Database Users

Can it be used worldwide?

Hi!Can i use an unlocked hermes,(apart from the tytn),in any country round the world?Anybody tried doing so??Thanks!

No mobile works in every country around the world.

I think that answer is a bit terse. A quad-band phone like the Hermes can be used in virtually any country. Take a look here, and you'll see that with the 850, 900, 1800 & 1900 MHz bands covered there's not many countries you can't get a signal in.
http://www.coveragemaps.com/gsmposter_freqbands.htm
I'm not familiar with Japanese requirements, but while it stands out as having a different set of requirements, I'm reasonably sure the Hermes works there too.
Testing it out in every single country could be a bit of a large proposition though.

totallytechie said:
I think that answer is a bit terse. A quad-band phone like the Hermes can be used in virtually any country. Take a look here, and you'll see that with the 850, 900, 1800 & 1900 MHz bands covered there's not many countries you can't get a signal in.
http://www.coveragemaps.com/gsmposter_freqbands.htm
I'm not familiar with Japanese requirements, but while it stands out as having a different set of requirements, I'm reasonably sure the Hermes works there too.
Testing it out in every single country could be a bit of a large proposition though.
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So add the countries with 850/1900/2100 UMTS to the GSM list, and you'll have a comprehensive list... and yes, Japan uses 2100 UMTS, so you can add that one, too.

That just leaves the wierd 1700 spectrum .. wonder if any country is running that ..

gravejoker said:
That just leaves the wierd 1700 spectrum .. wonder if any country is running that ..
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Not yet and probably not for a few years...

So in short,if i unlock the device,i may be able to use its phone capabilities on any carrier in the whole world,provided the carrier uses one of the 4 bands for communicating.The carrier may be anyone apart from the tmobile,o2,orange,cingular,vodafone?!

Yes ... you can use an unlocked TyTN on any carrier in the world that has one of the 7 bands that TyTN supports (4 GSM + 3 UMTS) ..

Ok thanks...the reason behind that question is that i'm going to Mauritius(a lost island situated in the indian ocean, beside reunion island) for a few weeks..And i wanted to be sure that my unlocked m3100 would work perfectly there...Anyway, thanks for ypur kind support..

Ahha .. Mauritius .. You are lucky my friend .. what a beautiful place from what I have heard .. enjoy your trip ..

Thanks,mauritius,the paradise on earth,here i come!

Thanks,mauritius,the paradise on earth,here i come!

gravejoker said:
That just leaves the wierd 1700 spectrum .. wonder if any country is running that ..
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goestoeleven said:
Not yet and probably not for a few years...
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Update: At the end of Nov 2006 T-Mobile won FCC auctions in 120 US markets for spectrum licenses in the 2100 and 1700 frequency bands. It is reported they will start rolling out service during 2007 (Sources: T-Mobile US Press Releases and Wikipedia). So the answer now appears to be, yes, the 1700 spectrum will be used extensively by T-Mobile USA.
I am not personally aware of any HTC phones which support 1700 yet. I am no engineer, but my assumption is that this could not be done through software upgrades on any existing devices. I imagine it will require different radio hardware. Clarification from the experts on this forum would be much appreciated.

Just a note of caution I've tried to use an unlocked VPA compact III in Barbados on the Bmobile network, but I can't geta signal. If I use a vodafone card I manage to get a signal, so I'm not sure all carriers support this phone.

flamingcrumb said:
I am not personally aware of any HTC phones which support 1700 yet. I am no engineer, but my assumption is that this could not be done through software upgrades on any existing devices. I imagine it will require different radio hardware. Clarification from the experts on this forum would be much appreciated.
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Yes, a software upgrade cannot physically synthesize circuitry to support the 1700Mhz frequency channel.
Looking at the hermes architecture, their LNA's have just enough frequency coverage to support the 7 bands. So the answer is a concrete no in re: 1700MHz.
It is possible to deisgn an LNA with a larger bandwidth, for example, to cover frequencies from 1500MHZ to 2300MHZ configurable via MEMS capacitors and inductors (I have a PhD student working on this atm, but he is facing the problem of keeping up the gain as well as linearity of the amplifier). Motivation for this: the fewer LNA's the less power a device will consuming yielding greater battery life.
HTC maybe should think about hardware re-configurability as well, but then again, they would like to make their devices obselete ASAP.

