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I'm new to WM5 having previously had a Blue Angel running 2003SE; so far I like my new toy by am wondering about the pros and cons regrading where to install applications Storage Card versus Main Memory. Obviously, installing on Storage card keeps memory free - this is a good thing, but will applications run slower from storage card?
What expereinace can you share regarding thsi?
Thanks
Chris
In WM2003, internal storage ROM is only used to store a backup of the OS and vendor extensions, and is only read during hard resets. Volatile RAM is used to store the OS, files, and applications during regular use (unless they are installed on the SD card), and so their storage must compete with the RAM needed for running programs.
WM5 changes everything -- with WM5, the OS, applications and files always get stored in a nonvolatile storage, be it internal or external, and this is separate from the RAM. Thus battery loss does not cause you to lose installed applications or files. RAM is totally available for running programs, and is not used to store files which are rarely used. There is no more competition for RAM between stored files and running programs.
The WM5 OS and applications running in the background will always use a certain amount of the 64 MB of RAM. You can free it up by removing unnecessary applications. You can also free up the non-volatile storage space by removing vendor extensions and cleaning up temporary files. See this thread, and search for "0506" in re: O2 XDA Exec ROM.
As I have not received my XDA Exec yet, I cannot comment on the speed differences between using internal storage and SD storage. Obviously both are slower than running programs stored in RAM, and depend on the speed on the storage card. But the difference between installing on a SD card and installing in the "default location" is less in WM5 than in WM2003. Installing in the default location won't reduce your available RAM, for example.
I'm sure others have opinions on how best to optimize memory.
thanks for the answer. I posed the question because I pretty much ran out of memory on my device. I have installed in Corporate mode, so don't have O2 active etc. I have just done a hard reset & will now install everything on my storage card just to see what happens
I have had a few WM5 devices. Basically install everything on a removable card. Only install on the internal storage utilities that you are likely to keep around and restrict this to a minimum and small things, like vbar, TRE, etc.
The disadvantage of course is that if you swap SD cards then you can't run applications until you put back in the card installed. I never have this problem as I have only 1gb card permanently in the system. I will shortly be upgrading to a 4gb card (as they are not around £100) which means this is less of a problem. Although note that in the current version of the xda exec's software the camera refuses to write to a 4gb card unless at least 2gb is full.
rgds
I too have a 1Gb card with a 4Gb on order. I'm not very bothered about the camera, but I have read about the 2Gb problem. Hopefully someone will fix this little bug, but until then I can save photos to main memory and then move them about
As a guide I install everything to a SD Card unless it's a today screen plugin or sync's in some way...
that's excatly my thought too - only things which have a today plugin go on the main memory; everything else to SD card - seems to work fine
So maybe this is asking for a lot or something that can’t be done, but has anyone found a way to remap or ADD a storage card as possible program memory? This would add so much more support for these phones if it could be done.
When you say "program memory" do you mean RAM? If so, there doesn't appear to be any way this is possible at this time. There would be too much lag between accessing the sd card and using the RAM, among other things.
If you mean storage of Apps and such then you can do that with heaps of programs, though some DO require being put into main memory. The windows files can't be put on he SD card for the same reason and there wold be no drivers to tell the Hermes to access the sd card. Things like Tomtom and other apps sometime do install to main memory but are able to be moved to the storage card, you just need to re do the shortcuts.
Cheers...
I meant as ram, I know you can do program installations to storage card, most of my large ones are done that way, but I was simply referring to when you are doing something and you just want to open the com manager and its like Not enought memory, close a program... but since it sounds like it wouldnt be fast or even possible then scratch that idea.
I referred to it as "program memory" because in the memory watcher ram is listed as that.
Where do you guys usually install your apps to? Are there any benefits in installing to the Storage Card vs. installing in the internal memory of the phone?
Is the phone faster if all apps are installed on the storage card?
some apps definitely would not respond well if you install it in the storage card, especially if the app needs to 'wake up' from the power standby, due to the battery saving mode for external storage.
with X1, the phone storage is plenty that it doesn't make any difference for you to install in phone storage versus external. Upon fresh hardreset, my phone would have at least 204MB after deleting away the demo videos, etc. And this is standard ROM, not custom ROM.
