Anyone know what this about?
http://www.engadgetmobile.com/2008/...-angry-mobile-owners-rush-castle-htc-with-bu/
link to the xda thread about it?
This is about a group of litigation-crazed people who want to file a class-action suit against a device manufacturer (HTC) because the manufacturer did not include a functionality that would be technologically possible to include in a device. Since class-action suits are overwhelmingly just scams where the lawyers literally make millions for a few hours work, and the companies sued get to give you a coupon for a future purchase thereby increasing the chance you will, in fact, make a future purchase from them, I make no prediction as to whether a suit will be filed or settled in the customary way. However, in a "real" law suit, there is no way the courts would require a company to include all technologically possible features in a product, regardless of how "easy" it might allegedly be to include them. Note that in this case, neither HTC nor the carriers (as far as I have heard) ever stated that this functionality was included in the device.
Yeah, I don't know where that is coming from... of all the issues with the phone.. video is the least. BT still sucks as well as the phone turning on and off at will. Not checking email when it is supposed to... etc etc.
yakky said:
Yeah, I don't know where that is coming from... of all the issues with the phone.. video is the least. BT still sucks as well as the phone turning on and off at will. Not checking email when it is supposed to... etc etc.
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Maybe you should file a class-action suit against the video driver class-action people for taking HTC's time and attention away from fixing real problems...
Actually the mogul does have video playback issues with constant stutering and pausing. From what I've heard from 6700 users video playback is much much smoother (the way it should be). I don't know if it calls for a law suit but hey at least they got htc's attention and now their releasing new drivers that will supposedly fix the video playback issues.
bakntyme said:
This is about a group of litigation-crazed people who want to file a class-action suit against a device manufacturer (HTC) because the manufacturer did not include a functionality that would be technologically possible to include in a device. Since class-action suits are overwhelmingly just scams where the lawyers literally make millions for a few hours work, and the companies sued get to give you a coupon for a future purchase thereby increasing the chance you will, in fact, make a future purchase from them, I make no prediction as to whether a suit will be filed or settled in the customary way. However, in a "real" law suit, there is no way the courts would require a company to include all technologically possible features in a product, regardless of how "easy" it might allegedly be to include them. Note that in this case, neither HTC nor the carriers (as far as I have heard) ever stated that this functionality was included in the device.
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Keep your feces to yourself. if you have nothing better to do but flame a valid issue on HTC phones then i suggest to go jump off a hill.
SINNN said:
Keep your feces to yourself. if you have nothing better to do but flame a valid issue on HTC phones then i suggest to go jump off a hill.
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Why are you afraid for someone to post a valid, opposing viewpoint to yours? Can you not accept that someone who disagrees with you may still have a valid point? My post was not flaming at all, your post however seems to utilize nothing but flame to express your thoughts. Now, please post again with a well-thought-out response to my points as opposed to a simple flame, as I am interested in an intelligent response and will read it with an open mind.
While you are at it, maybe you can explain why, if all that is needed is a simple driver and all graphics problems will be solved with no detrimental side-effects, no one here on xda-developers, where I truly believe there is at least as much talent as at HTC, has done the allegedly simple task of writing or finding that driver and distributing it.
bakntyme said:
Why are you afraid for someone to post a valid, opposing viewpoint to yours? Can you not accept that someone who disagrees with you may still have a valid point? My post was not flaming at all, your post however seems to utilize nothing but flame to express your thoughts. Now, please post again with a well-thought-out response to my points as opposed to a simple flame, as I am interested in an intelligent response and will read it with an open mind.
While you are at it, maybe you can explain why, if all that is needed is a simple driver and all graphics problems will be solved with no detrimental side-effects, no one here on xda-developers, where I truly believe there is at least as much talent as at HTC, has done the allegedly simple task of writing or finding that driver and distributing it.
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I feel the need to address this... despite not having been in the original exchange. I can accept that you have a differing viewpoint from us. I refuse to be called a "litigation-crazed" person. I also think you need to get your facts straight before you pass judgment.
The simple fact is - we want the functionality that our devices were advertised with. Many of us did our research and realized that the MSM7500 is a POWERFUL chip. The video acceleration is top-tier, and everything else seemed good too. Then HTC decided to not include a driver for video acceleration. Also, before someone mentions that HTC has claimed(but never in an official press release) that the MSM7500 might NOT include the video acceleration... When have you known a huge manufacturer(nVidia, AMD, Intel, ATi, Qualcomm, etc) to name two differing devices the same name? They don't. they generally qualify them(e.g. 8800 series nVidia cards can be 8800 GT, GTX, GTS, etc.) What HTC did is akin to Dell selling you an Inspiron notebook with an nVidia 8800GTS card inside, then telling you that they didn't include drivers. Oh, and don't forget that nVidia won't support the card, since it's up to the manufacturer(Dell) to supply the drivers. Microsoft won't do it since it's Dell's problem. Dell won't do it because it isn't cost effective. (Suspend the reality of the situation for the analogy, though, please) Now you're left with a $300 piece of video hardware that can't be used because nobody wanted to provide a driver. Go software acceleration! That's the issue we're having. The phones WERE advertised as having the MSM7500(or 7200) which according to everything I've seen both have video acceleration. HTC just dropped the ball.
Now, about us writing our own drivers... That would be difficult without getting a bunch of information from Microsoft, HTC and Qualcomm, which they won't release. If you don't know why, look up open source video drivers for Linux, and you'll understand the pain. It's not a baseless suit - however I don't think that class action is the way to go. I think we need to work WITH MS, HTC, and Qualcomm to come up with a driver. Period. Don't let up the pressure until we have that.
I am sorry, but when your advocacy group starts out with a name like "HTCClassAction", and names its website "htcclassaction.org", it shows itself as not interested in getting the claimed result, but instead, despite any protestations from the group, interested in filing a class-action lawsuit from the beginning. That is "litigation-crazed". Was "htcvideodrivers.org" not available? I am sure that, if you wanted to, given a few minutes you could come up with several non-litigation-oriented group and website names. If you were the product manager for the 6800 at HTC, and you heard of the issues raised by the group HTCClassAction, would you think, "Here is a group of users that wants to work with us to resolve what they see as a legitimate issue?"
Speaking of facts...have you actually seen an advertisement that stated that the devices came with this functionality, or did you just assume that because it was advertised as having this chipset, and the chipset has this capability, that the functionality would be included? I would bet that HTC never stated that the 6800 would include every feature technologically possible with the chipset. It has the capability of supporting an 8MP camera, but they didn't include that either. Another lawsuit? I am sure there are other things the chipset would be CAPABLE of that were not included. If you actually researched the chipset so thoroughly for this issue prior to purchasing the device, why did you not notice in the first 30 days that it was not included, and return the device?
Realize that modern class-action lawsuits are almost always settled for lots of money to the attorneys and a pittance to the class. Remember the Verizon Moto 710 Bluetooth class action? It was settled as usual...the attorneys got somewhere around $6 million; users got $25 if they wanted to keep the 710 and stay with Verizon, a waived ETF and a refund if they wanted to leave Verizon, and a credit toward another device if they wanted to stay with Verizon but not keep the 710. They did not get additional Bluetooth profiles. And if this goes to trial, the courts will never order a manufacturer to provide technology, and support for it, that the manufacturer does not want to provide. IF you could prove false advertising, and I do not think that you could, you might get a small refund or credit toward another phone. If that is what you want, just sell the device on an internet auction site and buy something else...you will probably get more that way.
sucks too that our phones dont even have the ati chip in them. my htc wizard (old school) had better video and gameplay
I don't play games much on my ppc so this problem hasn't affected me as much. However I did notice that PIE was sluggish and freaked when video playback sucked on WM and TCPMP. Most of that was avoided by using GDI on TCPMP.
The real issue here is why can't they add the driver? If it was a simple fix it probably wouldn't have been left out in the first place. Sounds to me like they ran into technical issues trying to make it work.
I just got the mogul last week. I have 30 days to evaluate it. Do you think that I should have gotten something else? I think that I've had at least 10 different Smartphones & PPC's in the past 5 or 6 years. They all have something I dislike about them. This one is the best one I've had yet, but would you recommend something else? THANKS
johnannie said:
I just got the mogul last week. I have 30 days to evaluate it. Do you think that I should have gotten something else? I think that I've had at least 10 different Smartphones & PPC's in the past 5 or 6 years. They all have something I dislike about them. This one is the best one I've had yet, but would you recommend something else? THANKS
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you hit the nail on the head. EVERY PPC is going to have SOMETHING you dont like about it.
with that said. it only matters what you think. dont go taking advice from a forum where 50 percent of its members cant even tie their shoes.
For the record, i agree with what the person said way up at the beginnning of the thread. "Why are you *****ing now when you had 30 days in which to evaluate and return it if you felt the need?!""
