Database Users

It could be worse, you might have an iPhone

Here is a list of features for the iPhone,
* The mobile version of OS X or whatever it is the iPhone runs takes up 700MB
* There's no way to cut, copy, or paste text!
* No A2DP support.
* Sorry, music can't be used as a ringtone
* On a PC the iPhone syncs with Outlook for calendars AND addresses
* It supports Exchange 'in some capacity'
* Document file reading -- but not editing -- for PDF, Word, and Excel (only).
* Adobe Flash support is officially out. It's just not in the browser.
* No kind of embedded video support.
* It will take snaps, but won't record video.
* Oh, and no MMS.
* No voice dialing, either.
* Contact groups can't be emailed as contact lists.
* Apple says between 300-400 charges the iPhone will lose battery capacity -- you'll send it in and get the cell replaced for a fee.
* Apple will be rolling out periodic updates
* Voice quality is said to be good -- not great.
Aren't you glad you bought an Athena not an iPhone?
I look forward to laughing at iPhone owners. Now I have nothing against apple, but this thing costs a bomb and has half the features.
Athena owner meets iPhone owner,
"hey, thats a pretty phone. Can you do blah with it?"
"No the iPhone wont do blah. Ooh, thats a huge 5"screen you've got, wow! I wish my iPhone could do that! AND that, and that! Hold on, battery is dead. No I cant replace it, no spare. I have to post it back to apple now."

I think you might have missed out:
"Wow a touchflow screen - shame the resolution is so low....."

It could be worse
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Click to collapse
Absolutely. And it would be hard to make the Athena better...
Of course, there's always something that could have been better, but compared to other phones or the iPhone, the Athena is miles ahead.

Moskus said:
Absolutely. And it would be hard to make the Athena better...
Of course, there's always something that could have been better, but compared to other phones or the iPhone, the Athena is miles ahead.
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Click to collapse
And only twice as expensive, too...
Give the Athena OS and hardware the sort of R&D Apple put into making their stuff work - but instead of cutting back on what it does, make it ALL work properly

Its an interesting first attempt, but they've got a fair way to go before it becomes a 'smart' device, rather than just a sexy phone. No 3G, unable to update OTA from Itunes, a fairly 'closed' platform (until people defeat that ) puts me off this 1st generation phone. I read today of rumors that 3G will be fixed for the European Release (via Yodafone), but the extended contract lifetimes with Mobile providers is very offputting.
I'm gonna wait till gen2 or even gen3 to see if the phone becomes 'smart' enough to warrant the screen size and how it pans out with the apple-chefs or the true apple upgrades. And I've never bought into the apple form over function that they've adopted since imac days.

Im afraid a stylish device with eye candy transition effects, just doesn't justify the large costs, restrictions and appaling array of non supported features for me.
I blame Microsoft and the manufactuers who make windows Mobile devices for their distinct lack of advertising, the cost of which is an array of people happy to call this the "god phone" despite much better and affordable and vastly less restricted technology being out there. With the exception of its multitouch interface its comparatively using the technology specs of a Windows 2003SE device.
To Apples credit though millions of people getting ready to sign up for two years to get one of these and tolerate an "activation fee" so I don't know what category to give them the thumbs up in, but they have obviously done something right.
Although I am still shocked that such a media driven device lacks the capacity to set mp3 ringtones, that should be on the top of apples first update to fix.

I think us geeks tend to forget that most people don't care of what is going on behind the eye candy. They want to use a stylish and easy-to-use phone.
For instance, go and show your parents, or any people in their forties-fifties who are not technology freaks, the iPhone and a Windows Mobile device, let them "play" with it for their use (i.e., place and receive calls, and maybe some SMS), and in the end ask them to choose one of the devices. I can already guess their choice....
In my opinion most of use are too much technology-centered, and find it hard to believe that Apple tries to center the device on its users...
Why did the first iPod have such a great success, when many competitors offered a screen for viewing videos, an FM tuner and voice recording for a lesser price?
Just my two cents (and anyway this is an eternal debate, so please don't start the usual flame war )
Silviu

RichardKAthena said:
And only twice as expensive, too...
Give the Athena OS and hardware the sort of R&D Apple put into making their stuff work - but instead of cutting back on what it does, make it ALL work properly
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes it's twice as expensive, but you should compare the iPhone to the HTC Hermes or the new HTC Kaiser.
Does iPhone support UMTS/HSDPA? Nope
Does iPhone support Exchange/Push Email? Nope
Does iPhone support any Remote Desktop apps? Nope
Does iPhone support user-created apps? Nope
Does iPhone support any 3. party software at all? Nope (at least not yet)
Can I then even use this phone? Nope...

Moskus said:
Yes it's twice as expensive, but you should compare the iPhone to the HTC Hermes or the new HTC Kaiser.
Does iPhone support UMTS/HSDPA? Nope
Does iPhone support Exchange/Push Email? Nope
Does iPhone support any Remote Desktop apps? Nope
Does iPhone support user-created apps? Nope
Does iPhone support any 3. party software at all? Nope (at least not yet)
Can I then even use this phone? Nope...
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Click to collapse
So, in fact, you want a mobile computer, not a mobile telephone
There's a very big clue in the name - iPhone. phone. Not iReallytinycomputerthatevenpeoplethatdon'tlikeAppleseemobsessedwithbecausedeepdowntheyknowApple'scomputershavethebestuserexperienceandtheyallwantitinapocketsizeddevice.
Sure, Apple could make a device like the Athena. And like the Athena, it would cost more than a MacBook, and like most UMPCs, it would sell in tiny amounts compared to the easy to engineer, wide-market appeal MacBook.

RichardKAthena said:
So, in fact, you want a mobile computer, not a mobile telephone
There's a very big clue in the name - iPhone. phone. Not iReallytinycomputerthatevenpeoplethatdon'tlikeAppleseemobsessedwithbecausedeepdowntheyknowApple'scomputershavethebestuserexperienceandtheyallwantitinapocketsizeddevice.
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Click to collapse
Well I get along with my other devices as the Qtek 9100, HTC TyTN, S620 and MTeoR.
The Pocket PCs support most of the points I specified, and the smartphones does at least support Push Email and 3. party software.
So, to me and I guess other users that likes how Smartphones powered by either Windows Mobile or Symbian, the iPhone won't do it. If you're a "standard users" that actually like those "simple" phones from Nokia or Sony Ericsson, the iPhone might suit you.

