I love my 8525 to death and I had thought it would fulfill just about any need I could possibly want in a cell phone (especially considering the impressive modding capability). Surprisingly, I discovered that it is lacking in one area: web browsing. This became more pronounced after I used the Xperia X1 for the first time.
Right now, the phones I'm considering are:
1) Xperia X1
2) HTC Touch Pro2
3) Toshiba G900
4) Toshiba TG01 (*drools*)
5) Let me cut it short: Basically any phone with 480x800 res or higher
So after mulling it over and doing an enormous amount of research, two particular points are sticking out in my mind: the importance of PPI (pixels per inch) and processors. To break it down:
1) I've been informed that screen clarity depends a lot on PPI and, basically, the more ppi you have, the better. Is this true?
2) There have been issues in the past regarding HTC and Qualcomm drivers. Is this still an issue in new phones?
Thank you to all.
Out of all those phones, the only one you'll one you can buy right now, and likely for quite some time is the X1, so that should make your decision much easier. And by the time those devices make it to the market, you'll likely be drooling over the Touch Pro 3 leaks.
Oh, and yes, Qualcom still sucks in all newer devices. Either use Core Player or just avoid movies altogether.
FYI: You clearly have an apetite for WVGA, just be aware, that many programs aren't compatible with that resolution. For example, the commerically available version of TomTom doesn't work.
Oh, I wish it made my decision easier, but as a traditionally patient guy, I'm all too willing to wait for the other phones. You also might be right about me drooling over the Touch Pro 3 leaks when those phones make it out, but I certainly hope not. I was completely happy with the 8525 in virtually all aspect, save for the web browsing experience, so if I could mitigate that, I might be able to hold the gadget beast inside of me.
It's also a shame about the Qualcomm thing. It wasn't just movies that I was actually concerned with, but general usage. Lack of drivers essentially made everything slower than it should be, doesn't it?
Lastly, from my usage of the Xperia X1, I realized the potential for problems concerning the screen. However, the only problem I encountered so far is with Java games. Everything else worked fine. I got Tomtom to work perfectly fine too (well, I got look fine. I'm still tweaking to get the GPS to actually function).
Well I say either go for the X1 or be patient until after the Touch Pro 2. I honestly feel that the TP2 will be an end of cycle device.
1. Hopefully WM7 will be making its debut maybe 2 to 3 Quarters later. (We have no idea what WM7 may require storage wise or even screen wise...capacitative?)
2. We are at the limit for the SDHC spec with 32GB cards not too far off, we will likely see devices carrying the SDXC spec next year.
I just have this feeling that unless you get a nicely priced carrier subsidized TP2, you will likely fell upset about having spent so much money if the TP2 isn't seemlessly upgradeable in the future. Besides, the TP2 is more of a software upgrade to current devices as it carries similar specs with the exception of a larger screen.
Thanks for responding, Sonus.
Concerning the TP2 being an end of cycle device, I'm not sure what that is. Do you mean it's the last device HTC makes before it starts developing devices with better specs? If so, I guess it's entirely possible. HTC seems to be big with Qualcomm processors, and Qualcomm has introduced those new Snapdragon processors. Of course, keeping up with new SD formats and Windows Mobile is important too.
I'm also not certain what you mean by 'seamlessly upgradeable'? Personally, I think the Touch Pro 2 sounds like a great phone. However, as I said before, I am a patient guy. I would be all too willing to wait for the new HTC devices (or whatever other company's devices), but it would make it a lot easier to start waiting if only HTC announces something.
8525Smart said:
Thanks for responding, Sonus.
Concerning the TP2 being an end of cycle device, I'm not sure what that is. Do you mean it's the last device HTC makes before it starts developing devices with better specs? If so, I guess it's entirely possible. HTC seems to be big with Qualcomm processors, and Qualcomm has introduced those new Snapdragon processors. Of course, keeping up with new SD formats and Windows Mobile is important too.
I'm also not certain what you mean by 'seamlessly upgradeable'? Personally, I think the Touch Pro 2 sounds like a great phone. However, as I said before, I am a patient guy. I would be all too willing to wait for the new HTC devices (or whatever other company's devices), but it would make it a lot easier to start waiting if only HTC announces something.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Cosidering that you have a "buissness oriented device" and assuming you want to keep on that "line", I´ll erase from the list:
1) Xperia X1 ERRASED
2) HTC Touch Pro2
3) Toshiba G900 ERRASED
4) Toshiba TG01 ERRASED
So same as you, I am comming form an exelent device: UNI, also buissness oriented and the only one I can see on the sooner future is TP2
More similar to Hermes than to Universal
I have patience...
Meh, it doesn't really bother me whether the phone is 'business oriented' or not. Basically, when I purchase a phone, I look for three things:
1) Specs
2) Design (i.e. keyboard and frontal hard buttons)
3) OS
So long as all of the above fits my requirements, I'm good to go. Of course, if the device is meant as a successor to the TyTN, then it's all the better as it would make the transition easier (I suppose), but I don't think it's that important.
To be honest, I don't understand the difference between a 'business oriented' device and otherwise anyway. So long as the OS is Windows Mobile, it seems to be most anything a 'business oriented' device is capable of is also possible on another phone, save for the hardware specific things, such as GPS or FM radio, of course.
