Database Users

Here's why I sold my Universal....or why i'm keeping it!

NOT ME!
I'm yet to get my universal, its on its way
Whats worse, it'll take another 15 days...as my sister is getting it from USA for me...and i'll have to wait till she makes it
I was just freaked out by the number of ppl selling away their devices, and thought i'd just start a thread where all of them give their reasons here...so that we'd know if it was the memory problem, or battery life, or bulkiness or whatever maybe the reason....and will help others making a decision to buy it!
Also, if you're one of those hanging on to the device from a while, and feel that this is "the" device to own, then tell us why!
Keep it nice and concise, bullet points as much as possible for easy reading
S

I'm keeping mine. The 'faults' are mostly little niggling things that can usually be gotten round by various hacks/tweaks people have made. And yeah it's a bit big, but you do get used to it
Positives:
- It's like having a little laptop.
- Connectivity wise it truly has it all - 3G, WI-FI, BT, video calling, SDIO, IRDA, etc. No other device has all of this.
- The WM5 OS makes it very easy to write programs/hacks for, so we will see a lot of these over the coming months.
- The VGA screen has a massive "wow" factor!
- Mini-USB connector and charger are very convenient indeed.
- Full-size headphone/speaker socket.
- Built in terminal services client is VERY useful!
- Awesome little keyboard with very good looking backlights.
- Persistant flash-based storage.
- Battery life is very good, lasts for many days on one charge.
- 4 (FOUR) speakers, and 2 (TWO) cameras! Flash is a nice gimmick too.
Basically for me, the huge amount of positives outweigh the small amount of negatives. Best "phone" I have ever owned.

dreamtheater39 said:
NOT ME!
I'm yet to get my universal, its own its way
Whats worse, it'll take another 15 days...as my sister is getting it from USA for me...and i'll have to wait till she makes it
I was just freaked out by the number of ppl selling away their devices, and thought i'd just start a thread where all of them give their reasons here...so that we'd know if it was the memory problem, or battery life, or bulkiness or whatever maybe the reason....and will help others making a decision to buy it!
Also, if you're one of those hanging on to the device from a while, and feel that this is "the" device to own, then tell us why!
Keep it nice and concise, bullet points as much as possible for easy reading
S
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
on a side note,
how much is your sister gettin it for for you from the US? did she have to sign a line?

vapor said:
dreamtheater39 said:
NOT ME!
I'm yet to get my universal, its own its way
Whats worse, it'll take another 15 days...as my sister is getting it from USA for me...and i'll have to wait till she makes it
I was just freaked out by the number of ppl selling away their devices, and thought i'd just start a thread where all of them give their reasons here...so that we'd know if it was the memory problem, or battery life, or bulkiness or whatever maybe the reason....and will help others making a decision to buy it!
Also, if you're one of those hanging on to the device from a while, and feel that this is "the" device to own, then tell us why!
Keep it nice and concise, bullet points as much as possible for easy reading
S
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
on a side note,
how much is your sister gettin it for for you from the US? did she have to sign a line?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bought it at Mad Monkey Boy's Gadgets for 930 USD [qtek 9000]...and 20 USD for shipping to her address...
That makes it a total of 950USD....in comparison to 1350 USD here in India!!!
San

@sl9, I can only manage one day of use from my Exec's battery. I have been very careful with it from new. My Nokia 9500 with similar use can give me twice the life of the Exec battery. With the Exec if you use BT and forget to shutdown PIE you could run out of battery while you think the unit is "off/standby".

dreamtheater39 said:
vapor said:
dreamtheater39 said:
NOT ME!
I'm yet to get my universal, its own its way
Whats worse, it'll take another 15 days...as my sister is getting it from USA for me...and i'll have to wait till she makes it
I was just freaked out by the number of ppl selling away their devices, and thought i'd just start a thread where all of them give their reasons here...so that we'd know if it was the memory problem, or battery life, or bulkiness or whatever maybe the reason....and will help others making a decision to buy it!
Also, if you're one of those hanging on to the device from a while, and feel that this is "the" device to own, then tell us why!
Keep it nice and concise, bullet points as much as possible for easy reading
S
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
on a side note,
how much is your sister gettin it for for you from the US? did she have to sign a line?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bought it at Mad Monkey Boy's Gadgets for 930 USD [qtek 9000]...and 20 USD for shipping to her address...
That makes it a total of 950USD....in comparison to 1350 USD here in India!!!
San
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
wow thats crazy man. but thanks for the heads up

I echo everything sl9 has said. The most important positives for me are:
- persistent storage
- WM5 means I never have to use my stylus, except for 3rd-party apps that haven't caught up yet
- full keyboard makes SMS a breeze
- some very useful touches in the software, like the easy switch on/off of BT and WiFi using just a couple of keyboard presses
- flexible and automatic speaker usage depending on the machine's orientation
- the way the thing feels in your hands (cool/cold, solid, 'tight'): it's nice to hold
- the VGA screen for browsing, Excel, calendar, contacts, ListPro and Today screen (I'm in proper VGA mode)
- battery lasts days for me, but I'm probably a lighter user than y'all and now (because most are awful on WM5) have no 3rd-party apps except PocketZenPhone, TomTom and ListPro (per day: 8 hrs Bluetooth, 1 hr phone, 10 SMS, 1 hr general use, 30 mins WiFi browsing)
- stability: Haven't done a reset in a week or so. I never force-close apps, but rely on WM5 to handle it. I have no idea how much program memory I have free, and I don't care: it just works
- Microsoft's contacts app is very good for keyboard-only use: makes dialling a contact easy
- there are some neat improvements in the UI, such as the way BT comes on automatically when you choose 'ActiveSync over Bluetooth', and headset mode is always on automatically if BT is on and the machine has found your headset to pair with
Negatives for me:
- WiFi reception is very poor
- OEM-supplied voice dial is poor. I hate having to record voice tags, and it's not 100% reliable with detection. This could be my HBH-65 headset though. Sometimes the voice dial prompt cuts in when I'm trying to answer a call on the headset :evil:
- Microsoft's calendar app is very very weak, as is PocketIE, and PocketOutlook for emails
- the phone app should scale to VGA properly and it should have a built-in T9 contact finder (the O2-supplied 'Smart Dialler' doesn't take advantage of the hardware keyboard, so is pointless)
- speaking of which, O2's bundled software is pointless and unhelpful
Umm....
- oh yeah: the cameras are still very weak and useful only for taking emergency pictures, such as recording car accidents that you have and newsworthy moments
- the camera flash is useless as a camera flash, but very good as a torch, if only the machine had an easy way of using this feature
- the hardware application buttons aren't as programmable or flexible as they could/should be. I wish we could program each button through the OS for both Press and Press-'n-Hold
Of course a big negative ATM is the lack of 3rd-party apps that are truly compatible with WM5, but this is hardly the fault of HTC or the mobile operators.
So, the hardware is excellent (with the exception of the cameras and WiFi reception) but the OS-bundled software is flawed. Hopefully we'll get ROM updates that will improve things, just like we did for earlier HTC machines.

jah said:
@sl9, I can only manage one day of use from my Exec's battery. I have been very careful with it from new. My Nokia 9500 with similar use can give me twice the life of the Exec battery. With the Exec if you use BT and forget to shutdown PIE you could run out of battery while you think the unit is "off/standby".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then I would say your battery may be faulty. Do you have wi-fi on?
With bluetooth on permenantly, my MDA PRO lasts for 3~ days on one charge. Without bluetooth, it lasts for 4-5 days.
I'm a fairly light user though, 1 short voice call a day on average, although I do open it up and turn on the screen about 10 times a day to check for reminders, text, notes etc.
Perhaps you are a much heavier user of it than I am? Even so, battery life on your device does seem unusually short

@sl9,
Without BT I get 3.5 hours of use with a combination of eBooks, PIM, email & web browsing (50% using 3G). With BT on that reduces to 3 hours. I use my Nokia in a similar was as a phone, ebook reader, PDA, etc. This is my second Universal as I had a JJ before the Exec and the JJ's battery life was a little worst. This level of use is not unusual for a business user who also travels a lot.