Digital.Diablo said:
Its an interesting first attempt, but they've got a fair way to go before it becomes a 'smart' device, rather than just a sexy phone. No 3G, unable to update OTA from Itunes, a fairly 'closed' platform (until people defeat that ) puts me off this 1st generation phone. I read today of rumors that 3G will be fixed for the European Release (via Yodafone), but the extended contract lifetimes with Mobile providers is very offputting.
I'm gonna wait till gen2 or even gen3 to see if the phone becomes 'smart' enough to warrant the screen size and how it pans out with the apple-chefs or the true apple upgrades. And I've never bought into the apple form over function that they've adopted since imac days.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Apple stuff never gets good until third generation.
Apple II - 4K-16K typical, upper case only.
Apple II Plus - 48K, shift-key mod...
Apple //e - lower case, better keyboard, 128K with extended 80 column card.
Macintosh - 128K RAM, 400K floppy - essentially useless.
Macintosh 512K/e - 400 or 800K floppy, still not upgradeable at all.
Macintosh Plus - 1-4Mb via SIMM expansion, 800K Floppy, SCSI.
iMac - first gen, I'd argue, was the 233MHz Bondi range. Unreliable and slow.
Then we got the SE types and colours. They were better.
And then I consider the eMac to be the true 3rd gen iMac - G4, flat CRT - and they were pretty good. I used one as my main office machine for a couple of years, but I've now got a 24" Intel iMac which is near silent and has a beautiful screen for the money. (My G5 runs dual 20" cinema displays).
iPod has been a little different, but I think the 3rd gen iPod got it right - I don't like the click wheel as much as the scroll wheel and 4 button layout. Harder to use in the car and not illuminated.
I really hope Vodafone don't get the iPhone deal. Their current data plans are useless.

Moskus said:
Well I get along with my other devices as the Qtek 9100, HTC TyTN, S620 and MTeoR.
The Pocket PCs support most of the points I specified, and the smartphones does at least support Push Email and 3. party software.
So, to me and I guess other users that likes how Smartphones powered by either Windows Mobile or Symbian, the iPhone won't do it. If you're a "standard users" that actually like those "simple" phones from Nokia or Sony Ericsson, the iPhone might suit you.
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Click to collapse
Bingo! That's precisely the market Jobs wants. This is "simple phone" with balls, not smartphone. This is "SE Walkman phone" with a UI that doesn't make you want to smash the handset and enough storage to actually hold some music out of the box.
Look at my signature. What do I use? I choose to use WM devices and have done for a decade; I was using smartphones whilst most of the people on here were still in nappies figuratively speaking (I used to use a lashup of datacard and Windows CE handheld, then the Nokia 9000 came out). I love these devices; my Ameo is nicknamed "The Guide" because it really is like the Hitchhiker's Guide To the Galaxy - connected to the sub-ether net, access to all the information you can imagine, entertaining, communicative - it's a great device.
iPhone doesn't suit me. But I'm fully aware of the market that it is aiming for and I think that constantly harping on about how it isn't a good competitor to WM devices, or lacks x features, is really silly; if the iPhone doesn't do what you want, don't buy one, especially if an existing product does do what you want. It really does seem to be that everyone WANTS an iPhone, but can't justify it and feels the need to complain
Which for Apple, is fantastic. OMGWANT! is exactly what they want people to do with their products, and that people feel compelled to post about what it doesn't have and why it is no good for them is a clear indication that they really wish it DID do all these things, so they could have one.
I think I own about 100 computers currently and 5 or 6 phones. If I want iPhone I'll have one anyway, but since it's only got 8GB, it won't replace my 80GB iPod as a music player - it'd be a whole extra device with a frustrating inability to cart all my music, thus ensuring I have to choose some to keep on it, and with no reason to use it instead of my Ameo.
And that's just fine by me, because the Ameo, flawed as it is, is still pretty damn good.

I'm intrigued to see how the OMGIWO (Oh my Gawd, I want one) effect lasts with iphone. Initially when the pod launched, it had this effect, but these days, every joe and his mate's got one, so there's nothing interesting to see when you get it out in public.
However, I suspect my Ameo will be pulling the crowds for a couple of years to come! Only today did I have a fella asking me all about it, and when I went through the spec's he nearly wet himself. HTC/T-mobile can probably chalk up another sale!

Digital.Diablo said:
I'm intrigued to see how the OMGIWO (Oh my Gawd, I want one) effect lasts with iphone. Initially when the pod launched, it had this effect, but these days, every joe and his mate's got one, so there's nothing interesting to see when you get it out in public.
However, I suspect my Ameo will be pulling the crowds for a couple of years to come! Only today did I have a fella asking me all about it, and when I went through the spec's he nearly wet himself. HTC/T-mobile can probably chalk up another sale!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When I got my Ameo, I ended up with my girlfriend buying one, two mates getting them, and about four more wanting them but not having the cash/being stuck on contract.
iPods are still good, but they're a commodity device now. I replace mine every year as long as there is a significant/useful upgrade; I pass the old one on to someone, though my 20GB one needed a new battery (and was then killed by a third-party USB/Firewire charging lead that also blew the Firewire bus on my G5 >_<)
Phones always attract more attention as a lekking device (look it up ). iPhone will do well for that, I think, and the tactile user interface will go a long way.

RichardKAthena said:
lekking
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A lek is a gathering of males, of certain animal species, for the purposes of competitive mating display.
Sounds like Scottish version of what we say (In Jest) "Right, lets all get our c..ks out and start waving them around." Your's is more 'polite' though.
The one thing that the WM5 needs is better out of the box skins. I've installed a black one (ying/yang I think) from this forum and it pee's all over the out of the box ones from MicroT-Mobilesoft. I'm not buying into the hype I'm afraid. And I think there does need to be a better explanation of the iphone NOT being a PDA/smartphone, just a smart-looking phone. Just out of interest, am I correct in remembering that my Ex's pink ipod-mini had a basic personal organiser function - A calendar with reminders?

I agree with much of what has been said - the Ifyyphone is aimed at a different market. Therefore...
Moskus said:
Does iPhone support Exchange/Push Email? Nope
Does iPhone support any Remote Desktop apps? Nope
Does iPhone support user-created apps? Nope
Does iPhone support any 3. party software at all? Nope (at least not yet)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
...these are all fine - an Iphoney doesn't care about these things
BUT
Moskus said:
Does iPhone support UMTS/HSDPA? Nope
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is unforgivable these days.

Digital.Diablo said:
A lek is a gathering of males, of certain animal species, for the purposes of competitive mating display.
Sounds like Scottish version of what we say (In Jest) "Right, lets all get our c..ks out and start waving them around." Your's is more 'polite' though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's true, though - you see how people are with their mobiles. Showing them around, having the latest models, the best features. Sometimes the most bizarre models get to be desirable - that unremarkable thing Panasonic/someone else sold that was the "Beckham Phone" for example. The Ameo is one HELL of a lekking device, but it suffers the same problem as my car does - gotta explain it. If I wanted to pull 'birds' as my normal peer group goes for (filthy goffick type here, I'm afraid), then the RX8 doesn't get a look in compared to a Focus ST, because the ST is loud, familiar and known to be quick. The RX8 has a bloody Wankel FFS. Sure, when someone gets in it and you boot it, there's this look of comprehension that kicks in, but on the road, it's a vaguely flash, odd sounding car.
Can't use it to pull if you have to get nerdy. Unless you like nerdy girls. In which case, well, my gf bought herself an Ameo after seeing mine. Says it all, I think
(also, oddly enough, she's in Birmingham. I'm going to have to listen out for that phrase now )
The one thing that the WM5 needs is better out of the box skins. I've installed a black one (ying/yang I think) from this forum and it pee's all over the out of the box ones from MicroT-Mobilesoft. I'm not buying into the hype I'm afraid. And I think there does need to be a better explanation of the iphone NOT being a PDA/smartphone, just a smart-looking phone. Just out of interest, am I correct in remembering that my Ex's pink ipod-mini had a basic personal organiser function - A calendar with reminders?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think the messaging app (at least the one on the Ameo, as they're apparently different on other devices like the Treo 750w) needs a lot of work, and the preferences panels are horrid, they look like they were drawn in Visual Basic by an NC Computing Student. A bad one. But yes, better skins go a long way towards fixing the crude look and feel.
iPods-with-displays have address book and calendar synchronisation, no editing (I think, the key to the PDA paradigm), and of course read-only notes.