8525Smart said:
Thanks for responding, Sonus.
Concerning the TP2 being an end of cycle device, I'm not sure what that is. Do you mean it's the last device HTC makes before it starts developing devices with better specs? If so, I guess it's entirely possible. HTC seems to be big with Qualcomm processors, and Qualcomm has introduced those new Snapdragon processors. Of course, keeping up with new SD formats and Windows Mobile is important too.
I'm also not certain what you mean by 'seamlessly upgradeable'? Personally, I think the Touch Pro 2 sounds like a great phone. However, as I said before, I am a patient guy. I would be all too willing to wait for the new HTC devices (or whatever other company's devices), but it would make it a lot easier to start waiting if only HTC announces something.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey smart, you got my points exactly. I think the TP2 generation of devices will be the last with the 528Mhz Qualcom processor, and maybe the last of devices before SDXC cards start being produced. As for "seamless upgrades", I just mean attaining a bug free upgrade path to WM7. You have a Hermes, so I am sure that you are familiar with the issues and sometimes persistant bugs that present themselves when upgrading to ROMs with newer OS's.
If you want a look at the future according the HTC (at least for 2009) look here:
http://www.gsmarena.com/htc_2009_roadmap_leaks_in_pictures_seems_quite_promising-news-733.php
Sonus,
I see what you mean now and you're right. I did my fair share of upgrading/changing OSes on the Hermes and I also read a few threads concerning why some things simply can't work, so I am somewhat familiar with the importance of updated hardware. WM7, I believe, is supposed to be a milestone, so I think it's all the more important to keep a phone capable of upgrading to that.
Concerning HTC's roadmap, to be honest, I'm a bit surprised by some of those phones. It's a bit difficult to follow the roadmap, but it seems to me the most likely device to get a specs upgrade is the Thoth and possibly the Topaz. It may just be my interpretation, however.
Nonetheless, thank you for the link. It's enjoyable to see HTC's plans for the future and where XDA may go as a result.
8525Smart said:
Concerning HTC's roadmap, to be honest, I'm a bit surprised by some of those phones. It's a bit difficult to follow the roadmap, but it seems to me the most likely device to get a specs upgrade is the Thoth and possibly the Topaz. It may just be my interpretation, however.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Update on the list (This time w/specs!):
http://wmpoweruser.com/?p=3428
Another thanks, Sonus. From the looks of things, the Firestone is the next HTC phone to look out for, though I'm disappointed it's only clocked at 600Mhz instead of 1Ghz.
Related
Hello all, as the title states I'm thinking of buying a Universal. I've lurked this site for a couple of weeks now and have lots of questiones answered but some are still lingering. I am a Palm user using a Sony UX-50 I'm hooked on this form factor tablet and laptop modes( one of the reasons I like the Universal similar from factor). But it has no phone capability which makes for carrying a phone. So I have a Symbian OS mobile phone(SX-1). The Palm device has piss poor battery life for on line use; and the phone has version 1 OS that cannot be upgraded and a lot of the software being created is not backwards compatible so I miss a lot of the apps that are coming out.
Which brings me here... when the Universal came out I thought it was the best converged device brought to market, but the price tag was too steep and rumours(at that time) was the OS was very unstable; times have changed prices have dropped and there are many ROM upgrades for this device so I'm thinking about getting one.
One of my concerns is the Caller id issue I have a headset that displays #'s but would like to have name as well per this thread http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=264700&highlight=Bluetooth+caller+id
I would like to get the Tekkeon headset and be able to see the phonebook not sure if this is possible with Jetware software.
Also the use of Dual sim cards I know it will work per this thread http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=246114&highlight=dual+sim+holder but can it work without turning off and on the phone I believe it was a paticular ROM upgrade that made it possible?
But my biggest concern is the future; I know technology is always moving forward and newer and better devices come out every 6 months. This device seems to be expandable ie. people are using WM6 already unlike my Palm and Symbian OS that are not able to upgrade their systems; it seems that this OS or device is able to keep moving forward with technology. I have many many more questions but will search for those answers.
Anyways thanks for reading this and any and all help is appreciated.
I suggest you goto a local store that stock them and have a play around first before spending your hard-earned cash. I'm always worried when someone mentions how long a particular pda/mobile will last..its entirely down to the individual. Most people buy what's available at the time they can afford it. I've known friends that have owned pdas and mobiles for years and are still content with them. You need to ask yourself if the universal is what you're looking for. There's a significant difference in size compared to a sony clie ux50. However if youre looking for that perfect convergence device, I doubt you'll find the answer...its horses for courses unfortunately.
Thanks for the reply; it's not the life span perse but the upgradability of the OS will this device be able to handle; let say WM7.5? The UX is still on par with most PDA's today but its life cycle is coming to an end Sony pulled out of that market warranties are nonexistent.
The size is not that much of a deal breaker for me; I toyed with one a year ago and liked it. I guess I'm down to the little details. I guess, like other people I'm looking for the Ultimate converged device and so far this seems to be the closeset out there.