SiliconS said:
I echo everything sl9 has said. The most important positives for me are:
- persistent storage
- WM5 means I never have to use my stylus, except for 3rd-party apps that haven't caught up yet
- full keyboard makes SMS a breeze
- some very useful touches in the software, like the easy switch on/off of BT and WiFi using just a couple of keyboard presses
- flexible and automatic speaker usage depending on the machine's orientation
- the way the thing feels in your hands (cool/cold, solid, 'tight'): it's nice to hold
- the VGA screen for browsing, Excel, calendar, contacts, ListPro and Today screen (I'm in proper VGA mode)
- battery lasts days for me, but I'm probably a lighter user than y'all and now (because most are awful on WM5) have no 3rd-party apps except PocketZenPhone, TomTom and ListPro (per day: 8 hrs Bluetooth, 1 hr phone, 10 SMS, 1 hr general use, 30 mins WiFi browsing)
- stability: Haven't done a reset in a week or so. I never force-close apps, but rely on WM5 to handle it. I have no idea how much program memory I have free, and I don't care: it just works
- Microsoft's contacts app is very good for keyboard-only use: makes dialling a contact easy
- there are some neat improvements in the UI, such as the way BT comes on automatically when you choose 'ActiveSync over Bluetooth', and headset mode is always on automatically if BT is on and the machine has found your headset to pair with
Negatives for me:
- WiFi reception is very poor
- OEM-supplied voice dial is poor. I hate having to record voice tags, and it's not 100% reliable with detection. This could be my HBH-65 headset though. Sometimes the voice dial prompt cuts in when I'm trying to answer a call on the headset :evil:
- Microsoft's calendar app is very very weak, as is PocketIE, and PocketOutlook for emails
- the phone app should scale to VGA properly and it should have a built-in T9 contact finder (the O2-supplied 'Smart Dialler' doesn't take advantage of the hardware keyboard, so is pointless)
- speaking of which, O2's bundled software is pointless and unhelpful
Umm....
- oh yeah: the cameras are still very weak and useful only for taking emergency pictures, such as recording car accidents that you have and newsworthy moments
- the camera flash is useless as a camera flash, but very good as a torch, if only the machine had an easy way of using this feature
- the hardware application buttons aren't as programmable or flexible as they could/should be. I wish we could program each button through the OS for both Press and Press-'n-Hold
Of course a big negative ATM is the lack of 3rd-party apps that are truly compatible with WM5, but this is hardly the fault of HTC or the mobile operators.
So, the hardware is excellent (with the exception of the cameras and WiFi reception) but the OS-bundled software is flawed. Hopefully we'll get ROM updates that will improve things, just like we did for earlier HTC machines.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
woah! your negatives sure scares the daylights out of me!
- bad wifi reception??? what seems to be the problem???! for me, this is going to be really important!
- bad camera quality? how bad is it??? I saw a few pictures taken from the universal on a couple review sites, and they looked pretty good! am i missing something? (damn i didnt play around enough with the camera when i had the device with me the last week )
S

Well, the WiFi is hard to measure, but the range is nowhere near as good as my HP laptop. I struggle to get a signal on my Exec if I'm not within about 4 metres of my Access Point in my house. (Standard modern house, thin internal wooden walls.) I can use my laptop anywhere in the house (up to 10 metres away) and in the garden too, but no chance with the Universal. I need to move the Access Point.
As for the camera, I guess it's subjective, but I wouldn't rely on it for decent photos. It's OK for times when you just have to record an image but you're not needing to print it out. Here's a comparison between my Universal and a 4 year-old 2 MPixel Canon Ixus300. Both photos without flash, because the Universal's flash has no effect on photos when the subject is more than a metre from the lens. Both photos are at 640x480 and at the same compression level (filesize 38KB). Neither camera is at its native resolution, to make it a realistic comparison.
Edit: moved photos to a new thread
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=33960

Hmm. Not sure why they don't both appear as thumbnails. :roll:
Forgot to add: Universal was in 'Night' ambience mode.
Edit: Incidentally, when you take pictures at the Universal's native resolution (1280x1024) the quality is better, but the same problems are there: poor light sensitivity, poor light colouration, blurred focus, indistinct details etc.
It's better, but a long way from good.
And don't forget, the Canon camera is old now: 4 years. Just 2 MPixel - only twice that of the Universal.
Edit edit: Moved photos to a new thread so they don't break this one
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=33960

@SiliconS
thats a nice comparison shot! ( still wondering if you took them both with similar lighting conditions!!! )
i did read that the universal is fairly bad with "colors" as such....guess we have to live with it!
with the wifi range issue....gosh!! 4metres??? tell me your joking please!
S

dreamtheater39 said:
thats a nice comparison shot! ( still wondering if you took them both with similar lighting conditions!!! )
i did read that the universal is fairly bad with "colors" as such....guess we have to live with it!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same room. Same lighting. Photos just one minute apart.
It's not really much better than my XDA2. Just bigger resolution. Low-light shots are really not its strong point though. Only by comparison can you see how bad it really is.
dreamtheater39 said:
with the wifi range issue....gosh!! 4metres??? tell me your joking please!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry - I'm serious. Maybe others can confirm, or tell me that mine is worse than theirs. It's hard to measure objectively though.

You have to be kidding about the 4m WiFi range. I have the router placed in my bedroom and i can actually connect 2 rooms away which are in serial. Oh and there are 2 concrete walls in between.
I still get 2 bars inspite of all this. If you call this weak, then i dont know what to say.
Regarding the camera, its oodles better than the xda2 or the xda2s. It is also much better than the JAM, but then again these are not very good standards to compare to. Yes, it is not as good as Nokia or SE but if the camera is the reason one decides not to buy this device, then this device is clearly not for you.

Yeah, the camera sucks. Who cares? The rest of what's on the Uni - the critical stuff - works great. Quality in a cell phone camera is few years off ...

universaldoc said:
You have to be kidding about the 4m WiFi range. I have the router placed in my bedroom and i can actually connect 2 rooms away which are in serial. Oh and there are 2 concrete walls in between.
I still get 2 bars inspite of all this. If you call this weak, then i dont know what to say.
Regarding the camera, its oodles better than the xda2 or the xda2s. It is also much better than the JAM, but then again these are not very good standards to compare to. Yes, it is not as good as Nokia or SE but if the camera is the reason one decides not to buy this device, then this device is clearly not for you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hi universaldoc!
i currently have an xda2 running on wm5! So when i junk my device and buy a new one, i'd first of all see what are the pluses i get by making such a decision.....
heres what i can count -
1. Awesome keyboard (i really love it!)
2. VGA screen (finally!)
3. Built in Wifi
4. Better Camera
5. 3G support (currently useless to me....but its still good!)
6. The cool factor???
7. 10MB more device root space??
8. I'm running out of points!!!
Having said that....I still have bought my universal (but i'm waiting for it get here :evil: ) only because, i'm a god damned gadget freak and wouldnt mind trading away my spare kidney for one!
I'm just reconfirming my buy....the "reality hits" phase....you know???!!
San

I totally agree with all the positives already mentioned. As far as negatives are concerned, I have none. I love my O2 XDA Exec!
One point I'd like to mention though. My XDA Exec has GREAT WiFi. When I was setting-up my MSN Messenger, my Exec detected 4 different access points including my own. I happen to notice my neighbors' access point which I helped her setup included in the list. Now, she lives about 3 apartments down, so you can just imagine the lenght and obstacles my Exec has to traverse.