3G?
http://www.newswireless.net/index.cfm/article/3466

As someone who works in the school system here in the US, I've used many Apple products over the years. One thing all of the Apple devices have in common that I have used is that they are too restrictive. They are all closed systems. I want to make choices, not have them made for me. I'm not some simple idiot that can't make my own decisions. This is the main reason I won't be buying an iPhone. Frankly I'm not that happy with Windows either (it's heading too much in this direction as well). I prefer Linux and I would like to see it show up on more phones.
There are some really nice things about the iPhone, but as long as Apple keeps being restrictive, I won't be using their products.

Pyrofer
Actually I don't care what you think, I have all the different devices that I wish, so its just another " mobile experience". And you don't have base to judge that (only specs to compare)
For me it's better have an Iphone that a lot of Windows Mobile Devices (most of them are EQUAL) I'm saying that because I have both...
It's very sad limited people without curiosity and criteria to evaluate other platforms, It just like Linux (opensource) people that ignore Microsoft innovation products, just like You do with Apple.
Thanks god I have money to spend in shinny new gadgets...

Latest News and picture of Shift ! No GPS and Phone for sure out the of Box !

Hi guys, there are more news on the HTC shift, it has been official presented on the 28th in Taiwan by HTC. This is the official retail package and it's 100% what you will get in retail store.
Here is a link for some picture: http://www.mobile01.com/topicdetail.php?f=224&t=508252&last=4825702
For those people who can't see the picture, see my attachment of how to show the picture.
My HTC contact was there and he has tested the device, i specific ask him to test on phone and gps function, he report back saying that there is 100% no phone and GPS inside the Shift.
I know a lot of people will say they seen photo of GPS or phone, but that me remind you this, this is the latest official retail version, all device before are prototype. Yes, i have also seen the picture on FCC website showing there is GPS inside, that's the reason I asked my friend to test it! And let me say this again, there will be no GPS or Phone out of the box.
Our hope will be for the developers here in XDA to crack the function to enable full windows mobile, phone, and GPS.
p.s. Another news i got from my friend, HTC is saying the SD slot will only support up to 2GB.

can you getem?
Hi Wu, how are you doing, just wondering like you got me my Dopod, can you get hold of a shift for me? Thanks Dude

faisal.husain said:
Hi Wu, how are you doing, just wondering like you got me my Dopod, can you get hold of a shift for me? Thanks Dude
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Click to collapse
Hi Faisal, i am fine thank you. I hope you are doing well too.
Yes i can get the Shift for you, it's currently on pre-order and the device will be available on the 4th of Feb. Price is a bit lower then anywhere else and you will get bonus with it such as GPS and extra battery....etc.
If you are interesting in getting one, please PM me and we can discuss more there !

Hmm.. i´m ordered a sample from our german distributor but now i´m thinking about to cancel the order. We thinking long time ago about a integration of the shift in our company network for our VIP customers. But without gps, without Mobile and without LAN (or can i install Windows over netboot over WLAN??) i should search better for a other solution. there is not really a innovation inside. maybe the better solution with same features is a Toshiba Portégé R400 Series laptop..
but we will see the next on cebit i hope. maybe a other manufactor. we support htc from scratch with their first devices. after over 7000 devices and the problems within it´s time to test a other manufacor i think. maybe asus, samsung

Pre-Order all gone
Please do not ask me any more for HTC Shift, all the 200 unit for pre-order is gone already, first shipment will be on the 4th of Feb, if there is any more stock available, i will let you all know asap.

joy.d said:
Hmm.. i´m ordered a sample from our german distributor but now i´m thinking about to cancel the order. We thinking long time ago about a integration of the shift in our company network for our VIP customers. But without gps, without Mobile and without LAN (or can i install Windows over netboot over WLAN??) i should search better for a other solution. there is not really a innovation inside. maybe the better solution with same features is a Toshiba Portégé R400 Series laptop..
but we will see the next on cebit i hope. maybe a other manufactor. we support htc from scratch with their first devices. after over 7000 devices and the problems within it´s time to test a other manufacor i think. maybe asus, samsung
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
weird comment .. I don't see any device being a half of what the Shift is ... and even without GPS, without Phone, without LAN and without full WM6 .. the shift is still the best device on the market for my needs.
WLAN will replace LAN over the time.. so I don't think it is a big mistake, but it could have been great
GPS "should" be in the SHIFT but not in WM6 (GPS in Vista).. but the choice is not perfect (who whant a GPS that is working only 2 hours..)
The Shift is not the perfect device, for everyone, but we have to see the real potential of the shift before crying for any lack of feature.
HTC has announced a "shift" like device with 5" .. maybe it will have GPS, Phone, etc.. we will see

weird - yes of course.. ;-)
i´m think it´s a new strategy of HTC to make devices without completly knows features.
maybe, LAN is only for Enterprise Customers like us with over 200tsd Users worldwide interesting, (automatic Software distribution) but Phone Functionality is interesting some more users. Is not really practicable with a 7" Device, but with BT Headset and Speak Control - why not. GPS is only a nice Addon for freaks like me, they travel around the world.
But overall: you´re need really a device like this? (i call that "the innovation factor" inside ;-)
But it´s really needed? Sometimes i think about Asus EEE PC, there a many Websites with modding this mini laptop, it´s crazy. when i have a look to this modding sites I see one:
they have much fun with modding her cheap Asus EEE Laptop.
But after 6 Years with HTC devices in all colors I ask me sometimes:
where is the fun - as i start with it..
;-)

joy.d said:
weird - yes of course.. ;-)
...
But overall: you´re need really a device like this? (i call that "the innovation factor" inside ;-)
But it´s really needed? Sometimes i think about Asus EEE PC, there a many Websites with modding this mini laptop, it´s crazy.
...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well well well .. yeah I really need a device like this. I hate laptop (it's almost like bringing my desktop tower ...) because it's too big for me (even 11" ones). The shift has the perfect size for being a good laptop to use everywhere (including when travelling, when being on the bed, ...).
A laptot is not silent at all... mine is making too much noise.. almost the same as my desktop ! And it's warm.. warm... too warm ! I can't keep it on my knees more than 10 minutes ... WAW ! Totally useless to have a laptop.
The shift is quite, cold (not warm I mean ) and I can put it in my pocket (yeah I can... really ... I can ! .. have I tried... not yet.. but I have look the size and it fits well in my pocket... yeah.. really !).
I have bought an HTC Touch to work without any computer with me ... and .. ouch.. impossible to work with the Touch ! No real application on Windows Mobile .... Mobile Office? NOOOO it's too horrible ! On the shift I can use Windows Vista to work .. mmh so nice !
And what about the size .. 40Go is enough to work everywhere I want .. i can plug a VGA cable to my TFT to have a real screen .. and I can do this in so many room (I'm a student, so believe me... I do see a lot of monitor that just want to put their VGA cable in something !).
The only thing that can be bad was the keyboard, but I have tried it.. and WAW it worked well ! Not as well as my own Logitech Media Keyboard with about 80 words per minute... but I can type about 60 words per minute... enough when I'm not @ home.
I do believe the shift is the only solution for me right now, and I'm waiting a little to see all the real features available on the "retail" shift.. but I have great hopes in it !