Cheers
ok..however theres no real guarantee at all that there will be further upgrades to the Universal. Look at the HP hx4700 for example. It was the top of the range HP pda for a while until HP decided to discontinue it, but a Windows Mobile 5 upgrade was made officially available for it. Alas, its still a dicontinued pda and its future remains at an end. Its obvious that the Universal will have a successor, and manufacturers will continue to produce better, more efficient devices. The Universal will eventually be superceeded and discontinued, however it will have a following. There is currently a WM5 Crossbow rom, albeit in different flavours, available that works quite well, especially Helmi's version, and hopefully a newer build will be out soon so theres plenty of life left in the Universal. I've had mine for over a year now and am very pleased with its functionality. In fact, the newer rom makes it a more interesting device to own. I've also owned most other pda/mobiles and have found I return to the Universal for its vga screen, keyboard, speed and overall class above the rest status. Remember, you're at the best stage to be contemplating its purchase as its had more than 12 months of "shelf-life", and as newer roms become available, it will get better.
Thats so true, I am an early watcher; but late adopter, so with that I will be getting one.
Hey xda´s!
Today I´m getting my own HD2 from england and I can´t wait to hold it in my hands
But I have some questions about the phone.
The first one is...Will the HD2 be upgradeable to Wiindows Phone 7 or if it will not be official upgradeable will the xda´s can do it? I know its early to ask about WM7 because there are not really many specs out about it yet but I would like to know what you think about that
And my second question is...Will the HD2 with it´s capacitive screen have full "multitouch" aahh sorry "pinch to zoom" support on WM7?
...or will the xda´s enable more multitouch gestures in the next weeks or months?
There have been tons of queries about this subject, please use the search before posting. It's probably safe to say that HTC won't be giving us WinMo7 the official way, but I'm sure the XDA community will find a way getting it to our beloved HD2 "the other way"
it will be possible congrats for ur new mob you'll love it
Yep! Thats right! If not Officially, you can bet that Win Mo 7 will be made available on the HD2 by the talented devs here. And not just that, we might even get Android to run on it!
Congrats on your purchase!
Tanmay® said:
..., we might even get Android to run on it!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thats a point i never got...
Why do people want to port Android on Wimo Phones? I you like Andorid, why don't you directly buy an Android phone which was designed for the operating system. I guess thats better than having a bad ported version running on a phone desigend for windows mobile.
actually this subject is non sense.
LordK said:
Thats a point i never got...
Why do people want to port Android on Wimo Phones? I you like Andorid, why don't you directly buy an Android phone which was designed for the operating system.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
People do it because, in the case of the HTC Leo/HD2, there's not one piece of hardware quite like it being sold with Android installed.
I guess smartphones are quickly becoming the new PCs & Laptops of the age. Some people buy a PC with an OS installed as default, they like the hardware but not the OS (usually Windows, maybe OSx) so they just format the HDD and install say Ubuntu etc etc.
jagnet said:
People do it because, in the case of the HTC Leo/HD2, there's not one piece of hardware quite like it being sold with Android installed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah but you will never get a well-performing port until an OEM makes a device with the same hardware. Who's going to make the drivers for you?
vangrieg said:
Yeah but you will never get a well-performing port until an OEM makes a device with the same hardware. Who's going to make the drivers for you?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's true. Though the Acer A1 and Xperia X3 both use snapdragon so drivers (or partial drivers) will undoubtedly make their way to the porting project.
Yes but then you will have Android devices with the same level of hardware as HD2! So the initial question remains - why not buy them instead of coping with inevitable problems with ports?
It's not like drivers instantly start working when you copy them from one device to another, even with the same hardware platform - check out the video drivers thread to see what I mean. You're doomed to have problems like battery drain or calls dropping or poor performance in some areas or what not.
Then there will be some problems with applications - I don't know about the new devices, but all the current Android ones have low-res screens.
In addition to that, you really want 2.0 with Sense, and there's no port of that available AFAIK. Plain Android is just dull, it's nothing to fret about, IMO.
I understand the fun of porting and making things work, but using that as your primary device? It's guaranteed to be worse than what you have now.
Neither of those devices have 4.3 inch touchscreens. Also The HD2 has a look and feel all of its own.
The only thing spoiling it for me is Windows Mobile and the terrible onscreen keyboard so if we could port Android to this device I would be elated as it has a much better marketplace (Windows Marketplace is really a sack over overpriced crap), less cludge and better built in apps - the Youtube app for example supports user subscriptions and favourites viewing, and I'm a big online video fan.
The fact that Android was built from the ground up for capacitive touchscreen devices rather than being a patched up ropey old operating system with a shell interface on top makes me drool at the idea of it being on the HD2, and YES we could buy an Android device of similar specification BUT where's the fun in that??? Check the name of this site.........................
Well, I'm not on the Google/Android hype bandwagon, I do admit that the UI out of the box there is much more finger friendly and the notifications are implemented in the best way among all the mobile phone OSes, but otherwise Android's greatness is blown out of all reasonable proportion. An Android crippled by driver incompatibilities/incomplete implementation is something that totally misses the concept of attractive in my terms...
