Database Users

Airave - Potential Cause of Network Location issues on 2.1 ROMS

If you've been watching the 2.1 ROM threads closely since we started getting 2.1 on our Hero, you will have probably noticed that I've been complaining (in addition to others,) that at times my location is showing a city 30 miles away from my location. GPS works fine, but network location alone, which used to be spot on in 1.5 ROMS, was acting funny.
Quite a few others confirmed similar behavior, and some not.
I use an Airave for Sprint Coverage when making calls since I have terrible signal in my area. It basically switches you over to it, and makes a 1x call over VOIP.
I've noticed that when I turn off the Airave, my location returns to normal (even though sometimes I have to reboot.) With it off, I am no longer having any issues at all.
This means that somehow the 2.1 ROM is either accessing the Airave more often, or some other reason that isn't immediately apparent to me.
I was excited to see a PM from Earldriscoll today, saying that he is seeing the same behavior, and ALSO uses an Airave.
This makes me feel a lot better about the issue, but annoyed at the same time. I'm lucky in the fact that I'm moving to a new place in a few weeks and won't need the Airave anymore.
What do you guys think?

Anyone?
This could be a big impact to all Airave users.

dont have an airave wish I did I get crap signal in my house

Its not just 2.1. I had the same issues on 1.5. And its not just android devices that have this issue. I have seen it with blackberry 8330, palm pre and touch pro 2. I believe if you read the manual it tells you that using airave services will cause interference with location based services.

im having the same issues with no airave, and had it on cooked 1.5 roms as well

If you're at home why do you need airave or if you use an airave in the same location everytime why would you need location-based services...not flaming just curious to better understand the dilemma

kmartburrito said:
What do you guys think?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Indeed in airave coverage my location is 22.7+ miles off

I use an Airave, and I am also being detected about 30 miles off of my location! I am in central Atlanta, and I show up as in Lawarenceville when using my Airave!

You've Been Warned....
kmartburrito said:
If you've been watching the 2.1 ROM threads closely since we started getting 2.1 on our Hero, you will have probably noticed that I've been complaining (in addition to others,) that at times my location is showing a city 30 miles away from my location. GPS works fine, but network location alone, which used to be spot on in 1.5 ROMS, was acting funny.
Quite a few others confirmed similar behavior, and some not.
I use an Airave for Sprint Coverage when making calls since I have terrible signal in my area. It basically switches you over to it, and makes a 1x call over VOIP.
I've noticed that when I turn off the Airave, my location returns to normal (even though sometimes I have to reboot.) With it off, I am no longer having any issues at all.
This means that somehow the 2.1 ROM is either accessing the Airave more often, or some other reason that isn't immediately apparent to me.
I was excited to see a PM from Earldriscoll today, saying that he is seeing the same behavior, and ALSO uses an Airave.
This makes me feel a lot better about the issue, but annoyed at the same time. I'm lucky in the fact that I'm moving to a new place in a few weeks and won't need the Airave anymore.
What do you guys think?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When i ordered mine the woman on the phone warned me prior to actually placing the order that it can possible throw off your location services in some areas, she said it was the wi-fi that does it, and asked me if i still wanted it.....Well i got it 2days later and i couldnt be happier when you place a call the signal meter completely fills. Awesome hows that for a battery saver. If you sleep @ the place you have the airave, it will save you battery life. The more time by it, the better the battery life....Sorry they didnt forewarn you like they did me. Salesperson was slipping i guess.

This actually makes a lot of sense.

Yeah this is a fact. I guess the location is based on where the Airave connection is coming from through the internet. There is a GPS wire on the Airave but not for sure it works, but then again I have it next to the window and not outside.

gravesy56 said:
If you're at home why do you need airave or if you use an airave in the same location everytime why would you need location-based services...not flaming just curious to better understand the dilemma
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No worries, I know you're not flaming
For me, it's an annoyance specifically with a few apps I use a lot. One of them is weatherbug. It gives you weather alerts based on your location. I have been getting some false weather alerts, because my phone thinks I'm in a completely different city over 30 minutes away. 30 miles can mean a lot from a weather standpoint. I also don't like that this also makes my weather on the HTC clock show incorrectly.
Finally, in an app I'm developing, it uses network based location, and it has been driving me mad as this problem, for me at least, manifests only on 2.1 based roms. Here I have been pulling out my hair thinking it was something with my code when doing 2.1 testing, but in fact it really wasn't at all.
So I agree, at home it really shouldn't matter, but sometimes when I want to see the weather forecast for tomorrow, I'd like to see my hometown instead of some place I never care to visit or live.
Just an annoying side product of using the Airave I guess. I literally cannot make calls in 50% of my home without the Airave, so it's a necessity.

kmartburrito said:
Just an annoying side product of using the Airave I guess. I literally cannot make calls in 50% of my home without the Airave, so it's a necessity.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Slightly off topic
Whats annoying is the Airave is the only sprint product I haven't voided the warranty on...

Now guys think about why the airave would cause this issue....
Your airave uses your broadband internet connection, and the network switch is probably somewhere about 22.4 miles away .....
Now troubleshoot.................

azyouthinkeyeiz said:
Now guys think about why the airave would cause this issue....
Your airave uses your broadband internet connection, and the network switch is probably somewhere about 22.4 miles away .....
Now troubleshoot.................
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Of course it's obvious when you realize the Airave is the one supplying the location to your 2.1 based Hero.
However, for me, it didn't ever happen on 1.5. Also, since I was an initial beta tester for the Airave, I didn't ever get explained to me that it could "interfere" with location services. It took me a bit to pinpoint the Airave as the culprit because it didn't do it for my 1.5 roms. So yeah it's easy to say what you said when you know the answer. If that answer isn't available to you, however, it's not so simple!