Tri3Dent said:
Where do you guys usually install your apps to? Are there any benefits in installing to the Storage Card vs. installing in the internal memory of the phone?
Is the phone faster if all apps are installed on the storage card?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The truth is that it is "horses for courses"
If you regard the device as a phone with a bit of residual computer capability, then 300Mb of Storage will last a lifetime
If you regard it as a computer with a phone segment attached, then use the SD card for everything you can. The tnyynt SD tweak for speeding card access is brilliant to the point where I am unable to tell the practical difference between Storage and card use.
I use mine as a work computer with a phone attached. My 16Gb card is already 55% full (ie. just under 9Gb of data and programs) - this cannot fit in Storage.
man what kind of programs and data that you have that takes over 8 gigs on your phone.
music and videos i can understand, programs and data???? i got a 4 gig card and the only program that i have that takes up 1 gig is the maps for tomtom 7.910
hopefully the 32 gig card will be compatable with the x1 in the near future.
c_legaspi said:
man what kind of programs and data that you have that takes over 8 gigs on your phone.
music and videos i can understand, programs and data???? i got a 4 gig card and the only program that i have that takes up 1 gig is the maps for tomtom 7.910
hopefully the 32 gig card will be compatable with the x1 in the near future.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OK, well 1) as I said, my device is used as a computer with a phone segment attached, so having >8Gb "on my phone" is not really accurate. I have >8Gb on my card (ie. HDD) and growing
2) Music and video ?? None of them, I use hifi and TV for those when I'm home
3) I use the device for geological/geotechnical mapping on a world-wide basis, together with CAD/3D modeling of collected and supplied data. So high-level topo data, drillhole data, outcrop data, survey data, engineering constraints, zillions of reference reports etc etc + the slew of large programs needed to run these data collections
So for me, smaller, faster ROM = better and better
4) you bet I'm hanging out for the 32Gb cards
problem with having too little phone storage is some program use storage as temp
currently i have about 40gb storage free but still
the comic book reader crash often because the .net program in question
unzip the whole comic to some temp dir in phone storage
when it operates and apparently the comic use more then 40gb
would be easy for the programmer to fix so it didn't unzip all or did it to
the sd card but..
I put pretty much all programs that can be installed onto the card on the card... I also have shedloads of files on there mainly for language learning (I am learning Chinese and also have some Russian stuff)... from 16gb I am down to 7.7 and thats only cos I deleted a few tv shows from China...
PS I am reposting this due to the deletion bug thing... I did have a longer post but cant remeber all my witty reply...
flip a coin
Hello,
Can someone elaborate on what is meant by Storage memory and Program memory?
I would expect storage to be My Docs and Programs to be Windows and so on. I ask since my Storage allocation is two thirds full and all my docs on the device is empty. I use the SD card for that.
Cheers.
rphillip said:
Hello,
Can someone elaborate on what is meant by Storage memory and Program memory?
I would expect storage to be My Docs and Programs to be Windows and so on. I ask since my Storage allocation is two thirds full and all my docs on the device is empty. I use the SD card for that.
Cheers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
-Storage memory is memory used for saving files on you're phone, extention is you're memory card (micro SD).
-Program memory, is like the RAM-memory on you're PC, this is used when running programmes, watching movies-pictures...
Thanks. Well there are two storage areas. "Main" and "Storage Card". My query is for "Main". Within this there is "Storage" and "Program".
I would like to know what is used for what so I can look in a specific area and delete stuff I don't need. Like I said "Storage" seems rather full but I do not store anything on the phone itself. I use the storage card which does not present a problem.
In the storage info on the settings tab, under device it shows "storage" which is like your hard drive, and "program" which is like your RAM. Obviously, you don't actually have a hard drive. It's just an example
There's certain stuff that gets cached on the internal storage, and this can obviously bump up the space that's used (there's threads on here for cleaning/moving these things). Then there's the other culprit - Marketplace. If you've installed stuff from there, it's on internet memory, not your storage card. Also, do you install software to the device, or to the storage card? I only put essential stuff on the device, and stuff that I can live without on the storage card.
