Related
an iPod Touch/iPhone can play 3d games, utilise the g-sensor and run smoothly - for example racing games. Tilt the iPhone, the car turns.
Why can't our phones run these sort of games? Or is it just the case they haven't yet been produced?
From what I'm aware a Diamond is more powerful than an iPhone therefore these games "shouldn't" be a problem?
Shoot me down in flames if I'm wrong, just kinda thought there should be iPhone-esque software for these phones now.
I am right with you, i keep thinking the same thing.
Because Apple has crazy fanboys and they provided a simple infrastructure to facilitate payment and downloading (appstore). They also gimped the iphone out of the box so as to pretty much require people to sign up for the appstore if they actually want to use it, ensuring that they have the user base they need for it.
Now the iphone has several million users - how many Diamonds do you think are sold? Windows mobile itself is bigger, but the capabilities of the phones running it vary too much that profiting from making advanced games is as feasible.
I have wondered about this as well. I think the problem is 3 fold
Firstly, the Diamond has 3d and graphics performance issues for sure. Sometimes my Diamond will slow down terribly when running some simple animations. I have read that HTC are notorious for providing poor graphics drivers and this could be part of the reason.
Secondly, I actually dont think Windows Mobile is capable of doing what the iPhone UI is capable of in terms of interactive gaming.
Thirdly, Apple provide your at home developers a great business model to go out and develop great games and apps for the phone. Plus with the Appstore they know that if they develop something good, people will see it - there is only one place to get apps from - and the developer will make money.
For me, the iPhone is not the right phone, but I would love Windows Mobile and HTC to be able to do what the iPhone and Apple can do.
The iPhone has v-sync, so the 3d graphics are drawn smoothly with no tearing and sadly win mo just does not. At least that is what my mate said who is a games developer. The power is there but you just can't get it to the wheels! This just makes it fundamentally unappealing to a lot of developers.
yeah totally agree, i love the diamond, but i've been using windows mobile for years now, and each new model HAS generally got better and better. however the iPhone is just something else.. for people who aren't nerds and into mucking around iwth their phone etc, i could never recommend a windows mobile over an iPhone. its just so much more polished compared to the diamond.
i'm an AMD fan too, godamnit why do i always have to back the underdog
Yes, even though i have a diamond and have had great fun tweaking it, i still can't help but envy the iPhone users for their graphically superior games and video playback prowess .
Another explanation would be that iPhone games are developed solely for... u guessed it, iPhones! ...whereas WinMo games have to be developed to run across many different devices, with (or lack of) accelerometers, touch screens etc. Therefore, to achieve this interoperability / compatibility across the many different devices, compromises have to be made.
That said, there are still gd games for our beloved devices, my favourite being PDAMill, whom develop aesthetically pleasing games with intuitive controls, and they're cheap too.
Nudge.
So all in all, will it become possible? And what's vsync? Portable to diamonds?
I think V sync is something to do with the way images are drawn to the screen, and it is just not implemented in win mo, I don't know if it could be written into the drivers or of it is a hardware thing, but then I don't actually have a clue what I'm talking about! Can anyone confirm this?
vsync actually makes bad performance even worse since it forces the back buffer to wait until right after a screen refresh before it copies its data to the frame buffer.
it's great if the device is capable of rendering an FPS that is higher than the refresh rate, but in the diamond case it's just another fps thief
if you want games like iphone get an ipod touch. The diamond never advertised gaming as a capability. Think of it this way: The iphone is like a mac with mediocre hardware but also comes with a mid range video card. The diamond/touch pro are like PC's with raging motherboard/cpu/ram combo, but bottom entry level video card. You can get a lot done with the PC, but the fun factor lies in the mac.
Go buy virtual pool mobile, it runs great and it's very fun. Its the best pool video game ive ever seen actually.
Simple reason
The reason to me is simple: Apple cares about user experience. Just look at win mobile contacts, or explorer. Do you think this software is made for 2008-2009 hardware? Now look at iphone's ones... Seriously, Microsoft has the power to make good things for mobile users, but they released win mo 6.1 one year ago, which is mainly the same OS that existed in 2003.
Silly we when we buy pocketpc running on windows mobile.
Just to revive a dead thread for quite a good reason..
I've seen a few videos on Youtube and also a few write ups on the wonderful Tinterweb in relation to Windows Mobile devices running and successfully playing iPhone games through emulation.
