Database Users

PROPER way to charge your X1's battery?

before everybody tells me the search function, I already have but I find mixed and contradiction answers on this issue. Some people say to do a full discharge followed by a full recharge as soon as you get the phone. Then on the other hand some people say that you shouldn't do this since the x1 uses a li-ion and its bad for it. Some people say you should charge it only when it's near empty, but on the other hand some people say to keep charging it as often as possible. Some say to take it off the charger once its fully charged, but then some say its ok to leave a fully charged battery on the charger.
As you can see, from searching the forum I've gotten pretty confused. so what is the PROPER way to charge our x1 battery? Is it also true that battery life gets better the more you put it on the charger? Does the x1i get better battery life than the x1a? I'm asking this because I'm gettin very poor battery life on my x1 compared to the 1-3 days of heavy usage that I see other people gettin on this forum. I'm going to exchange it today for a new one, so I don't want to make the same mistakes with charging my battery as I did with the first one.

Charging:
Do charge the battery often.
The battery lasts longer with partial rather than full discharges.
Discharging:
Avoid full cycle because of wear.
80% depth-of-discharge recommended.
Re- charge more often. Avoid full discharge.
Low voltage may cut off safety circuit.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
From:
http://www.batteryuniversity.com/partone-21.htm

dogans said:
From:
http://www.batteryuniversity.com/partone-21.htm
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
that is very true......i get better life (3days) when i charge from 50%. otherwise i barely get more than 24hr.

thanks, that helps a lot! but what do I do once the battery has finished fully charging on the charger? should I take it off or is it fine to still leave it on the charger?

i have noticed this today,
i have installed a battery indicator bar (i cant remember which one) i charged my my X1 during night, when i woke up, i found that the phone is not charging and the battery is full. so i think that the phone automatically stopps charging when the battery reaches 100%
anyone can confirm that?

Not sure about the way to charge it, but i can comment on your current battery life. when i got mine, i had 1 days battery life, but after flashing it, i'm now getting between 3-4 days......
i used
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=458768

Glad to see that there are people that read the "real" stuff (I'm talking about dogans), the batteryuniversity site is mantained by the very battery fabricants, so their opinions are the best informed ones, even if they might bias a little to keep the bussiness "healthy".
However, any Lithium battery should not be fully discharged -at least not often-, because the full discharge shortens their life.
Usually, good chargers do control the charging parameters (battery's voltage, current and temperature curves) while it charges and "know" when to stop, even if they really don't stop ever (normally), the go in "tickle" charging mode, to keep the battery "fully" charged.
Hope this helps.

The article on Wikipedia about Li-Ion batteries is quite informative as well:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium_ion_battery
It specifies the technology, the do's, the dont's and usefull tips in keeping your battery in good condition.

Charging Nexus 7 before using it for 1st time?

Should I charge it for like 10 hours, then play with it? or you think its ok to just start playing out of the box.
I've heard stories..where you should, and where it's not necessary.
Thanks

lin013190 said:
Should I charge it for like 10 hours, then play with it? or you think its ok to just start playing out of the box.
I've heard stories..where you should, and where it's not necessary.
Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Mine came nearly full. I just plugged it into charger out of the box and played with it while it was charging
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2

With any new phone I always play with it till it dies and then plug it in and charge for 8 hours and then power it on and good to go
Sent from my EVO using xda app-developers app

Hmm, I see.:cyclops:

With every electronic gadget using Lithium-ion batteries nowadays, it doesn't really matter how/when you charge it.
Some would argue to make sure to allow a full discharge from a full charge from a battery calibration point of view, so the battery meter is more accurate. It wouldn't affect the health of the battery itself either way.
Things like memory effect doesn't apply to lithium-ion. How often you charge it and how much you charge it (full or partial charge etc.) doesn't affect it much either. The only 2 things that can potential kill a lithium-ion is high temperature and letting it discharge far too low to the point that it cannot be charged up again. Note that all electronic devices will power off way before it even reaches this threshold.

What makaijin says is correct
I had mine a bit of a charge yesterday but it was no where near full.
Used it till it was flat this morning. It's currently on charge and I'm going to leave it till it's full only because I need to stop messing with it and do other things
Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2

I charged mine for 4 hours before use.

