes, even though signal receive strength may be very good, performance can suffer from channel noise...and I see it all the time in cell overlap areas (I live in one even).
And when you have two devices like that operating right next to each other using the same ARFCN, especially if one is in the upload portion of the test, it's going to create additional noise that the other device is going to have to fight through....then throw on top that both devices are fighting for whatever is left of free resources on the site..which is basically cutting whatever is left in half....if they are on the same sector/channel.
zephxiii said:
Based on that statement, it looks like you really don't understand how WCDMA (or CDMA based) networks work. Channel noise, noise floor, neighboring interference etc. plays a huge part in network performance. So yes, even though signal receive strength may be very good, performance can suffer from channel noise...and I see it all the time in cell overlap areas (I live in one even).
And when you have two devices like that operating right next to each other using the same ARFCN, especially if one is in the upload portion of the test, it's going to create additional noise that the other device is going to have to fight through....then throw on top that both devices are fighting for whatever is left of free resources on the site..which is basically cutting whatever is left in half....if they are on the same sector/channel.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I understand the theory, I've just never seen it affect a device in practice to any noticeable degree. I might get 3.15 down with no other devices nearby, and 3.14 down with several others running at once (GSM and CDMA devices).
Living in an area with several carriers fighting for the airways can impact performance, but again, I've never seen a big enough difference to care. Maybe you've just been in areas with outdated hardware or poor filtering. This is all from personal experience, however, and I live in Chicagoland where there is no shortage of service from any carrier.
I know some have said that having all 3 devices and running the test can affect the performances when running data. I was hoping to try to run a test that could show what would happen if you were out and happen to be close to other smartphones that might be accessing data.
I will post another video showing how the data performance is, by running the speed test one at a time. I did try that today, and I can say that whether I had all three running at the same time or run speed test one at a time, the speeds didn't not change much; maybe only .04 difference. So having all three running the speed test would only affect around .04 to .06 difference in download speed.
I will also do a test to compare the speed to open browser and going to websites.
Also when I was doing the speed test today with my Atrix, I was using it as a mobile hot spot to provide internet to my Samsung Galaxy Tab, and the download speeds on the Atrix was very good. I got around 3.0 Mbps down and .29 Mbps upload; which is very slow compared to my iPhone 4. Hopefully soon this will be fixed.
So in real world situations if others around me are using their phones/data I shouldn't judge how my phone performs based on that? Individual testing is fantastic, but I'm rarely the only person in the room with an AT&T smartphone so it's not practical. Everyday use throughout the day (speedtest app or not) is the only real way to judge data performance in my book.
Besides, the speedtest app can go from 1.2 to 3.4 to .08mbps in 3 consecutive tests. It's all over the place.
For browsing the Atrix should open pages quicker because the processor will help out along with the network speeds.
One of the popular mods on XDA is Data Throttle Removal (AKA DTR), as described in this thread:
[MOD] Uncapped Data For Your ROMS (Skyraider, Virtuous, OMGB, ETC). In fact, some people consider it so vital that I have seen them delay upgrading their rom (even if the upgrade contains bugfixes) because they are waiting for a new DTR to be created.
The premise of this mod is simple:
1. Throttle code was discovered in our services.jar file.
2. It has been hypothesized that Verizon uses this code to throttle our 3G data speeds.
3. It is further hypothesized that flashing this mod disables the throttle, thereby returning your 3G speeds to their full potential.
In reading the forums, I see a lot of different values being thrown around. Quoting that original thread, for example, it is claimed that "Verizon starts to throttle data speeds after 5gb of data. That doesn't mean you get charged more, Verizon just slows you down. This mod will prevent that, and only that."
Looking at the code itself, however, pokes some holes in the original premise:
ihtfp69 said:
Examining the code, if this throttling service was engaged, it would put an icon in the notification bar. You would know it was on. This is code built in by Google. It is not an add on from Verizon. Personally, I would leave it alone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Looking at your framework-res.apk should show you the icon that is being mentioned. In the stock Froyo framework, for example, it can be found at /res/drawable-hdpi/stat_sys_throttled.png
And here's what it looks like in stock Froyo:
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}
As for the 5gb claims, I cannot find any source on where that figure comes from. While Verizon has publicly stated that they reserve the right to throttle data (even on unlimited plans), they only state that it may be done to "the top 5% of Verizon Wireless data users."
Source:
http://support.vzw.com/terms/products/broadbandaccess_nationalaccess.html
http://support.vzw.com/terms/products/vz_email.html
While a VZW network specialist may be misinformed (or lie), here's what one had to say when this topic was broached by AdhvanIt:
AdhvanIt said:
Just FYI. According to the VZW network specialist that I talked to the other day, consumers are notified if their data is to be throttled due to high data usage. Mine has not been throttled and I've used 5.2GB of data, with my cycle not ending until the 22nd. He said my usage wasn't nearly high enough to have my data throttled. Its the top 5% of users that get throttled.
