Database Users

Piracy Crackdown!

Anybody else received this?? I'm assuming this is going out to all members of their forum and thought I would post it here.
Hmmm... I can foresee servers crashing from the massive flow of posts from people crying about all their bricked PPC's.
From: Pocket PC Live! [[email protected]]
ATTN: Piracy users
It has come to our attention that our software has been cracked just like every other software. We take this issues very seriously.
If you are NOT using the pirated version, you can skip this mail to save your time. or if you want to know more about our brains, keep reading..
We are teaming up with many developers to implement a module in our softwares that will cross check our applications for pirated versions in your device. For example: Software1 checks for Software2' pirated version and for exchange software2 checks for software1. If a pirated version has been detected, the module will force the device to Bootloader mode and makes it not to return for ever! We have made it in a way that the module functions in a separate thread and so there will be no slow-ing of device during the check process and the complete check process takes just less than 2 secs benchmarked on a standard 416Mhz Intel Xscale processor. This check might also be skipped as well by the crackers, but they first need to know which application checks for which and unfortunately those details will definitely be kept confidential by us(developers).
SO if you are using pirated versions, delete them before you loose your $400 device on spaing a few 10$. we will not be responsible if the device gets forced to Bootloader and turned to a heavy brick! You cannot even re-flash the device We have taken every step in the module to not disturb the safe versions and detect the pirated versions alone perfectly! Its rather a simple and easy process though.
This technology has been developed by CartyStudios, Inc. and is getting good view and publicity for us among the developer's world. Very soon every software going to implement this modules of exchange check technology. Pirated users, face the end very soon!
*Exchange Check Technology - Copyright CartyStudios Inc. | *Patents pending
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

Sounds awesome.
I can't wait to sue them like how Sony was sued over their DRM/CD fiasco that could "crash" a computer.
Ah, it's great to be an American. We'll sue everyone. lol

this is _INSANITY_
No developer in their right mind would do something like that.
1. this is illegal to do.
2. what if the software error occured and someone got into this trouble by mistake in software/ error/ etc
3. people who use pirated software would never buy legitimate copy anyway. so they are immediatelly discounted.
4. one should understand that if developer is ready to destroy someone's property to protect his own copyrighted material, deserves the worst. bottom line is: this is not likely to be the case.

SecureGSM said:
this is _INSANITY_
No developer in their right mind would do something like that.
1. this is illegal to do.
2. what if the software error occured and someone got into this trouble by mistake in software/ error/ etc
3. people who use pirated software would never buy legitimate copy anyway. so they are immediatelly discounted.
4. one should understand that if developer is ready to destroy someone's property to protect his own copyrighted material, deserves the worst. bottom line is: this is not likely to be the case.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Gee, wonder what will become of the world, if everyone starts taking justice into their own hands.

Sounds like a scare tactic.. they would get sued pretty fast. What if it wrongly detects a pirated copy? There was a developer who did something like this before, and he was stopped pretty fast.

Maybe in Europe or America, where most of the people using Original software...but not in Thailand/indonesia/and china , where 70% people still using pirated software.. :
BTW no offense to ppl who are staying there, i just pointing to BSA finding ....
thanks

I think the whole announcement is strange:
1) If you do go to such length to protect your software, why would you want to tell the whole world how you do it. For a good hacker the knowledge that the protection runs in different thread and messes with the device is sufficient to find and crack it, and the fact that different software check each other doesn't matter. (Just another clue what to look for).
2) This would be useless if someone uses only one pirated software. Who will check it?
3) This is next to impossible to implement. To prevent reflashing you need to corrupt the bootloader and this is different for every device. Still, theoretically possible but this is more work than MS puts in to windows protection (and for a 10$ piece of software???)
4) If I were considering buying their product I definitely wouldn't after reading this announcement. What user in their right mind would pay for something that due to an error could kill his device?
No I am not in support of piracy, and I think that anyone who uses cracked software basically makes a choice to risk destruction of his equipment be it from viruses or protection module.
Any way I suspect they dug their own whole with this so if this is true it won't be around for long.

It's impossible they think all this seriously. They will get sued really hard.
See the following three threads on a simlar case:
http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=37285
http://discussion.brighthand.com/showthread.php?t=212006
http://discussion.brighthand.com/showthread.php?t=212067

The degree of piracy protection depends on the amount of work the author puts in or on his intelligence. Resorting to this just shows a lack in one of those areas.

Great, a breakdown handphone is a good excuse to buy another new phone! ;-)
This will get those guys to be sue if their software has bug especially those without warning on their web and during installation (legally the developers must provide warning) especially in Europe & US. They will be sue to their pants drop. The developers will pay a bomb for the protection technology and collect peanuts from their software (as no body will buy) and pay hell of legal fee when sue. Commercially does not sounds good.
Of course piracy is wrong.
I think a better way is to just delete the pirated software used, not the whole PPC software. This will be Win-Win situation and commercially more feasible. Delete the whole PPC software is action same as people who writes Virus, exactly no difference.
A good example is one of my Legal software, which on the web say able to upgrade with the old Code, but unfortunately when my Code is keyed, it still say "Unregistered Version". A quick check via email with their technical support, the same answer that I old version code can be used. Conclusion is I give up the new version and reverse back to my old version.
My 2 cents worth.