Is this just simple hear-say or fake ? I've been thinking for a long time about focusing simply on making the graphical capabilities of the diamond better through customising the graphics drivers. That's the main flaw for me.
According to a few posts the graphics card has 64MB dedicated memory.. is this right?
If so, these things SHOULD be capable of running bloody good games but the drivers are just nowhere near good enough. I did hear about changing to ATI drivers - is this right? If so, where can I find the info on this cause I would like to maybe bash at hybrid-combining the drivers and modifying them a bit as to allow maybe a bit more fluid graphics. If you check one of my other posts on the Diamond, I've been complaining about split-graphics. It's really getting on my nerves as I'd rather just see a full picture move around my screen fluidly. None of this "split it up" rubbish.
Cheers
Driver dev
This seems to be a good thread with most/all of the available drivers posted.
well I have been enjoying copy + paste and fully working GPS on my Diamond ever since
now why hasn't Apple offered this so far?
I guess each company chooses their own battles
glumetu said:
well I have been enjoying copy + paste and fully working GPS on my Diamond ever since
now why hasn't Apple offered this so far?
I guess each company chooses their own battles
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hrrm.. In the new 3.0 SDK update for iPhone 3G and iPod Touch which will be released soon there is copy and paste + redo.. in a very stylish and functional way.
And there will be mms + almost every single function that the iPhone was lacking before + some more.. many, many new stuff for improved gaming, new OS improvements etc.
I watched the presentation on the apple website..
Shoddy_me said:
Hrrm.. In the new 3.0 SDK update for iPhone 3G and iPod Touch which will be released soon there is copy and paste + redo.. in a very stylish and functional way.
And there will be mms + almost every single function that the iPhone was lacking before + some more.. many, many new stuff for improved gaming, new OS improvements etc.
I watched the presentation on the apple website..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Stuff that should have been released last year. The only reason Apple is releasing it when they are is because people's 2 year contracts are starting to expire, and Apple wants to try and persuade them from leaving by finally giving them features they've been demanding from day 1.
Honestly, it doesn't surprise me in the slightest. I knew Apple would do that.
Heres my question:
Smart phones and windows mobile operating system have been around for something like, oh, 15 years now. Why is it some EMO company like Apple releases a phone (badly I might add) and it becomes THE Benchmark for mobile devices? Its just purely unbelievable to me that so many people obsess over "well the iphone can do this, and it can do that.. I want my ______ to do what the iphone does..." If you like the turd and all its glory so much, why don't you just buy one and get it over with??
the iphone is so easy to use, thats why so many people bought one. when everyone has something, it becomes the norm to judge other things by. think of the model t from ford
Model T?
Confused.com. Is that the foreign (for me) Focus? lol
Anyways, I've looked about and the ATI drivers have given me the power boost I'm happy with. However - My images are still split on the screen.
Still trying to get this fixed...
Not that it is by any stretch of the imagination a definitive source of unbiased intelligence on gadgets, despite the title, but Five's Gadget Show did a test on last night's show that included the G1, the Blackberry Storm and the iPhone.
The testing was hardly rigorous or subjective but in three rounds of tests (functionality, speed to send an email and battery life) the HD trounced them all in pretty much every department.
The final two in the battery test were the iPhone and the HD. I didn't fancy its chances but it lasted a full 30 minutes longer than the poseur's wet dream.
Both HD and iPhone were rated 4/5 - something of a travesty since it outperformed the iPhone all the way down the line, but sadly the Gadget Show presenters seem to have succumbed to iPhone Syndrome (style counts for more than substance) and are prepared to mark it up even though it's quite poor functionally.
I was happy with my HD before, but rather pathetically, I'm even happier following a set of non-scientific and fairly meaningless tests. Maybe I am coming down with Variant iPhone Syndrome?
You can watch it here if you're interested. Whats the chances of Microsoft watching it and realising that its their "clunky" OS thats losing them points agains Apple?
iain.fraser said:
Not that it is by any stretch of the imagination a definitive source of unbiased intelligence on gadgets, despite the title, but Five's Gadget Show did a test on last night's show that included the G1, the Blackberry Storm and the iPhone.
The testing was hardly rigorous or subjective but in three rounds of tests (functionality, speed to send an email and battery life) the HD trounced them all in pretty much every department.
