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We seem all to be waiting for a version to leak of the CE 5.0 for our devices, and at the same time we seem to think that this will not happen due to the fact our providers are going to want to ship it on new devices and not upgrade the old ones.
Well Mwang put me in the mood to do some searching and this is what I found.
Because Windows CE is in components, you can create a custom version of the OS that includes exactly the elements your particular device requires—no more and no less. Using the Windows CE development tool called Platform Builder, you can create a customized version of the OS, called an "image," that you then download onto your device hardware for debugging. If your hardware is not available yet, you can run your image and debug your applications on the included x86 emulator. That allows the end-user application developer and the low-level system software developer to work in parallel on the same project.
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http://msdn.microsoft.com/embedded/getstart/bring2market/plan/learn/windowsce/default.aspx
Well it seems that you can download a 120 days trial version which would mean you would have to flash your device in 120 days.
Windows CE Evaluation Version
Windows CE integrates reliable real-time capabilities with advanced Windows technologies to rapidly build a wide range of innovative, small-footprint devices. The evaluation version is a 120-day trial version of Windows CE, valid from the day of installation. The CD and DVD versions include a copy of Microsoft eMbedded Visual C++ 4.0 Service Pack 4. The Evaluation Edition (download) requires you to download eMbedded Visual C++ separately.
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http://msdn.microsoft.com/embedded/getstart/evaluate/default.aspx
Think this is the homepage
http://msdn.microsoft.com/embedded/windowsce/default.aspx
So what is stopping us ?? Or Cant I read?
Any body in the mood for this??
Downloading now What could go wrong ?
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/...50-D311-4F67-9FB3-23E8B8944F3E&displaylang=en
Does this work for you gues ?
I tried this a while back.
Its not as easy as it sounds, firstly you have to correctly setup all the drivers for the hardware.
I wouldnt garantee that it has stuff like the phone apps ready to be compiled in either.
lastly, you have to make it into the correct format for the installer prog, I dont know if the package will output a himaupload.exe compatible rom.
Let me know how you guys do though, it would be nice to compile our own OS!
It's installing on my computer :shock: i want it on my PPC
Well I found a 30 min tutorial on the platform builder and it looks like a lot of the stuff is around (Wifi), What we will miss is the camrea app, but hell its a start.
Ps cant find that link anymore, and the posted link works great.
MDAIIIUser said:
Well it seems that you can download a 120 days trial version which would mean you would have to flash your device in 120 days.
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Im sure it's a 120 days from the day you install it on your Desktop PC :?
definatly not as easy as you think!
i had the older version and i made some images for X86 machines (to make them thin clients)
you need every driver for the device that it will be installed on so theres alot more required than just the platform builder,
check it out anyway, its still fun to use and you can make custom CE's for old PII machines (routers, thin clients etc)
Well Bosjo, would that not give you 119 days to post a BA Rom?
@MDAIIIUser
Well i dont know, but Im guessing that the ROM itself will expire 120 after Desktop installation
@bosjo
Well you better hurry up and do good documentation so that I can rebuild your posted rom in 118 days.
@MDAIIIUser
Ha ha ha, well don't get your hopes up, Im just a plumber that bought a BA to save some time and get projects more organized........... Well that what just to be a laughf, this device has eaten every spare second I have had since the day i bought it, and it's still crappy...............
What? You mean you can use it as a phone, thought it was only good for the pocket solitair, how did you do it? and can I read it on wiki?
You see I am True born again MDAIIIUser and
"I haveth faith in thou"
I've pu the windows CE 5.0 installer in the upload folder
Good job you got this , see your pm
Hmmm... well, if someone can create a ROM that won't expire or brick my device, I'm willing to help with testing...
Let me know if you need me...
hehe. Its impossible to create WM2005 from the stuff offered with the trial WinCE 5.0 Platform builder.
Hint: WM5 has version 5.1. PB offers 5.0
im wondering.. where would you get ALL the drivers from? im sure HTC will not be willing to help us here..
@Manich
I truly respect your post and I am very much aware of not having your knowlege, insight, understanding, hacking competence.
That is why I am amember of this forum, to learn from people like yourself in order to try and get the best for my device. To share what I have learnt with others (I use wiki for that).
So please, please share with us a better idea of how we can get 2005 on a BA. It would save me a lot of time searching on the net, uploading sdk that are of no use as well as moving files on the ftp.
A "it cant be done answer" I could accept if it came from somebody else without your knowlege and I remember reading that somebody wrote something along the lines if it can run it can be cracked (smile).
