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hi all
just received an email from t-mobile uk saying that have no plans to release the wm6 rom. Does this mean were are cursed or will we be able to use the HTC version when it comes out. is it just a case of losing branding and the cab files with the gprs settings etc???
cheers
Yeah i know, i got the same reply by email at weekend. you think that with the unit being so high spec that they would want to upgrade to WM6 for customer satisfaction
Disgraceful! Let's hope someone cracks the CID protection soon so we can use the HTC ROM when it is released!
Not good news. Let's all sign a petition and get it over to T-Mobile.
-Krip
yea, not happy about this at all, been with t-mobile for 8 years now, theyve had a **** load of money off of me. let me know if you start a petition
Since WM6 isn't an upgrade for any Advantage yet, is it really likely their emaildrone is going to know about it really?
Yes, we should petition them. But in context. "When WM6 is shipping on the Advantage please make it available for Ameo"
I second that, we need to make sure they know how not realising an operating system upgrade as big as WM6 would nark us Ameo owners off. (to put it nicely!)
Don't get upset..we'll get it anyway
Sorry guys I'm in disagreement with you on this one. I agree that a device as new and feature rich as the Ameo should definitely come with WM6, but it was never promised or even mentioned to the best of my recollection prior to and after the Ameo was released. Therefore we all knew what we were getting before we shelled out, even though we all held out hope that an official T-mobile WM6 upgrade would be available.
I'm quite happy to wait until CID unlocking has been cracked and an official WM6 ROM is available for the Dopod or Advantage version.
Let's face it people, we'll get there in the end anyway, wether they want us too or not.
CID is already available through imei-check, but they cant do it over-the-air. I emailed them about CID/SIM unlocking and this is their reply.....
Hello,
>>we can unlock it, but remote is not possible right now. If you want you can send the device to us for unlock. Special delivery is ok. The unlock is 20 GBP + 7 gbp to ship it back to you. Please send it to:
MIGsofT LTD FAO:Florin Mandache 19 Cowan Road Balloch Glasgow G68 9BX. Send just the handset + battery. >Regards, > >IMEI-CHECK Team >
I was very unsure sending the unit and needed reassurance so i replied.....
Thanks for your reply, but could you supply me with a contact number(landline) to help keep track of my unit, and so i can make payment by card. Your website doesn't contain any contact info which makes me a little uneasy.
And this is the reply i got back.....
Hello,
You can call me on my mobile : +44795*******.
The payment it will be done via paypal or direct bank deposit after we received the device and we unlocked it.
As you might guess, i'm still wary of sending it off so i guess i'll sit and wait until another option is available.
i was checking via STREETMAP, the postcode for imei-check (look at my post above) and i found this........http://www.myhouseprice.com/HousePr...imeframe=1&timeframemonth=99&timeframeyear=99
CHECK THE FIFTH HOUSE DOWN THE LIST! Its the same address and postcode for IMEI-CHECK, and it went up for sale on 23/03/07. Now i definately aint sending my unit through the post, to dodgy!
neildunne said:
Please send it to:
MIGsofT LTD FAO:Florin Mandache 19 Cowan Road Balloch Glasgow G68 9BX.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Excellent! I'm just down the road (for a certain value of "down the road", being a two hour drive but one I do frequently) from them.
Wonder if they'll do it whilst I wait
Richard
mackaby007 said:
Sorry guys I'm in disagreement with you on this one. I agree that a device as new and feature rich as the Ameo should definitely come with WM6, but it was never promised or even mentioned to the best of my recollection prior to and after the Ameo was released. Therefore we all knew what we were getting before we shelled out, even though we all held out hope that an official T-mobile WM6 upgrade would be available.
I'm quite happy to wait until CID unlocking has been cracked and an official WM6 ROM is available for the Dopod or Advantage version.
Let's face it people, we'll get there in the end anyway, wether they want us too or not.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i agree with you here, T-mobile has never promise WM6 update, so if they decide not to offer it, it's no problem, you just need the CID tool, and you can install the DOPOD or HTC one.
Whilst i accept that we were never promised an upgrade i consider that most of the Ameo owners believed that an upgrade would be in the pipe line.
By using unauthorised upgrade methods are we not invalidating our warranties and risking the chance of removal of technical support from t-mobile?
Perhaps there are associated overhead costs for T-mobile with regard to supporting another operating system but there are already phones in their range that use wm6. We are not asking them to support *nix.
I rang t-mobile last week regarding a phone problem last week (unable to make/receive calls). i was told that nobody on their thd had an Ameo manual (in the end the problem was 3g network related rather than a fault with the phone).