I would imagine the courts will say the same. everyone who thinks this is a legit complaint needs to get a hobby. you all had 30 days in which to make your decision, so DEAL with it.
sound like a buncha kids to me
I guess we should sue them for not having a 'tv out' jack on the mogul too, since thats also possible. and oh yeah, where's my 8 megapixel camera on the mogul?? it supports that as well.
ah screw it, im going to cry to mommy
watson540 said:
you hit the nail on the head. EVERY PPC is going to have SOMETHING you dont like about it.
with that said. it only matters what you think. dont go taking advice from a forum where 50 percent of its members cant even tie their shoes.
For the record, i agree with what the person said way up at the beginnning of the thread. "Why are you *****ing now when you had 30 days in which to evaluate and return it if you felt the need?!""
I would imagine the courts will say the same. everyone who thinks this is a legit complaint needs to get a hobby. you all had 30 days in which to make your decision, so DEAL with it.
sound like a buncha kids to me
I guess we should sue them for not having a 'tv out' jack on the mogul too, since thats also possible. and oh yeah, where's my 8 megapixel camera on the mogul?? it supports that as well.
ah screw it, im going to cry to mommy
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Hahahahaha. Yes, we're children. Little babies, the lot of us. Anyway......
No, we shouldn't sue them for not including a tv-out jack or an 8 megapixel camera. What we are trying to achieve is driver support FOR THE INCLUDED HARDWARE. This is what most people who argue against our position fail to realize. We aren't asking them to do something crazy, like give us a better camera or a tv-out jack, or even more memory. We're asking them to SUPPORT THE HARDWARE THEY SOLD US. Gasp.
Now... I'll use an analogy for those among us who are a bit retarded. If you were to buy a car that was advertised with a special computer chip in it that can control a supercharger, the electronic stability control system, up to 6 airbags, and the radio (all of which are included in your car, albeit only 4 airbags) - and it came with a 30-day money-back guarantee... and you drove it for 30 days and thought to yourself, "Wow, this is clearly better than last years' model" - would you return it? Probably not... That's what happened here.
We bought our phones, tried them and went, "Wow, they kicked the crap out of the <insert old PDA phone here>" and kept them. Now, back to our example. Now imagine you go to a car-meet-up with your new fancy car, and everyone there is talking about how <insert another fast car here> is wayyyy faster than their car, in the same conditions. You and the other owners do some research and find out that the car manufacturer didn't include software to make your supercharger work. It's just inert, sitting there looking pretty. Wouldn't you be pretty pissed that the chip in your car wasn't actually using the supercharger? Wouldn't you expect that if it was advertised as having this chip and a supercharger, that the supercharger would actually work?
Anyway - that's where I'm coming from at least - I don't presume to speak for anyone else though. I will say this though, watson540, you need to calm down. You're running around these forums beating on people's opinions and posts. Frankly, yours aren't much more productive. At least try to post something relevant or meaningful... or at the very least something other than "you moron, rtft" or "you moron, stop crying".
it's not really a bug its more
like a pc with the generic vga driver installed
even if the pc have a geforce
problems is that one cant get hold of the
spc driver to replace the generic
ponicg said:
We bought our phones, tried them and went, "Wow, they kicked the crap out of the <insert old PDA phone here>" and kept them.
...
Wouldn't you expect that if it was advertised as having this chip and a supercharger, that the supercharger would actually work?
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OK, so you admit that you were very satisfied with the performance until someone said "Hey, I think they OWE US something MORE than what we got, let's SUE THEM for it?" If the device met your needs when you tested it, then you have no complaint. If it did not, you should have returned it in the 30 day return period.
As I asked you way back in this thread, but you have not yet addressed, (nor any of the other points in my previous post), "have you actually seen an advertisement that stated that the devices came with this functionality, or did you just assume that because it was advertised as having this chipset, and the chipset has this capability, that the functionality would be included?...If you actually researched the chipset so thoroughly for this issue prior to purchasing the device, why did you not notice in the first 30 days that it was not included, and return the device?"
None of these analogies is perfect...one big flaw in yours is that you hypothesized "If you were to buy a car that was advertised with a special computer chip in it that can control a supercharger," then switched to the car actually having a supercharger advertised: "Wouldn't you expect that if it was advertised as having this chip and a supercharger". Another is that the supercharger's existence is open and apparent to someone who looks under the hood, without requiring any research or disassembly of the vehicle. Another is that in chip manufacturing, it is usually more efficient to produce a batch of chips with all the capabilities, then use the ones you want in each device, as opposed to redesigning the chip package and retooling the production run for each combination of features desired in each application. No one could reasonably say that it was more efficient to produce a factory run of cars with all possible mechanical features (such as the supercharger in your example) included, and then only connect and use the ones desired for that model. However, auto manufacturers also sometimes utilize parts and sub-assemblies in a particular model without enabling or utilizing all of that component's capabilities, when doing so is more efficient.
Since you like automotive analogies, I will use one without resorting to calling anyone "a bit retarded": suppose that Ford announced that all 2010 Mustangs would use the new computer chip from Super Tuner Corporation, "because of its wonderful and powerful new capabilities," with no details as to what particular features would be made available. Your research into the chip on Super Tuner's website revealed that it supported superchargers, turbochargers, four-wheel drive, four-wheel steering, and nitrous fuel systems. You went in to a Ford dealer and test-drove the top-of-the-line 2010 Mustang, were impressed by its performance, and bought it. Six months later, someone pointed out that you had received none of those performance items listed above. You did not know why, but it was because Ford had internally determined pre-production that the suspension and frame would not be sufficient to provide those performance items in any model Mustang, and they did not want to re-engineer the support structure. They made no announcement about these features not being available, as they had never made any announcement about including those features. Would you join the MustangClassAction.org group? Now suppose that you had done no research prior to the purchase, and six months later discovered the information on Super Tuner's website after someone pointed out the lack to you...even less valid a complaint then, isn't it?
And further suppose that at the same time, someone else says, "I took the interior of my Mustang apart, and it has mounts for 8 speakers, and they only provided it with 4 speakers. Ford has to install 4 more speakers in every Mustang, because it has the capability of holding them!"
And another owner pulls out his factory radio, notices the output jack on the back for a subwoofer..."Where is my subwoofer? It obviously was supposed to come with my car, or they would not have included a radio that could support one and put a jack on the back of the radio to plug one in!!"
Meanwhile, another owner says "I was testing the electronic trip computer included in my Mustang, the same one included in all 2010 Mustangs, and it has the ability to calculate and display up to 55 MPG, but my Mustang only gets 23 MPG. Obviously, Ford was advertising a Mustang that would get 55 MPG and must give us that!"
Enough analogies? Would you get angrier, and call Ford arrogant, when they say, "Thank you for your business, customers, but we never said the Mustang had those capabilities, and we have no intention of retrofitting them, but we will take your opinions into account in designing our next vehicle?"
Analogies by their nature will never replicate the Titan/Mogul/6800 situation. However, we can discuss the 6800 situation itself, and I am waiting for your answer about the HTC advertisement and your not discovering the lack in the first 30 days of your device ownership.
its just bull**** when the the video playback on the 6700 is alot better than the titan. makes no sense at all and yes i feel ripped off.
im no expert..but from over here it looks like bakntyme just put all of you crybabies in your place
very well said bakntyme. perfect.
p.s. yeah im an asshole. but this asshole can read and troubleshoot and operate electronics all by my big self.
read these forums enough and you will start to think everyone in the world collectively never got out of elementary school
apologies where they are due. but some people are incredible helpless (this last comment has nothing to do with this thread im responding to the guy above who "called me out" for being an (admitted) asshole)
unless you guys can come up with some previous claim by HTC that the mogul was supposed to support this specific capability of the chip, i dont see how you guys can try to force anything out of them. I'm with bakntyme on this one.
Sure its pretty crappy that they put the hardware in there and didnt support it, and im no lawyer, but it doesnt seem like they would be under any legal obligation to support the video drivers.
watson540 said:
im no expert..but from over here it looks like bakntyme just put all of you crybabies in your place
very well said bakntyme. perfect.
p.s. yeah im an asshole. but this asshole can read and troubleshoot and operate electronics all by my big self.
read these forums enough and you will start to think everyone in the world collectively never got out of elementary school
apologies where they are due. but some people are incredible helpless (this last comment has nothing to do with this thread im responding to the guy above who "called me out" for being an (admitted) asshole)
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Although I appreciate the support, a more professional wording of it might help to keep from increasing the level of emotions and inflammation on this issue.
