Database Users

Can the abuse be toned down please?

Dunno what people's beef is on here ?
Yes there are new members and so on, but some of the foul mouthed attacks I have seen here is disgraceful.
If your mother/wife/daughter or whatever logged on here would you want her to be subjected to such abuse ? No? Thought so!
Tone it down please - if you don't have anything constructive to add to a post, don't bother.
If it makes you feel better about yourself because you feel superior as you know more about HTC/Windows mobile etc. than other people - go back to your ZX81 or whatever but please stop the swearing and nastiness.
Sorry, just never seen such animosity on a forum in my life!

I wish I could say I feel your pain man, but I am a noob as well however I feel the more seasoned vets on here are just tired of the same stupid repetitive questions typically posted by none other than us new guys. I am not saying its right but the way I see it, its kinda like having a little brother or sister that keeps asking the same question over and over and over again while your trying to get something done. My occupation is sales and has been for almost a decade and the first thing I always try and do is look at something from all sides. In doing this it A) Makes me do a search before asking and B) Not feel as bad if I get checked by someone. Just my .42. Additionally I have found if I really cannot find something then I will pm someone I feel is approachable and let them educate me.

From what I have seen lately, the "abuse" has toned down big time around here, were you recently flamed or something, that made you think this?

donzx6 said:
If your mother/wife/daughter or whatever logged on here would you want her to be subjected to such abuse ? No? Thought so!
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bit sexist

Truly!
ChaoticDruid said:
From what I have seen lately, the "abuse" has toned down big time around here, were you recently flamed or something, that made you think this?
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I agree. The replies on this site have become MUCH more mature, helpful, and professional in the last few weeks.
I hope you're not referring to 'now' ... or maybe you're reading through the historical posts to avoid getting flamed.
This is another reason why, no matter how many times a question's been asked, the old-timers should carefully think about the legacy their words will leave behind on these forums.
I find the repeated questions unbearable sometimes, too. But the historical traces of the blatant abusive and immature replies will live with these boards for a very long time, making it unlikely that anyone will like to search for an answer before posting the same question over and over and over and....
-pvs

swtaltima said:
I wish I could say I feel your pain man, but I am a noob as well however I feel the more seasoned vets on here are just tired of the same stupid repetitive questions typically posted by none other than us new guys.
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They make the choice to read the questions then respond in an abusive manor. Its not like a brother or sister who hunt you down to annoy you. I have tried searching for a good tutorial on how to build packages and what not to build my own ROM but the usual thread I see is, "Google It and learn it the way I did." It almost like no one really wants to share their knowledge on certain areas of ROM building. I've tried googling etc. But I have still not run across a decent tutorial. I'd be willing to help make a tutorial if I knew the complete process. I've seen others claim this forum is for XDA "developers" and if you are not a developer you should look elsewhere for "help." The only way to become a developer is to learn. Most people learn by reading and asking questions. I just don't understand why people insist on berating others for asking innocent questions. I have searched for answers before and not found it. Then later I am reading a thread and I do see the answer to my question but it was not worded the way I say things possible because of language differences. So it slipped throught the cracks of the search. Should I be verbally abused for asking my question? Probably not, especially seeing as how the diversity on this forum is great. Many different primary languages and knowledge levels. It seems like before ROM cooking for Hermes was possible people were all fine and cordial with each other. Then boom, cooked ROMs became possible and it turned into if you cant help me finish my ROM and let me put the donte link in my signature I don't want to help you.
Well thats my take.
PS- if someone helps me grasp the art of ROM building I will make a tutorial and do my best to make it simple to understand for everybody.
Jokinawa

There are still a few bad apples around thou & most of us know them but just keep to our selfs, too much of that n00b flame go read wiki or search google, they can tell you to read the wiki but too lazy to type a quick fast reply to a simple question....