That said, I'm sure I'll install it myself one day (via haret or otherwise) just out of curiosity, that would certainly serve to satisfying the geek in me. But to expect that your experience from using the device would improve is somewhat unrealistic.
I am happy with the HD2 and figured I would decide what platform to go with at the time of my next phone purchase. This report should mean I can try out Windows Mobile 7 on the HD2 and take that into consideration as well.
http://msmobiles.com/news.php/8793.html
CAH000 said:
I am happy with the HD2 and figured I would decide what platform to go with at the time of my next phone purchase. This report should mean I can try out Windows Mobile 7 on the HD2 and take that into consideration as well.
http://msmobiles.com/news.php/8793.html
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
nice, i can't wait
MSmobiles is full of **** as usual. They post BS to get hits every once in a while.
Article released today, brought to my attention by a friend.
http://apcmag.com/microsoft-no-windows-phone-7-upgrade-for-windows-mobile-6x-devices.htm
What do you think?
morpheus1982 said:
Article released today, brought to my attention by a friend.
http://apcmag.com/microsoft-no-windows-phone-7-upgrade-for-windows-mobile-6x-devices.htm
What do you think?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Tip for HTC disable 2 buttons with a upgrade ... lol
Just another example of M$ shafting existing customers, to make them buy a new phone. And I find that quote saying that the HD2 doesn't have certain hardware components to meet the spec, sounds like a crock to me.
Hopefully someone with skill can graft a WinMo 7 on to the HD2, while M$ is too lazy to do it.
That I frankly don't care, I got my HD2 for what it is and not what it possibly could be.
And that for those who are dying for it there's certainly a >50% chance that even if it doesnt come officially, someone on here will hack it. We have 2004 devices originally on PocketPC2003 running WM6.5 today, and having unofficially made all the steps inbetween... that's definitely very far from what they were originally intended for.
wtff?? just because the htc hd2 doesn't have the three buttons is not getting the wm7s upgrade? Microsoft just scuppered future sales of the hd2 by doing this, i have my doubts now if ill buy it or not!
I don't see how the buttons would be the issue...
Call can stays the same
Hang-up stays the same
Back stays the same
Home makes it go back to the windows panels
Windows could be the dedicated search button
I think HTC can upgrade if they wanted to, it just comes down to some executive saying yes/no for money reasons
kilrah said:
That I frankly don't care, I got my HD2 for what it is and not what it possibly could be.
And that for those who are dying for it there's certainly a >50% chance that even if it doesnt come officially, someone on here will hack it. We have 2004 devices originally on PocketPC2003 running WM6.5 today, and having unofficially made all the steps inbetween... that's definitely very far from what they were originally intended for.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, that would even be better. A WinPhone with 5 buttons, what do you think about that!!
No, just kidding. I think you're right. The HD2 is really well designed. If HTC would just maintain the OS and update the Sense interface on the go, that would be really fine by me.
WinPhone is something for the future, far far ahead. (First wait for the first Winnie-the-Pho 7 generation, then get one when WinPhone 8 comes kicking in)
I'm not too surprised and not really disappointed. WP7 is looking way too closed for me. I would have given it a try, if the HD2 was upgradeable, but instead I will switch right to an android device (or hopefully there will be an [inofficial] upgrade for the HD2). Looking at the latest handsets with the latest 2.1 version, I really don't see why I should stick with Microsoft, which are screwing their current customers, who kept WM alive.
I wouldn't give too much about this article. Until now WP7 is by far not released and M$ often told a lot of tings that never came true. The funny thing about that company is the fact, that nobody knows ho is really able to give an official statement. I think you will be able to find more then 10 "official" statements by some M$-people about WP7 within the next months...
And about the THREE buttons - what should that mean? Does WP7 not allow QWERTY-phones? If that was true they would just lose lots of business-users that simply want to have HW-keyboard....
Im not fussed about whether HD2 gets an upgrade or not.
WHat i am fussed about (if this is true) is the fact that MS will insist upon each of their WP7 series devices having ONLY 3 buttons and no more.
That would truly suck. Having their 3 buttons makes sense but the restriction for putting any more hardware keys onto a device does not.
I guess i will now seriously be thinking about android for my next device.
Who the hell said that any WP7S device is not allowed to have more than 3 buttons? Right, nobody..
How can they say that this phone dont have what they want?
It has everything except the frontfacing cam that they will use for commands like waving your hand over your phone. (that wont work in darkness)
Anyway not that i would want WP7 since it looks like crap.
And wm6.x will become classic for budget users? wtf? wp7 looks more budget to me :\
Audio Oblivion said:
Im not fussed about whether HD2 gets an upgrade or not.
WHat i am fussed about (if this is true) is the fact that MS will insist upon each of their WP7 series devices having ONLY 3 buttons and no more.
That would truly suck. Having their 3 buttons makes sense but the restriction for putting any more hardware keys onto a device does not.
