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I remember a while back when Google said that they were going to keep Android OS fragmentation at a minimum or I think it was not at all...
Yet along comes honeycomb a version of Android built specifically for tablets.
-Sigh-
What are your thoughts?
It's going to be very tricky to have tablets and phone with the same processing power, let alone have people wanting the same things from both.
I don't think it fragmentation at all, just a version built for tablets. I wouldn't want that on a phone <5".
I would like to see a source for that too because the whole point of the OS is for the carrier/manufacture to customize it. They are the ones that need to update faster.
fragmentation is heavy on android platform, let it be because of freedom of customization, lack of support from phone builder for updates, etc. No need to quote source, just read on it, there's plenty of info on that.
Well he said Google says but didn't give a source for it.
I know there are multiple versions out that are lower than AOSP, it's a fact. There are also features left out of recent iOS versions that are not available on older versions but because they have the same v# people don't seem to complain about it.
But there is ZERO reason to blame Google for not updating blur/touchwiz/sense when it is the Manufactures obligation to update the software with their skin.
Honeycomb has nothing to do with phones though. The OS is made specifically for tablets. Its like windows ce. Yea, its called windows, but because it only runs on smaller devices doesn't make windows fragmented. Same thing applies here. Honeycomb is specifically made for tablets.
The windows ce example is a bad one. Have u used a wall windows ce device (not windows mobile - ce/embedded edition windows)?
In any case as long as APIs are kept consistent there should not be any big problems.
The fragmentation is only problematic because of the way devices are supported, tbh...
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
Just wanted your opinions on which dev has the best Onskreen Cornerstone build right now. I have installed both CM9 and Eos i personally prefer Eos' build they are doing a great job with the dev so far. Great job on both roms though. And are there any other roms with OSCS built in these are the only two im aware of.
I can deal with the minor bugs I really couldn't see my TF without OSCS now im spoiled
I'd personally love a completely stock with cornerstone and stock buttons. I like the Asus quick panel and soundset
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using xda premium
I like the Team EOS better.
After using Cornerstone for a day, you cannot imagine life without it. I know the feeling.
jinsoku3g said:
I'd personally love a completely stock with cornerstone and stock buttons. I like the Asus quick panel and soundset
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using xda premium
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This is pretty much what I'm holding out for, a nice stock rom with cornerstone.
st0nedpenguin said:
This is pretty much what I'm holding out for, a nice stock rom with cornerstone.
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Which can't happen right now because we ain't got no source code yet.
i flashed back to ARHD to many bugs for me to use as daily (especially now with the dock) waiting for a good solid CS build screen swapping would be cool if they release the source for that (not likely soon)
Here is some important information from the CEO of Onskreen directly to Diane Hackborn of Google, I've not read this on this site, I was directed here after an email with consumer relations with Onskreen while asking if the window-swappng option was going to be re-implemented..their reply was basically "no, and here is why; read this comment" so here is what they said..
(my emphasis)
hansmeet sethi - I am the CEO of Onskreen and felt it was about time we weighed in on the public discussion. To start off with, we have been impressed by the level of discussion on this thread on the topic of compatibility. We take it very seriously and are glad that the rest of the community do as well.
+Dianne Hackborn - Thanks for sharing specific concerns and we can appreciate their gravity and the need for a dialogue. However, outside of the implementation details perhaps some background will help. Onskreen saw an obvious need in the UX of Android on larger screen devices (that is our business after all), and we worked to address that with Cornerstone. During the process, we have invested heavily to respect Android's intentions and compatibility of the Frameworks you helped build. When you get a chance to review the code, you will see that we went out of our way to not introduce app requirements, leverage the patterns already used, and treat running Applications in a way that they are oblivious to the Cornerstone experience. We rejected many features along the way to optimize for compatibility. The result is a product that we are proud of, respects the Android project, that the user and mod communities are excited about, and OEMs love. And frankly, once you use a tablet with multi-tasking there is no going back. We are the first to admit the product is not perfect, but was at a point where we felt comfortable sharing with the community to use, help improve and polish. We see the goal of this conversation as a way to come to an agreement on some of the aspects of Compatibility and deliver multi-tasking on Android.
Now - a few of your concerns:
- Orientation - Good points, and we spent a ton of time thinking through the UX here. Cornerstone adheres to the desired orientation of the Application running in the Main Panel (and rotation of the device). Cornerstone restricts the user from opening an app that won't support all orientations in the Cornerstone panel, so there is not a case where an app running there is forced into an orientation the app developer did not intend to run in (try opening Angry Birds in the Cornerstone and you will see this). There is more here but I will leave it at that for the time being.
- Screen size changes - You point out the complexity of a changing screen size on an app. We agree and this is the reason that swapping panels (applications moving from the main area to the cornerstone or vice versa) was removed from the product. Apps at this point just aren't enforced to consider this, so Cornerstone imposing it on them would be incompatible and we don't (although we all sorely miss the feature). One area we are still considering is the Config of the main app. Logically this should change when the user minimizes/maximizes the Cornerstone, however the implementation is not doing that because of compatibility issues it would introduce. To be fully compliant we are aware that we will may have to remove the ability to minimize/maximize the Cornerstone (we will miss that feature too). Perhaps you have some suggestions here?
- ProcessRecord/ActivityThread Configurations - As you mentioned, while the ActivityStack was refactored out during your exploration, other inherent dependencies on a static Configuration do still exist. Some interesting features could be enabled by expanding this, but we didn't make these changes so that the Cornerstone codebase could more easily be used in customized Android trees of OEMs and others, as well as perhaps in upcoming Android releases.