I don't have wi-fi yet though hoping to get it sorted in the next month or so. Though on the odd occasion I've switched the Exec's on, I've picked up stuff that must be about 30 - 40 metres away. I know for sure I picked up my cousin's network from around 20 metres outside his house the other week - and he lives in a converted barn with thick interior / exterior walls!
Regarding everyone else's positives and negatives, I agree with most. The camera is a LOT better, and is better than the 2.0MP one we had up to a few months ago. However, it's certainly not the main reason for buying a phone and certainly not in a feature-rich device such as the Exec. The pose factor alone is worth it, especially when sat in laptop mode in the car :wink:
It's 3G. It's an awesome looking bit of kit. One or two niggles in the software that will be ironed out. It's inspired 3 of my colleagues and bosses at work to get one. Less kit to carry around between home and work (no cradle, just a lead). VGA screen - which I STILL look at in awe sometimes. I didn't think I'd get to like landscape mode, but now I LOVE it.
Best XDA by far for me, and I've had most :wink:
Cheers
Ant

if else is positive, the main negative would be the response to incoming phone calls especially thru BT headset :evil: ... you would be lucky to take it from the 1st time ... usually it takes 2-3 sec which is more than enough for the caller to hang up :evil:
Believe it or not ... I use the Universal now only for data activities (e-mail, net, ...) and I have to carry my old i-mate for phone things ... nice scene ... huh ? :x
I can't wait to see a real update for the Radio ROM
ohh ... and a one hell missing feature ... a secondary LCD on the cover to avoid opening the screen just to see who's calling ... a very simple idea you find on almost all flapping mobile phones!!!!

My experience so far

I’m going to start this off by saying that this is not a review of the AT&T Tilt, the HTC Advantage, or the iPhone. These devices have been reviewed in depth already. This is more of a reflection on my use of the 3 devices mentioned. My primary phone is the AT&T Tilt, my wife uses the iPhone, and I bought a HTC Advantage 2 week ago.
I wanted to see if the Advantage would augment or even replace my laptop and Tilt, like a true convergence device. I mentioned the iPhone because my wife has one, and so I have access to the use of it along with the 2 other HTC devices.
All of the devices mentioned are box stock so to speak. They are locked to AT&T with the exception of the Advantage, which as you know can work on any GSM network, but for me it is used on AT&T’s network.
I was able to use all 3 while on a week’s Christmas vacation trip to Minnesota (I live in Jacksonville, FL.) to see my parents. I transitioned to the Advantage one week prior to leaving to get used to it. It worked as expected, sync’s to my laptop with Vista and Mobile Device Center no problem, as does my Tilt. Connected to AT&T’s network no problem. I was always able to get my e-mails and made and received calls on it, and Bluetooth worked flawlessly. I paired my Jawbone with no problems. The only software problem I encountered with it so far has been with Windows live services. It would fail to sync completely, signing out and then back in repeatedly. I have had zero lock ups and have not had to reset it yet. The GPS worked without a hitch and was able to use it with both Google maps and Live search to navigate. The only problem I can find to fault this device with is the size and weight, but I knew that when I got it. It is not designed to be carried around with you all day. I found myself leaving it in the car or on the desk and checking it throughout the day. I did carry it with me while walking around the Mall of America in Minneapolis. Throughout the whole trip I had excellent network coverage and the high speed 3g worked everywhere I was at. All and all the Advantage did everything it was advertised to do.
While at my parent’s house in Rochester, I also used my Tilt. Once again it worked as it has always been working. The only problem I have with my Tilt is it has a tendency to drop calls while using the Bluetooth headset (Jawbone). This has happened several times and I have read here on these forums that I am not alone with this problem.
To be honest, after using both devices I think the Advantage is at a slight disadvantage. Now, I realize they are meant for two entirely different types of users. I can do everything I need to do on the Tilt. The Advantage can do everything the Tilt can do, and has way more storage. The size, weight, and portability are just too much to work around for me. I must say though, that looking at that nice big VGA screen on the Advantage will spoil you.
I am more than happy with the performance of both devices, as well as the other HTC devices I have used in the past. (AT&T 8525)
Here’s the other point I wanted to make, and why I have mentioned the iPhone. I pay all my bills online, so I needed to be able to log on to my bank as well as other creditors to make payments. Of the 8 online bill paying websites I needed to access, I was only able to complete 3 of the tasks. The websites would not render correctly no matter what changes to the display I made. As a note I use a program called PIE+ by Rensoft, and it works great on my Tilt and the Advantage. I was able to log on and complete the other 5 transactions with the wife’s iPhone, in the Safari browser no problem what so ever. That’s the only thing I like about the iPhone, and it is not enough of a reason to switch to one, she likes that phone and it’s nice, but I prefer the functionality of windows mobile.
I would like to add that I am not a noob, nor am I an expert at using WM6; I learn new stuff about it every day on this site. I thought it might be interesting for someone to read about my experience with these 3 devices, and how they were used in my everyday life.
In conclusion, I would say that for me, the choice clear. I will stay with my Tilt, and possibly find a new home for the Advantage. I don’t know though, it’s like a guilty pleasure to use the Advantage.
One more thing I just thought of, maybe a HTC Shift is what I need.
Anyway thanks for reading.

My week with my advantage
It all started on christmas eve, i bought my advantage off someone on these forums, who got conned into buying an ameo with a blocked imei. Im 17 so i hardly ever call, and when i do its when im out with my K800i. It has been like this since i got my hermes in June. And texts work for me, so its a perfect buy, way cheaper then normal, and probably the best spec of a pda phone there is.
I got it out of the box, and i was actually surprised by the size. I thought it would be bigger, but its not really massive, seeing as i had a hermes. Its probably the same depth as a hermes, and width is about double the hermes, and height is id say about 1cm shorter then the hermes length. And, most importantly, it fits into my school blazer pocket perfectly, so no belt clip.
Straight away, i downloaded the latest athena project rom. I was surprised by the amount of apps cooked in, coming rom hermes where every rom is stripped bare, because of the half size rom.
I fired it up, played around a bit, but i found that even with double the ram, and more then 50% extra processing power, it was the same speed. But thinking about it, this is probably because it has to render double the number of pixels.
I downloaded google maps, tried to get a gps fix, and so far ive been able to get a fix in my house fdrom my bedroom window [5 satellites] and the living room window [3 satellites] i havent been able to when ive been in a car. I got tomtom for it, and the success has been the same. But quick gps does i think speed up getting a fix, but it may just be psychological.
The best app on the rom is id say real vga. The icon are massive on 192 dpi, and when i changed to 96 dpi, at first it was tiny, but now im used to it. Another massive plus is snapvue. The calendar is great and the viewing od new sms at the bottom is excellent. Then only thing wrong with it so far is that the clock never syncs fast. its always approx 10 secs after the normal clock. And, when i turn it on in the morning, it shows the time it was turned off at at night. And by turn off, i mean like screen off, not power down.
Yesterday, i had some trouble with it, when i turned the screen off, it wouldnt turn back on, i had to soft-reset. it did this twice in a row. but since then it hasnt done it.
That is the only problem so far [touch wood] that has caused a soft reset.
Wisbar advance desktop wouldnt work, but now i worked out that 96 dpi is just like qvga? lol. so my old hermes WA2 and WAD themes will work.
Thanks for reading, and i liked your "review" cib911.
x

cib911 - After getting a good case for my Athena (Tough-as-Nuts; it has the same quality as a good holster), I don't even notice its on my belt most of the time. I even have moments where I think I've lost it and reach down to make sure its still there. When I had some cheaper cases in the beginning it was a drag, literally. Especially one that had a swivel belt clip which held it so far from the belt it had leverage to twist the belt outward with each step. But the good case makes it an easy carry-everyday item now.