I guess i will now seriously be thinking about android for my next device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As senseless as it may sound in this discussion, I actually think that it makes sense that Microsoft is constraining phone-makers. I think they should strive for a uniform product. That would be a very good answer to apple and in the end will serve the user better. Now, the user have to choose between a myriad of devices that only on the surface differ from each other. Maybe, when there's just one hardware standard we can look for:
a) a better integration of software and hardware (like the iPhone)
b) a better way to compare several devices
c) a broader platform of third party accessoiries producers
But it would be great if in the meantime there will be still a WM 6.5(.x) platform that is highly customizable by phone-makers. Then we can look forward to two types of Windows Mobile devices: 1. a standard WinPhone and 2. a customized Windows Mobile based phone that each have their own interfaces.
appelflap said:
As senseless as it may sound in this discussion, I actually think that it makes sense that Microsoft is constraining phone-makers. I think they should strive for a uniform product. That would be a very good answer to apple and in the end will serve the user better. Now, the user have to choose between a myriad of devices that only on the surface differ from each other. Maybe, when there's just one hardware standard we can look for:
a) a better integration of software and hardware (like the iPhone)
b) a better way to compare several devices
c) a broader platform of third party accessoiries producers
But it would be great if in the meantime there will be still a WM 6.5(.x) platform that is highly customizable by phone-makers. Then we can look forward to two types of Windows Mobile devices: 1. a standard WinPhone and 2. a customized Windows Mobile based phone that each have their own interfaces.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
WM6.5.x will still exist alongside WP7... this is a given.
The problem is... for how long? In my opinion... i cant see it being all that long at all... developers will obviously want to port their apps to the newer platform asap. Once this happens... to an extent its game over for 6.5.x
I like your points about how a uniform product can be a good thing... and i agree with having a hardware standard. However... extending the hardware standard to include how many buttons you can put on a device makes no sense to me whatsoever. What if i want to make a device that has a dpad? or trackball? optical mouse? etc etc.... even a simply volume rocker? is this allowed?
Some one needs to clear this up.
derScheich said:
Who the hell said that any WP7S device is not allowed to have more than 3 buttons? Right, nobody..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
FTA: the phone will be ruled out for the simple reason that it has five buttons instead of the three mandated for all Windows Phone 7 devices.
General Manager for Microsoft’s Mobile Communications Business in the Asia-Pacific region, told APC that the HD2 “doesn’t qualify because it doesn’t have the three buttons”.
I'm sure XDA-Devs will do it ourselves like we seemingly have to do for everything, as the saying goes "if you want something done properly, do it yourself", we have with everything else in the past and I am sure we will with WindowsPhone7Series
derScheich said:
Who the hell said that any WP7S device is not allowed to have more than 3 buttons? Right, nobody..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you watched the wp7s introduction video? i don't think so .
btw. i don't get it. every time anybody asks microsoft about upgrade on the HD2 they just point to come to the mix. I don't think that at the mix they'll just say "no we won't upgrade". Doesn't make any sense; why don't they just say "no" right now? and i don't think that they would say "no" to upgrade right before the US HD2 launch.
shu8i said:
you watched the wp7s introduction video? i don't think so .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The whole show, my friend can you give me the exact quote, which says that no more than 3 buttons are allowed? And what about this?
http://www.engadget.com/2010/02/27/exclusive-lgs-windows-phone-7-series-early-prototype-unveiled/
Is it just me, or are there more than just 3 buttons?
derScheich said:
The whole show, my friend can you give me the exact quote, which says that no more than 3 buttons are allowed? And what about this?
http://www.engadget.com/2010/02/27/exclusive-lgs-windows-phone-7-series-early-prototype-unveiled/
Is it just me, or are there more than just 3 buttons?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i don't have the link now, since i watched it live. if you send me a link of the video i will show you that Joe Belfiore explicitly said that wp7s devices will have 3 buttons . and the link you posted above will be the first wp7s device from LG with 3!!! buttons on the bottom. if you see more than 3, i'll need glases
Seems all to strange to me...... it's like saying that "you can't upgrade your PC to windows 7 because you have to many buttons on the case or too many usb ports"
Anyway, things may well change between now and release.... (here's hoping)
Well we could go down the iphone users route and demand a free upgrade to a new handset because there is a new Os out........ lol
I'm wondering if anyone heard about Microsofts statement regarding no WP7 upgrade for the HD2? I was expecting to see lots of discussions going on in the HD2 forums, but I couldn't find any thread. Apologies if I wasn't looking too hard.
According to several news sites of today, Microsoft official said that the HD2 does NOT qualify for a WP7 Upgrade.
I am absolutely tempted to be believe this statement to be true. When MS recently announced WP7 at the Barcelona press conference, one of the first things they said was that ALL WP7 must have the same three button layout. They urged the importance of having the same interface on all WP7 phones.
What do you guys think about this?
Here are some parts of the article. Links to the sources are below:
Microsoft’s tight hardware spec for Windows Phone 7 smartphones means that Windows Mobile 6.x devices – including HTC’s just-launched HD2 – can’t be upgraded.
Owners of HTC’s highly-praised HD2 touchscreen smartphone will be unable to upgrade the device to Microsoft’s new Windows Phone 7 software when the OS is released towards the end of the year.