- CDD Compliance - We take this one very seriously and you bring up good points. However, our intention is that each area (the main panel and cornerstone panels) be designed as CDD compliant sizes. That is not fully the case in the .85 release that was open sourced. As we made the switch to v4.0.3_r1 and the 1280x800 reference device (Xoom), we haven't made all these changes yet. It may require that some of the panels in certain orientations run in a pseudo compatibility mode similar to how the Android OS supports legacy apps already so that their config is CDD compliant and the UX is optimized.
- CTS - One test in CTS calls for any Activity that doesn't have the focus to be moved to the paused state. This is obviously not the case in Cornerstone as Activities do stay resumed when not having the focus and still are visible on the screen. Google could ding Cornerstone for that and in truth they would be technically correct. However this would be silly considering the nature of the test when applied to a real multi-tasked environment. That is not our call however.
In short, we think about the same problems you do and we believe in the product as well as maintaining the integrity of Android applications and devices. You of all people can appreciate the complexity in working with the Android framework in the way we have to get Cornerstone built, and to call it a fork is doing the design and engineering effort that went into it a disservice. We see the point of AOSP and contributions like Cornerstone to create a dialogue, come to agreement and add great features to the platform. To that end, we are more than happy to continue this conversation. Some of us are in the bay area and happy to drop by Google if you prefer.
hansmeet.
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thats pretty cool but i will miss having the features im sure the community will implement our own twist on it though. to bad for the screen swapping though .
on a different note CM9 with cornerstone is moving along quite well a lot more stable ROM can i vote again lol
Cornerstone is just a placeholder for me until Windows 8 is released for tablets.
Definitely switching to Windows 8 unless Google adds to Android a comparable multitasking capability.
Just stock, I like stock ICS on TF101 (after reboot and pc connection issue removed...) and don't see any pro's in any other ROM for me...
Pretty much all of the concessions that they have or are discussing making to cornerstone are quickly removing the reason for having it at all. There are plenty of apps that already are not compatible with many devices and resolutions. Crippling a feature because you "can't" create new app requirements is silly. This is the area where google(and cornerstone) have the potential to destroy apple. As these devices get faster and bigger, you can't stick with the one app at a time paradigm.
I understand google is trying to remove the "fragmentation" but your OS can't evolve if that outweighs everything else.
gottahavit said:
Pretty much all of the concessions that they have or are discussing making to cornerstone are quickly removing the reason for having it at all. There are plenty of apps that already are not compatible with many devices and resolutions. Crippling a feature because you "can't" create new app requirements is silly. This is the area where google(and cornerstone) have the potential to destroy apple. As these devices get faster and bigger, you can't stick with the one app at a time paradigm.
I understand google is trying to remove the "fragmentation" but your OS can't evolve if that outweighs everything else.
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Google will add better multitasking to Android. They have to or they will lose to Windows 8.
Cornerstone is just not Google's answer to multitasking on Android. I bet Google has something better.
horndroid said:
Google will add better multitasking to Android. They have to or they will lose to Windows 8.
Cornerstone is just not Google's answer to multitasking on Android. I bet Google has something better.
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The problem with windows 8 is that a windows tablet will always cost 100 dollars more than the same android tablet. Add to that the fact that you'll have to re-buy all your apps for ARM or Metro and they have a tough battle ahead in the consumer market.
Personally I Find Metro totally annoying on my 17" laptop, I think Microsoft is having an identity crisis with windows 8. The last thing I want on my laptop is forced full screen apps. Honestly Metro is a little to Android(ish) for what I would want on a tablet once they get a little more powerful and have better rez.
EDIT: I should qualify this with the fact that I am a die hard windows fan, I LOVE windows 7, prefer coding for windows over any other OS EVER, and absolutely hate MAC OS.
gottahavit said:
The problem with windows 8 is that a windows tablet will always cost 100 dollars more than the same android tablet. Add to that the fact that you'll have to re-buy all your apps for ARM or Metro and they have a tough battle ahead in the consumer market.
Personally I Find Metro totally annoying on my 17" laptop, I think Microsoft is having an identity crisis with windows 8. The last thing I want on my laptop is forced full screen apps. Honestly Metro is a little to Android(ish) for what I would want on a tablet once they get a little more powerful and have better rez.
EDIT: I should qualify this with the fact that I am a die hard windows fan, I LOVE windows 7, prefer coding for windows over any other OS EVER, and absolutely hate MAC OS.
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I don't care. All that matters is that Windows 8 will motivate Google to add some real multitasking capability to its Android OS. We all know how competitive Google is. They will do it, and it won't be Cornerstone. It will be something better.
horndroid said:
I don't care. All that matters is that Windows 8 will motivate Google to add some real multitasking capability to its Android OS. We all know how competitive Google is. They will do it, and it won't be Cornerstone. It will be something better.
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Kinda, my point. have you used Windows 8 Multitasking? it looks too much like Honeycomb except they keep apps actually running. This is of course Metro, native apps are still good old windows. This isn't Microsoft putting out something for google to steal or envy, it's Microsoft going "OHHH everybody love android and IOS, they must all want "one app at a time" style OS.
I can get on board with Windows Phone 8 or even IOS but the only thing I cannot stand is how they don't allow you to have choice. On Android even though it doesn't come as standard any more, I can still download the APK and install Flash Player myself. Average users can just use the OS and never install flash but I'm still allowed to install it as it's a personal need.
Now Windows Phone 8 is out and it is another OS that doesn't allow you to install software they haven't approved. It just pisses me off so much, especially seeing as they don't have BBCiPlayer yet which uses flash. I mean everyone will tell you these days that flash sucks, no one uses it and yet every site I seem to go to does, even Youtube has lots of flash only content you cannot play with HTML5. I mean is HTML5 even going to become the new standard? I don't see people picking it up very fast.