Edit: when i asked, he also told me that data was throttled from the line itself, not from the device. Not saying the DTR is all placebo effect, but confirming why its never done anything for me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The VZW network specialist's statement echoes the VZW official release on their website, and AdhvanIt's data usage shows that the 5gb figure is not necessarily a hard threshold.
The argument that VZW would not throttle in this method also has merit. As mentioned by ihtfp69, the throttle is Google code, not VZW code. Furthermore, by placing the burden of throttling on the device alone, VZW leaves itself easily exposed to exactly the kind of hack that people are trying to achieve. Maybe they are indeed that lazy, but I have a difficult time believing that. They have complete control over your services: why would they leave this one task up to the phone?
Actually, given that this mod came over to us from the EVO, it would mean that both Sprint and Verizon were relying on this throttle. Why would two phone giants who have different networks, policies, and plans, rely on the same throttle that was coded as part of Android itself?
But perhaps those arguments are a bit too hypothetical to address in a meaningful way. Besides, as ihtfp69 further states:
ihtfp69 said:
If ppl are think they are getting better throughput with this mod, then go for it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And there's the rub. I see a lot of anecdotes but very few hard numbers. When I do see numbers here and there, they are generally extremely small samples: 1 or 2 speed tests done before and after the mod. Such a small sample is statistically insignificant, especially since we know that 3G speeds fluctuate based on location, time of day, population, etc.
In my own testing, I have not been able to find any difference between a stock services.jar file and one that has been modified with DTR. I make this statement based on 70 recorded speed tests, split evenly between stock and DTR. Forty recordings were taken throughout a single morning at my office, where my signal hovers around -84 dBm (the building itself interferes with reception). The thirty remaining recordings were taken throughout a single evening at my house, where my signal hovers around -74 dBm. I flashed back and forth between stock and DTR every few tests to ensure that neither testing condition was clumped into a single time window or boot cycle.
Office:
Home:
If I hadn't run so many trials, I could have easily seen a difference that was purely chance, but falsely attributed to DTR. This is true even across multiple readings. For example, my first few readings at the office:
Stock:
Test #1: 1,155 kbps
Test #2: 1,090 kbps
Test #3: 1,008 kbps
DTR:
Test #1: 557 kbps
Test #2: 1,406 kbps
Test #3: 1,404 kbps
Someone might look at these figures and think that DTR had delivered a 40% increase in max achievable speed. Looking back at the full chart, however, over the course of many trials, it is clear that the differences were natural fluctuations.
Of course, you could reasonably retort that I am seeing no difference because I am not being targeted by Verizon's throttling.
The question then becomes, why do you believe that you are being throttled? Is it solely a dissatisfaction with "stock" 3G speeds, or do you have reason to believe something more?
When you are not using DTR, do you see the throttle icon present in your notification bar? If the services.jar file really is the culprit, you should.
Have you ever been notified by VZW that you are being throttled?
How much data do you use in an average billing cycle?
Do you have more substantiation than a small handful of readings?
I would love to find out that DTR is truly effective, but I have yet to see convincing evidence.
I have to agree. I tested over a few days & came to same conclusion. No increase at all just standard fluctuations.
sent from dinc
byrong said:
One of the popular mods on XDA is Data Throttle Removal (AKA DTR), as described in this thread:
[MOD] Uncapped Data For Your ROMS (Skyraider, Virtuous, OMGB, ETC). In fact, some people consider it so vital that I have seen them delay upgrading their rom (even if the upgrade contains bugfixes) because they are waiting for a new DTR to be created.
The premise of this mod is simple:
1. Throttle code was discovered in our services.jar file.
2. It has been hypothesized that Verizon uses this code to throttle our 3G data speeds.
3. It is further hypothesized that flashing this mod disables the throttle, thereby returning your 3G speeds to their full potential.
In reading the forums, I see a lot of different values being thrown around. Quoting that original thread, for example, it is claimed that "Verizon starts to throttle data speeds after 5gb of data. That doesn't mean you get charged more, Verizon just slows you down. This mod will prevent that, and only that."
Looking at the code itself, however, pokes some holes in the original premise:
Looking at your framework-res.apk should show you the icon that is being mentioned. In the stock Froyo framework, for example, it can be found at /res/drawable-hdpi/stat_sys_throttled.png
And here's what it looks like in stock Froyo:
As for the 5gb claims, I cannot find any source on where that figure comes from. While Verizon has publicly stated that they reserve the right to throttle data (even on unlimited plans), they only state that it may be done to "the top 5% of Verizon Wireless data users."
Source:
http://support.vzw.com/terms/products/broadbandaccess_nationalaccess.html
http://support.vzw.com/terms/products/vz_email.html
While a VZW network specialist may be misinformed (or lie), here's what one had to say when this topic was broached by AdhvanIt:
The VZW network specialist's statement echoes the VZW official release on their website, and AdhvanIt's data usage shows that the 5gb figure is not necessarily a hard threshold.
