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Hi,
I noticed that OS constantly unloads my applications.
Say, I visit some page using IE, then switch to another application, then switch back - it is usually at the same page, but, probably depending on idle time, it sporadically gets closed.
That said, when I go to IE again, it starts afresh on its initial page and I must reload my page again. Needless to say, in most cases this is unacceptable. (extra traffic, so it costs $$, also GPRS could become unavailable etc :x )
How do I PREVENT this behaviour?
Not only IE suffers, any application! Sporadically exits despite of fact there are tons of free memory and I would better free resources with another way than just closing what is required for me.
I have elder device with PocketPC 3.0 (Cassiopeia E-125) and it does NOT behave in such a way. Does not close even it has 4times less memory! Now I understand how nice it is.
While this problem persists, I forced to have both devices with me.
Please help me solving this!
Vadim.
I've noticed the same behavior randomly also. I don't have a fix, but you're not alone.
What ROM version are you using? There was an issue with the earlier ROMS in that there were too many programs running and when you launched another program the OS would terminate a background program to provide the necesssary process space.
The newer ROMs have solved this problem, but CheckNotify and ClearNotify (search the forum) will help with the earlier ROMs.
This is an old problem, related to the number of running processes.
Consult this thread
http://www.ppcw.net/?itemid=1645
which will show you how to solve it. Also the newer roms cut down on the number of processes at startup, which helps.
Surur
Mine is much more random than that described. Sometimes I can have a half dozen apps open with no problem, and sometimes a single app will close itself while I work in the phone or the Today screen.
Carlos said:
Mine is much more random than that described. Sometimes I can have a half dozen apps open with no problem, and sometimes a single app will close itself while I work in the phone or the Today screen.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't forget that we are talking processes, not appications, here. One app. may have many processes and multiple app's may use the same common processes. Therefore, launching one application can generate a number of new processes and that can push you over the limit (e.g. ActiveSync, which launches three or four I recall), so something gets nuked.
I understand, and was looking for a pattern, but there is none. In fact, it seems reversed, as it happens more often while I'm just out and about and less frequenty while the device is in the cradle. Very often it happens after a fresh boot with a single app running.
I may look at it more closely with a process viewer. It's not bugging me enough to make it a priority.
Thank you all for providing many help!
surur said:
This is an old problem, related to the number of running processes.
Consult this thread
http://www.ppcw.net/?itemid=1645
which will show you how to solve it. Also the newer roms cut down on the number of processes at startup, which helps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That explains it all, many fruitful comments, and a prove that there could be no fix but just temporary solutions to reduce a problem a bit.
It is a bit larger problem in my case, because I use special sotware to support Russian.
Too bad MS can't recognize and fix such a big design mistakes.
Since no one replied to this message in the official CM 5.0 thread. I have decided to create a new thread and hope to find a solution to this problem.
My alarm clock would stop working randomly ever since I flashed to CM 5.0, from Beta 4 to 5..2, the problem persists. If i set an alarm that is about one hour from now, it would go off. But the real alarm I need which is supposed to go off at 8 am in the morning never goes off. Anyone had similar problems? I read Cyanogen's warning about the alarm clock problem. But seems he's just trying to remind you to reset your alarm after flashing to CM. Unluckily, I've reset my alarm numerous times and it never goes off in the morning.
Anyone can give me a hand? Thanks in advance! Overall, CM is a great ROM which gives me the option to use open vpn, which is vital for me since I'm living in China behind the GFW.
Are you by chance using any taskillers?
I do use a task-killer program. But I always keep the clock app on while i'm sleeping to try to make sure the alarm goes off on time. But it never does in the morning.
Don't use task killers on the N1, there really is no need.
cyanogen said:
Don't use task killers on the N1, there really is no need.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wouldn't say that's accurate... The phone does slow down noticeably when you have 20-30+ things open
Sometimes a lot of them are running as well (using TasKiller, a lot of Yellow, including Camera, Gmail etc even when not in use and no emails being downloaded). This probably affects battery life as well.
Paul22000 said:
I wouldn't say that's accurate... The phone does slow down noticeably when you have 20-30+ things open
Sometimes a lot of them are running as well (using TasKiller, a lot of Yellow, including Camera, Gmail etc even when not in use and no emails being downloaded). This probably affects battery life as well.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do you have any evidence to back this up? Yes this was a problem on older devices because many things would be fighting over the tiny amount of RAM.