I just don't get why people don't want choice any more, they seem quite happy to defend being controlled and told how to use their phone. I find IOS harder to use than Android and many people I meet do, I mean things like sharing files between your device and your PC which should be so easy has become so hard. You used to be able to just plug in your phone and it would show as a HDD, now however with IOS and I'm sure Windows Phone 8, you cannot do that. I find it funny because people actually do find these so called user friendly devices harder to use. It's like Windows 8 now and how their new Metro UI has tried to make things look so simple that they've hidden all the options. Things once simple to do, you have to right click and then search in settings to find they've removed the feature to keep the UI looking clean.
I'm just sick of it, the least Microsoft could do is allow third party software to be installed as an option for advanced users. This would at least make up for the lack of functionality on a new OS... no BBCiPlayer? No problem, use the Desktop site which I always do on Android anyways as it has far more functionality and content than the app, the same goes for Youtube.
HTML5 is the new standard. It is adobe's policy and attempts to try to maintain the monopoly over the market-share, combined with pure ignorance from established web developers that still keep it alive.
Installing third party software on a phone is kinda dangerous. Your phone is not a desktop PC, it has limited uses, and it should be regarded as such...
Oh and there is really no reason not to have your functional app on the marketplace. If your app is that awesome and yet you can't get it from the marketplace, then there is something wrong with it.
Don't forget about piracy.
Firstly the phone has limited uses? I've got the same Nokia phone that I've had since 2003 and it works fine. I've had the GS2 for a year and a half now and loaded countless custom roms and third party software and the phone is perfectly fine. Also on that point like I've said I've loaded countless amounts of third party software on Android from torrents or other sites and my phone has been fine. I've put lots of different firmware types on my phone and it has been fine. I don't see anything dangerous about it other than being an idiot enough to load some virus onto your phone.
Apps don't get to the market half the time not because there is anything wrong with it but because Microsoft or Apple simply don't want it on their platform. There is nothing wrong with saying you can flick this switch to open you phone but then have a warning saying you void your warranty or whatever if you brick your phone. Why don't they do this? I just think it all comes done to being scared of piracy more than anything and tbh that isn't a good enough excuse.
HTML5 isn't the new standard because 90% of the sites I go to still use flash and not HTML5. I just don't get why they'd say you can never install this on your phone, why not? All these fanboi claims of how bad it is has led to the downfall. I don't know what machines these people are using, I guess they're made up ones because I've never had a problem with flash, it has always run fine and never crashes all the time like people say... not on my GS2 and not on my Desktop. I'd say Flash is one of the most stable things on my system, I mean games crash far more often, surely ban games then for being unstable and poorly coded? Frigging barely any games are multithreaded even now, BAN THEM ALL!
^ What he said ^
All in all WP8 was a huuuge disappointment. At least for me
Venekor said:
Firstly the phone has limited uses? I've got the same Nokia phone that I've had since 2003 and it works fine. I've had the GS2 for a year and a half now and loaded countless custom roms and third party software and the phone is perfectly fine. Also on that point like I've said I've loaded countless amounts of third party software on Android from torrents or other sites and my phone has been fine. I've put lots of different firmware types on my phone and it has been fine. I don't see anything dangerous about it other than being an idiot enough to load some virus onto your phone.
Apps don't get to the market half the time not because there is anything wrong with it but because Microsoft or Apple simply don't want it on their platform. There is nothing wrong with saying you can flick this switch to open you phone but then have a warning saying you void your warranty or whatever if you brick your phone. Why don't they do this? I just think it all comes done to being scared of piracy more than anything and tbh that isn't a good enough excuse.
HTML5 isn't the new standard because 90% of the sites I go to still use flash and not HTML5. I just don't get why they'd say you can never install this on your phone, why not? All these fanboi claims of how bad it is has led to the downfall. I don't know what machines these people are using, I guess they're made up ones because I've never had a problem with flash, it has always run fine and never crashes all the time like people say... not on my GS2 and not on my Desktop. I'd say Flash is one of the most stable things on my system, I mean games crash far more often, surely ban games then for being unstable and poorly coded? Frigging barely any games are multithreaded even now, BAN THEM ALL!
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Yes, a phone has limited uses, you can't replace your PC with your phone no matter how much you want that.
Second, downloading apps from torrent is illegal. You have quite a lot of gutts to post such misery on a developer's forums, and i, as a developer, take great offense to that, so please get my sincere GTFO.
Third, Custom roms are something that android needs to survive, without it there would be no android. Windows Phone doesn't need that.
About HTML5, yes it is the standard, but people aren't forced to adapt by the standards instantly, they have a lot of time. But as this time runs out, flash will become extinct, therefore there is no reason to implement flash on new phones, as in 3 year's time, flash will be gone.
If your games have worse stability than flash I suggest you:
Get new RAM, your existing one is damaged.
Reinstall your Operating system, and don't pirate it.
Check your error logs, you will see flash is very unstable.
A ton of websites use HTML5.
Not a lot of websites use the new HTML5 video and audio elements.
A lot of the websites that do use them, either fall back to flash / Silverlight or use flash / Silverlight, first, and fall back to the HTML5 video and audio elements.
The websites that I work with, that use video and audio, do Silverlight, first, and fall back to HTML5 video and audio.
The biggest reasons are...