Related
Ok gentleman. The guy that made the post about the dual OS iPh**e is not lying! I own a Computer Prog. Company in Kingsport TN that doe sub contract work for Sony Inc. The guys actually called and told my assistant to give me a message about it but I blew it off. They came to my office four times and I finally met with them. This things real. Three of my techs here checked it out and its no joke. Everything the kid said holds up. Weve had it three days now and still dont know alot. Not used to PPC's. We specialize in programming for Sony products, Laptops, Playstation etc. The kid told me about this sight and said some gelp may be available. Heres what weve got so far. On startup it brings up a dual bootloader screen. The htc versions is running amazing. Its running overclocked at 623mhz while the radio still runs at normal rate. This is strange because there is no type of over clocking software anywhere on the device. Also accelerometer is inactive on htc rom. Screen/light sensors work on both. iPhone side. Safari is somehow flash and java enabled. itunes is not here anymore. Its actually registered thru apple for warranty which im sure is void. works on gsm network as well as cdma like it says. now internal time. remember my techs are not ppc specialists. It appears ro have two processors tied into each other. one is original one appears to be custom. also there is some extra wiring tied into the screen running off an unknown circuit board which was def placed there aftermarket style. Also the everything seems to be somehow tied into this circuit board & and the board is a phenomenal custom job. Like I said, we do hot specialize in programming for ppc. I am willing and have rights to send this to an experienced and I mean GENIUS, programmer to work with this. Only condition is you must reside in the US OR CANADA, and you must sign a predrawn contract which you may print off, sign, and scan and email or fax back. It just says you will send it back, working or not. By the way, I contacted the creator of this & the reason it wasnt online or advertised is due to apples long arm. If there pulling hair over icons then theyd draw blood for this. Which brings me to this. NO PICS WILL BE PUBLICLY POSTED. I will email detailed video to any senior member only who honestly believes they can help make this widely available and rip off App** short leash. Im sorry to any non senior member but i dont wana email a video to an apple attorney. So post your thoughts but only serious requests for Photos.
can u email them to me
is it me? or does this person write awfully similar to the other person who started this whole wm6 iphone stuff
Email?
Yes. PM your email add to me & Ill do by Monday, possibly tonight. One of my techs is working on a few extremely detailed vids of External & Internal , pics are to easy to fake & I want no misconceptions about how phenomenal this thing is. I also do not want it released to anyone after I send it to you. So please dont redistribute the vids.
Small Minds or Jealousy
WOW man. I think your right! The T's in both posts are identical! Are you just jealous or to small minded to think someones smart enough to do this? Just because your not talented enough to conceive this idea, doesn't mean it's not possible. Email me the videos ASAP and we'll take a look at it over here at TechRev. Try to get it done by tomorrow please.
If this works. I will get my iphone this week!
THis is a hoax. Don't buy it.
TechRev_Admin86 said:
WOW man. I think your right! The T's in both posts are identical! Are you just jealous or to small minded to think someones smart enough to do this? Just because your not talented enough to conceive this idea, doesn't mean it's not possible. Email me the videos ASAP and we'll take a look at it over here at TechRev. Try to get it done by tomorrow please.
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take a look at the posts by "technology" in the smartphone threads somewhere. Seems to be the same spammer.
And do you think your 2 posts are what he was looking for in a "senior member"?
Why should it not be posible with dual boot. Apple did it with their computers and said it could not run Windows then someone figgured out how to and they released theire version. now the iphone maybe can do the same. Apple are prob just waiting for someone to do it for them before releasing their own version. Why they wait... well they might not wan't to be the once making it work as it might seam like an attack on MS. And by doing these dual boot they get costumers that are using MS products to swap to Apple because they can us the MS on Apple iPhone or computers. this way Apple gets a part of a market they would not gotten with only their OS running.
but yes I'd like to see some real prof of it working before I will be convinced... but it's possible that it's true. Because Jobs wants a bigger marked
I just find it strange that the videos aren't open not even on a private server and streamed to others...and the posts seem spammish I will point out some inaccuracies in grammar and spelling
Ok gentleman. The guy that made the post about the dual OS iPh**e is not lying! I own a Computer Prog. Company in Kingsport TN that doe sub contract work for Sony Inc. The guys actually called and told my assistant to give me a message about it but I blew it off. They came to my office four times and I finally met with them. This things real. Three of my techs here checked it out and its no joke. Everything the kid said holds up. Weve had it three days now and still dont know alot. Not used to PPC's. We specialize in programming for Sony products, Laptops, Playstation etc. The kid told me about this sight and said some gelp may be available. Heres what weve got so far. On startup it brings up a dual bootloader screen. The htc versions is running amazing. Its running overclocked at 623mhz while the radio still runs at normal rate. This is strange because there is no type of over clocking software anywhere on the device. Also accelerometer is inactive on htc rom. Screen/light sensors work on both. iPhone side. Safari is somehow flash and java enabled. itunes is not here anymore. Its actually registered thru apple for warranty which im sure is void. works on gsm network as well as cdma like it says. now internal time. remember my techs are not ppc specialists. It appears ro have two processors tied into each other. one is original one appears to be custom. also there is some extra wiring tied into the screen running off an unknown circuit board which was def placed there aftermarket style. Also the everything seems to be somehow tied into this circuit board & and the board is a phenomenal custom job. Like I said, we do hot specialize in programming for ppc. I am willing and have rights to send this to an experienced and I mean GENIUS, programmer to work with this. Only condition is you must reside in the US OR CANADA, and you must sign a predrawn contract which you may print off, sign, and scan and email or fax back. It just says you will send it back, working or not. By the way, I contacted the creator of this & the reason it wasnt online or advertised is due to apples long arm. If there pulling hair over icons then theyd draw blood for this. Which brings me to this. NO PICS WILL BE PUBLICLY POSTED. I will email detailed video to any senior member only who honestly believes they can help make this widely available and rip off App** short leash. Im sorry to any non senior member but i dont wana email a video to an apple attorney. So post your thoughts but only serious requests for Photos.
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on first glance its almost like the post was written from an iPhone or a touch screen winmo device. That said, the likelihood that it is a possible theme customization for the iphone is pretty high and not a modded htc device. Most developers, even the ones that develop themes for iphones, also display their pictures and such. So um...
This is highly suspicious if it is legit, prove it.
Not used to PPC's ????
Well I need some gelp to understand all this....
How could this be possible? He'd need to have the sources for WM6 to port it to the iPhones Samsung processor which is ARM11 unlike the present gen WM6 based Samsung processors which are ARM9. This seriously sounds like its a scam.
Also, why would an apple product NOT have iTunes which is one of the biggest selling points of the iPhone?
I'd be interested to see some pictures including a view of how thick it is, and how large the screen is/how much of the front of the device the screen takes up...
Make No Mistake
Phillips_technology said:
Ok gentleman. The guy that made the post about the dual OS iPh**e is not lying! I own a Computer Prog. Company in Kingsport TN that doe sub contract work for Sony Inc. The guys actually called and told my assistant to give me a message about it but I blew it off. They came to my office four times and I finally met with them. This things real. Three of my techs here checked it out and its no joke. Everything the kid said holds up. Weve had it three days now and still dont know alot. Not used to PPC's. We specialize in programming for Sony products, Laptops, Playstation etc. The kid told me about this sight and said some gelp may be available. Heres what weve got so far. On startup it brings up a dual bootloader screen. The htc versions is running amazing. Its running overclocked at 623mhz while the radio still runs at normal rate. This is strange because there is no type of over clocking software anywhere on the device. Also accelerometer is inactive on htc rom. Screen/light sensors work on both. iPhone side. Safari is somehow flash and java enabled. itunes is not here anymore. Its actually registered thru apple for warranty which im sure is void. works on gsm network as well as cdma like it says. now internal time. remember my techs are not ppc specialists. It appears ro have two processors tied into each other. one is original one appears to be custom. also there is some extra wiring tied into the screen running off an unknown circuit board which was def placed there aftermarket style. Also the everything seems to be somehow tied into this circuit board & and the board is a phenomenal custom job. Like I said, we do hot specialize in programming for ppc. I am willing and have rights to send this to an experienced and I mean GENIUS, programmer to work with this. Only condition is you must reside in the US OR CANADA, and you must sign a predrawn contract which you may print off, sign, and scan and email or fax back. It just says you will send it back, working or not. By the way, I contacted the creator of this & the reason it wasnt online or advertised is due to apples long arm. If there pulling hair over icons then theyd draw blood for this. Which brings me to this. NO PICS WILL BE PUBLICLY POSTED. I will email detailed video to any senior member only who honestly believes they can help make this widely available and rip off App** short leash. Im sorry to any non senior member but i dont wana email a video to an apple attorney. So post your thoughts but only serious requests for Photos.
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i do not know nor have i ever met this poster, and if he thinks my idea is plausible then i thanks him. now on to other matters; as for the guy who spoke of porting the WM6 ARM9 processor to the iphones ARM11 there has never been a time when a OS complained of having too much resources as i dont think that would be a problem. if you search the threads and read my original post you would see that i threw out a hypothetical and asked if it was possible and then asked if (and gave praises to the intelligence) anyone could do it. then i spoke of dual booting the iphone and provided links where the iphone has been partitioned, jailbreaked and running 2firmware, heck i even threw in a firmware builder link so if anyone just wanted to modify a iphone firmware to be WM6 then they could do that; again all i see you doing is swapping the system files, Mac HD for windows folder etc.