Just thoughts and suggestions.
johncmolyneux said:
In the storage info on the settings tab, under device it shows "storage" which is like your hard drive, and "program" which is like your RAM. Obviously, you don't actually have a hard drive. It's just an example
There's certain stuff that gets cached on the internal storage, and this can obviously bump up the space that's used (there's threads on here for cleaning/moving these things). Then there's the other culprit - Marketplace. If you've installed stuff from there, it's on internet memory, not your storage card. Also, do you install software to the device, or to the storage card? I only put essential stuff on the device, and stuff that I can live without on the storage card.
Just thoughts and suggestions.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah ok that explains a little then. I have been installing cabs to the device.
Do not understand; my total storage memory is 181,23MB, in use is 175,21MB, but when I check in explorer, there is only 89MB in use. What am I missing here??
Also, what does it mean program storage - total space 336,97MB?
Flash size 512MB, RAM size 448MB, what is the difference?
Its rather more complex than it ought to be, and HTC are being a little 'economical' with the truth!
It has 512MB of total storage, of which about 175MB is taken up by the ROM image. This leaves the 337MB you see reported. Of this, about 150MB is taken up by the HTC Sense system, then another chunk by the video memory leaving around 135MB free to the user. The new 'Light' custom ROMs without HTC Sense have over 300MB free to the user.
The 448MB RAM is just that- same as a PCs RAM. Even after loading the OS on startup there is ample ROM left for pretty much any eventuality!
I was wondering if anybody could help answer a few questions about the Sprint S4 for me.
Currently I have an HTC Evo 3D, the internal storage is so small that I have made a 4gb ext3 partition on my SD card using Link2SD just to alleviate some of this annoyance. The 32GB counting the 4GB partition is actually almost full.
First of all, is there any word on a 32GB version? I saw some forum threads a while ago about Sprint supposedly not carring the 32+GB versions, but I saw no official word, if there has been one.
And also, how does the 16GB of internal work? The first time I saw a phone with large internal memory was the original Droid RAZR. And it basically partitioned off the majority of the space like a virtual SD card. Most to all apps on it saved to here instead of the actual SD card assuming it was an actual external storage. Does the S4 do this too, or is the entire 16GB (minus obviously what the system partitions take up) used as internal?
The reason I am asking is because I have many apps and games which download anywhere from 50MB to 3 gigs of additional data, and they almost never ask you where to download it, and just use the first "external" space they find, and many are hard-coded to only use that space. Like I said, my 32GB card on my Evo 3D is practically full, I do NOT not want those apps to install that data on the internal memory and fill it up, I want that space to keep the apps installed on, while photos, music, and video, as well as that app additional data, will be on the real SD card. I am planning to get a 64GB card for the S4.
Cyber Akuma said:
I was wondering if anybody could help answer a few questions about the Sprint S4 for me.
Currently I have an HTC Evo 3D, the internal storage is so small that I have made a 4gb ext3 partition on my SD card using Link2SD just to alleviate some of this annoyance. The 32GB counting the 4GB partition is actually almost full.
First of all, is there any word on a 32GB version? I saw some forum threads a while ago about Sprint supposedly not carring the 32+GB versions, but I saw no official word, if there has been one.
And also, how does the 16GB of internal work? The first time I saw a phone with large internal memory was the original Droid RAZR. And it basically partitioned off the majority of the space like a virtual SD card. Most to all apps on it saved to here instead of the actual SD card assuming it was an actual external storage. Does the S4 do this too, or is the entire 16GB (minus obviously what the system partitions take up) used as internal?