1: Very little native full-screen support (Chrome has it, but that's about it)
2: Firefox and Opera don't support MP4 / MP3 (we have to produce video is MP4 and WebM and audio in MP3 and OGG)
3: Our live broadcasts use the SmoothStreaming technology (only iOS and Android 3+ support that for HTML5 video - Silverlight supports it and supports most computers)
It is worth noting that I COMPLETELY agree with the point of this thread, though.
The iPhone started a trend of consumerizing smartphones.
As such, a lot of big business is still using Blackberry and Windows Mobile.
I would not be surprised, at all, if, in the next five years, we started seeing another separation of consumer versus professional.
The last few years have really tried to re-integrate the two and it hasn't worked, very well.
JJ
If 90 percent of the sites you visit still use flash then you're going to some low-quality porn sites... Also, WP8 does have disk mode, it also syncs through media player in the same way WinMo did.
mcosmin222 said:
Yes, a phone has limited uses, you can't replace your PC with your phone no matter how much you want that.
Second, downloading apps from torrent is illegal. You have quite a lot of gutts to post such misery on a developer's forums, and i, as a developer, take great offense to that, so please get my sincere GTFO.
Third, Custom roms are something that android needs to survive, without it there would be no android. Windows Phone doesn't need that.
About HTML5, yes it is the standard, but people aren't forced to adapt by the standards instantly, they have a lot of time. But as this time runs out, flash will become extinct, therefore there is no reason to implement flash on new phones, as in 3 year's time, flash will be gone.
If your games have worse stability than flash I suggest you:
Get new RAM, your existing one is damaged.
Reinstall your Operating system, and don't pirate it.
Check your error logs, you will see flash is very unstable.
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Click to collapse
"downloading apps from torrent is illegal"
Uh... Not really. He never said what apps he was downloading. Torrents != piracy.
SilverHedgehog said:
"downloading apps from torrent is illegal"
Uh... Not really. He never said what apps he was downloading. Torrents != piracy.
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Preach, preacha!!!
I would agree that a majority of torrents are copyrighted material, but certainly not everything.
Almost every Linux distribution utilizes torrent as their main means of downloading.
JJ
Venekor said:
On Android even though it doesn't come as standard any more, I can still download the APK and install Flash Player myself. Average users can just use the OS and never install flash but I'm still allowed to install it as it's a personal need.
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On my Jelly Bean I can't do this.
How is having Flash choice?
Can I get Flash from Microsoft or Flash from Apple or Flash from Google? nope, all versions of flash were done by one company. That's not competition or freedom, that is lock in. If Adobe didn't like your OS and phone you didn't get Flash.
HTML5 is like a universal language for all web enabled devices, we're better without these proprietary closed and restricted plugins.
After years if constantly flashing new ROMs and such. I for one am glad to be at WP8.
"Hello, my name is LudoGris and I am a flashaholic. I recently switched to Windows Phone 8 and have not had the urge to flash anything since. I am well on my way to being cured." ?
Sent from my RM-820_nam_att_100 using Board Express
LudoGris said:
After years if constantly flashing new ROMs and such. I for one am glad to be at WP8.
"Hello, my name is LudoGris and I am a flashaholic. I recently switched to Windows Phone 8 and have not had the urge to flash anything since. I am well on my way to being cured." ?
Sent from my RM-820_nam_att_100 using Board Express
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I got a little laugh out of this one. Thanks. I agree a bit here. That's what happened to me when I went from pre WinMo 7 to iOS. Now I'm back on Android because of how tired I was of the inability to do something as simple as customize the homescreen. Really, I don't care which one I use and, honestly, I'd use different ones at different times depending on needs and even mood. I flash a little bit with my Android but really like to get settled on something and not have to worry about it. That doesn't work out that often on Android, unfortunately. That's why I relate to the comment on "flashaholic...being cured". I'd like to try out WinPhone 8 for a little bit, but the first thing to turn me off big is the same thing that bothers me on the Win8 desktop, the integration with the MS ecosystem. I'm tied to Google apps and don't feel like switching. It makes most sense for me to use a Google OS because of the strong integration with Google apps.
All that being said, it's just a phone, it's just a desktop, just let me get what I want to get done on the two and have a real life! LOL
The basic fault with the argument here is that the ability to sideload applications has been there in various ways since WP7 came along. It wouldn't help you with your problems though. IE9 on WP7 and IE10 on WP8 simply don't have any plugin support so you wouldn't be able to add any.
The complete architecture of Android is more open and geared towards customization. The effect of that is that we frequently have Apps that don't run (well) on different OS versions, have stuttering problems or have to wait for ages and ages until the customized code gets updates. Allowing for a lot of flexibility with the system makes updating and changing code really challenging. I've encountered numerous of those problems on my GS2. Of course it's running reasonably well after I put CM9.1 on there and didn't bother to change much else but that's hardly how I would use my primary phone (installing Twitter killed Video playback for me on the Stock ROM - for whatever reason).
So basically as a consumer the tradeoff comes down to having everything work as intended without much possibilities to make the system misbehave versus a customized system that I can break at times. It seems there is not much of a middle ground there. We'll have to see how this plays out in the end as Microsoft is indeed adding integration points for developers to use to the system that make it more flexible while still enforcing certain guidelines.
On the whole Flash vs. HTML5 debate. Actually HTML5 can't replace Flash and Silverlight in many use cases. There are not even any standard proposals for certain functionalities that have been part of those Plugins for ages. Webcam-Support, DRM'd Video/Audio, etc. For those reasons alone it will be quite a long time before HTML5 really could replace them. Another important part is that there has been lots of money invested in building sites on top of those technologies. Over 90% of all Web activity still originate on classic PCs/Notebooks that have Flash support so unless your target audience is particularilly Smartphone/Tablet focussed (e.g. Gadget Blogs, etc.) you simply don't feel much pressure to move away from something that works just fine right now.