I have heard that law enforcement agencies have teamed up with car manufacturers. The built in GPS devices of new cars will autocheck your speed according to TeleAtlas maps and if you exceed the speed limit by more than 10%, the car will selfdestruct. No need to complain about your car being destroyed, because you brought it upon yourself by speeding!
What a bunch of... Don't believe that mail, some jokester is just having a bit of fun, that's all

i think this has just happened due to their software(UTA3) nowadays cracked
it seems like they are trying to make people afraid of

This is bollocks. Carty's software is freely available on IRC.
But every programmer that makes software has to be live to the fact that if it can be run on a CPU, it can be disassembled. If it can be disassembled, it can be reversed.
If any manufacturer warns you that they'll trash your hardware because of piracy, I'll show them the laws of trespass, tort, criminal damage and the various laws enthusiastically enacted across the globe to prevent malicious hacking and criminal damage, even if it is committed by self-appointed vigilante software manufacturers. Patent pending or no.
Class actions a-hoy boys . I'll happily take on your case.
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http://www.boingboing.net/2006/11/22/audio_from_xbox_hack.html
V

Yeah total BS.

I keep hearing "piracy is wrong". I just don't belive that. If I was born eating fruit and living in trees I would knock the next monkey over to get the bannana - I was however born into this high tech world where certain tools and information are just as important. Any person smart enough to obtain what they need should do so, its up to the vendor to either prevent it in code or make the product less attractive to hack because of demos, basic versions or versions with some disabled functionality being freely available.
Even if it is moraly wrong, piracy can't be beat. There are millions of geeks/programmers around the world with too much time on their hands and the desire to hack and share.

lol.. monkeys and bannanas.. ROFL

No Comment!!!
Lol

I assume this message alone could ruin their business seriously. As they started developing on a magician they might found out a way to destroy the bootloader & maybe from some other devices. But why would I want to install software with such a risk of malfunction anyway, if it were true? To hard-reset it when some thief puts in a different sim as mine?
Maybe we find out the truth about this in the near future, but in the mean time I take pity on them

You know, this thread reminded me of an old Russian saying. It is roughly translated like this:
"Locks are for honest people.", meaning there is nothing that can't be cracked / hacked / broken in to.

levenum, very smart sayng

bogous microsoft letter info

According to tweakers.net (dutch), a very popular and more important, trustworthy Dutch IT website.
XDA-Developers (And thus also Duttythroy.net) breaches intellectual property laws regarding ROM Cooking.
However Microsoft and HTC both agree "We can't live with 'em and we can't live without 'em."
Microsoft will not send take down orders to sites such as XDA-Developers, who offer customized ROMs for windows-mobile telephone.
Some sites offering ROMs based on Windows Mobile 6.5 got take down orders last week. They, However, appeared to be hoax.
“Taking action against sites such as XDA-Developers isn’t a matter of concern for Microsoft” says Maarten Sonneveld of Microsoft Netherlands against tweakers.net. “What happens there, the modifying of ROMs, is illegal. The intellectual property however is not with us. The ROMs are intellectual property of the producers of the phone or the mobile phone providers if it concerns branded telephones. We simple only deliver the OS.”
The biggest producer of Windows Mobile-phones, HTC, also says they don’t have any plans to take action against ROM sites. “What happens there isn’t allowed” says HTC Benelux-CEO Mark Moons,
“But XDA-Developers is the biggest and most active community of Windows Mobile-developers. We can’t live with ‘em and we can’t live without ‘em.”
Last week it seemed there were to come an end to tolerating Windows Mobile-communities.
A certain ‘James Young’ sent emails on behalf of Microsoft to site managers in which he stated that they were sharing illegal content, and summoned them to stop their practices; some site managers, in fact, did this.
It mostly concerned ROMs with betas of Windows Mobile 6.5, the update of Microsoft’s Mobile OS that should appear this summer.
The email of Young appeared, however, to be a hoax.
Microsoft denied against XDA-Developers that the summoning came from them, they also say that the email address is incorrect and that summons such as these always are sent by written letters instead of email. Not so long ago someone with the exact same email address and name sent the same kind of emails to sites that, according to him, placed illegal content for the Xbox. The Pirate Bay also received a message by ‘James Young’ in the past.
Aside from this: a funny fact is that recently Arne, when he still was on our team, contacted Microsoft and HTC concerning this very issue as we were wondering the legal status of sharing ROMs.
He however didn't receive any clear answer even though he called a zillion times and emailed to infinity, twice.
source: translated with google

so, HTC and Microsoft have acknowledged that they can't really stop us as that would pretty much halt independent development for Windows Mobile... i'd say that's a good thing

disillusionment
really microsoft is big company,but in this behaviors it will be smallest in eyes of thier system users and developers.
So small comment to microsoft (go to hell) u did not stop the developing & progression in the world.