The reason I am asking is because I have many apps and games which download anywhere from 50MB to 3 gigs of additional data, and they almost never ask you where to download it, and just use the first "external" space they find, and many are hard-coded to only use that space. Like I said, my 32GB card on my Evo 3D is practically full, I do NOT not want those apps to install that data on the internal memory and fill it up, I want that space to keep the apps installed on, while photos, music, and video, as well as that app additional data, will be on the real SD card. I am planning to get a 64GB card for the S4.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The way samsung does it is actually very anoying. First thing they do is cut off 8.5 gigs of storage, thats your "internal memory" for system stuff. That's untouchable. You then have 9gigs give or take left for apps and the like which is EMULATED external storage. This emulated bit confuses android and so your real external sd card is only usable for movies and music. The only way to put apps on it would be to root your phone and use folder mount (which for some reason isn't working for me yet). So to sum it up:
16gb +ext sd card (lets say 32 gb)
8ish gb- system internal
9ish gb-apps EMULATED external
32 gb- movies, music, books/media BUT NO APPS UNLESS YOU ROOT REAL external
AAAAUUUUGGGHHHHH!</CharlieBrown>
Wow, I can not possibly think of a worse way for Samsung to handle it. The low internal memory giving me problems installing and updating apps was a major reason for wanting to upgrade. With this, it means I actually have less space for apps than my current phone, since I can't actually install to SD and the apps that download hundreds of megs to gigs of additonal data will be downlioading it to the internal instead of external.
I... honestly have no idea which phone to get now.
I know the Sprint S4 is unlocked, is there any way to use rooted tools or a custom rom to just make the memory internal and make it mount a SD as an actual SD? I am worried that unofficial roms might be lacking in features or glitchy.
Cyber Akuma said:
AAAAUUUUGGGHHHHH!</CharlieBrown>
Wow, I can not possibly think of a worse way for Samsung to handle it. The low internal memory giving me problems installing and updating apps was a major reason for wanting to upgrade. With this, it means I actually have less space for apps than my current phone, since I can't actually install to SD and the apps that download hundreds of megs to gigs of additonal data will be downlioading it to the internal instead of external.
I... honestly have no idea which phone to get now.
I know the Sprint S4 is unlocked, is there any way to use rooted tools or a custom rom to just make the memory internal and make it mount a SD as an actual SD? I am worried that unofficial roms might be lacking in features or glitchy.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well this is an issue with all honeycomb plus android phones. Google is trying to phase out the external sd card while increasing the internal memory. Well that's all good and fine EXCEPT that we are right in the middle of the phase out process where the sd cards are too small for that. 2-3 years from now googles plan will work, but samsung has to be on board for that to happen. For now the only thing you can do is use folder mount or wait for ext2intSD script. It will swap it so your external sdcard works as your internal and vice versa. However, we will have to wait for that to be released.
I don't get what phasing out the SD slot has to do with emulating the external SD storage when all apps can work on internal storage anyway.
What is folder-mount? And I tried link2sd on my evo 3d and its kinda problematic, I wanted to get AWAY from these problems by upgrading.
Cyber Akuma said:
I don't get what phasing out the SD slot has to do with emulating the external SD storage when all apps can work on internal storage anyway.
What is folder-mount? And I tried link2sd on my evo 3d and its kinda problematic, I wanted to get AWAY from these problems by upgrading.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The reason why is that android its self, the code that google supplies, has to create partitions in order for it to work with only one internal sdcard so that the average user does not corrupt the system somehow. The emulated external storage is what google expects you to use so that you can't mess up. However, samsung just adds in an sdcard without changing anything which means its not set up correctly. This is a problem with all new sd card phones and finally think of folder mount as a better link2sd
But aren't the system partition and the internal storage partition separate partitions? I don't understand why the rest of the memory outside of the system partition needs to be an emulated external instead of just being an internal storage partition like on phones that do not have a large amount of internal memory.
Also, why do we have to link folders or use link2sd scripts and other such work-arounds? Can't we re-partition the internal memory with a custom recovery or through the bootloader?
not work brother
Sent from my ST18i using xda app-developers app
deadger said:
not work brother
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
.... what? I have no idea what that means.
So, can the phone be repartitioned if you have root access? And is only the Sprint version partitioned like this, or all of them?