I just wanna know but have my replies been helpful?? :s

jokinawa said:
They make the choice to read the questions then respond in an abusive manor. Its not like a brother or sister who hunt you down to annoy you. I have tried searching for a good tutorial on how to build packages and what not to build my own ROM but the usual thread I see is, "Google It and learn it the way I did." It almost like no one really wants to share their knowledge on certain areas of ROM building. I've tried googling etc. But I have still not run across a decent tutorial. I'd be willing to help make a tutorial if I knew the complete process. I've seen others claim this forum is for XDA "developers" and if you are not a developer you should look elsewhere for "help." The only way to become a developer is to learn. Most people learn by reading and asking questions. I just don't understand why people insist on berating others for asking innocent questions. I have searched for answers before and not found it. Then later I am reading a thread and I do see the answer to my question but it was not worded the way I say things possible because of language differences. So it slipped throught the cracks of the search. Should I be verbally abused for asking my question? Probably not, especially seeing as how the diversity on this forum is great. Many different primary languages and knowledge levels. It seems like before ROM cooking for Hermes was possible people were all fine and cordial with each other. Then boom, cooked ROMs became possible and it turned into if you cant help me finish my ROM and let me put the donte link in my signature I don't want to help you.
Well thats my take.
PS- if someone helps me grasp the art of ROM building I will make a tutorial and do my best to make it simple to understand for everybody.
Jokinawa
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By the way, they do hunt people down with PM, e-mail, IM, etc...
Here my take
The Art of ROM building does not happen overnight and it is not for everyone. You are also correct there are no A-Z tutorials on how to do it. Nonetheless, there is a lot of information on how to get your feet wet. It requires certain skill set in order to develop good cooked ROM.
Skill set: Search and Read both threads and wiki, Development (someone with a development background is preferred), Cab (building and extracting) PPC registry, Windows Mobile OS (understanding how things work), device infrastructure (understanding how things work with that particular device, because they are not all made equal), understanding you could brick your expensive device with the one wrong turn. Most important patience and keep you changes to a minimum until you get the hang of it.
The list of requirements can go on but I figure with the above information you should have an idea. It takes months of reading, searching, and trying things out in order to understand how to cook. While you are researching you also want to keep with new findings, that means you have to stay on top of up coming new threads. It is a crazy cycle and some of us can keep up with it but I assure you it is not for a lot PPL.
Oh, I forgot one more thing, you also have keep up with your full time job (you know, the one you get paid for).

Thank You
lpsi2000: Thank you. I almost have it down. The only issue I had was one of my apps did not make the start menu icon and I posted it in a thread directed towards one of the kitchens and thus far has been ignored for a week or so. I posted what I put in the initflashfiles.dat etc. It makes a shortcut but appears as a folder link to the /Windows directory and not a shortcut to the EXE. I will get it eventually though.
DAFTEK: I totally agree. Why say use search or the wiki when you could post a link to the search results or the exact thread.
mrvanx: Yes, you are always very helpful.
Thank You all.
jokinawa
<polish>Shines his new Senior Member badge.</polish>

I agree that is has gotten much better in the past few weeks. I also use the ignore list to block out a couple of folks who repeatedly belittle others with their uneducated and profane flaming.

Here is my take. WTF cares
you want a bucket to catch those tears?

jokinawa said:
lpsi2000: Thank you. I almost have it down. The only issue I had was one of my apps did not make the start menu icon and I posted it in a thread directed towards one of the kitchens and thus far has been ignored for a week or so. I posted what I put in the initflashfiles.dat etc. It makes a shortcut but appears as a folder link to the /Windows directory and not a shortcut to the EXE. I will get it eventually though.
DAFTEK: I totally agree. Why say use search or the wiki when you could post a link to the search results or the exact thread.
mrvanx: Yes, you are always very helpful.
Thank You all.
jokinawa
<polish>Shines his new Senior Member badge.</polish>
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The way I get around some of the issues with applications not working properly, I flashed the ROM, take a copy of device registry and files then install the app on the device and then compare it to see what was changed. From there I normally address it with my cooked ROM.
I must disagree with this comment " DAFTEK: I totally agree. Why say use search or the wiki when you could post a link to the search results or the exact thread." although I have done it at time when the search is not obvious.
If you spoon feed the search every time, then the person will never learn how to search. I have seen PPL on this board expecting other people to do search for them and also provide the answers. Trust me there are a lot of lazy people on this forum.

mrvanx said:
I just wanna know but have my replies been helpful?? :s
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Exteremely, MrVanx... EXTREMELY! Only to be outdone by your wonderful guides...easy to follow and up to date. You provide a wonderful service to these forums, and I always look forward to your posts.
Sorry I haven't yet made a donation in your direction. It will be coming soon.
All the best,
-pvs

austinsnyc said:
Here is my take. WTF cares
you want a bucket to catch those tears?
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Easy there bro... that kinda attitude got the elf kicked out of the house...