Commercial facts
As I understand the info shared by Nemonique...
The matter of bann this develops... is concerned by the brand... but... this makes people buy devices... cause at last... the business is sell devices.. no matter if it has the shipped version X.XXXXXXXXXXXXX or the Last upgrade Y:YYYYYYYYYYYYYYY, it does´t matter they buy the OS original and upload to their devices... the upgrading modding and sharing is responsability of the user... they lost his warranty by unlocking... the business is to sell devices.
I think this ends on summer... so... provide links here is risky... pirate bay has almost closed cause the GUB on swed has told them "if you search on that site we bann you from Internet providers..." so the user at the end is the responsable.

homam_france said:
really microsoft is big company,but in this behaviors it will be smallest in eyes of thier system users and developers.
So small comment to microsoft (go to hell) u did not stop the developing & progression in the world.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Uhh, I really advise you to read the OP again..
Microsoft is NOT to blame, it was a moron IMPERSONATING MS.
Please refrain from bashing Microsoft, or we will be forced to invoke your right to use a WinMo device and will convict you to use an iPhone
BTW You are free to post ANY ROM (provided they don't contain warez).
They won't be removed (until a true complaint from MS or HTC arrives).
Regards,
EquinoXe

now, i understand more the letter, but did this process is useful for them?they couldn`t stop any one,but only the websites will be the victim.
or there is the enycripitation or the hidden will works,they try to build illegal world by thier legal stuff.
sorry, but it is really disapointed matter.

homam_france said:
now, i understand more the letter, but did this process is useful for them?they couldn`t stop any one,but only the websites will be the victim.
or there is the enycripitation or the hidden will works,they try to build illegal world by thier legal stuff.
sorry, but it is really disapointed matter.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
HTC themselves said it: We can't live with 'em, and we can't live without 'em !
In other words: They're not going to do anything since any Action against this site will seriously harm the Windows Mobile Community.
So, as the-equinoxe said, as long as your ROM does not contain warez, you can post it here, and download the ROMs of others as well without fearing a reprimand for it...

the-equinoxe said:
Uhh, I really advise you to read the OP again..
Microsoft is NOT to blame, it was a moron IMPERSONATING MS.
Please refrain from bashing Microsoft, or we will be forced to invoke your right to use a WinMo device and will convict you to use an iPhone
BTW You are free to post ANY ROM (provided they don't contain warez).
They won't be removed (until a true complaint from MS or HTC arrives).
Regards,
EquinoXe
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So, being this said, why not remove the fake email's posted on Sun_Dream's thread, and perhaps, if there is a way, restore all the info that was deleted, to show appreciation for his work. I think that would be the best way to apologize for the action taken(which at the time was justified based on the unknown/unconfirmed veracity of those emails, and as a precaution to protect XDA), and welcome back Sun_Dream.(not that he was banned, but we all know how uncomfortable he must have felt.

Well i want just to comment the legitimacy of rom modifying. It is illegal but noone cares. Microsoft cares about leaked betas but not too much as you see - they can afford few leaks here and there, but they can not afford to loose such large community of beta tersters and developers (a massive feedback for roms and devices) - and it is for free for them so thats why they do not care. Microsoft takes money for licensing their mobile OS to OEM manifacturers and Operators. One as these OEM manifacturers is HTC, their reason to not care is that forums like xda-developers makes them popular - free advertising - if they cut the rom upgrades and ban rom cooking they risk bad advertising and sales drop, why they should loose money instead of making them ?! Also some other phone manifacturers have turned to WM - SonyEricsson, Samsung (with OMNIA series, the other ones were crap) they feel whats happening and they want a piece of the pie . Why mobile operators do not care ? Well they buy some licenses for their branded devices and in most cases the mnifacturer makes the rom and the operator makes the customization. No one takes measures because in the long run it will harm their profits.
Someone may ask: Why it is illegal i have license for my device? - The license is for one and only one version of Windows mobile + upgrades of the same version. You may upgrade to new WM major version only if your OEM or Operator offer you a upgrade.
So we @ xda-developers make things which operators and OEMs will not do, this makes people happy and Microsoft is happy because of rapid growing popularity of windows mobile (more popularity = more profits), OEM's are happy about the popularity of their devices so everyone is happy
I am really sleepy so please excuse me if i have any typos or misstakes

So, I guess this infamous internet investigator was a hoax after all, huh? I guess it did sound a little far fetched that M$ would hire someone and would give him/her a dumbas$ title like that.
In any case, I completely agree with xplode's statement. M$ doesn't necessarily make much advertising on their WM platforms and equipment manufacturers don't spend that much money on advertising their stuff either. In fact, HTC is just beginning to have some sort of advertising (public kind like TV commercials and such) in the US. I gotta be honest, if it wasn't for this site, I would not know that HTC ever made anything beyond the Wallaby, which BTW I didn't know was manufactured by HTC until I nearly bricked it and found this site.
Just think about this for a second. Think about the number and size of forums and blogs dedicated to WM vs iPhone, Symbian, and BlackBerry. And now compare that to the money spent in advertising of the same devices. More than likely, Apple would top the charts in spending since everyone out there was literally brainwashed by the iPhone's outstanding marketing campaign. The Blackberry has always been out there somewhat competing with WM, but due to the lack of interest of freelance developers out there for these devices, they have had to dump big chunks of cash into advertising.
To put things more into perspective, think about how the announcements by HTC show up in this site right after being made by them. Normally, within a few hours the WM communities will get winds of new devices coming this way... which is, for lack of a better term, free advertising. They create a big expectation among seasoned users and new comers alike. Some of them, even willing to dump large sums of money on the new devices even though theirs are only a few months old. For this same reason, (and once again, I agree with xplode) shutting us (and other communities down) would be like cutting an arm. Plus, they don't pay us, so what's the harm?
Aside from all that, M$ understand that not everyone will have money to upgrade devices as they are released, but if the customer is kept happy, he/she is more likely to be a returning customer when his/her situation allows. So, let them keep their betas and their leaks.
All in all, kudos to M$ and HTC for understanding our role in this game. And as far as James "Jacka$$" Young, go kill yourself... you and people like you are the reason why the internet has a bad rep these days.
EGZ