To date T-mobile have no publicly available rom versions (at all) which leads me to think that they are not yet up to speed wrt support for this unit anyway.
I have been a T-mobile customer for 10 years and have been out of contract for the last 3 until selling my soul for 18 months to get this Ameo. T-mobile cannot provide me adequate support at the moment and HTC will not because it is not their phone.
At a minimum i cannot see why we can not be offered this upgrade as a gesture of goodwill.
If it is a question of HTC (or microsoft) charging too much for the upgrade then perhaps they should consider how few units would have been sold without the t-mobile branding/subsidy.
i for one would be happy to petition T-mobile and will put my money where my mouth is later this weekend and start a site for the petition.
Lips tightly zipped.
But don't worry.
That's all I'm saying.
Slave1 said:
Lips tightly zipped.
But don't worry.
That's all I'm saying.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That'll do then. Thanks.
imaginarynumber said:
Whilst i accept that we were never promised an upgrade i consider that most of the Ameo owners believed that an upgrade would be in the pipe line.
By using unauthorised upgrade methods are we not invalidating our warranties and risking the chance of removal of technical support from t-mobile?
Perhaps there are associated overhead costs for T-mobile with regard to supporting another operating system but there are already phones in their range that use wm6. We are not asking them to support *nix.
I rang t-mobile last week regarding a phone problem last week (unable to make/receive calls). i was told that nobody on their thd had an Ameo manual (in the end the problem was 3g network related rather than a fault with the phone).
To date T-mobile have no publicly available rom versions (at all) which leads me to think that they are not yet up to speed wrt support for this unit anyway.
I have been a T-mobile customer for 10 years and have been out of contract for the last 3 until selling my soul for 18 months to get this Ameo. T-mobile cannot provide me adequate support at the moment and HTC will not because it is not their phone.
At a minimum i cannot see why we can not be offered this upgrade as a gesture of goodwill.
If it is a question of HTC (or microsoft) charging too much for the upgrade then perhaps they should consider how few units would have been sold without the t-mobile branding/subsidy.
i for one would be happy to petition T-mobile and will put my money where my mouth is later this weekend and start a site for the petition.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If everyone thinks the same with you, then all T-mobile PDA user will be asking wm6 update (T-mobile MDA,MDA PRO.....). The things is it cost nothing to buy the upgrade, Microsft does not charge anything for it, but in order to publish the update, service provider will needs to run testing on it to make sure it's stable, it's nothing to do with HTC here as well, HTC offer the basic ROM, then T-mobile will needs to finish it, so it will takes them a while to make it stable, this is where you see the advantage of each different ROM, they are not all done by HTC, they are done by the service provider. And when you say WM6 device is already available on T-mobile, which one are you talking about? i don't seems to remember any of them.
Another important issue, you are going to see less and less HTC product on T-mobile, and any other provider too, HTC is now changing their company structure, they are trying to be like Nokia, so you won't see T-mobile mark or branding on HTC device in the future. So you already notice, T-mobile is the only one selling HTC advantage in UK, and it could be the last one, (or the very last few). In the future, you will see only HTC brand. So because of this, T-mobile has a very good reason not to be bother with WM6 update, i believe they are due to the end of the contract with HTC, and really, i don't think T-mobile care too much about Ameo, you don't see it advertise anywhere....
The bottom line is, even T-mobile release official WM6 update, i don't think it's going to be as stable as the DOPOD one or HTC one, they are already in the testing stage, and beta version will be release for tester next month. So all we need is the CID unlock, then you can choose the best ROM to upgrade.
Owners of the dash have been offered upgrades to wm6
And i go back to my point about not being offered support (understandably) for unauthorised upgrades. Surely if you know that the majority of owners of a particular phone are going to follow this path (ie unofficial upgrades) it will be cheaper (in the long run) to aid them and ensure that they have a phone that works. Otherwise you also run the risk of them blaming the network when it is in fact their phone that is not working.
With regard to your assertion that "t-mobile don't care about the ameo" the argument doesn't hold much water as it would imply that they don't care much about their customers- hence we return to the crux of this thread.
I cannot go out and buy a copy of wm6 and install it myself. if i purchased a copy of vista and discovered that it would not be possible to legitimately upgrade (purchase) to it's replacement (bar hardware issues) i would not purchase vista. It is now a given with phones of this form that we expect software/os improvements to compliment the hardware.
not every one is aware of these types of forums and would benefit from the upgrades and the ensuing improvements. It is through T-mobile that awareness would be increased (with the greatest respect to this site).