You know I would go easy just everytime my faith is restored in the people here the stupid bug seems to bite again. like asking questions that where answerd in a post right above or someone wanting to be spoon fed its almost to the point where no one wants to do anything for themselves. that's pretty sad if you ask me im sure most of the cooks here did not receive the amount of help that has been given in just the past month. I understand helping people but I also understand earning respect and until that's done give me a reason why I should spoon feed when there is a search button and google.

mrvanx said:
I just wanna know but have my replies been helpful?? :s
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pretty obvious answer(s)

why create another thread in 'Hermes Mobile 6', this should be put in the 'General Section'
and as far as i have seen it the abuse has been dramatically in the past few weeks

Sometimes the abuse is (IMHO) justified.
This post generally makes my blood boil http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=311698 - the asshole keeps appearing in many guises, doesn't want to help but only make money. If this is the first post you see when you log on you get pissed off, then get carried away with the 'Flashing LSVW bricked my V3' type of threads.
In my opinion, ronfin44 was perfectly justified in (mildly) flaming this guy.

mrvanx said:
I just wanna know but have my replies been helpful?? :s
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Awww fishing for praise now? ahhahah!
Of course it's been helpful.. Honestly, I'm pretty impressed with the impartial, well thought replies that you always give.
[mumbles]Wish I could say the same for me hee hee![/mumbles]

Calling all noobs! Noob survival guide 101 a must read for all noobs!

Oh good lord, look what we have here. You're inexperienced and you need help. Before this guide starts the most important thing to remember is; You're only a Noob if you say you are Look, I could tell you what you want to know but the truth of the matter is your thread that you are about to post is going to get bumped and piss people off because you will more than likley post it in the wrong category so here's some information that will help all you noobs in the long run.
Rule #1: "Hello XDA" <- At this point people already know or assume you are a noob and your chances of getting help are slim to none. If you're lucky someone will tell you to go check the qna which to me is the same as someone telling you to "Go F*** Yourself!" Don't sound stupid! Be confident and get right to the point!
Note: At the end of your comment, just end it with a "thanks" as this is more acceptable and prone to getting a better response than someone who is over-appreciative for a request for help when they haven't even gotten the answer their looking for.
Rule #2: "i've tried did work," Always use capitalization and proper punctuation. You come off as a person who lacks self-esteem and with little confidence. At this point you've gone from noob status to a knowledge-less noob which makes your chances for getting help even slimmer than they already are... Secondly, what you're saying makes no sense, no offense but use your head and edit your work, the edit button is there for a reason so use it when necessary and no one will notice or bust your balls.
Rule #3: Be confident in what you say and do. Be direct in what you're saying and get to the point. You don't need to sound like a dumb blond b**** who's drunk and helpless. It's mostly a nasty world out there but there are good people that will help you! Don't ever give up or in, keep trying until you get what you're looking for.
Rule #4: There are people who will put you down. Remember, there is no such thing as a stupid question There are people who will go out of their way to put you down because it makes them feel good about themselves. The truth of the matter is those individuals will have questions to things they don't know about which makes them hypocrites and therefore they deserve no respect.
Rule #5: If you are attacked by someone on XDA or in life, be defensive. Make the antagonist feel vulnerable, stupid and guilty for even trying to put you down at all costs. If your "foundation" is crippled and you do not defend yourself it is like walking around with a label "NOOB" stapled to your forehead and people will assume you are incompetent and therefore no help will be given!
Rule #6: Be resourceful, broaden your horizons, post in multiple places. Help is not limited to XDA... I am by no means a know-it-all but when I was in your shoes I made a lot of mistakes. Trial and error is a good thing, it is a very effective way of learning in actuality. I have used places like Youtube and searched and I found what I was looking for, helpful information. There are video tutorials that have been very helpful to me, just search and you will get help from multiple sources.
Rule #7: Be persistent! Never take no for an answer. Never give up and never surrender, empower yourself! If you are attacked, stand up for yourself and if you have trouble use comedy and make jokes, just be careful because people on here can be sensitive and you could get booted for awhile...
Well, that's my noob guide just don't take it too personally, I wrote it to be helpful and so that you can get what you're looking for the easiest way. Most people won't go out of their way to tell you this stuff but I can tell you from experience as a motivational speaker my guidelines are far more effective than when I see someone post a thread: "HELP! nOOb here" or" Noob Needs HELP NOW PLLLLLLEAAASSEE!!!" or "Phone crasHED what DO I DO!?!?!?"
Poeple are not only not willing to help but they will probably laugh at a thread with a title like that and it will probably give them enough of a kick to make their day while you still have a severe issue that is not humorous by any means.
Good luck.
Note: To all non-noobs you may now laugh your ass off if you haven't already.

Can I just say this is the wrong forum But it is kinda funny.