NO, you cannot use it worldwide
I could not receive a signal in Brazil with my 8525. Others reported the same problem with the Samsung Blackjack. Cingular has not provided a solution to our problem.
I hope the band select hack that I found on this great XDA forum will let me use my unlocked 8525 in Brazil next time I go in March.
Australia, if I recall, was also a problem for a Blackjack user. See the Blackjack thread on the Cingular forum for details on our tribulations.
Rgds
Ben

I have used my TyTN in the USA, Japan, Taiwan, Thailand, Cambodia, Singapore, Philippines and Hong Kong all with no problems. All locations outside the USA were with pre-paid local SIM cards (except Japan and Taiwan, which were roaming on Cingular).
Are the people having problems using a Cingular SIM (and roaming), or using a local pre-paid card?

I got full coverage in the Geylang District in Singapore. full bars.

Am I right to understand that an 8525 purchased from Cingular is locked to Cingular and in order to use in another country it would need to be unlocked prior to inserting another sim card? Would I simply ask Cingular to provide the unlock code for such use?

I'm having a Problem using a local pre-paid SIM card in Barbados, if I Roam on Vodafone which is my original carrier then it's no problem at all

Sad that T-Mobile USA 3G isn't happening

This broke my heart... and I work for T-Mobile. Why on earth would HTC/SE make a phone that practically every company in the world can use with 3G, but not T-Mobile!? Frustrated.

gregnm369 said:
This broke my heart... and I work for T-Mobile. Why on earth would HTC/SE make a phone that practically every company in the world can use with 3G, but not T-Mobile!? Frustrated.
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Then why don't you blame T-mobile for building their 3G network on 2100mzh while there others are using 850/900/1900 for YEARS?

jackleung said:
Then why don't you blame T-mobile for building their 3G network on 2100mzh while there others are using 850/900/1900 for YEARS?
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AT&T is 2100mhz... T-Mobile USA is 1700mhz

Uh...ATT is 850/1900, FYI. Tmobile is 1700/2100 both, not either or.

jvs60 said:
Uh...ATT is 850/1900, FYI. Tmobile is 1700/2100 both, not either or.
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That's strange. A G1 is unlockable to ATT, but only supports UMTS 1700/2100. The G1's in our store access 3G just fine. My X1i won't access anything but EDGE (not 3G). Since the G1 supports 1700 and X1i does not, this is the logical deduction that the X1i doesn't support the same standard that the G1 does which is T-Mobile USA 3G

gregnm369 said:
Why on earth would HTC/SE make a phone that practically every company in the world can use with 3G, but not T-Mobile!?
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hmmm... let me state it upside down:
"Why on earth would T-MOBILE chose a band NOT USED BY ANY OTHER COMPANY IN THE WORLD ??"
Sounds better this way
Or... you can say it like this:
"Why on earth would HTC/SE or ANY other phone maker include in all their phones a band that is ONLY USED by T-MOBILE ??"
This one is even worst
PS: It's true, T-Mobile is the ONLY operator using the 1700+2100 martian band don't blame phone makers
And beware: it is NOT "1700 & 2100" but "1700 PLUS 2100" (one band for uplink and the other band for downlink)
SUCH A FREAK !!

gregnm369 said:
AT&T is 2100mhz... T-Mobile USA is 1700mhz
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Are you kidding me that you are working for a carrier and you don't even know what bands your company (or your competitor) is using? I am starting to understand why you would blame the phone manufacture now ....