The argument that VZW would not throttle in this method also has merit. As mentioned by ihtfp69, the throttle is Google code, not VZW code. Furthermore, by placing the burden of throttling on the device alone, VZW leaves itself easily exposed to exactly the kind of hack that people are trying to achieve. Maybe they are indeed that lazy, but I have a difficult time believing that. They have complete control over your services: why would they leave this one task up to the phone?
Actually, given that this mod came over to us from the EVO, it would mean that both Sprint and Verizon were relying on this throttle. Why would two phone giants who have different networks, policies, and plans, rely on the same throttle that was coded as part of Android itself?
But perhaps those arguments are a bit too hypothetical to address in a meaningful way. Besides, as ihtfp69 further states:
And there's the rub. I see a lot of anecdotes but very few hard numbers. When I do see numbers here and there, they are generally extremely small samples: 1 or 2 speed tests done before and after the mod. Such a small sample is statistically insignificant, especially since we know that 3G speeds fluctuate based on location, time of day, population, etc.
In my own testing, I have not been able to find any difference between a stock services.jar file and one that has been modified with DTR. I make this statement based on 70 recorded speed tests, split evenly between stock and DTR. Forty recordings were taken throughout a single morning at my office, where my signal hovers around -84 dBm (the building itself interferes with reception). The thirty remaining recordings were taken throughout a single evening at my house, where my signal hovers around -74 dBm. I flashed back and forth between stock and DTR every few tests to ensure that neither testing condition was clumped into a single time window or boot cycle.
Office:
Home:
If I hadn't run so many trials, I could have easily seen a difference that was purely chance, but falsely attributed to DTR. This is true even across multiple readings. For example, my first few readings at the office:
Stock:
Test #1: 1,155 kbps
Test #2: 1,090 kbps
Test #3: 1,008 kbps
DTR:
Test #1: 557 kbps
Test #2: 1,406 kbps
Test #3: 1,404 kbps
Someone might look at these figures and think that DTR had delivered a 40% increase in max achievable speed. Looking back at the full chart, however, over the course of many trials, it is clear that the differences were natural fluctuations.
Of course, you could reasonably retort that I am seeing no difference because I am not being targeted by Verizon's throttling.
The question then becomes, why do you believe that you are being throttled? Is it solely a dissatisfaction with "stock" 3G speeds, or do you have reason to believe something more?
When you are not using DTR, do you see the throttle icon present in your notification bar? If the services.jar file really is the culprit, you should.
Have you ever been notified by VZW that you are being throttled?
How much data do you use in an average billing cycle?
Do you have more substantiation than a small handful of readings?
I would love to find out that DTR is truly effective, but I have yet to see convincing evidence.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i think this is all placebo. The code was written by Google and not VZW. and it would be easier for VZW just to limit your connection on there end rather then send a code to turn it on, on the phone.
PLUS VZW knows that we can hack our phone and delete the code our self's so of course they would have a back up plan.
Great Busting of that myth. I figured that it was useless to an extent
Thanks for another great writeup byrong!
I have been assuming these modifications didn't do anything but never tested much between the two.
I'm inclined to agree with you. Logically, why would VZ throttle from the handset rather than from inside the network? However...
I have two brothers with the droid x and I have an incredible. One brother has complained of awful speeds lately, and they are pretty bad for him. I just started to notice it too. Now, I've begun to do some testing switching ROMs and such to see what happens. I normally run CM7 and about an hour ago was pulling .11Mbps where I have in the past had at least 1Mbps.
First, I tried the stock 2.2 PB31 zip file. I went through the initial wizard steps, started the market, added a secondary gmail account (not the one I normally use with my phone), and downloaded the speedtest app. No restoring, nothing. In that environment, I was getting bad speeds (can't recall if the .11 was back at CM7 or with stock sense). I wanted to try a ROM that included the throttle patch/fix/whatever. I did a full wipe and installed magnolia.
Same process as with stock, didn't install anything, just speedtest. Bam. 1.5+MBps consistently across 2-3 tests.
I'm flashing CM7 clean and will test it without installing anything. Now, I absolutely agree that a handset-side throttle makes no sense whatsoever, but something is going on that I can't account for...I'll have to try flashing something like skyraider, testing, then flashing the throttle remover and see how that goes, but CM is taking forever to boot...
UPDATE: OK, so CM7 finally booted and I was pulling 1-1.5Mbps. I restored my nandroid from earlier tonight before I went ROM crazy and I'm at 2.4Mbps down. Weirdnes...
johantheolive said:
UPDATE: OK, so CM7 finally booted and I was pulling 1-1.5Mbps. I restored my nandroid from earlier tonight before I went ROM crazy and I'm at 2.4Mbps down. Weirdnes...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think that goes to show what many people experience and mistake for increased speed with the mod, thanks for sharing
I completely agree with you byrong, great write up and data.