REMEMBER IT WAS A HYPOTHETICAL
Make No Mistake
Phillips_technology said:
Ok gentleman. The guy that made the post about the dual OS iPh**e is not lying! I own a Computer Prog. Company in Kingsport TN that doe sub contract work for Sony Inc. The guys actually called and told my assistant to give me a message about it but I blew it off. They came to my office four times and I finally met with them. This things real. Three of my techs here checked it out and its no joke. Everything the kid said holds up. Weve had it three days now and still dont know alot. Not used to PPC's. We specialize in programming for Sony products, Laptops, Playstation etc. The kid told me about this sight and said some gelp may be available. Heres what weve got so far. On startup it brings up a dual bootloader screen. The htc versions is running amazing. Its running overclocked at 623mhz while the radio still runs at normal rate. This is strange because there is no type of over clocking software anywhere on the device. Also accelerometer is inactive on htc rom. Screen/light sensors work on both. iPhone side. Safari is somehow flash and java enabled. itunes is not here anymore. Its actually registered thru apple for warranty which im sure is void. works on gsm network as well as cdma like it says. now internal time. remember my techs are not ppc specialists. It appears ro have two processors tied into each other. one is original one appears to be custom. also there is some extra wiring tied into the screen running off an unknown circuit board which was def placed there aftermarket style. Also the everything seems to be somehow tied into this circuit board & and the board is a phenomenal custom job. Like I said, we do hot specialize in programming for ppc. I am willing and have rights to send this to an experienced and I mean GENIUS, programmer to work with this. Only condition is you must reside in the US OR CANADA, and you must sign a predrawn contract which you may print off, sign, and scan and email or fax back. It just says you will send it back, working or not. By the way, I contacted the creator of this & the reason it wasnt online or advertised is due to apples long arm. If there pulling hair over icons then theyd draw blood for this. Which brings me to this. NO PICS WILL BE PUBLICLY POSTED. I will email detailed video to any senior member only who honestly believes they can help make this widely available and rip off App** short leash. Im sorry to any non senior member but i dont wana email a video to an apple attorney. So post your thoughts but only serious requests for Photos.
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i do not know nor have i ever met this poster, and if he thinks my idea is plausible then i thank him. now on to other matters; as for the guy who spoke of porting the WM6 ARM9 processor to the iphones ARM11 there has never been a time when a OS complained of having too much resources as i dont think that would be a problem. if you search the threads and read my original post you would see that i threw out a hypothetical and asked if it was possible and then asked if (and gave praises to the intelligence) anyone could do it. then i spoke of dual booting the iphone and provided links where the iphone has been partitioned, jailbreaked and running 2firmware, heck i even threw in a firmware builder link so if anyone just wanted to modify a iphone firmware to be WM6 then they could do that; again all i see you doing is swapping the system files, Mac HD for windows folder etc.
REMEMBER IT WAS A HYPOTHETICAL
i have to join the BS camp. the least this guy could do would be to put a vid on a private tracker then link to it via tinyurl or something like that. and we could pm him for the torrent info
frasbyte said:
as for the guy who spoke of porting the WM6 ARM9 processor to the iphones ARM11 there has never been a time when a OS complained of having too much resources as i dont think that would be a problem.
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I'm not going to comment either way on the plausibility of the topic of this thread, but I would like to point out that I can think of several legacy MS OS's that would not run on newer hardware without a patch or just would not run right at all.
i posted this a few days ago...
y'all just bastardizing my idea...
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=2149033
Read The Original
HostileJava said:
I'm not going to comment either way on the plausibility of the topic of this thread, but I would like to point out that I can think of several legacy MS OS's that would not run on newer hardware without a patch or just would not run right at all.
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as i said i was taking a shot in the dark when i proposed the idea, but i did provide research and said nothing of the validity of the subject in question
Cynical
Perhaps I am just getting old and cynical, but in my experience most individuals who have risen to any kind of high office or have been successful in business to the degree that our friend suggests have actually mastered the basics of spelling and punctuation.
I have to remind my 11 year old son to remember paragraphs, capital letters and apostrophes - I would expect better from the owner of a 'Computer Prog. Company in Kingsport TN that doe sub contract work for Sony Inc.'
Someone else mentioned this earlier, but I hadn't seen it until just now. EDIT: the original poster: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=9374284&postcount=23
Well, a note to TnT management, if you happen to read this. I didn't click "Agree", so phooey on you.
Btw, it's things like this which made me decide to never accept donations. Once I start doing that, I'm crossing over somewhere that I really don't want to go - TnT / Viewsonic, please keep that in mind.
EDIT: To Viewsonic CS -- I had two devices (one was going to be a gift to a relative, and I was going to leave TnT on it). I now have one device, and the main reason is because of that insane EULA. Specifically, section 4.1 and, to a lesser extent, 4.2. You should have a chat with that company and have them explain what the heck they were thinking.
If a larger tablet company like Archos did this, Engadget and other tech sites would roast them alive.
roebeet said:
Someone else mentioned this earlier, but I hadn't seen it until just now.
Well, a note to TnT management, if you happen to read this. I didn't click "Agree", so phooey on you.
Btw, it's things like this which made me decide to never accept donations. Once I start doing that, I'm crossing over somewhere that I really don't want to go - TnT / Viewsonic, please keep that in mind.
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One reason I bought the sears warrenty for 60 bucks. So I am not to worried if Viewsonic is going to honor their warrenty
Doesn't look that strange for a commercial products EULA. Frankly I think we all have violated EULA many times on many devices/software. I do agree that accepting donations does create a different situation, but I don't think anyone should be scared off by it. Just read a Windows EULA, or the FBI warning on a DVD, or listen to the NBA rights (or lack thereof) before any game.
They make it excessively broad so that if they elect to they can crack down on any modders (if it cuts into their bottom line) by issuing cease and desist orders. Since TapUI is still making money by including it (even if we don't use it) and we aren't modifying so much as removing it I think there is very minimal chance of legal difficulty.
Then again, stranger things have happened.
Whoever (Ok, mgmt Roebeet) decided to include TnT was either a relative, or a used car salesman. If anyone had actually used the device instead of just listening to someone talk it up in a meeting I can't see it ever being released.
And I mean no disrespect to used car salesman by comparing them to whoever sold VS on TnT.
akodoreign said:
One reason I bought the sears warrenty for 60 bucks. So I am not to worried if Viewsonic is going to honor their warrenty
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Yeah. I bought the extended warranty from Staples.
Closing - keeping for informational purposes only.
I just happened to read an article over at pocket now:
http://pocketnow.com/windows-phone/microsoft-on-hacked-windows-phone-7-and-live-services
titled: Microsoft On Hacked Windows Phone 7 And Live Services
in their vain search for headline news it seems pocketnow made it a part of their duty to have Microsoft look into us getting Live ID keys for our HD2s running Windows Phone 7. Now Microsoft is saying their going to take a hard look into this pratice. who knows what is going to happen if Microsoft is going to ban the issued keys
by the amount of mad faces you can tell i'm pissed.
wether Microsoft new about what was going on or not, pocketnow just amplified the issue.
It was strange that Pocketnow chose to push Microsoft on the issue. Microsoft seemed to be (deliberately?) ignoring the HD2-WP7 key issue. Pocketnow is just forcing them to take a position - which helps noone (except Pocketnow).
I imagine that Microsoft wont be too active in pursuing our phones. They will probably just put in place a policy to restrict new keys.
Perhaps everyone is just jealous of us & our HD2....
coolfire said:
Perhaps everyone is just jealous of us & our HD2....
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Sounds like thats the case.
link is dead anyways >.<
Ive been following pocketnow.com for years, very disappointed in them for forcing this and publishing this article.
F*CK you Anton D Nagy!!!!!
jcsy said:
link is dead anyways >.<
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http://pocketnow.com/windows-phone/microsoft-on-hacked-windows-phone-7-and-live-services
Everybody should leave a comment on the article to show how let down you feel with them/author.
TheATHEiST said:
Ive been following pocketnow.com for years, very disappointed in them for forcing this and publishing this article.
F*CK you Anton D Nagy!!!!!
http://pocketnow.com/windows-phone/microsoft-on-hacked-windows-phone-7-and-live-services
Everybody should leave a comment on the article to show how let down you feel with them/author.
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I'm with you on this one.
As long as everyone is buying from the marketplace and not bloomin well ripping apps and side loading them, Microsoft will be happy, but alas with all things people feel the need to steal from others, Android is rife with piracy...
So I would imagine Microsoft would be very pleased with HD running WP7 and activating the Live services as they can get more revenue from the marketplace without having to support our devices in anyway.
JUST BUY SOME APPS people and we will be OK.
People always seems to immediately think just because you have cracked or hacked a device it means you are a pirate, this is not true
Tards at pocketnow grrr haters! Thats what they are!