Pompous members

Ive been lurking here for a while quietly helping through PM and congratulating great work.
Over the years the members have become like the fan boys at apple. Foaming at the mouth waiting to flame a new member for not finding the answer in search or posting a relevant topic in the wrong section.
Seriously?
When the G1 came out we were all noobs. This Samsung is no different. There are alot of people new to android who picked up this device and I love it when the community grows.
FYI. XDA isn't the Bentley of android forums... we are a community of people looking to help eachother. Can we please keep the flaming to a minimum? You are wasting bandwidth.
My two cents. (now watch the number of people who tell me I'm in the wrong section.)
Sent from the best phone from TMO... Vibrant

I agree for the most part. But it does get old if there is a similar thread on the 1st page of the section. This is not a matter of being a noob to android but a noob to forum etiquette.
There are no stupid questions, but not attempting to find the answer first is a bit lazy.

I don't think its the fact that people are noobs. Its the fact that they have poor forum etiquette. Senior Members and New Members are both guilty of it. I think most people are more than willing to help or give advice. People just need to think before they post.

I hear ya on this one. Even as an android user from day 1, I, myself am guilty of becoming pompous member at times.
Back when the sh*t fest started in the G1 forum (during the Haykuro and CM C&D letter) I created a thread that was added into the "Informative links" sticky.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=568011
While I feel it mostly feel on deaf ears and blind eyes, if you think a revision of this would help, I dont mind spending some time on updating it before we post here in Vibrant forums.
Sorry OP, im not trying to hi-jack the thread, but do you mind if use this thread as a start point? maybe we can have some ppl chime in to get this updated and more in line with Vibrant forum. I already see some things I would need to change, but anymore technical info and thoughts would be appreciated.

xda-developers.com displays textbook… narcissism...
Agreed.

What about a FAQ page related to specific phone That includes the most asked questions. Specific to flashing, apk, odin, a step by step guid.

30Glock said:
What about a FAQ page related to specific phone That includes the most asked questions. Specific to flashing, apk, odin, a step by step guid.
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Well the problem is we have that yet people don't read it. So people post the same thing over and over again and the older members get mad and take it out on the person.
The street goes both ways. New members need to put a little effort and older members need to be a little more forgiving.

I've worked very hard on the Sticky. If someone asks the same questions I've answered over and over, I have little patience.

No we just need more aggressive moderation and banhammers. We also need English as a second language, because places like Mobile-Review.com forums are far more tame and nicer, even though no one goes there. And that's probably the main reason, since XDA is the go to place for a lot of people when it comes to smartphones, whether they are concerned about modding or not. Popularity has its downsides. And there's another stereotype that may or may not be true, but people who want to hack their phone and be on the cutting edge are also *usually foul-mouthed brats living in their mother's basement with no social life or sensibilities to speak of. Normal people don't really care about any of this. Or maybe that's geeks in general, real nasty on the net but pansies in real life.

I've done my fair share of forum moderating and admining. I have the same thought process on every on.
1.Everybody is new day one.
2. Its the senior members job to point them in the correct direction.
3. Todays newbie is tomorrows expert.
Scare new members away and who knows what they would of contributed later. Senior members if you get tired of the same old questions either be helpful and answer it or don't say anything at all. Being rude just scares away members and honestly that is not a good practice.

Hijack away I dont mind I just got tired of reading flaming posts. Its good to know im not the only one who felt that way.
I think a forum ettiquette post would be great
Sent from the best phone from TMO... Vibrant

kizer said:
I've done my fair share of forum moderating and admining. I have the same thought process on every on.
1.Everybody is new day one.
2. Its the senior members job to point them in the correct direction.
3. Todays newbie is tomorrows expert.
Scare new members away and who knows what they would of contributed later. Senior members if you get tired of the same old questions either be helpful and answer it or don't say anything at all. Being rude just scares away members and honestly that is not a good practice.
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Plus 1. Thats wat I was trying to say. Perfectly worded sir.
Sent from the best phone from TMO... Vibrant

Yeah I go through and
Read many forums and the search option is not the greatest. Sometimes it'll point me to a line someone said on a thread with over 100 pages. Honestly although I try sometimes it's too much to read and a lot of bs to skim through about people arguing over who knows more. And sometimes I just get lost reading the technical stuff.
But because of some members attitudes here i am OFTEN reluctant to ask questions. They either get overlooked or people get upset. I understand a lot of times a lot of things are repeated but sometimes it's not clear the first time or someone else puts it in a different light.
I appreciate all the work done here but I wish sometimes people would just relax and have fun doing this. If someone asked a question that was already answered then YOU don't have to respond. Someone else is willing to help.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