I do not doubt that you are more savy than me but if that implies an "i'm alright Jack" mentality then I personally prefer to be ignorant (it is after all blissful)
When sms was rolled out did you sit there and say "oh i don't expect to be able to use that because I signed up when vox was the only option"- i think not.
imaginarynumber said:
Owners of the dash have been offered upgrades to wm6
And i go back to my point about not being offered support (understandably) for unauthorised upgrades. Surely if you know that the majority of owners of a particular phone are going to follow this path (ie unofficial upgrades) it will be cheaper (in the long run) to aid them and ensure that they have a phone that works. Otherwise you also run the risk of them blaming the network when it is in fact their phone that is not working.
With regard to your assertion that "t-mobile don't care about the ameo" the argument doesn't hold much water as it would imply that they don't care much about their customers- hence we return to the crux of this thread.
I cannot go out and buy a copy of wm6 and install it myself. if i purchased a copy of vista and discovered that it would not be possible to legitimately upgrade (purchase) to it's replacement (bar hardware issues) i would not purchase vista. It is now a given with phones of this form that we expect software/os improvements to compliment the hardware.
not every one is aware of these types of forums and would benefit from the upgrades and the ensuing improvements. It is through T-mobile that awareness would be increased (with the greatest respect to this site).
I do not doubt that you are more savy than me but if that implies an "i'm alright Jack" mentality then I personally prefer to be ignorant (it is after all blissful)
When sms was rolled out did you sit there and say "oh i don't expect to be able to use that because I signed up when vox was the only option"- i think not.
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Click to collapse
i understand your point there, but if you stand at the T-mobile side and think about it, then maybe you will understand if they decide not to offer wm6 update. It cost them time and money to release, it's pruely a bonus for T-mobile customer if they offer it. So do you think T-mobile MDA PRO should be offer WM6 as well? since it's the second most expensive PDA that T-mobile offer.
Anyway, what i am saying here is we are not suppose to flash un-official ROM, it has already bought this site trouble. I know lots of people (including me still do it anyway). I guess time will tell whether T-mobile will lunch WM6 update or not, but if they decide not to, don't be surprise, they have perfectly good reason for it.
Sorry WU
this was not intended to be a snipe at you but i believe in fair play and think that you are wrong.
with regard to a petition i will hold off given that Slave1 seems to know something and others respect his opinion, unless i am convinced otherwise
imaginarynumber said:
Sorry WU
this was not intended to be a snipe at you but i believe in fair play and think that you are wrong.
with regard to a petition i will hold off given that Slave1 seems to know something and others respect his opinion, unless i am convinced otherwise
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
let's all hope the upgrade will comes out from T-mobile, yes you are right, i don't know about T-mobile, and i have no contact inside this company too, all I know is when i went to the 3GSM this year, they did say something about the WM6 update but they are not sure which machine to offer by that time.
So hopefully they will release it, if not, we just need to hope a CID tools then all Ameo user can then flash HTC, DOPOD rom.
I got this from another thread on XDA, if it needs to go to the Q&A section, please move it.
What I find interesting, is the BOLD section.
This "explanation" has to do with the Samsung Galaxy S series, but, could also be viable to all android phones.
Now, never let it be said I'm defending at&t in ANY way, but perhaps some of the lag on updates, could be this.
If the manufacturer is "selling" an android update to a carrier, wouldn't that be in violation of the open source agreement?
To explain the political situation, first, a primer on how phone firmware upgrades work for carriers. When a carrier decides to sell a phone, a contract is usually written between the phone manufacturer and the carrier. In this contract, the cost of updates (to the carrier) is usually outlined. Updates are usually broken into several types: critical updates, maintenance updates, and feature updates. Critical updates are those that resolve a critical bug in the phone, such as the phone overheating. Maintenance updates involve routine updates to resolve bugs and other issues reported by the carrier. Finally, feature updates add some new feature in software that wasn’t present before. Critical updates are usually free, maintenance updates have some maintenance fee associated with them, and feature updates are usually costly. In the past, most phone updates would mainly consist of critical and maintenance updates. Carriers almost never want to incur the cost of a feature update because it is of little benefit to them, adds little to the device, and involves a lot of testing on the carrier end. Android has changed the playing field, however – since the Android Open Source Project is constantly being updated, and that information being made widely available to the public, there is pressure for the phone to be constantly updated with the latest version of Android. With most manufacturers, such as HTC, Motorola, etc. This is fine and considered a maintenance upgrade. Samsung, however, considers it a feature update, and requires carriers to pay a per device update fee for each incremental Android update.