The final two in the battery test were the iPhone and the HD. I didn't fancy its chances but it lasted a full 30 minutes longer than the poseur's wet dream.
Both HD and iPhone were rated 4/5 - something of a travesty since it outperformed the iPhone all the way down the line, but sadly the Gadget Show presenters seem to have succumbed to iPhone Syndrome (style counts for more than substance) and are prepared to mark it up even though it's quite poor functionally.
I was happy with my HD before, but rather pathetically, I'm even happier following a set of non-scientific and fairly meaningless tests. Maybe I am coming down with Variant iPhone Syndrome?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They and many other TV/WEB shows are just designed to entertain, their ratings mean absolutly nothing. You can get better knowledge in this forum and many other in the web.
I agree with original post (and disagree with the Gadget Shows biased final opinion), Microsoft have been left "napping" and Apple/Android has spotted this, dont forget Microsoft were releasing mobile OS's 9 years ago, just unfortunate MS havent bolted on pretty front end to its now matured and stable mobile kernel (Apple has bolted a pretty front end onto a "open source linux" based OSX (well I say open source, of course apple forget what is in their kernel).
I think MS have been listening as from what I have seen on google about Windows Mobile 7 due for release next year (and will be checking ROM section daily on this forum when it is), it looks far more user friendly with no more Windows 95-esque graphics.
I recently moved from iPhone 3G to HTC Touch HD (only reason I switched was the iPhone wasnt compatible with the bluetooth in my new car), in my opinion WinMo is not as pretty as iPhone OS but is far more stable (my iPhone ended on version 2.2 and was still buggy, I was constantly experiencing freezes, no sound and other problems).
The only thing i miss is the iPhone hardware, the transducive touch screen is a million times better that the resistive screen on the touch, I am still getting used to using stylus again)
Those twits on Gadget Show have no clucking idea! Especially the bold bloke.
Yes, the tests were crap and the show is about as tech savvy as my mum. The idiots came up with some bs negative points, it seemed that they were just interested in making sure that the iSheep didn't lose, especially the self confessed Apple fanboy baldy speccy git. In the end they said it was a draw on points but the iSheep edged it overall - absolute garbage.
If a negative is that underneath the good touchflo interface was clunky winmo and they didn't explain why that was an issue for them, then you could see the pathetic bias by the tools who present the show.
They didn't list the iSheep set of negatives did they.
•Its tied to the Apple App Store for downloadable content - music, video and apps etc.
•The OS is locked down and has to be ‘jail-broken’ (hacked) to enable functionality, phone has to be ‘re-jail-broken’ every time you upgrade the software.
•You can’t copy and paste.
•It has no GPS software with maps and voice navigation i.e. TomTom.
•It doesn't multi-task, you have to close your app to go to another and then re-open it if you go back.
•No FM radio.
•Safari doesn’t work with all web pages and technologies such as streaming video, flash and Java.
•It doesn’t support MMS.
•It doesn’t support Video recording.
•It doesn’t support Video calls.
•It doesn’t support memory cards.
•You can’t change the battery, it has to go back to Apple for an expensive 'service'.
•It supports less video and audio codecs that the HD.
•Reported poor battery life.
•The Bluetooth is mono.
•You can’t skin the interface or customise it like the HD.
•It has no Voice dialling or Voice control.
•It only a 2mps camera compared to the Touch HD’s 5mps.
•You have to use your finger, forget gloves on a cold day or a stylus.
•The Touch HD’s screen resolution is 2.5x the iPhone, is slightly bigger and definitely sharper.
•The Touch HD screen is 800 pixels wide and can display many web pages without reformatting.
•Every loser has an iPhone so they can look ‘cool’.
This list was compiled of the iSheep vs THD thread on here for a friend, if any of it is inaccurate (yes I know you can download stuff to overcome the out-of-box limitations) then its unlucky, certainly no worse than C5's Git Show.
crankshaft said:
Those twits on Gadget Show have no clucking idea! Especially the bold bloke.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I find them all so patronising that I rarely ever watch it. Saw this though, and as usual the tests were laughable.
crankshaft said:
Those twits on Gadget Show have no clucking idea! Especially the bold bloke.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is that the 'old' bloke or the 'bald' bloke or both or does it not matter as they are both clueless spanners.