markanthonypr said:
So, being this said, why not remove the fake email's posted on Sun_Dream's thread, and perhaps, if there is a way, restore all the info that was deleted, to show appreciation for his work. I think that would be the best way to apologize for the action taken(which at the time was justified based on the unknown/unconfirmed veracity of those emails, and as a precaution to protect XDA), and welcome back Sun_Dream.(not that he was banned, but we all know how uncomfortable he must have felt.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for bringing this into attention.
As there where many threads "purged" by the site admins (who are the ones who deal with the copyright cases), I have no idea which posts in which threads all need to be restored.
I have seen some of sun_dreams work I and I was impressed (and that is a difficult thing to achieve).
They deserve to be restored. (So I just restored the one containing the letter myself)
Please use the
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button in the threads to report those threads who have wrongly been purged but not yet repaired, so the mods can repair those threads where possible.
Use a text like "Please restore this 6.5 ROM post which was a victim of the James Young hoax, but was not yet repaired" to let us mods and the admins know why you are reporting a thread.
In regards to these threads, please have some patience, it was a big task to purge them, unpurging is sometimes even more difficult.
Especially for a poor mod
Regarding this thread: I can safely say that your complaints have been heard and are acted upon.
Please report other threads/post regarding the 6.5 ROMs using the above mentioned method so all the mods and the admins are notified, not only the few who read this thread.
That is why I close this thread: to make sure that every report get it's fair hearing, and not only by the few who read this thread.
With Kind Regards,
EqX

lets get the kernel source

Htc must release the source in a timely matter, not just for us, but all devices out, and future ones coming. The best way to do this imo is not to start a big fire and smoke them out per say, but to go though proper channels. Obviously emailing them is having no effect, 120 days is not timely, I mean in 120 days this device will be outdated technically.
Imo this is the proper channel: http://gpl-violations.org/faq/violation-faq.html
Go there, read their page and then email them. Here is the letter I sent to the. Subject, "htc again, this time the vision" :
"I just wanted to bring to your attention that htc is in violation of the gpl again. As I'm sure your aware from other devices they released, ie desire, they are not releasing kernel source codes in a timely manner. In the case of the desire it has been over 3 months and to my knowledge is still not released, however my complaint today is about the htc vision, known in the usa as the G2. This product was offically released on oct. 6 2010, with no source code available. When contacted about it, they said it will be 90-120 days before its available. Maybe I'm wrong, but as my interpertations of the gpl this is unacceptable. Since the product is commerically available, then surely the source code is, and just being held back purposely.
Thank you for your help!
Keep open source open!"
edit: 4:45 pm est 10-09-10
here is their response:
"We heard you. In fact, we got the message seven times
We have already been in contact with HTC and they have heard the message
loud and clear. I have no idea when it will be fixed though
armijn"

fastludeh22 said:
Htc must release the source in a timely matter, not just for us, but all devices out, and future ones coming. The best way to do this imo is not to start a big fire and smoke them out per say, but to go though proper channels. Obviously emailing them is having no effect, 120 days is not timely, I mean in 120 days this device will be outdated technically.
Imo this is the proper channel: http://gpl-violations.org/faq/violation-faq.html
Go there, read their page and then email them. Here is the letter I sent to the. Subject, "htc again, this time the vision" :
"I just wanted to bring to your attention that htc is in violation of the gpl again. As I'm sure your aware from other devices they released, ie desire, they are not releasing kernel source codes in a timely manner. In the case of the desire it has been over 3 months and to my knowledge is still not released, however my complaint today is about the htc vision, known in the usa as the G2. This product was offically released on oct. 6 2010, with no source code available. When contacted about it, they said it will be 90-120 days before its available. Maybe I'm wrong, but as my interpertations of the gpl this is unacceptable. Since the product is commerically available, then surely the source code is, and just being held back purposely.
Thank you for your help!
Keep open source open!"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No offense, but perhaps you should have someone proofread your letter first. There are a number of grammatical errors in there. If you're posting in the boards, people just don't care, but YOU should care if you're sending a letter that is supposed to be accepted as intelligent and factual.
I can't stress this enough. I know a guy that does AMAZING web-design, but never gets hired(without me as an intermediary anyways) because his grammar and spelling is horrible. He miss-spells every other word, uses many words out of context, and rarely uses proper punctuation and capitalization.
This is not a rant and rave, but if you'd like a regulatory entity to take you seriously, it's in your best interest to put your best foot forward and proofread.
Sorry if this comes off as 'complainy', but if you're going to represent a community as a whole, i.e. xda or developers entirely, just do so gracefully.

