Database Users

Windows Phone 7 with full "multitouch" on our HD2´s

Hey xda´s!
Today I´m getting my own HD2 from england and I can´t wait to hold it in my hands
But I have some questions about the phone.
The first one is...Will the HD2 be upgradeable to Wiindows Phone 7 or if it will not be official upgradeable will the xda´s can do it? I know its early to ask about WM7 because there are not really many specs out about it yet but I would like to know what you think about that
And my second question is...Will the HD2 with it´s capacitive screen have full "multitouch" aahh sorry "pinch to zoom" support on WM7?
...or will the xda´s enable more multitouch gestures in the next weeks or months?

There have been tons of queries about this subject, please use the search before posting. It's probably safe to say that HTC won't be giving us WinMo7 the official way, but I'm sure the XDA community will find a way getting it to our beloved HD2 "the other way"

it will be possible congrats for ur new mob you'll love it

Yep! Thats right! If not Officially, you can bet that Win Mo 7 will be made available on the HD2 by the talented devs here. And not just that, we might even get Android to run on it!
Congrats on your purchase!

Tanmay® said:
..., we might even get Android to run on it!
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Thats a point i never got...
Why do people want to port Android on Wimo Phones? I you like Andorid, why don't you directly buy an Android phone which was designed for the operating system. I guess thats better than having a bad ported version running on a phone desigend for windows mobile.

actually this subject is non sense.

LordK said:
Thats a point i never got...
Why do people want to port Android on Wimo Phones? I you like Andorid, why don't you directly buy an Android phone which was designed for the operating system.
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People do it because, in the case of the HTC Leo/HD2, there's not one piece of hardware quite like it being sold with Android installed.
I guess smartphones are quickly becoming the new PCs & Laptops of the age. Some people buy a PC with an OS installed as default, they like the hardware but not the OS (usually Windows, maybe OSx) so they just format the HDD and install say Ubuntu etc etc.

jagnet said:
People do it because, in the case of the HTC Leo/HD2, there's not one piece of hardware quite like it being sold with Android installed.
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Yeah but you will never get a well-performing port until an OEM makes a device with the same hardware. Who's going to make the drivers for you?

vangrieg said:
Yeah but you will never get a well-performing port until an OEM makes a device with the same hardware. Who's going to make the drivers for you?
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That's true. Though the Acer A1 and Xperia X3 both use snapdragon so drivers (or partial drivers) will undoubtedly make their way to the porting project.

Yes but then you will have Android devices with the same level of hardware as HD2! So the initial question remains - why not buy them instead of coping with inevitable problems with ports?
It's not like drivers instantly start working when you copy them from one device to another, even with the same hardware platform - check out the video drivers thread to see what I mean. You're doomed to have problems like battery drain or calls dropping or poor performance in some areas or what not.
Then there will be some problems with applications - I don't know about the new devices, but all the current Android ones have low-res screens.
In addition to that, you really want 2.0 with Sense, and there's no port of that available AFAIK. Plain Android is just dull, it's nothing to fret about, IMO.
I understand the fun of porting and making things work, but using that as your primary device? It's guaranteed to be worse than what you have now.

Neither of those devices have 4.3 inch touchscreens. Also The HD2 has a look and feel all of its own.
The only thing spoiling it for me is Windows Mobile and the terrible onscreen keyboard so if we could port Android to this device I would be elated as it has a much better marketplace (Windows Marketplace is really a sack over overpriced crap), less cludge and better built in apps - the Youtube app for example supports user subscriptions and favourites viewing, and I'm a big online video fan.
The fact that Android was built from the ground up for capacitive touchscreen devices rather than being a patched up ropey old operating system with a shell interface on top makes me drool at the idea of it being on the HD2, and YES we could buy an Android device of similar specification BUT where's the fun in that??? Check the name of this site.........................

Well, I'm not on the Google/Android hype bandwagon, I do admit that the UI out of the box there is much more finger friendly and the notifications are implemented in the best way among all the mobile phone OSes, but otherwise Android's greatness is blown out of all reasonable proportion. An Android crippled by driver incompatibilities/incomplete implementation is something that totally misses the concept of attractive in my terms...
That said, I'm sure I'll install it myself one day (via haret or otherwise) just out of curiosity, that would certainly serve to satisfying the geek in me. But to expect that your experience from using the device would improve is somewhat unrealistic.

I am happy with the HD2 and figured I would decide what platform to go with at the time of my next phone purchase. This report should mean I can try out Windows Mobile 7 on the HD2 and take that into consideration as well.
http://msmobiles.com/news.php/8793.html

CAH000 said:
I am happy with the HD2 and figured I would decide what platform to go with at the time of my next phone purchase. This report should mean I can try out Windows Mobile 7 on the HD2 and take that into consideration as well.
http://msmobiles.com/news.php/8793.html
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nice, i can't wait

MSmobiles is full of **** as usual. They post BS to get hits every once in a while.

What does the windows 7 update mean for us?