The latest edition of PC Pro has a slighly more subjective review of the latest smartphones where the HTC Touch HD scores better than the Iphone. Would tell you more but I was only browsing in WH Smith.
[Q] Why did the G1 go out in the first round?
[A] Becase it has a HW keyboard and then both HTC devices would have beat the iPhone.
P.S. Keep the swearing to a minimum, we arn't in the navy now
Ta
Dave
To reinforce their flippyness they went on to compare a Archos to a notenook and did a facebook event test that obviously the device with the sodding keyboard would win. Did they balance it by doing a 'fit in pocket' test - did they flip!
One's a computer the other a media player, you bunch of flips, its like comparing a car to a motorbike because they both transport you and complaining that the motorbike was colder and had less room for passengers.
Did I mention that they are flips?
DaveShaw said:
[Q] Why did the G1 go out in the first round?
[A] Becase it has a HW keyboard and then both HTC devices would have beat the iPhone.
P.S. Keep the swearing to a minimum, we arn't in the navy now
Ta
Dave
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry, will tone it down.
Some of you really do need to get over yourselves
Here we have a show that:
- introduces the HD to the masses
- gave a (very) subjective comparison of the features that will concern most mobile phone users
- provided viewers with 3 alternatives to the iPhone
And yet all you can do is slag it off! This is a TV programme for the masses (not iPhone/WinMo fanboys) and doesn't try to pass itself off as some kind of Noughties version of Tommorrow's World - it's just a bit of fun and not meant to be a definative review of latest tech.
tommyturnip said:
Yes, the tests were crap and the show is about as tech savvy as my mum.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hehe..i could probably be your mum and you can find me here almost daily....
just to say not all mums are alike...
Agree, test was BS
Did this guy not have the smarts to notice the other keyboards built in? Why was he bent on using the baby keyboard and the stylus? He seemed to make it a point that it still needed a stylus which is bull! I use the stylus once a week if that (GSFinder file manager)! He also didn't make it clear that the TouchFlo system makes nice large menus for the fingers.
They really didn't want to step on the iPhone masses toes, huh?! Oh, poor babies!
Also, he could have been nice and quickly popped in another battery and really made the iPhone look foolish.
so, am i the only one that watches the gadget show for the eye candy ? i also thouight it was common knowledge that journalists know nothing...
iPhone v HD
A few thoughts:
I think that the iPhone "wins" because Apple has been able to focus and apply its considerable marketing skill in promoting this product and congratulations to them for that.
However, being the best marketed product does not mean that you have the "best" product and I would add that for some people the iPhone meets their functional needs.
The Touch HD has great flexibility for someone with the inclination to invest the time in the product to customise it for their own use. However, MS need to realise that having the best product sometimes is not always enough to win the race.
I started out using PDAs 8yrs ago with a Palm IIIc which was brilliant and was an ardent Palm fan until OS development stopped and fell behind.....
WM has the product lead but even this can be lost to Apple if they don't step up their game.
Having said all of that I understand that there is a Windows7 in the pipeline for mainstream windows and it would appear (to me) that WM7 may be being held back to align to Windows OS. However, MS realise they are behind in the game and therefore will be offering the 6.5 upgrade in H1 2009.
These are amateur thoughts guys as I don't work in the IT industry.
Seasons greetings to all and happy customising for 2009
The PC Pro review was what brought me to my new HD. The summary of features is very useful but it does miss tethering - yet another feature that the iPhone does not have - unless you jail-break it.
I agree with the Gadget show comments - for and against. The G1 was out for me as it won't work with Outlook and it feels cheap. The Blackberry Storm has no wifi (and the the Gadget Show was very critical of the the on-screen keyboard). The vote for the iPhone was a bit of a fix.
Cookie999 said:
Some of you really do need to get over yourselves
Here we have a show that:
- introduces the HD to the masses
- gave a (very) subjective comparison of the features that will concern most mobile phone users
- provided viewers with 3 alternatives to the iPhone
And yet all you can do is slag it off! This is a TV programme for the masses (not iPhone/WinMo fanboys) and doesn't try to pass itself off as some kind of Noughties version of Tommorrow's World - it's just a bit of fun and not meant to be a definative review of latest tech.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We are only having a bit of fun slagging them off, no need for anyone to 'get over themselves'.
Nirak said:
Hehe..i could probably be your mum and you can find me here almost daily....
just to say not all mums are alike...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
???