Although it is probably not necessary nowadays, I like to fully discharge the device, then charge it overnight (so it gets back up to 100% and tops off), then cycle it that way 2/3 times, so properly "condition" the battery, as I don't 100% trust the conditioning done before shipping.
Just as a side note, most of the battery conditioning lore is coming from way back in the bad ol' nicad days (probably 1990's), when you HAD to 100% discharge/recharge the battery, and make sure it didn't overcharge or undercharge, else it would not be "conditioned" properly, and it had a permanently reduced max charge. Nowadays, expecially with Lion, it is not necessary, and may even be harmful to fully discharge/recharge cycle EVERY time you use it. The first few times it's probably best to do it to fully condition the battery, but beyond that, it really does nothing.

hanthesolo said:
Although it is probably not necessary nowadays, I like to fully discharge the device, then charge it overnight (so it gets back up to 100% and tops off), then cycle it that way 2/3 times, so properly "condition" the battery, as I don't 100% trust the conditioning done before shipping.
Just as a side note, most of the battery conditioning lore is coming from way back in the bad ol' nicad days (probably 1990's), when you HAD to 100% discharge/recharge the battery, and make sure it didn't overcharge or undercharge, else it would not be "conditioned" properly, and it had a permanently reduced max charge. Nowadays, expecially with Lion, it is not necessary, and may even be harmful to fully discharge/recharge cycle EVERY time you use it. The first few times it's probably best to do it to fully condition the battery, but beyond that, it really does nothing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
"Conditioning" does not occur with li-on batteries, period. Charging/discharging does absolutely nothing for the life of your battery.

Ifixit shows that the battery inside the Nexus 7 is Lithium Polymer. Does that make a difference in terms of conditioning compared to Li-Ion batteries?

MaxCarnage said:
"Conditioning" does not occur with li-on batteries, period. Charging/discharging does absolutely nothing for the life of your battery.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh, thanks. I thought that was my being paranoid .
Lithium Polymer batteries are actually worse than Lithium-Ion. Don't take my word for it, but at least with older RC Lipo batteries, fully discharging damages them even more the lithium-ion. I am sure the tablet cuts off way before the danger point, but still something to keep in mind.

Here's the deal- and this has been verified on multiple devices with larger batteries- Your tablet will need to self-calibrate the battery meter/charging to the battery. You can expect things like sketchy battery life and running down very low or completely overnight for the first couple days. Once everything "syncs up", you can take advantage of the full potential of the battery. This happened with my Razr Maxx and it happened on my Nexus 7's first overnight. And, talking to people who have had their Nexus 7's a few days, it's common and expected.
As said, it is NOT the battery conditioning, it is the device calibrating. The battery is pretty big and there's a period of time while the device learns.

I decided to drain the battery all the way and then charge it all the way up. It's charging right now actually, any idea how long it should take to get up to 100%?
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using xda app-developers app

phoneman09 said:
I decided to drain the battery all the way and then charge it all the way up. It's charging right now actually, any idea how long it should take to get up to 100%?
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not sure but you can always tap the power button to pull up the battery charge animation. It should let you know when it is fully charged.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2

Over discharging a Lithium Ion battery can ruin it in a single cycle. Of course any consumer device should shut off before that happens but deep discharges to the shut off point still permanently reduce battery capacity significantly more than shallower discharge cycles.
In simple terms, you'll get significantly more hours of battery use during its lifetime if you only discharge to 50% than 10% or less.
Lithium Ion batteries never need to be "fully discharged" to the device shut off point and as stated above, it isn't "good" for them.
That said, a discharge from fully charged to at or near shutoff let's the device software measure the battery capacity more accurately so you'll get a more accurate battery reading.
Lithium Ion batteries should not be charged at elevated temperatures. If you just watched a two hour movie, let it cool down before charging. A tablet is a nasty place for a battery with the CPU heating it up. Most manufacturers advise not charging at > 85 deg F and 70 deg F is better. A really good charger will measure battery temperature and reduce the max charging rate at elevated temperatures.
Lithium Ion batteries should be stored at 50-70% capacity and not fully charged. That's ~3.7 V per cell. Those of us who use the device a lot on external power would see a lot longer battery life if there was a mode which allowed keeping the battery below 100% while on external power. It seems every manufacturer thinks consumers are too dumb to understand the value of providing it and switching to full charge mode before we run off on battery power.