I feel kinda stupid for not realizing this also, of coarse mine says dallas, TX when i live 20 miles south of austin(couple hundred miles difference). F's my weather up something fierce.

azyouthinkeyeiz said:
Now guys think about why the airave would cause this issue....
Your airave uses your broadband internet connection, and the network switch is probably somewhere about 22.4 miles away .....
Now troubleshoot.................
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thats what I said earlier #11. It actually has a GPS wire that is supposed to go outside to get the actual GPS location

wtphoto said:
dont have an airave wish I did I get crap signal in my house
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I got one and didnt like it too much but it was free. All I did was call and tell them that since the last PRL update I was losing signal and they said they would send it out free of charge. And to add to that they also gave away 2yrs of service for free as well. If you want one you can call and tell them the same thing and see if they will help you out like they did me.
I still have mine and if they didn't stipulate that when done with it I had to send it back or pay for it I would send it to ya in a heartbeat.

I got my airave when I called to cancel because I just could not switch to roaming at my house.
Anyway, as far as it working, it is the berries man. But beyond that my phone has always showed the weather about 10 miles off. But when I pull up apps that geocode me, it pins me spot on to where I am at. No problems at all.
BUT I have only had it for about 6 hours. Let's see if that changes in the next couple days.

I have also noticed this.
I am running DC's 2.2v2 and my htcwweather and htcclock both tend to show about 100+ miles off(in Bellingham,WA but shows Artondale,WA). The weird thing is that it is consistent on the location. When at home it always show the same location but it is wrong.
This being said other GPS features are correct. When I run google maps or sprint nav it does find the correct location and it is spot on.
The thing that baffles me is why this is the case? I am guessing, and remember this is just a guess, that the HTC apps are using cell tower triangulation while the others actually use the GPS unit. This is my conclusion and I am not sure if it is correct, just a guess since when I do an update on the weather it doesn't activate the GPS on the top...

GPS Wrong - Google Map Not Accurate

Why does Google Map tell me that I'm 1000m from my current location? It's useless if I need street directions.

a_ok2me said:
Why does Google Map tell me that I'm 1000m from my current location? It's useless if I need street directions.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is strange. I have the same problem with my Rhodium. My HD2 has the best GPS I have ever owned.
I use Waze not Google maps though. Last night I was on the highest bridge of a multi road exchange and took a 90 degree turn that confuses every GPS device I have ever used but this time Waze made the turn with me.
Are you using the stock ROM?
Does Google maps support GPS?

Snarksneeze said:
This is strange. I have the same problem with my Rhodium. My HD2 has the best GPS I have ever owned.
I use Waze not Google maps though. Last night I was on the highest bridge of a multi road exchange and took a 90 degree turn that confuses every GPS device I have ever used but this time Waze made the turn with me.
Are you using the stock ROM?
Does Google maps support GPS?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well...I no longer have the hd2 because it does not pick up 3G 95% of the time and it can't find a GPS satellite. Google Map supports GPS. It was also stock ROM. I must have done a million hard resets. Basically, it didn't work for $450 + $50 tax.

Did you even turn on the GPS option in Google maps? If not then it was finding your location throught GPRS which is triangulation from cell towers.
I have both a Fuze and HD2 and both work just fine for me. Also when was the last time you tried runner Quick GPS to update the tracking files?

Google Maps, by default, won't connect with GPS, but find your estimates location from cell towers. that's why you're always a little off.
press menu and use GPS, and the GPS will track your location accurately from there on.

rickyoon.vegas said:
Google Maps, by default, won't connect with GPS, but find your estimates location from cell towers. that's why you're always a little off.
press menu and use GPS, and the GPS will track your location accurately from there on.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Close but the newer version is Menu/Options/GPS

Wil Badger said:
Did you even turn on the GPS option in Google maps? If not then it was finding your location throught GPRS which is triangulation from cell towers.
I have both a Fuze and HD2 and both work just fine for me. Also when was the last time you tried runner Quick GPS to update the tracking files?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
rickyoon.vegas said:
Google Maps, by default, won't connect with GPS, but find your estimates location from cell towers. that's why you're always a little off.
press menu and use GPS, and the GPS will track your location accurately from there on.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes I turned on the Google GPS option. It just tries to find a tower forever, but never finds anything. I also ran Quick GPS after the Google GPS option didn't work. Similarly, I rarely ever get 3G. But, stick in my sim card to my old phone and everything is fine.
I think there is a big issue with the HD2.

a_ok2me said:
Yes I turned on the Google GPS option. It just tries to find a tower forever, but never finds anything. I also ran Quick GPS after the Google GPS option didn't work. Similarly, I rarely ever get 3G. But, stick in my sim card to my old phone and everything is fine.
I think there is a big issue with the HD2.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have read that leather cases have something to do with this sometimes. Are you using one?

MirasHD2 said:
I have read that leather cases have something to do with this sometimes. Are you using one?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes & no. Yes, I do when I'm on the road. But, no because I would try it at home - without any case - to see if it's accurate but it can't pick up any satellites.
I was only able to get a reading of my home position the first 2 days of owning it.

a_ok2me said:
I think there is a big issue with the HD2.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think you mean with your particular HD2. Because as I said before, I've never had a better GPS device... ever. Any GPS device that can actually follow me on a 90-degree turn without missing a beat is just lightyears beyond anything else I've found so far.
Even with stock ROM there could be a number of things causing trouble:
You could have a bad phone. It happens. Manufacturer's defects will occur in even the best runs, that's why there are warranties to cover it.
Something may be interfering with your GPS receiver. Even if other devices perform flawlessly in the same location in your vehicle, one device may be more succeptible to radio interference than others.
You could have battery issues. A bad battery can cause all sorts of problems. When your phone can't get a good cell reception, it just boosts juice to the hardware, which in turn drains your battery faster. A bad battery just can't keep up. Again, this is why there are warranties.
Please don't just assume that the HD2 is a bad phone just because you had problems with yours. I've heard of people curse a phone maker because they got two or three bad phones in a row. The thing to remember is that when a plant makes a bad batch, the entire shift's production could easily be sent to the same area, meaning that multiple returns for the same issue from one customer are not unheard of.
I would return it and get a replacement. It may take a few times of swapping around, but you should get things worked out. Trust me, this is the best phone on the market today. Hands down.
#ListMaster