Now, here’s where the politics come in: most U.S. carriers aren’t very happy with Samsung’s decision to charge for Android updates as feature updates, especially since they are essentially charging for the Android Open Source Project’s efforts, and the effort on Samsung’s end is rather minimal. As a result of perhaps, corporate collusion, all U.S. carriers have decided to refuse to pay for the Android 2.2 update, in hopes that the devaluation of the Galaxy S line will cause Samsung to drop their fees and give the update to the carriers. The situation has panned out differently in other parts of the world, but this is the situation in the United States.
Some of you might have noticed Verion’s Fascinate updated, but without 2.2 : This is a result of a maintenance agreement Samsung must honor combined with Verizon’s unwillingness to pay the update fees. In short, Android 2.2 is on hold for Galaxy S phones until the U.S. carriers and Samsung reach a consensus.
Some might wonder why I didn’t deliver this over a more legitimate news channel – the short answer: I don’t want to lose my job. I do, however, appreciate transparency, which is why I’m here.
Hi,
I'm thinking about getting a Galaxy Note. Unfortunately I'm in the U.S. So I'll have to get it from overseas. Even if I get it from a US seller, the phone is probably imported anyway. I'm planning to get it from Handtec. They have the EU version I believe.
Now if Samsung relases any OTA, does anyone know if I'll be able to get it here in the U.S.
Thanks.
As I understand, the Note doesn't need OTA's per se, as they're also downloadable directly into the phone through your WiFi using a piece of software called Kies, that is instaleld both in your phone and in your desktop.
I don't own one yet tough, so I'm just passing along forum information.
Funny you are asking that on XDA. Who cares? You can always come here and get it. Be much more concerned about the lack of warranty. The only thing holding me back from getting the Note
Sent from my Xoom using Tapatalk
Phylar said:
Funny you are asking that on XDA. Who cares? You can always come here and get it. Be much more concerned about the lack of warranty. The only thing holding me back from getting the Note
Sent from my Xoom using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Correct me if I'm wrong but the Note comes with an international warranty... Well my Note did. I'm in the UK and bought it as an import from Germany. Confirmed the international warranty with the supplier too and it's definitely in force. Got a warranty book in the box to prove it.
Ngambek2003 said:
Hi,
I'm thinking about getting a Galaxy Note. Unfortunately I'm in the U.S. So I'll have to get it from overseas. Even if I get it from a US seller, the phone is probably imported anyway. I'm planning to get it from Handtec. They have the EU version I believe.
Now if Samsung relases any OTA, does anyone know if I'll be able to get it here in the U.S.
Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
the availability of OTA is dependent upon the region the phone originated from, not which country youre currently in.
ie. if you have the european note, it will only update when a european update is available, not when the US update is available. doesnt matter if youre in US or australia like me, cant update until they release a european update.
denialnw10 said:
Correct me if I'm wrong but the Note comes with an international warranty... Well my Note did. I'm in the UK and bought it as an import from Germany. Confirmed the international warranty with the supplier too and it's definitely in force. Got a warranty book in the box to prove it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It doesn't matter where the warranty comes from, but if any Note user decides to:
a) root their device
b) install any custom rom/kernel
the warranty will be gone in most cases. The warranty will cover hardware or software malfunction but if you install not-stock stuff on your phone, then you can't complain if your service provider or repairshop won't do it for free.
Souai said:
the availability of OTA is dependent upon the region the phone originated from, not which country youre currently in.
ie. if you have the european note, it will only update when a european update is available, not when the US update is available. doesnt matter if youre in US or australia like me, cant update until they release a european update.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, but I believe his question was more about if an american carrier would broadcast a european OTA over their networks. They don't, but Kies take care of that.
Viamonte said:
Yes, but I believe his question was more about if an american carrier would broadcast a european OTA over their networks. They don't, but Kies take care of that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wasn't expecting the update to be broadcast from the carrier actually. I'm expecting Samsung to broadcast it directly. It sounds like I should be able to get the update, either through OTA or through Kies. It'd be nice to be able to update without requiring a desktop though.
Viamonte said:
Yes, but I believe his question was more about if an american carrier would broadcast a european OTA over their networks. They don't, but Kies take care of that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
carriers only broadcast updates to carrier locked phones iirc.
if you purchase an unlocked phone, it doesnt matter what carrier youre on. when you go to check for updates, it should be connecting to samsung's servers, not your carrier's.
Read the article below.