Mum, is your real name Nirak?
Oh yeah! What's your mum like
http://www.expansys-usa.com/d.aspx?i=187760
$879.99
I'm not optimistic about SE's sales on this one, lads. If I had that kind of cash around, I'd get an LG Expo in a second and pocket the $200 I had left over. Who knows what SE was thinking using a 2007 processor in 2010?
The X2 made a lot more sense in November 2009. The only true appealing feature of the phone is the 8.1MP camera. With the premium that SE will charge, most people are better off getting the HTC TP2 (and XDA support) and a separate digital camera.
I hope it does well though.
emuneee said:
I hope it does well though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I also hope it does well, because I hope SE makes a Snapdragon WM device and doesn't give up on WM.
Just purchased an X2 =)
Will X2 b tweakable like the X1?
http://www.plemix.com/phone-sonyericsson-XPERIA_X2-phone
740USD
vodaphone uk which had a exclusive deal to sell the x2 has dropped the phone altogether, this is a bad sign.
Sony Ericsson seems to be digging there own grave.
No point to use 8.1MP camera with those in-phone optics. Overkill for lenses, with no better quality.
im looking forward to it. hopefully theyve sorted the little annoyances that plague the X1. im not concerned about a faster processor, the X1 can handle most of the stuff i require it to do, its the bugs that cause the lag. itll be running fine and then just get itself confused.lol. sticking a 1ghz processor into a phone is complete overkill and the same bragging rights as the pc cpu constant increases. ive got a laptop here somewhere that doesnt even have 1ghz.lol so why does a phone need it? its lazy programming that makes things slow.
my main requirements would be a) signal b) a keyboard that lasts more than 6months c) no cracks after a bit of light usage
there seems to be a few on ebay for $700-800 about £450-500.
royalbloodvi said:
Just purchased an X2 =)
Will X2 b tweakable like the X1?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You have it or just ordered?!
Ganondolf said:
vodaphone uk which had a exclusive deal to sell the x2 has dropped the phone altogether, this is a bad sign.
Sony Ericsson seems to be digging there own grave.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Got a link to confirm this as I was in a Vodafone store in Middlesex today and the guy in the shop said it was coming in stock next week.
659.99 at www.1shopmobile.com
Really respectable site, have ordered from them before. Has always been slightly cheaper than plemix, but this time they seem to be a hundred bucks cheaper.
nice spot. works out about £430 very tempted!
*just found these guys. dont know if theyre any good. $618
http://www.auroracell.com/sony-eric...68_a_7c66_a_7c416_a_7cSony Ericsson XPERIA X2
currently out of stock though..
sticking a 1ghz processor into a phone is complete overkill and the same bragging rights as the pc cpu constant increases.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, glad that the processor suffices for you, but i think for many people, the lagginess is a huge issue. I use a couple programs where i need rapid, on-the-fly data for my job, and the x1 is slower than my old Palm TX. Not good.
The 1gHz processor is not overkill or something for bragging rights for many of us; rather, it's a necessity because of the way we use our phones.
vanilla.coffee said:
Got a link to confirm this as I was in a Vodafone store in Middlesex today and the guy in the shop said it was coming in stock next week.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i was called by vodafone yesterday to say that they wouldn't be stocking the x2 and that i should look for something else.
unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be anything else worth having at the moment. :-(
The X2 is beyond me now - i really want a HD2 - unfourtunatley vodafone doesnt have them either >.<
Edit:
Coming soon page on vodafone doesnt list x2 anymore - thought the iphone is gone too >.<
Strange with this Voda isn't it?
i just read a review for the snapdragon expo... its got a 1ghz processor. the guy who wrote the review said that in most applications it wasnt any faster. with the added bonus of less battery life. so shows what little difference the cpu makes. the point i was tryin to make was, its usually the fault of the firmware or software that makes it laggy. 528mhz should be more than enough to browse the net, listen to mp3s or even watch videos... my old p1i could do it on a 208mhz processor...strange how a processor with twice the power (and dedicated gpu aswell) cant manage it...
i think you prove the point when you mention the palm tx being faster. that had a 312mhz processor?? so shows that cpu speed doesnt really mean much at all. sticking a faster cpu into the xperia brand isnt the answer...making efficent use of the available power is the key. early reports seem to suggest theyve improved greatly on the X1. fingers crossed thats true. i remember the p990 to p1i was similar situation. same processor but the p1i was much much faster and overall a far superior phone yet using most of the same hardware.