I see lots of people say when windows mobile 7 goes on our device it will be unbeatable, why is this? I dont really see much wrong with this one lol

hammers4life said:
I see lots of people say when windows mobile 7 goes on our device it will be unbeatable, why is this? I dont really see much wrong with this one lol
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I don't know about unbeatable but WM7 has gone through several delays as I'm sure Microsoft is aware that they are standing on there last leg to keep there (9%) of there mobile market shares, so......
...if Microsoft is smart, and it looks like they seem to be (delays signify that WM7 is not quite ready and thus, not rushing it), it should be a much improved Operating System as it has to compete against Symbian and Apple's and blackberry.
Market Shares:
Symbian....50.3%
Blackberry..20.9%
Iphone........13.7%
Windows.......9.0%
Andriod.......2.8%
WM 6.5 was was not even supposed to have existed but due to the delays, 6.5 was nothing more than a stand in, holding it's place for what some have anticipated to be revolutionary OS. Not sure if they will push through with that term when it actually comes out of the gates. Time will tell...

There isn't too much wrong with this one. Windows Mobile 6.5 is by far the most powerful mobile OS and it's getting bashed just because it lacks a nice and simple user interface.
Windows Mobile 7 will bring a new, hopefully exciting, user interface, probably based on Silverlight, new APIs for developers to create great applications that look and work much better than what we have now and better integration with Microsoft's services (Zune, XBox, Windows Live, Bing...).
On the other side, it will probably break compatibility with most, if not all, currently available applications.

freyberry said:
On the other side, it will probably break compatibility with most, if not all, currently available applications.
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And I think it should. The past should be scrapped to create a new future. Like OS9 to OSX and PalmOS to WebOS. Bring emulation if really needed.

Don't forget the new core of the CE which will fully support the new fast processors. That means we get an even faster phone.

windows 7 base on ce 6.0 core so ther wont be any backward compatibility.
Probably new core will be much stable and faster (support for FPU) and some othre stuff.

will windows mobile 7 be freely avalible on hd2? some sites are saying yes and others are saying no. it is my understanding that wm 6.5 and wm7 will co-exist, with wm7 aimed at high end devices (i assume because of the higher system requirements). would be good if HTC gave the hd2 wm7, as it would really open up the device in terms of performance and features.

matthewharmon102 said:
will windows mobile 7 be freely avalible on hd2?
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Nobody knows yet.
My guess is that there will not be an official HTC release of it, for the same reason as there hasn't been any official WM6.5 upgrade for the Touch HD - WM7 is due to launch at about the same time as the successor to the HD2 (Q4 this year), and allowing HD2 users to upgrade easily to WM7 would cannibalise sales of the HD3 (or whatever it's called); HTC would obviously prefer people who want to upgrade to WM7 to buy a new HTC phone to do it.
I've no doubt that attempts will be made by the ROM "chefs" on this site to produce "cooked" ROMs for the HD2 based on WM7. However, this may be a much tricker proposition than, say, producing a WM6.5 ROM for a Touch HD, as WM7 is based on an entirely different Operating System kernel and uses a new driver model. That means that unless there is some reference device which uses exactly the same hardware as the HD2 and runs WM7 and whose drivers the ROM chefs can pirate, it's not going to work.

WinMo 7 predicitions

What do you think WinMo 7 is going to be like? Do you trust Microsoft to not screw it up? Do you think HTC will really give us a free update for our Leos?
I think it would be fantastic if they released a Beta version for the public to test like with Windows 7, but it doesn't seem like that's going to happen, which makes me nervous.
Hopefully the Zune team has a say in the design, cause they seem to have their **** together.

I'm guessing it's going to be a combination between WM 6.5, Android, Iphone OS and Zune. Honestly I'm hoping for something revolutionary.

MS didn't mess up Windows 7 so there's no reason to think WM7 will be any different.
Think positive.

I think a beta test would be positive for them anyways, especially to beat down all the rumors and to give people a reason to wait/want those WinMo devices, guaranteeing the availability of WinMo phones by the time it releases to the world in final form.
If they don't act swift in these times there would be no manufacturer left to distribute to and it would pretty much be at the brink of death (= even more pressure)..
However, once they bring out a public beta, IPhone OS and Android might actually get inspired by it and anticipate before it is even released, making it less spectacular.
Yep, there are two sides on this.. I hope it'll be as revolutionary as they are implying.

laserviking said:
Do you trust Microsoft to not screw it up? Do you think HTC will really give us a free update for our Leos?
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No and definitely no.

I hope MS knocks it out of the park. But, I don't understand how they are going to leverage all of the legacy apps and their ugly interfaces and some new-age GUI.
If they decide to kill off all the old stuff and start fresh, then it technically isn't Windows Mobile anymore because none of the 1000's of WM apps will be compatible. Maybe there will be some sort of compatibility mode for the old stuff?
All of the "iPhone killers" died because of the following reasons:
1) No iTunes. Nowadays, services are more crucial to sucess than hardware specs. Direct-to-device music, movies and books is a killer feature.
2) User-experience less than iPhone's. The iPhones killer feature is it's fluidity and lightning fast response of it's GUI. You can't hate such speed.
3) Single form factor. Developers know how their apps will behave whereas WM apps have to cater to the various types of WM phones. Screen resolution, graphics acceleration, d-pad, optical mouse, fingerprint sensor, accelerometer, touchscreen, keyboard ? All of these options hinder software development for WM.
Microsoft is the only company that can battle Apple on all three fronts right away. For services they have Zune, Bing mobile, for gaming XBox, Windows Live/MyPhone, Exchange, Office, Windows Desktop. All of this needs to be thoroughly incorporated into its WM7 platform.
I just hope MS doesn't market WM7 as some cheap alternative to iPhone. WM7 needs to be a great OS GUI-wise but also offer services equivalent to iTunes on a super-powerful hardware platform with no less than cutting edge specs. It appears MS is on this path but I don't know how great the end product is going to be. My fingers are crossed.