Some might argue why T-Mobile and Sprint version N3 is unlocked that's because of their network coverage. If you do little research you will find that most of the giant firms use either Verizon or At&t for their employees. This now confirms how Saamy is forgetting about us and mostly putting their focus on giant firms. Give me your point and lets see where this goes.
TechnoBuffalo said:
Samsung already has a firm grip on the consumer smartphone market, but the enterprise sector is a completely different ballgame. So in an effort to put businesses at ease and gain a larger corporate following, the Korean company this year officially unveiled a new mobile security system called Knox. With so many Samsung devices available, the company certainly has the potential to make inroads at some big firms around the world—only, a new report from The Wall Street Journal suggests Knox has been full of bugs and delays, annoying some big clients.
One of Samsung’s clients, the U.S. Defense Department, has allegedly become frustrated by Samsung’s Knox system, leading to some internal strife among the Samsung brass; the company is supposedly hard at work bringing Knox back into 100 percent shape. With BlackBerry ailing—enterprise market share has reportedly fallen from 68 percent in 2010 to 5.4 percent today—Samsung certainly has an opportunity to fill that void. There’s still the stigma of Android to contend with, however, making Apple’s iOS a more appealing option.
According to WSJ, “many corporate tech administrators widely perceive its smartphones, which run on Google Inc.’s open-source Android operating system, as being more prone to viruses and easier to hack than Apple Inc.’s iOS and BlackBerry proprietary software.” Fixing that perception has become one of Samsung’s top priorities, WSJ added.
Knox essentially gives corporate tech admins complete control over their employees’ Samsung device or devices. Handsets can remotely be shut down, company data cordoned off, and alerts can be set if a device’s code has been tampered with—all excellent features for sensitive corporate data. But if those promised features aren’t working as advertised, especially for a customer such as the U.S. Defense Department, Samsung could lose its small portion of the enterprise market pretty quick.
One source admitted that Samsung isn’t a service business, which is why it’s experiencing so many issues. “Creating this new organization that specializes in selling software and services, that took us longer than expected,” the source said. Over the course of 2013, Samsung repeatedly assured potential clients Knox would be ready, and even come preloaded on the Galaxy S4. It didn’t wind up coming preloaded on a Samsung devices until the Note 3 hit a few months back.
Deployment thus far has been slow while Samsung works through the issues. But if those issues don’t get patched up, the company’s big enterprise push could fall flat. One BlackBerry exec said of Knox, “[It] can potentially pose threats to enterprises.” With the consumer market locked up, definitely not the start to enterprise life that Samsung would have wanted.
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Click to collapse
http://www.technobuffalo.com/2013/1...rogram-running-into-major-issues-says-report/
I would agree. Sounds right and does make sense!
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk
Does make sense until you wonder why other carriers have the bootloader unlocked. Unless those people saying the bootloader is unlocked they mean it has been unlocked by a hack.
Delakit said:
Does make sense until you wonder why other carriers have the bootloader unlocked.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
85% of the Fortune 1K in the U.S. are on VZW and AT&T.
Im nkt sure this really explains why AT&T's bootloader is locked. This article discusses the issues with Knox, something that is present in the VZW Note 3 but missing from the ATT version. If the bootloader is locked due to trying to attract enterprise business then why would Knox (the container application) be missing from our version of the phone? Even if Knox is being wonky it still should have been included if they were going after the enterprise market.
AT&T Samsung Galaxy Note 3 stock rooted with changes by Wanam
Samsung Galaxy Note 10.1 GT-N8013 rooted w/Hyperdrive RLS6
This…..
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk
---------- Post added at 05:45 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:44 PM ----------
BarryH_GEG said:
85% of the Fortune 1K in the U.S. are on VZW and AT&T.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
HappyPessimist said:
Im nkt sure this really explains why AT&T's bootloader is locked. This article discusses the issues with Knox, something that is present in the VZW Note 3 but missing from the ATT version. If the bootloader is locked due to trying to attract enterprise business then why would Knox (the container application) be missing from our version of the phone? Even if Knox is being wonky it still should have been included if they were going after the enterprise market.
AT&T Samsung Galaxy Note 3 stock rooted with changes by Wanam
Samsung Galaxy Note 10.1 GT-N8013 rooted w/Hyperdrive RLS6
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This and this....
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk
HappyPessimist said:
Im nkt sure this really explains why AT&T's bootloader is locked. This article discusses the issues with Knox, something that is present in the VZW Note 3 but missing from the ATT version. If the bootloader is locked due to trying to attract enterprise business then why would Knox (the container application) be missing from our version of the phone? Even if Knox is being wonky it still should have been included if they were going after the enterprise market.