However Apple led the charge to kill Flash, Microsoft chimed in and in the end even Adobe decided to jump onto that train - even though none of them had a clue how to replace the technology. This clearly showed when Microsoft decided to revive Flash in Windows 8's Metro IE. I still doubt we will see any renewed development of Flash for mobile operating systems and it remains to be seen how long it will keep running on Android given that it has been abandonned by Adobe. It all comes down to the fact that the industry decided to move away from Flash and for better or worse that is what is happening right now. As soon as mobile really becomes important for the web industry things will start changing, right now it simply isn't or it is far easier to simply write an App then messing with a website that's working right now.
Android doesnt let you customize as much as maemo5, but still people choose it.
C'est la vie, necafé?
Personally Im enjoying wp8 for what it is: a smartphone OS. If it was a laptop Id be inclined to agree that it would be too limiting, but its not.
Slai said:
Android doesnt let you customize as much as maemo5, but still people choose it.
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While people like to customize, they also want to have an OS that's actually supported.
LudoGris said:
After years if constantly flashing new ROMs and such. I for one am glad to be at WP8.
"Hello, my name is LudoGris and I am a flashaholic. I recently switched to Windows Phone 8 and have not had the urge to flash anything since. I am well on my way to being cured." ?
Sent from my RM-820_nam_att_100 using Board Express
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@LudoGris
Do you know if your device is gonna get software upgrades or have you been able to flash new software. I have the same version as you have but won't be able to flash something new on it.
itsa porno thing
Just go to the jack-shack its cheaper
I was like you : I thought using iOS or WP was a regression because of lack of freedom. I used to heavily flash my Android devices... then I discovered WP (7.5 first, then 8). I really like it because it's simple... and it's working ! No need to flash, no need to choose another launcher, no need to get lost in settings : it works ! It's stable, fluid and ergonomy is great.
I really like WP8 "launcher" AKA Metro. I think it has the best way to personalize information by choosing what is the more pertinent for each user.
I can live in a closed OS if it answer to all my needs... With WP8, it's the case !
zepretender said:
I was like you : I thought using iOS or WP was a regression because of lack of freedom. I used to heavily flash my Android devices...
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We probably don't need another "me too" here, but I have to say, you've summed up my experience perfectly I was thrilled to flash AOKP's ICS and JB onto my old single-core Samsung Fascinate, and then I could get Nova Launcher with gestures and docks and more options than I can recall; but all those new features were slow, slow, slow. So I flashed the Devil kernel and tried different govenors, but of course YGWYPF and my battery life went down the tubes. I had replaced almost all the stock apps with better versions from the market, but my app collection grew to well over a hundred and I needed Titanium Backup to manage it all. So here I am doing like high-level IT support just to get my phone to work as a phone. It was very pretty but my wife was complaining about how I always missed her calls.
My new HTC 8X is such a revelation. There's nothing to do except use it, and it works perfectly. There's no lag ever; everything is right there or at most one or two clicks away, and the stock apps are just fine, thank you. Sure, I have my hit-list of missing features but none rise even to the level of annoyance, and I expect there will be improvement.
My only concern is developer interest. I read this about an IDC survey:
According to IDC, which surveyed almost 5,000 developers, Windows 8 and Windows Phone are in a lot of trouble. While iOS (iPhone, iPad), Android (handsets and tablets), and HTML5/mobile web fall well above that crucial 50 percent mark, Windows 8 and Windows Phone fall well short. Only 33 percent of developers said they were very interested in writing Windows 8 “Metro” apps. And only 21 percent were interested in doing so for Windows Phone.
(Fully 85 percent of responders were very interested in writing iPhone apps, and 83 percent were very interested in writing iPad apps. Android handsets and tablets came in at 76 percent and 66 percent, respectively, whereas HTML5/mobile web was at 66 percent as well.)
So we'll see. I think the new handsets from Nokia and HTC will help draw attention to how good the O/S is; but it seems Microsoft is trying now to make itself into a better Apple, only Apple was there first.
In case you haven't seen it...
http://m.gsmarena.com/jolla_sailfish_os_detailed_demoed_on_video-news-5104.php
Looks really good, anyone wanna work on a port for our lovely gs3?
Hmmm...doesn't seem to have generated any interest yet...
In an interview with the CEO of Jolla, the interviewer asked if he could put this on his GS3, the CEO replied "Enabling Sailfish for a device such as Galaxy S3 is something that any community member could already do."
The SDK is released online here (I believe)
Unfortunately, I have no technical expertise in this area, is anyone else interested?
Could this be better than Jellybean?
Sent from my SCH-I535 using xda app-developers app
brew182 said:
In case you haven't seen it...
http://m.gsmarena.com/jolla_sailfish_os_detailed_demoed_on_video-news-5104.php
Looks really good, anyone wanna work on a port for our lovely gs3?
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Click to collapse
I'd love to play around with it. The Ambiance feature looks really really cool.
A port form a different OS would only be good for the community However, I have no skills in developing or porting so I can't help except perhaps a small donation to whomever gets it done.
Same here, looks fun but no idea how to do it
I want! Looks awesome!
Sent from my SCH-I535 using xda premium
This have to be done! I really want sailfish!
It's awsome .
I's a good OS ! But not for geeks for sure .
It will only turn heads of people who want to use it for daily usage . Not for heavy customizing ,
BTW The gecko / Firefox OS Would be awesome ! as it is an HTML 5 Based OS / or just a web page :cyclops:
Man no Google now voice search. Gapps. Or play store apps.