Supposedly the Shift has the Qualcomm MSM 7200 chipset in it which has voice and gps built in. I can not see them "removing" that from the chipset. It's just a matter of time before this device get's "unlocked" to it's fullest potential.
I still do not see the marketing strategy of HTC leaving these features "out"... You would think that every device you release you would want to sell the hell out of it no? Are they that cocky that they believe they will be around forever to keep selling up their products to us?
i.e. Model Shift II including GPS!!! More money!!!

juiceppc said:
Supposedly the Shift has the Qualcomm MSM 7200 chipset in it which has voice and gps built in. I can not see them "removing" that from the chipset. It's just a matter of time before this device get's "unlocked" to it's fullest potential.
I still do not see the marketing strategy of HTC leaving these features "out"... You would think that every device you release you would want to sell the hell out of it no? Are they that cocky that they believe they will be around forever to keep selling up their products to us?
i.e. Model Shift II including GPS!!! More money!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hard to know... but it's sure that the strategy seems completely wrong .... maybe they want us to buy a Phone and a GPS ... but it's not the right choice.... many people will not buy a HTC device because of it...

It is an odd strategy but not the first time they've done this stuff. Still I think most people who are inclined to buy Windows Mobile devices usually research them. A WinMo device is alot more advanced than your cpl hundred dollar nokias, I think when people are spending over $500 on a phone they are pretty inclined to do some research.
With that said im pretty sure HTC know if they release a shift w/o GPS or phone enabled, good people here can hack it and enable (remember the P3600) and then its on the users onus if things mess up. Actually sounds like a good strategy when you think about it, they only have to meet target "X" in terms of standards for "X" features. If end users decide to try activating features "Y" then they do so at their own risk...

Osir1s said:
It is an odd strategy but not the first time they've done this stuff. Still I think most people who are inclined to buy Windows Mobile devices usually research them. A WinMo device is alot more advanced than your cpl hundred dollar nokias, I think when people are spending over $500 on a phone they are pretty inclined to do some research.
With that said im pretty sure HTC know if they release a shift w/o GPS or phone enabled, good people here can hack it and enable (remember the P3600) and then its on the users onus if things mess up. Actually sounds like a good strategy when you think about it, they only have to meet target "X" in terms of standards for "X" features. If end users decide to try activating features "Y" then they do so at their own risk...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i don't think it's smart.. because about 50% of intersted people will not buy the shift only because of missing GPS and Phone.

Windows7 looks and sounds overhyped

i know im not the only one that thinks this....i love new features and upgrades just as much as anyone but it seems the goal of windows 7 is to take away the customization experience of windows and bring consumers closer with microsoft then closer 2 their device. No flash, No skins, limited apps, and lets be honest who wants a device that looks exactly the same as another person device, u could take a million hd2 and none will look exactly like mines

jbanga86 said:
i know im not the only one that thinks this....i love new features and upgrades just as much as anyone but it seems the goal of windows 7 is to take away the customization experience of windows and bring consumers closer with microsoft then closer 2 their device. No flash, No skins, limited apps, and lets be honest who wants a device that looks exactly the same as another person device, u could take a million hd2 and none will look exactly like mines
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I say save these comments till after it comes out and you actually use it.
And it's Windows Phone 7 Series, not Windows 7.
dwizzy130

anything short of 5 pages and this thread will be a failure!

dwizzy130 said:
I say save these comments till after it comes out and you actually use it.
And it's Windows Phone 7 Series, not Windows 7.
dwizzy130
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Click to collapse
I'd agree if it was for ALL comments on the awesomeness OR failure of WP7s.

lol all im saying is if we wanted a zune we would buy a zune!
seriously ever since the thing came out they been talking about
making it a phone and now this is new news?
psht! they have a few ideas on point though like the whole
finger friendly thing, but to me its like buying a new house
with thin walls or move into a comfy old brick home
yeah the lighting fixtures is up to date but what about the foundation

I love the new interface. I love the accent that is being layed on the text. From what i've seen it's like browsing through a magazine. Well thought, because in the end, mostly it's text with what you're dealing with on this type of devices.
No really, i'm very thrilled about the new design. And with the new silverlight based development framework I think that we can expect more useful applications that are focussed on what they are supposed to do and less on the user interface.

The UI is awesome. Other than that, it's just an iPhone copy with the same bad policies, like censorship and no multitasking, no file system access etc.

seed_al said:
The UI is awesome. Other than that, it's just an iPhone copy with the same bad policies, like censorship and no multitasking, no file system access etc.
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WP7S, No cutomizability, locked eco system, no multi tasking.
Dont u think it defeats the purpose of WinMO.
I hope it will be a big failure. The reason i got WinMO instead of anything else is because of the power of freedom it has. WP7S killed that.
and yes, its just as hyped up as iphone before it was release. NOthing more. Its not revolutionary, its just pretty with no brain.
The start or home screen may look pretty, but its functionless. U have to scroll a lot to see info. I think the novelty will wear off faster then the iphone.

Good post, Frostlance, very good post... it's sad how they destroyed everything good about Windows Mobile. I'm not at all interested in a stupid locked down system.

seed_al said:
Good post, Frostlance, very good post... it's sad how they destroyed everything good about Windows Mobile. I'm not at all interested in a stupid locked down system.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And not only that, they way they made WP7S Backwards incompatible also means MS just killed WinMO6.5 and previous versions.
Developers are abandoning WinMO 6.5 1 by 1, started with adobe , then Skype, and many more to come.
We were waiting for Flash 10.1 anxiously, seeing the beta version test on OUR HD2, but in the end, they discontinued their support for WinMO.
As Steve Ballmer Said " OS are nothing without Developers, Developers Developers , (he goes on saying developers many2 times)
And that is the fate of WinMO 6.5. With no Developer support, Our BELOVED OS, is becoming NOthing.
To tell you the truth,ive been a loyal WinMO user since 2000. I relied heavily on its apps (esp medical applications,helps me a lot with my work as a doctor and manage my patients data). Now ive heard from a friend in skyscape,a major medical apps developer for WinMO, that they will also discontinue support for WinMO. Now this really saddens me really.
For a phone(expensive phone in fact) which i bought just 2 months ago, will no longer provide me new apps, new updates to my medical apps, no flash (A BIG WASTE , With our huge gorgeous screen,we cant even load flash content!).
I envy those using android, updating their OS constantly, and getting apps like google earth,goggle and etc which we were once promised to be given,now all left is a dream.
MS has killed our beloved WinMO. It is a sad news for all of us. WP7S is more like a curse then a blessing.