Despite the HD2 meeting many of the criteria laid down in Microsoft’s ‘Chassis 1’ spec – including a 1GHz Qualcomm processor, high-res capacitive touch display, 5 megapixel camera and 3.5mm headphone jack – the phone will be ruled out for the simple reason that it has five buttons instead of the three mandated for all Windows Phone 7 devices.
That’s the official line from Microsoft, at any rate. Natasha Kwan, General Manager for Microsoft’s Mobile Communications Business in the Asia-Pacific region, told APC that the HD2 “doesn’t qualify because it doesn’t have the three buttons”.
Not that Microsoft is singling our the HD2 as a phone or even HTC as a manufacturer. “Because we have very specific requirements for Windows Phone 7 Series the current phones we have right now will not be upgradable”, Kwan explained.
There could be more to this than just the sin of having two buttons too many, however: Tony Wilkinson, Business Operations Director for Microsoft Australia, told APC that “there are some hardware components that the HD doesn’t have”.
sources:
apcmag.com/microsoft-no-windows-phone-7-upgrade-for-windows-mobile-6x-devices.htm
ubergizmo.com/15/archives/2010/03/no_windows_phone_7_upgrade_for_winmob_6x_devices.html
I dont think the buttons will be the "major" deciding factor on whether WM7 will work or not.
A minimum of 3 buttons is required, the HD2 has 5.. That means HTC can re-assign these buttons for something else (eg. quick links)..
Don't get too wrapped up in this people. We know for certain WM7 is coming, and thats about all at this stage.
The rest is just speculation....
You cant find any threads when there's about 3 similar threads on the front page?
lude219 said:
You cant find any threads when there's about 3 similar threads on the front page?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry, I didn't saw another thread when I posted this. I admit I did not look hard enough, since I was expecting such breaking news to be among the first discussion threads on page one.
I think M$FT just needed a reason to make us buy new hardware.
cheetah2k said:
I dont think the buttons will be the "major" deciding factor on whether WM7 will work or not.
A minimum of 3 buttons is required, the HD2 has 5.. That means HTC can re-assign these buttons for something else (eg. quick links)..
Don't get too wrapped up in this people. We know for certain WM7 is coming, and thats about all at this stage.
The rest is just speculation....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I really hope you are right, however I don't think that having 5 buttons will qualify the HD2 for WP7 upgradability.
MS stressed the importance of the same user experience and 3 button interface on all WP7 phones. I initially thought that the HD2 will not qualify when seeing the press conference. The HD2 may have the required hardware specifications for running WP7, however it is lacking the 3 button user interface. Personally I don't care about the button layout but I don't see the point of MS stressing out the importance of the same 3 button interface on all WP7 devices and then allowing an official HD2 WP7 upgrade. It's kinda stupid if this is just a matter of button layout, but I see their point. They want the big market mainstream Iphone clientel to buy WP7 phones, not just
a few tech savy rom flashing nerds on xda-developers.
to b honest i dont think i matters surly if WM7 CAN work on HD2 it will b ported on to it by some nice ppl from XDA b4 it will b released.. or as soon as someone get a hold of a copy... so official or not we shuld get it...
on the other side as time goes by im debating IF i will actually want it, i will most certainty give it a go, but if it going to b as lock down as iPoop i may stick with last standing WinMo OS where i can get all the freedom i want, without having to jailbreak it or whatever it will b called if it will b the case...
iphone and WebOS, BB and alike are not actual pocket pc as WM is now, they just advanced phones... and i hope WM7 is not going to become that...
posted today on engadged.com:
The fate of the mighty HTC HD2 seems to be getting murkier by the minute: Microsoft UK VP Alex Reeve said last week that an upgrade to Windows Phone 7 Series might be left up to hardware partners, but now Natasha Kwan, General Manager for Microsoft's Asia Pacific Mobile Communications Business says the 1GHz handset "doesn't qualify because it doesn't have the three buttons" required by WP7. Making matters even less clear, we asked Microsoft's Director of Consumer Experiences Aaron Woodman about the HD2 directly on The Engadget Show, and he politely declined to tell us about the device's upgradability, and said that WP7's final required specs would be revealed at MIX '10. We'll be honest: we're taking all this confusion to mean that Microsoft hasn't quite figured out how to say the HD2 is at a dead end just before it launches on T-Mobile US, but hey -- maybe we'll be pleasantly surprised at MIX.
Please sign to support:
http://www.petitionspot.com/petitions/hd2windowsphone7
Bungholio99 said:
There could be more to this than just the sin of having two buttons too many, however: Tony Wilkinson, Business Operations Director for Microsoft Australia, told APC that “there are some hardware components that the HD doesn’t have”.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is likely the real reason, and it's not some sort of useful phone hardware that's missing. They probably require some sort of encryption hardware so the OS is hell to hack on. (Like the ZuneHD is a pain to try and hack).
From the sounds of it, W7PS is all show and no go anyway... what's up with all the talk of limited multitasking, and not having access to native APIs?
İf I can't upgrade I'll go to android
then i have to go for iPhone..