Snarksneeze said:
I think you mean with your particular HD2. Because as I said before, I've never had a better GPS device... ever.
Please don't just assume that the HD2 is a bad phone just because you had problems with yours. I've heard of people curse a phone maker because they got two or three bad phones in a row.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well...conversely, you can't assume the other direction because many, not only my phone, can't get 3G. Further, my phone can't pick up satellites even after many hard resets and no non-OEM apps installed. As I keep on reading threads, it tells me the HD2 is poor with reception. There's something to be said about this.
After selling my phone, I'm tempted to buy another one. But I'll hold out for awhile as more feedbacks come in.

MirasHD2 said:
I have read that leather cases have something to do with this sometimes. Are you using one?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
[OFF-TOPIC] Congratulations on your 100th post! You're a Senior Member now [/OFF-TOPIC]

a_ok2me said:
Well...conversely, you can't assume the other direction because many, not only my phone, can't get 3G. Further, my phone can't pick up satellites even after many hard resets and no non-OEM apps installed. As I keep on reading threads, it tells me the HD2 is poor with reception. There's something to be said about this.
After selling my phone, I'm tempted to buy another one. But I'll hold out for awhile as more feedbacks come in.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The lack of 3G can't be blamed on the phone, you know. I live in the center of Austin, TX and my 3G is constant. I've driven 100 miles south to a small community there and couldn't get anything higher than Edge.
Also, T-Mobile won't kick you from a tower that doesn't belong to them. At least, I've never been able to catch them doing it. I always get the closest tower and best reception possible. Problem is, T-Mobile simply doesn't have enough money to ensure that every corner of every city has third-generation towers.
This is the same gripe coming from iPhone users; they say that AT&T just isn't investing enough in putting out more towers.

Snarksneeze said:
The lack of 3G can't be blamed on the phone, you know.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, but the thing is - as I originally mentioned - I get 3G on my BlueAngel using the same sim card. Without this test, I would not have been able to point my finger at the HD2. The BlueAngel is something like the first PDA/phone ever and I still get 3G with it. I can't believe PDA technology has not advanced so much until now that I'm still using it after all these years.

a_ok2me said:
Yeah, but the thing is - as I originally mentioned - I get 3G on my BlueAngel using the same sim card. Without this test, I would not have been able to point my finger at the HD2. The BlueAngel is something like the first PDA/phone ever and I still get 3G with it. I can't believe PDA technology has not advanced so much until now that I'm still using it after all these years.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I see. Well, I certainly can't say what the problem is. As I said before, you may have just gotten a bad phone, which would suck but it does happen.
I've never dropped 3G here in Austin since I've gotten my HD2 in. Of course, the icon switches between [3] and [H] all the time, but it won't drop to [E] unless I manually turn off the "Data connection" toggle under Settings->Comm Manager.

Sorry but, our GPS on our Hd2 only works when in 3g? Just wondering because im on Edge at home and it dont work. havent tried in 3g coverage yet though.

starkall said:
Sorry but, our GPS on our Hd2 only works when in 3g? Just wondering because im on Edge at home and it dont work. havent tried in 3g coverage yet though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't know. I was associating poor 3G reception with my phone's inability to find a satellite.

i live in long beach, ca and my phone finds gps even on edge. It also connects to 3g and has a stable connection. try replacing ur phone by using ur warranty.

starkall said:
Sorry but, our GPS on our Hd2 only works when in 3g? Just wondering because im on Edge at home and it dont work. havent tried in 3g coverage yet though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, GPS has nothing to do with 3g or your cellular connection. The GPS will work even if you have no sim card in and don't use it as a phone.
Also, I have to say, the GPS on my HD2 is one of the best I've used. I've had 4 other GPS enabled phones, 2 handheld standalone GPS devices, and 3 different bluetooth gps devices and the HD2 is definitely as good or better than all of them. I was very impressed... never thought a phone could work so well with gps.

google maps
GPS CONNECTION ERROR??!
am i the only one ?
No GPS receiver was found maake sure you have a gps receiver (built in or bluetooth that is turned on and configured towork with google maps for mobile. ??
UMM? is this so that i can bluetooth a tomtom or something like that and use their satelites ? cuz i ran quick gps why wouldnt gmaps use that ? my location is a little off but i am inside a brick apartment building. and its only off several blocks?
any way to configure gps to gmaps ?

Unsuitable radio or poor data services from UK mobile networks...?