Why would HTC/SE make a phone that practically every company in the world can use with 3G, but not T-Mobile?
Why would T-mobile chose a 3G band (1700+2100mhz) not used by any other company in the world?
It's really quite complicated, so I'll keep it simple (although the details won't be very clear).
It's neither HTC/SE nor T-mobile's fault. Unlike in Europe, the American government (FCC) does not define or reserve specific bands (1900mhz, 2100mhz, etc) for specific technologies (GSM, UMTS, CDMA, etc). The US government also does not want to reallocate bands that are already being used, even if it's for older technology. Since VoiceStream (Tmo before Deutsche Telekom bought it) didn't have any money to buy spectrum in advance for 3G, that pretty much means that T-mobile has had to settle for whatever bands are leftover.
T-mobile wanted to keep their US 3G bands the same as in Europe, but the lower half (uplink) is already occupied by another technology (which the FCC cannot or will not vacate). So the only choice was to launch 3G on the 1700+2100mhz "AWS" band, or have no 3G at all. And without 3G, AT&T would have a monopoly on UMTS, Tmo would lose business with only 2G, and we as customers would suffer in the long run (especially since without competition, AT&T could keep its prices artificially high).
For the other points, contrary to popular belief, Tmo is not the only carrier in the world that runs a UMTS network in the 1700mhz range. Carrier e-Mobile in Japan runs a UMTS 1700 network. It is slightly different than Tmo's AWS because e-Mobile uses 1700-uplink/1800-downlink (UMTS Band IX) while Tmo uses 1700-uplink/2100-downlink (UMTS Band IV) and is therefore still incompatible. However, as with the G1, it is fully possible to build a radio that can switch between "overlapping" modes (eg: 1700+2100 and 1900+2100* on the G1), it just isn't very cost-effective to make those radios at the moment.
*1900+2100 does not mean AT&T's UMTS 1900mhz network. It's 1900mhz uplink and 2100mhz downlink, and you can see the specific frequency differences here (UMTS Bands I and II).
Keep in mind (and this is a more general point): GSM started off with most phones being only dual-mode (900/1800mhz or 850/1900mhz), but after the technology matured tri- and quad-band radios became commonplace, and now quad-GSM phones are found everywhere. In time we might see a penta-band (850/900/1700/1900/2100) "global" UMTS radio become standard on all phones -- just not with the X1. Then again, by the time we see penta-radios, we will move on to 4G, and with the current split between WiMAX and LTE, we will probably have these same headaches all over again.
So if you want someone to blame, blame the FCC for being unable or unwilling to harmonize the US wireless spectrum with other global standards. Tmo, HTC, and SE are merely just trying to play the cards dealt to them.
--
You might also stop to consider: it is still possible for SE to release a Tmo-capable X1 (let's call it the X1t), but the only advantage is that it would work with Tmo, and thus only Tmo customers would buy it (unlike the X1a which can work with any 850/1900/2100mhz carrier, not just AT&T). That makes it cost-prohibitive at the moment. Furthermore, since it would be sold in the American market, the Qualcomm patent restrictions would still apply, and you would end up with the MSM7201A processor which many X1a users have been complaining about. There is just no perfect answer.

Thank you for clarifying. I learned something from that.

X1a in Other Countries

Hello everyone,
This is my first post. Anyways, I have searched the forum, for this answer, but could not find it.
I understand that the X1a will be best in the US, as I understand it, because the network I will be on, AT&T, will be expanding their network to the 850MHz band. OK, well what I need to know is what kind of connectivity I should be expecting outside the US.
My new extended international family is all over the world. I don't travel real often right now, but I will be traveling more frequently over the next few years.
As I understand it, in the major cities in the US, the X1i will do fine on AT&T, as they have 3G on 1900MHz, but again, only in the big cities. This would be fine with me, I just don't want to be screwed as I move beyond the cities when traveling in the US.
So, for my situation, what is recommended? I fully understand the differences between the models, I am just not as familiar with the networks across the world.
Thanks,
-Steve

You should be able to get GSM reception world wide (quad band GSM) on either phone.
If you want 3G reception in the US go for the X1a, it also has UMTS2100, so you will be able to get 3G reception in many other parts of the world too.

buzz83 said:
You should be able to get GSM reception world wide (quad band GSM) on either phone.
If you want 3G reception in the US go for the X1a, it also has UMTS2100, so you will be able to get 3G reception in many other parts of the world too.
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Is that a garaunteed 3G Freq in the rest of the world? Can you give examples of where it would be used? or is it like 1900 in the US, where only major cities will broadcast on that Freq?

bluespire said:
Is that a garaunteed 3G Freq in the rest of the world? Can you give examples of where it would be used? or is it like 1900 in the US, where only major cities will broadcast on that Freq?
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I haven't problems with my SEX1 on Russia (my country) 3G, EDGE, GPRS, and in Europe (UK, Germany, France)

AlexDem said:
I haven't problems with my SEX1 on Russia (my country) 3G, EDGE, GPRS, and in Europe (UK, Germany, France)
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Do you have the X1a or X1i? My question is specifically about the X1a Freqs.

bluespire said:
Do you have the X1a or X1i? My question is specifically about the X1a Freqs.
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Oops, sorry, my official russian SEX1 exactly X1i
But I think difference between X1a and X1i only in ROM, you can change it to worldwide edition.

AlexDem said:
Oops, sorry, my official russian SEX1 exactly X1i
But I think difference between X1a and X1i only in ROM, you can change it to worldwide edition.
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I know for a fact that what you just said is wrong, there is a hardware difference. Specifically, the radios are different.

bluespire said:
I know for a fact that what you just said is wrong, there is a hardware difference. Specifically, the radios are different.
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Sorry, I can't catch a problem.
You can compare spec from Russian and US official SE sites
http://www.sonyericsson.com/cws/products/mobilephones/specifications/x1?lc=en&cc=us
http://www.sonyericsson.com/cws/products/mobilephones/specifications/x1?lc=ru&cc=ru
Networks / Поддерживаемые стандарты
No difference

AlexDem said:
Sorry, I can't catch a problem.
You can compare spec from Russian and US official SE sites
http://www.sonyericsson.com/cws/products/mobilephones/specifications/x1?lc=en&cc=us
http://www.sonyericsson.com/cws/products/mobilephones/specifications/x1?lc=ru&cc=ru
Networks / Поддерживаемые стандарты
No difference
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The English version you linked to is indeed the X1i (900MHz), and not the X1a (850MHz).

Bump!!
Please, read my OP and let me know what you think.

Sorry to keeps asking this, but I really need a satisfactory answer before I choose which one to buy.

bluespire said:
My new extended international family is all over the world. I don't travel real often right now....
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I recently purchased an additional Xperia, an X1i, to test 1900 MHz 3G proliferation in my part of the world.
In most of the area that I live, work and travel, the X1a got a perfect 3G signal and the X1i would only get EDGE. The only place the X1i picked up a truly usable "H" signal was in DC itself. As soon as I got outside the DC metro area, the phone would start using EDGE. Even if it showed an "H" it would immediately move to EDGE when I started to make a voice call or when I started to use data.
I do not think that most users of the Xperia are going to be happy unless they have an X1a. If you live in a metro 1900 MHz area that was developed in part of the older AT&T 3G rollout and you will seldom leave that metro area, then perhaps the X1i will work for you. Otherwise, I think you should spend the extra money for the X1a.
As for your overseas travel, perhaps people could be of a little more use to you if you could tell us what countries or major metro areas you'll be travelling in.
Most of Europe is using the 2100 MHz WCDMA frequency, if that helps. Your US edition X1a would work fine on that frequency.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UMTS_frequency_bands <--If you scroll down you will see the UARFCN settings for the UMTS frequencies. If one of your friends overseas can use fieldtest.exe from a Windows Mobile phone, they can check to see what channel they are on. I know the UARFCN will show up in the "3G Neighbour" screen. Cannot remember if it shows up elsewhere.

ATT 3G on a T-Mobile HD2 - Who says you can't?

I was lamenting on my lack of foresight, getting a HD2 without researching the different bands that AT&T and T-Mobile use for 3G coverage, when just the other day...
NOTE: This was on a call to AT&T Support and the tech tells me:
a) Once unlocked from TMOUS, I should do a search on "AT&T APN's" and that if I search diligently, I will find APNs on AT&T's network that support HD2 3G Bands
b) AT&T techs, right in his data center have this working.
So I research a bit, and, apart form everyone and his brother professing to be 3G Band experts, and saying all I will see is Edge if I put the HD2 on AT&T. (Which is troublesome, since Wikipedia claims Edge is being dropped to facilitate more 3G bandwidth, so potentially I would lose even THAT).
Here is what official information I could find on the two:
The U.S. T-Mobile network predominately uses the GSM/GPRS/EDGE 1900 MHz frequency-band. T-Mobile's UMTS (3G) service is now active in over 30 major US cities
Further all official documentation states that AT&T uses:
* 850 MHz UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+ 3G
* 1900 MHz UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+ 3G
Finally look at my screenshot, taken from the GSM 3G toggle on the "Settings Tab" of Manila. I am running a NRG ROM (see signature) and I KNOW this is wishful thinking. This screen in particular is no doubt a function of the many devices NRG cooks for, but really, can anyone explain to me why this technically would NOT WORK (other than "just because", LOL)?

AT&T's CEO recently gave an interview and stated that the company's 3G service is being migrated to the 850MHz band with a target date of 2010:
http://www.intomobile.com/2009/02/24/att-3g-network-going-850mhz-nationwide-by-2010.html
For what it's worth, I think the Australian version of the HD2 might have a band that overlaps with US AT&T bands.

Whos gonna buy me one?
Mase_Mase said:
AT&T's CEO recently gave an interview and stated that the company's 3G service is being migrated to the 850MHz band with a target date of 2010:
http://www.intomobile.com/2009/02/24/att-3g-network-going-850mhz-nationwide-by-2010.html
For what it's worth, I think the Australian version of the HD2 might have a band that overlaps with US AT&T bands.
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Yes, I have been hearing the same. Problem is, I am not likely to fork out $$ for ANOTHER HD2. I just wanted to get the most out of the one I have. Thx!

if something like this WAS possible, it would have to be through something like a rogue apn setup on non-standard frequencies on ATT's network...but good luck finding anything like that, it wouldn't be able to remain a secret if it existed. also, if the hd2 had the ability to use those native frequencies, it would have had to have been certified as such by the FCC (which of course it wasn't).
To summarize, the only way to make it happen is if ATT did indeed somehow sneak in alternative-frequency apn's across it's entire network. Let us know how the search for those turns out

SmartAs$Phone said:
The U.S. T-Mobile network predominately uses the GSM/GPRS/EDGE 1900 MHz frequency-band. T-Mobile's UMTS (3G) service is now active in over 30 major US cities
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Sorry.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T-Mobile_USA
3G (UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+) service by T-Mobile exclusively uses the AWS 1700/2100 MHz frequency-band, making it incompatible with other existing 3G UMTS/HSPA networks already established in the United States.
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Its not physically possible. The hardware would have to be changed. They don't make radio chips with all the bands in it. I see this all the time, some random csr from whatever company says it can be done, but its just not true. Cell phones are designed and made for a specific company. They don't make universal radios and just turn off some bands. They don't exist, though I did read a few months back that Motorala was working on making one.

Although I understand the reason for your wishful thinking (and you did do some research which is always great), unfortunately it is just that and I'll gladly (though not happily) tell you why.
As you stated "U.S. T-Mobile network predominately uses the GSM/GPRS/EDGE 1900 MHz frequency-band" which is correct (and it also uses the 850 band for edge as well....though this is usually more 'roaming' aka you're using another companies cell tower because tmobile made a contract with them to allow you). You were also correct in stating that "Further all official documentation states that AT&T uses:
* 850 MHz UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+ 3G
* 1900 MHz UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+ 3G"
Also, ironcroth was also correct in quoting that "3G (UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+) service by T-Mobile exclusively uses the AWS 1700/2100 MHz frequency-band" which alone might not answer your question.
So where is the problem if both use 1900 and 850 bands? Well, the problem is that in the hardware, there is a difference between GSM/GPRS/EDGE and 3G/UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+. In other words, you can't use 1900 and 850 Edge frequency of the HD2's radio chip to get 3G (UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+); they are incompatible. This is why phone spects always list both seperatly and not just all the frequencies that it supports.
The above reason alone will make the TmoUSA HD2 incompatible with AT&T's 3G, but there's even more. When Tmobile says that it uses the (for example) 1900 frequency band for Edge, it doesn't actually mean that it uses 1900-1999 frequencies; instead it only uses a part of that spectrum (buying the full 100 frequency range would be expensive so they only buy what they need). Instead they only use maybe something like 1943-1978. And this range will likely not overlap with the frequncies that AT&T uses for their 3G (you can look up the exact values on the internet if you'd like). This second reason is why a european phone which supports 2100 band for 3g will not work on Tmobile's 3G 2100 frequncy (because they don't actually overlap).
Lastly (and I almost forgot to mention this), the screen shot you posted from your ROM can indeed be changed by a cook to whatever they want (though it won't actually make any difference since it all depends on the hardware). However, in this case, it's likely because htc actually made the error and never updated that screen and just used it from their previous builds from previous phones (this was stated on the forums before and I'm sure you'd be able to find it given some searching).
Hope this helps.

sirphunkee said:
To summarize, the only way to make it happen is if ATT did indeed somehow sneak in alternative-frequency apn's across it's entire network. Let us know how the search for those turns out
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Quite unlikely, the AWS bands are licensed to TMO, im sure TMO would notice real quick if there were unlicensed cell towers on the AWS band and the FCC would be slapping ATT with fines pretty quick. quite alot of work goes into setting up cell towers and the frequencies each cell segment runs on, If a rouge cell tower went up overlapping TMO's frequencies, all hell would likely break loose as far as customers being able to get usable service in the area.
also as far as the terminology APN's don't operate on a "frequency" an APN is more or less and authentication/proxy server on the data network after the data has transferred over the air interface.
Maybe the best way to think of it is similar to a cell tower being like a wifi access point, and the APN being like an authenticating router/firewall on a standard tcp/ip network. yeah i know its not quite the same, but that might be a simple way to visualize it for those familiar with networking

d0ug said:
Quite unlikely, the AWS bands are licensed to TMO, im sure TMO would notice real quick if there were unlicensed cell towers on the AWS band and the FCC would be slapping ATT with fines pretty quick. quite alot of work goes into setting up cell towers and the frequencies each cell segment runs on, If a rouge cell tower went up overlapping TMO's frequencies, all hell would likely break loose as far as customers being able to get usable service in the area.
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Exactly
d0ug said:
also as far as the terminology APN's don't operate on a "frequency" an APN is more or less and authentication/proxy server on the data network after the data has transferred over the air interface.
Maybe the best way to think of it is similar to a cell tower being like a wifi access point, and the APN being like an authenticating router/firewall on a standard tcp/ip network. yeah i know its not quite the same, but that might be a simple way to visualize it for those familiar with networking
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Right, very true...I should have said "apn's attached to alternative-frequency radios" Are you a Ham d0ug?

sirphunkee said:
Exactly
Right, very true...I should have said "apn's attached to alternative-frequency radios" Are you a Ham d0ug?
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Haha no, though i do have scanners and listen in on HAMs sometimes and have read up on the stuff somewhat. never gotten myself licensed.
On the subject of scanners, there isnt all that much interesting to listen too anymore. Here in tampa the police and sheriff are on analog trunked now, so its impossible to follow anything without a trunking scanner, and about the only other things you can listen to are cabbies, tow truck drivers, aircraft, and hams. I don't even know why scanners still have the 800mhz blocks anymore, analog amps cellular has been dead a few years now. you find lots of digital noise scanning around though, just about everything is transmitted digitally now. i've got an icom R20 that goes from 150khz all the way upto 3ghz

So why don't you put in an AT&T sim card with a 3G data plan and let us know if you get 3G on your HD2?

Svegetto said:
Although I understand the reason for your wishful thinking (and you did do some research which is always great), unfortunately it is just that and I'll gladly (though not happily) tell you why.
As you stated "U.S. T-Mobile network predominately uses the GSM/GPRS/EDGE 1900 MHz frequency-band" which is correct (and it also uses the 850 band for edge as well....though this is usually more 'roaming' aka you're using another companies cell tower because tmobile made a contract with them to allow you). You were also correct in stating that "Further all official documentation states that AT&T uses:
* 850 MHz UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+ 3G
* 1900 MHz UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+ 3G"
Also, ironcroth was also correct in quoting that "3G (UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+) service by T-Mobile exclusively uses the AWS 1700/2100 MHz frequency-band" which alone might not answer your question.
So where is the problem if both use 1900 and 850 bands? Well, the problem is that in the hardware, there is a difference between GSM/GPRS/EDGE and 3G/UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+. In other words, you can't use 1900 and 850 Edge frequency of the HD2's radio chip to get 3G (UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+); they are incompatible. This is why phone spects always list both seperatly and not just all the frequencies that it supports.
The above reason alone will make the TmoUSA HD2 incompatible with AT&T's 3G, but there's even more. When Tmobile says that it uses the (for example) 1900 frequency band for Edge, it doesn't actually mean that it uses 1900-1999 frequencies; instead it only uses a part of that spectrum (buying the full 100 frequency range would be expensive so they only buy what they need). Instead they only use maybe something like 1943-1978. And this range will likely not overlap with the frequncies that AT&T uses for their 3G (you can look up the exact values on the internet if you'd like). This second reason is why a european phone which supports 2100 band for 3g will not work on Tmobile's 3G 2100 frequncy (because they don't actually overlap).
Lastly (and I almost forgot to mention this), the screen shot you posted from your ROM can indeed be changed by a cook to whatever they want (though it won't actually make any difference since it all depends on the hardware). However, in this case, it's likely because htc actually made the error and never updated that screen and just used it from their previous builds from previous phones (this was stated on the forums before and I'm sure you'd be able to find it given some searching).
Hope this helps.
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Thank you very much. I myself had been wondering why I couldn't get an HTC Desire (honestly, pretty much the only phone I'd change my HD2 for unless a GSM version of the Supersonic becomes available) and have it work in the US at the 2100 frequency.
When I asked before, people would tell me that a phone would have to support both bands (1700/2100) to actually run on T-Mobile because one did HSDPA and the other did HSUPA, but that didn't make sense to me since all you need is a single band frequency to handle both D and U data streams.
Your explanation makes a lot more sense. It's a sad thing, though.

I remember reading somewhere that a chip manufacturer (motorola?) was working on a all frequency chip. I also read that the inherent problem with that would be the antenna.
It would be awesome to have an all band phone that world travelers could utilize. I love the HD2, I had upgraded from a long time use of a Treo 750. That phone was pretty close (quad GSM, triple umts). However when Tmo rolled out it's 3G on 1700 I was still stuck on edge with the 750.
Finally bit the bullet for an HD2, really like this phone. The 750 seems antique now heheh

moonchaser said:
I remember reading somewhere that a chip manufacturer (motorola?) was working on a all frequency chip. I also read that the inherent problem with that would be the antenna.
It would be awesome to have an all band phone that world travelers could utilize. I love the HD2, I had upgraded from a long time use of a Treo 750. That phone was pretty close (quad GSM, triple umts). However when Tmo rolled out it's 3G on 1700 I was still stuck on edge with the 750.
Finally bit the bullet for an HD2, really like this phone. The 750 seems antique now heheh
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Building a multi frequency chip isnt all that hard. software defined radios have existed for quite some time. basically a simple reprogramming allows it to xmit/rec on a different frequency. the trouble comes in the antenna design. antennas must be designed to work at specific frequencies to be the most efficient at transmitting and the most sensitive at receiving. trying to make a single antenna capable of xmit and rec anywhere in a bandwidth ranging from 700mhz upto say the 2500mhz that wimax uses, is going to make for quite a ****ty antenna at any frequency. When you see the piece of foil antennas in todays phones, they may just look like a simple piece of foil, but a lot of design goes into them to make them work well at the frequencies they need to work with.
I guarantee if you compared the internal antenna of the Euro, AUS and USA HD2 there are slight differences. Ill bet the radio chip in them is for the most part identical, there may be something modified on them to keep people from interchanging the radio roms between them though since that would invalidate any FCC or other country equivalent certification for that phone to operate
Its one thing to run a hacked rom, its something completely different to use an uncertified radio rom. Could cause all kinds of havoc with the cellular network, and get slapped with FCC fines if they could track down your trouble causing phone

d0ug said:
Building a multi frequency chip isnt all that hard. software defined radios have existed for quite some time. basically a simple reprogramming allows it to xmit/rec on a different frequency. the trouble comes in the antenna design. antennas must be designed to work at specific frequencies to be the most efficient at transmitting and the most sensitive at receiving. trying to make a single antenna capable of xmit and rec anywhere in a bandwidth ranging from 700mhz upto say the 2500mhz that wimax uses, is going to make for quite a ****ty antenna at any frequency. When you see the piece of foil antennas in todays phones, they may just look like a simple piece of foil, but a lot of design goes into them to make them work well at the frequencies they need to work with.
I guarantee if you compared the internal antenna of the Euro, AUS and USA HD2 there are slight differences. Ill bet the radio chip in them is for the most part identical, there may be something modified on them to keep people from interchanging the radio roms between them though since that would invalidate any FCC or other country equivalent certification for that phone to operate
Its one thing to run a hacked rom, its something completely different to use an uncertified radio rom. Could cause all kinds of havoc with the cellular network, and get slapped with FCC fines if they could track down your trouble causing phone
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Yeah that's on par with what I had read, you do well at explaining it.
Maybe some futuristic worldphone designer would opt for interchangeable external antenna's... I could live with that or maybe multiple builtin foils with a software driven switch between them and the radio... that would be neat. Not holding my breath though...
Interesting on the FCC, hadn't thought of that.

moonchaser said:
Yeah that's on par with what I had read, you do well at explaining it.
Maybe some futuristic worldphone designer would opt for interchangeable external antenna's... I could live with that or maybe multiple builtin foils with a software driven switch between them and the radio... that would be neat. Not holding my breath though...
Interesting on the FCC, hadn't thought of that.
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Thanks, I was just again looking at the spec differences between the euro and TMO HD2s and i really don't know why HTC did not also give the TMO HD2 850/900mhz HSPA/WCDMA to truly make it a world 3G phone. According to the tech specs over at HTC.com, TMO HD2 can already use 850/900mhz for GSM/GPRS/EDGE so the antenna is obviously quite capable of both. The only other frequency the TMO HD2 has to handle that the euro doesn't is 1700mhz
Part of me thinks it was probably done so the HD2 couldn't be used over on AT&T

d0ug said:
Thanks, I was just again looking at the spec differences between the euro and TMO HD2s and i really don't know why HTC did not also give the TMO HD2 850/900mhz HSPA/WCDMA to truly make it a world 3G phone. According to the tech specs over at HTC.com, TMO HD2 can already use 850/900mhz for GSM/GPRS/EDGE so the antenna is obviously quite capable of both. The only other frequency the TMO HD2 has to handle that the euro doesn't is 1700mhz
Part of me thinks it was probably done so the HD2 couldn't be used over on AT&T
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It had nothing to do with AT&T, it's because there's a difference between Edge and 3g radio frequency. More than that, there is no phone radio chip that supports all those frequencies and even more so, htc doesn't manufacture radio chips, they purchase them and put them in their phones....just like the majority of the hardware

Srs wow hd
How do you get SRS WOW HD downloaded onto the HTC HD2?

Svegetto said:
a european phone which supports 2100 band for 3g will not work on Tmobile's 3G 2100 frequncy
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I think this is incorrect -- the 2100 band support on the HD2 is in fact expressly intended for 3G compatibility in Europe/Asia, and people have reported being able to get 3G in Europe with their US HD2.
1700 == US-only 3G
2100 == Europe, Asia 3G
What's missing, I believe, might be 3G support in certain areas of places like Latin America which may follow US frequencies but don't have T-Mobile USA there to provide 1700 service... e.g., no 2100 and no 1700 either.

T-Mobile U.S. uses both AWS 1700mhz and 2100mhz for 3G. The 2100mhz band is used for transmit and 1700mhz is used for receive. Hence the incompatibility with other carriers phones that only operate in one spectrum.
Cheers.
~Jasecloud4

DVP 3G Europe/US Roaming

If I understood right at least some DVPs have radios capable of using both T-Mobile US's 3G network and European 3G networks. Has anyone tried this? Are we sure that all DVPs have the same radios? Or do the European ones have the US frequencies disabled or something?
Thanks in advance for any info,
Tom

The US ones have AWS for TMOUS, and European 900/2100.
Whether they will actually provision correctly and be usable w/ 3G services in non-US locales is anyone's guess. The US DVP has only just recently been unlockable and I don't think we have had any reports of actual int'l roaming success yet.

I think its been mentioned in the unlocking thread that people have used it in Europe and from the listing of the DVP I've seen the specs indicate its has the exact frequencies as the US one. I would expect it to work, unless Dell has done something really screwy (but thats not impossible) but hopefully someone can confirm for sure.

People are claiming that European DVPs have AWS 3G support? I don't think so.
Although it is conceivable that it's there and simply unadvertised, I believe non-US DVPs have 900/2100 *only*.
US DVPs have 900/2100 *and* AWS.

tai4de2 said:
People are claiming that European DVPs have AWS 3G support? I don't think so.
Although it is conceivable that it's there and simply unadvertised, I believe non-US DVPs have 900/2100 *only*.
US DVPs have 900/2100 *and* AWS.
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Actually I was referring to people with US handsets being used in Europe, not the other way round. And its possible the Euro version is hte same as the US one, looking at a video of a DVP released in India it shows the same frequencies as the US one, and Clove also lists the same 3G frequencies so I would lean towards all DVP's bring usable in Europe and the US.

With today's big news, what's the point?
Once AT&T shuts off AWS UMTS in a year or so we are all gonna be left with paperweights anyway.

tai4de2 said:
With today's big news, what's the point?
Once AT&T shuts off AWS UMTS in a year or so we are all gonna be left with paperweights anyway.
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NAY, I SAY THEE NAY!!!!!!!! Could be right though, but I was planning on ditching the DVP for a penta band Nokia so I guess I'll be ok - save for being on at&t!

3G works here

They are saying it will take "several years" to transition T-Mobile users. Lets hope the regulators see sense and block it in any case...

So I have a European DVP now. Anyone know of an app that will tell me the radio frequencies it supports? The System Info one doesn't seem to.

It supports 900 and 2100.

How did you find that out? The box says UMTS 2100/1700/900.

The European box says the phone inside supports 1700?

my US T-mobile DVP (unlocked) works fine on tmobile Germany and I get about 3000k download 2500k upload. I am in a fairly bad region for network speeds. But I have hit upwards of 7000k download in some bigger cities.

tai4de2 said:
The European box says the phone inside supports 1700?
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Yes.......