InGeNeTiCs said:
No offense, but perhaps you should have someone proofread your letter first. There are a number of grammatical errors in there. If you're posting in the boards, people just don't care, but YOU should care if you're sending a letter that is supposed to be accepted as intelligent and factual.
I can't stress this enough. I know a guy that does AMAZING web-design, but never gets hired(without me as an intermediary anyways) because his grammar and spelling is horrible. He miss-spells every other word, uses many words out of context, and rarely uses proper punctuation and capitalization.
This is not a rant and rave, but if you'd like a regulatory entity to take you seriously, it's in your best interest to put your best foot forward and proofread.
Sorry if this comes off as 'complainy', but if you're going to represent a community as a whole, i.e. xda or developers entirely, just do so gracefully.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well, you are right. maybe i shouldnt have done it lying in bed from my phone. so do US a favor and send a better one...
when re-reading it, i noticed 1 run on sentence. could you point out the other errors for me so i can improve my writing skills...

Mistakes marked as bold, corrections in parentheses. Also, some word changes made to make it sound like an adult wrote it
I just wanted to bring to your attention that htc is in violation of the gpl again. Formal letters to companies should begin "To Whom It May Concern: As I'm sure your (you're) aware from other devices they have released, ie (i.e.) desire (the Desire), they are not releasing (htc has not been releasing) kernel source codes in a timely manner. In the case of the desire (Desire,) it has been over 3 months (since the device was released) and to my knowledge is still not released, (and, to my knowledge, the kernel remains unreleased.) however my complaint today (However, my complaint today) is about (in regards to) the htc vision (Vision), known in the usa (USA) as the G2. This product was offically (officially) released on oct. 6 2010 (Oct. 6, 2010), with no source code available. When contacted about it (contacted regarding this), they (htc) said (that) it will (would) be 90-120 days before its (the code [or source code] is made) available. Maybe (perhaps) I'm wrong (mistaken), but(,) as my interpertations of the gpl according to my interpretation of GPL,) this is unacceptable. Since the product is commerically available, then surely the source code is, and just being held back purposely. (Horrible closing sentence and "commercially" is misspelled and I believe you meant "purposefully")
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

damn, i guess thats why i was always better at math, lol. i should have re-read it before sending it half asleep, but enough with the excuses. i see your point and that does sound better, HOWEVER, guess it was good enough for them, here is their response...
*also thanks to whoever else has sent, or will be sending emails to the proper channels
"We heard you. In fact, we got the message seven times
We have already been in contact with HTC and they have heard the message
loud and clear. I have no idea when it will be fixed though
armijn"

great idea -- sent this (edited and worded in my way, dont give a **** if its grammertikally inkorrect) from 6 gmails 3 yahoos 1 hotmail, one rocketmail, an earthlink, a comcast and a tmo.mail. and my law firm email, and just for hell, I faxed off a few to HTC Tmobile and to Apache on law firm letterhead (basic courtesy of notification) that how pissed i am -- this phone should have been delivered to us with first option after initial boot
"Hello dear customer, would you like to void your warranty right now and proceed to data wipe of our clunky bloaty bull****!!!!"
arrrgh

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i'm sorry,i just had to

Wow...
That's all I really have to say about this thread...
Sent from my HTC Vision

"To whom it may pertain to...
Just purchased a HTC T-mobile G2 aka HTC Vision and have been a avid HTC supporter for quite sometime. Ever since I owned my first HTC device the codenamed blueangel. The fact that HTC would work with the developer community pulled me toward your devices. I can't believe you guys (HTC) would lock down the successor to the device that helped you start the "open" revolution. I know it was most probably T-mobile that made you do it but that is besides the point. Especially since they have blamed you in the press. You have spit it the face of the developer community and shame on you and T-mobile. This protection will be broken I have no doubt of that but the fact that HTC put it there at all is what is in question. Please don't make this a race of protection...hack...protection...hack. OPEN means we should work together not against each other. So please do the right thing and help us either root these devices or give us the kernel source to help us along. Or even better do both of the above and show you respect the dev community like we all thought you did. Below I have included the first post of a stream that will become a torrent against HTC from the XDA devs.
Thanks for your cooperation."
Message I just sent HTC with a copy of the first post here. Don't care about grammar and neither will they if they receive enough complaints. We get enough people involved in this and it gets engadget or another blogs attention then maybe they will listen. This might be our only option considering the thinktank threads have gotten kinda quiet.

We cannot comment on whether or not HTC has blocked any customer from rooting or hacking their phone.
Rooting the phone may open the phone up to virus attacks and other un-secure activities, as well as introduce intended functionality, and as such is very difficult for us to support.
We cannot comment on whether or not HTC, Google, or T-Mobile has blocked any customer from rooting or hacking their phone.
All three companies work very closely to bring you the best experience on the phone possible.
I do understand how important it is to be able to use your device to the best of its capabilities.
We are not withholding the kernel; we are currently working through the legal channels that we must go through to make the kernel available to you. Each product is individually under review.
When the kernel is available, you will be able to find it on developer.htc.com. I apologize for any inconvenience you may have experienced, and thank you for your patience in this matter.
You can contact HTC Technical Support via telephone by calling 866.449.8658 between 6AM – 1AM EST, seven days a week.
To send a reply to this message or let me know I have successfully answered your question log in to our ContactUs site using your email address and your ticket number 10USCW42ENA000115.
Sincerely,
Sarah
HTC
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That was a quick generic response. boo...hiss...