AT&T Samsung Galaxy Note 3 stock rooted with changes by Wanam
Samsung Galaxy Note 10.1 GT-N8013 rooted w/Hyperdrive RLS6
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not sure where you got your ATT N3 from, but mine has KNOX and it is a 900A like the others here. You can even look at running apps and see KNOX listed. you can also go into the upload menu and see the KNOX status.
It depends on Sammy's customer base spread. If the majority are suits, Sammy loses very little by losing the nerd market. But if the majority are teen-agers texting their BFF, Sammy is going to see that a little bad press in the Blogosphere goes a LONG way. The under-21 set will believe a blog stating that the Martians have landed faster than they'll believe the WSJ that the big yellow ball in the sky is the sun.
We'll just have to wait and see, but if Sammy keeps welding these things shut, a lot of ROM builders are going to be building non-Sammy ROMs. And a lot of people will put up with the Sprint dead spots rather than be treated like numbers by Big Red.
Since my crystal ball battery is dead, all I can do is make wild guesses.
Solarenemy68 said:
Not sure where you got your ATT N3 from, but mine has KNOX and it is a 900A like the others here. You can even look at running apps and see KNOX listed. you can also go into the upload menu and see the KNOX status.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm talking abiut the Knox container. The other variants of the Note 3 had a Knox app of sorts that acts as a container for more sensitive information. See this thread-
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2470278&page=8
AT&T Samsung Galaxy Note 3 stock rooted with changes by Wanam
Samsung Galaxy Note 10.1 GT-N8013 rooted w/Hyperdrive RLS6
Can't quote the guy above for some reason but I don't see KNOX running anywhere on my phone.
HappyPessimist said:
I'm talking abiut the Knox container. The other variants of the Note 3 had a Knox app of sorts that acts as a container for more sensitive information. See this thread-
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2470278&page=8
AT&T Samsung Galaxy Note 3 stock rooted with changes by Wanam
Samsung Galaxy Note 10.1 GT-N8013 rooted w/Hyperdrive RLS6
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
KNOX container most certainly works on 900A.
Quick question for everyone here...
Do you think that filing complaints with government agencies over the locked bootloader issue might be an effective route for seeking change? Consider that when complaints were filed against them for blocking FaceTime on their network, the groups that filed those complaints did achieve a limited measure of success.
I would envision that the complaint could look as follows:
1. Denying users root access to their own phones and locking the phone's bootloader prevents access to all features of some software packages. (e.g. Titanium Backup)
2. Some of the packages that AT&T effectively blocks through these policies (i.e. Titanium Backup) compete with software they offer. (e.g. AT&T Locker)
3. Ergo, AT&T seeks to obtain an unfair competitive advantage over other applications through its behavior.
I also wonder if it would be possible to argue that AT&T is knowingly selling defective phones through its policy of locking the bootloader. I'm sure we can all point out many bugs in the stock firmware which have been addressed by custom ROMs. An argument could be made that AT&T's action of preventing custom ROMs from being installed is forcing its customers to use materially defective equipment - it's just a question of whether or not an agency could be convinced of this amidst AT&T's "greasing of the palms" to quiet complaints against them.
now i'm clearly understand
Unless the private key slips, or if people don't care about warranty (in about 10 months ) the bootloader won't be unlocked.
Personally, I think this allows for more inventive solutions to processes which have become so routine we expect them to work on every phone. RDLV for example. The Kn0x0ut script. My MJ5 Recovery methods -- all include unique techniques to catch up to the level of security ATT/Samsung has surprised us with.
This process, of course, is cyclical. Both sides have an opportunity to gain here and I welcome it!
evilpotatoman said:
Unless the private key slips
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If I only worked for Samsung in a capacity to help...
evilpotatoman said:
or if people don't care about warranty (in about 10 months )
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hopefully we don't have to wait that long for it... I'm almost ready to purchase a Note 3 from TMO just to have an unlocked bootloader. If I could get a new one locally for around $500 this weekend I probably would. (Just got the Note 3 this week so I'm still within my 14 day return period with ATT.)
evilpotatoman said:
Personally, I think this allows for more inventive solutions to processes which have become so routine we expect them to work on every phone. RDLV for example. The Kn0x0ut script. My MJ5 Recovery methods -- all include unique techniques to catch up to the level of security ATT/Samsung has surprised us with.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm glad you and others enjoy the challenge presented by AT&T's greed, and am thankful for each of you and the hours you spend trying to figure out how to remove or bypass the artificially created limitations and restrictions on our devices.