When all else fails, we have got the Cooks in here!
i know im not the only one that thinks this....i love new features and upgrades just as much as anyone but it seems the goal of windows 7 is to take away the customization experience of windows and bring consumers closer with microsoft then closer 2 their device. No flash, No skins, limited apps, and lets be honest who wants a device that looks exactly the same as another person device, u could take a million hd2 and none will look exactly like mines
jbanga86 said:
i know im not the only one that thinks this....i love new features and upgrades just as much as anyone but it seems the goal of windows 7 is to take away the customization experience of windows and bring consumers closer with microsoft then closer 2 their device. No flash, No skins, limited apps, and lets be honest who wants a device that looks exactly the same as another person device, u could take a million hd2 and none will look exactly like mines
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I say save these comments till after it comes out and you actually use it.
And it's Windows Phone 7 Series, not Windows 7.
dwizzy130
anything short of 5 pages and this thread will be a failure!
dwizzy130 said:
I say save these comments till after it comes out and you actually use it.
And it's Windows Phone 7 Series, not Windows 7.
dwizzy130
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'd agree if it was for ALL comments on the awesomeness OR failure of WP7s.
lol all im saying is if we wanted a zune we would buy a zune!
seriously ever since the thing came out they been talking about
making it a phone and now this is new news?
psht! they have a few ideas on point though like the whole
finger friendly thing, but to me its like buying a new house
with thin walls or move into a comfy old brick home
yeah the lighting fixtures is up to date but what about the foundation
I love the new interface. I love the accent that is being layed on the text. From what i've seen it's like browsing through a magazine. Well thought, because in the end, mostly it's text with what you're dealing with on this type of devices.
No really, i'm very thrilled about the new design. And with the new silverlight based development framework I think that we can expect more useful applications that are focussed on what they are supposed to do and less on the user interface.
The UI is awesome. Other than that, it's just an iPhone copy with the same bad policies, like censorship and no multitasking, no file system access etc.
seed_al said:
The UI is awesome. Other than that, it's just an iPhone copy with the same bad policies, like censorship and no multitasking, no file system access etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
WP7S, No cutomizability, locked eco system, no multi tasking.
Dont u think it defeats the purpose of WinMO.
I hope it will be a big failure. The reason i got WinMO instead of anything else is because of the power of freedom it has. WP7S killed that.
and yes, its just as hyped up as iphone before it was release. NOthing more. Its not revolutionary, its just pretty with no brain.
The start or home screen may look pretty, but its functionless. U have to scroll a lot to see info. I think the novelty will wear off faster then the iphone.
Good post, Frostlance, very good post... it's sad how they destroyed everything good about Windows Mobile. I'm not at all interested in a stupid locked down system.
seed_al said:
Good post, Frostlance, very good post... it's sad how they destroyed everything good about Windows Mobile. I'm not at all interested in a stupid locked down system.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And not only that, they way they made WP7S Backwards incompatible also means MS just killed WinMO6.5 and previous versions.
Developers are abandoning WinMO 6.5 1 by 1, started with adobe , then Skype, and many more to come.
We were waiting for Flash 10.1 anxiously, seeing the beta version test on OUR HD2, but in the end, they discontinued their support for WinMO.
As Steve Ballmer Said " OS are nothing without Developers, Developers Developers , (he goes on saying developers many2 times)
And that is the fate of WinMO 6.5. With no Developer support, Our BELOVED OS, is becoming NOthing.
To tell you the truth,ive been a loyal WinMO user since 2000. I relied heavily on its apps (esp medical applications,helps me a lot with my work as a doctor and manage my patients data). Now ive heard from a friend in skyscape,a major medical apps developer for WinMO, that they will also discontinue support for WinMO. Now this really saddens me really.
For a phone(expensive phone in fact) which i bought just 2 months ago, will no longer provide me new apps, new updates to my medical apps, no flash (A BIG WASTE , With our huge gorgeous screen,we cant even load flash content!).
I envy those using android, updating their OS constantly, and getting apps like google earth,goggle and etc which we were once promised to be given,now all left is a dream.
MS has killed our beloved WinMO. It is a sad news for all of us. WP7S is more like a curse then a blessing.
I'd rather buy an iPhone than any WP7S device.
Both are locked down crap systems without multitasking from my POV.
Espentf said:
I'd rather buy an iPhone than any WP7S device.
Both are locked down crap systems without multitasking from my POV.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But WP7S has better hardware and a better UI. So, IF you buy a locked down crap system, you really should get a WP7S phone.
But of course, you shouldn't buy a locked down crap system.
seed_al said:
But WP7S has better hardware
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do we know enough about the iPhone 4 to be sure that its hardware will be inferior to WP7S phones? We'll be about half way between that and its replacement when WP7 starts to get going.
Shasarak said:
Do we know enough about the iPhone 4 to be sure that its hardware will be inferior to WP7S phones? We'll be about half way between that and its replacement when WP7 starts to get going.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We know nothing about iPhone 4, but Apple's iPhone hardware has ALWAYS been at least half a year behind HTC's. I don't expect that to change.
iPhone 4 would need a WVGA display, a 1GHz processor, 448MB RAM, a five megapixel camera with dual LED flash, much much better materials... in order to be "only" half a year behind again. In other words: No way. They're not going to catch up anytime soon.
seed_al said:
We know nothing about iPhone 4, but Apple's iPhone hardware has ALWAYS been at least half a year behind HTC's. I don't expect that to change.
iPhone 4 would need a WVGA display, a 1GHz processor, 448MB RAM, a five megapixel camera with dual LED flash, much much better materials... in order to be "only" half a year behind again. In other words: No way. They're not going to catch up anytime soon.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The strange thing is that if the WP7 is really a closed down system without multitasking it would not need such advanced hardware for it. The need of so much memory and processor power is precisely because of the multitasking when a user can run several applications simultaneously. Otherwise you can have a good user experience with much less memory and processor power like in case of the iPhone.