I've been reading internet forums since the dawn of USENET. Guess what? People asking questions that are in the FAQ has always happened and always will. Yeah, it gets annoying to the long-time readers/contributers, but you have to look at it from the point of view of the new user. Believe it or not, some of them just don't know better. They don't know to read the sticky. They don't know where the search button is, or they don't know what to search for. There are a multitude of reasons, but the bottom line is, they are all individual, unique people who come here seaking an answer to a problem. They have no knowledge of the 10, 100, 1000+ people that have asked the very same question. So when you get upset about reading the same question for the eleventeenth time, you are getting mad at a person for asking one question. Not a person who has asked the same question a bunch of times.
If you look carefully, you will see that after a person comes here (and any forum for that matter) and asks a question that has been asked before, and when that person is replied to with respect and helpfulness, generally that person will not ask any other questions that have been asked before. In fact, that person very likely may become a contributer, helping other newbies a long the way.
My wife teaches college and without fail, when it gets to the last two weeks of the semester, she starts getting floods of emails "What can I do for extra credit?" "What is the policy for late work?" etc. Guess what. All of the questions are in her course syllabus that she hands out on the first day. It drives her nuts too. I try to calm her down there too.
Have you ever gone to some public service desk (DMV, taxes, hunting license, anything like that) and received very rude service for just asking a question? Because that person is fed up for answering the same question over and over again, even though there is a sign on the door that you somehow missed reading on the way in. Remember how you felt? Was it really YOUR fault?
Some of them are truly lazy and want to ask even though they truly know better and for some crazy reason they think they will get a faster response by asking rather than searching.
Bottom line is, if you are the kind of person who gets really, visibly annoyed over things like this, then internet forums may not be the best place for you to hang out. If it just annoys you a little reading the same question over and over again, then congratulations--you are human. You can either choose to respond or not respond. And if you do respond, personally, I think it is better to try to keep a positive, helpful attitude.

I agree with the OP.
I have been using forums since it was first called UseNet, as a matter of fact, I still call them "newsgroups".
XDA nowadays reminds of the reasons why I left the Media Center forums back in 2005, after having earned 2 MVPs for my help there. Those who were once newbies themselves and asked stupid questions at first became arrogant and elitist and spent more time flaming and calling names those who asked questions like they once asked, than pointing them in the right direction.
Using the search is not always the answer. There are many ways to frame or word one issue or question. What for one person is a lag, for another one is slowness, delay, performance, etc. Words can be misspelled, shortened, euphemisms can be used, etc. For many English is not even their first language.
Posts by people well acquainted with the technologies at hand can be daunting not only for newbies, but for many who are not experts. References to CM6, Odin, Clockwork, Recovery mode, etc, in the same sentence can be intimidating, when you know that a simple misunderstanding can brick your $600 phone.
Like someone else well said before, today's newbies are tomorrows experts.
I understand that seeing the same question (not necessarily stupid) for which an answer has been provided before may bother some people (not me), but instead of spending valuable time and bandwidth criticizing and frequently offending others saying things that probably wouldn't be said in person, wouldn't it be better to answer the question, or at least point the person in the right direction and then humbly instruct them how to find the answers by themselves?
The anonymity of nicknames sometimes lead people to act in a less civilized way than what they would do otherwise.
Luis

I quickly browsed through this thread to read others thoughts. Here are my own:
Yes, this forum in particular does have it's share of rude members. What I'm noticing is that a lot of people will chime in and immediately chastise the OP, or call someone an outright liar about their particular experience. What I really hate is when someone with a particularly bad attitude posts something like "Well I really don't care about...." and then proceed to go on a diatribe about how they don't care about something or how someone else is wrong or stupid. They obviously care if they opened the thread, took the time to read the thread, and then took the time to respond.
Look, we are all here to share our knowledge on something in particular that we know, and to also gain knowledge from someone else on things that we don't. My hope is that this forum becomes more helpful to the people seeking it. For instance, I never found a clear-cut answer to the question if you root the phone and apply the lag fix and whatnot, if you will still get the OTA updates that are forthcoming. Some people say yes, others say absolutely not. I didn't get the feeling that anyone who answered that question knew exactly what they were talking about. Yet, if I made a post asking, I would get slammed because it's "been answered before you stupid noob".

orells said:
Ive been lurking here for a while quietly helping through PM and congratulating great work.
Over the years the members have become like the fan boys at apple. Foaming at the mouth waiting to flame a new member for not finding the answer in search or posting a relevant topic in the wrong section.
Seriously?
When the G1 came out we were all noobs. This Samsung is no different. There are alot of people new to android who picked up this device and I love it when the community grows.
FYI. XDA isn't the Bentley of android forums... we are a community of people looking to help eachother. Can we please keep the flaming to a minimum? You are wasting bandwidth.
My two cents. (now watch the number of people who tell me I'm in the wrong section.)
Sent from the best phone from TMO... Vibrant
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\
I think it has to do with age. I've come to the realization that this board is full of 14 year old wanking little boys, so what else to do you expect? I don't care what their birth certificate says, maturity wise, the majority of the board is all of 14. It's disgusting and if I didn't need mod info, I sure as h*ll wouldnt be here.