In my opinion, limitations like locked bootloaders are material defects, and should be treated as such by government. Once one enters into a contract with the wireless provider, the phone is yours as long as you continue to abide by the terms of the contract (on time payments, staying within acceptable use policies). As such, one should be free and clear to modify the phone in any way - as long as expectations of service and support are diminished appropriately for "non standard configurations". No carrier should be allowed to lock bootloaders or otherwise take measures to prevent users from rooting their devices.
rooted_1 said:
Quick question for everyone here...
Do you think that filing complaints with government agencies over the locked bootloader issue might be an effective route for seeking change? Consider that when complaints were filed against them for blocking FaceTime on their network, the groups that filed those complaints did achieve a limited measure of success.
I would envision that the complaint could look as follows:
1. Denying users root access to their own phones and locking the phone's bootloader prevents access to all features of some software packages. (e.g. Titanium Backup)
2. Some of the packages that AT&T effectively blocks through these policies (i.e. Titanium Backup) compete with software they offer. (e.g. AT&T Locker)
3. Ergo, AT&T seeks to obtain an unfair competitive advantage over other applications through its behavior.
I also wonder if it would be possible to argue that AT&T is knowingly selling defective phones through its policy of locking the bootloader. I'm sure we can all point out many bugs in the stock firmware which have been addressed by custom ROMs. An argument could be made that AT&T's action of preventing custom ROMs from being installed is forcing its customers to use materially defective equipment - it's just a question of whether or not an agency could be convinced of this amidst AT&T's "greasing of the palms" to quiet complaints against them.
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Hmmm...
That actualy sounds like legit reasons!
Does AT&T sell the developer edition like Verizon?
I so want to come back to AT&T but had to jump ship to VZE because they had SafeStrap. How much I hate Verizon! They used to have best signal in town. Now its no better than Sprint.
Anyways back on topic. That seems like reasonable pitch. Where do we / you file that complaint? FCC? FTC?
Why not offer a corporate version? If you want to use it at work, you never have the corporate locked bootloader.
They could even make it a ROM update accessible by corporate accounts.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N900A using xda app-developers app
designgears said:
KNOX container most certainly works on 900A.
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I'm sure it works on the 900A, but I think he meant it's not on there by default for the 900A AT&T variant. Do you have an apk for it?
scrosler said:
Hmmm...
That actualy sounds like legit reasons!
Anyways back on topic. That seems like reasonable pitch. Where do we / you file that complaint? FCC? FTC?
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I filed a complaint with the FCC the other week using the precise argument I suggested above. Of course, I've yet to hear anything from them. If it's anything like the net neutrality complaints I filed against AT&T years ago, the FCC will forward the comment along to AT&T and the company will provide a written response back to both me and the agency in a couple months.
I'm also wondering if there would be any sort of way to get the FTC involved in this as well, by making an argument that AT&T is knowingly selling defective devices, refusing to fix the defects in a timely manner (by releasing new versions of Android, quicker), and preventing users from fixing the defects on their own (by locking the bootloader). I'm sure that there's a plethora of issues with 4.3 and TouchWiz and Knox that could be pointed out... the least of which would be the constantly-nagging security error notification that shows up every time one uses WiFi on a stock phone.
I'm generally not a big fan of big government, but this is one exception. The more government agencies we can legitimately engage with valid points, the more effort that AT&T has to put into defending its decision to only market phones with locked bootloaders. If enough agencies get involved from enough angles with reasonable and logical arguments, there *may* come a time at which AT&T decides that it's not worth the effort. They obviously feel that some economic benefit come from their decision. The trick is to create the perception that the economic benefit they gain from locked bootloaders is outweighed by the ill will and cost of participation in government inquiries they bear. There's only a slim chance that this will work, but I'm willing to take a few minutes to file complaints and let the wheels of our government agencies churn. After all, isn't that what they're there for?
rooted_1 said:
I filed a complaint with the FCC the other week using the precise argument I suggested above. Of course, I've yet to hear anything from them. If it's anything like the net neutrality complaints I filed against AT&T years ago, the FCC will forward the comment along to AT&T and the company will provide a written response back to both me and the agency in a couple months.
I'm also wondering if there would be any sort of way to get the FTC involved in this as well, by making an argument that AT&T is knowingly selling defective devices, refusing to fix the defects in a timely manner (by releasing new versions of Android, quicker), and preventing users from fixing the defects on their own (by locking the bootloader). I'm sure that there's a plethora of issues with 4.3 and TouchWiz and Knox that could be pointed out... the least of which would be the constantly-nagging security error notification that shows up every time one uses WiFi on a stock phone.