Hmm they always been apple fanboyz, but this is it!
A little sidenote, if microsoft locks us out, I'll never ever buy a phone from them again. Customers will drop like flies, let's sit this one out.
One of the only results of the article is that more people will know about being able to flash the WP7 ROM on their HD2s. Microsoft was of course aware of the ROM and why the number of people asking for keys for WP7s increased. Microsoft surely had formulated their responses and policies on the situation long before pocketnow.com contacted them.
The only other result is more people can see what kind of outfit that site is.
Most likely this will have little effect on using the ROM or obtaining keys.
Yeah, I saw that article earlier. Was surprised they would press the issue, but you know journalists, they generally have no conscience, all they want is a story. Won't be supporting or recommending pocketnow from now on.
Think as a Microfoft guy. Some retards come and ask you if you are OK that your services are being hacked. Of course you will not say that you are OK with this. It's a completely different question if you will do something about it.
Although the term "hacking" is completely wrong here. We all have legitimate WP7 keys issued by MS. He have hacked NOTHING to get Live access. Some ppl even said honestly they have a HD2. The MS representative that gave me the key never asked me about my device btw.
Just see the matter from MS point of view: YOu have 10 000 or so Windows Mobile customers that have found a way to flash WP7 to their devices. Unfortunately for you these folks can also flash Android to their devices. What would you do? Shut them down and send them to Google?
rlydiard said:
One of the only results of the article is that more people will know about being able to flash the WP7 ROM on their HD2s. Microsoft was of course aware of the ROM and why the number of people asking for keys for WP7s increased. Microsoft surely had formulated their responses and policies on the situation long before pocketnow.com contacted them.
The only other result is more people can see what kind of outfit that site is.
Most likely this will have little effect on using the ROM or obtaining keys.
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Pocketnow already has tons of articles telling people that HD2 has got WP7 now.
What they did by this article was just to get Microsoft to look into a matter which they were most likely deliberately ignoring!
Am totally disappointed by Pocketnow!
Tanmay® said:
Pocketnow already has tons of articles telling people that HD2 has got WP7 now.
What they did by this article was just to get Microsoft to look into a matter which they were most likely deliberately ignoring!
Am totally disappointed by Pocketnow!
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Yes, I am quite aware of the articles that pocketnow.com has put online about HD2s running WP7. Partly because of those articles, and because Microsoft does indeed monitor XDA-Developer posts, they were indeed aware of the port since the beginning, and they certainly were aware of why so many people have been trying to obtain keys.
I doubt that Microsoft was deliberately ignoring the situation, but had already formulated their policies. And, as another poster pointed out, how do you expect Microsoft to respond when asked by a publication about the situation?
Microsoft could have come out with a much tougher statement, but they did not, so I still maintain that the situation for those who use WP7 ROMS on the HD2s will not drastically change, and that Microsoft will not make a sudden change of course here.
MS were already looking into this. You don't get to be the biggest software company by not knowing what is going on with your business.
Everyone should just relax. I've had a few friends who have told MS that they are running WP7 on HD2 and they need an activation code. MS gave them one, no questions asked.
If MS wanted to stop us using WP7 then they would have blocked ALL services by now. The HD2 is such a small share of their market, do you think they care? Not really. More exposure for them and their OS.
Personally, I don't really care either way. It would cost MS a few bucks to actively exclude certain phones. It isn't worth their time or effort. WP7 is a new OS. Why would they want to limit exposure?
Pocketnow are in it for the money. Any news is GOOD news.....
For all the people saying that they are disappointed by PN.COM,
Here is the response from the writer:
Anton D. Nagy said:
"@Adam Bentley, @luke Flex
Thanks for the kind words!
I get it you're neither a developer with software in the Marketplace nor songwriter/artist/or part of a band with its Music up on Zune. I understand you're not even part of an OEM or carrier that builds or sells smartphones or communication services and I think you’re not part of the team that made Windows Phone 7 possible. Simply put, I don't think you're someone who earns anything from the activities above. Should I wish you that your work, whatever it is that you do, would end up hacked/plagiarized the same way someday? No, I will not!
If you think that Anton, or even pocketnow.com for that matter, can do anything to influence a company like Microsoft, you're a fool! If you think that Anton, or even pocketnow.com for that matter, brought Microsoft the terrible news that its platform and services got hacked, you're a fool again!
What I'm saying here -- and this will be in no way considered pocketnow.com’s position -- is that I don't really care about the opinions of readers like you! Not because of the "screw you" part because we're professionals, but because the words that express your inappropriate thoughts, because of the mentality. You think you deserve to have something just because it simply can be achieved or because you own an HTC HD2? You disrespect the thousands who’ve worked hard for software that runs on hardware designed and manufactured by other thousands. You disrespect your fellow community members who have legitimately bought Windows Phone 7 software running on Windows Phone 7 hardware. Last but not least, you disrespect other pocketnow.com readers that might agree with the things I said above."
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To my mind, this answer is just a kind of hypocrisy, bc I don't think Microsoft would be angry if some thousands of users would buy applications from the market, or even if some HD2 users would develop some apps (Microsoft claims that developers are needed and welcome).
In addition, remember that a lot of us (and me in particular) have bought HD2 only because it was the first phone that would have an update to WP7...
To my mind, it's just fair for us to have a port, even hacked, to WP7 !
kawazaki said:
For all the people saying that they are disappointed by PN.COM,
Here is the response from the writer:
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The tool obviously doesn't realise the 'hack' does not allow carte blanch access to any Marketplace software, but only to free apps.
Poor journalism. But I'm sure Anton/PN is going to get a few extra hits out of this.
the only ones who will benefit from it are pocketnow.com, obviously.
I suggest we don't give them the attention they so loudely cry for, because they will bring XDA down. They disrespect developers, not vice versa.
Whatever goes on, I don´t care at all.
Yes, I indeed was hoping that WP7 would be ported for our HD2. Unfortunately, MS and HTC both missed the chance to offer this upgrade officially. Just try to imagine if they would have done this: There is a big chance that some longtime WinMo users would move over to the new platform - just thanks to a trial possibility.
The thing is: I think 80% of all HD2 owners don´t flash their devices. Imagine the possible boost for WP7 if all those were offered to upgrade officially. Great customer satisfaction generates positive mouth-to-mouth advertising.
If they start to fight the "hack", I believe the opposite will happen: More former "core" WinMo "power users" than before will move on to Android and iOS, the first is more "open" and the second is nicely jailbroken, both offering a massive number of apps. The result for MS is not only negative mouth-to-mouth advertising (the worst scenario a company can suffer), but also loss of ROI since less potential users buy stuff from marketplace, less potential users decide to use paid "Live" services (such as XBox Gold membership, let alone maybe even new potential buyers of that gaming platform), etc.
MS could simply decide to stop giving codes for "unsupported" hardware. Then again, HD2 is so close to HD7 that they might consider this device as "compatible". If they are even more clever, they could offer a trial, just as many app providers do in the marketplace. I would actually be willing to pay a couple of bucks if I would decide to keep WP7 - which is not the fact as of today, mainly because the OS isn´t ready yet imho.
http://www.xda-developers.com/android/motorola-announces-modular-smartphone-project-ara/
[Holy ****] Motorola Announces Project Ara, An Open, Modular Smartphone Hardware Platform
http://www.androidpolice.com/2013/1...an-open-modular-smartphone-hardware-platform/
Motorola is inviting people across the globe to become Ara Scouts. Over the next 6 - 12 months, we'll be doing research to shape the direction of Project Ara. You can help by collaborating with us on special missions.
http://www.dscout.com/ara
After the trip, we asked ourselves, how do we bring the benefits of an open hardware ecosystem to 6 billion people? Meet Ara. - See more at:
http://motorola-blog.blogspot.ca/2013/10/goodbye-sticky-hello-ara.html
My post at http://www.androidpolice.com/2013/1...ip-and-offers-another-glimpse-of-project-ara/
I'm excited too, though still cautious/skeptical.
I'm sure MANY people have thought about such a concept Lego-type phone/everything device over the decades. My first serious but skeptical thoughts were in 2001, noting that it seemed wasteful to buy a digital video/still camera (at 2001 prices) over and over again for many different devices. But 12 years have made me even more skeptical about the practical realities.
This holds promise, but without specific guarantees; I look forward to seeing what happens.
Many/most engineers started with Lego or Mechano (my fave) when young and want to see similar in the real, practical world.
Linux is the Lego of Operating Systems.
Android AOSP is the Lego of Mobile Operating Systems.
Google, then MIT App Inventor is at least one of the Lego's of Android app development.
Arduino shields and similar are Lego for micro-controller hardware.
I look forward to Lego like pieces for phones, tablets, "laptops" and other devices.
I guess I'll sign up for the special missions of an "Ara Scout" and hope to not be disappointed: http://www.dscout.com/ara#
EDIT: Uh, oh, looks like DScout is some weird 3rd party thing that makes this all look like a lame-ish marketing ploy at this time...