I'd rather buy an iPhone than any WP7S device.
Both are locked down crap systems without multitasking from my POV.

Espentf said:
I'd rather buy an iPhone than any WP7S device.
Both are locked down crap systems without multitasking from my POV.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But WP7S has better hardware and a better UI. So, IF you buy a locked down crap system, you really should get a WP7S phone.
But of course, you shouldn't buy a locked down crap system.

seed_al said:
But WP7S has better hardware
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do we know enough about the iPhone 4 to be sure that its hardware will be inferior to WP7S phones? We'll be about half way between that and its replacement when WP7 starts to get going.

Shasarak said:
Do we know enough about the iPhone 4 to be sure that its hardware will be inferior to WP7S phones? We'll be about half way between that and its replacement when WP7 starts to get going.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We know nothing about iPhone 4, but Apple's iPhone hardware has ALWAYS been at least half a year behind HTC's. I don't expect that to change.
iPhone 4 would need a WVGA display, a 1GHz processor, 448MB RAM, a five megapixel camera with dual LED flash, much much better materials... in order to be "only" half a year behind again. In other words: No way. They're not going to catch up anytime soon.

seed_al said:
We know nothing about iPhone 4, but Apple's iPhone hardware has ALWAYS been at least half a year behind HTC's. I don't expect that to change.
iPhone 4 would need a WVGA display, a 1GHz processor, 448MB RAM, a five megapixel camera with dual LED flash, much much better materials... in order to be "only" half a year behind again. In other words: No way. They're not going to catch up anytime soon.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The strange thing is that if the WP7 is really a closed down system without multitasking it would not need such advanced hardware for it. The need of so much memory and processor power is precisely because of the multitasking when a user can run several applications simultaneously. Otherwise you can have a good user experience with much less memory and processor power like in case of the iPhone.

This thread will be better if it has a poll on it.
I think it is hyped too. I really prefer the HTC interface and customization freedom of the HD2 against the new design of windows mobile 7. I have my device so customized that I can access every feature with a few clicks (AE button plus and multiple button press) I dont see that coming soon in WM7, you need to scroll a lot with your finger to actually go anywhere. And what botters me more is that it looks like "multimedia oriented" and not "bussisness" oriented.
If they close the platform like Apple they will loose al the support of the comunity. I really think WebOs look more interesting as a new modern platform (but they still lack variety of applications)
If there is no oficial WM7 update to the HD2, I really dont care. (we know the chef here will be realising it and even with a newer rom)

What not being said may be the most revealing.
Other than a few picture and limited stories from just a few people (MS insiders) what do we really know about WM7?
With all the stories about what WM7 cannot do, you start to wonder if there is something that we are not being told about the new OS.
For instance:
* MS Voice Command has not had any real updates for a number of years. Is there a (much improved) new version in WM7?
* Wireless/Blue tooth set up? (better setup etc?)
* Haptic interface,
* camera and other elements used in a more interactive way for interface?
* New/updated/Improved version of transcriber?
Or is MS really just going to bring out a dumb version of Windows Mobile, for the dummys, and to more directly compete with iPhone, and continue the development of the OS version (6.5) they already have for the business users, and the more adventurous?
We still remember XP/Vista don't we, lets hope MS learn't something!

No option for both? I think bits are great and bits are over hyped.

1) Maybe it´s going to be the same story as with Win Vista: faulty, crappy, resource-hungry, no benefits. Good for the basic user that only surfs with IE, listens to music, watches videos, e-mails and uploads videos on YouTube
2) NO software is uncrackable ! Wonder what the experts here on XDA will do with WM7 ! When I received my HD2 in November it wasn´t much more than my Touch HD, a little bit faster though. Now with all the geniousses here in this forum it is a rocket of a PDA that spared me the investment into a Sony Vaio P
3) I eagerly wait for the HD3 at the end of the year, wait this time some months ´till I buy it. First I will see what the leading programmers here will do with it, then buy it and flash it with a cooked ROM from this forum. And maybe this cooked ROM will be rebased on WM6.5.x or a hacked WM7, able of multitasking.
4) When I will buy HD3 (or whatever it will be called) I buy the hardware (1,5 GHz Qualcomm, ROM/RAM etc.) and I want it to be FAST. Like with Win Vista the hardware will be eaten up by WM7-software giving no speed advantage. Like with my Sony Vaio TT92 which is equipped with WinXP and which is much faster than most of the desktop-PCs for MY use of the Vaio (no gaming, prof. medical work) I will rely on the experts here to cook a ROM that´s faster than lightning for the APPS, ´cause I don´t care if the basic software is WM6.5.x or WM7, TF3D, HTCSense or what, I want my preferred apps to run fast and smooth w/o hangup.
Conclusion: trust the people here, THEY will make the best outa the new HARDWARE, not HTC, not Microsoft ..........

gm_fisher said:
Or is MS really just going to bring out a dumb version of Windows Mobile, for the dummys, and to more directly compete with iPhone, and continue the development of the OS version (6.5) they already have for the business users, and the more adventurous?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm afraid that's exactly what they are doing. Everyone - including MS - is green with envy for the zillion$$$ Apple are making with teenagers and "wanna-look-cool" adults who spend their time on social networks or mms-ing pictures. Little brains, fat wallets. No surprise manufacturers and carriers LOVE them and would do ANYTHING to please them.
MS had a decision to make: continue to fight on two fields (business and dummies) and continue losing to RIM on the former and to Apple on the latter? Or instead concentrate on one, playing the cards (like hardware) where the competition has always been behind?
WPS7 is just that.
Do I like it? Hell, no.
Would I have done the same thing had I been in Steve Ballmer's shoes? Probably yes.
Will their strategy succeed? Probably no. Unless Steve Jobs screws up big-time...
gm_fisher said:
We still remember XP/Vista don't we, lets hope MS learn't something!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Looking at Win7, I think they learnt that crappy-buggy OS's should never ever make their way into the market. However keeping looking at Win7 on other PC's makes me wish I will still have the option for XP when my laptop replacement is due in June.
I don't think MS will be stupid enough to allow WPS7 to be crappy-buggy like Vista, but most likely WPS7 will be as alienating to business users as Win7 is, leaving them in fact with two choices:
a) BlackBerry (for most)
b) Android (for power users)
Actually there is a third one for the (very few) adventurous: cooked WinMo ROMs.