Sent from my ADR6300 using XDA Premium App
POQbum said:
I think that goes to show what many people experience and mistake for increased speed with the mod, thanks for sharing
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree, but how do I account for pulling such miserable speeds at one point and adequate an hour later, in the same location? I tested this morning and am doing 2Mbps+. Something's not right somewhere, whether it's network congestion or throttling, but then again that's not really related to these client side 'fixes'. It's only been prevalent since the iphone release, which was when VZ came out with throttling the upper percentile of users...
johantheolive said:
I agree, but how do I account for pulling such miserable speeds at one point and adequate an hour later, in the same location? I tested this morning and am doing 2Mbps+. Something's not right somewhere, whether it's network congestion or throttling, but then again that's not really related to these client side 'fixes'. It's only been prevalent since the iphone release, which was when VZ came out with throttling the upper percentile of users...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Could be any number of moment-to-moment variables that affect how RF signals propogate.
Simple stuff like weather can affect speed. It's likely there might had been a few users pulling a lot of data at that particular time to reduce that.
Without seeing what's actually causing the slowdowns it's easy to try and pin the problem on something it's not, but there's definitely a lot of variables when it comes to data speed over 3G on your phone so it could easily be something you haven't even thought of that was limiting the speed at that time.
Thanks guys - glad you appreciate the write-up.
I'm a skeptic, but I am completely open to being proven wrong on this topic (or any issue, really).
najaboy said:
Could be any number of moment-to-moment variables that affect how RF signals propogate.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
POQbum said:
Without seeing what's actually causing the slowdowns it's easy to try and pin the problem on something it's not, but there's definitely a lot of variables when it comes to data speed over 3G on your phone so it could easily be something you haven't even thought of that was limiting the speed at that time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well stated, gents.
Our brains are amazing pattern recognition systems. The problem is that they try way too damn hard. It's why many people have superstitious beliefs and why Airborne continues to sell
Im not sure if it works or not but Im willing to try.
My company says they throttle at 100MB (yes, 100MB) so Im willing to try this out.
riahc3 said:
Im not sure if it works or not but Im willing to try.
My company says they throttle at 100MB (yes, 100MB) so Im willing to try this out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If, after such a clear and concise debunking, you're still not sure, there are some folks in Nigeria that are willing to make you a very rich individual.
I've had a slightly different experience. Before the DTR, I couldn't get above approx 1mbps down, however after I get about 3 on 3g, and 9 on my wifi.
Maybe it's just a freak occurrence, though.
omgjosho,
Thanks for chiming in. I'm very much interested to hear from people who believe they've seen results from DTR. In the interest of gathering more data, could you answer the following?
byrong said:
When you are not using DTR, do you see the throttle icon present in your notification bar? If the services.jar file really is the culprit, you should.
Have you ever been notified by VZW that you are being throttled?
How much data do you use in an average billing cycle?
Do you have more substantiation than a small handful of readings?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're the second person I've seen point to Wi-Fi speeds, but no carrier would have any interest in throttling your Wi-Fi. On the contrary, they would want to encourage Wi-Fi as it shifts demand for data off of their network.
Anything done on Wi-Fi is meaningless to Verizon. It doesn't count towards your monthly data usage.
byrong said:
omgjosho,
Thanks for chiming in. I'm very much interested to hear from people who believe they've seen results from DTR. In the interest of gathering more data, could you answer the following?
You're the second person I've seen point to Wi-Fi speeds, but no carrier would have any interest in throttling your Wi-Fi. On the contrary, they would want to encourage Wi-Fi as it shifts demand for data off of their network.
Anything done on Wi-Fi is meaningless to Verizon. It doesn't count towards your monthly data usage.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah. Mostly a misread on my part then. I use somewhere between 500mb and 1gb a month. I've never noticed the throttling icon.
I understand what you're saying about the wifi part, but if it's a software data cap, theoretically it may not differentiate between wifi and 3g and cap the data throughput completely. I look at the DTR more like uncapping a cable modem as opposed to preventing the provider based throttle. So maybe I misunderstood. Simply posting the empirical evidence I had, the only difference was the 10 minutes it took to nandroid and flash the DTR. I was standing in the same spot in my house with the same amount of signal. *shrug*
omgjosho said:
I use somewhere between 500mb and 1gb a month.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's almost impossible to believe that Verizon is throttling you with that kind of data usage. That's less than 35mb per day: practically insignificant on their network. A couple email attachments, picture messages (not to mention video), some YouTube... the average person can consume that much data no problem.
If you were being throttled for that kind of usage, then almost every Verizon smartphone user would be actively throttled on a regular basis. The internet would be lit up like a Christmas tree with all of the complaints that people would post.
The top 5% of users may be throttled, but as AdhvanIt has shown, Verizon doesn't even consider >5gb of data in a billing cycle to reach the top 5%
I keep reading and reading, looking for the origins of all of this. I see people trying to use this mod on T-Mobile, Sprint, Verizon, and Cricket. To add to the reading list, here's the oldest thread I've found so far:
Dec 7 - http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=863923
I don't know when this quote was added to the original post, since it has been edited, but:
sino8r said:
SO FAR, THIS HAS ONLY BEEN KNOWN TO WORK ON T-MOBILE USA AND CANADA BELL... ALL OTHER CARRIERS SEEM TO HAVE THESE FILES JUST BECAUSE IT'S A STANDARD IN ANDROID 2.2.1 AND SEEM TO BE CONTROLLED COMPLETELY OTA UNLIKE TMOBILE AND BELL...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And in that thread it is stated that the mod no longer even works on T-Mobile: that it is "extinct."