My reply to HTC
I understand the position of HTC to not comment on the situation at hand even though it has already been outed in the press by T-mobile that HTC did indeed lock the phone. So either you are saying that the T-mobile press release was a hoax and HTC did nothing with write protection or HTC just want's the problem to go away. As far as not wanting us to root because of unsafe activities.... Well I don't even know where to start with that comment. We are all big boys and girls and can handle the effect of our actions. It's like saying Toyota installed a system in my car that will only let a certified technician open the hood because I may insert washer fluid into the engine instead of oil. Most companies would love it if you would void your warranty. Does it not lead to less operating cost for HTC in the long run to not support it's products because the warranties are void? You don't want me to void my warranty then do as the GPS companies do and make a disclaimer that I have to read and agree to before I go any further. Also on the subject of voiding warranties did HTC not say that G2 had 4gb's of internal storage? Yet only 1.2gb are available for use because of this lock? Back to the car analogies. If Ford says your car has 200 horse power in the brochure and (AFTER!!!!) you buy it you learn that only 50 horse power is unlocked you might be a little angry. No? I understand the position of all big companies is to play dumb until something either is forgotten or legal channels make them play smart but I do have to say that I did not expect this out of HTC. This post isn't directed at you Sarah but merely my G2 and thousands of others crippled devices. If you could pass this and my prior message to someone higher up that might at least read it and think it over it would be greatly appreciated.
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Evo ex DEV “TrevE” Hit With Cease & Desist new update CIQ has thrown in the flag :)

Evo ex DEV “TrevE” Hit With Cease & Desist new update CIQ has thrown in the flag
For a refresher, back in October a user over at the XDA forums came across a major security flaw on HTC devices which allowed for the tracking and recording of every use of your phone through certain app permissions. Since then, HTC released pressers that acknowledged the issue and that they would have fixes. Better yet, they said that no data had been stolen by any users and that HTC’s people were on the case to fix the problem. Unfortunately, nothing ever seems to end on a good note.
After his initial findings, research then led Trevor Eckhart to CarrierIQ. That company, has now issued a cease and desist to the Mr. Eckhart for the research he published on their software. CarrierIQ claims that “TrevE” reproduced copyrighted Training Material and made “false allegations” about their software’s purposes. And this is not just a slight slap on the wrist. CarrierIQ wants Mr. Eckhart to issue a formal announcement that shows that what CarrierIQ is doing is completely normal, and is in no way a vulnerability to users.
It’s almost scary to read these C&D letters as if you are the person it is addressed to. Of course, if Mr. Eckhart does not stop his research and retract all previous posts and articles showing CarrierIQ’s software at work, then there will be legal ramifications. Luckily, there is a good shot at the good guys coming out on top. Echkhart reached out to the EFF (Electronic Frontier Foundation) for legal counsel and they feel that CarrierIQ’s claims are pretty much bologna.
We have now had a chance to review your allegations against our client, and have concluded that they are entirely baseless. Mr. Eckhart used and made available these materials in order to educate consumers and security researchers about the functionality of your software, which he believes raises substantial privacy concerns. Mr. Eckhart’s legitimate and truthful research is sheltered by both the fair use doctrine and the First Amendment.
I have felt that Eckhart’s research was for the greater good of the consumer and was most definitely just a,”Hey, watch out for this type of thing,” then an actual attack on CarrierIQ. I could be wrong, but I feel that the research done was in good heart. What do you all think? Will the first amendment save this guy from an ugly court hearing?
Source:http://www.droid-life.com/2011/11/2...esist-for-researching-security-vulnerability/
*UPDATE* there is a online petition please if u support reve go sign it
http://www.change.org/petitions/your-phone-is-collecting-data-about-you
*update* Carrier IQ withdraws 'misguided' cease-and-desist letter, apologizes to security advocate TrevE by Phil Nicki
Source: http://www.androidcentral.com/carri...ogizes-security-advocate-treve?style_mobile=0

So he finds a big security flaw that exposes every HTC phone and they wanted him not to say anything bull**** HTC

Reminds me of Sony BMG and their distribution of XCP and MediaMax rootkits they distributed on millions CDs in 2005 and wanted everything hush..hush..made excuses and so on.
Just part of the reason they paid a heavy price recently.

I back trev 1000%. These big companies thought they could be dirty and get away with it. I believe they knew what they were doing and did it on purpose thinking that the normal dumb user would never find out about it. So when someone brighter than them figures it out and releases it for the masses to read and see for themselves they get all worried and try to use scare tactics to cover up their illegal activity. If you ask me i believe trev should go to court and expose them for the crooks they r.

We may have to start taking up a legal fee fund for Trevor. Go Trev go!
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk

I have felt that Eckhart’s research was for the greater good of the consumer and was most definitely just a,”Hey, watch out for this type of thing,” then an actual attack on CarrierIQ. I could be wrong, but I feel that the research done was in good heart. What do you all think? Will the first amendment save this guy from an ugly court hearing?
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I agree, I feel his research has been for the greater good and education of
the end users of these products, and not just the HTC users. I assume that
this kind of software is on every smartphone, regardless of manufacturer or
operating system.
I don't even directly blame CarrierIQ for their spyware. I blame the carriers
themselves. They're just providing a service that the carriers all want, and
the carriers are basically bullying the manufacturers into installing this crap
into the devices. I don't think any of the manufacturers would willingly spend
their time and resources to install, configure, test, and debug these types of
applications and services if the carriers didn't 'require' it in the first place.
Not saying that any of the above are really innocent, but, blame should start
at the source. CarrierIQ's business model and product would definitely be
different if the carriers didn't create the demand in the first place.
I'll support TrevE any way I can.