OMG can we please close this? Totally useless speculation.
If you have no clue, just don't post. I know a lot but I won't tell you anything, just wait for MWC and stop the silly speculation.
EDIT: WhyBe, your post is actually very intelligent. That's why I'll give you a hint: Trust MS to do exactly what you expect
(though not all is perfect)
Oh and @Shasarak: I told you before, but I will tell you again: Ruling out any possibility without actually having a clue is stupid
You always pretend to know what you're talking about, but you actually know nothing at all. And, you know, drawing conclusions from nothing at all is just silly. Much more so than those speculators who at least admit that they've got no clue.

Freyberry you are one wound up dude. It's pretty normal to speculate on this kind of thing and hope that there will be change for the better. Given WinMo's awful track record and Windows recent push for usability everyone is speculating how it's gonna be.
"I know a lot but I won't tell you anything"... I'm getting flashbacks to the school playground here

mark0326 said:
MS didn't mess up Windows 7 so there's no reason to think WM7 will be any different.
Think positive.
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Basically this.
Also, Microsoft hasn't messed anything up since Windows Vista.
Microsoft is on a hot streak right now, and I don't see any reason that should end anytime soon. Ballmer even beat Jobs to the punch with tablets.
And not only did Ballmer beat Jobs [to the punch], he punched harder too.
The only thing Apple et cetera has going for them at the moment is populism. People like Apple and they don't like Microsoft, probably because Apple tries to make tech appeal to the lowest common denominator, whereas Microsoft makes tech appeal to the enthusiast, while giving the lowest common denominator sufficient attention that they'll be at least able to passably use whatever product is in-question.
WhyBe said:
I hope MS knocks it out of the park. But, I don't understand how they are going to leverage all of the legacy apps and their ugly interfaces and some new-age GUI.
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Look at Windows and Internet Explorer.
Microsoft is positively the master of backwards compatibility.
WhyBe said:
If they decide to kill off all the old stuff and start fresh, then it technically isn't Windows Mobile anymore because none of the 1000's of WM apps will be compatible. Maybe there will be some sort of compatibility mode for the old stuff?
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Click to collapse
So is Windows 7 not Windows because 16-bit Windows 3.1 apps won't run on it?
Not saying at all that Microsoft will kill of backwards compatibility. The Windows Mobile family is just too new for us to see backwards compatibility die off -- at least if Microsoft sticks with their current paradigm.
Windows was backwards-compatible with Windows 3.1 for over 17 years.
WhyBe said:
[/B]1) No iTunes. Nowadays, services are more crucial to sucess than hardware specs. Direct-to-device music, movies and books is a killer feature.
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If you're insinuating that Microsoft should do anything like iTunes, then I suggest that you just get out right now. iTunes is an example of everything a device experience shouldn't be. The ActiveSync paradigm is brilliant -- an application to sync your device if you want, with your device retaining the ability to act on its own.
iTunes isn't about user experience, it's about locking you in, and that's the biggest strength Microsoft products in general have -- you can do whatever you want.
WhyBe said:
2) User-experience less than iPhone's. The iPhones killer feature is it's fluidity and lightning fast response of it's GUI. You can't hate such speed.
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Click to collapse
Look at Windows 7. They're knocking the ball out of the park on GUI design these days, just look at the massive steps forward from 6.1 to 6.5, and now to 6.5.3.
And, they're taking their time on Windows Mobile 7. I'd rather wait and get something great than something that's rushed out of the gates.
WhyBe said:
3) Single form factor. Developers know how their apps will behave whereas WM apps have to cater to the various types of WM phones. Screen resolution, graphics acceleration, d-pad, optical mouse, fingerprint sensor, accelerometer, touchscreen, keyboard ? All of these options hinder software development for WM.[/I]
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Again, I suggest you just get out right now. Go buy your Apple products and enjoy your "single form factor". Microsoft doesn't play this game. You buy Windows, you don't buy a Microsoft computer, you buy Exchange, you don't buy a Microsoft mail server.
Their biggest strength is the fact that they don't have a single form factor. They do what they're good at -- software design -- and let the hardware designers do what they're good at.
WhyBe said:
Microsoft is the only company that can battle Apple on all three fronts right away. For services they have Zune, Bing mobile, for gaming XBox, Windows Live/MyPhone, Exchange, Office, Windows Desktop. All of this needs to be thoroughly incorporated into its WM7 platform.
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Again, if you want Apple-like lock-in, go play with an iPhone. I doubt Microsoft is going to go this route, and if they do, they'll lose me as a customer. The strength of Windows and Microsoft products is the fact that you're not locked in. You're given an operating system and you're free to do whatever you want with it.
If you want someone to tell you how to do what you want to do with your device, rather than merely giving you the choice, go bend over for Steve Jobs.
Get out.
WhyBe said:
services equivalent to iTunes
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You mean lock-in?

If you're insinuating that Microsoft should do anything like iTunes, then I suggest that you just get out right now. iTunes is an example of everything a device experience shouldn't be. The ActiveSync paradigm is brilliant -- an application to sync your device if you want, with your device retaining the ability to act on its own.
^^^^^zune marketplace says hello

I certain hope there's no 'itunes' or 'single form factor', unless it's going to be their Zune phone, which I won't be buying.
I'm probably not who the new phone OSes are designed for. I just want to be able to copy files directly to it, use it for what I need, don't want to share data with them, don't really use social networks.