Hey cib911, I'm gonna assume you flew. Did you use the Advantage on the flight, around 3hours would be my guess. How was the battery life and what were you using it for? music? Movies? Work?
I've been considering one to add to my TyTn / Fujitsu p1510 stable.
thanks

cib911 said:
I’m going to start this off by saying that this is not a review of the AT&T Tilt, the HTC Advantage, or the iPhone. These devices have been reviewed in depth already. This is more of a reflection on my use of the 3 devices mentioned. My primary phone is the AT&T Tilt, my wife uses the iPhone, and I bought a HTC Advantage 2 week ago.
I wanted to see if the Advantage would augment or even replace my laptop and Tilt, like a true convergence device. I mentioned the iPhone because my wife has one, and so I have access to the use of it along with the 2 other HTC devices.
All of the devices mentioned are box stock so to speak. They are locked to AT&T with the exception of the Advantage, which as you know can work on any GSM network, but for me it is used on AT&T’s network.
I was able to use all 3 while on a week’s Christmas vacation trip to Minnesota (I live in Jacksonville, FL.) to see my parents. I transitioned to the Advantage one week prior to leaving to get used to it. It worked as expected, sync’s to my laptop with Vista and Mobile Device Center no problem, as does my Tilt. Connected to AT&T’s network no problem. I was always able to get my e-mails and made and received calls on it, and Bluetooth worked flawlessly. I paired my Jawbone with no problems. The only software problem I encountered with it so far has been with Windows live services. It would fail to sync completely, signing out and then back in repeatedly. I have had zero lock ups and have not had to reset it yet. The GPS worked without a hitch and was able to use it with both Google maps and Live search to navigate. The only problem I can find to fault this device with is the size and weight, but I knew that when I got it. It is not designed to be carried around with you all day. I found myself leaving it in the car or on the desk and checking it throughout the day. I did carry it with me while walking around the Mall of America in Minneapolis. Throughout the whole trip I had excellent network coverage and the high speed 3g worked everywhere I was at. All and all the Advantage did everything it was advertised to do.
While at my parent’s house in Rochester, I also used my Tilt. Once again it worked as it has always been working. The only problem I have with my Tilt is it has a tendency to drop calls while using the Bluetooth headset (Jawbone). This has happened several times and I have read here on these forums that I am not alone with this problem.
To be honest, after using both devices I think the Advantage is at a slight disadvantage. Now, I realize they are meant for two entirely different types of users. I can do everything I need to do on the Tilt. The Advantage can do everything the Tilt can do, and has way more storage. The size, weight, and portability are just too much to work around for me. I must say though, that looking at that nice big VGA screen on the Advantage will spoil you.
I am more than happy with the performance of both devices, as well as the other HTC devices I have used in the past. (AT&T 8525)
Here’s the other point I wanted to make, and why I have mentioned the iPhone. I pay all my bills online, so I needed to be able to log on to my bank as well as other creditors to make payments. Of the 8 online bill paying websites I needed to access, I was only able to complete 3 of the tasks. The websites would not render correctly no matter what changes to the display I made. As a note I use a program called PIE+ by Rensoft, and it works great on my Tilt and the Advantage. I was able to log on and complete the other 5 transactions with the wife’s iPhone, in the Safari browser no problem what so ever. That’s the only thing I like about the iPhone, and it is not enough of a reason to switch to one, she likes that phone and it’s nice, but I prefer the functionality of windows mobile.
I would like to add that I am not a noob, nor am I an expert at using WM6; I learn new stuff about it every day on this site. I thought it might be interesting for someone to read about my experience with these 3 devices, and how they were used in my everyday life.
In conclusion, I would say that for me, the choice clear. I will stay with my Tilt, and possibly find a new home for the Advantage. I don’t know though, it’s like a guilty pleasure to use the Advantage.
One more thing I just thought of, maybe a HTC Shift is what I need.
Anyway thanks for reading.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i would try opera. it works on all the sites i do online payments on. i would also try my rom. u'll be spoiled by it and with hardspl u can always return to stock if needed for warrenty.
what i would do is loose the keyboard like i did because of the teksoft fingertouch keyboard included in my rom and use the qwerty layout which is layout 1(ull see on the bottom left hand corner a red square with number. thats used to change layout).
without the keyboard the athena is now close to moto razr thin. but as wide as about 2 razrs side by side.
coming from a hermes i do not have a problem with the size. it fits into my jeans pockets and i love the power of the device. with my rom the device just flies. i can throw everything at it and do anything i want with it.

rorydaredkign said:
It all started on christmas eve, i bought my advantage off someone on these forums, who got conned into buying an ameo with a blocked imei. Im 17 so i hardly ever call, and when i do its when im out with my K800i. It has been like this since i got my hermes in June. And texts work for me, so its a perfect buy, way cheaper then normal, and probably the best spec of a pda phone there is.
I got it out of the box, and i was actually surprised by the size. I thought it would be bigger, but its not really massive, seeing as i had a hermes. Its probably the same depth as a hermes, and width is about double the hermes, and height is id say about 1cm shorter then the hermes length. And, most importantly, it fits into my school blazer pocket perfectly, so no belt clip.
Straight away, i downloaded the latest athena project rom. I was surprised by the amount of apps cooked in, coming rom hermes where every rom is stripped bare, because of the half size rom.
I fired it up, played around a bit, but i found that even with double the ram, and more then 50% extra processing power, it was the same speed. But thinking about it, this is probably because it has to render double the number of pixels.
I downloaded google maps, tried to get a gps fix, and so far ive been able to get a fix in my house fdrom my bedroom window [5 satellites] and the living room window [3 satellites] i havent been able to when ive been in a car. I got tomtom for it, and the success has been the same. But quick gps does i think speed up getting a fix, but it may just be psychological.
The best app on the rom is id say real vga. The icon are massive on 192 dpi, and when i changed to 96 dpi, at first it was tiny, but now im used to it. Another massive plus is snapvue. The calendar is great and the viewing od new sms at the bottom is excellent. Then only thing wrong with it so far is that the clock never syncs fast. its always approx 10 secs after the normal clock. And, when i turn it on in the morning, it shows the time it was turned off at at night. And by turn off, i mean like screen off, not power down.
Yesterday, i had some trouble with it, when i turned the screen off, it wouldnt turn back on, i had to soft-reset. it did this twice in a row. but since then it hasnt done it.
That is the only problem so far [touch wood] that has caused a soft reset.
Wisbar advance desktop wouldnt work, but now i worked out that 96 dpi is just like qvga? lol. so my old hermes WA2 and WAD themes will work.
Thanks for reading, and i liked your "review" cib911.
x
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
quick gps is ment to speed up the time for a lock so it isnt ur imagination. i am glad u love my rom and ur device. only comment i have is with the gps i actually get as good signal in my car as out of it.
i use the htc branded case and it sits in between the dashboard and front windshield of my car. it doesnt move around bc of the design of my car and the device with case. it is pretty much stuck in there and wont move no matter what i do with the car yet i can still remove it by hand from that spot.