With alll due respect
MDAIIIUser
Generally it cannot be done as you don't have a board support package for BA or other compatible platform. With lots of hacking and reverse engeneering you can write all drivers and all applications absent from Platform Builder (like cprog, SMS client, SIM toolkit, etc), but it would be only a waste of time. It would take as much time and would be as useless as making a Linux for BA. Better buy a device that originally ships with OS you want.
The only hope for getting WM5 on BA is that some person from MS would offer it or someone would get a device with such a ROM. Even a locked device with a signed ROM would help.
I looking for advice on getting started developing simple programs for WM5 - I guess I'm not really bothered if they don'y make use of the advanced features
The options appear to be
#1 MS Visual Studio 2005 (90-trial or $$$)+ WM5 SDK (free)
#2 MS Embedded Visual C++ 4.0 SP4 (free) + WM2003 SDK (free)
#3 MS Embedded Visual C++ 3.0 - 2002 edition - PPC2002+SP2002 SDK included (free). Also include Embedded Visual Basic.
As my recent experience is VB I guess option 3 is best C++ learning curve might be a bit steep given the just for fun motivation
but ..... there are other options saw this today
PPL - Pocket Programming Language
Write software for your PocketPC and PC in minutes using our new programming language. PPL is a fast and easy-to-learn programming language that is fully object-oriented. PPL runs on all Pocket PC using PocketPC 2000, 2002, Windows Mobile 2003, 2003SE, and 2005 (VGA compatible). PPL also runs on Windows 2000, XP, 2003 Server desktop computers. Programs written for one system are 100% compatible with the other.
Write high quality games in no time using our easy-to-use GameAPI that incorporates physics, isometric display support, pixel-perfect collision detection and so much more...
Design forms visually on your PDA or desktop computer with the visual form builder. Edit components properties and code events within the same interface. PPL is a complete development environment.
Starting as low as $39.95 USD for a limited time.PPL - Pocket Programming Language
Write software for your PocketPC and PC in minutes using our new programming language. PPL is a fast and easy-to-learn programming language that is fully object-oriented. PPL runs on all Pocket PC using PocketPC 2000, 2002, Windows Mobile 2003, 2003SE, and 2005 (VGA compatible). PPL also runs on Windows 2000, XP, 2003 Server desktop computers. Programs written for one system are 100% compatible with the other.
Write high quality games in no time using our easy-to-use GameAPI that incorporates physics, isometric display support, pixel-perfect collision detection and so much more...
Design forms visually on your PDA or desktop computer with the visual form builder. Edit components properties and code events within the same interface. PPL is a complete development environment.
Starting as low as $39.95 USD for a limited time.
http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=52935&highlight=
there must be other options?
I guess SharpDevelop 2.1
develop is an Open Source IDE written in c# and running on the Microsoft .NET platform.
http://wiki.sharpdevelop.net/default.aspx/SharpDevelop.CompactFramework2Development
Opinions welcomed
The old VB for CE (and eVB) were rubbish. Unless it changed in much later versions these were just VBscript, not actually VB. Very limited functionality indeed.
All the C++ versions work OK (and I still use eVC++ 4 sometimes) , but of course C++ is a fairly fiddly, low-productivity language. It's not really the ideal language for having a play.
So, sorry to say, of the Microsoft ones VS2003/VS2005 using VB.net or c#.net are by far the easiest, and most productive of other offerings.
Never tried the non-MS ones.
Stuart
The real trouble with embedded VB is the runtime library it requires which will not run on WM 5 (it barely works on WM 2003).
I remember seeing a cheap and according to the manufacturer powerful VB compiler in some post on the forum, but for the life of me can't remember the name. It compiles to native code and doesn't require a run time.
Now it's true that C++ takes more work to get things done, but it also gives you more power. Even if you just program for your self you may one day want to create your own today plugin or even keyboard and that can't be done in .NET
My recommendation: Spend a little time and learn MFC. It has a lot of similarities to the .NET languages and saves a lot of work for C++ programmers.
[OT] i've also just started "trying" to create applications using vb.net on VS5. Am i allowed to ask questions here? Or is there a thread for posting vb or c questions?
Never seen a specif thread for these, and I am here quite often for a long time.
If you have a specific question you can even open a new thread, no need to clatter several unrelated issues in to one giant thread just because there about same programing language.
Just do a quick search first to make sure it's not something that was asked a 100 times and away you go.