TP_NC_USER said:
Over discharging a Lithium Ion battery can ruin it in a single cycle. Of course any consumer device should shut off before that happens but deep discharges to the shut off point still permanently reduce battery capacity significantly more than shallower discharge cycles.
In simple terms, you'll get significantly more hours of battery use during its lifetime if you only discharge to 50% than 10% or less.
Lithium Ion batteries never need to be "fully discharged" to the device shut off point and as stated above, it isn't "good" for them.
That said, a discharge from fully charged to at or near shutoff let's the device software measure the battery capacity more accurately so you'll get a more accurate battery reading.
Lithium Ion batteries should not be charged at elevated temperatures. If you just watched a two hour movie, let it cool down before charging. A tablet is a nasty place for a battery with the CPU heating it up. Most manufacturers advise not charging at > 85 deg F and 70 deg F is better. A really good charger will measure battery temperature and reduce the max charging rate at elevated temperatures.
Lithium Ion batteries should be stored at 50-70% capacity and not fully charged. That's ~3.7 V per cell. Those of us who use the device a lot on external power would see a lot longer battery life if there was a mode which allowed keeping the battery below 100% while on external power. It seems every manufacturer thinks consumers are too dumb to understand the value of providing it and switching to full charge mode before we run off on battery power.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would rather always have my battery near max charge when I take it off the charger than have a battery last 7 years instead of 3 or 4 in a device I will realistically only use extensively for 2. Even more so with a phone where they battery can replaced for $20. I'll take a full charge every time over the battery lasting for years longer than I need it to.
I have a first gen iPod Touch I bought when they were released (2007 I think?). I have left it on a charger for MONTHS. Still holds a decent charge.

Is there benefit to using a battery calibration app like this if you're rooted?
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.nema.batterycalibration&hl=en

You don't have to but I like to. Mine was like 40% charged when I unboxed
Sent from my Nexus 7 using xda app-developers app

sRDennyCrane said:
Here's the deal- and this has been verified on multiple devices with larger batteries- Your tablet will need to self-calibrate the battery meter/charging to the battery. You can expect things like sketchy battery life and running down very low or completely overnight for the first couple days. Once everything "syncs up", you can take advantage of the full potential of the battery. This happened with my Razr Maxx and it happened on my Nexus 7's first overnight. And, talking to people who have had their Nexus 7's a few days, it's common and expected.
As said, it is NOT the battery conditioning, it is the device calibrating. The battery is pretty big and there's a period of time while the device learns.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Calibration occurs every time the battery is charged to 100%. It isn't a "first few days" type of thing, it is every single time the battery meter reaches 100%.

I had no choice but to completely charge my N7 (purchased from Office Depot 7/14). When I went to turn it on the first time, I was greeted with small text in the upper left side of the screen that said "show low battery logo" on a completely black screen. No logo...no nothing. Completely blank. Plugged it in, the battery charging logo popped up, fully charged it and it's been working great since.
However, I found it a bit odd as I thought most of these types of devices ship with about a 40% battery charge.
Thoughts?

[Q] Keeping the Nexus 10 plugged-in

I have read conflicting articles on increasing the battery life of Lithium-ion batteries (the ones used in Nexus 10). Most of the Lithium ion batteries have a lifespan of 300-400 charge/discharge cycles. From my understanding, this means that it is bad to fully discharge the batteries and then recharge them as it reduces from the above mentioned lifespan and it is better to top-off the battery often as possible.
In fact there was an article that I read on Cnet specifically for the iPad (I'm not allowed to post outside links for some reason, google: "ipad keep plugged in" and the first article in the search result) , where they recommend to keep the iPad plugged-in whenever possible to increase the battery life.
I use my Nexus 10 a lot at house. So, Is it better to keep it plugged-in all that time?

roshanpius said:
I have read conflicting articles on increasing the battery life of Lithium-ion batteries (the ones used in Nexus 10). Most of the Lithium ion batteries have a lifespan of 300-400 charge/discharge cycles. From my understanding, this means that it is bad to fully discharge the batteries and then recharge them as it reduces from the above mentioned lifespan and it is better to top-off the battery often as possible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is correct.
In fact there was an article that I read on Cnet specifically for the iPad (I'm not allowed to post outside links for some reason, google: "ipad keep plugged in" and the first article in the search result) , where they recommend to keep the iPad plugged-in whenever possible to increase the battery life.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The life span of LiIon/LiPoly batteries is also reduced when the battery is at or near 100% for a prolonged time. Don't think too much about it, just use the N10 and recharge it often. I usually try to plug it back in around the 70% mark.
It's also quite easy to open up the tablet, you only need a screwdriver and a plastic prying tool and then you can change the battery yourself, if it ever should become necessary (unlikely, unless you plan to use it for ~5 years).
> http://www.powerbookmedic.com/wordpress/2012/11/16/google-nexus-10-take-apart-first-look

i don't care about it... i leave it plugged whenever i can
chances are, those who take "good care" of their battery may end up with 10% more life in 2 years.... and frankly, i couldn't care less about that
not worth the hassle of worrying about batteries anymore

Best practice actually is to drain to 40% and charge up to 80%. Dropping to 90% and charging back up to 100% a bunch is still bad for your battery, as is leaving it plugged in over night when it reached 100% long before you wake up.