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Yeah, I'm a little disappointed that the DScout is a third-party app, but at the same time, I think it is a neat idea. More importantly, this is something I want them to market to me. I don't mind providing companies with personal information or feedback about my tastes if I get what I want in return. It's when they take it without asking that bugs me. Especially when they don't seem to actually do anything in response. At the end of the day, I think it's a good thing if they're making products I want to buy and generally conducting their business in the way I want them to conduct it. If anything, I think the more glaring problem right now is companies NOT listening to people and instead adopting that stupid Apple notion that "people don't know what they want; we have to tell them what they want." If only google actually were listening in on us--then they'd at least know how strongly opposed we are to carriers locking down devices.
I'm hoping it really happens. And if it is true that Moto has been working on this for a year already then I think its at least somewhat encouraging.
My OP was moved here from the Hardware Hacking forum.
This new section is named "MDK Hacking".
MDK = Module Developer's Kit which will allow 3rd party module development. It's supposed to be released sometime "this winter".
I'm personally interested in getting an FM receiver, AND transmitter module created. While were at it, maybe w/ a chip for HD/Dab+/DMB radio. Might as well keep wishing and go for digital broadcast TV and effectively anything with a Software Defined Radio, LOL.
As for Project Ara in general, a few days of sober second thought, and the reading and thought processing of the several hundred posts I read, have put me more back in the skeptical range.
But I'd be happy even if this went no further than a reasonably successful hobbyist oriented eco-system, like Arduino.
Jane and Joe average "6 pack" could not care less how their phone or tablet were built. But the people who run custom ROMs, and they number in the many millions now, may find this compelling.
I'm imaging a robot, with an Android tablet as a head (with face(s) LOL.) Hooked to the head/brain are redundant communications paths to the rest of the body. The rest of the body may have their own small USB flash drive or less sized Android devices for specialty tasks.
Heck, with the right parts, the robot could disassemble and re-assemble itself, as needed. We've seen Futurama's Bender do so many times, ROFL.
And there are thousands of other cool and interesting non-robot uses for all this stuff. Someday soon, if not already, a sizable percentage of science fair projects will contain a connected Android device.
There may even be many useful business use cases, to add to all the fun stuff.
I could definitely see it happening, mainly because I think the project is keeping its aspirations in check. From what I've heard, at least, Ara is not looking to take the idea quite as far as Phonebloks was suggesting. I think that, rather than a Lego phone--where you can make anything you want--they are looking to bring phone hardware more inline with the hardware on computers (excluding those made by Apple, of course). You can already customize pretty much every aspect of your average PC. And the parts are more or less universally compatible: you can put basically any brand of hard drive in basically any computer. But even though it's not quite a Lego-phone, it would still be pretty amazing. Even if the only thing they did was allow you to choose what kind of camera you want on your phone, that would still be a significant improvement over the way things are now. Right now, you can sort of pick the color on some phones. and even that you can only do once, at the time of purchase. (I guess you also get the choice of buying a phone with more storage, but that's only because those phones don't come with external SD card slots. I refuse to count that as an example of customizability.)
Yeah.
PhoneBloks so far is 2 guys "on a mission", not too unlike a 2 guy FSF. The first part of that mission includes gathering enough money for a discussion forum and even that is not complete yet.
Project Ara seems like a "skunkworks" project of a large company doing some research ideas.
Google has a history of starting unusual projects. Most of them are eventually defunded and canned.
But that's OK IMO. Google seems to me to be run by very smart people focused on making money, in the long term. Part of that is "crazy" projects that mostly eventually disappear and sometimes turn into something great.
hai vl con bo
sharknado said:
Yeah, I'm a little disappointed that the DScout is a third-party app, but at the same time, I think it is a neat idea. More importantly, this is something I want them to market to me. I don't mind providing companies with personal information or feedback about my tastes if I get what I want in return. It's when they take it without asking that bugs me. Especially when they don't seem to actually do anything in response. At the end of the day, I think it's a good thing if they're making products I want to buy and generally conducting their business in the way I want them to conduct it. If anything, I think the more glaring problem right now is companies NOT listening to people and instead adopting that stupid Apple notion that "people don't know what they want; we have to tell them what they want." If only google actually were listening in on us--then they'd at least know how strongly opposed we are to carriers locking down devices.
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trthrujy ghikvb dfhg
---------- Post added at 11:20 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:16 AM ----------
mikereidis said:
Yeah.
PhoneBloks so far is 2 guys "on a mission", not too unlike a 2 guy FSF. The first part of that mission includes gathering enough money for a discussion forum and even that is not complete yet.
Project Ara seems like a "skunkworks" project of a large company doing some research ideas.
Google has a history of starting unusual projects. Most of them are eventually defunded and canned.
But that's OK IMO. Google seems to me to be run by very smart people focused on making money, in the long term. Part of that is "crazy" projects that mostly eventually disappear and sometimes turn into something great.
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navg fghj fduyhjm
---------- Post added at 11:25 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:20 AM ----------
sharknado said:
I could definitely see it happening, mainly because I think the project is keeping its aspirations in check. From what I've heard, at least, Ara is not looking to take the idea quite as far as Phonebloks was suggesting. I think that, rather than a Lego phone--where you can make anything you want--they are looking to bring phone hardware more inline with the hardware on computers (excluding those made by Apple, of course). You can already customize pretty much every aspect of your average PC. And the parts are more or less universally compatible: you can put basically any brand of hard drive in basically any computer. But even though it's not quite a Lego-phone, it would still be pretty amazing. Even if the only thing they did was allow you to choose what kind of camera you want on your phone, that would still be a significant improvement over the way things are now. Right now, you can sort of pick the color on some phones. and even that you can only do once, at the time of purchase. (I guess you also get the choice of buying a phone with more storage, but that's only because those phones don't come with external SD card slots. I refuse to count that as an example of customizability.)
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con bo
I was pretty hyped every since this device got announced. Saving up my money and arranging for shipping beforehand so I could snatch it ASAP but actually no, I won't be getting this device at all.
I'll tell you the experience I went through when I tried asking their support if they'll release 16gb version of the device so I don't end up regretting jumping the gun on the 12gb one.
Whole experience was dodgy af from support not being able to speaking proper English at all to constantly being asked for personal data that I'd later realise wasn't being user to better answer my questions at all.
For example I asked if there's a trade in program and they reply asking what device I'm using. I take that as OK there is but maybe not every device is elegible so I reply with my current device only to be then told that there's no program at all??? ( Why did they ask what device I'm using then idk and they haven't bothered answering when I questioned them... )
I was also asked where I currently live when I asked if there's a 16gb version on the way and what it would cost. That was before I asked for trade in program, so I thought they might be asking in order to tell me the price for my region but no. Once again, they have no idea if 16gb version is in production and they just inquired for my info again for no reason.
Mind you, the English is completely broken and the reply turnaround is few days to a week per response at best, so I really didn't feel like dragging the conversation around asking why they want to know all of that beforehand.
After all of that I don't feel like I can trust a company like this not to be looking into my personal data during my use of the device. Paying 700$ or maybe upwards of 800$ if 16gb version ever gets released is way too much for not having an ease of mind of what might be going on in the background.
I understand that their reasoning for where I live might be justified but never in the conversation did they inform me ahead of time on what the purpose is for all the data collection is. They haven't answered why they want to know what device I'm using if there's no program in the first place so I'll assume that previous reasoning was also an excuse thought up to justify their inquiry.
I'm pretty bummed to see that as a company they haven't changed much from their early days. They might have improved the OS, introduced better hardware and all but the core of the company is still both shady af and completely non organised.
This all plays a major factor in why I won't be getting this device, just thought I'd let others know too if they are thinking of going for it.
Picture is below, you will have to read from the bottom to the top to follow the conversation.
I don't want to nit pick. you are right in some points. but I'd like to point out a few things.
you're giving them questions in English, which they need to translate then organize into a response then re translate it back for you to understand.
They are based in Hong Kong, So I would assume the number of local English speaking people a small sub section of an already crippled tech giant (due to US sanctions of ZTE) have the space to employ customer service agents in English. when their main market is China.
They tell you to look at the site for information on the sale of the devices in question.
After your question of If a device with 16gb of ram would be available. if the site says no, there is no plan.
so you had your answer to your original Question. they asked what region so they could confirm what devices where available to you. because some parts of the world cannot receive their devices.
your question on the 12gb to 16gb upgrade must have been a mis-understanding.
you can read that in their response. they said there would be no way to upgrade a 12gb to 16gb. to them thats a technical impossibility.
they didn't understand that you meant trade back your 12gb RM5S for a 16GB version.
they though that you were asking if you could upgrade the hardware of your 12gb model.
at least thats how I understood their answer of your question.
they may have asked you what device you where using because they honestly though you were contacting support for a Nubia device. when you said you had a different phone altogether, they were trying to tell you that they did not support your device. as in Nubia don't do customer support for Huawei.
after that you blew up at them for general question to find out what market you were in to see if you would be able to even buy any model.
you took that way out of bounds dude. they are still trying to do their best. with awful translation programs.
your questions were understandable to an English person but you got to understand WHO you're chatting with. and how they will see and understand your messages.
even putting some some of your messages into google translate. going to Chinese simplified then translating it back to English what do you get? because that's only half of about what they will understand from your questions.