You'll see lots of processes running but that's just the way Android works. Since it doesn't really benefit from simple caching like a normal linux system would, it just keeps everything running and kills unused stuff when memory is low. Most of the things you see running are either paused and using no CPU, or are services that would be periodically launched anyway.
http://developer.android.com/guide/topics/fundamentals.html#lcycles
Keeping these processes alive should actually be saving you battery rather than using it. It's more expensive to launch and restore the state of an application or service after being killed than it is to simply resume one that's been paused.
cyanogen said:
Do you have any evidence to back this up? Yes this was a problem on older devices because many things would be fighting over the tiny amount of RAM.
You'll see lots of processes running but that's just the way Android works. Since it doesn't really benefit from simple caching like a normal linux system would, it just keeps everything running and kills unused stuff when memory is low. Most of the things you see running are either paused and using no CPU, or are services that would be periodically launched anyway.
http://developer.android.com/guide/topics/fundamentals.html#lcycles
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes. The phone gets slow when TasKiller shows 30 things in it. I click close all, and it's faster. Do you know my personal experiences more than I do?
Paul22000 said:
Yes. The phone gets slow when TasKiller shows 30 things in it. I click close all, and it's faster. Do you know my personal experiences more than I do?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think there is likely one or two specific misbehaving applications that are giving you trouble, rather than the way the system works as a whole, thats all.
I think what Cyanogen is saying is that android does not handle running processes the way other os's do They have a lifecycle that is non-obvious to someone just looking at a process list. If you insist on killing tasks outside of the activity/service lifecycle they you _will_ get service failures (like the alarm clock) its up to you what you value more.
I have not installed any sort of task manager (outside what's in astro but I don't use it) and never see any noticeable slow down.
Anyway - back on topic.
Yes I have the same issue, never had it before.
Since flashine 5.0.2 my alarm doesn't work in the morning.
The linux kernel keeps a buffer cache of recently used files in RAM. So whenever an application wants to access something on the flash, instead of going to the flash file system, it can just get it from the file buffer cache in RAM, a significant speed increase.
If the RAM is currently being taken up by unused android apps, then that leaves less room for the buffer cache, so in theory, by killing off unused android apps more quickly, that will allow the linux kernel to allocate more space for the buffer cache and thus speeding up the system.
Am I way off here?
Dave
cyanogen said:
Do you have any evidence to back this up? Yes this was a problem on older devices because many things would be fighting over the tiny amount of RAM.
You'll see lots of processes running but that's just the way Android works. Since it doesn't really benefit from simple caching like a normal linux system would, it just keeps everything running and kills unused stuff when memory is low. Most of the things you see running are either paused and using no CPU, or are services that would be periodically launched anyway.
http://developer.android.com/guide/topics/fundamentals.html#lcycles
Keeping these processes alive should actually be saving you battery rather than using it. It's more expensive to launch and restore the state of an application or service after being killed than it is to simply resume one that's been paused.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would have to agree with Cyanogen on this one. When I first got my N1, I looked towards task killers to help alleviate slowdown, but in the end, I think it's just the placebo effect in a way; you did something to try to solve the problem, and so therefore you perceive a difference.
In other words, task killers aren't needed on this beast of a phone. As for battery life (if that's an issue), look into SetCpu.
Thanks for the reply Cyanogen. I think not using task-killer, or at least not killing the clock app got my alarm working this morning. But I use task-killer not for the purpose of saving ram, but for using less data. Some programs such as facebook or a twitter client would try to connect to the internet every once in a while. I'm on a low data limit plan in China. So I don't want those programs to eat up all my data. When I'm on wifi at home, I don't worry about that. Thanks again.
Same problem. Don't use taskkillers, flashed last CM last night and didn't wake up on time this morning - alarm didn't work, thought I checked that clock icon was on place on notification bar
amwayorlando said:
But I use task-killer not for the purpose of saving ram, but for using less data. Some programs such as facebook or a twitter client would try to connect to the internet every once in a while. I'm on a low data limit plan in China. So I don't want those programs to eat up all my data.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have you thought about using something like APNDroid or Toggle Data, to just switch off the cell data when you don't want to use it?
Or, Modify the behavior of the applications you don't want using data?
I have my facebook and twitter for example set to manual update only (for battery saving purposes) because there's nothing there that is critical important info, and I don't need to be notified.
Nice thread though, I'm pretty sure I try to keep people informed that task-killers aren't needed and cause issues, everywhere where it comes up. I find humor that people will still argue, even with a developer, this fact. I've had 150+ hours uptime with no slowdown (and 30 apps running) on the stock rom (without highmem support).
bofslime said:
Or, Modify the behavior of the applications you don't want using data?