EniGmA1987 said:
Best practice actually is to drain to 40% and charge up to 80%. Dropping to 90% and charging back up to 100% a bunch is still bad for your battery, as is leaving it plugged in over night when it reached 100% long before you wake up.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It stops charging upon reaching 100%.

Its hard to follow those instructions when your out 24 hours a day, or maybe you just want to use your tablet
Don't worry about doing extra stuff.. like the user said I could careless..
Just don't let your device die, charge it once it hit like 15%..
Saying charge your device once it at 70% is like only driving your car for 5miles and putting it back in the garage and walk the rest of the way..
Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk 2

YoungAceAtlanta said:
Saying charge your device once it at 70% is like only driving your car for 5miles and putting it back in the garage and walk the rest of the way..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I didn't say you have to do that. If it's possible I recharge early, if not I just use it anyway.
Doesn't really matter too much since the battery can be exchanged rather easily if it ever comes to that.

BoneXDA said:
It stops charging upon reaching 100%.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, and then it drains a bit and goes back to charging, over and over the rest of the night.

I've read that Li-ion batteries don't like "deep cycles", that is, fully dischanging then fully charging, because this shortens the battery's life. Also that it's not good to have it at 100% for a prolonged time. So it would be best to always have the device partially charged, plugging it if below 50% and unplugging at 90%. When the battery reaches 90% some phones even notify you that "the battery is full, and you can disconnect from charger"
Source: http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries

Charging - disconnect after full or leave connected?

I've got a question.... I leave my phone charging overnight on the pillow next to me and use the phone in the morning still plugged in to check emails, browse news etc and only remove the charger when I'm done and going to work...
Is this good for the phone and the battery or am I better off unplugging and then recharging when low again?
My method above keeps me charged up for the day's use as otherwise I would need to charge again at work..
What do you guys think?
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

As long as you are using the original Cable+Charger, you aren't harming the phone or battery at all. Technology on batteries and chargers are amazing now, especially with usb-c.

i leave my 6p the whole nights too nothing happens. Just use the original charger and cable and youll be fine.

Alekos said:
As long as you are using the original Cable+Charger, you aren't harming the phone or battery at all. Technology on batteries and chargers are amazing now, especially with usb-c.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not entirely true, see below.
mchu6am4 said:
I've got a question.... I leave my phone charging overnight on the pillow next to me and use the phone in the morning still plugged in to check emails, browse news etc and only remove the charger when I'm done and going to work...
Is this good for the phone and the battery or am I better off unplugging and then recharging when low again?
My method above keeps me charged up for the day's use as otherwise I would need to charge again at work..
What do you guys think?
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
While you can't overcharge the battery, leaving it connected like that will degrade the long term life of the battery. A lithium battery shouldn't sit at peak voltage (100%) for extended periods of time. Here are a couple of really good articles:
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/do_and_dont_battery_table
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries

Heisenberg said:
Not entirely true, see below.
While you can't overcharge the battery, leaving it connected like that will degrade the long term life of the battery. A lithium battery shouldn't sit at peak voltage (100%) for extended periods of time. Here are a couple of really good articles:
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/do_and_dont_battery_table
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is correct in my experience, and is one of the reasons why the battery life on laptops tends to go right to crap . . . because people just let them sit on the charger constantly. IIRC, ideally you want to let it drain to around 20%, charge to full, let it drain, etc. Never let it completely die, and long-term storage should be at around 40% charge. No one does this perfectly because it would be such a hassle but in general this is what keeps lithium-ion batteries happy.
*sits back and waits for an electrical engineer to come humiliate this peon's approximation*

cabbieBot said:
This is correct in my experience, and is one of the reasons why the battery life on laptops tends to go right to crap . . . because people just let them sit on the charger constantly. IIRC, ideally you want to let it drain to around 20%, charge to full, let it drain, etc. Never let it completely die, and long-term storage should be at around 40% charge. No one does this perfectly because it would be such a hassle but in general this is what keeps lithium-ion batteries happy.
*sits back and waits for an electrical engineer to come humiliate this peon's approximation*
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're pretty much right on the money there. I think three ideal range is between 40%-80% though. Small top up changes are the best way to charge lithium batteries.