Thanks I guess that leaves me with
PPL - Pocket Programming Language and SharpDevelop 2.1c#
thanks levenum. i will be doing that
starfish_001 said:
Thanks I guess that leaves me with
PPL - Pocket Programming Language and SharpDevelop 2.1c#
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Click to collapse
I can highly recommend ppl, seeing as I just entered the games competition and had my entry done in just over twenty days, without any real windows based programming background.
it's relatively cheap, and the support is great, with questions on the forum getting a very fast turn around.
Here's another to look at Basic4ppc
http://www.basic4ppc.com/
Basic4ppc and ppl are both great little applications
what is MFC ?
levenum said:
My recommendation: Spend a little time and learn MFC. It has a lot of similarities to the .NET languages and saves a lot of work for C++ programmers.
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trying ot choose on which programming language I will begin with and I was wondering what is MFC ?
Thank you
MFC == microsoft foundation Classes --- library
it's a library which encaption the gui and other general purpos functionalitet of windows in a set of classes that makes it
easier to get ones program up and running without having to
worry about WinMain and a messageLoop
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Foundation_Classes
microsoft have long since abandoned mfc as their pref library
now they are pushing .NET
problem is that .net is slower more so on devices like pda's
MFC really means
Mother F*cking Crazy, which it will drive you! All joking aside it is probably the best thing to develop in. I've writen small apps with it on every CE since 2.11 and even on XPeMbedded (which I'd avoid like the black death).
I've had great success with C# on WM5 and Pocket PC before. Even wrote a handheld POS terminal. Microsoft is really behind .NET and it will be supported for a long time. It's very easy to learn and the documentation is great.
Visual Basic .NET will do the same job, but keep in mind the switch from VB6 to VB.NET is HUGE. Just because some of the code looks the same doesn't mean it is. I'd take the time and learn C#. If you're really serious register as Microsoft ISV (their program is Empower for ISVs). For $375 you get basically everything MS has written in the last 10 years. You get 5 development use copies of anything you want including Visual Studio 2005 Professional. All you have to do is create an app for a Microsoft system in 18 months.
PM me if you need any more details.
Thanks
starfish_001 said:
Thanks I guess that leaves me with
PPL - Pocket Programming Language and SharpDevelop 2.1c#
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Click to collapse
Thank u bro
Hi,
I hope this question is not too lame to all of you experience developers.
I would like to start developing Windows Mobile app. Could you please inform a little bit about what would be the good programming language and tools that I should learn?
I have browsed quite a while, and found several alternatives, like C++ or .Net compact framework. but i confuse which one woulb be the best all around, easy and have future prospect/support.
My goal is to create open sourced On Screen keyboard app.
I am no stranger in Windows programming. I code in Borland Delphi and a little bit VC++.
But I know almost none about Windows Mobile. Well, I tried Java J2ME, but does not like much.
Please if you can advice, or maybe inform about good books or articles, so I can start
getting dirty (coding).
Thanks.
.net is easy to start with but a bit slow
and have limitations
microMFC is ok speedwise with c++ but in general af dated object lib
pure win32 stk is the fastest way and give the most options but like with pure win32 for windows it's take some exp to get good at and you dont just throw together a prototype in a few mins
vb not .net is a horror and should be avoided at all costs
vb .net is pretty much just c# with an ugly syntax
other "high" language's are not likely to be as powerfull and prob got narrow developer numbers and could go away as fast as they came about
think borland even have some developing envioment for wm not sure if it use delphi though
Hello all,
This post is in regard to the Google Android Challenge put out by Google to create/develop new software for the Google Android shell. If you haven't had a chance to read about it, it's basically a new OS created by Google to run on any type of PDAesque cellular phone. The challenge issued is then to develop new software for this OS (written in Java) so that when it is released it will have software available for it.
My question to all of you is what software would you like to see developed for this new OS? The reason I am asking for ideas is because I am a CS undergraduate student working in a research group to create one of these programs. Ergo, I figured asking you guys what you'd like to see created would be the best way to get ideas that will make sense and benefit the community.
Any ideas you submit here may be used in the creation of new software--if you require idea copyrights that can be worked out.
Thank you all in advance,
Jake
Jake Lake
Undergraduate Student at LCSC Lewiston, ID
Hello Jake,
We'll I'm a Java programmer too, not thinking of entering the challenge though. Had a quick look at the SDK for Android and it does'nt seem like pure java, more like a hybrid of C and Java does'nt it?
Since I have'nt had a thorough look at it, I'd like to ask you a few questions regarding the freedom to program on the platform.