Spike15 said:
Basically this.
Also, Microsoft hasn't messed anything up since Windows Vista.
Microsoft is on a hot streak right now, and I don't see any reason that should end anytime soon. Ballmer even beat Jobs to the punch with tablets.
And not only did Ballmer beat Jobs [to the punch], he punched harder too.
The only thing Apple et cetera has going for them at the moment is populism. People like Apple and they don't like Microsoft, probably because Apple tries to make tech appeal to the lowest common denominator, whereas Microsoft makes tech appeal to the enthusiast, while giving the lowest common denominator sufficient attention that they'll be at least able to passably use whatever product is in-question.
Look at Windows and Internet Explorer.
Microsoft is positively the master of backwards compatibility.
So is Windows 7 not Windows because 16-bit Windows 3.1 apps won't run on it?
Not saying at all that Microsoft will kill of backwards compatibility. The Windows Mobile family is just too new for us to see backwards compatibility die off -- at least if Microsoft sticks with their current paradigm.
Windows was backwards-compatible with Windows 3.1 for over 17 years.
If you're insinuating that Microsoft should do anything like iTunes, then I suggest that you just get out right now. iTunes is an example of everything a device experience shouldn't be. The ActiveSync paradigm is brilliant -- an application to sync your device if you want, with your device retaining the ability to act on its own.
iTunes isn't about user experience, it's about locking you in, and that's the biggest strength Microsoft products in general have -- you can do whatever you want.
Look at Windows 7. They're knocking the ball out of the park on GUI design these days, just look at the massive steps forward from 6.1 to 6.5, and now to 6.5.3.
And, they're taking their time on Windows Mobile 7. I'd rather wait and get something great than something that's rushed out of the gates.
Again, I suggest you just get out right now. Go buy your Apple products and enjoy your "single form factor". Microsoft doesn't play this game. You buy Windows, you don't buy a Microsoft computer, you buy Exchange, you don't buy a Microsoft mail server.
Their biggest strength is the fact that they don't have a single form factor. They do what they're good at -- software design -- and let the hardware designers do what they're good at.
Again, if you want Apple-like lock-in, go play with an iPhone. I doubt Microsoft is going to go this route, and if they do, they'll lose me as a customer. The strength of Windows and Microsoft products is the fact that you're not locked in. You're given an operating system and you're free to do whatever you want with it.
If you want someone to tell you how to do what you want to do with your device, rather than merely giving you the choice, go bend over for Steve Jobs.
Get out.
You mean lock-in?
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Click to collapse
Well Said. The only problem is that people really beleive what apple says.
If one said RIM & blackbery i would sort of listened. but iPhone! it doesn't do multitasking it's not an OS, it's a frimware
I do believe that WM7 is gonna be something that we didn't even think about. i don't know, maybe bringing another dimention to the scrolling? Vertical + Horizontal + Depth? that would be cool.
btw, why do we think that WM7 will be blue?

anaadoul said:
btw, why do we think that WM7 will be blue?
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lol! Blue always comes to my mind when I try to imagine WM7. Maybe because windows xp, vista and 7 are by default blue?
I wonder if WM7 will actually be black! like the zune hd interface. will be really cool!

laserviking said:
Freyberry you are one wound up dude. It's pretty normal to speculate on this kind of thing and hope that there will be change for the better. Given WinMo's awful track record and Windows recent push for usability everyone is speculating how it's gonna be.
"I know a lot but I won't tell you anything"... I'm getting flashbacks to the school playground here
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Yeah school playground... lol, grow up, little child. Maybe I'm not allowed to tell you something? Ever thought about this simple fact?
I already told you too much. Just re-read my post, you'll see it contains a LOT of info.
And NO, I do NOT work for Microsoft, nor HTC.
About all the speculation: It's OK if you speculate what it will/won't be, but what is very annoying is when
a) people complain about things that are pure speculation
b) people pretend they know something by using words like "definitely", despite that they actually know nothing
@anaadoul @mightymn It will be blue/grey
(but only by default, cause it's very customizable)
Btw. those are worth watching:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pC0cxzLhFqM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xXfJZzeSZ0U
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0typyfPG_4

@freyberry
In the absense of better information I'm happy to accept that you know 'stuff' and logically, if you do know 'stuff', you probably oughtn't to talk about it.
So in that spirit, if you were to randomly throw a dart at a calendar in the interests of picking a date - entirely at random - when the wider community might start seeing pre-release or beta versions appearing, what would be your hunch for where that random dart might land?