Hi guys,
I don't know how many of you are living in UK or if you experience this in other parts of the world. Basically there's one thing that really annoys me and I can't figure out WHAT'S causing it!
I am well satisfied with my Leo but as to web services I am not so enthusiastic. Firstly I've given up on "My location & weather" services exactly the same way as I did on Blackstone. I just don't bother setting them up after ROM update, so they don't show up on the homescreen and I turn the weather tab off instantly after flash. Reason being: THEY ONLY UPDATE IN CERTAIN LOCATIONS EVEN THOUGH I'VE GOT FULL HSDPA OR 3G SIGNAL COVERAGE ALMOST EVERYWHERE I GO!!!
No idea why this is happening. At home where I've got full 3G and GPRS signal coverage, it updates quickly and nicely. But when I go to work where there's full HSDPA, 3G and also GPRS it will not update whatever trick I try!!! It just pops out a message about not being able to connect... Same thing in town centre and other locations. It seems totally random to me where it works and where it doesn't. And folks: I just hate having 12 hours old location and weather report on my screeen before coming back home or wherever it decides to work!
Now secondly, similar thing happens with web browsers. Because of unsupported flash in Opera I have started using Skyfire in larger scale and recently also the uZARD, if anyone came across to that. They are both good browsers (in my opinion the uZard is nearing perfection!) but strangely a similar issue to the one above comes with them. Again they only seem to work in certain places and again there is quite a decent data coverage almost everywhere in my area.
So the question is: does it have something to do with data services of my network (UK Orange) or is it something radio related maybe? I have tried 2.06, 2.08 and 2.10 radios and there wasn't any significant difference.
Does it ring a bell? Did anyone experience this?

morningstar.fallen said:
Hi guys,
I don't know how many of you are living in UK or if you experience this in other parts of the world. Basically there's one thing that really annoys me and I can't figure out WHAT'S causing it!
I am well satisfied with my Leo but as to web services I am not so enthusiastic. Firstly I've given up on "My location & weather" services exactly the same way as I did on Blackstone. I just don't bother setting them up after ROM update, so they don't show up on the homescreen and I turn the weather tab off instantly after flash. Reason being: THEY ONLY UPDATE IN CERTAIN LOCATIONS EVEN THOUGH I'VE GOT FULL HSDPA OR 3G SIGNAL COVERAGE ALMOST EVERYWHERE I GO!!!
No idea why this is happening. At home where I've got full 3G and GPRS signal coverage, it updates quickly and nicely. But when I go to work where there's full HSDPA, 3G and also GPRS it will not update whatever trick I try!!! It just pops out a message about not being able to connect... Same thing in town centre and other locations. It seems totally random to me where it works and where it doesn't. And folks: I just hate having 12 hours old location and weather report on my screeen before coming back home or wherever it decides to work!
Now secondly, similar thing happens with web browsers. Because of unsupported flash in Opera I have started using Skyfire in larger scale and recently also the uZARD, if anyone came across to that. They are both good browsers (in my opinion the uZard is nearing perfection!) but strangely a similar issue to the one above comes with them. Again they only seem to work in certain places and again there is quite a decent data coverage almost everywhere in my area.
So the question is: does it have something to do with data services of my network (UK Orange) or is it something radio related maybe? I have tried 2.06, 2.08 and 2.10 radios and there wasn't any significant difference.
Does it ring a bell? Did anyone experience this?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm on o2 I'm and have found the new 2.10th radios to give an extra bar and speed improvements network wise. the latest is awesome but consumes more battery life for me so i went back to 2.10.50.08.2
hope this helps

Im on Virgin in the UK, where i live i have full signal where ever i i am in my town, my location doesn't work simple, i added my own city, my internet works fine, now i have been house sitting for my dad for 2 weeks in a little village, 2 weeks only just had 1 bar of signal and my location worked now wtf is that all about lol, oh my radio in my sig

Im on tmobile uk and when I'm at home I'm lucky if I get 1 bar of 3g coverage, if I dont I'll only get 2 bars of gprs, then again we are behind a ruddy great hill, most other urban areas give good 3g, however like the OP says sometimes theres an issue with speed and location not updating (or updating to the wrong location) despite full coverage
My gf is on vodafone and at home shes lucky if she gets one bar of gprs
But then thats what she deserves for having a iphone!
I've never tried another radio but I'm considering it

Update
Just to let you guys know, UK Orange was going through some major technical difficulties with their 3G network lately. So that has been the cause for trouble with browsers.
But the first problem I've mentioned is a fact that MY LOCATION and WEATHER still only updates on certain (random) places, regardless the signal coverage or radio version!!!

Works fine for me wherever I go on O2 as long as I have somes signal, just takes longer on GPRS.
In my experience of friends on Orange, they've never been good.
Try SPB weather and see if that works.
Alternatively, try updating in an Orange shop, if it fails, ask if you can use one of their handsets to try, and if that works, you'll know it's a problem with your phone so time to get it replaced, if it doesn't work, you'll know Orange are just poo.

Weather Locations has never worked for me. Just look for the cab named something like Dutty's disable current location and it will remove that my location entry in the weather so it will never bother you. Then just manually add your city and job done!
As for the web browsers not working, i had intermittent drops (its ok now tho). but what i did before, was disable HDSPA. the phone kept switching betweeen 3g and hdspa and cudnt make its mind up, and so it wouldnt connect to the net. But as you said Orange have been messing up so it should work soon.

morningstar.fallen said:
Just to let you guys know, UK Orange was going through some major technical difficulties with their 3G network lately. So that has been the cause for trouble with browsers.
But the first problem I've mentioned is a fact that MY LOCATION and WEATHER still only updates on certain (random) places, regardless the signal coverage or radio version!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have to ask how often is it set to update? i have mine set to update every 3 hours and it does. The location accuracy can be a little off at times but i don't really rely on it and if i do notice i'll do a manual update which works first time 99% of the time.
Poor 3G/HSDPA signal (2 bars or less) will cause some crazy packet loss and will cause problems with internet connectivity in general. Most often the phone will fall back to EDGE and then GPRS in order to correct this (but for saking the speed). If the signal is still crap then there is no hope. I'm on O2 and my radio version is in my signature. I was using 2.07 (stock) and that wasn't brilliant and i have heard that the newer radios suck the battery and the wifi isn't so great.
If your signal is pants even with the new radio i would advise you lay your hands on an extended battery and leave the wifi chip turned on. Then if you configure to connect any unsecure networks first as soon as it finds one you'll have net access.