A rant with thoughts on improving the tone of the X10 section.

Hi,
Here are some ideas and thoughts on how I would try improving the overall tone in the forum through moderation and rules. This thread is by no means intended as any demands or criticism, it's just what I think could help. It's also not written with anyone specific in mind.
First off I would like to see posters refrain from personal attacks, this goes both for intentional trolls as well as those reacting to trolling. If the "no personal attacks" rule was enforced more we would get rid off a lot of the hostility in here.
Asking questions
Just saying "RTFF", "Use search, you noob" and so on is pretty counter-productive. Which search terms to use aren't always obvious so a lot of the times it's better to go for an approach like prefacing the answer with: "That question has been asked and answered many times before, try searching first and checking FAQs". The point comes across, the poster gets his answer and hopefully a potentially valuable member isn't scared off. Everyone's a noob at some point.
Personally I encourage asking questions but some people might find that annoying so I propose two things:
1. Either labeling the thread accordingly, like "No questions" or stating that in the original post.
2. Leave the job of moderating questions to the OP. If you don't want to answer then don't say anything, slamming the question doesn't help anything.
General conduct
There are forum rules for this already so I won't go into detail too much. I just wish that people would skip the insults and personal attacks. If you want to criticize something then criticize the subject not the person. Calling someone an idiot and flaming them doesn't do any good. That goes for the spelling and grammar police too.
Thoughts on moderation
My suggestion would probably increase the moderators workload but I feel it might be necessary. Posting a quick motivation when locking a thread is great, keep at it. Let the OP of the thread dictate the tone in it and only go after rule violations unless the complaints come from the OP himself. If the OP still interacts in a thread even after it's veered way off-topic you could ask him to edit the topic to reflect this. Threads can be seen as conversations and those are seldom static so going OT is almost inevitable.
Just a few thoughts, feel free to comment on them.

You're an idiot loser who likes to lick iPhones.
(AKA: I agree with your ideas and wish to suscribe to your newsletter.)

Its not the tone only in X10 forum, you can find the same thing else where. But thanks for putting together this nice notes and helpful instruction to behave right. Before anyone sign up for a new account they should pass a test by doing that they are forced to read all these notes. Its the nature of human that thinks he or she is right all the time and knows better that everyone else, just like me.
Well, I hope people get the point and stop bashing each other over some none sense problems.

Nimche said:
Its not the tone only in X10 forum, you can find the same thing else where. But thanks for putting together this nice notes and helpful instruction to behave right. Before anyone sign up for a new account they should pass a test by doing that they are forced to read all these notes. Its the nature of human that thinks he or she is right all the time and knows better that everyone else, just like me.
Well, I hope people get the point and stop bashing each other over some none sense problems.
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I singled out this board simply because I have no experience from the other parts. You could even make a case that the issues mentioned are universal in all forums with lots of users. I've seen the things I talk about happen other places too and how well similar guidelines have worked so it might be worth a shot.

ddewbofh said:
I singled out this board simply because I have no experience from the other parts. You could even make a case that the issues mentioned are universal in all forums with lots of users. I've seen the things I talk about happen other places too and how well similar guidelines have worked so it might be worth a shot.
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Don't get me wrong. What I was trying to say was that reminders are awesome and I do really appreciate your time putting your thoughts on here for us and I will be the first one to follow. I do respect XDA.

Yeah, I got your point. I just wanted to elaborate on why i talked about the X10 forum in my post and not forums in general.

Unpolite

Why are some answers rude . If a person posts without giving it much fore thought and an answer appears to be self evident what do you gain by calling them stupid or giving a "Snotty" answer. In my opinion the person make the rude comments are showing there own stupidity. If a person makes an obvious error you can politely bring it to there attention without name calling.

I think the biggest problem here in xda is people dont search.. People ask questions that have been asked loads of times.