I think they did a professional job of explaining to you that you needed to look at the information on the market site of your location. and that they couldn't give you support with your Huawei because its not a supported model of their Nubia support team.
Also you should Hide your personal Email address when posting things online.
Patrick Morgan said:
I don't want to nit pick. you are right in some points. but I'd like to point out a few things.
you're giving them questions in English, which they need to translate then organize into a response then re translate it back for you to understand.
They are based in Hong Kong, So I would assume the number of local English speaking people a small sub section of an already crippled tech giant (due to US sanctions of ZTE) have the space to employ customer service agents in English. when their main market is China.
They tell you to look at the site for information on the sale of the devices in question.
After your question of If a device with 16gb of ram would be available. if the site says no, there is no plan.
so you had your answer to your original Question. they asked what region so they could confirm what devices where available to you. because some parts of the world cannot receive their devices.
your question on the 12gb to 16gb upgrade must have been a mis-understanding.
you can read that in their response. they said there would be no way to upgrade a 12gb to 16gb. to them thats a technical impossibility.
they didn't understand that you meant trade back your 12gb RM5S for a 16GB version.
they though that you were asking if you could upgrade the hardware of your 12gb model.
at least thats how I understood their answer of your question.
they may have asked you what device you where using because they honestly though you were contacting support for a Nubia device. when you said you had a different phone altogether, they were trying to tell you that they did not support your device. as in Nubia don't do customer support for Huawei.
after that you blew up at them for general question to find out what market you were in to see if you would be able to even buy any model.
you took that way out of bounds dude. they are still trying to do their best. with awful translation programs.
your questions were understandable to an English person but you got to understand WHO you're chatting with. and how they will see and understand your messages.
even putting some some of your messages into google translate. going to Chinese simplified then translating it back to English what do you get? because that's only half of about what they will understand from your questions.
I think they did a professional job of explaining to you that you needed to look at the information on the market site of your location. and that they couldn't give you support with your Huawei because its not a supported model of their Nubia support team.
Also you should Hide your personal Email address when posting things online.
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I wish I could give you a hundred likes for this.
As a matter of fact, I was equally thinking along the same lines as your response when I was reading his post.
To OP: I think it's time for you to do a little research on your own first rather than immediately looking for ways to point a finger.
Just my 2 cents
I gotta agree with Patrick, but at the same time I got hosed by Nubia with my RM5G and had a completely different yet still terrible experience. My phone arrived uncalibrated, I talked with Nubia Admin's and they agreed my phone was not calibrated correctly because the camera will switch from 16mp to 64mp, but the image quality is exactly the same, so the camera app is showing it's 64mp, but it can't produce it because it was never calibrated before it left the factory. Which means there's a whole batch of RM5G's out there that don't actually take 64mp photo's. I contacted Nubia countless times, they only actually responded twice, the first time they were really nice, apologized for the phone not working and gladly offered to take it back for an exchange. and after giving them all of my info, just like stated above where they're data hungry. They ghosted me. I tried again about a month later because the finger print sensor also stopped working and again, same process, ,they were nice, offered to take it back and exchange for a new unit, gave them all of my info again for the return label, and just like clock work, ghosted me.. fast forward 8 MONTHS LATER, I got an email (this was only a few weeks ago now) where they actually followed up asking if I still needed a return request for my phone. I said yes, they then asked for all of my info.. again.. even though it was literally in the previous email they responded to.. but sure, play by their game, gave it all again.. and ghosted.. it's been a few weeks now, probably going on about a month actually and I still haven't heard back from them lol.
To put it simply, they do not care about customers, Nubia is about making money, they just want their product in your hand, once it is, peace, later, seeya, goodbye.
So I gave up on them. I have all of it documented, made a few youtube videos, people hated me for bad mouthing Nubia but in all reality they're a terrible company. The RM5G is actually a deadly phone now that everything is fixed, but you gotta remember this is a phone that on launch showed up to my door unable to make a phone call because the software was so broken the microphone would turn off if you made a call, it only worked on speaker phone lol. It couldn't send MMS messages, and mine specifically doesn't even have a calibrated 64mp camera. It's complete junk. It looks cool, ,the idea is there, the platform is there, the software is trash, and the company should probably be stripped of rights to sell uncompleted products.
It was as later confirmed that the launch software was Beta because they didn't have it done for their launch day, so like I said earlier, clearly shows that rather than delaying launch to fix bugs, they cared more about getting their phones in our hands rather than actually having a good product.
I mean, it's great now, basically everything is fixed but the soiled taste in my mouth from this company makes this phone look good on my desk, I don't daily it, and if anyone asks about it I tell them it was almost cool but the company ruined it and I don't recommend people buy them because of Nubia's practices.
Kinda like what they did here with the 5S lol, lets just change the logo on the glass.. add a little piece of metal to the centre.. .boom, new phone, new software that actually works.. no we won't fix the 5G yet.. we'll make a new phone for $10 more instead of fixing the actually identical phone already in the wild that's riddled with issues.
Nubia cares more about making money, than they do making a good product. It's been working for them this long, why would they change? Sure it's shady but it's business, it sucks but that's the world we live in, if we don't like it, then we just won't buy their products again. I'm one of those. I still play with the 5G from time to time but I wouldn't daily this thing if my life depended on it.. Which not as life threatening as suggested, but I soft bricked my S20 ultra while playing around with One UI 3.0 flashes, and instead of putting my SIM into the RM5G, I just decided it was better to go without a phone for 3 days until I fixed my S20 Ultra than it was to deal with the bugs and headaches that follow with the RM5G.
Which is why I'm back, 8.11 came out and it's suppose to be good so I'm giving it another shot, maybe I could use it as an Android game console to toss in my bag or something if it's stable enough.
Anyway, kind of went off on a rant there. Nubia is trash, the phones are cool, but if you buy one, just pretend you're buying something without warranty, no customer support, and you're entirely on your own once you get it. You buy these phones AS-IS because Nubia doesn't give an F about you after the sale is completed lol
bencozzy said:
This is the redmagic 5s forum I think you posted on the wrong place.
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It's still the same phone, they both even officially use the same firmware now. 5G and 5S are the same phone, they just have a different piece of glass on the back.
However, I was just responding in coordinate to the OP having a bad experience with the company Nubia, as I also had a bad experience with the company, it's still relevant as the device doesn't matter when we're addressing the customer support we received.
Guys I need some help. If I am posting in the wrong place I apologize and please redirect me. My less than a month old 5S pulse (Christmas present we got both his and hers) literally just died while I was scrolling through my WeChat! I really loved the phone though up to that point. No the phone was not abused....I baby it! It had more than 90% charge at the time, was not running any apps so no stress, laying on the table beside me so not in my pocket or being charged. Literally just watching a photo on the screen and it suddenly dimmed black and died. No sign, no drama. Power button and volume buttons dont do anything....any ideas as to what to do are welcome :-(
I don't see a support thread for 5S here ...only 5G hence my above post
Phew thank God I saw this thread. Was really interested in the redmagic 6 pro, at £600 but stories like these freak me right out, I guess I'll be staying away.
Patrick Morgan said:
I don't want to nit pick. you are right in some points. but I'd like to point out a few things.
you're giving them questions in English, which they need to translate then organize into a response then re translate it back for you to understand.
They are based in Hong Kong, So I would assume the number of local English speaking people a small sub section of an already crippled tech giant (due to US sanctions of ZTE) have the space to employ customer service agents in English. when their main market is China.
you took that way out of bounds dude. they are still trying to do their best. with awful translation programs.
your questions were understandable to an English person but you got to understand WHO you're chatting with. and how they will see and understand your messages.
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Hi, I'll jump into the conversation as it's similarly relevant to my case.
I agree with the rest of your arguments, but including the part where you, yourself mentioned possible nitpicking & in a limited context, will side with the OP.
I have a feeling you try to see the best in people & also in this case, focus on the "human being".
That's noble of you, but let's keep in mind that at the end of a day, we're (as client) making a financial transaction & expecting/owed reliable support. It's not the client's worry how the supplier (in this case, Nubia) sorts out his support structures, but the supplier, needs to manage client expectations & deliver a service of relevant quality.
1: I'd agree with the OP, that Nubia has terrible support.
- being fully aware that they are providing a global service (assuming OP reached out via the global or EU portal), should provide adequate support - meaning service desk agents or support staff with adequate command of the English language.