It looks like Dec 26 is when people brought it to the Evo / Sprint world: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=888372
I read through all of that second thread and from the very beginning people were doubting the effectiveness of the mod on the Sprint network, or frankly even the need for it. There are numerous posters in there showing 20-30gb of data usage with no throttle from Sprint even on stock services.jar
omgjosho said:
I've never noticed the throttling icon.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Which again, in and of itself, should indicate that the services.jar throttle function was not the cause of your speed fluctuations.
omgjosho said:
I understand what you're saying about the wifi part, but if it's a software data cap, theoretically it may not differentiate between wifi and 3g and cap the data throughput completely.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Theoretically.... I guess. But now we're moving beyond the realm of "ambiguous data" straight into "wild theory." Not even the developers of this mod ever claimed that it would influence Wi-Fi.
omgjosho said:
Simply posting the empirical evidence I had, the only difference was the 10 minutes it took to nandroid and flash the DTR. I was standing in the same spot in my house with the same amount of signal. *shrug*
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But that's the thing: 10 minutes could certainly be an influencing factor. As noted by the other members, there are a lot of variables that go into 3G speeds: distance to tower, users connected to tower, time of day, weather, reception, geographical region, and so on.
Additionally, there are variables within the phone itself. Maybe before you flashed the DTR, your phone was using background internet services that slowed your speed test. Just one possible influence.
This is why I flashed back and forth between stock and DTR in my own testing: I wanted to minimize the potential influence of other variables by spreading the readings across time, location, and other conditions. I'm not saying your data is meaningless, just that it lacks the controls to consider it conclusive. I'm also not sure how many readings you took, so it's hard to judge the mathematical probability that the differences were chance.
I'm not particularly disagreeing with you here, as I'm near positive you've done much more research on the subject than I.
Truth be told, I got rid of the patch simply because I'm too lazy to update it when they release it, and it occasionally caused my 3g connection to take a dump. I'd prefer stability over faster speeds any day.
The thing is, until someone, anyone, can provide a test like byrong did except showing different results, then byrong is correct by default.
As far as I know, NO ONE has done this test other than him.
I've seen "one speed test shows dtr is faster".
I've seen "one speed test shows dtr is slower for me".
You have to do several tests, alternating, between dtr and non-dtr before you can say it works or not.
Is there actually throttle code in the phone? Yes.
Is the phone capable of throttling? Yes.
Does the dtr mod make the phone incapable of throttling? Yes.
Is the throttle code ever used? No. And unless you can provide a test like byrong's showing otherwise, then your opinion is not very valid.
I think android has the code as a generic function that providers could use if they wanted to.
As for the cable-box analogy, cable providers sell many different speeds. The cable box throttles you to your paid speed. Verizon sells 1 speed total, they have no need to throttle you with the device, everyone is the same.
I assume nobody else is having speed issues because I haven't seen any recent posts about this topic, but I went from 100% stock (including recovery, non-rooted, no extra apps installed) EC05 to EI22.
The first thing I noticed when I started to install applications was the 3G data was tremendously slower than it was before. Yes, I'm on Sprint. It wasn't great before, but it is *really* bad for me now.
I am currently getting:
4 out of 6 bars, -76dBm to -91dBm 0 asu
I do not know what the dBm/asu indicate, if those are "good" values or not. I've received acceptable data speeds at this location before.
I performed three speed tests using the Speed Test app:
ping 790ms, 693ms, and 982ms
download (bits, not bytes): 95kbps/0.09Mbps, 75kbps/0.07Mbps, 35kbps/0.03Mbps
upload (bits, not bytes): 93kbps/0.09Mbps, 127kbps/0.12Mbps, 138kbps/0.14Mbps
I am a bit reluctant to odin the modem back to EC05 with the modem NVRAM flash cleared and re-applying the EI22 patch, since I am not rooted I do not have the necessary numbers it appears I need to re-establish service from reading that forum thread.
Anyone else seeing a similar issue? Any suggestions for resolving it, other than the aforementioned NVRAM flash?
No noticable speed issues here....the towers that were broke before still don't work for data and the ones that do work..work the same.
Go to the data status in the ##DEBUG screen and make sure it says evdo and not 1x.
It's likely the tower. I get the same sort of thing downtown here but if I get out to another tower I pull just over 1 meg down. Hopefully Sprint gets all of their towers sorted out soon.
I compared mine on an Airave and they are comparable in speed.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
Thanks, everyone.
I tried to search the forums for ##DEBUG to see how to do that, but wasn't able to find a post that explained it. One post I did find talked about turning on tethering mode and using a com port, but none of the ports I tried to open worked (I stopped at COM7). I will look into this more later on the great interweb.
I found some co-workers who have Sprint and androids, and when they ran Speed Test all also got abysmal results: one test returned a 2kbps (bits) download result. Yikes.