Nice topic, it is fun to hear what everybody expects from WM7
I am very confused about WM7... one day I am all happy and can't wait for WM7.. the next day I am not so sure about it anymore... MicroSoft can really go either way IMO.
At the best:
- Brilliant new OS: Nice looking UI, smooth, stable, NEW features the other OS's don't have, good services like Zune, Xbox Live, etc. But most important...
A GOOD APPSTORE.
If all goes wrong...:
- Minor update of 6.5.3, some small UI changes, Zune, Xbox Live.
-------------------------
In the end if I just look at my HTC HD2, and think very clearly: what is missing? I think of the following:
- HTC Sense is nice, but it just does not come together with WM. I would like it to become 'one'. HTC Sense can also get a little bit slow sometimes. I would prefer a HTC Sense in the styl of HTC Hero, with the widgets.
- I want perfect stability of the OS: no more crashes, no more lagging.
- I want more App Support. I want a decent official AppStore. I don't need 140.000 apps, but I want it to be a succes. So not like the current 'AppStore' which is dead.
That's it. Zune and Xbox Live support are not even so important to me. These 3 points I mentioned are a MUST for WM7. Now that I look at it, the iPhone has all of these 3 points. I guess in the end I can not escape the fact that the iPhone OS is brilliant. That plus the awesome hardware offered by the HTC HD2 will make it a beast.
And regarding if HTC will give us the update for free: I hope so, I thing the chances are 50/50. But even if they want some money for it, I will pay it. Up to 15 euro, not more.
Come on Microsoft, show us you can, like you did with Windows 7, Xbox 360 and Zune!

@Gustopher
Nicely put, but unfortunately, I can not give you any satisfying answer.
I have no access to pre-release/beta versions, therefore I can only hope that something will leak soon. I don't think there will be a public/official beta.
After MWC, they will give more people access to the software, which will increase the probability of a leak.
Let's hope we won't have to wait until HTC releases an official upgrade, cause you know how long that usually takes.
WM7 definitely looks good (and yes, I may use the word "definitely", cause I know it). But Microsoft is doing a "great" job at scattering confusing/contradictory pieces of information, thus I'm just as anxious as you to see all the pieces come together.

freyberry said:
@Gustopher
Nicely put, but unfortunately, I can not give you any satisfying answer.
I have no access to pre-release/beta versions, therefore I can only hope that something will leak soon. I don't think there will be a public/official beta.
After MWC, they will give more people access to the software, which will increase the probability of a leak.
Let's hope we won't have to wait until HTC releases an official upgrade, cause you know how long that usually takes.
WM7 definitely looks good (and yes, I may use the word "definitely", cause I know it). But Microsoft is doing a "great" job at scattering confusing/contradictory pieces of information, thus I'm just as anxious as you to see all the pieces come together.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Understood and thanks. If I were to try to paraphrase, your - let's call it a hunch - elements of the OS are coming together but it's not quite at alpha/beta stage...but could be relatively soon.
So maybe waiting is the best tactic...

Waiting is certainly the best tactic. However, I fear some of the most important questions will not be answered at MWC, at least not officially.
(I don't mean the UI, I mean core functionality/services/compatibility etc., cause that's what I don't know about and have lots of questions - that's the pieces I want to see come together)
Ah well, let's turn this into a wild speculation thread, shall we? Just let me get the popcorn first....
...OK, here we go:
ppcgeeks said:
-At the Mobile World Congress event on February 15th, 2010, Windows Phone 7 will be unveilved, although at this time plans are only to unveil the user interface of the new platform . Specific indepth functionality of the device will most likely not be shown.
-The User Interface is based upon codename “METRO”. It will be very similar to the Zune HD User Interface with a complete revamp of the “Start” screen. The UI is “Very Clean”, “Soulful” and “Alive” [<-- That I can confirm.]
-Unfortunately there will be no Flash support at the get go as there was not enough time to implement these features.
-Windows Phone 7 will only support application installation through service based delivery. (i.e Marketplace). Application installation via storage card will not be possible.
- No Multi-Task support. Applications will “Pause” when in the background, however will support notifications via push notifications.
-Marketplace will now support “try before you buy” as well as an API
-No NETCF backwards compatibility. This means the original rumor of no backward compatibility for applications holds to be true. That being said, there are high hopes of porting the NetCF to the newer platform easily.
-Microsoft is confident that devices will be ready by September 2010
-Full Zune Integration
-Windows Mobile Device Center will no longer be used. Zune software to take over syncing via PC.
-OEM Interfaces will not be allowed to run on the device. Say goodbye to Sense UI / SPB Mobile Shell / Point UI / Infinity, etc, etc
-Full XBOX Gaming Integration (Gamer tag, achievements, friends, avatars, merchandising, etc)
-Full support for social networking
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Source: http://www.ppcgeeks.com/2010/02/06/...ndows-phone-7-details-emerge-from-the-depths/
Flame on! Hahahaha...

freyberry said:
Waiting is certainly the best tactic. However, I fear some of the most important questions will not be answered at MWC, at least not officially.
(I don't mean the UI, I mean core functionality/services/compatibility etc., cause that's what I don't know about and have lots of questions - that's the pieces I want to see come together)
Ah well, let's turn this into a wild speculation thread, shall we? Just let me get the popcorn first....
...OK, here we go:
Source: http://www.ppcgeeks.com/2010/02/06/...ndows-phone-7-details-emerge-from-the-depths/
Flame on! Hahahaha...
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i don't like that!
let's hope it's not true! i have always loved WM because it's so open.
no .net cf?! no way, this will mean loosing the whole developers community! i disagree with you i'm afraid
@freyberry
how can you tell all this? i'm close to MS here in my region and they didn't say anything and not willing to, notice that they support WindowsPhoneMiddleEast Community which i lead (look at my signature).