M3PH said:
I have to ask how often is it set to update? i have mine set to update every 3 hours and it does. The location accuracy can be a little off at times but i don't really rely on it and if i do notice i'll do a manual update which works first time 99% of the time.
Poor 3G/HSDPA signal (2 bars or less) will cause some crazy packet loss and will cause problems with internet connectivity in general. Most often the phone will fall back to EDGE and then GPRS in order to correct this (but for saking the speed). If the signal is still crap then there is no hope. I'm on O2 and my radio version is in my signature. I was using 2.07 (stock) and that wasn't brilliant and i have heard that the newer radios suck the battery and the wifi isn't so great.
If your signal is pants even with the new radio i would advise you lay your hands on an extended battery and leave the wifi chip turned on. Then if you configure to connect any unsecure networks first as soon as it finds one you'll have net access.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi,
It was set to update every 1 hour and as I said before, there's quite decent signal coverage in my area. I usually have full HSDPA and 3G signal at work and about half of 3G and full GPRS at home. The only time I can think of when I have poor or no connection is on the train (when passing through places with funny welsh names like Llanharran or Pontyclun... ). Still MY LOCATION won't update at work, or central train station or city centre. As a paradox, it updates nicely at home...
Anyway, for sake of having the weather animation on and updating, I have used Dutty's "Disable current location" cab mentioned above. Now the weather service updates fine on manually chosen locations. So bye bye MY LOCATION...

I'm on O2 (UK) and have noticed that all but my local transmitter actually allows weather/location updates.
I did a pretty big test - I drove from the south coast to Edinburgh the other week, and had it updating every 15 mins.
It updated every step of the way.
I'm sitting at home, and it doesn't update.
I've already got hold of my local O2 engineer and he is looking into it as he thinks he knows what the problem is.

The Problem is Orange.....
morningstar.fallen said:
Hi guys,
I don't know how many of you are living in UK or if you experience this in other parts of the world. Basically there's one thing that really annoys me and I can't figure out WHAT'S causing it!
I am well satisfied with my Leo but as to web services I am not so enthusiastic. Firstly I've given up on "My location & weather" services exactly the same way as I did on Blackstone. I just don't bother setting them up after ROM update, so they don't show up on the homescreen and I turn the weather tab off instantly after flash. Reason being: THEY ONLY UPDATE IN CERTAIN LOCATIONS EVEN THOUGH I'VE GOT FULL HSDPA OR 3G SIGNAL COVERAGE ALMOST EVERYWHERE I GO!!!
No idea why this is happening. At home where I've got full 3G and GPRS signal coverage, it updates quickly and nicely. But when I go to work where there's full HSDPA, 3G and also GPRS it will not update whatever trick I try!!! It just pops out a message about not being able to connect... Same thing in town centre and other locations. It seems totally random to me where it works and where it doesn't. And folks: I just hate having 12 hours old location and weather report on my screeen before coming back home or wherever it decides to work!
Now secondly, similar thing happens with web browsers. Because of unsupported flash in Opera I have started using Skyfire in larger scale and recently also the uZARD, if anyone came across to that. They are both good browsers (in my opinion the uZard is nearing perfection!) but strangely a similar issue to the one above comes with them. Again they only seem to work in certain places and again there is quite a decent data coverage almost everywhere in my area.
So the question is: does it have something to do with data services of my network (UK Orange) or is it something radio related maybe? I have tried 2.06, 2.08 and 2.10 radios and there wasn't any significant difference.
Does it ring a bell? Did anyone experience this?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I had the same problem in East Anglia with Orange
Switch of 3g and the weather will update
GPRS data works fine, but 3g/hsdpa data was not working i complained to orange and looked on the net loads of other people in this area were having the same trouble....(voice was fine though)
About 2 weeks ago it started working fine except when im surfing i get 'orange safeguard' blocking sites ...it even blocks this site!
its not because ive got safeguard enabled. it's because orange cant establish my identity!
I bet if streamed loads of TV they would identify me for sure...

on orange in cardiff aswel, i find that even though i have a strong 3g signal some times the internet just doesn't work,which gets really annoying, as normally have to terminate the 3g connection then restart it to work.
been reading this thread if any intrest
forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=614119&page=45
it says about people using the chucky tabtastic ROM, and the problem is gone. but I'm happy with the ROM I'm using, so really wish i knew a fix for this!

On O2 in Nottingham and just recently it's been awful.
I've gone through a multitude of radios and none work with data properly. Weather services always show "My Location" or cannot update. Google maps takes about 10mins to load one square of the map (so GPS navigation is out of the question as the marker moves to a region of the map that isn't updated and takes forever to load).
Opera can now take anywhere between 15 seconds and 5 minutes just to load the Google homepage.
Thing is, about 2 months ago it was perfect, speedy as anything, running fine. Like I said i've gone through various radio roms and have settled on 2.10.50.08_2 at the mo as it gives the best battery life for me, but even with full 3g/hsdpa signals i get rubbish data performance.
I know that stopping and starting the data connection sometimes fixes it, but I'm not prepared to continually stop and start connections just to be able to browse the web.

I've tried switching from 3G to 2G mode at work so the device started using GPRS signal instead of HSDPA but there was no joy either. Initially I would incline to idea that this would be a problem of Orange UK only but it seems now that people using other networks are experiencing the same. I wish I could only guess how much of this is caused by the technical breakdown Orange UK (and maybe other networks?) were recently going through. I think the actual efficiency of MY LOCATION service in UK was never great...