Its looks nice but right now in this phone world its apple Google and Microsoft. I may want to try out the new Ubuntu os since Google is technically Linux.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app
Sure I would still prefer Android as my main platform, but I would LOVE to try this out on my GS3! I've always been an OS geek, and love the feel of exploring a new, beautiful, and innovative UI, as well as learning how the underlying platform works and differs from similar setups. It's why I've been playing around with Linux distros and customizing and tweaking them, Solaris, BSD, etc long before Android, despite the fact that I'm no developer. I would LOVE to be able to play around with different OS'es on my GS3, rather than just different Android roms, and Sailfish is one of the most interesting to me. I'll probably end up using Ubuntu more than anything if we get it, but Sailfish is something new and different and it looks really fun. :fingers-crossed:
Can someone link the story of a Jolla dev saying it can be ported easily by the community? If so, let's get this project started, and find out what needs to be done to make this happen, I'm tired of all these different OS'es coming only to the GNex!
With the re-merge of Android and Linux, and addition of the ARM drivers to the mainline, these types of alternative OS'es shouldn't be terribly difficult to port, and between Alien Dalvik and Google writing all their apps in HTML5 for ChromeOS, we should be able to get the basics of what we need from Android running on here, we just need to get the OS running!!
robogoflow said:
I may want to try out the new Ubuntu os since Google is technically Linux.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You realize that Sailfish is also technically Linux, too, right? And you realize that Ubuntu OS won't have Google Now, Gapps, or the Play Store either, right? So why are you naysaying Sailfish but optimistic about Ubuntu? You, sir, make no sense.
Why Sailfish might be a "GOOD" idea too...
The simple fact is I just bought a NOTE 2. First Samsung Device and aside from the S-pen, making a different way of interaction.
We have this to consider. As i have been readng how to 'setup' my NOTE 2 as it's on order and pending... I have come across
threads about how GOOGLE is trying to get 'us' the end users off of SD cards. Other Crap like that... Google has power now,
and they are acting so far like EVERY other US company that gets it. M$, Apple...
It's nice to 'have' something else to look at that is OPEN and someone noted something that is a concern to me. Customizable
look, and features. I myself don't like CRAP on my desktop or my HOME SCREENS... I just don't. When I run Linux, I go with no
icons on my desktop.
So this is so far from what I've seen a bit of a turn off but in the future because the system has to start somewhere... if it's really
open, one would hope such features could be expected. Either 3rd party or by the main OS makers.
There have been enough complaints here by users about devices without SD CARD access. About how Google is trying to cut
this off and how ni Samsung devices Samsung had to 'hack' around it to allow SD card access to apps that were used to getting
it.
I for one for simplicity don't want a stupid OS where all my personal CRAP PHOTOS etc are STUCK in the phone. Just for a simple
reason like that.
Another reason we should all hope for MORE OS's to be released is because lets let the DEVICE makers take something back!
Eventually it only takes one to WISE up... loosing money competing OS to OS or by trying to follow up when they have a good device but for example the ANDROID leader is SAMSUNG. I like that LG picked up WebOS SO they're gonna make Smart TV with it but all it takes is a little pebble to start the Landslide.
THese OEM's we want them to wise up and say... WAIT! There's stuff out there... we make the DEVICE and let them decide what they want on it. Isn't waht we all dream of? Cause then stupid crap like Samsungs Flash counter will be something made obsolete by trend.
Makes will possibly start trying to just concentrate on GOOD HARDWARE just like computers, and then maybe some company will really wise up and the only thing they'll contribute will be a device coming with some kind of AWsome MULTI-BOOT loader system ... Or at least if the devices are open someone can make one... haha.
Also about the Ubunty on mobiles thing... well, it's an interesting idea but seems like they are still not planning to get anywhere with it for a whole year? I wonder why...
Sailfish is using the WHOLE Linux... it's the same thing, but with a UI set for imbedded and small devices. SO all that needs to be done in the future is a step up to a whole desktop for bigger screen devices or if you dock your device to a large screen... so in other words...
Sailfish could have the same potential as Ubuntu...
I have personally never used Ubuntu and hope that with the option of sailfish what we may see is other Linux projects joining the trend. I mean really... it's all OPEN source. What actually bugs me the most as an end users is also the same problem that I see with some Linux projects.
Everyone reinventing the WHEEL trying to make the best this and taht and this is the real reason in some instances it's taking longer to do something that is lying around and could be modified and it's true, I don't speak with any experience in coding or programming but I think some who do know what is said is a bit true in some instances just like in some a total rewrite may be in order.
but if it's OPEN, then the parts are there.
So either way... it'll be good to see SAILFISH and other things. I'm sorry, but the whole TIZEN thing doesn't appeal to me pesonally. If it had more underlying structure other than the HTML 5, cause frankly, I am not real happy about every little thing on my system always
being connected to the internet in some way... though yes, I realize HTML 5 is just a way to create graphics but, remember these are companies we're dealing with here and they always have their own agenda.
Anyway... I'd like to see Sailfish vs Windoz OS, cause Micro$haft has not changed their ways and I don't expect to see them do any different than they have and their system will be similarly locked in ways but differently or in differently places as much as Apple's.
Android is open now but Google is acting weird and some competition and innovation can keep it open longer...
So, I'd love to see Salifsish fly or is that Swim... and of course they need to start somewhere and 90% of they users will be people who just want it to 'work' and that's where they need to go first. Us power users, etc in this forum, we're like the 10% or less now. Before
we were the people buying smartphones but when smartphones are now what the average user is getting their hands on?