I have my facebook and twitter for example set to manual update only (for battery saving purposes) because there's nothing there that is critical important info, and I don't need to be notified.
Nice thread though, I'm pretty sure I try to keep people informed that task-killers aren't needed and cause issues, everywhere where it comes up. I find humor that people will still argue, even with a developer, this fact. I've had 150+ hours uptime with no slowdown (and 30 apps running) on the stock rom (without highmem support).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then please inform us of a thread that can verify what you all are saying. Not in an argumentative tone, my linpack score drastically improves after 16 hours of uptime, and a task-killer.
Rom:CM 5.0.2 -OC Kernel
wesbalmer said:
Then please inform us of a thread that can verify what you all are saying. Not in an argumentative tone, my linpack score drastically improves after 16 hours of uptime, and a task-killer.
Rom:CM 5.0.2 -OC Kernel
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This has basically been discussed into the ground. In my eye's, its a fight vs what I like to call "Windows XP mentality", and that there was benefit on phones like the G1. With the copious amounts of memory on the N1 and droid, they cause way more harm, and immeasurable good (if any).
Summary thread: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=627836
I've linked to quotes from others.
Threads/posts of interest: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=5494890#post5494890
And: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=5298630#post5298630
Well, this discussion is very interesting, but lets return to our problem with non-working alarm.
Is something wrong with my phone? My Quadrant scores are NO where NEAR where they should be. I just got a whopping 872 I avg 900-1000. I know it might not matter, and that those scores can be manipulated. But a few have suggested this might actually indicate that my phone is messed up and if so – I want to get another one from Sprint.
Basics – I am rooted, custom rom (myn’s), stock htc10 kernel. I don’t know what other information is need to get help with this. I have tried running Q scores as soon as I do a wipe cache/dalvik thinking maybe it’s just slow after that stuff clogs it up. Same result. I have tried moving as much stuff off my sd card and now leave about 1.5 available ( I’ve slimmed my music down as much as I’m willing to do . I’ve tried running the Q score with the kernel set to performance, etc. I saw 1250-1350 one time, but I was using a kernel that was so unstable on my phone I had to ditch it pretty fast (multiple reboots, severe lag, etc).
I also wonder if there is something wrong with my phone because it does not seem to be able to handle anything other than the stock kernel very well. The phone completely spazzzes out with almost every kernel I have tried except for two. I am happy with the stock and have no complaints about battery life. I use the phone when I want and how I want and easily go 24hrs without having to charge. But the fact that only stock and 2 other kernels (king’11 and netarchys) are stable makes me wonder….
If anyone has any suggestions, opinion, thoughts, etc I would appreciate. I have searched and not seen this specific issue addressed.
If this helps, when I check my Running Services, this is what I see and this list varies very little.
Blik Calendar Widget
Y5 Battery Saver
More Icons Widget
AndLock
Handscent SMS
Antivirus
Calendar
Com.smithmicro.dm (have no idea what this is)
New and Weather (I have use the glass clock)
Google Service Framework (cloud to device; messaging)
HTC DM (no idea)
HTC IQAgent (no idea)
Voicemail
Ultra Keyboard
Def sounds sluggy.
My recommendation would unfortunately be to start from scratch. Backup only needed apps that you may not be able to download from the market and completely wipe, flash a stock OTA root ROM, completely wipe again, and flash whatever ROM you like after that.
I know it sounds like a huge PITA, but it should definitely help out.
I had a similar situation once, and this did the trick.
Ugh. Ok. I can try that. I did a full wipe/factory reset less than 2 weeks ago. I use Titanium so getting it all back up is not bad. I also sync to AppBrain so at least if I start with a clean slate I would know what Apps I did have.
Thanks for the help and suggestion.
to eliminate as many variables as possible, i'd do a nand backup, install your ROM of choice with no additional apps except the ones you use to benchmark and perform your tests. give it an hour or so after you flash to let the phone settle down (sync, etc.). you may have apps may be hogging resources or be running in the background (i.e. y5, antivirus) which will effect your tests. report back.
I will try that way first
Yes - antivirus and Y5 are always running in the background. Always.
ha - maybe I'll freeze most of the apps I listed as Running Services, wipe cache/dalvik, reboot and THEN see what I get. But I'm not ever going to realically run my phone without Y5, Handscent, UltraKeyboard, antivirus, etc. I could probably get rid of the More Icons widget now that I have Apps Organizer, but I really really like having one, 1/3 page widget with 8 icones that have ALL my apps organized.