I'm on Vodafone, Kingston upon Thames,
Radio: 2.10.50.26 (Leon Rom)
Had the same problems ( almost all stated in here ) with the new radio i have full bars 70% of the time on almost all connections at home, and before, i used to have 1 max 2 (the house is in a "bad"/"blind" vodafone coverage area), so this radio seems to work for me.
Still:
the weather i won't mention that it never worked regardless of signal or not, regardless of the connection or radio... then i found something into the menu under the GPS folder... called Quick GPS . I realized that is not a data download problem (as any manually set out location works), it was just a simple "i will tell you the local weather info as soon as i bloody find out where the heck we are" phone problem.
Well all you have to do, is set up the satellites to download automatically and/or update manually when you travel extreme distances... it will definitely improve location tracking as it sets the "default" satellites settings in your area, and to be honest with you, since i set that up, i NEVER had weather/location problems at home or anywhere else. Is just a small tweak witch you won't realize is linked directly to the location service until you open the Quick GPS thing.
For the radio, at least for vodafone users, i recommend the above one. just give it a try as it has decent battery life and a better connection, also everywhere i go i seem to have a working stable connection for data (at least for me it worked, and i do travel alot, needles to say that my laptop gets it's internet from my phone during travels, so bye bye dongle ).
Give it a try, it may really work out.
Initially I would incline to idea that this would be a problem of Orange UK only but it seems now that people using other networks are experiencing the same.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hmm... i think is not related to networks more than it needs the network connection to download data (especially that you said the connections are working fine most of the times), location is definitely related to the GPS receiver and the GPS settings (Global Positioning System remember? witch in my book is Location ...), witch apparently on the Leos around UK are not set properly by default.

This is probably why mine works flawlessly. I set WM to use the inbuilt GPS all the time so i don't have to mess about with turning it on in google maps. I don't use QuickGPS because that is about as accurate as as dropping a brick out of a plane at 35,000ft with your eyes closed. Atleast with proper GPS it's accurate to within 20 metres.

when i had the tmobile g1, weather plugin worked almost flawlessly with only odd times it didnt update correctly. but with the hd2 ive been having the same problem recently on tmobile (was on tmobile wiwith the g1 aswell).
Im using the eu rom that allows 576mb ram .
Ive just flashed a new rom and it seems to have detected my location just fine at home. I will know tomorrow when i go to work if it upodates correctly.

DikoMike said:
I'm on Vodafone, Kingston upon Thames,
Radio: 2.10.50.26 (Leon Rom)
Had the same problems ( almost all stated in here ) with the new radio i have full bars 70% of the time on almost all connections at home, and before, i used to have 1 max 2 (the house is in a "bad"/"blind" vodafone coverage area), so this radio seems to work for me.
Still:
the weather i won't mention that it never worked regardless of signal or not, regardless of the connection or radio... then i found something into the menu under the GPS folder... called Quick GPS . I realized that is not a data download problem (as any manually set out location works), it was just a simple "i will tell you the local weather info as soon as i bloody find out where the heck we are" phone problem.
Well all you have to do, is set up the satellites to download automatically and/or update manually when you travel extreme distances... it will definitely improve location tracking as it sets the "default" satellites settings in your area, and to be honest with you, since i set that up, i NEVER had weather/location problems at home or anywhere else. Is just a small tweak witch you won't realize is linked directly to the location service until you open the Quick GPS thing.
For the radio, at least for vodafone users, i recommend the above one. just give it a try as it has decent battery life and a better connection, also everywhere i go i seem to have a working stable connection for data (at least for me it worked, and i do travel alot, needles to say that my laptop gets it's internet from my phone during travels, so bye bye dongle ).
Give it a try, it may really work out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the post man Ive been trying many different Radios to get a stable connection with VF I also live in an iffy area so i'll give this one a try and see if it works for me!
I'm also now using a 2.13 rom so it seems that the radio will match

M3PH said:
This is probably why mine works flawlessly. I set WM to use the inbuilt GPS all the time so i don't have to mess about with turning it on in google maps. I don't use QuickGPS because that is about as accurate as as dropping a brick out of a plane at 35,000ft with your eyes closed. Atleast with proper GPS it's accurate to within 20 metres.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So how exactly did you set your GPS to work all the time?

morningstar.fallen said:
So how exactly did you set your GPS to work all the time?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
easy! go into settings in sense, hit menu, all settings. Then go to the system folder and external GPS and set a com port (mine is set to com4)
Job done. Sense will pick it up automatically and then all you need to do is tell google maps it's configued by windows.
Finally disable quickgps by hitting start, tools quickgps and then menu options and uncheck "download quickgps automatically" and "download quickgps when roaming" this will stop it updating when not connected to the pc and save on your data plan if it's limited but allows for a backup to the true gps if for some reason all the satellites get taken out.
**edit** i picked up this tip from a collegue that had a touch pro (well we all did but i left before they got the n900 upgrades) and a tomtom external bluetooth receiver and it appears to work with the internal reveiver on newer devices

[q] gps & nyc?

Hi,
I know the whole GPS issue has been discussed extensively, but I was wondering whether it even works in new york city. I tried GPSTest and although my phone sees up to 15 satellites, it never locks on to any. I picked up a Vibrant for my wife too -- her phone doesn't even see any satellites (using same setup and GPSTest -- only difference is she has the purple back on hers).
the odd thing is that i tried investigating this on my blackberry curve 8530 (work phone) and it doesn't get a lock either.
so i'm wondering if this a moot issue for nyc residents.
thanks!

I don't have my vibrant yet so I can't test but a Nokia N900 has done well for me in terms of GPS signal in NYC, so I don't think it's *impossible* for smartphone to get GPS signal in NYC, it just may be a bit harder in some areas.

i tried both downtown (wall st area) and all the way uptown (near the cloisters). i'll try more places throughout the week. i did manage to get a "partial fix" with the blackberry -- not sure what that means, just a direct quote.