Hey cib911, I'm gonna assume you flew. Did you use the Advantage on the flight, around 3hours would be my guess. How was the battery life and what were you using it for? music? Movies? Work?
I've been considering one to add to my TyTn / Fujitsu p1510 stable.
thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes I did use it on the flight. 1 hour to ATL. and 2 hours to MSP. The battery held up fine. I haven't put any music or movies on it yet, but played some games. I use it more for e-mail and as a lap top replacement.
i would try opera. it works on all the sites i do online payments on. i would also try my rom. u'll be spoiled by it and with hardspl u can always return to stock if needed for warrenty.
what i would do is loose the keyboard like i did because of the teksoft fingertouch keyboard included in my rom and use the qwerty layout which is layout 1(ull see on the bottom left hand corner a red square with number. thats used to change layout).
without the keyboard the athena is now close to moto razr thin. but as wide as about 2 razrs side by side.
coming from a hermes i do not have a problem with the size. it fits into my jeans pockets and i love the power of the device. with my rom the device just flies. i can throw everything at it and do anything i want with it.
Today 06:27 PM
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Glad you mentioned your ROM, I haven't had to courage to try it yet. Don't want to brick it, plus I'm still adding cabs and configuring it. I am thinking about flashing it now though.

cib911 said:
Glad you mentioned your ROM, I haven't had to courage to try it yet. Don't want to brick it, plus I'm still adding cabs and configuring it. I am thinking about flashing it now though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just do it, unlock with Olipro's unlocker (best do all 3 steps) then flash the ROM - you won't regret it and it's almost impossible to brick your device.

Confucious said:
Just do it, unlock with Olipro's unlocker (best do all 3 steps) then flash the ROM - you won't regret it and it's almost impossible to brick your device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
olipro is right: his ROM makes a world of difference to the usability of the athena. its a great device but in the end the size just got too much for me. there were also one or two disappointments for me. im an internet addict and found that neither opera nor pie did full enough job for me. i also thought video playback was less than acceptible, with lipsync gradually worsening throughout many films and general playback quality a bit hit and miss. it was possible to convert movies to a format that worked well but this was too much of a trial for me. perhaps i expected too much of the athena's raw power but try copying a video recorded on an N95 (330mhz ARM proocessor) onto the microdrive and playing it with tcpmp or coreplayer and you'll see that the athena was clearly never designed to play movies. this rendered the 8gb of storage a little redundant for me, and it remained pretty empty.
taking its relative spec into account i never thought the device showed itself any more nippy than the hermes. web pages for example rendered around the same speed on both devices, but i get the feeling that's a fault with windows mobile as a whole and not the athena.
overall i loved texting on the athena. there's something about the feel of it (minus the silly keyboard) that i grew fond of, and theres an abundance of really great apps out there, but in the end it never fulfilled my expectations and i felt obliged to sell it before its value depleted further.
if the size doesnt bother you and you're not too bothered about watching movies you'll definitely be sold when you try black touch though. its great, and no doubt it's helped HTC a lot as the stock ROMs are crap. without black touch i would have sold my athena months ago.

OK -- what can I really use if for?

Please don't get me wrong -- I think the Shift represents a great advancement in UMPC technology. Having WM6 and WinVista (or WinXP) combined on 1 device is, IMHO, a super idea. And the form factor and build quality are very good. I'm impressed and, as Jenn at Pocketables pointed out, it's fun to use -- kind of grabs you. But unlike Jenn, I'm not ready to say I'll not part with it. I've liberated WM6 so I have as full a use of the WM6 side as I believe is so far available. I've got Vista humming, at least as much as the 1G RAM can live with. But if this is as far as I can go I don't see much more than another "gadget" to add to my collection. The 1G RAM limit is a show stopper -- slows the machine down and really limits what I can do in Vista. The 64MB limit in WM6, combined with inability to access the SD card slot (or even the USB slot) means my WM6 is crippled -- hardly any of what I'm accustomed to using can be routinely done. Throw in the 2 hr battery limitation in Vista -- it just isn't a very good "solution" for a road warrior.
I realize there are folks hard at work to improve on these and I commend them (and have contributed to the Shift Project) -- I really hope they succeed. But I have to say that what I'm looking at from HTC is, at best, a "beta" version -- they have so limited what's inside the box that it's hardly useful for anything. Considering the growing competition I doubt HTC will hold much share of this market.

agree
Huib

Interesting comments and many agree with. Given the amount of information available on the net about this device, and its limitations including SnapVue, battery etc etc, what motivated you to buy it? It seems to be a mismatch to me re. your requirements. I bought it even knowing all these things as it matched my needs.
A road warrior it is not. A media powerhouse it is not. A tiny portable always on email and document viewer/editor, plus web browser it is. I get 2.5hrs on Vista browsing the web - same as almost every other laptop I've ever owned, so I'm not surprised really...altho again, Vista leaves much to be desired in this respect - a spinning hard drive kills batteries.
I agree with you regarding the things they didn't get right - SnapVue is just silly right out of the box and Vista is a mistake. HTC really fvcked up there.
This device kind of reminds me of the Sony C1V picturebook I had (with that horrible Crusoe processor - if you think this chip is slow, that thing was lifeless)...awesome for what I wanted but that's where it stops...it doesn't extend beyond that and I'm comfy with that.
To answer the question, I use my Shift when I travel. I used to take my HX4700 but bluetooth 3G connection was slow, Opera was slow for browsing and the screen too small really. I had a b/tooth key board which was OK but another piece of kit that needed batteries and sync'ing etc etc. Now I carry a v. small bag with me when away and it holds the Shift, power packs, Archos 504, headphones and a few other bits and bobs...all I need. On planes I can type my reports in Mobile Word, sync it to Vista and tart them up and send. In hotels I can surf the web at my own pace on HSDPA with it plugged in to AC (on high performance setting). I can adjust my webpage using filezilla etc etc....basically all the things I couldn't do on the HX4700 (which I now use as a support device for the Archos, and as a GPS)....the Shift really filled my requirements. I almost bought the Fujitsu U1010 but the ones here didn't have 3G built in and the keyboard was harder to use that the Shift.
Next version, should HTC shift (no pun intended) enough of these first ones, should ideally have:
1. Higher res screen
2. Bigger hard disk
3. SnapVue fully functional with SD card, WiFi access etc etc
4. XP as an option
5. A battery compartment that allows for an extended one to be added
Aside from that, I still like my Shift and use it almost everyday...

FOOFTR said:
Interesting comments and many agree with. Given the amount of information available on the net about this device, and its limitations including SnapVue, battery etc etc, what motivated you to buy it? It seems to be a mismatch to me re. your requirements. I bought it even knowing all these things as it matched my needs.
A road warrior it is not. A media powerhouse it is not. A tiny portable always on email and document viewer/editor, plus web browser it is. I get 2.5hrs on Vista browsing the web - same as almost every other laptop I've ever owned, so I'm not surprised really...altho again, Vista leaves much to be desired in this respect - a spinning hard drive kills batteries.
I agree with you regarding the things they didn't get right - SnapVue is just silly right out of the box and Vista is a mistake. HTC really fvcked up there.
This device kind of reminds me of the Sony C1V picturebook I had (with that horrible Crusoe processor - if you think this chip is slow, that thing was lifeless)...awesome for what I wanted but that's where it stops...it doesn't extend beyond that and I'm comfy with that.
To answer the question, I use my Shift when I travel. I used to take my HX4700 but bluetooth 3G connection was slow, Opera was slow for browsing and the screen too small really. I had a b/tooth key board which was OK but another piece of kit that needed batteries and sync'ing etc etc. Now I carry a v. small bag with me when away and it holds the Shift, power packs, Archos 504, headphones and a few other bits and bobs...all I need. On planes I can type my reports in Mobile Word, sync it to Vista and tart them up and send. In hotels I can surf the web at my own pace on HSDPA with it plugged in to AC (on high performance setting). I can adjust my webpage using filezilla etc etc....basically all the things I couldn't do on the HX4700 (which I now use as a support device for the Archos, and as a GPS)....the Shift really filled my requirements. I almost bought the Fujitsu U1010 but the ones here didn't have 3G built in and the keyboard was harder to use that the Shift.
Next version, should HTC shift (no pun intended) enough of these first ones, should ideally have:
1. Higher res screen
2. Bigger hard disk
3. SnapVue fully functional with SD card, WiFi access etc etc
4. XP as an option
5. A battery compartment that allows for an extended one to be added
Aside from that, I still like my Shift and use it almost everyday...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i agree and htc should also use SSD's to save more power and they should make sure they announce the correct specs.