20% is too low. Charge cycles slowly degrade the battery. 80% is a good number, but failing that 100% is a better option than continually cycling it. But this is a phone we're talking about not a laptop. I would imagine cycling is what's going to happen to it in most normal usage scenarios.
Sent from a 128th Legion Stormtrooper 6P

Many thanks for all the responses much appreciated.. I'll have to work out a way of not having to charge overnight as this is the only time I leave it plugged in for extended periods!
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

Getting my new Nexus 6P from Google Store today and have a few questions

So excited about getting my new phone today but have a question prior to opening just to be prepared. What is the best process to ensure the battery health when first opening device? Do I charge the device fully prior to turning it on for the first time or do I let the battery drain fully before I put it on the charger? I know this is an age old discussion but not sure with these new phones how to best handle it.
Thanks in advance.

I honestly used it took it died, then I charged it all the way to 100 (never leave overnight) then I let it die all the way, then charge again.. So far good battery life
That was after my first full charge[emoji4]
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

RidinNerdy said:
I honestly used it took it died, then I charged it all the way to 100 (never leave overnight) then I let it die all the way, then charge again.. So far good battery life
That was after my first full charge[emoji4]
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks. Ill do that. I love the battery stats you getting and that's what I want!!

RidinNerdy said:
I honestly used it took it died, then I charged it all the way to 100 (never leave overnight) then I let it die all the way, then charge again.. So far good battery life
That was after my first full charge[emoji4]
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is the worst thing you can do. These aren't NiCads. LiIon batteries do not like to be fully discharged.

You'll likely find that the battery will be charged to roughly 40%. This is considered the ideal amount of charge for long-term storage. People often still worry about memory effects of batteries, harping back to the days of older battery types such as Ni-Cad and some Ni-Mh batteries but the same isn't true for Li-ion or Li-Pol batteries.
The one thing to absolutely try to avoid is letting the battery run down to flat. Li-ion batteries will degrade quicker over time if discharged fully, which is also why devices have a built-in "buffer" amount when you run the battery down to avoid damaging them.
Honestly, the main issue for your battery is heat, and large drops or knocks. Try and keep it cool and never let it die on you!

You don't need to do anything special, just use it. One thing you should definitely not do is completely discharge the battery though. You should also refrain from keeping the device connected to a charger once it's reached full charge, keeping the battery at peak voltage decreases the long-term battery life. Here's a couple of really helpful articles:
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/do_and_dont_battery_table

Just a point of info: Phone batteries don't LET you completely discharge. Once your phone shuts down (afer running "out" of battery, the battery still has some level of charge left.

l_stevens said:
Just a point of info: Phone batteries don't LET you completely discharge. Once your phone shuts down (afer running "out" of battery, the battery still has some level of charge left.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is right, but if you continue to power the device on in order to drain it more you'll cause problems. It's virtually impossible to completely drain one of these batteries, it actually powers down at something like 50% of its true capacity, because if it gets much lower than this it can cause irreparable damage. If you do somehow manage to drain one of these batteries past that magical point (by the methods I described above), it will simply not power on again because there's a minimum amount of voltage required.

Interesting. I normally charge my devices while I sleep so when I wake up they are fully charged. Once I'm up I'm ready to go and have a full charge not wake up to charge the device and wait for it to reach capacity idk. I haven't had any issues in any phone I've had while charging it while I sleep at night
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

Cleva1 said:
Interesting. I normally charge my devices while I sleep so when I wake up they are fully charged. Once I'm up I'm ready to go and have a full charge not wake up to charge the device and wait for it to reach capacity idk. I haven't had any issues in any phone I've had while charging it while I sleep at night
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It just basically reduces the capacity of the battery over time. I charge in the evening before bed, it only drops a couple of percent overnight thanks to doze.

Heisenberg said:
It just basically reduces the capacity of the battery over time. I charge in the evening before bed, it only drops a couple of percent overnight thanks to doze.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
With my Nexus like now I'm in bed with 77% battery, I'm usually on my device until I fall asleep, my BlackBerry has great standby time. With doze, I don't lose much battery if any and since the phone recharges so fast. I'm rarely "dead" enough to warrant me charging it while I sleep like say my note four etc. But this is food for thought in regards to charging
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk