Database Users

WM video acceleration lacking?

Does the Shift's WM side suffer from the dreaded lack of video acceleration enabled drivers affecting most current HTC devices? This would show up as relatively mediocre video performance while playing TCPMP or Slingplayer. On the Shift I would expect no less than 30fps using Slingplayer.

ok, if no one knows the answer directly, maybe we can infer it...
I'd really like to find out the performance of Slingplayer for example. It is well-documented that this is an app that suffers in many newer HTC devices due to the lack of drivers specifically taking advantage of the video hardware.
Can anyone report the fps and bitrate they are getting while using Slingplayer Mobile on the Shift? I have a Slingbox available if anyone needs testing.
I think RealVGA may be needed to see the full layout of Slingplayer while it is running to display the fps in the upper right hand corner of the screen.
thanks.

Slow video playback?

Hey all.
So the HTC Touch Diamond has a VGA screen. How can I get it to play VGA quality videos? or is this not possible? I would of thought it would be with its own graphics processor and decent cpu. I have tried .mp4 at 512kbits 640x480, but struggle more than 7 or 8 fps. It works good enough at half the resolution, but is still dropping some frames. Not as good at video playback as some reviews would have me believe.
I am using TCPMP , which has been modified to work with Windows Mobile 6.1
Many thanks.
Gary.

Well, I have played some movies that have higher resolution than 640x480 with -very- smooth framerates in CorePlayer (easily over 20 fps).
Specifically: HellBoy Sword of Storms, Eagle vs. Shark.
No problems at all.
HTC Touch Pro.

Yep, i have high res files playing in coreplayer as well (touch pro). coreplayer doesnt fully support diamond (or touch pro) so it can only get better in the future

Taken from Coreplayers site, this looks good:
GPU support: Intel 2700g, ->ATI Imageon<-, QTv, Marvell Monahan Processors
CPU Support: ARM9, ->ARM11<-, MIPS
Both the processor and gpu will be used really well on our diamonds/touch pros.

coreplayer works fine for me in vids much higher than the screen res, you must be doing something wrong or that "hack" to make the player work in 6.1 really isn't a good idea

Ok, thanks for all your replies. What format are you using to get decent fps with Coreplayer, and what bit rate normally?
Its a shame coreplayer do not have a trial version, so I want to be pretty certain first that it will work.
TCPMP hasnt been developed for a few years i dont think so that might also not help.

Well i splashed for Coreplayer anyway, but I still get rubbish fps
.AVI (xvid) 640x480, 24fps, 748kbits.
Am I using the wrong codec?

captanbirdseye said:
Well i splashed for Coreplayer anyway, but I still get rubbish fps
.AVI (xvid) 640x480, 24fps, 748kbits.
Am I using the wrong codec?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
24fps!?
That's supposed to be quite good (100% for most movie rips).

Using Coreplayer, VGA .avi videos play very smoothly on my diamond as long as I'm not using A2DP. Once I pop on my Jabra BT8010, the high res vids start to skip a little. I hope Coreplayer fixes that up soon!

Hmmm, could one of you do a favour please?
Go to http://www.madagascarmovie.com/
Click on trailers
Download the PSP version of the trailer, and then try to play that on your HTC Touch Diamond. It won't even play that for me Then let me know if it works fine for you or not. I get alot of tearing and skipping. I have gone as low as 640x480 avi at 512kbits and its still jolting around and skipping. I have used all the different types of rendering, and currently have Coreplayer 1.25
Not the good playback I was expecting
Thanks
Gary

After some tweaking around with the bitpool and some searching, I've gotten the A2DP performance hit down to a minimum.
Bitpool: 58
Maximum Bitpool: 80
That seems to reduce the stuttering when playing VGA vids using coreplayer. They still stutter a little during some demanding action scenes when using A2DP, but the stutter is much better and the audio and video are in sync.
Once Coreplayer is optimized for the Diamond, this thing is going to scream!
Overall, I'm pretty impressed with this little phone.

Mr.Sir said:
Taken from Coreplayers site, this looks good:
GPU support: Intel 2700g, ->ATI Imageon<-, QTv, Marvell Monahan Processors
CPU Support: ARM9, ->ARM11<-, MIPS
Both the processor and gpu will be used really well on our diamonds/touch pros.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What version include this ?? or is just for a future version ??
And what is the GPU that comes with diamond ?? that "ati Imageon" ??
TY

So there are no video apps that are currently programmed to use HTC Touch Diamonds fancy bits? like the graphics processor etc?

use the divx labs divx player!!! lol

captanbirdseye said:
Hmmm, could one of you do a favour please?
Go to http://www.madagascarmovie.com/
Click on trailers
Download the PSP version of the trailer, and then try to play that on your HTC Touch Diamond. It won't even play that for me Then let me know if it works fine for you or not. I get alot of tearing and skipping. I have gone as low as 640x480 avi at 512kbits and its still jolting around and skipping. I have used all the different types of rendering, and currently have Coreplayer 1.25
Not the good playback I was expecting
Thanks
Gary
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OK, I did what you said and I ran the video in Coreplayer benchmark mode. The best I could get was 70%. Perhaps it's the h264 format that is so demanding?
The more I use the Diamond the more I get dissapointed.

Hi, I'm having the same problem on my Touch Pro (i'd post in the TP forums, but no app/software category there), however I don't have Core Player because I won't pay for something if I can't see if it works first.
My question though is: Are there any similar movie file players like Core Player that are free?
(sorry if this was a bit off-topic, and I've tried searching but did not find anything useful)

If I see correct, madagascar is h.264 coded. It's a codec that is used to prepare hd video(b-r,hd-dvd etc.). It needs a powerfull processor or a hardware acceleration from graphic card. Some of new computers have problem with decoding it (i.e. with embaded video chip) and you're trying to play it on diamond. The 70% you're getting is a great score.

I have Coreplayer v 1.1.0 Build 1408
I get some lag for my music videos I have on my phone.
File Size: 78,924KB
Video Size: 640 * 480
Frame Rate: 29.970
is there a reason why it's laggy?

Why don't you try the latest build which is v1.2.5 I believe.

daveloft said:
Why don't you try the latest build which is v1.2.5 I believe.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just updated and still has the same problem, maybe it's the file that is the issue.

Touch HD Video Playback Performance Concerns

So here's my story:
I recently bought Samsung Omnia on which I did extensive tests on video playback
with CorePlayer 1.2.5 and TCPMP and with various video formats such as:
H264 Baseline 3 480x272 (originally encoded for playback in iPod Touch)
Various XviD encoded videos with resolutions varying from 640x360 to 720x400
Using DirectDraw as video output in both CorePlayer and TCPMP
the result was awful, dropped frames, awful motion and distorted colors.
However since the Omnia has the fastest CPU I know in WM Device so far,
the Marvell PXA312, 624MHz with IntelXScale acceleration,
the CorePlayer and TCPMP gives this as an option for video output the IntelXScale acceleration.
So when using this setting the video playback of any type of encoding was absolutely beautiful.
Colors were correct, performance was amazing (even in double playback speed) it was in general as smooth as it gets.
For a powerfull (hardware-wise) device such as omnia, I was very disappointed
in the resolution of the screen (240x400 - wqvga) and its size 2.8".
For this kind of device which has literally everything one would expect it
to have same screen size and resolution as the touch hd.
I rushed to buy this device I must admit and so I sold it to a friend after experimenting with it for one week.
The reason that I gave away so fast the Omnia was simply the Blackstone.
Since I am kind of perfectionist as far as it concerns screen resolutions, the touch hd is no match with any other phone/ppc device out there.
So here comes the real concern, how is the performance on video playback on the blackstone?
For a multimedia device like this one would expect that the performance
would be excellent (much like the omnia or even better if it can).
But what concerns me is the Qualcomm cpu at 528Mhz which as far as I can tell
doesn't have IntelXScale acceleration (plz correct me if i'm wrong on this)
So if it uses only DirectDraw and the results are crappy, then this would be such a turn off.
Can this CPU give a smooth video playback performance on a 640x360 XviD avi video
with "Smooth zoom: ON" and "Zoom: Fill Screen" settings on either CorePlayer or TCPMP?
And keep in mind that we are talking about realtime upsizing of the video to 800x480
which IMHO requires quite a lot of cpu power for such device.
Because really I am not willing to spend 700 euro on a multimedia phone
that can't actually perform well on multimedia.
I'd love to hear someone that has it and tested it on that matter.
Thanks for reading!

We really want to know the answer for your question, And I think that we have to wait until we see the phone on the market and get some benchmarks.
Also I think that SE in their xperia phone did what you are asking for ..! In the same beautiful screen resolution 800x480
Thank you,
Mohammed

mohdtmn said:
We really want to know the answer for your question, And I think that we have to wait until we see the phone on the market and get some benchmarks.
Also I think that SE in their xperia phone did what you are asking for ..! In the same beautiful screen resolution 800x480
Thank you,
Mohammed
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
More like SE said to HTC "We want an awesome phone, but we don't want you to tell us what's in it, and we'll just make Magnus make up stuff as we go, also we suck at marketing."

touch HD has a slower cpu, without xscale acceleration. but it has a dedicated graphics chip, which matters more in video play back. at the resolution you have mentioned, i have full confidence it will do just as well if not better than omnia.

buggybug0 said:
touch HD has a slower cpu, without xscale acceleration. but it has a dedicated graphics chip, which matters more in video play back. at the resolution you have mentioned, i have full confidence it will do just as well if not better than omnia.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I sure hope so, because I would say I'm not so satisfied with the Touch Diamond performance. Let me explain:
Since this matter is really killing me, I need to be sure it can perform well on video (not extreme stuff, the standard-like video formats we all use).
So I decided to make a test, since i don't own a Touch Diamond (which has the same hardware), I went to a local retail store that had the device on display for ppl to see and experiment with, I installed coreplayer and sent a 40" 608x400 xvid video with ~900kbps bitrate to test it.
CorePlayer was set automatically with video mode QTv and with TytnII Driver mode enabled (which i suppose is the accelerator driver)
I made sure nothing else was running in the background and the results was not so ok. I was playing just ok, I noticed some frame skips and some "lag" in fast motion.
I just hope the Touch HD has revised hardware (if that's possible) and better drivers maybe?
I really would like to hear an answer from someone that has already his hands on the touch hd

buggybug0 said:
touch HD has a slower cpu, without xscale acceleration. but it has a dedicated graphics chip, which matters more in video play back. at the resolution you have mentioned, i have full confidence it will do just as well if not better than omnia.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
but htc is also notorious for not not allowing 3rd party software to use the graphic chip, that is when they do provide drivers for the chip

fallenczar said:
but htc is also notorious for not not allowing 3rd party software to use the graphic chip, that is when they do provide drivers for the chip
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
so are you saying if i were to install a 3rd party video player, when i try to play video, i will see a blank screen? because this player is 3rd party and can't access the graphic chip?? :S

buggybug0 said:
so are you saying if i were to install a 3rd party video player, when i try to play video, i will see a blank screen? because this player is 3rd party and can't access the graphic chip?? :S
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, i'm saying that coreplayer/TCPMP will only be able to use the default qualcomm chip, its exactly like having a graphic card in your pc with no drivers and no in built support

Thats sux
I hope Touch HD has better driver ... because the hardware is the same.
Quite a downer ...
mkMoSs said:
I sure hope so, because I would say I'm not so satisfied with the Touch Diamond performance. Let me explain:
Since this matter is really killing me, I need to be sure it can perform well on video (not extreme stuff, the standard-like video formats we all use).
So I decided to make a test, since i don't own a Touch Diamond (which has the same hardware), I went to a local retail store that had the device on display for ppl to see and experiment with, I installed coreplayer and sent a 40" 608x400 xvid video with ~900kbps bitrate to test it.
CorePlayer was set automatically with video mode QTv and with TytnII Driver mode enabled (which i suppose is the accelerator driver)
I made sure nothing else was running in the background and the results was not so ok. I was playing just ok, I noticed some frame skips and some "lag" in fast motion.
I just hope the Touch HD has revised hardware (if that's possible) and better drivers maybe?
I really would like to hear an answer from someone that has already his hands on the touch hd
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

fallenczar said:
No, i'm saying that coreplayer/TCPMP will only be able to use the default qualcomm chip, its exactly like having a graphic card in your pc with no drivers and no in built support
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If that is the case, then I dont understand it. I mean why HTC would go through all this trouble to have an extra graphics chip in their devices when no other than their own app could ever use? So they put a graphic chip with 3d capabilities and video acceleration for just their own apps like touchflo 3d ?
Isn't it just stupid?

Yes, that would be stupid. Fortunately though, there is quite some talk about the HD having an optimized chipset compared to the Diamond, even though this does not include the processor. It is already evident by the many movies that the device performs faster than the diamond even with the same processor, so I doubt you'd have exactly the same performance issues as with the diamond. Though there is only one way to be sure: wait 2 more weeks and everybody will own one.

nin2thevoid said:
.......... wait 2 more weeks and everybody will own one.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hell...i cant agree with you more..almost everyone i know is either 'buying one' or 'Wants to buy one'....whatever happened to the times when there were a few geeks like me who went out and bought a winmo phone....whatever happened to the iphone??...lol

gauravdc said:
Hell...i cant agree with you more..almost everyone i know is either 'buying one' or 'Wants to buy one'....whatever happened to the times when there were a few geeks like me who went out and bought a winmo phone....whatever happened to the iphone??...lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
iPhone died, blackstone killed it

Blackstone is a killer... Woohoo.. We have to send it to prison!!.. I think I might have a good prison here at my home so my blackstone, come for punishment *roarr* lol

Coreplayer 1.3.0 is said to have major improvement with QTv rendering on MSM7201A/7200A. This was promised by them on their forum about a month ago.
Head over there and hurry them up! Those guys are reeaaaalllly slow, probably too busy working on Coreplayer for stupid iPhone.

wuzy said:
Coreplayer 1.3.0 is said to have major improvement with QTv rendering on MSM7201A/7200A. This was promised by them on their forum about a month ago.
Head over there and hurry them up! Those guys are reeaaaalllly slow, probably too busy working on Coreplayer for stupid iPhone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi, if I buy the current coreplayer-version from them, do I get a free update when the 1.3.0 will arrive? Or should I wait until it comes out? This would be the most important application for me on the Touch HD.. Greez, cad^^

wuzy said:
Coreplayer 1.3.0 is said to have major improvement with QTv rendering on MSM7201A/7200A. This was promised by them on their forum about a month ago.
Head over there and hurry them up! Those guys are reeaaaalllly slow, probably too busy working on Coreplayer for stupid iPhone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Fingers crossed!
They should just forget the iPhone, ppl will be finding out about blackstone and they will be throwing their iPhone from the window xD

I guess no problem with playing video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fv9lLAVidgA&fmt=18
Thanks to johnkorver who own the device, create the video review, and upload it to youtube.

looks promising even though we don't have any other info on the video file except the codec used (xvid).. anyway upscaling works nice and that says much..

one more video playback demo: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wo7I6K8U7L4

[APP] DIVX for WM

Thought id post this for those who are looking for a divx player.
http://labs.divx.com/node/6211

CorePlayer still works faster on the Diamond.

How fast?
can i simply drop a regular ~700mb xvid/divx movie on the internal storage and play it in full screen(with dithering and smooth zooming enabled) without lag or frame dropping?
just wondering since i'm probably buying the diamond, and this could really be a deal breaker.

leonatan25 said:
CorePlayer still works faster on the Diamond.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My friend I think you didn't try watching divx on Diamond...We can't watch divx even with core player. But this is possible on Omnia. So we are watching other programs ore codecs...

sorry but, have no problems watching dvix 700mb files on my diamond witch coreplayer

Doritoch said:
My friend I think you didn't try watching divx on Diamond...We can't watch divx even with core player. But this is possible on Omnia. So we are watching other programs ore codecs...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm sorry, but I have no problem watching 640x272 files on my Diamond with CP.

I have 2 diamonds and for a few days the omnia i900. I think nobody can see a full 700Mb movie on Diamond, without cuts. But on omnia is no problem at all. Omnia is much much faster than Diamond. I was thinking to buy one, but i will wait for the 480x800 version.

katerini said:
I have 2 diamonds and for a few days the omnia i900. I think nobody can see a full 700Mb movie on Diamond, without cuts. But on omnia is no problem at all. Omnia is much much faster than Diamond. I was thinking to buy one, but i will wait for the 480x800 version.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Omnia resolution screen is just 240 x 400 pixels
Diamond is real vga - 640 x 480 ...
so Omnia has less resolution with faster CPU ...
as result, u have BIG cut in the resolution with the Omnia..

Diamond is not for Multimedia. Is one of the slowest mobile that I`ve been testing so far. The only thing that can chage this is the release of Ati video Drivers from HTC and a new O.S (maybe windows mobile 6.5?). Until that, I recomend you to buy another phone with better multimedia support (iphone or nokia)

I downloaded DivX player from divx labs and installed it.
After that, I started downloading movies from the following site:
http://moviesmobile.net/
and now, I have aproximatly 10 movies installed on my phone, that I can watch with rather good quality, (not crisp)
So I think it's very well doable, but you shouldn't try to cram a 700 mb movie trough there.
also, I used core player once and it starts showing some weird deformations when I run a 700 mb movie on my diamond
The speed stays nice and stable, but the movie itself looks like crap.
Hope this helps

Err, that site only has 320xXXX resolution, awful lol.

"700MB divx" don't mean anything.
You have to look the bitrate of the video. The diamond with the last Core Player can handle videos (almost perfectly) with a bitrate <~ 550 (and a resolution under the 640x)

No problems with video at all. Make sure to tailor your videos to the Diamonds resolution, I use DVD Catalyst to switch up resolution, then DL to my phone. Typical 1 1/2 hour movie is around 550 to 650MB, I use size to denote quality although even a 550MB movie looks awesome on my Diamond.
Mind you, this is using the new Telus ROM
Whatever Telus did with the ROM upgrade, it turbocharged my media capabilities

by 700 mb I ment all comon .avi files cam,TS,DVDrips and so on you can find. Had no problem whatsoever.

Videos with a higher bitrate than 600~700 will have frame drop on the diamond.
Its hard to see them, especially if the movie don't have many actions scenes.
With a movie ~90mn/700MB, you have generally a ~800KBp, so no problem really, some frame drop, but it seem perfect.
But if you try a ~20mn/400MB or ~40mn/700MB (midle quality TV Show for example), the bitrate is most higher than 1000KBp and the video its almost unviewable...

yeye2 said:
Diamond is not for Multimedia. Is one of the slowest mobile that I`ve been testing so far. The only thing that can chage this is the release of Ati video Drivers from HTC and a new O.S (maybe windows mobile 6.5?). Until that, I recomend you to buy another phone with better multimedia support (iphone or nokia)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://www.glbenchmark.com/compare.jsp

I`m watching 700MB movies whitout problems, is very important what program was used when the movie was processed, there are some that hang some time. I watched movies that had 1500kb bitrate without problems, and the quality is great. Try the CorePlayer 1.3 is the best. I will always choose my Diamond over an Omnia .

yeye2 said:
Diamond is not for Multimedia. Is one of the slowest mobile that I`ve been testing so far. The only thing that can chage this is the release of Ati video Drivers from HTC and a new O.S (maybe windows mobile 6.5?). Until that, I recomend you to buy another phone with better multimedia support (iphone or nokia)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I didn't know that HTC Diamond got an ATI chipset
Maybe it has a HD4850

blacriderv said:
I didn't know that HTC Diamond got an ATI chipset
Maybe it has a HD4850
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well the Diamond uses a Qualcomm cpu which has a embeded ATI Imageon. Programs like coremedia player uses this to improve the performance, but windows mobile comes without drivers. So bassically your diamond is running windows mobile like a failsafe version of windows xp.
check this link http://www.mobilewave.ro/news/Performanta-grafica-a-lui-HTC-Diamond-Touch-Pro-259.html, there are a few videos about the bad Diamond´s graphic perfomance. Devices with one, two or even 3 years have better perfomance than diamond
spippo said:
http://www.glbenchmark.com/compare.jsp
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
thats very funny , a synthetic benchmark is very helpfull to see the true potencial of the device, but that doesn´t meen that you are using all of this power in a daily use. Just one example, try to play a video (H.264 at VGA (640×480) resolutions at 30 frames per second) in a diamond and then try a nokia n96. The nokia device plays the video smooth and without lag, the diamond video is laggy with frame lost, but ehy! you can run the benchmark on the diamond to feel better afther that.
htc performance post.http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=449391

30 FPS cap HD2/Evo

Hi my HD2 counterparts. I come from the land of Android, and the Evo, with a question for you all. I believe the HD2 and Evo use the same screen, if this is true, is there a way for you guys to test FPS? If it is the same screen, I think this could help us figure out whether or not our Evo's 30 FPS cap is actually a hardware limitation, or a driver limitation.

It may be the same screen but not the same video driver or even the same graphics chip, I know I have run a couple of games that have fps counters and they show way over 30 ...
I am using the patched 3d drivers for HD2 ...

I use Morphgear and I get 60 fps. No fps limitations here.