Windows7 looks and sounds overhyped

i know im not the only one that thinks this....i love new features and upgrades just as much as anyone but it seems the goal of windows 7 is to take away the customization experience of windows and bring consumers closer with microsoft then closer 2 their device. No flash, No skins, limited apps, and lets be honest who wants a device that looks exactly the same as another person device, u could take a million hd2 and none will look exactly like mines

jbanga86 said:
i know im not the only one that thinks this....i love new features and upgrades just as much as anyone but it seems the goal of windows 7 is to take away the customization experience of windows and bring consumers closer with microsoft then closer 2 their device. No flash, No skins, limited apps, and lets be honest who wants a device that looks exactly the same as another person device, u could take a million hd2 and none will look exactly like mines
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I say save these comments till after it comes out and you actually use it.
And it's Windows Phone 7 Series, not Windows 7.
dwizzy130

anything short of 5 pages and this thread will be a failure!

dwizzy130 said:
I say save these comments till after it comes out and you actually use it.
And it's Windows Phone 7 Series, not Windows 7.
dwizzy130
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I'd agree if it was for ALL comments on the awesomeness OR failure of WP7s.

lol all im saying is if we wanted a zune we would buy a zune!
seriously ever since the thing came out they been talking about
making it a phone and now this is new news?
psht! they have a few ideas on point though like the whole
finger friendly thing, but to me its like buying a new house
with thin walls or move into a comfy old brick home
yeah the lighting fixtures is up to date but what about the foundation

I love the new interface. I love the accent that is being layed on the text. From what i've seen it's like browsing through a magazine. Well thought, because in the end, mostly it's text with what you're dealing with on this type of devices.
No really, i'm very thrilled about the new design. And with the new silverlight based development framework I think that we can expect more useful applications that are focussed on what they are supposed to do and less on the user interface.

The UI is awesome. Other than that, it's just an iPhone copy with the same bad policies, like censorship and no multitasking, no file system access etc.

seed_al said:
The UI is awesome. Other than that, it's just an iPhone copy with the same bad policies, like censorship and no multitasking, no file system access etc.
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WP7S, No cutomizability, locked eco system, no multi tasking.
Dont u think it defeats the purpose of WinMO.
I hope it will be a big failure. The reason i got WinMO instead of anything else is because of the power of freedom it has. WP7S killed that.
and yes, its just as hyped up as iphone before it was release. NOthing more. Its not revolutionary, its just pretty with no brain.
The start or home screen may look pretty, but its functionless. U have to scroll a lot to see info. I think the novelty will wear off faster then the iphone.

Good post, Frostlance, very good post... it's sad how they destroyed everything good about Windows Mobile. I'm not at all interested in a stupid locked down system.

seed_al said:
Good post, Frostlance, very good post... it's sad how they destroyed everything good about Windows Mobile. I'm not at all interested in a stupid locked down system.
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And not only that, they way they made WP7S Backwards incompatible also means MS just killed WinMO6.5 and previous versions.
Developers are abandoning WinMO 6.5 1 by 1, started with adobe , then Skype, and many more to come.
We were waiting for Flash 10.1 anxiously, seeing the beta version test on OUR HD2, but in the end, they discontinued their support for WinMO.
As Steve Ballmer Said " OS are nothing without Developers, Developers Developers , (he goes on saying developers many2 times)
And that is the fate of WinMO 6.5. With no Developer support, Our BELOVED OS, is becoming NOthing.
To tell you the truth,ive been a loyal WinMO user since 2000. I relied heavily on its apps (esp medical applications,helps me a lot with my work as a doctor and manage my patients data). Now ive heard from a friend in skyscape,a major medical apps developer for WinMO, that they will also discontinue support for WinMO. Now this really saddens me really.
For a phone(expensive phone in fact) which i bought just 2 months ago, will no longer provide me new apps, new updates to my medical apps, no flash (A BIG WASTE , With our huge gorgeous screen,we cant even load flash content!).
I envy those using android, updating their OS constantly, and getting apps like google earth,goggle and etc which we were once promised to be given,now all left is a dream.
MS has killed our beloved WinMO. It is a sad news for all of us. WP7S is more like a curse then a blessing.

I'd rather buy an iPhone than any WP7S device.
Both are locked down crap systems without multitasking from my POV.

Espentf said:
I'd rather buy an iPhone than any WP7S device.
Both are locked down crap systems without multitasking from my POV.
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But WP7S has better hardware and a better UI. So, IF you buy a locked down crap system, you really should get a WP7S phone.
But of course, you shouldn't buy a locked down crap system.

seed_al said:
But WP7S has better hardware
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Do we know enough about the iPhone 4 to be sure that its hardware will be inferior to WP7S phones? We'll be about half way between that and its replacement when WP7 starts to get going.

Shasarak said:
Do we know enough about the iPhone 4 to be sure that its hardware will be inferior to WP7S phones? We'll be about half way between that and its replacement when WP7 starts to get going.
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We know nothing about iPhone 4, but Apple's iPhone hardware has ALWAYS been at least half a year behind HTC's. I don't expect that to change.
iPhone 4 would need a WVGA display, a 1GHz processor, 448MB RAM, a five megapixel camera with dual LED flash, much much better materials... in order to be "only" half a year behind again. In other words: No way. They're not going to catch up anytime soon.

seed_al said:
We know nothing about iPhone 4, but Apple's iPhone hardware has ALWAYS been at least half a year behind HTC's. I don't expect that to change.
iPhone 4 would need a WVGA display, a 1GHz processor, 448MB RAM, a five megapixel camera with dual LED flash, much much better materials... in order to be "only" half a year behind again. In other words: No way. They're not going to catch up anytime soon.
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The strange thing is that if the WP7 is really a closed down system without multitasking it would not need such advanced hardware for it. The need of so much memory and processor power is precisely because of the multitasking when a user can run several applications simultaneously. Otherwise you can have a good user experience with much less memory and processor power like in case of the iPhone.