Does your phone seem slow? That is what I would base the speed of my phone on not some q-score. What if you never ran the test would you be concerned.?.?
I would try this http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=836728 after your nand backup. That has the latest ota, kernel and you would not loose root.
I'll have time on Sunday to try some of the suggestions. Thanks again for the help, I really do appreciate it. I was with a friend this evening, his Evo is rooted and running Myn's rls3 just like mine. He scored around 1300.
And no - my phone doesn't seem slow to me at all. But I've also not used another to know how it might "feel" if there is a difference. I more curious than anything - I tend to research things to death just so I'll know. And I find it curious that my phone is both low on Q scores and can't handle many kernels without it spazzing out.
So I searched and could not find a thread that compiled tips and tricks people use to increase their battery life and get the most ram or memory available.
This way we can put everything together so you don't have to search through a bunch of threads or posts to get information.
I'll start with mine first.
Battery and memory usually go hand in hand, but specifically for the battery I use Juice Defender (Ultimate). I got it to last 31 hours before with minor use. Even the free one said it increased my life 1.5x
I use Titanium Backup to freeze certain programs that run in the background, like the social networking ones since I dont use those along with wallpapers and non-essential system services like the Weather and date/time services. It would be nice to compile a list of all the services you can freeze without messing up the phone, I usually freeze a couple and then test my phone out.
Not having a lot of widgets or background programs running also helps.
I found programs that prevent start-up programs usually fail, the app starts anyways. Task killers also don't seem to work, the app just starts back up. The only one I have used with some success is "Free Memory", it seems to work.
I'm interested in other peoples methods, along with their normal battery life and how much free memory they have.
Somehow I went from having around 450MB free to only having 250MB, which really gets bad if I want to use the webtop and have a bunch of crap open. I might try to reflash it and start over, I went a little app crazy for a few days.
If people want, list the (system) apps you were able to safely remove along with ones you were able to freeze and I can make a list in this post. I would add mine but my phone is acting up right now.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...26699&_sacat=See-All-Categories&_fvi=1&_rdc=1
No, I'm not kidding either. I have three batteries for the Atrix. I go through about two a day. I run them all the way down, phone shuts off, I replace, and I have a 100% ready to go. Saved me in many instances. It sounds really convoluted, but it works.
I recommend installing widgetsoid and actively managing wifi.
Check out an app called Watchdog.
Basically what you should have instead of a task killer.
Instead of killing tasks wantonly, Watchdog simply monitors the CPU % each task/app/element running is consuming. You can custom set detection thresholds or leave the defaults, but whenever that threshold is crossed, you can get a little alert for it (customizable too). It tells you the app that's been acting up and give you the option of killing, ignoring, or "whitelisting" (permanent ingore, basically) it. The paid version also allows you to "blacklist" processes (permanent kill).
I would definitely recommend it.
For reasons I don't understand, most if not all of my live tiles stopped updating with in the last week or so. Mi have tried every "fix" I can find posted on Microsoft help and WPCentral forums, ( soft reset, stopping background agents, unpunished and pinning tiles, etc) but nothing has resolved the problem although others report that these have. I am heading for a hard reset, something I very much don't want to do.
Looking for any solutions, suggestions, etc.
gmfeld said:
For reasons I don't understand, most if not all of my live tiles stopped updating with in the last week or so. Mi have tried every "fix" I can find posted on Microsoft help and WPCentral forums, ( soft reset, stopping background agents, unpunished and pinning tiles, etc) but nothing has resolved the problem although others report that these have. I am heading for a hard reset, something I very much don't want to do.
Looking for any solutions, suggestions, etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've never had this issue on WP8 but on WP7 I had something almost similar to your issue. It turned out to be an app; If I remember correctly on mine it was a battery meter app, it was conflicting with my other apps over background usage or something. Try deleting any recent apps that use the background services especially the free apps. I recently had another issue where my battery was draining, after delete recently downloaded free apps one at a time the issue went way.
sinister1 said:
I've never had this issue on WP8 but on WP7 I had something almost similar to your issue. It turned out to be an app; If I remember correctly on mine it was a battery meter app, it was conflicting with my other apps over background usage or something. Try deleting any recent apps that use the background services especially the free apps. I recently had another issue where my battery was draining, after delete recently downloaded free apps one at a time the issue went way.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Should have tried that, but I did a hard reset. Everything now working, but it took a lot of time.
Many WP users are experiencing this problem, Microsoft must look into it,coz Live tiles are what differentiate WP from other OS.