I am getting a fix within 15-30 secs in Downtown by the Battery Park.
If I move closer to the skyscraper jungle it is a shot in a dark.
EDIT: to add, my coworker with a Captivate couldn't get a fix at all where my Vibrant is solid. We both are using MS-based with supl.google.com SUPL server configured.

GPS Issue, only in some areas. GSM network dependent.

Bit of an odd one. Basically at home with the phone on my home network T-Mobile I simply can't get a GPS fix. This problem has only happened in the last couple of weeks previously its been fine, a fix within seconds.
As some of you may know T-Mobile and Orange in the UK have now enabled roaming between the 2 networks. If I force the phone to roam onto Orange I get a GPS fix with-in a minute. Switch the network back to T-Mobile back to no fix.
If I'm in a different area, network on T-Mobile, fix within seconds. I thought maybe it's quick GPS wrongly loading the wrong area because of an issue in the cell db, I've set quick GPS to never update and now the GPS appears to cold start although quick GPS still says the data it has is valid for x number of days.
I've tried defaulting the phone but exactly the same with defaults and using GPS Test rather than TomTom.
Does anyone have any ideas? Is anyone else having the same issue?

I just tried another test. I roamed onto Orange and got a GPS fix in TomTom, I then set my network back to T-Mobile and the GPS fix was lost! As I switched networks I left TomTom running in the background.

A bit more testing. If I force the phone onto 3G T-Mobile the GPS works fine. My theory is what ever frequency the cell here operates on (some 5 miles away in the 1800MHz band) must be causing the some issue with the hardware
I'm thinking that most people wouldn't be able to experiment to see this, I'm just lucky or unlucky depending on how you look at it that I'm in a position where I can switch networks therefore changing frequency within the 1800MHz band and I can stay in the same place to test it. I've had in the past where the GPS would loose its fix for no reason and then just come back while travelling on a motorway I wonder if this was the same thing. Also the chances of someone owning a HD2 using the GPS and being on a cell who's frequency causes a problem is pretty small, and if your travelling you're likely to just think it's dropped for some reason, and oh yes it's back again now so think no more of it.

You are getting confused between GPS and GPRS.
GPS is the satellite system that you use to pinpoint your location (as with TomTom). If your phone is indoors or has a restricted view of the sky, then it cannot receive a signal.
GPRS is a data connection between your phone and the telecoms company. It is basically 2.5G, which way a intermediate step before 3G became set up.

fred_up said:
You are getting confused between GPS and GPRS.
GPS is the satellite system that you use to pinpoint your location (as with TomTom). If your phone is indoors or has a restricted view of the sky, then it cannot receive a signal.
GPRS is a data connection between your phone and the telecoms company. It is basically 2.5G, which way a intermediate step before 3G became set up.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, completely understand the difference between GPRS and GPS
I've proven with out a doubt that when using the t-mobile cell serving our house (2g) there is no GPS signal. Use another network still 1800 and there is GPS, use 3g, or move to another area on t-mobile there is GPS.
GPS was working at home while on t-mobile upto a couple of weeks ago, I can only think that the cell has had some work done and has changed frequency.

twerki78 said:
No, completely understand the difference between GPRS and GPS
I've proven with out a doubt that when using the t-mobile cell serving our house (2g) there is no GPS signal. Use another network still 1800 and there is GPS, use 3g, or move to another area on t-mobile there is GPS.
GPS was working at home while on t-mobile upto a couple of weeks ago, I can only think that the cell has had some work done and has changed frequency.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Silly question, but have you got AGPS activated? Because it can give you a rough location based upon the local cell transmitter info and any GPS satelite signals you may be recieving.

fred_up said:
Silly question, but have you got AGPS activated? Because it can give you a rough location based upon the local cell transmitter info and any GPS satellite signals you may be receiving.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have AGPS disabled. I doubt my operator supports it. I have tried with QuickGPS disabled and enabled but makes no difference.
If I get a fix while on Orange, leave which ever GPS enabled application I have running, running in the background, force the phone back onto my home network (TMobile), go back to the GPS application there's no fix and no satellite signal being received not even a hint.
I've also tried with the SIM card removed and GPS performs perfectly!

Thank you, I thought I was going mad - my GPS has been working perfectly since I got the phone 6 months ago but in the last week has been dropping out or refusing to start at all.
I tried a hard reset, which fixed the problem until I started driving the next day - after a few minutes TomTom lost it's way. Using a bluetooth GPS proved the signal was good, so I was coming around to the idea that the phone was broken...
I have also now read other users that have had GPS problems when roaming, although usually when switching between countries.
Looking on the T-Mobile website about the orange roaming issue it say 'there might be a few quirky side-effects' but I haven't even signed up for the Orange roaming option, sounds like T-Mobile has changed something for everyone?
I have read that fixing the network choice to manual, not auto, can help with GPS issues while roaming - I've yet to test this.

boomboomer said:
Thank you, I thought I was going mad - my GPS has been working perfectly since I got the phone 6 months ago but in the last week has been dropping out or refusing to start at all.
I tried a hard reset, which fixed the problem until I started driving the next day - after a few minutes TomTom lost it's way. Using a bluetooth GPS proved the signal was good, so I was coming around to the idea that the phone was broken...
I have also now read other users that have had GPS problems when roaming, although usually when switching between countries.
Looking on the T-Mobile website about the orange roaming issue it say 'there might be a few quirky side-effects' but I haven't even signed up for the Orange roaming option, sounds like T-Mobile has changed something for everyone?
I have read that fixing the network choice to manual, not auto, can help with GPS issues while roaming - I've yet to test this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've had the issue for a couple of weeks I would say. Certainly last weekend I couldn't get a fix for ages when I set off and it wasn't until I was a way away from home that the GPS got a fix. This was before the roaming got switch on, of course it doesn't mean they were not doing something with the cell/network.
I too can get a perfect fix with external GPS or with a GPS nav system, or by changing networks! I've also tried another SIM card in the phone, again T-Mobile and get the same results.