- responsiveness - my particular case has echoed OP's experience - terrible response times. To the extent of "some benefit", they did follow up on some questions with a week's/week & a half, delay.
- knowledge & eagerness to provide client satisfaction - they will never tell you that they don't know something but will consult internally & come back to the client with a satisfactory response (I was asking about the reason behind the differences in power adapters in the different regions - global/china).
- misc - not following their legal obligations & releasing adequate GPL code within required timelines (example: kernel).
- the device is crippled on unlocking the bootloader (fingerprint scanner stops working). Understandably, any activity AFTER unlocking a bootloader (example: messing with system files) is not RedMagic's worry, but the sole fact of just unlocking the bootloader should not cripple functionality. Relevant behaviour in other OEMs (Sony Xperia - the camera stopped working after unlocking the BL, but they fixed their approach in time).
2: they will not take ownership for blunders & do their best endeavours to make it up to the client.
Case: I ordered my phone on the 10th of April, it was stuck in processing for 2 weeks (their shipment policy mentions a maximum of 4 days for processing). It's still not here (major city in the EU). Even in the most pessimistic variant, the device should have been at my doorstep, yesterday at the latest & I'm looking at a delivery near the end of the week.
They cancelled the first FedEx shipment, were not forthcoming/(fully) transparent regarding the cause.
Mistakes happen, but if I were a supplier who's keen on building brand loyalty & focused on the quality of my service, I'd go miles to try to make it up to the client - in this case, I would have at least expected the fastest shipping & maybe a gesture of reparation (some accessories, or at the very least discounts for purchases in the future).
The only thing which kept me from going for the Black Shark 4 Pro was the absence of an under-display fingerprint scanner. I admit that RedMagic seems to be the current leader of the gaming phone niche, but other OEMs have caught onto this segment & in a year or two, should RM keep their current approach/practices, will start losing relevancy, as at the end of the day, client satisfaction is all that matters & this should be the foremost priority of any business owner.
adwinp said:
Hi, I'll jump into the conversation as it's similarly relevant to my case.
I agree with the rest of your arguments, but including the part where you, yourself mentioned possible nitpicking & in a limited context, will side with the OP.
I have a feeling you try to see the best in people & also in this case, focus on the "human being".
That's noble of you, but let's keep in mind that at the end of a day, we're (as client) making a financial transaction & expecting/owed reliable support. It's not the client's worry how the supplier (in this case, Nubia) sorts out his support structures, but the supplier, needs to manage client expectations & deliver a service of relevant quality.
1: I'd agree with the OP, that Nubia has terrible support.
- being fully aware that they are providing a global service (assuming OP reached out via the global or EU portal), should provide adequate support - meaning service desk agents or support staff with adequate command of the English language.
- responsiveness - my particular case has echoed OP's experience - terrible response times. To the extent of "some benefit", they did follow up on some questions with a week's/week & a half, delay.
- knowledge & eagerness to provide client satisfaction - they will never tell you that they don't know something but will consult internally & come back to the client with a satisfactory response (I was asking about the reason behind the differences in power adapters in the different regions - global/china).
- misc - not following their legal obligations & releasing adequate GPL code within required timelines (example: kernel).
- the device is crippled on unlocking the bootloader (fingerprint scanner stops working). Understandably, any activity AFTER unlocking a bootloader (example: messing with system files) is not RedMagic's worry, but the sole fact of just unlocking the bootloader should not cripple functionality. Relevant behaviour in other OEMs (Sony Xperia - the camera stopped working after unlocking the BL, but they fixed their approach in time).
2: they will not take ownership for blunders & do their best endeavours to make it up to the client.
Case: I ordered my phone on the 10th of April, it was stuck in processing for 2 weeks (their shipment policy mentions a maximum of 4 days for processing). It's still not here (major city in the EU). Even in the most pessimistic variant, the device should have been at my doorstep, yesterday at the latest & I'm looking at a delivery near the end of the week.
They cancelled the first FedEx shipment, were not forthcoming/(fully) transparent regarding the cause.
Mistakes happen, but if I were a supplier who's keen on building brand loyalty & focused on the quality of my service, I'd go miles to try to make it up to the client - in this case, I would have at least expected the fastest shipping & maybe a gesture of reparation (some accessories, or at the very least discounts for purchases in the future).
The only thing which kept me from going for the Black Shark 4 Pro was the absence of an under-display fingerprint scanner. I admit that RedMagic seems to be the current leader of the gaming phone niche, but other OEMs have caught onto this segment & in a year or two, should RM keep their current approach/practices, will start losing relevancy, as at the end of the day, client satisfaction is all that matters & this should be the foremost priority of any business owner.
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- Nit picking, in terms of what device to buy, its a personal call. if you prefer to side with another that is totally OK and is not my problem.
- For seeing the best in people, you've not read my posts on Nubia support and their lack of actual support I've written a few times here on XDA.
in a basic manner, if the phone turns on, and the basic features advertised and (mentioned in the small print) is working as described, all other features and options are of a personal preference.
Features like - what do you mean I can't enable and disable the fan from the dropdown notification menu? or why is NFC not a togglable tile in the drop down menu either? ( both options have been added by custom app developer on our Telegram group) but Nubia have stated it was not intended and wont be added. (but they added those options in the 6 series devices {oh did they now?}) - strange how those that have already paid them money have been left behind on features that would be very easy to add) ( the code is freely available on github)
- Global service to sell devices. support its a toss up based on warranty ownership. (its why they only support devices that are bought directly from them) all stock is shipped from Hong Kong. its a Chinese business selling stuff from china. they use a translation app / program to communicate with most customers. there is a few people like Jerry here, that have decent enough command of the english language, but still fails to understand some things. their staff are all ... ALL Chinese. English is not the only Language in the world so they have to adapt to all other languages too. (redmagic Phones are actually sold more in the Indian / Arab regions of the world outside of the Asian / Chinese markets. so English customer services is actually a few steps below any kind of priority before their other more paying customer regions. which covers their response time. I usually get a 3-5 day time line. (maybe I'm more polite about my messages to redmagic.gg ?? ) maybeI dont know.
- My last message to them was about the current bug-list for the 8.59/7.60 roms all I got was. thanks we will forward to the department responsible. .. some 5 or so weeks ago. Go team red for that awesomely fast R&D department - Not.
- GPL source codes. ? what GPL source? were does it say they need to provide adequate sources? does this mean Nubia as well as almost every other OEM have broken the law?? OMgosh we need to bring all the peoples to court.
almost all OEM release old broken non up to date sources. even Nubia, Sony, Samsung, Xiaomi, IQOO, POCO phone, Mediatek, Qualcomm, Etc you will always find a few devcies that quite literally have no source at all published anywhere, and then you'll find sources that are so broken, with base drivers and other stuff that even making hardly boots on the required hardware. needin additional work to get booting, then bug fixed to get stable. nothing like the stock kernels that the oems release with up to date roms. for Nubia for example - the current A11 kernel they released is a almost direct copy of the base Android 11 kernel. just without some needed things to actually compile and boot. (even the triggers) you gotta make those yourself. - kernel source is provided as required by law. take Nubia to court if you need any more sources I'm sure google will help with that eventually in about 40 years.
fingerprint sensor being corrupted when unlocking bootloader is not a bug. Its actually a feature added to the device by Qualcomm. According to Jerry it was done on purpose and is not a bug.
Shipping and processing, sometimes can literally be out of their hands. with covid now some companies are required by law to close for 2 weeks. at their own loss, instead of advertising that their shipping processing center was closed or limited, its possible it was on hold for 2 weeks due to something they couldn't deal with.
but as customer processes like these are common, writing to them to find out what's going on with a 3 days delay before writing once again with the order number and a request for a refund usually gets them to contact you pretty fast.
client satisfaction at point of sale is all that matters. once they have your money, you don't get it back.
to be honest though. Jerry has, every time I've put someone in his direction for a genuine warranty service he has been on point and helped everyone he could. his estimates are rubbish though and he should stop telling people update will be out on X day because it nearly never true and never his fault (his fault he got the date wrong, but not his fault its delayed)
he's not in charge of software development but he can give suggestions and push requests that are demanded ALOT.
So if 3 people (in my current experience here on XDA and the some 700+ people on the telegram group) there is 3 people I have personally seen report the hz refresh rate issue on youtube and instagram and other common apps like this on the new Android 11. so unless there is a big. like a few thousand people getting in Nubia's faces about this on their twitter, facebook, and other social media sites and talking about the lack of support for updates etc like myself and few other members did back in January this year to get Android 11 for the global customers Nubia will sweep most of these things under the rug until its a big pile of crap they need to clean by dealing with it.
thats the only option for companies that don't respond or help. hurt their marketing image and they'll jump to help you.
privately request, or even publicly post here on XDA where most Chinese people wouldn't even know what this site is at a first glance and you're not getting the message to the right people.
contact support. when that does not work, go social and go big. its the only way to get the message through.