FOOFTR said:
Interesting comments and many agree with. Given the amount of information available on the net about this device, and its limitations including SnapVue, battery etc etc, what motivated you to buy it? It seems to be a mismatch to me re. your requirements. I bought it even knowing all these things as it matched my needs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Point well taken -- I should have added that my comments were stated with the proverbial tongue in cheek. I was well aware of the Shift's limitations and purchased one out of curiosity -- I've followed it since its initial announcement and had cancelled my preorder after seeing the limitations being documented. But I saw this one on ebay for several hundred $ less than retail and decided to look at it for myself.
I agree with the suggestions made and really hope HTC listens (if they decide to stay in the UMPC market -- that's not a "for sure" thing). I've tried five different UMPC's as well as the Sony TZ "subnotebook" and have yet to find what I think I'm after -- a truly business capable device small enough for my purposes (and that's really subjective, I know) yet powerful enough to replace my usual notebook (13.3" XPS). I knew the Shift wouldn't do this -- its very short battery life is a show stopper although I could carry an external battery pack. But the limited RAM and the very limited usefulness of SnapVu make it relatively useless to me so I'll end up ebaying it.
I'd hoped to generate more discussion in the hope that collective experience and wisdom would prove useful to the UMPC market.

There are some very interesting viewpoints here.
I purchased mine after following the news stories for months. I purchased it the moment it was available in the UK and paid nearly £900.
I knew the limitations, but had to buy one of these! It gets used a lot in our house. And I am always doing things to it. It's leberated and its dual boot with XP.
I use it to tinker with, watch movies and surfing. The wife loves it too and surfs on the sofa while watching the tele, she prefers it to any of the laptop we have because of the size. My daughter took it away for the weekend recently too so she could surf. Its such a versitile device. And most of all, PEOPLE STARE AT IT ON THE TRAIN/PLANE WHEN I'M ON BUSINESS!!! I don't really use the liberated Snapvue, I don't need to when its dual boot.
If I had a wish list, I would love to see an SSD in it and another 1GB RAM. The processor is fine for what I use it for, so I have no grumbles there.
My eldest daughter wants it for school, so it'll be used for that full time in September when she is a year 10.
I do understand that to some people its limited in its application, but for us as a family, its one of the better toys we've purchased (and we buy a lot of techy toys/gadgets!) The joys of working in IT means I am addicted to buying new toys!
I'm actually sat here in the garden using HSDPA typing this. Apart from a couple of phones, I don't have another device with this ability. why be inside when its such a sunny evening!

benktlottie said:
TIt's liberated and its dual boot with XP...... I don't really use the liberated Snapvue, I don't need to when its dual boot.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What do you mean by "dual boot"? I have mine liberated but I'm not sure it dual boots?
Thanks!

brucewilsonpa said:
What do you mean by "dual boot"? I have mine liberated but I'm not sure it dual boots?
Thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same here, I have dual boot, as in when powered up it asks whether you want to boot Vista or XP. Next stop, triple boot with Linux installed too, although that will be cutting it a bit fine for hard drive space.

Bruce, I think your comments, and the general community's will help deliver better products...I think they're constructive for sure.
I don't like it when people say product X sucks when indeed product X is not designed to do the very things they are comparing it against. I have read so many appalling reviews of the Shift - I'm ceratin 50% of the people won't have even used one...a classic is when someone said "the poky keyboard makes you wish for full size keyboard real estate..." - um, one cannot have a 7" screen device with an 18" keyboard...get real and take the device in the context it is meant for - maybe that's it, they cannot get their head around indeed what context this device resides/exists in. Maybe because they do not have a need for such a device it must be a failure? I mean, I don't need a concrete mixer so reviewing one would be pointless, and I'd end up saying things like "it doesn't sound as nice as my NAD stereo" - maybe they're the same.
Ah Pantaloonie, was loading XP as easy as booting from an XP disc/ISO (tablet I assume)? Thanks...

FOOFTR said:
Ah Pantaloonie, was loading XP as easy as booting from an XP disc/ISO (tablet I assume)? Thanks...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yup, almost that easy. Use Vista to partition off a few Gigs for XP, install XP, then use a Vista disc to repair the mbr so you can get back into Vista.
Then use VistaBootPro to create a boot menu.
I didn't use tablet edition at the time, and can't be bothered to go back and do it again; maybe next time I'm really bored I will.

FOOFTR said:
Maybe because they do not have a need for such a device it must be a failure? I mean, I don't need a concrete mixer so reviewing one would be pointless, and I'd end up saying things like "it doesn't sound as nice as my NAD stereo" - maybe they're the same.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi FOOFTR,
yes, I like your comparison. Made me laugh. And I think what you say is right in all sorts of contexts. You make up something that wasn't said or done in the first place and then you go on bashing it.
Thanks!
S.

Pantaloonie said:
Yup, almost that easy. Use Vista to partition off a few Gigs for XP, install XP, then use a Vista disc to repair the mbr so you can get back into Vista.
Then use VistaBootPro to create a boot menu.
I didn't use tablet edition at the time, and can't be bothered to go back and do it again; maybe next time I'm really bored I will.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thats what I did.
I Used BartPE to make a bootable usb stick with xp pro on it. stole 6gb from Vista and installed xp pro. Viola, dual boot Shift!

Sold it after 8 months - now got 3GS Iphone

Hi
I thought i would post this as i've been thinking about moving to an iphone for ages, but have used this forum as my source of info as never quite been convinced
I run a .net software house, so i get involved in sales, development, networking, servers etc
So for me the windows mobile seemed perfect as i thought i could use the mob for emergencies with remote desktop etc
However, i was annoyed with some stuff on it mainly due to lag, slow speeds, and especially web browsing (page rendering).
I tried cooked roms, and was running lots of dutties (3.9 was the last)
The other day a friend of mine who runs a hardware IT company upgraded from windows mobile to the normal iphone (non 3gs) and started raving about it.
I trust what this guy says so i started to seriously consider it
I then did my research here, and was put off by the iphone because everyone was SO against it, i thought "these guys are hardcore users like me, so they must have done their homework"
....so i decided not to switch
I then wondered into an o2 shop when the 3gs was released, and played with it for about 30 mins.
I went home, put my phone on ebay, and a week later its gone and i have the new 3gs sitting in front of me.
firstly i'll list the bad points
1) battery isn't as good as touch HD, but it'll last you a day with some heavy use (still testing this bit though)
2) sat nav seemed a bit thin on the ground, but i'm using SYGIC which has full postcode and voice navigation which works ok, not quite tom tom but tom tom is due to be released soon.
3) the keyboard is actually really good, and i was very supprised, but the normal T9 style keyboard doesn't exist natively (theres an app for that - probably)
4) app store is flooded with a load of pointless applications which make a noise when you touch the screen (whoopdee fecking doo!)
5) you cant customise the home screen appart from icons, BUT, i find it very functional, as icons have notifications on them.
6) you have to go through i tunes to do everything, but there is software around to get away from that (yet to test it)
So these are the bad points, but the good points FAR out way these.
The user experience is amazing, very snappy, loading apps are very much bang bang bang and done.
Screen roatation is pretty instant
web browsing on wifi is like on a pc, downloads and renders very quickly
on 3g its still very quick, renders fast but data transmission just a little slower
the touch HD doesn't even come close.
EVERYTHING is so much quicker, and better, the camera may only be 3MP but who cares, because as least you can take pictures, and not be left waiting 2 mins everytime you want to boot up the camera etc.
I'm not a "FAN BOY" i'm a serious business user
My only regret is that i didn't upgrade sooner
All you die hard Win mob fans here..... seriously dont comment on stuff you know nothing about, i bet most of you have never used a iphone for long enough to give it a fair test.
this thread isn't a win mob VS iphone os.
its for those sitting people sitting on the fence thinking shall i get one???
my advice is YES, but, play with one for a few hours first.
Loads of people on here have converted, and told me i wouldn't look back, and i thought they were just little kids, but i now now what they mean
so there you have it, advice from a 31 year old professional, and not a 16 year old kid who uses it to play tetris
p.s. mine is jail broken, and unlocked and running on orange.
CUE flamming
disclaimer: this is just my opinion, and i've only owned the device for a few days, sorry if i offended anyone.