I'm just tired on fighting with the X2

I just tired on fighting with this piece of crap.
In fact, I just surrender and just leave all the Windows Mobile 6.5 platform behind.
The X2 is a marvell Hardware device, but it's Software support it's a shame. I even think that SE Android support will be the same: low quality updates, no information.
I swear i'll never buy or it recommend a Sony Ericsson product again.
On the other hand, the Windows Mobile platform is really outdated and unsupported. Low quality apps, even for Twitter and Facebook (Twikini is the best out there and really is a shame compared to the iPhone or BlackBerry), no more Skype. Do I really need to tell you the Internet browser experience? Windows Mobile has NO future at all.
When the iPhone appeared in 2007, it was a shame operating system, we all agree. But, in 2010, iOS 4 is from another planet. There's no more excuses. Everyone should see it.
I'm affraid that Windows Phone 7 will take a couple years just to catch the progress on the Apple iOS. It doesn't have Copy/Paste, no multitasking, so...
I'm selling this piece of crap X2 that never got to work at a basic quality level, I'm jumping for good of the Windows Mobile world and I'm buying an iPhone 4 in the coming days. No need to find stupid arguments in defense of WM, a piece of crap operating system in our days (2010, not 2000 or 2002).
Cheers and sorry for my english (of course! an Spanish X2 user that never got his desired MR2 GENERIC_ES Update: f**k Sony Ericsson.
Jolo.

Jolo_ said:
I just tired on fighting with this piece of crap.
In fact, I just surrender and just leave all the Windows Mobile 6.5 platform behind.
The X2 is a marvell Hardware device, but it's Software support it's a shame. I even think that SE Android support will be the same: low quality updates, no information.
I swear i'll never buy or it recommend a Sony Ericsson product again.
On the other hand, the Windows Mobile platform is really outdated and unsupported. Low quality apps, even for Twitter and Facebook (Twikini is the best out there and really is a shame compared to the iPhone or BlackBerry), no more Skype. Do I really need to tell you the Internet browser experience? Windows Mobile has NO future at all.
When the iPhone appeared in 2007, it was a shame operating system, we all agree. But, in 2010, iOS 4 is from another planet. There's no more excuses. Everyone should see it.
I'm affraid that Windows Phone 7 will take a couple years just to catch the progress on the Apple iOS. It doesn't have Copy/Paste, no multitasking, so...
I'm selling this piece of crap X2 that never got to work at a basic quality level, I'm jumping for good of the Windows Mobile world and I'm buying an iPhone 4 in the coming days. No need to find stupid arguments in defense of WM, a piece of crap operating system in our days (2010, not 2000 or 2002).
Cheers and sorry for my english (of course! an Spanish X2 user that never got his desired MR2 GENERIC_ES Update: f**k Sony Ericsson.
Jolo.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Holy ****!
If you are on MR1 the experience is miserable indeed!
And WM 6.5.2 was bad.....
Pity because MR2 and WM 6.5.3 is a heaven tu use.
Much better interface in every area, modern and smooth.
X2 itself on MR2 is smooth too including great screen sensitivity.
There are issues of course but I would not like to have any other OS...
iPhone 4 may be great but it's limitations are too much for me. And it's boring.....
As for Windows future I think you may be wrong.
WP7 looks really promising.
Good luck anyway!!!!

doministry said:
Holy ****!
If you are on MR1 the experience is miserable indeed!
And WM 6.5.2 was bad.....
Pity because MR2 and WM 6.5.3 is a heaven tu use.
Much better interface in every area, modern and smooth.
X2 itself on MR2 is smooth too including great screen sensitivity.
There are issues of course but I would not like to have any other OS...
iPhone 4 may be great but it's limitations are too much for me. And it's boring.....
As for Windows future I think you may be wrong.
WP7 looks really promising.
Good luck anyway!!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm sorry, but I already using MR2 Spanish Vodafone, without personalization.
I just reset the phone at the end of the calibration screen, and I've installed all cabs from US MR2 ROM manually. The ROM is faster, ok, but stability problems remains.
And also, MR2 not resolve the primary problem with Windows Mobile: stupid old, pointless and bad mobile operating system. That's why I'm switching. I could buy an HD2 or other WinMo Device, but why?
There are issues of course but I would not like to have any other OS...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's the point. At this moment, iOS 4 DOESN'T HAVE problems. That's the very big difference.
Cheers.

Jolo_ said:
I just tired on fighting with this piece of crap.
In fact, I just surrender and just leave all the Windows Mobile 6.5 platform behind.
The X2 is a marvell Hardware device, but it's Software support it's a shame. I even think that SE Android support will be the same: low quality updates, no information.
I swear i'll never buy or it recommend a Sony Ericsson product again.
On the other hand, the Windows Mobile platform is really outdated and unsupported. Low quality apps, even for Twitter and Facebook (Twikini is the best out there and really is a shame compared to the iPhone or BlackBerry), no more Skype. Do I really need to tell you the Internet browser experience? Windows Mobile has NO future at all.
When the iPhone appeared in 2007, it was a shame operating system, we all agree. But, in 2010, iOS 4 is from another planet. There's no more excuses. Everyone should see it.
I'm affraid that Windows Phone 7 will take a couple years just to catch the progress on the Apple iOS. It doesn't have Copy/Paste, no multitasking, so...
I'm selling this piece of crap X2 that never got to work at a basic quality level, I'm jumping for good of the Windows Mobile world and I'm buying an iPhone 4 in the coming days. No need to find stupid arguments in defense of WM, a piece of crap operating system in our days (2010, not 2000 or 2002).
Cheers and sorry for my english (of course! an Spanish X2 user that never got his desired MR2 GENERIC_ES Update: f**k Sony Ericsson.
Jolo.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Jolo_ said:
I'm sorry, but I already using MR2 Spanish Vodafone, without personalization.
I just reset the phone at the end of the calibration screen, and I've installed all cabs from US MR2 ROM manually. The ROM is faster, ok, but stability problems remains.
And also, MR2 not resolve the primary problem with Windows Mobile: stupid old, pointless and bad mobile operating system. That's why I'm switching. I could buy an HD2 or other WinMo Device, but why?
That's the point. At this moment, iOS 4 DOESN'T HAVE problems. That's the very big difference.
Cheers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry but I don't get "stupid, old, pointless OS".
For me WM is the most sensible OS.
Maybe you just don't like it? There's nothing like what you described in WM 6.5.3.
Besides some small issues with stability.
As for iOS 4 - you must be kidding.....

doministry said:
Sorry but I don't get "stupid, old, pointless OS".
For me WM is the most sensible OS.
Maybe you just don't like it? There's nothing like what you described in WM 6.5.3.
Besides some small issues with stability.
As for iOS 4 - you must be kidding.....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why I'm kidding?
Well, this is just a debate, don't worry. I appreciate your help.