comeradealexi dont worry about vodafone not stocking the X2, ive not bothered with getting phones from my network for years now. if youre due an upgrade then get the most expensive phone they will give to you for free (if possible, one that can be unlocked easy as that will be worth more) then dont even open it, sell it on ebay and use that money towards buying the phone you want! the last phone i got was a nokia E71 for free, i sold it on ebay for £190 i could probably of got more as i put it as buyitnow and it sold within an hour. i then used that towards buying my xperia X1. also youll have an unlocked phone without all the networks restrictive firmware on it. and chances are if youre on this forum you know how to flash and customize a phone anyway. if you get a phone like the xperia from your network they will usually tie you into a very expensive contract too. ive got one of the cheapest unlimited plans from my network and just buy my phone seperately. more choice and overall much cheaper.
I'm sure in some areas snapdragon will be treat to use, like video playing.
Or browser speed/rendering.
In most cases incl. music, apps, photo making etc., app management it won't make any significant difference.
I don't believe it.
yeh, pretty much what i was thinking. the review i read is here if anyone is interested. i was considering it as an alternative to the X2 but i dont really like the look of it, and not too keen on the proprietary headphone jack amongst other things. sony seem to be the only ones who add LED notifications. a must for me as i have to have my phone on silent most of the time. such a simple yet essential feature in my book!
http://www.engadget.com/2009/12/20/lg-expo-unboxing-and-hands-on/
i think he sums it up quite well halfway through..
"You might think that slipping a mighty 1GHz Snapdragon processor this package works wonders, but after using the eXpo for a while, we're not so sure. It's not that the Snapdragon isn't a brilliantly capable core, it's that it's simply not playing in the same league as a bone-stock WinMo 6.5 build like the eXpo uses -- it's like trying to race a Ferrari in a parking garage (don't anyone dare make a The Fast and the Furious: Tokyo Drift reference here).
In terms of everyday usability, we'd venture that an old-school 528MHz MSM7201A (like that found in the Tilt2) would work just as well -- and you'd get more battery life out of it to boot. Cores like OMAP3 and Snapdragon excel at powering flashy, modern, animation-intensive user interfaces, and considering that 6.5 is basically a tweaked version of a UI we saw early this decade, it doesn't need (nor can it really take advantage of) this kind of processing power effectively.
Gaming capability alone might justify it, but goodness knows WinMo isn't anyone's mobile gaming platform of choice these days. Perhaps the one place where you'd think the Snapdragon would pay dividends -- browsing -- didn't seem to have much of an effect; we didn't have an MSM7200-based phone side by side to benchmark it, but the eXpo doesn't scroll or zoom in IE Mobile with the creamy smoothness you might expect (it's not bad, it's just not anything special). We can't believe we're saying it, but yeah: this might be the first, last, and only time we wish a Snapdragon phone had an MSM7200 series chipset instead. Revel in it, because you won't see us making that statement very often.
"
Exactly what I was thinking about.
I hope this isn't perceived as spamming or fishing for votes. I think most of us would like to see a smoother Android GUI instead of that choppyness on our 1GHz phones. I and many people believe that Google can do something about this but are not prioritizing this as they should. I think we can change this by visiting and voting here, clicking on the star under the headline, if we want to see a change: http://code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=6914
Who knows, if we start voting now, maybe they will implement this feature in the next Android version.
P.S. You need a Google account to be able to vote.
EDIT: Maybe this is why we haven't seen it yet?
From what I've heard, the fault lies mostly with HTC, encouraged by wholesale indifference by the carriers. Here's the story I was told:
* Qualcomm makes the core chipset used by most HTC phones, and most Android phones were built by HTC until VERY recently. Thus, the things that got the most attention during Android's first year and a half of commercial availability were things directly supported by HTC phones.
* The price charged by Qualcomm for its chipset varies, depending upon what features the handset manufacturer chooses to license from them. Put another way, every Qualcomm chip in a given family has the silicon resources to do everything... but manufacturers are only allowed to use the features they pay Qualcomm for the right to use.
* Because the carriers don't care, and the carriers are HTC's real customers, HTC didn't care about GPU support, either. It saved a few cents per phone, and washed its hands of GPU support to boot.