Forget it... you bettre make something that they goo OOOH perty, and it's simple. OR you will be lost in the market. I also recall that
Sailfish is coming out here in the Asian market if I read taht right a couple month ago. I am an expat living in CHINA and believe me.
They want it simple and pretty, anything else... and it will fail. But once it hits this market, where a lot of stuff for Android is being made now
if it is accepted... then it will start having things made for it and if it can run Android apps, it's a true plus...
Depending on what hardware it comes out on, if it's able to use the simple apps I use in Android, it may be my next device to replace my daily users...
Obviously the NOTE 2 is going to be my KIND device and isn't exactly for 'daily' use in the way that I use my devices.
Still, the more the merrier and frankly, a lot of OEM's will want to get off of being branded as ANDROID device makers or whatever if they want to sell.
Also it's all good that ANDY is merging back with main kernel, but so far... there is still NO REAL work you can do with Android despite this yet. I do mean, such as prepare a very good OFFICE DOCUMENT, Power Point presentation and so on that you would on a computer. Though I hear the Open Office to Android project is going... so one can but wait and hope.
I would love to try this out on my LG optimus 2x SU660!
brew182 said:
In case you haven't seen it...
m.gsmarena.com/jolla_sailfish_os_detailed_demoed_on_video-news-5104.php
Looks really good, anyone wanna work on a port for our lovely gs3?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow. should try
I would love to see this OS running on my S3.
very cool... watch the hands on video. Note that they say that android apps will be ported over for the sailfish os, SO i would imagine that even if gapps are blocked etc. that they would likely work for the most part, or could be made to work ... lol :highfive:
Im definitely interested in anything that has quality (obviously this does!) ... and represents a new form of competition
I think this is pretty damn awesome. The hands on videos on YouTube look great, especially the ambiance thing.
Honestly, the phone looks good too but i would rather keep the beast hardware in my S3 and maybe get an S4, but having this OS on it would be awesome.
If someone had a way to dual boot Sailfish and Android, that would be epic.
Sure, it isnt completely and utterly customizable. But Sailfish seems very natural to use and at the same time you can still tap into all the Android apps!
Simple OS + Android apps.. what's not to like?
mandeep1 said:
I's a good OS ! But not for geeks for sure .
It will only turn heads of people who want to use it for daily usage . Not for heavy customizing ,
BTW The gecko / Firefox OS Would be awesome ! as it is an HTML 5 Based OS / or just a web page :cyclops:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is perfect for geeks! Lots of stuff to play with, mod and hack + true multi tasking
robogoflow said:
Man no Google now voice search. Gapps. Or play store apps.
Its looks nice but right now in this phone world its apple Google and Microsoft. I may want to try out the new Ubuntu os since Google is technically Linux.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dat comment. You must be somekind of an expert
/sarcasm
IOS 7 looks like Jolla.
We may never get Android 5.0
Hi guys just sharing an opinion piece I wrote about the future of Android.
My current theory is that eventually Android could be replaced by Chrome OS, or merged and it could happen as soon as the next major update (5.0)
My article and reasons are here and I just wanted to get some input from you guys: my fellow Android Enthusiasts,
I have one word for you: grammar
there and their, you really should know the difference
I can't believe there is a Firefox OS coming. I mean, sigh... I was a big supporter of firefox for a long time, but finally got sick of the bloat. And I might add I can't stand chrome browser, desktop or mobile. Chrome on the XZ was the worst mobile browser I've ever used.
It's a nice opinion, but do you develop applications yourself?
Here's my opinion, as consumer, an Engineer and an App developer;
Mobile phones aren't about browsing, frankly, I could care less about web on my phone. Putting everything on the web would be a night mare. Further, no scripting language is going to run as fast as native code, yes most Android apps are written in Java, but are then compiled into DBC (Dalvik Byte Code), yes, this runs on a VM (Dalvik-VM), but it's a highly optimised one. Next, we have the NDK, developers can currently write native applications compiled directly into machine code and ran natively on the hardware, again, this can not be replicated in web scripting languages, nor will the speed be matched.
Further, integrating web technologies would rely on an abstraction layer that allowed the web languages to talk to the hardware, guess what, this won't be written in web technologies, and will be written in native.
Mobiles are powerful pocket computers, but they can't be expected to have internet access all the time. Yes, web apps can be stored locally, but shifting completely to the cloud doesn't work everywhere.
Finally, my thought on Chrome OS, I would never use it personally, it's a late entry into a dying breed of desktop computing, worse yet, it's aimed almost entirely at the casual desktop user. Web browsing, desktop publishing, it's the netbook of the 20-teens(2013+).
Firefox lost my interest as my number one browser when they said screw the companies that need test cycles in order to deploy our latest browsers by switching to rapid release cycles of poor quality updates, that came and went faster than any company get put it through their test process. Firefox OS for phone has no interest from me. Ubuntu OS also isn't quite the "full OS" they claimed it to be, in fact, the dev preview wasn't even Ubuntu and was a hypervisor on top of Cyanogenmod (Android).
Shifting to cloud based services is inevitable, but to have entirely web based OSs such as the ChromeOS is ridiculous currently.
DISCLAIMER: This is my opinion, feel free to disagree, but structure and debate please.
I cringed at the title.
alias_neo said:
It's a nice opinion, but do you develop applications yourself?
Here's my opinion, as consumer, an Engineer and an App developer;
Mobile phones aren't about browsing, frankly, I could care less about web on my phone. Putting everything on the web would be a night mare. Further, no scripting language is going to run as fast as native code, yes most Android apps are written in Java, but are then compiled into DBC (Dalvik Byte Code), yes, this runs on a VM (Dalvik-VM), but it's a highly optimised one. Next, we have the NDK, developers can currently write native applications compiled directly into machine code and ran natively on the hardware, again, this can not be replicated in web scripting languages, nor will the speed be matched.