What a stupid question!!!
How dare you clog up the boards with this rubbish!!!
Just kidding mate
Its like my dear old mum used to say...
"Some people are just dicks"
Sent From My Toaster Using A Tin Can And Some String

BTW it's "impolite"

I think I'll vent a little here, if you don't mind..
.. but as Shum97 said, people don't search. The forum search may not be up to scratch or hard to navigate for new visitors, but it is there. Maybe having an even bigger and glaring button SEARCH would help leviate some of the [Q]this-[Q]that topics which don't get past the 5 post stage.
Another way of searching is to use Google and add "xda" into your search query. Try searching up "xda unpolite hd2" and see if you can get back to this thread (not directed at you OP).
Now a major point I think is worth mentioning:
Notice the transition of Apple iPods and iPhones from a somewhat unknown in the early 2004-05's to a global sensation beyond? Also notice an increase in "iPhone is da best ur fone cnt beat it ha!" and / or "ZOMG sum1 help me wif my prob plueeeeeeze". Once devices start becoming popular beyond the moderate / advanced computer-literate customers it starts becoming a nightmare to browse any useful comments amongst the sea of flamers and fanboys.
I think that's what is happening to the HD2. Due to its massive screen (seems size is what average joes think about) and the moderate but decent exposure by xda users, this phone in particular by HTC has begun to gain in popularity. Likewise, the phenomenon with the increase in popularity (leads to) the increase in irritating posts on this forum (or any forum really).
How to solve this?
Answering much of the questions in the Questions forum could help stem the overflow of [Q] or even [Req] topics into other forums. The reason why they are spilling over is nobody wants to answer endless questions with virtually no information and endless repetition. How to deal with that? I don't know..
And believe it or not, how you construct and word your questions can be determinate of your response time and how engaged the responder is to your query.
Questions like this..
Hey all, I am having problems with the bluetooth settings on my international HD2 (stock WWE 1.61). When connecting to my Sony Ericsson HSH925, the prompt mentions driver x missing. After browsing through some other topics, there seems to be a conflict between program x and y which causes this driver to be erased. I have tried the drivers from the other topics but they were all for ROMs before 1.61. Would anyone have a fix for this or would we have to wait for HTC to release an updated driver?
.. will most likely get answered and stay on track.
Questions like this..
HLP I CNT CONNECT MY BT HEADSET 2 MY HD2 I tried connecting thru da menu but it not work. Srry if its been asked b4 srry if its been asked b4 srry if its been asked b4 srry if its been asked b4csrry if its been asked b4 srry if its been asked b4 srry if its been asked b4 srry if its been asked b4 help me PLS PLS PLS PLS PLS PLS PLS PLS PLS PLS PLS PLS *bump* *bump* *bump* *bump* *bump* *bump* *bump* *bump*
.. will most likely be ignored.
The other possibility (and this is to the extreme, but not necessarily impossible), is that advanced users / developers / testers will move off to another site, leaving this forum to wash away in endless never-finished topics. An example I like to compare to is remember (if anyone's old enough) how downloading (by that I mean illegal downloading of pirated material unfortunately), was a sort of niche, a nerdy / geeky past-time who nobody below a Major in IT would understand? Then it slowly become popular over time, and then rose sites such as Kasaa, then LimeWire, then torrent sites. Where next? Because it has become so popular, it has also attracted the flack of anti-piracy regulators (rightly-so) which just never would of happened had it remained secluded and nobody-knew-about-it-basis. I "think" the next big thing would be VPNs and proxys, but you ain't hear nothing from me.
Anyway I hope the forums don't turn out to be what the X1 forums are now (which I was a proud owner of). And to go back to the OP, I guess on behalf of xda to the wider non-tech-savvy community, we aren't angry or unpolite by nature, we are just tired of answered questions and one-line flame comments silluetting out the actual developments and hacking topics that has made the HD2 greater than it ever was.
*going to troll the Questions forum now*

I'm with btyeh on this one.
a big tip is when using google, try typing:
site:xda-developers.com [your search terms here]
i.e.
site:xda-developers.com hd2 unpolite
The top search result should be this topic.
I've been an avid user of these boards for quite a while, and encourage people to help others (as I do), but it doesn't work if people don't bother to try and help themselves first.
You wouldn't get much help if you rang a support line and said "it's broken, fix it"
Its not easy to help someone with so little detail.
What is broken?
How is it broken?
What has happened to it recently/has anything changed?
I've noticed a much larger number of topics that are repeating, and quite frankly, its making me think twice about even looking at the site, let alone bother to take the time to respond to the 4th topic of the same problem on page 1 alone.

If it chaps your "delicates", why answer? Why even look? skip the thread and go on about your day instead of being a complete prick to some stranger.
Sad thing about the internet, is that because it's through the safety of a terminal, people have sacrificed manners and common sense.
If you don't want XDA to become the next youtube-comments site, then learn to not be a search-nazi. The annoying people asking annoying questions will go away or learn to ask the right questions.