So, it seems to indeed be tower problem of some sort. After talking more with them, it appears to have really taken a nose dive the past couple weeks. The suspicious is the tower is saturated. Awhile back one of my coworkers called Sprint to complain, after going through several levels the most he got them to do was re-provision his phone which didn't help at all. So there's no acknowledgement of a problem or apparently any intention of fixing the issue. Maybe someday...
Anyhow, I appreciate your help and insights. Thanks again, everyone.
Same Issue Here!!
Insanely slow, all stock, formerly 1.0Mbps DLs before in same spot.
I have to throw my 2 cents in, used to get pretty good speeds and now, not sure if it is EI22 or something else, I get horrible speeds.
I sat in a car, parked in a lot across the street from the sprint tower, full bars, -65dBm, and ran a speed test... 483kbps download, 614kbps upload, 117ms ping.
I'm in a smallish town and can't imagine there is that much traffic on the tower...
Just to update, in another smallish town about 45 minutes away from the other one, sitting 5 bars about 1/4 mile away from tower and my speeds are even worse.
same problem here - speed test results are dismal
5 bars - tower within 1/2 mile away - ping 138 ms - d/l 439 kbps ul 443 kbps
phone samsung epic 4g
ERA Legendary 2.1 ROM
thanks
I've found that if I disable 100 MHz then I get a lot better data speeds. I'm on Legendary RC 2.1 with 2.0.8 of the Samurai kernel.
I also have this problem too, however if 3g is super importante, I would recommend CM7 the problem seems to go away too. Runs smoother too. I have 4g, and love it, so that is what I use when I am connected to a charger. 3g is getting pretty bad that I can't even stream music sometimes, just for the skips.
Saki18 said:
Insanely slow, all stock, formerly 1.0Mbps DLs before in same spot.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Installed ACS Recovery and Rooted, only thing different, drastic improvement in speed. Dunno why.
Here's what I used:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1307980
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1339478
Slow speeds with a strong signal usually means that the tower is having issues. I have that problem on the main road (I live in the sticks) where there is only one tower, and a lot of users. In the middle of the night my speeds skyrocket, indicating network saturation during the day.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using xda premium
Ok another update. I had a friend with a galaxy tab at work today try a speed test and the same time as I did on my epic. We both got very similar results... which hopefully confirms that my phone is working fine, just sprints network is being saturated in my area. I'm going to go ahead and blame the number of people who probably picked up smart phones in the last few weeks. Seems like every day at work somebody has a new shinny toy to show off... to bad the network isn't able to support it.
I live in San Francisco, and I still get crappy speed. San Francisco's suppose to have the "fastest" 3G. I donno why though.
update from me.
sprint was down much of today
just came back - speed test report 1177 kbps down - 649 kbps up and ping of 163 ms - A dramatic improvement
did the 100 mhz mod also
but this seems to point to towers.
http://anandtech.com/show/10081/wifi-testing-with-ixia-wavedevice/4
Anandtech just got a really fancy, manufacturer-grade WiFi testing setup and did some initial testing with the iPad Pro and the Pixel C.
In the case of the iPad Pro and Pixel C, we found that WaveDevice was able to show a number of notable interesting data points from both an end user perspective and an engineering perspective. With the rate vs range test, it was possible to clearly see how well a device would perform in response to worsening reception from a user experience perspective. From an engineering perspective, it was possible to identify the root cause for the Google Pixel C’s poor Wi-Fi performance by using WaveAnalyze and an RF analysis blade in WaveDevice. While determining the root cause is still beyond what we can do with limited information on the hardware, an OEM would be able to act on the information provided by WaveDevice to improve their product before it reaches mass production.
In addition to the rate vs range test, the roaming latency test was quite illuminating. While root cause analysis is more difficult and best left to actual engineers, it’s quite obvious that the iPad Pro passed this test with flying colors while the Pixel C shows some serious deficiencies. If you regularly encounter large Wi-Fi networks with multiple access points all under a single SSID/name like eduroam, it’s obvious that the Pixel C will be an exercise in frustration if you’re hoping to keep a working Wi-Fi connection on the move. Even when the device roams successfully, the time that the device spends moving from one access point to the next is long enough on average to result in noticeable connection interruptions. When it doesn’t roam successfully, it seems to get stuck on a single access point and basically drops off the network entirely without manual intervention or has to re-authenticate and acquire a new IP address, which is guaranteed to cause most traffic to be dropped.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In a nutshell, we might need to file a class action lawsuit.