* Making matters worse, Qualcomm only makes its chipset documentation available under NDA (at least, the parts dealing with "premium" capabilities), and only made it available to licensees (of which there were very, very few). Ergo, the documentation has been VERY hard to come by, and less likely to be leaked by a public-minded HTC employee for the good of humanity.
Put another way, there probably isn't a thing Qualcomm can do to stop the folks at xda-developers.com from releasing guerrilla video drivers for HTC Android phones that take advantage of acceleration if they can figure out how it works, but you'll never see a phone come out of the box new with GPU acceleration unless HTC officially licenses the capability from Qualcomm. Nor will you see Google making it easy to do an end-run around the official release to graft it on, because then Qualcomm would sue THEM.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
- This is from: http://androidforums.com/android-news-talk/29584-why-doesnt-androids-gui-use-gpu-acceleration.html
I starred it.
Definitely is bizarre that GPU integration isn't enabled in Android 2.1+
This hardware-can-do-qualcom-wont-allow-it is old...
It happens with a LOT of devices...
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App
I'm glad to see that we are climbing on the chart of issues.
I have come to notice that the issue of the choppy Android experience is not only a problem because of the lack of GPU acceleration. Android phones tend to respond to our gestures way too exactly. This results in uneven transitions, one half of the animation is fast and the other half is slower. This unevenness being a result of us not making, or following through, with perfectly even movements in terms of speed. I believe this is something Apple has addressed and they did it very nicely because even though you are moving your fingers unevenly and slowly, the UI transitions follows your finger in an even and smooth fashion but in a speed that matches your finger. This looks phenomenal. Same goes for faster input gestures, the Ios (iOS) responds in an even and smooth fashion but the transition is faster.
It was the same with my old HD1, the xda gpu-drivers helped alot. Looks like we'll have to take the matter into our own hands again.
Wasn't HTC mass-sued for this a while back?
Syc said:
It was the same with my old HD1, the xda gpu-drivers helped alot. Looks like we'll have to take the matter into our own hands again.
Wasn't HTC mass-sued for this a while back?
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Click to collapse
Nope. There was a whole load of talk of it over the TyTn II debacle, but the only thing to ever come of that was the rather excellent XDA GPU drivers.
I hate to admit this, but if Google, or whoever it is responsible, doesn't do something about this, I'll have to look elsewhere (Iphone). It might sound crazy but it's that important to me. I mean, it's so basic. Why add mega-ultra-fiction features and all other sh*t, when you don't know how to make a smooth transition. The basic element of the GUI.
Don't get me wrong, I don't like Apple, their policy or their attitude towards the rest. However, I'm being honest about this: they care. I haven't seen one Android phone capable of delivering smooth transitions although they are more powerful than the Iphones. On the one hand you have a team utilizing the entire potential of their sh**ty phones, and on the other hand you have a team doesn't give a rats a*s about the hardware in them.
I don't know if Google is to blame or the phone manufacturers. I just don't like the idea of owning a 1 GHz CPU and an awesome GPU (Samsung Galaxy S) and not being able to use it.
Sorry to bump an old thread.
Has there been any progress on this issue?
Using spare parts and setting all the window animations and transitions to very slow has made everything "smoother" to me for all purposes of discussion. during the slow but smooth transition, my phone has time to fully load the next screen or popup menu, therefore it all appears to happen seamlessly.
android is very smooth on my Hd2 ... Did you try a cyanogen mod build ?
Sorry, i was referring more towards the GPU being actively used by the UI front end.
Im using a Legend with Azure's cyanogen mod (froyo) things are pretty slick but I can tell when there are slowdowns, but the worst offender is definately the web browser.
The best example I can find is going to the html5 test website, I get a score of around 180 and the iphone about 140, but the legend browser (built in and Dolphin) really struggles to scroll that page, whereas on the Iphone its extremely smooth. Its these kind of inconsistencies which are annoying.
Another gripe is the whole portrait-landscape switch, its not gpu based in the least and its a rather half assed solution at the minute (visually). But I understand that no app could ever interfere with how this works as its so deep in the os? Such a shame.
I work in animation which is why im overly critical
http://armdevices.net/2011/04/08/catwalk-girls-show-tablets-and-smartphones-in-shenzhen/
I'll take all of them.. yes, and the tablets too!