This thread will be better if it has a poll on it.
I think it is hyped too. I really prefer the HTC interface and customization freedom of the HD2 against the new design of windows mobile 7. I have my device so customized that I can access every feature with a few clicks (AE button plus and multiple button press) I dont see that coming soon in WM7, you need to scroll a lot with your finger to actually go anywhere. And what botters me more is that it looks like "multimedia oriented" and not "bussisness" oriented.
If they close the platform like Apple they will loose al the support of the comunity. I really think WebOs look more interesting as a new modern platform (but they still lack variety of applications)
If there is no oficial WM7 update to the HD2, I really dont care. (we know the chef here will be realising it and even with a newer rom)

What not being said may be the most revealing.
Other than a few picture and limited stories from just a few people (MS insiders) what do we really know about WM7?
With all the stories about what WM7 cannot do, you start to wonder if there is something that we are not being told about the new OS.
For instance:
* MS Voice Command has not had any real updates for a number of years. Is there a (much improved) new version in WM7?
* Wireless/Blue tooth set up? (better setup etc?)
* Haptic interface,
* camera and other elements used in a more interactive way for interface?
* New/updated/Improved version of transcriber?
Or is MS really just going to bring out a dumb version of Windows Mobile, for the dummys, and to more directly compete with iPhone, and continue the development of the OS version (6.5) they already have for the business users, and the more adventurous?
We still remember XP/Vista don't we, lets hope MS learn't something!

No option for both? I think bits are great and bits are over hyped.

1) Maybe it´s going to be the same story as with Win Vista: faulty, crappy, resource-hungry, no benefits. Good for the basic user that only surfs with IE, listens to music, watches videos, e-mails and uploads videos on YouTube
2) NO software is uncrackable ! Wonder what the experts here on XDA will do with WM7 ! When I received my HD2 in November it wasn´t much more than my Touch HD, a little bit faster though. Now with all the geniousses here in this forum it is a rocket of a PDA that spared me the investment into a Sony Vaio P
3) I eagerly wait for the HD3 at the end of the year, wait this time some months ´till I buy it. First I will see what the leading programmers here will do with it, then buy it and flash it with a cooked ROM from this forum. And maybe this cooked ROM will be rebased on WM6.5.x or a hacked WM7, able of multitasking.
4) When I will buy HD3 (or whatever it will be called) I buy the hardware (1,5 GHz Qualcomm, ROM/RAM etc.) and I want it to be FAST. Like with Win Vista the hardware will be eaten up by WM7-software giving no speed advantage. Like with my Sony Vaio TT92 which is equipped with WinXP and which is much faster than most of the desktop-PCs for MY use of the Vaio (no gaming, prof. medical work) I will rely on the experts here to cook a ROM that´s faster than lightning for the APPS, ´cause I don´t care if the basic software is WM6.5.x or WM7, TF3D, HTCSense or what, I want my preferred apps to run fast and smooth w/o hangup.
Conclusion: trust the people here, THEY will make the best outa the new HARDWARE, not HTC, not Microsoft ..........

gm_fisher said:
Or is MS really just going to bring out a dumb version of Windows Mobile, for the dummys, and to more directly compete with iPhone, and continue the development of the OS version (6.5) they already have for the business users, and the more adventurous?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm afraid that's exactly what they are doing. Everyone - including MS - is green with envy for the zillion$$$ Apple are making with teenagers and "wanna-look-cool" adults who spend their time on social networks or mms-ing pictures. Little brains, fat wallets. No surprise manufacturers and carriers LOVE them and would do ANYTHING to please them.
MS had a decision to make: continue to fight on two fields (business and dummies) and continue losing to RIM on the former and to Apple on the latter? Or instead concentrate on one, playing the cards (like hardware) where the competition has always been behind?
WPS7 is just that.
Do I like it? Hell, no.
Would I have done the same thing had I been in Steve Ballmer's shoes? Probably yes.
Will their strategy succeed? Probably no. Unless Steve Jobs screws up big-time...
gm_fisher said:
We still remember XP/Vista don't we, lets hope MS learn't something!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Looking at Win7, I think they learnt that crappy-buggy OS's should never ever make their way into the market. However keeping looking at Win7 on other PC's makes me wish I will still have the option for XP when my laptop replacement is due in June.
I don't think MS will be stupid enough to allow WPS7 to be crappy-buggy like Vista, but most likely WPS7 will be as alienating to business users as Win7 is, leaving them in fact with two choices:
a) BlackBerry (for most)
b) Android (for power users)
Actually there is a third one for the (very few) adventurous: cooked WinMo ROMs.

Do you still use WM? If so why?