The first amendment is quite limited by other laws that cover it. Imagine a mess of papers on a desk, the desk is the first amendment, which is obvious to anyone that is in the room, but each paper obscures the desk more and more, making it harder to clarify what the desk really looks like.... Sure there is the desk, black and white, but this "desk" is on the WORLD WIDE WEB, which, consequentially can make this a very, very controversial case.. As for CarrierIQ.... that was also found on my old Samsung Epic 4G and there have been roms that disable it since early this year out for it... There was even a huge post explaining what CarrierIQ is... so when I saw it here on the EVO 4G forums, I wasn't surprised. However, this lawsuit does surprise a lot... The "Ex DEV" as you say could come up on top... if he has enough funding, because he is RIGHT to do what he did... but whether its legal or not... thats another question. Just because something is legal, doesn't mean it's right.

looks like CIQ is trying to say there not any harm to our phones bull**** http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ofHr8Lv5cNk&feature=youtube_gdata_player

auau465121 said:
looks like CIQ is trying to say there not any harm to our phones bull**** http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ofHr8Lv5cNk&feature=youtube_gdata_player
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Lmfao comments r disabled for the video. Go figure they don't want to be called out even more

Papa Smurf151 said:
Lmfao comments r disabled for the video. Go figure they don't want to be called out even more
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Yeah they were smart about that cause I was definitely going to let them have it
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk

auau465121 said:
Yeah they were smart about that cause I was definitely going to let them have it
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk
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Yeah me too. Little ****s

The **** there doing to him is making them seem even more shady. They want him to stop because he prob hasn't even scratched the surface. I hope he uncovers the real story behind their bull****. I'm sending them a nice message rite now.

Watched the video and eye movement alone told me alot
Article on what it alledgedly does and collection process

devnulldroid said:
Watched the video and eye movement alone told me alot
Article on what it alledgedly does and collection process
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I watched the video and I agree with you, the eye contact made it seem like they're full of it!
They should of hired Tom Hanks or something, maybe I would of believed them..haha
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I'm all for that, wondering the same thing myself.
BuddaBelly said:
We may have to start taking up a legal fee fund for Trevor. Go Trev go!
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk
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Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App

online petition please go sign and support treve

Signed away. Ive talked to Trev a couple of times. Sux what is going on!!! Wish I was lawyer and help him and give full support.

OTA IP and other info is 204.235.122.129 along with More info

Null
auau465121 said:
online petition please go sign and support treve
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App

Joshmccullough said:
URL?
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
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It's in the first post labeled update
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App

Developer Edition Community Stretch Goals

*This thread is about discussing the future of the Dev Edition as it pertains to the relationship between us and Samsung, and what we need from them. This thread will also contain official updates and information from my contacts at Samsung corporate.*
Ladies and gentlemen, I'm back home and able to respond again in regards to the DE situation. As you all know I had dedicated time to dealing with corporate on the matter of getting our phones in stock and working on other stretch goals such as software support. I told you all that Monday would be a good day but to be honest I had a feeling that we wouldn't have had our products shipped until Tuesday. I have a few ideas as to why this is the case, but more importantly I would like to emphasize and state something very important in regards to our participation in the developer program.
In all my dealings with the project managers and corporate wigs at Samsung I represented the cause on behalf of our community which no one there had heard of. I explained to them the importance and the legacy of XDA Developers, but most of all I made sure to tell them about the tight-knit community that helps each other out, the portal of people who band together in solidarity to raise support for developers, leaders, products. Most importantly I told them that not only does this credo bind us as a small group of users, but that the most important phone advancements come from communities like ours.
With that being said, we have a prime opportunity to make history by influencing their developer program in in a positive way. For that we need everyone to please be civil and respectful when dealing with Samsung customer service at the mobile accessories department. It is not their fault these phones were not ready to go out and they are willing to make it right. I say this as someone with an overnight order that not only didn't go out until today, but went out as ground shipping instead for Monday. There are hundreds of us, many calling in, and the last thing we need is to turn this into a clustercluck. The more positive we make this experience, the better.
I promised it would be a good holiday weekend with the Note 4 so take the time to enjoy it. The delay does push us back a bit on our goals. Tomorrow I will get to the bottom of this and hopefully get you an official explanation. Though we are delayed a bit, the volume of sales was larger than I expected initially which means that we now have a larger community. As one of "The First 40" from last month, we only had a couple of threads and not too much going on. I want to change that and so I will reach out to the mods and see if we can get our own space to collaborate and work together. This requires teamwork and participation as well as patience and a dash of happiness.
My contacts at Samsung see our numbers as leverage to get the things we really want, like support and original firmware as well as possible future updates. There's a lot riding on this so we can't mess it up. I can't delve into specifics about everything I've discussed with them but we may be looking at changing the way vendors officially view unlocked bootloaders and custom roms.
I've drawn up what in my experience is a good map of where to go from here with the product. If you have any input and information, this is the thread to add to the Developer Edition project pipeline. I can't believe we have to do the work for them and we aren't even paid for this, though someone's got to do it or else none of us are getting the full product experience we paid hundreds of dollars for.
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Any questions/concerns/goal ideas/requests here. This should be a good starting map of where to go from here. It is imperative that we all have our units, and we all have the safety net needed to not brick our units which is why Goal 2 is so important. Then we can go on to have custom ROMs. We'll need to collaborate but for now we will enjoy the device this week and figure out what you'd like to see out of the future with Samsung and the dev program.
Sincerely,
Virgil Woods