Congratulations on your purchase!
Thread closed!

Handled The Beast Today

My persistent knocking on the doors of mobile phone providers within a 30 mile radius from my home finally paid off today when I finally managed to get my hands on a HD2 (hoorah).
I have always said that there is no way on earth I would spend over £500 ona sim free device without first seeing one in the metal and testing it out. No one in their right mind buys a house or car without first seeing it and, if appropriate, testing it out before buying.
First Impressions:
Even though I had seen a dummy earlier, the size of the screen does come as a bit of a surprise. However this is a very thin device which makes the whole thing just about manageable. It is not quite as in-your-face, size-wise, as, say, the Toshiba TG01. Be aware though that there is absolutely a shedload of real screen estate to play with on the HD2.
Build quality looked very good. The back plate looks like a well machined item. I tweaked the keys around a little but did not experience the "wobble" that others have talked about.
The screen is a fingerprint magnet of the first order; however it is nothing a quick blow of hot, moist breath and a clean handkerchief can't cure very quickly. Maybe an appropriate screen protector might be helpful; however I cannot confirm.
Something else that was immediately apparent was just how fast the device is. Apps opened near instantaneously and the device was simply a joy to use.
The camera was rather interesting: as a brand new device, straight out of the box and booted up for the first time, the camera screen started up with a pink hue across the whole of the screen. I immediately thought of the pink issue that a lot of people have spoken about. However after about a minute the camera settled down and the pinkish hue cleared up.
The guy from o2 said that he had seen this start-up effect on all of the cameras he had seen/used/demonstrated/sold to date so I am assuming that this is "feature" of the device.
All the shots I took (indoors in artificial light) came out just fine and the quality, to my eyes, was good as far as camera's on mobile phones go.
I did not find the lack of a hardware camera button a problem. The fact is I actually preferred the on-screen shutter button; seemed pretty cool and effective.
The Keyboard:
I opened up MS Word and moved onto the dreaded keyboard.
Within a couple of seconds I could clearly see why some of you have given up on this device and sent it back. The keyboard out of the box is awful and stringing 2 words together was a real pain. However switch off the T9 function and the keyboard is transformed into something very very useful.
Yes, you have to be quite accurate with your fingers. I found I got the best results using my fingertips pointing near vertically downwards rather than horizontal and flat. The former method presents a narrow minimal area of the finger to the keyboard, resulting in reasonable/acceptable accuracy, while the latter method simply created problems, pulling in adjacent letters to the ones I wanted to use on nearly every occasion.
The key here is that, given I had no more than a half hour with the device, I found that I made no more mistakes with this keyboard, at no greater frequency, than I do now with my resistive keyboard on my TYTN, which I have had for over 3 years.
I did not get a chance to test the voice, email or sms functions as I did not have the time. Therefore I am unable to verify whether the problems others have mentioned were present in the device I tested or not.
Availability:
It is difficult to work out what the strategy is with the supply of this device. The 3 o2 shops I went into had only received 2 devices each! 2 out of the 3 shops had sold them on within a day and the 3rd, where I did my test, had 1 left.
None of the shops could confirm for certain when their next supplies would be in or how many handsets they would get. Each one suggested contacting them on a regular basis to see what the position is.
For me, given that this is a device in demand at probably the most advantageous marketing point in the year, i.e. the run up to Christmas, I cannot understand why there is so much uncertainty around the supply chain.
What Next?:
Now that I have finally laid my hands on the device, the key question I had to address was this; given all the horror stories on here about various problems, etc, was it sensible for me to become another early adopter given that this device will be used for business purposes where reliability is essential.
The decision I have made is, given the work currently being undertaken by C'monex and others coupled with custom roms already in the pipeline, plus the hints and tips thread in this forum, on balance I think it is just about worth the risk me jumping in and purchasing a device.
I was at this point 3 years ago when I first purchased my TyTN. To this day I consider it an absolute miracle that the device did not end its days under a hammer within the first week of ownership, so appallingly awful was that device straight out of the box.
Over time, and with a lot of people doing sterling work on here, things turned around to the point where I have a device that is rock solid stable, reliable and good to use.
I would strongly suggest that if anyone is considering buying this device, they find a live model to play with first before making their minds up. I can see why the keyboard could be a real deal breaker although I intend to purchase a capacitive stylus to get around some of the problems I foresee with non-finger friendly winmobile applications.
Conclusion:
This device looks very promising and yes, it does have issues, based on the reports we have seen here on XDA. You need to play with one first before making a decision to buy.
The keyboard is very different to a resistive one and requires patience, perseverance and good technique to get the best out of it.
I did not have enough time to have an exhaustive, comprehensive play with the device; however I have seen enough to determine that, on balance, and based on emerging developments here on XDA, I could live with it. Besides my current device is now long in the tooth and needs replacing.
The only fear I have is that once I have paid out my hard earned cash for this device, HTC bring out an Android HD2-like device using the snapdragon processor, which is really what I would prefer.
My order for a HD2 plus a HTC Hero goes in next week, depending on stock availability in the UK.
I hope this quick walk through is helpful to those who are trying to make a decision on this device, one way or another.
WB

Thanks WB for this excellent overview - certainly more down to earth and focused than most reviewers who don't know what to expect in HTC phones.
I too had a similar experience to your TYTN when I purchased my Polaris. Mine nearly took a high dive from the 30th floor of an office block when I got it. However in February this year, I installed epimazzo's KhanX ROM and didn't touch it again given how stable and usable everything was.
I've been watching the Leo forum closely for the past two weeks and I can see some of the top cookers hovering and waiting to pounce (oh, Hard SPL, wherefore art thou?). This device has so much potential and is so exciting that I purchased mine sight unseen.
The bugs and wrinkles are...ahem...par for the course if you buy a HTC phone these days. To my mind, there is nothing that appears insurmountable to the ROM chefs (respect). As I said, the phone has monstrous potential - seems like a solid GPS implementation plus the accelerometer, compass and proximity sensor. Bingo!
I had the option of going for any of the Samsung Omnia II, the Acer F1 and the Toshi phones. But none of those has the depth of support found here on xda (only iPhone comes close in community support). HTC owes many people on this forum in a big way - without it, probably you and I would have sh_tcanned HTC years ago...
And for someone who is always fiddling with my phone every day, the possibility of squeezing performance out of this thing is half the fun. May not suit those who need a perfect phone OOTB (like the iPhone for example).
He says confidently before he hits the SMS lag problem...