I'm not very technically minded, so just wondering in simple terms, does the article suggest this might be a hardware issue? Something that can't be fixed with future software updates? Thx
aalin13 said:
I'm not very technically minded, so just wondering in simple terms, does the article suggest this might be a hardware issue? Something that can't be fixed with future software updates? Thx
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
From the article:
It may be that we're looking at something like improper impedance matching somewhere in the system, amplifiers that are either poorly selected or poorly integrated, and/or a phase-locked loop somewhere that isn’t set up or designed properly for this task.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Basically, they said they are not familiar enough with the hardware in the Pixel C to say if the problem is hardware or software related. Google probably knows, but good luck getting them to admit to anything.
oRAirwolf said:
Basically, they said they are not familiar enough with the hardware in the Pixel C to say if the problem is hardware or software related. Google probably knows, but good luck getting them to admit to anything.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks, so there is still hope. This wifi concern is the only thing holding me back from buying one right now, my Nexus 10 has started to have issues with random reboot and extremely slow charging (20 hours to go from 20% to 100%), so I'm thinking of buying a Pixel C as a replacement
aalin13 said:
Thanks, so there is still hope. This wifi concern is the only thing holding me back from buying one right now, my Nexus 10 has started to have issues with random reboot and extremely slow charging (20 hours to go from 20% to 100%), so I'm thinking of buying a Pixel C as a replacement
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For the record, I have absolutely no problems with WiFi with my Pixel C. I live in a 2 bedroom apartment with a highly saturated WiFi environment. I think the WiFi is unquestionably bad, but my usage scenario generally revolves around reading the news while pooping and watching media in airports/airplanes. In my scenario, none of the problems have even remotely affected me.
oRAirwolf said:
For the record, I have absolutely no problems with WiFi with my Pixel C. I live in a 2 bedroom apartment with a highly saturated WiFi environment. I think the WiFi is unquestionably bad, but my usage scenario generally revolves around reading the news while pooping and watching media in airports/airplanes. In my scenario, none of the problems have even remotely affected me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Haha, sounds like how I use my tablet as well, and I also live in an apartment with saturated WiFi. Guess I can always buy it and return it if the WiFi is an issue. When you say WiFi is unquestionably bad, do you mean that it is slower and has weaker signal than other devices? Given that my home internet is still on DSL, I think I might not even notice the difference in WiFi speed
aalin13 said:
Haha, sounds like how I use my tablet as well, and I also live in an apartment with saturated WiFi. Guess I can always buy it and return it if the WiFi is an issue. When you say WiFi is unquestionably bad, do you mean that it is slower and has weaker signal than other devices? Given that my home internet is still on DSL, I think I might not even notice the difference in WiFi speed
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I just mean that the problems are widely reported and backed by the test data in that article. I have never had any noticeable issues myself, though.
No surprise here.
IPad Pro is a $1000+ real product with the full forces of Apple R&D, manufacturing and Q&A behind it.
Pixel C is more like a prototype made by a small team inside a big company whose core business isn't to build and sell devices.
It's borderline silly to compare these 2 without comparing the budgets, the staff and the marketing/sales "intentions".
That's been said there is no doubt the Pixel C has room for wifi optimizations but then is this really necessary ? it's not meant to be widely sold at a huge scale. Its purpose is not to have the best wifi possible. I'd rather have Google staff working on next gen Android & Chrome OS features for the Pixel C rather than wasting their time fine tuning & optimizing its wifi...
People should stop considering the Pixel C as a real product. It's more like a dev kit / prototype / experimentation device. Not a real device that you can find in a shop next door like an IPad or a Samsung tablet. It's meant for Googlers to work on new features, for 3rd party apps devs to prepare their next gen apps and for tech enthusiasts to preview stuff.
So, in that context, thinking about a class action is just plain silly.
No problems at all with WiFi. How can ortople be sure it's not an external factor at play? I wouldn't trust Anandtech. They take bribes from anyone with deep edbough pockets. No better than paid for survey companies.
Until they post an ethics and gifting policy, you should disregard anything they have to say.
What exactly is the wifi issue? I got a Pixel C recently, knowing about the issue roughly; but I've never had any issues. I just ran a Speedtest connected to a 5Ghz network and pulled down 106Mbps (down) and 25Mbps (up); this is about the same I get on a wired connection (actually better on average, for some reason).
i've had absolutely no issues, either, but i also have a device from the newer batch (612300) and i'm running n. it actually works better than my nexus 10 in some cases, though i have yet to test it in an area with saturated wifi.
CrazyPeter said:
I wouldn't trust Anandtech. They take bribes from anyone with deep edbough pockets. No better than paid for survey companies.
Until they post an ethics and gifting policy, you should disregard anything they have to say.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am not saying you are wrong, but I have never seen anything to give me the impression that their objective testing is skewed in any way. They clearly have subjective opinions about products and it is no secret they tend to lean towards iOS devices. That being said, they generally have, by far, the most thorough, quantifiable testing and results of any mobile device review site.
Do you have any sources or examples to back up your claims? I would definitely like to know, as I do consider them to be a trusted source for thorough, numbers based, and high level reviews. I tend to leave the subjective opinions up to myself, though.
Proved my deep suspicions from Day 1 and yes there is absolutely ground for a class action here since this product is being sold as the Android tablet , not an experimental product with a disclaimer that core features like wifi may be seriously broken.
undertaker2k14 said:
Proved my deep suspicions from Day 1 and yes there is absolutely ground for a class action here since this product is being sold as the Android tablet , not an experimental product with a disclaimer that core features like wifi may be seriously broken.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ROFL so what's a class action gonna do? Get you like $300 cash or $500 of Google play, after 3-4 years.