I'm generally not a big fan of big government, but this is one exception. The more government agencies we can legitimately engage with valid points, the more effort that AT&T has to put into defending its decision to only market phones with locked bootloaders. If enough agencies get involved from enough angles with reasonable and logical arguments, there *may* come a time at which AT&T decides that it's not worth the effort. They obviously feel that some economic benefit come from their decision. The trick is to create the perception that the economic benefit they gain from locked bootloaders is outweighed by the ill will and cost of participation in government inquiries they bear. There's only a slim chance that this will work, but I'm willing to take a few minutes to file complaints and let the wheels of our government agencies churn. After all, isn't that what they're there for?
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Thank you for doing this..
I feel the only way we will ever be heard is to start a Samsung boycott petition. Even if those who sign the petition has no plans to truly boycott Samsung, the negative publicity and the potential for consumers to boycott them would be a huge risk in Samsung eyes. Imagine if we had 10k users signed the boycott petition because of the bloatware & locked bootloader. Samsung could care less about the 10k consumers but the word of mouth from those consumer could equal millions. Samsung might not officially release an unlock bootloader but might allow leaks to occur to keep us quiet. If one website picked up the story about Samsung boycott petition, Samsung would do everything in their power to correct or fix the problem. Due to carrier restrictions and request they would have to come up with clever ways or do what htc does and allow you to unlock your phone on their site with a code.
Hey All,
So I was in the market for a GNote 12.2, but I wanted to avoid the lag that I have associated with the Exynos lineup (maybe due to big.LITTLE transition?). So I was able to find a 12.2 on eBay that was being sold with a bad IMEI. I don't really care so much about the inability to access the LTE network since I can tether from my other devices when no WiFi is available. The reason I went for it was because due to the bad IMEI, I was able to get the tablet for less than the lowest price of a WIFI refurb model I've seen (which was $430). My question though is this: When the next Android update is approved by AT&T, am I going to have a problem receiving the update? They come OTA, but I'll never have a SIM in this thing, and the tab will never be registered to the ATT network.
Is rooting then flashing a stock ROM of Android L when it comes out my only option? Or will the OTA work?
In any case, I'm really loving this thing...
Keaka26 said:
Hey All,
So I was in the market for a GNote 12.2, but I wanted to avoid the lag that I have associated with the Exynos lineup (maybe due to big.LITTLE transition?). So I was able to find a 12.2 on eBay that was being sold with a bad IMEI. I don't really care so much about the inability to access the LTE network since I can tether from my other devices when no WiFi is available. The reason I went for it was because due to the bad IMEI, I was able to get the tablet for less than the lowest price of a WIFI refurb model I've seen (which was $430). My question though is this: When the next Android update is approved by AT&T, am I going to have a problem receiving the update? They come OTA, but I'll never have a SIM in this thing, and the tab will never be registered to the ATT network.
Is rooting then flashing a stock ROM of Android L when it comes out my only option? Or will the OTA work?
In any case, I'm really loving this thing...
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As long as there is no SIM card in the device, you should get the update. The only time the update system would scream and shout would be when there's a SIM in the device that isn't active. You should be alright.
AT&T uses RedBend software for doing OTA updates and it really sucks. haha If you try to check for an update, does it tell you something about the software update being interrupted? If not, you're fine.
oldblue910 said:
As long as there is no SIM card in the device, you should get the update. The only time the update system would scream and shout would be when there's a SIM in the device that isn't active. You should be alright.
AT&T uses RedBend software for doing OTA updates and it really sucks. haha If you try to check for an update, does it tell you something about the software update being interrupted? If not, you're fine.
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Right now it just says no updates are available Didn't know if that would change once a legit OTA update (Android L) was available...
If it just says no updates are available then your device is registering properly with the system and therefore you should get updates.
Sent from my Galaxy Note Pro 12.2 using Tapatalk
Great news! Staring at the airplane mode icon and seeing the "insert SIM" message sort of drives me nuts, but getting this tablet pretty much brand new for under $400 made it worth it I think. Hopefully no unforeseen consequences will crop up.
Do you know why the IMEI is bad? I hope the tablet isn't stolen or something like that. :/
According to the seller, they accepted the device as a trade-in at their retail B&M store, and the IMEI was clean at that time. After the seller paid the customer, the customer reported the device lost/stolen to the insurance. It is a shady practice that is becoming more prevalent, unfortunately. The seller I purchased from is a popular and highly rated merchant on eBay...