Since it does'nt use the "normal" JVM but googles Davlik where theres no byte code but script code, does it allow better interaction with the hardware, and is it faster? Also can you implement equallizers and other effects in a media based application, which of course was not possible on J2ME. I was thinking on a All-round mediaplayer for Android, something like Rockbox which maybe found at www.rockbox.org which is a linux based program used on iPods etc.. but has been ported to Linux based EZX phones.
Regards,
Akshay
Hello,
After a decade of not doing C, I find that alot of things have changed when programming c++ native for CE. Even things like:
string somestring;
no longer function. Wow!.
strcpy has been replaced with StringCchCopy. Wow, MS has done a number here... and so on...
Anyhow I searched xda and found allot of good threads. But what if I'm looking at re-learning C++, with a focus on CE programming only? What books and other resources would you recommend, its almost like starting from scratch. I got vs2005 + emu + been reading allot of MSDN, did some basic apps. etc.
BTW: How the .... do you declare a variable length string???
and in VS2005 is running the debugger the only way to get the app to start automatically ???
Thanks
*bump*, anyone?
Couple of notes:
1) I strongly recommend avoiding VS, it is unbearably slow and balky.
2) strcpy and all the other functions are still supported by c runtime on CE (VS 2005 complains about them but you can ignore it). The problem is all windows API on CE use UNICODE so you have to declare strings as WCHAR (thats MS speak for unsigned short) and use wcscpy, and such.
3) The only book I know on CE specifically is this and I only read the two sample chapters online, so can't really recommend it. (Though the sample chapters were very useful). What you need is to get a good book on Win32 programming that will get you well on your way.
4) There is an MFC class CString which wraps up all string related functions very nicely. If you are not using MFC but clean C/C++ the only thing I can think of is malloc and free or the C++ versions new and delete.
Check out the links in my sig if you want to see code examples of small but functioning apps.
I disagree with levenum's comment on VS, but agree at the same time (weird I know). I wouldn't use VS for native development because it has A LOT of extra features that I think would be useless for native developers. Also, the lighter eVC++ has pretty much everything you need to write native apps.
I had this book called "Programming Windows CE 3.0" or something along those lines a few years ago. I got it for like $3 on Amazon. If you can find an updated version of that (or even the old version would be useful) then you should buy it. It will show you all you need to know to get started. You can learn the new api's from browsing msdn.
If you're only a little rusty with C/C++ I would suggest jumping right in to the Sdk samples and seeing how they do things.
Thanks, the reason why I wanted to use VS is so that maybe later I wouldn't mind going into MFC. So having one platform would be nice.
So far I have done some basic things, like drawing, etc, but I find I'm having a harder time making strings and including the api's to work. Almost all of the msdn examples fail to compile properly.
I have an old book MFC for Windows 95 by MS, is it even worth looking at ?
robp said:
I disagree with levenum's comment on VS, but agree at the same time (weird I know). I wouldn't use VS for native development because it has A LOT of extra features that I think would be useless for native developers. Also, the lighter eVC++ has pretty much everything you need to write native apps.
I had this book called "Programming Windows CE 3.0" or something along those lines a few years ago. I got it for like $3 on Amazon. If you can find an updated version of that (or even the old version would be useful) then you should buy it. It will show you all you need to know to get started. You can learn the new api's from browsing msdn.
If you're only a little rusty with C/C++ I would suggest jumping right in to the Sdk samples and seeing how they do things.
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Click to collapse
could you provide some links for msdn. also i know how to program in c but how do i compile a program for windows ce could you recommend a free one. thanks
The only way to code for Windows Mobile for free is to use embedded Visual C++. You'll have to google it to find a link.
Once you have that downloaded, check out:
http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/bb158662.aspx
The new solution files most probably won't open in eVC++ but you can create new projects and add the source files yourself.
You'll want to look at the samples in the Win32 folder.
robp said:
The only way to code for Windows Mobile for free is to use embedded Visual C++.
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Click to collapse
That's not entirely true - there's still ceGCC (it works on linux or windows using cygwin) - however this one lacks resource (window, forms, etc) editor (but if you have resources already created it will compile/link properly). But it works great with apps where you want to handle all the graphics and user interaction by yourself (like games, or programs with 100% custom UI), for example using SDL, pocketHAL, etc.
Also, wxWidgets seems to have support for windowsCE, and might be made to work with ceGCC, but i haven't tested it yet.
Sorry, I actually meant to put "(I think)" after that sentence lol.