IMHO wm is the best os for mobile devices, it is flexible and it has sofisticate software. You have to approach like a computer, a PC, where hardware is different from software. Apple makes hw and sw, Blackberry makes hw and sw. Sonyericsson makes hw (the project?) and Microsoft makes the os. When Htc made HD2 (capacitive) or Diamond2 (resistive) or others, it used wm and made great devices. If x2 doesn't work the cause is se. I had a lot of wm devices but only x2 is such a disaster. I only hope for a good chef

Jolo_ said:
Why I'm kidding?
Well, this is just a debate, don't worry. I appreciate your help.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well I just don't believe in OS without trouble.
Personally iOS has things I just don't like at all
and it also has many kinds of issues, you can be sure of that.
But I basically wish you luck!

vitc said:
IMHO wm is the best os for mobile devices, it is flexible and it has sofisticate software. You have to approach like a computer, a PC, where hardware is different from software. Apple makes hw and sw, Blackberry makes hw and sw. Sonyericsson makes hw (the project?) and Microsoft makes the os. When Htc made HD2 (capacitive) or Diamond2 (resistive) or others, it used wm and made great devices. If x2 doesn't work the cause is se. I had a lot of wm devices but only x2 is such a disaster. I only hope for a good chef
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A phone is not a PC. You control a phone with your fingers and with your hands, and maybe with a small keyboard. But, pointers, stylus and other devices are outdated. The capacitive display are an very high innovation, and it will be present on every mobile device on the market.
That's why Windows Mobile fails, and that's why is discontinued and Windows Phone 7 was created. A 'front skin' update (like WM 6.5.3) isn't just good enough.
On other hand, WM6.5 could be a good operating system, but... there's no apps. All developers had go to other platforms. WM has no future.
You can see Skype dropping all support for WM. The only 'decent' app for Twitter, Twikini, had no see Updates since December... That's 7 months ago! The Facebook app has also outdated.
The only developer that has some interest on WM is the own Microsoft, updating Office Mobile to... a 'new' version that trully doesn't contain any new features. Even, the Windows Live suite for mobile is really outdated and always worked really bad. Instead, MS prefer to develop a new Windows Live official suite for the iPhone.
Windows Mobile has no future. It's the true, and all we must accept it. No more devices will appear with this OS. And now, we doesn't have a good number of applications. It's time to go.
Cheers.

Just thought I would drop by and say hello
Since my move to the X10, I am very happy indeed
They achieved root this week and this is going to open up a world of goodies
As far as IOS 4 is concerned, LOL! Don't be fooled by the Apple advertising campaign. Just google "iPhone security issues" and you will see what I mean. Besides, they just added features that should have been there in the first place! Nothing new, but they sure make the world think "Oh gosh! look at this shiny new phone! It's got all these cool new features!"
What a freaking joke!

mtechfan said:
Besides, they just added features that should have been there in the first place!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But they have done it, finally. So, what are the complaints now?
A really honest question: What feature is missing on the iOS now that we REALLY use day by day?
You can say:
- There's no 3G Videocall... I don't have ANY contacts with a video phone, and even, the first ones sure will be iPhone 4 owners. And, by the time that videocall be a REALLY standard, it will be the APPLE Standard.
- There's no Bluetooth Send and Receive files... Why? We have Internet, Mail, and the last time that I sent a file via BT was 2 or 3 years ago. BT transfer is unreliable, slow and unnecessary.
- SD Card, why? There are a 16GB and a 32GB version iPhone 4. Probably it will be even a 64GB version on the future.
- Removable battery, why?
And that's it.
Really... There's no more excuses. A year or two ago it really was. But not today.
Even, Windows Phone 7 will appear with a lot of cons: No Copy/Paste, No multitasking... I insist: it will take a couple of years to catch iOS and even Android. And, of course, there's an App Market that it will no show really interest: Skype dropped support, Mozilla too.
And even, the most important and the most relative thing to this thread: Apple really CARES about the Software support on these products. Users of 2008 iPhone 3G can Upgrade to iOS4, a two years ago phone.
What happened to the Xperia X1?
What is happening to us? We can even use officialy the accelerometer on our phones.
Some we're complaining about even cannot upgrade to MR2 by a clean language-localized version.
Do you think that the iPhone cannot notify a received SMS? Please...
This war is over. There's a winner, iOS, and even contenders, but they're still fighting: Android, BlackBerry, even WP7 in the future.
Windows Mobile? nope. It's dead, really.
Cheers.

hahahaahhaha

Jolo_ said:
You can say:
- There's no 3G Videocall... I don't have ANY contacts with a video phone, and even, the first ones sure will be iPhone 4 owners. And, by the time that videocall be a REALLY standard, it will be the APPLE Standard.
- There's no Bluetooth Send and Receive files... Why? We have Internet, Mail, and the last time that I sent a file via BT was 2 or 3 years ago. BT transfer is unreliable, slow and unnecessary.
- SD Card, why? There are a 16GB and a 32GB version iPhone 4. Probably it will be even a 64GB version on the future.
- Removable battery, why?
Cheers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hahaha!
These are quite essential things on my device.
You say a bit of a bull**** here mate, sorry.
Bluetooth? It's marvellous. Instead of stupid sending email (?!)
or beeing forced to use iTunes I send files Phone -> PC or PC -> Phone. The best way.
Somebody is NEXT TO ME - so why the **** I should send EMAIL when
I can immediately send whatever by BT?! Funny...
SD card - well, first I can transfer content to any device without PC or whatever. I can also extract all the files from it even if my device is broken!!
And use the card for multiple devices, man that's easy to understand.
Removable battery?! ****. So when my iPhone battery is broken
I have to SEND my personal device to the company and WAIT? A joke?
Also when it freezes completely - no way to turn it off...
I can replace it with new...
Buy your iPhone, probably WM is just not for you.
WM is still superior to any iCrap anyway.

I suggest you another key to read: Microsoft has won the battle with Apple in computer war for a reason that isn't "oh great!" but... cheap. Apple has success with smartphones for a reason that isn't "oh cool!" but... marketing. Iphone (a good device anyway) has caught the market of cellphones users, not professional user who prefers to sync outlook or use a portable word processor.
Smartphones ARE computers, little computers, if you don't understant this one it's difficolt to explain the rest. Mouse and pens are everything but outdated, I makes graphical works and it would be difficult to use... fingers to work (...waiting for the Iphone with physical keys )
Anyway, it's important you have found a device suitable for your needs, the perfect one doesn't exists.
Bye
P.S.: Apple was not born with Iphone, it is as old as Microsoft and they are old partners so don't think Windows is dying...

I guess its all just based on preferences
because in my opinion iphones are ****. hardware is outdated, UI is ugly, and phone is virtually locked (memory, kill switch). yeah it may have a Capacitive screen which supports multi-touch, but why? multi-touch only forces you to hold the device with two hands (ex. pinch zoom hold phone in one had use other hand to pinch) which i i would just prefer a double tap, plus the Capacitive screen requires you to use the fat part of your greasy finger (yes my hands get sweaty) where the resistive touch screen allows you to use both the fat part of your finger, or you fingernail/stylus for more accuracy. as for web browsers, according to some test i just ran (which included 8 browsers, safari, IE, skyfire, fennec, android 2.2 browser, uZard web p, opera mini 5, and opera mobile 10) safari tested almost as badly as IE and fennec (opera and android 2.2 browsers performed the best) and once more iphone will NEVER support flash, and they act like HTML5 is the future and is all you really need, but hell i still play farmvill, bloons tower defense, and watch youtube videos with skyfire with practicly no lag. Oh and the lack of hardware buttons on these modern phones... why?
moving on to windows mobile 7, looks very promising. app integration is well planned, the hardware on these phones will blow aways iphones, the panoramic UI is just damn sexy. trust me it'll be great, from what i saw (youtube videos) it will be an iphone killer
and as for your accelerometer issues you may want to check out this forum http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=681982 if you keep your phone, it fixes some of the bugs sorry for typing so much i have a lot to say. when ever i have an issue with winmo i find a fix, if something is wrong with the iphone they are stuck with it until the next update.