Update
Well, since I wrote the short review above and read XDA LEO forums end-to-end so my initial thoughts on jumping in and buying the device faded a little. Part of the problem was the sheer volume of negative noise coming from a number of people on these forums plus the fact that I have been here before with the Tytn, taking a year before I had a device I could both trust and like.
Those painful memories made me think long and hard about jumping in and doing the deed. What I needed to do was to get a sense of perspective and balance which was proving difficult to find on XDA. Also being able to lay hands on a device at will to play with was proving very difficult as the limited stocks becoming available were flying off the shelves as fast as they were coming in. This was at odds with all the negativity I was picking up here.
Now don't get me wrong, I am not knocking people. Those that were brave enough to post their honest views about the device, albeit negative ones, did me a huge favour, despite the fact that most of them faced massive hostility from the masses. What this meant for me was that instead of going into any decision rosy eyed I knew that if I bought into the HD2 world there would be problems to overcome, over and above the usual tweaks that one does because its windows, don't you know?!
Some sense of balance was found via the following polls, which I found to be invaluable:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=598900&highlight=polls (severity of grid display)
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=595655&highlight=poll (weird touch-screen behaviour)
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=591011&highlight=poll (earpiece and voice quality)
http://forum.xda-developers.com/poll.php?do=showresults&pollid=2075 (HD2 speaker quality)
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=592375&highlight=poll (in search of balance).
So, approaching the festive season with the family nagging me to tell them what I wanted for Xmas, I rang a supplier, talked through all the known issues with them, which they were aware of. However the rate of returns on HD2's to them was so small as to be infinitesimal which meant one of 2 things:
- People were buying the device and either liking it or could live with it or
- The supplier wasn't telling me the truth (highly unlikely as I have been using them for a while now).
They were happy enough to agree to take the device back and return my funds if I did not like it either under the 7 day distance selling rules in the UK or by me ringing them up and indicating my preference.
Went back to the family, gave them the news and......a brand new HD2 landed in my sack on Xmas day via Santa Claus. What an amazing guy he is! Someone should offer to have his children for him.
Broke the box open last night, ie Xmas night and despite my anticipation, took time out to charge it up properly. Time spent now conditioning the battery correctly equals solid battery performance later down the line.
Tackled the beast in anger today. It is true to say that in the metal, this is a beautiful piece of engineering. Build quality on my version at least is excellent with none of the wobbly keys and ill fitting screen problems reported by others being noticable.
Went through setting up the device as I want it (yes, its been a long day and I have stopped now), made a complete backup immediately as my master backup, then installed tips no 8, 44, 46, 58 from the hints and tips thread and made another backup, separate from the original. This way if anything goes wrong I can simply roll back to the last successful change.
Points Worth Commenting On:
Keyboard:
The keyboard needs a degree of accuracy to use it successfully. I did not find the sensitivity out of the box an issue at all. Where I had to be absolutely accurate was in keying in my sim unlock code into the phone. Got that wrong too many times but practice will make perfect.
An even greater level of accuracy is required when trying to put ticks into selection boxes, e.g when installing Memmaid. This can prove frustrating as can the process of copying and pasting. I am sure that the capacitive stylus coming out of HTC will help with this "problem".
For me the keyboard works best without T9 switched on. However for sheer speed the Swype keyboard which I have installed is the way to go. Another version of this board (SlideIt) is readily available and I will be moving to that asap as Swype is NOT free-ware nor, as I have just found out, not officially released yet for the windows platform.
Weather Animations:
The weather animations are very good, just the sort of thing a chap needs to gain bragging rights down at the local pub. I have already seen most of the animations today due to the readily changing weather conditions we have had where we live.
Back Cover:
There is a serious but amusing thread on here where someone could not get their back cover off. Having already been through that thread I was not looking forward to my experience. However I can report that as long as you follow the instructions in the guide the cover is pretty easy to take off and put back on.
Overall First Impressions:
There is a hell of a lot to like about the HD2. There are things that I felt needed to change to suit me better. I have altered SMS to show in traditional mode rather than conversation mode as this works best for me.
Twitter and Facebook are of no use to me so these have not been configured.
I have yet to work out how to get the built-in picture viewer to pick up and show my pictures on the external SD card and there are a whole host of other things I have yet to get done. However day 1 has gone very very well indeed.
I will add to this post as I get to know the device a little better. In the meantime I am off to read the full manual to pick up on what else I need to know.
WB
PS: For those interested I am running Rom 1.48 straight out of the box. Not bothered with the SMS fix as I have not had any issues with SMS sending and receiving so far.
I am being meticulous about killing off apps not required but running in the background via the task manager. Also been straight onto the notification queue lock-up problem by installing Memmaid to sort that out.
Need to find a way of making sure that the X button really does kill off these open apps to save valuable memory space.
PPS: Really annoying niggle is after 10 goes I have not been able to put on the HTC screen protector properly. No matter how hard I try, even using a large cardboard piece to smooth it out, I can't get all the air bubbles out. I really want to use the protector but as it stands, I might have to take the risk and ditch it unless someone can pass on a full-proof method for putting the damned thing on properly.
I have never ever had this problem before in all the years I have had of devices that needed their screens protecting.
More updates soon.
WB

Regarding keyboard I recommend to use Swype or Finger Keyboard.

its a support forum 99% of posts here will be problems

wacky.banana said:
The only fear I have is that once I have paid out my hard earned cash for this device, HTC bring out an Android HD2-like device using the snapdragon processor, which is really what I would prefer.
My order for a HD2 plus a HTC Hero goes in next week, depending on stock availability in the UK.
I hope this quick walk through is helpful to those who are trying to make a decision on this device, one way or another.
WB
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Honestly I'd recommend waiting for the Xperia X10 if you want an android device. The HD2 in its current state is not something I'd want to use for everyday business use; it has still got some minor problems that needs addressing.

Toss3 said:
Honestly I'd recommend waiting for the Xperia X10 if you want an android device. The HD2 in its current state is not something I'd want to use for everyday business use; it has still got some minor problems that needs addressing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
have they sorted the speed of the x10 out yet, last videos i saw it was terrible

sharpey said:
have they sorted the speed of the x10 out yet, last videos i saw it was terrible
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's still in its beta stages so the software is bound to get faster once they've sorted out the minor bugs. I really doubt Sony would release it in its current state, but considering HTC released a device without proper texting support and awful call quality I can't say I'd be surprised.

Next year HTC brings out the HTC Bravo, it's an Android Phone (V. 2.0) with the snapdragon 1GHz and total similar to the HD2 instead of the 3,7" AMOLED (more than 16 mio colors) display .
I think it's the same as the hd2 just the android version of it
regards
HTC BRAVO: http://www.engadget.com/2009/12/08/htc-bravo-pictured-more-lucidly/

sharpey said:
its a support forum 99% of posts here will be problems
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
@ sharpey,
Hey fella, merry Xmas to you. If you have been on here as long as I have you would know that XDA is not a support forum but a Developers forum, hence the name XDA-Developers. The conversation and posts used to be about cooked roms, hacking, development of tools and utilities, etc and pushing the technical envelope, NOT coping with people who won't or can't RTFM (read the manual).
It's only in recent times that new users have attempted to change the format and shape of the forum and it has now become, in part, a support forum because people like me like to help other people. Only problem is the noise generated by this process tends to obscure the real nuggets of good information one is looking for before investing in a device like this, e.g, SPL availability and associated development, availability of cooked roms, flexibility of the device from a hacking perspective, and so on. This is what I meant when I said I was looking for a balanced view on here but found it difficult to find what I was looking for although the polls I have linked to also provided useful info.
@ all others,
This thread is just a running update of the journey I went through until I got a HD2. I know there are a lot of people out there who are holding back on buying one as they are confused by how much information/misinformation there is out there on the HD2. All I am doing is sharing my experience in the hope that it helps someone.
Right now the device is 2 days old and I am Just loving it. :. Yes, there are some minor annoyances like the lack of a sent indicator when sms messages are sent; however I trust the device and if I want to be sure I simply look in my sent box to confirm the message is gone.
If you are considering buying a HD2, read this thread plus all the links, read the independent 3rd party reviews then go play with one in the metal, and, if you are happy, go buy one and ENJOY!!
WB