btyeh
I really value the time it took to post that. Specially when 9 out of 10 of my post go ignored. I could post something here or in another forum and it would be the same result.
I usually provide a lot of detail and thats because I really want to show that I've done my research. Doing my own research shows to me that I value others time.
I will have to agree that a lot of flames start by the person failing to search.
So now we have a delimma.
Those who arse are chapped by the insane amount of double and tripple post are asked to ignore it and move on. Those who post these topics are asked to do searches and not double post.
No one puts their foot down and says dont flame or your banned. No one puts their foot down and says do a search or be banned.
I know that sounds harsh but I think both needs addressing. The site needs to get under control the amount of first timers who ask questions and dont bother to do a search. The site also needs to put the jerks flamers and a-holes in check also myself included.
I guess my beef is I mostly have to search for these things myself. I think its only fair that someone else have to do the same. Atleast show some effort.
I am making a effort to not to be a jerk to new memebers. I Actually wont answer the thread if i think i am going to be mean.

hazard99 said:
btyeh
I am making a effort to not to be a jerk to new memebers. I Actually wont answer the thread if i think i am going to be mean.
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I think we all make this effort.. but to some dudes.. its just the wrong day.. like i avoided answering this thread because i think its the most whiney ass man on man sex **** i have ever heard in my life to write a thread crying about how someone was/ is inpolite to you or someone else on a forum..
but here i am.
I think its not just the way we answer new folks though but the way the questions are asked...
when there is a thread called
"Question"
regardless what comes when you open it.. the dude deserves to get flamed.. for not even prefacing us with what a question was about.. and wasting time space and bandwidth just to pacify his own simple.. ignorance.
This being said.. a newer person posted a Question the other day and less than 4 hours later was *****ing no one answered him yet... yea i made a smart ass comment about him being a **** for expecting people to answer him in a manner of seconds.. but i also answered him. .and tried my best to help him with his issue..
i guess what im saying.. is as the theoretical knowledgeable portion of this forum we are probably going to flame ignorant questions... but we need to try and answer the questions at the same time..
Yea you might call someone an idiot for asking an idiotic question.. but if you are gonna take the time to flame.. take the time to point them the right direction while your at it.

conantroutman said:
sent from my toaster using a tin can and some string
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two camels in a tiny car!

Because i did my due diligence and search like anyone who's tech savvy enough with an ounce of logic (and if you're not those type, you shouldn't be involved with ROM flashing and should just stick with stock ROM), so I don't see how that gives other people the free pass to post whatever their hearts desire without giving us some background to their problems.
Sure, I've seen threads where people were unsure of their problems but they post a laundry list with background info, pics, ROM version, etc....yet there are others who simply post "HD2 froze...phone wont get past white screen." I'm sorry, but stupidity and lack of awareness are not excuses for you to post whatever you want. What's funny are the people who complain about the "unpolite"ness every week, yet are still as shortsightedness as the people who post without any measurable contents.

greenkonstantinos said:
I have problem with my htc hd 2 rom 19.4 leo . I can't send or recieve e-mails. Can someone help me?
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Just answered this one over in Q&A.
Could have been rude, but that wouldn't help him with his email problem, wouldn't have made him more likely to provide background in the future, only would have made me an asshole.
When he reply's back with the proper background info, I will try my best to help him, and then kindly bring to his attention that in the future he should search twice , then gather the apropriate background info, then post his question.
The old carrot and stick technique usually provides the best results for all.
Plus the reason he didn't post all the background info may be because he has been trying for an hour to get it to work, and may be upset that he is not able to get important emails tomorrow at work.
Being rude to people is an easy way, and easy ways usually don't pay.
There is seldom ever a reason to be unpolite

There's a couple things not mentioned so far that also contribute to the impoliteness:
Often the people who would reply have done so already for another person, and are now fed up seeing the same question.
If you've been around here for as long as some of us, or have been on a device thread since it was new, you've seen the same question asked possibly hundreds of times. How many new threads ask how to flash? Or "HELP! I'VE BRICKED MY PHONE"?
I don't remember ever opening a thread to ask a question, I just know that someone else has already asked it, and it has been answered already, I just gotta find it. Even a lot of googling is quicker than waiting for a reply anyway.
On the other side, there are some things which can be annoying about these responses, that is:
When the answer is buried in a ROM thread, and there is no dedicated thread to the problem.
or
There are more threads about the problem which say "search for 'x'", than there are actual threads with solution 'x', making searching unlikely to give the results you want. Often there is only one small thread, such as the disabling the HTC customisations thread which is only a few pages.
or
The search terms are not obvious (such as the same thread already mentioned) if you don't know the details of the problem, or the answer very well, then it can be hard to know what to search for.

I think compared to other forums ive seen XDA is by far the best almost everybody is really helpfull a few bad apples though just like every forum. But I think everyone needs to be patient to n00bs as we have all been there. I too have been guilty of posting without searching but thats since has changed.
Eitherway you guys on XDA rock