It may be just me, but I absolutely don't get this thread. Jolo_, if you've decided that you want to switch your mobile OS, fine, but why do you have to bother writing anything in here? You think you'll enlighten us by your opinion? There are many different ones and what makes you think yours is the best? Suit yourself and let everyone else suit themselves. Also, stick to the people that share your opinion, who we're obviously not. I believe there was much more than enough pointless arguing all over the Internet, it's time to let it go. Yet again, it might be just me...

totally agreed. sony [email protected] is a crap. sigh...

See what you want to see.
If it's not dead yet, Windows Mobile life ends in a three or four months, when WP7 arrives.
Then, all our crappy WM phones will became useless, pointless (no new applications, no new developers). And gets worse: impossible to re-sell because NOBODY will want a Windows Mobile phone.
Think about it: we even haven't HardSPL for the X2 yet. And of course, this is never going to happen because the X2 is so locked that anyone isn't really working on it.
It's now or never: get rid of this crap or you'll stay the same and you'll lose money.
Cheers!
P.D.: Last post, sorry.

Jolo_ said:
See what you want to see.
If it's not dead yet, Windows Mobile life ends in a three or four months, when WP7 arrives.
Then, all our crappy WM phones will became useless, pointless (no new applications, no new developers). And gets worse: impossible to re-sell because NOBODY will want a Windows Mobile phone.
Think about it: we even haven't HardSPL for the X2 yet. And of course, this is never going to happen because the X2 is so locked that anyone isn't really working on it.
It's now or never: get rid of this crap or you'll stay the same and you'll lose money.
Cheers!
P.D.: Last post, sorry.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Silly.
So you really mean people use only devices purchased yesterday?
Nonsense.
So your beloved iPhone: people use the first gen one till today.
So what will happen to X2 when WP7 arrives?
My phone will explode? Disappear?
It will be working as it is now. There's plenty of apps to choose from anyway.
I don't install new thing every day..

Jolo_ said:
See what you want to see.
If it's not dead yet, Windows Mobile life ends in a three or four months, when WP7 arrives.
Then, all our crappy WM phones will became useless, pointless (no new applications, no new developers). And gets worse: impossible to re-sell because NOBODY will want a Windows Mobile phone.
Think about it: we even haven't HardSPL for the X2 yet. And of course, this is never going to happen because the X2 is so locked that anyone isn't really working on it.
It's now or never: get rid of this crap or you'll stay the same and you'll lose money.
Cheers!
P.D.: Last post, sorry.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
*shrug* I'll buy it for $100, if you think it's impossible to resell.

everybody who reads this needs to first watch this video http://www.break.com/index/iphone-4-vs-htc-evo.html trust me it will make you laugh i guarantee it! and will hopefully settle some differences

the last emperor? motorola ES400, the best wm6.5 device

purchased motorola es400. truly happy with this device, do think it's the greatest wm6 device with fantastic usability.
pros:
1. qwerty keyboard is easy to press, even better than any blackberry keyboard
2. 3.0 VGA tft screen: high brightness, clear display
3. perfect size to fit your hands, rugged phone, rubber frame give you best feeling
4. 1500mah standard battery + 3000 mah extended battery, a gigantic power house. so no worry about battery
cons:
1. wm6.5(hope it'd be a android one)
2. system needs to be more optimized, it took 5 to 6 seconds to shoot a picture after you press camara button!!

came more pictures.
1 more cons: 2.5mm headset jack

more pictures....................

Looks like that came from the Symbol line of devices. Lots of retailers use the MC-70 and related devices for inventory work and more. Very good devices for that type of work, but way to big and bulky for average use.
When Motorola bought out Symbol they started make a line that was more slim and trim in the hopes of getting executives/manager to adopt them. They'd not only be able to perform the inventory type jobs but also work as the default cellphone for the individual.
They are very rugged and well built devices. They can take a LOT of abuse and still function. If I recall the OS has also been "ruggedized." What I mean is that they sort of strip out some of the more advance, high end stuff that is more likely to cause incompatibility and/or crashes. I know this is true of some of Symbol's earlier devices. I don't know if it's true with the Motorola stuff... especially if they wanted execs to use these I doubt they would have done too much to 'em.
Great devices for Field Work, but I don't know they're usually not cutting edge tech or the most feature packed machines.

You've got Windows EH 6.5 on this right ? What build number do you see on it ? Just curious

Sorry but the best WM device is Leo
At least for me

orb3000 said:
Sorry but the best WM device is Leo
At least for me
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Add me to this. Leo is already Legendary.

Can anybody with this device upload dumped ROM?

Hello
i need a german Rom for this device!
Can anybody help

Hi,
Try following link, it should offer you a download link with when you provide your device's SN
http://support.symbol.com/support/s...eId=&dialogID=216462608&stateId=1 0 216464033

As mentioned above, these devices are really designed for data capture work in the business arena. Just the job, for barcode reading, warehouse pick list instructions, utility company meter reading, in the field survey response capture, customer order capture, etc. etc, but for personal phone use, it is a bit of a heavyweight.
Having said that, if you make a habit of dropping your phone down the WC, quite a common method of trashing it by all accounts, such a purchase could be a very good investment. It will survive that sort of thing time after time. You will have to give it some really serious abuse in order to break it.
This is where Microsoft is taking the CE/Mobile/Embedded platform.
Windows Phone 7 is now purely a consumer product.

..if it had DPAD and wm6.1...
sigh.
what's the cost of this, btw?
any kitchens available?

Regarding the cost, they're not cheap, but then again you get what you pay for.
Here in the UK they start at just over £400.

thank you buddy, nice work

mrteii, have you tried to shoot a photo at night using the flashlight? the light is distributed also into lens, making an ugly white arc at the bottom of the picture. anyway, the PenTile display is very nice. i'm currently using this device alongside with mc75a, which i like much more

On Sprint in the USA, the Touch Pro 2 is the best Windows Mobile device. I would get a Leo/HD2 if I was on T-Mobile.

Anyone one could get this ES400 rom ?

orb3000 said:
Sorry but the best WM device is Leo
At least for me
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Also think that! Proud leo owner here!

Ev0luti0n_ said:
Also think that! Proud leo owner here!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
go away..
sheesh.

I just received this device off ebay several days ago, brand new, unbranded and it came with the extended battery. I've added a PNY 32GB class 10 microsd card and activated it with an at&t gophone plan. I'm getting the H data symbol up top so it looks like I'm connecting at 3.5G speeds and so far so good! It's quite beastly in size but I love the display and the keyboard! I hope they release an updated model in Android/WP7 form, but I kinda like how it feels like a computer on a phone. It's my first WM phone, my previous phone was a Palm Pre.