Further, integrating web technologies would rely on an abstraction layer that allowed the web languages to talk to the hardware, guess what, this won't be written in web technologies, and will be written in native.
Mobiles are powerful pocket computers, but they can't be expected to have internet access all the time. Yes, web apps can be stored locally, but shifting completely to the cloud doesn't work everywhere.
Finally, my thought on Chrome OS, I would never use it personally, it's a late entry into a dying breed of desktop computing, worse yet, it's aimed almost entirely at the casual desktop user. Web browsing, desktop publishing, it's the netbook of the 20-teens(2013+).
Firefox lost my interest as my number one browser when they said screw the companies that need test cycles in order to deploy our latest browsers by switching to rapid release cycles of poor quality updates, that came and went faster than any company get put it through their test process. Firefox OS for phone has no interest from me. Ubuntu OS also isn't quite the "full OS" they claimed it to be, in fact, the dev preview wasn't even Ubuntu and was a hypervisor on top of Cyanogenmod (Android).
Shifting to cloud based services is inevitable, but to have entirely web based OSs such as the ChromeOS is ridiculous currently.
DISCLAIMER: This is my opinion, feel free to disagree, but structure and debate please.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
agree :good:
hebbe said:
agree :good:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
nosebleed
Sent from my C6603 using xda app-developers app
alias_neo said:
It's a nice opinion, but do you develop applications yourself?
Here's my opinion, as consumer, an Engineer and an App developer;
Mobile phones aren't about browsing, frankly, I could care less about web on my phone. Putting everything on the web would be a night mare. Further, no scripting language is going to run as fast as native code, yes most Android apps are written in Java, but are then compiled into DBC (Dalvik Byte Code), yes, this runs on a VM (Dalvik-VM), but it's a highly optimised one. Next, we have the NDK, developers can currently write native applications compiled directly into machine code and ran natively on the hardware, again, this can not be replicated in web scripting languages, nor will the speed be matched.
Further, integrating web technologies would rely on an abstraction layer that allowed the web languages to talk to the hardware, guess what, this won't be written in web technologies, and will be written in native.
Mobiles are powerful pocket computers, but they can't be expected to have internet access all the time. Yes, web apps can be stored locally, but shifting completely to the cloud doesn't work everywhere.
Finally, my thought on Chrome OS, I would never use it personally, it's a late entry into a dying breed of desktop computing, worse yet, it's aimed almost entirely at the casual desktop user. Web browsing, desktop publishing, it's the netbook of the 20-teens(2013+).
Firefox lost my interest as my number one browser when they said screw the companies that need test cycles in order to deploy our latest browsers by switching to rapid release cycles of poor quality updates, that came and went faster than any company get put it through their test process. Firefox OS for phone has no interest from me. Ubuntu OS also isn't quite the "full OS" they claimed it to be, in fact, the dev preview wasn't even Ubuntu and was a hypervisor on top of Cyanogenmod (Android).
Shifting to cloud based services is inevitable, but to have entirely web based OSs such as the ChromeOS is ridiculous currently.
DISCLAIMER: This is my opinion, feel free to disagree, but structure and debate please.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Very good points. I mean why would they kill something which is already working well. Think what happened to Windows 8, it turned out to be
sort of like Vista. Companies need to innovate, but usually it doesn't go as what they desire, but understanding the perception of the user
is not a straight forward task.
Rchard said:
Very good points. I mean why would they kill something which is already working well. Think what happened to Windows 8, it turned out to be
sort of like Vista. Companies need to innovate, but usually it doesn't go as what they desire, but understanding the perception of the user
is not a straight forward task.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Android is too mature to be killed, it would be like google want to commit suicide... And if i remember well there is a few more corp is involved in android like htc, samsung, sony, huawei , and a few others, and spooks as well , we probably don't know. Android is a perfect spying platform and more then half of the devices on internet constantly. Who would kill that info net??
IOS will die before android, until then it will continue to thrive just like Window OS on your laptop or desktop.
too bad for Apple, they never stay in the lead.
My pov as an marketer,
You cant pull something out of the market when its doing so well at this time or later. Maybe when android becomes crap then yes.
Currently android OS is dominating the global market share. Do you really think they would stop jewing money when they can still jew more? Thats completely suicidal. Android came a long way since it was launched and surpassing iOS or came to being recognized by everyone around the globe.
You know we're in 2013 and everything in business is about money money money, Android OS is definitely one of their major income.
Android will die, but not so soon. maybe a few more years till consumers are tired of it, or when something better takes over the market. How google will keep updating android is unknown, whether android 5.0 will come or not remains unknown, but one thing im sure of is that android wont die that early.
LitoNi said:
My pov as an marketer,
You cant pull something out of the market when its doing so well at this time or later. Maybe when android becomes crap then yes.
Currently android OS is dominating the global market share. Do you really think they would stop jewing money when they can still jew more? Thats completely suicidal. Android came a long way since it was launched and surpassing iOS or came to being recognized by everyone around the globe.
You know we're in 2013 and everything in business is about money money money, Android OS is definitely one of their major income.
Android will die, but not so soon. maybe a few more years till consumers are tired of it, or when something better takes over the market. How google will keep updating android is unknown, whether android 5.0 will come or not remains unknown, but one thing im sure of is that android wont die that early.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Jewing?? Really?
Sent from my C6603 using xda premium
Gez77 said:
nosebleed
Sent from my C6603 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
what does that mean
are you boring?
sahinz said:
are you boring?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
thanks