I've attached some screen shots.
1st T-mobile no satellites, you'll notice that there isn't so much of hint of signal.
2nd Changing network.
3rd T-Mobile Orange and GPS fix.
All screen shots were taken with the phone in the same place.

Just come back from a drive just to test the GPS. Basically driven 30 miles away from home fixing the phone to T-Mobile and 2G and the only time I got a GPS fix was when the phone lost signal.
Parked in a layby and switched over to orange and got a fix with in a few seconds! Just can't figure out what the connection with being on T-mobile 2g is!

What Radio version is your phone using?

fred_up said:
What Radio version is your phone using?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have the same issue with various official T-Mobile ROMs.
I had a play with updating my AGPS settings last night using the Google settings from this thread: http://ip208-100-42-21.static.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=544421 when working on Orange couldn't notice any difference, with T-Mobile still not GPS fix.
I left the GPS running over night on T-Mobile, admittedly indoors but somewhere I know I get a fix, there was still no fix 7 hours later.

I live in a rural village covered only by one cell mast. GPS starts and runs fine at home with or without the phone turned on. if I walk over the other side of the hill, different cell mast, the GPS drops out immediately - I can't test if 3G fixes the problem as it doesn't work here. Once the GPS has stopped I can't get it to start again, even switching the phone off to airplane mode doesn't help. Only a soft reset, with the phone still in airplane mode will allow the GPS to start.
Switching the phone back on and the GPS drops, however walking back over the hill to home - back to my original cell mast and the GPS starts again.
I'm pretty sure t-mobile have rolled out a change to their 2G system, but not to all masts? rural ones maybe last done hence why my home cell still works.
How to proceed from here? T-Mobile are kind of hard to talk to.....
One thing I did notice was in Memory Map the satellite view normally flicks across satellite numbers until it finds a signal, if the T-Mobile problem occurs this process stops and it would appear to have frozen the service?

I take back the hard to talk to part of my last post, I emailed support from the website and they phoned me back within 2 hours!
As to be expected they couldn't give any instant answers but I gave this thread as a reference and the problem is to be escalated.
The call centerthen phoned me back and asked if I was happy, also to offer me 30 minutes free calls for next 3 months - very nice thank you.

Good work boomboomer. Hopefully T-mobile will find something. I'd like to know what they find, still can't understand the connection between a GSM network and GPS though. I haven't tried a controlled test with flight mode but will try that later. Out of interest what part of the country are you in? maybe it's just a pocket of cells that are affective? I'm in the BA8 postcode area.
The problem certainly only affects 2G, 3G is fine.
I'm out of the country this week but fingers crossed T-Mobile will find the problem. It's nice to know I'm not the only one with a problem.

I'm quite a distance away, DT2 here.
I've been asked to test the GPS over the next few days and keep a log of when and where it doesn't work, they said their network people will ring me soon.
At least this fault is 'interesting' in the words of their technical support guy, he'd never heard of anything like it, so there's hope they will give it some time.
On the plus side they've also given me a free month of internet, so I can't fault their customer support focus.
Incidentally, do you have SPB shell installed? This was the only change I'd made on my phone at the time this problem started.

boomboomer said:
I'm quite a distance away, DT2 here.
I've been asked to test the GPS over the next few days and keep a log of when and where it doesn't work, they said their network people will ring me soon.
At least this fault is 'interesting' in the words of their technical support guy, he'd never heard of anything like it, so there's hope they will give it some time.
On the plus side they've also given me a free month of internet, so I can't fault their customer support focus.
Incidentally, do you have SPB shell installed? This was the only change I'd made on my phone at the time this problem started.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I didn't get chance to do any testing today at Heathrow as ended up being a bit rushed. I wouldn't say your not a million miles away. 22miles ish, the Cell that covers our home is in Dorset which is pretty useless when you have to call 999 because you get connected to Dorset who then can't pass you to Somerset and you end up being in a situation where you have no way of contacting Somerset 999 not great in this day and age! But I'm not going to get started on that one on this topic.
It's quite possible its a regional problem.
No I haven't installed SPB shell, I have tried it with a defaulted phone but still had the same problem.
I'm out the country now until Friday, but will do some testing when I return on my return journey. I'll fix the phone to 2g T-mobile and keep an eye on where the GPS drops out.

Oh dear, just got a call from T-Mobile technical networks - they don't support GPS as part of their service and won't be spending any time on the problem, case closed. They did say the problem seems to be with HTC devices only, blackberrys are not effected so it sounds like they have heard of the issue eleswhere?
Looks like it's a network switch required to solve the problem, shame that as I've been with T-Mobile for over 7 years.

boomboomer said:
Oh dear, just got a call from T-Mobile technical networks - they don't support GPS as part of their service and won't be spending any time on the problem, case closed. They did say the problem seems to be with HTC devices only, blackberrys are not effected so it sounds like they have heard of the issue eleswhere?
Looks like it's a network switch required to solve the problem, shame that as I've been with T-Mobile for over 7 years.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hmm, T-Mobile sold me the phone for use on their network, the phone is sold with a GPS, that now doesn't work on their network surely they need to spend sometime working with HTC to resolve the problem.
I do have a case open with HTC under the ref 10gbc410001235 they were supposed to be taking it up with tier 2 but as yet I've not heard anything back. I'll have to follow it up when I'm back in the UK. It might be worth you also logging a fault with HTC quoting my ref. at least if 2 people call in with the same problem they may start to think it's not just one crazy with the issue!
My other half has a HTC Desire, I haven't checked the GPS on her phone. Not sure if they use the same chipset, of course one is WM the other android. I wonder if its a problem for all HTC phones or just the HD2?