Just a friendly discussion, so my question is why do yous till use WM if you do, with Android, WP7 and IOS out their, why stick with WM?

cause i enjoy every minute i use my HD2 with WM-CHT2.0
for my WP7 is an incognita, can anybody please provide a link for WP7 secreenshots?
Android is fine, my kids love playing angrybirds all time! but WM is for me, its adult games ...

poyensa said:
[SNIP]WM is for me, its adult...[/SNIP]
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Click to collapse
.....OS
Android is for kids/teenagers

Reason 1 WM integrates flawlessly with my windows PC ,office ect..
Reason 2 WM has TOMTOM Satnav and it works flawlessly with my WM device just load the software and your ready to go .
The reasons could go on and on but i gave you my most important two
Unlike my daughter just purchased a iPhone 3gs loaded on TomTom and found out to my disgust that you need the car GPS Dock to make it work as integrated GPS don't work with the app (Don't get me started on iphone sh*t)

OS!!
still using WM 6.5/6.5x.
Android is for kids and WP7 is immature..

c_shekhar said:
WP7 is immature..
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couldnt of said it better myself.lol
+1

How is android fo kids??? And I can see how wp7 isnt fully matured yet.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA App

WM rulez!
HD2 with NRGZ WM ROM and CHT 2.0 is the best !!!
WM7 is crap, IOS is a toy, android is garbage....
my 2 cents

solidkevin said:
How is android fo kids???
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look at it lol

So you are going by looks only and not functionality?
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA App

i dont just judge an OS on looks, i judge it on many of things, 1 of which being functionality..
i wasnt really impressed with android, simple as

raving_nanza said:
i dont just judge an OS on looks, i judge it on many of things, 1 of which being functionality..
i wasnt really impressed with android, simple as
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh ok cause you said look at it, I thought you meant looks, imo android does anything and everything but it has its flaws, iphone is nice and simple but a little too restrictive. And wp7 is hands down the best UI around imo, simple, clean and elegant, missing funtionality and support though at this stage. As for WM I think its a fine OS but too slow for my tastes and it seems like it never matured into full touch UI. Symbian is real functional but so damn slow and ugly UI.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA App

In my experiences. I love WM then another other OS and will keep in first place of my favorite list ever.
WM functions are very similar to Windows OS. You can do what ever you want, as a developer or as a user. If you are from Windows PC, then you won't be liking android, iOS or even WP7.
Android has good graphics and speed but it feels like a beta software. Cannot trust it.
WP7 is very simple and basic but Still lacks lots of things. I didn't expected MS will do such a bad thing. Better if they stood in WM interface itself.
iOS, I have no comments about it as I haven't used much.
To say in one line, android, WP7, iOS and etc (except WM of course) developers are trying to keep users in there custody!
This never happened in WM, users of it were very free to use, as if they made there own OS.
WM has something that you cannot express but feels in heart when using. Android is my second option though.
Thanks...
Best Regards
solidkevin said:
As for WM I think its a fine OS but too slow for my tastes and it seems like it never matured into full touch UI. Symbian is real functional but so damn slow and ugly UI.
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Because its a Win CE core which operates from 1x1 pixel tap (i.e stylus). Its same as a cursor present in PC. Later on, MS and HTC tried to make it better Touch Sensitive. Though it wasn't very successful because the core and kernel didn't match the latest hardware. If you know about VM in WM, you probably also knowing it doesn't have much space. Even though the physical memory (RAM) has enough space, multiple apps load slow and its because VM is lacking space. Thats the major fall in WM.

CRACING said:
WM has something that you cannot express but feels in heart when using
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B-E-A-utifull

'cause i dont have money to buy an iphone

you can setup what if you want on your Wm.but i have never used Anroid operation system.
in my opinion best reason is wm useful for you(office,gps,internet..)

I learnt the Win32 programming model so that I could use the original Embedded Tools 3.0 to create native C++ ARM Windows Mobile 2002 programs.
It was a long hard slog, involving studying the shell "Hello World" program as created by the project wizard, and then trying to figure out what the hell was going on. Embedded C++ 4.0 came along later for WM2003. The accumulated skills could then be used later in Visual Studio, for creating Win32 PC programs, and being able to port applications from one platform to the other, in either direction!
Microsoft have made a total mess of the transfer to Phone 7, with the complete change of programming model, being one of the most crass moves they have ever pulled. Phone 7 was too little, far too late which allowed the opposition to run away with the advantage. Microsoft will never get that back.
Windows CE and Windows Mobile are still good solid operating systems, tried and tested, even if they are a little long in the tooth. Win32 programming may be considered very old hat these days, but the programs run like a bat out of hell.
Android is also pretty stable, being based on a Linux core, and it's improving, but to learn Android development means starting from scratch, almost from the "Hello World" example above. Do I really want to start all over again? Maybe, mañana........ Fortunately, there is not much difference between C# and Java code, so the transition may not be that painful.
Update: Currently studying some of the stuff in the Android SDK........ At the "What the hell does this do?" stage again.
Windows Mobile lives on as Windows Embedded Handheld, but this is now primarily for line of business devices.
Have look at the current WinMo devices sold by Expansys here in the UK
Update: WinMo 6.x has been dropped as a separate category, you have to specifically search for Windows Mobile. There is the HD2/HD2 Mini and some rather expensive near indestructible rubber armoured devices.
How long before HTC drops the HD2?

I like WM because of it's flexibility, the fact that it's an open platform with lots of freeware and it's ability to function without a Google, Itunes or whatever account. You buy it, charge the battery, put in a sim card and there you go. No activation no nothing. That's simply the way it should be. Oh and by the way: Call me crazy but I actually like the UI of WM. It always offers multiple ways to do something. And lots of possibilities to customize your device of course.

i recently traded in my touch pro2 for the sensation...i didn't give up on wm, but microsoft did...i loved that platform...so versatile yet so misunderstood...
this android platform ain't too shabby tho...it's not wm but not too shabby indeed...

my signature pic says it all.....