This thread will be better if it has a poll on it.
I think it is hyped too. I really prefer the HTC interface and customization freedom of the HD2 against the new design of windows mobile 7. I have my device so customized that I can access every feature with a few clicks (AE button plus and multiple button press) I dont see that coming soon in WM7, you need to scroll a lot with your finger to actually go anywhere. And what botters me more is that it looks like "multimedia oriented" and not "bussisness" oriented.
If they close the platform like Apple they will loose al the support of the comunity. I really think WebOs look more interesting as a new modern platform (but they still lack variety of applications)
If there is no oficial WM7 update to the HD2, I really dont care. (we know the chef here will be realising it and even with a newer rom)
What not being said may be the most revealing.
Other than a few picture and limited stories from just a few people (MS insiders) what do we really know about WM7?
With all the stories about what WM7 cannot do, you start to wonder if there is something that we are not being told about the new OS.
For instance:
* MS Voice Command has not had any real updates for a number of years. Is there a (much improved) new version in WM7?
* Wireless/Blue tooth set up? (better setup etc?)
* Haptic interface,
* camera and other elements used in a more interactive way for interface?
* New/updated/Improved version of transcriber?
Or is MS really just going to bring out a dumb version of Windows Mobile, for the dummys, and to more directly compete with iPhone, and continue the development of the OS version (6.5) they already have for the business users, and the more adventurous?
We still remember XP/Vista don't we, lets hope MS learn't something!
No option for both? I think bits are great and bits are over hyped.
1) Maybe it´s going to be the same story as with Win Vista: faulty, crappy, resource-hungry, no benefits. Good for the basic user that only surfs with IE, listens to music, watches videos, e-mails and uploads videos on YouTube
2) NO software is uncrackable ! Wonder what the experts here on XDA will do with WM7 ! When I received my HD2 in November it wasn´t much more than my Touch HD, a little bit faster though. Now with all the geniousses here in this forum it is a rocket of a PDA that spared me the investment into a Sony Vaio P
3) I eagerly wait for the HD3 at the end of the year, wait this time some months ´till I buy it. First I will see what the leading programmers here will do with it, then buy it and flash it with a cooked ROM from this forum. And maybe this cooked ROM will be rebased on WM6.5.x or a hacked WM7, able of multitasking.
4) When I will buy HD3 (or whatever it will be called) I buy the hardware (1,5 GHz Qualcomm, ROM/RAM etc.) and I want it to be FAST. Like with Win Vista the hardware will be eaten up by WM7-software giving no speed advantage. Like with my Sony Vaio TT92 which is equipped with WinXP and which is much faster than most of the desktop-PCs for MY use of the Vaio (no gaming, prof. medical work) I will rely on the experts here to cook a ROM that´s faster than lightning for the APPS, ´cause I don´t care if the basic software is WM6.5.x or WM7, TF3D, HTCSense or what, I want my preferred apps to run fast and smooth w/o hangup.
Conclusion: trust the people here, THEY will make the best outa the new HARDWARE, not HTC, not Microsoft ..........
gm_fisher said:
Or is MS really just going to bring out a dumb version of Windows Mobile, for the dummys, and to more directly compete with iPhone, and continue the development of the OS version (6.5) they already have for the business users, and the more adventurous?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm afraid that's exactly what they are doing. Everyone - including MS - is green with envy for the zillion$$$ Apple are making with teenagers and "wanna-look-cool" adults who spend their time on social networks or mms-ing pictures. Little brains, fat wallets. No surprise manufacturers and carriers LOVE them and would do ANYTHING to please them.
MS had a decision to make: continue to fight on two fields (business and dummies) and continue losing to RIM on the former and to Apple on the latter? Or instead concentrate on one, playing the cards (like hardware) where the competition has always been behind?
WPS7 is just that.
Do I like it? Hell, no.
Would I have done the same thing had I been in Steve Ballmer's shoes? Probably yes.
Will their strategy succeed? Probably no. Unless Steve Jobs screws up big-time...
gm_fisher said:
We still remember XP/Vista don't we, lets hope MS learn't something!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Looking at Win7, I think they learnt that crappy-buggy OS's should never ever make their way into the market. However keeping looking at Win7 on other PC's makes me wish I will still have the option for XP when my laptop replacement is due in June.
I don't think MS will be stupid enough to allow WPS7 to be crappy-buggy like Vista, but most likely WPS7 will be as alienating to business users as Win7 is, leaving them in fact with two choices:
a) BlackBerry (for most)
b) Android (for power users)
Actually there is a third one for the (very few) adventurous: cooked WinMo ROMs.