Reserved for Goal 1 Updates
Update 1: With a one day delay, many of us are getting the phones and it's now out of stock again. Great work, I doubt we will have an idea of when it will be back in stock until next week because of the holidays.
Please take a moment to answer this one question survey on whether you were able to order a DE or you want to and are waiting on the back-order. This will give us a good head count for demand.
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1uf...8JgFisXC4/viewform?c=0&w=1&usp=mail_form_link
Thank you.

Reserved for Goal 2 Updates

Reserved for Goal 3 Updates

How about a program similar to HTC? This would solve almost all problems without even having another sku..

I just looked over the HTC dev program, it's pretty simple and easy to implement something similar but on a smaller scope as a test. The only problem I see with Samsung rejecting the release of the files we need is that it could be used on non-DE models to make them DE editions as we noticed with the latest shipping. Remember, Samsung is still a business and not our buddies so they need a fiscal motivation to compete with HTC, which we've shown them with this high demand. So far they have been painfully ignorant of growing demands and I would attribute it to them not knowing how to properly implement/make money off of this.

I understand what you are saying but why have a developer edition period. If you are talking from a Fiscal standpoint, why does it matter who unlocks the bootloader. I guarantee that they lose sales to HTC because people want root. Nexus and HTC are gaining popularity as Samsung is losing popularity. Verizon and AT&T are losing sales and T-mobile is gaining sales.
People don't want to have to pay full retail when they can upgrade and unlock the retail version...
Here is another consideration, why should someone who pays full retail price for the retail version not be able to unlock the bootloader. It's not Samsung who owns the device... Samsung is greedy for the money... If you give the customer what they deserve that in itself will increase sales.
Why don't you pitch that idea to them. Give the consumer the choice, what Samsung has done was push away customers and make us Angry.. I applaud HTC, they did it right

Hi Virgil, here's a problem I see with your approach. Samsung knows all to well that the huge majority of people buying the Developer Edition of their phones are not developers. They are everyday users who are willing to pay the extra money for a phone they can install a custom recovery on and root. I don't know the statistics for sure, but I would bet that 98% of the Developer Edition Note 4 (for instance) sales have been generated by everyday users...not developers.
I've bought 3 developer devices from Samsung previously. With each previous purchase there was a questionnaire that you had to complete (obviously designed for developers) before your order would be processed. That questionnaire was/is not present in the sales "process" for the Note 4. A developer program is a great idea, but won't go far without real, no kidding developers.
If we want to give Samsung a reason to take our "developer community" serious then we need to find a whole lot of developers.

The whole developer thing is dumb...I own a Dev N3. You have to pay full retail for a device that will never get any updates or any stock firmware package to fall back on. Each dev bootloader has its own signature that is device specific, so there is no way to upgrade the bootloader without a dev specifically signing it to your device. I am running 4.4 Alliance build 2 on a 4.3 bootloader and because of that I have a few small quirks with youtube and bluetooth. Not a huge deal but it irks me.
Samsung should just allow you to have the choice to unlock your bootloader via fastboot at the cost of a voided warranty. Samsung once had the Smartphone market by the ballz. Now they are losing ground.

Sorry guys and girls we need to wait a few days for the Samsung internal team to decide upon the expansion of the developer program before we can begin to see any changes. I was told by the project director that there will be an internal meeting this week and our suggestions have been taken to account. I'm sorry I have nothing better for the community for now. I really want that original firmware most of all so we can begin developing.
Stay tuned and thanks again.
Sincerely,
Virgil Woods

VirgilWoods said:
Sorry guys and girls we need to wait a few days for the Samsung internal team to decide upon the expansion of the developer program before we can begin to see any changes. I was told by the project director that there will be an internal meeting this week and our suggestions have been taken to account. I'm sorry I have nothing better for the community for now. I really want that original firmware most of all so we can begin developing.
Stay tuned and thanks again.
Sincerely,
Virgil Woods
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Hi Virgil,
Just wanted to say "Thanks" for doing this. It's nice to hear updates from someone who actually does have some inside knowledge even if a particular update is just that we are being heard and more info may come later.

Yeahp THANK YOU

VirgilWoods said:
Sorry guys and girls we need to wait a few days for the Samsung internal team to decide upon the expansion of the developer program before we can begin to see any changes. I was told by the project director that there will be an internal meeting this week and our suggestions have been taken to account. I'm sorry I have nothing better for the community for now. I really want that original firmware most of all so we can begin developing.
Stay tuned and thanks again.
Sincerely,
Virgil Woods
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for your persistance, Virgil. If you can get them to release firmware for the Developer Edition Note 4 you will have promoted yourself from Liason to "The Man".