Hahah, seriously, check out the blog for more of the no-name cheapies heading your way. Once Papa Googlie decides to let go of his goods, of course.
One of the more informative blogs concerning the state of the cheap tablet. The hand-drawn sign was a nice touch, and emblematic--as was the forthrightness of the booth dude. Let me have some of em BSPs, too?
http://armdevices.net/2011/04/12/rayology-com-135-arm-cortex-a9-dual-core-7-capacitive-tablet/
More of the Shenzhen Electronics Fair on,
http://armdevices.net
I don't know what they are selling, but I'll take 5.
How the Xoom is made?
http://armdevices.net/2011/04/12/shenzhen-behind-the-scenes-1-hongda-factory-tour/
They could be selling me a dead cat in a bag and i'd buy it..maybe not.
Wow, those tablets are really cheap. Hope they are in good quality.
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Looks like we took their site down
**sigh**
Come on, really? We're all geeks. We know that, we accept that, and we are proud of that. But any "geeks" who are going stir crazy because the tablets are being handled by a couple of random Asian girls on a runway need to get out of the house more often. A cheap tablet is still a cheap tablet. You're still getting what you paid for. No offense to anyone.
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Damn, this tablets are so cheap
http://armdevices.net/2011/04/15/ebot-shows-necrenesas-cortex-a9-based-7-capacitive-tablet/
The specs on this one is similar to the Acer A100. 7", 1024x600 IPS LCD. Viewing angle is supposed to be 175-deg; it certainly looks wide enough.
Press release of the Renesas SH-Mobile APE5R chip (dual-core Cortex A9 class):
http://www.renesas.com/press/news/2011/news20110210b.jsp
General info:
http://semiaccurate.com/2011/02/12/renesas-demo-dual-core-arm-cortex-a9-soc-mwc/
It has the Imagination PowerVR SGX MP GPU, which will also power the Sony NGP and the iPhone 5. Capable of 1080p60 H.264.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PowerVR#Series5XT_.28SGXMP.29
Looks like a pretty beefy processor. Once the 3.0 NEC BSP drops (probably in May/June like the other guy said), I think we'll see some serious cheapo dual-core HC action from your friendly Sears/Walmart.
Tech specs for the earlier Renesas EV2, which is also a dual-core Cortex A9 class. It uses the Imagination SGX:
http://www2.renesas.com/mobile/en/emma_mobile/em_ev.html
Note that its "AV Engine" specs allows 1080p for all H.264 profiles, as well as NEON acceleration (which the Teg2 lacks). I couldn't find tech specs for the APE5R. But by inference, the announced chip with SGX543MP2 should perform better than older EV2.
obstacles can kill said:
**sigh**
Come on, really? We're all geeks. We know that, we accept that, and we are proud of that. But any "geeks" who are going stir crazy because the tablets are being handled by a couple of random Asian girls on a runway need to get out of the house more often. A cheap tablet is still a cheap tablet. You're still getting what you paid for. No offense to anyone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
True true, why would I fap for some lil asain chick on a catwalk when I could just go outside and seduce one with my laptop slills
Sent from the Aids ridden slums of China using the claw of an unborn rat
Price/performance of various Cortex A9 chips
http://www.youtube.com/watch?&v=dcdyyd2RtsA#t=159.1
..at least from the shenzhen manufacturers' perspective. Note the price/perf graph at the 3:40 mark.
Contrary to what I thought earlier, these cheap tabs are using the older EV2 (dual-core 533MHz), and the APE5R isn't yet in the mix. The "1.2GHz" is an "equivalent" marketing number, similar to AMD's old MHz-equivalent rating. This advertising practice is common for shenzhen tabs.
If the chart is to be believed--and these Asian folks are pretty honest dudes--then the EV2 is slower than the Teg2 in general perf, but its multimedia performance should be superior. From the EV2 specs (linked earlier):
AV Engine
. H.264 decode: BP/MP/HP Full HD(1920x1080)
...
. AC-3 decode Dolby digital 5.1ch
Charbax (ARMDevices blogger dude) has bought a sample, and he should be checking out video perf for us pokes.
Sigh... I only watched a few seconds of that video, what a load of crap that women/lady is saying...
I would be interested to see how she can produce a benchmark showing the Renesas EMMA EV2 at similar performance as Tegra2.