If you don't want the tablet, sell it, and give it someone who wants it
May be nudge Google's hardware team towards better QAand something is always better than nothing.
No issues with wifi, either using my home router or tethering. So I don't know what the issue is as a practical matter.
Sent from my Pixel C using Tapatalk
I would be interested to know what scenario people are reporting good Wi-Fi performance in. I know that my c definitely has a problem as soon as the Wi-Fi signal drops below -75dB. This happens when trying to use when in the garden. The main issue is that it drops the connection and refuses to connect to it again without the Wi-Fi being switched on & off. It reminds me of the behaviour that I used to get with the 'don't connect to connecting with poor Wi-Fi signal' - except that -75dB isn't really a low signal. All my other android devices (oneplus 2, hudl2 & Nexus 5) all give reliable performance at the same distance (20m).
boboskins said:
I would be interested to know what scenario people are reporting good Wi-Fi performance in. I know that my c definitely has a problem as soon as the Wi-Fi signal drops below -75dB. This happens when trying to use when in the garden. The main issue is that it drops the connection and refuses to connect to it again without the Wi-Fi being switched on & off. It reminds me of the behaviour that I used to get with the 'don't connect to connecting with poor Wi-Fi signal' - except that -75dB isn't really a low signal. All my other android devices (oneplus 2, hudl2 & Nexus 5) all give reliable performance at the same distance (20m).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Only had this tablet a week but I have had no Wifi issues and I live in an apartment with metal studs that cause problems for many of my other devices. As a matter of fact I write this sitting in a garden with a -80db signal. I am on N so that may (I hope) have something to do with my lack of wifi issues.
here is a comparsion of my Pixel vs my phone 10 feet from the router. My phone saturates my link, while the pixel comes up 100mbps short. It is still fast enough...but at further ranges it gets worse fast.
https://goo.gl/photos/NdC3KG4186xuifDW6
oRAirwolf said:
For the record, I have absolutely no problems with WiFi with my Pixel C. I live in a 2 bedroom apartment with a highly saturated WiFi environment. I think the WiFi is unquestionably bad, but my usage scenario generally revolves around reading the news while pooping and watching media in airports/airplanes. In my scenario, none of the problems have even remotely affected me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same here, I live in a tiny, packed city (1.3 square miles, about 50k people) across the river from NYC and I have easily 15-20 WAPs showing up on any wifi device and while I did have wifi problems, turns out it was my sh!tty verizon router and the overly packed 2.4 GHz band. Once I got an AC router and hopped on the 5 GHz band I've had no problems at all!
natezire71 said:
What exactly is the wifi issue? I got a Pixel C recently, knowing about the issue roughly; but I've never had any issues. I just ran a Speedtest connected to a 5Ghz network and pulled down 106Mbps (down) and 25Mbps (up); this is about the same I get on a wired connection (actually better on average, for some reason).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've only seen problems connecting with very poor wifi signals. The only time I ever really had problems connecting was in a hotel where it would see the WAP, try to connect and then fail, even with the "only connect to strong WAPs" option turned off. I have no problems at my apartment or at my parent's house.
undertaker2k14 said:
Proved my deep suspicions from Day 1 and yes there is absolutely ground for a class action here since this product is being sold as the Android tablet , not an experimental product with a disclaimer that core features like wifi may be seriously broken.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm sorry but people like you are the reason why we need labels on everything warning someone about every possible thing that could happen, just so they can cover their a$$es in case some idiot attempts to sue for something ridiculous (e.g. a warning on a jar of peanuts that says "warning: contains peanuts!"....yes, Planter's peanuts actually has that warning on the jar lol). I think you're using a bit of hyperbole there, the wifi is not "seriously broken" because it obviously works fine for most people, including myself and it seems like largely a software issue since Cheep5k8 has largely fixed most of the issues with his kernel. There's probably not even a large enough amount of people that even on the Pixel C, I wouldn't doubt that less than 50k have it. It's a pretty expensive device that wasn't really marketed at all, not many people outside of Android/Tech geeks know about it.
beardymcgee said:
ROFL so what's a class action gonna do? Get you like $300 cash or $500 of Google play, after 3-4 years. If you don't want the tablet, sell it, and give it someone who wants it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
More like $3.00 or $4.00 :laugh: Have you even been involved in a class action lawsuit? I've gotten the emails before that says I could claim a payment if I wanted to but the payouts are hysterically laughably low, I think for the Amazon e-book price fixing scandal, I could claim about 10-30 cents because I bought like 5 books from them over the course of a few years. I think the biggest payout I've ever received was a few bucks and that maybe have been on a few hundred dollar purchase, hell even class action lawsuits on cars that cost $30k+ receive payouts of maybe a few hundred dollars hahahaha Instead of selling it and getting something that works better he'd rather keep the tablet then ***** and complain about how the wifi sucks and he deserves to be repaid for buying something with sub-par wifi