Actually I think you should be able to use any C++ compiler as long as you have the necessary libraries, and I think all the libs you need are in the sdk download. But the easiest route for beginners in native coding is probably eVC++
Well, now i can agree with you
That is, unless you want to create games - in that case ceGCC+XFlib might be a good way to go for someone with general programming knowledge, but not familiar with winCE-specific coding. Some games coded with it (and their sources) can be found on XFlib homepage: www.xflib.net.
thanks for the info
Ok, as I wouldn't mind at a later time going into MFC, and building dll's for mobile. How much "harder" would it be for me to learn VS2005 native for ce instead of using evc++ ?
Just trying to weight the cons and the pros. BTW where can I get eVC ?
Thank you.
Two more free options: PellesC and Lazarus + WinCE add-on
I don't think it would much harder. Once you get the hang of it you'll find that it makes life much easier. If you buy a boxed retail version it comes with a nice book that will take you from n00b to master in a few hours (not really but it's still a great reference).
I think the hardest part of upgrading to newer versions of VS is learning the new project file setup. Atleast that's what it looks like from watching other students at my school go from VS6.0 to VS2k5 and 2k8.
Also, I should note that I prefer VS2008 hands-down, but I don't disagree with other people who say eVC++ is faster. While I haven't done any real native development since eVC++ 4 was new, I still dabble a bit (especially since getting active on this forum) and VS2005 works great to me.
So, my advice would be to use the newest tools available to you, unless money is an issue. But don't be worried about upgrading. Your life will only get easier once you do.
robp said:
Also, I should note that I prefer VS2008 hands-down, but I don't disagree with other people who say eVC++ is faster. While I haven't done any real native development since eVC++ 4 was new, I still dabble a bit (especially since getting active on this forum) and VS2005 works great to me.
So, my advice would be to use the newest tools available to you, unless money is an issue. But don't be worried about upgrading. Your life will only get easier once you do.
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Click to collapse
Well I just got eVC and will give it a try too. But I am pretty much used to vs2005. I do not think I can't afford the vs2008 right now. How much difference is there between 2005 and 2008 when it comes to programming for WM?
I'm looking to create some commercial applications for WM. For the last 10 years I'v been doing .com apps, now I figured I would do some for the mobile platform. We have all the graphics/design/marketing guys for .com, so it should work out just fine for WM.
One thing we noticed when working with exec type people is their frustration, I see exactly how we can help them resolve their frustration with WM, Symb, and java type phones...
Thanks
marek101 said:
Well I just got eVC and will give it a try too. But I am pretty much used to vs2005. I do not think I can't afford the vs2008 right now. How much difference is there between 2005 and 2008 when it comes to programming for WM?
I'm looking to create some commercial applications for WM. For the last 10 years I'v been doing .com apps, now I figured I would do some for the mobile platform. We have all the graphics/design/marketing guys for .com, so it should work out just fine for WM.
One thing we noticed when working with exec type people is their frustration, I see exactly how we can help them resolve their frustration with WM, Symb, and java type phones...
Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Honestly I wouldn't rush to upgrade. VS2008 is better, but doesn't add much to the WM development arena.
And if you already have VS2005 and are used to it, I would stick with that and forget about eVC++. You should give the compact framework a try. I promise you'll love it
compact framework, that's a part of the .NET isn't it?.
For the time being, for learning purposes, I think I will stick with the native for now. Once I get a grip, I will explore .net. The thing is I really don't like bulky apps for WM. Most of the apps I came across that required the .net framework were slow, any apps that use the .net with a today plug in seem to really slow down my phone.
BTW is HTC Home plug in written with the .net?
Thanks
marek, it seems to me that you are under the impression that you need VS 2005 to use MFC.
eVC fully supports MFC as well as creating DLLs and MFC DLLs.
It admit the reason I don't like VS is because I only write in native and don't like .NET languages a lot.
Since you want to create commercial apps you should note that any app created with WM 5 SKD will not be backwards compatible with WM 2003 which reduces your clients range.
You should compile with WM 2003 SDK which is forward compatible.
Our primary target audience would be WM6. We will make every effort to make WM5 compatible apps. Yes it does reduces significantly the client base, but also there are many positives...
We are still looking for more programmers for the simple concepts we have developed. I believe this will work out just fine. Having WM5 support is a "would be nice" but not required. WM5 has a bag of problems, 2003 I don't even want to touch it.
Thanks
I have to admit that I love VS because I love using .net
But VS is also a much more powerful editor in general than eVC is. It's still nice but the experience isn't as smooth as it is in newer versions, which is expected since the newer versions build on the previous ones.