Charging Battery - 8125, K-JAM, P4300, MDA Vario General

I was reading through the manual for the 8125 and it said to do a few compleate charged-empty cycles. I have read other places that with LiIon bateries you do not want to let them go below 40% for long.
What do you reccomend for the best long term battery life?
Do a couple cycles, then keep it as full as possiable?
Thanks

Normally the best thing to do when charging a new battery pack for the first time is to charge it fully and let it discharge fully for the first cycle. After that, Li-on batteries tend to perform best if the charging cycle is alternated between charging after a full discharge and a recharge when the discharge hasn't been completed. However, I'm not an expert on this so you might want to get more info on this but basically Li-on batteries are less likely to suffer from the lazy battery effect or memory effect that Ni-Cad/Ni-MH batteries suffer from.

Be careful.
I have seen some posts elsewhere on the forum that report problems if you let the battery run down completely.
Apparently if you do it won't recharge on the cradle again and you have to take it off the phone and use a special modified lead to recharge it.
Best to keep it from draining to zero.

That is what I have read about Li-ions. My wife thought you were susposed to drain it down all the way, and now her laptop battery only lasts 20 min. I don't want to end up like that.
I don't want to end up like this

Related

PROPER way to charge your X1's battery?

before everybody tells me the search function, I already have but I find mixed and contradiction answers on this issue. Some people say to do a full discharge followed by a full recharge as soon as you get the phone. Then on the other hand some people say that you shouldn't do this since the x1 uses a li-ion and its bad for it. Some people say you should charge it only when it's near empty, but on the other hand some people say to keep charging it as often as possible. Some say to take it off the charger once its fully charged, but then some say its ok to leave a fully charged battery on the charger.
As you can see, from searching the forum I've gotten pretty confused. so what is the PROPER way to charge our x1 battery? Is it also true that battery life gets better the more you put it on the charger? Does the x1i get better battery life than the x1a? I'm asking this because I'm gettin very poor battery life on my x1 compared to the 1-3 days of heavy usage that I see other people gettin on this forum. I'm going to exchange it today for a new one, so I don't want to make the same mistakes with charging my battery as I did with the first one.
Charging:
Do charge the battery often.
The battery lasts longer with partial rather than full discharges.
Discharging:
Avoid full cycle because of wear.
80% depth-of-discharge recommended.
Re- charge more often. Avoid full discharge.
Low voltage may cut off safety circuit.
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From:
http://www.batteryuniversity.com/partone-21.htm
dogans said:
From:
http://www.batteryuniversity.com/partone-21.htm
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that is very true......i get better life (3days) when i charge from 50%. otherwise i barely get more than 24hr.
thanks, that helps a lot! but what do I do once the battery has finished fully charging on the charger? should I take it off or is it fine to still leave it on the charger?
i have noticed this today,
i have installed a battery indicator bar (i cant remember which one) i charged my my X1 during night, when i woke up, i found that the phone is not charging and the battery is full. so i think that the phone automatically stopps charging when the battery reaches 100%
anyone can confirm that?
Not sure about the way to charge it, but i can comment on your current battery life. when i got mine, i had 1 days battery life, but after flashing it, i'm now getting between 3-4 days......
i used
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=458768
Glad to see that there are people that read the "real" stuff (I'm talking about dogans), the batteryuniversity site is mantained by the very battery fabricants, so their opinions are the best informed ones, even if they might bias a little to keep the bussiness "healthy".
However, any Lithium battery should not be fully discharged -at least not often-, because the full discharge shortens their life.
Usually, good chargers do control the charging parameters (battery's voltage, current and temperature curves) while it charges and "know" when to stop, even if they really don't stop ever (normally), the go in "tickle" charging mode, to keep the battery "fully" charged.
Hope this helps.
The article on Wikipedia about Li-Ion batteries is quite informative as well:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium_ion_battery
It specifies the technology, the do's, the dont's and usefull tips in keeping your battery in good condition.

Cradle use and battery health

At the office I leave my phone in a cradle. When I get calls I remove the phone to answer and then return it to the cradle when done. My battery goes from 100% down to somewhere in the 90's then charges back to 100% in the cradle. Does this repeated process harm the battery in any way? I've read that these batteries don't suffer from the memory effect, but I'm still not sure if this counts as a charging cycle.
Sent from my Desire HD using XDA App
You should always let the battery run down completely some times maybe once a week.
Really? I've read on this forum that there is no need to do that with the new Lithium Ion batteries. I've even read that this could have a negative effect and you should try not to let the battery drain completly.
I don't understand why there isn't a proper battery care section in the manual. Its as if its some kind of voodoo science.
Perhaps not Once a week. But Once a "while"
The reason is that, Phone software uses approximation to calculate the charge left in the Battery. So over time, battery ages and software may not be calibrated to match with the battery's storage capacity. So draining the battery entirely and charging them fully gives the phone's software to assess the battery's health and recalibrate.
It's a lithium battery mate. The only way you can really damage it is by a complete discharge. So long as you don't switch the phone back on once it switches itself off due to low battery you needn't worry about anything else.
Also in theory the lithium batteries have a lifespan of say about a 1000 charges for example and everytime you charge it has one charging less left. This ofcourse isn't exactly how it is in practice but charging the battery alot wears it down. It isn't good either to keep it in the charger for a longer time after it's reached a 100%.
Hi,
this is only partly correct:
Suppose the battery can make 1000 (which I don't believe) charge cycles,
it means that you can charge 1000 times from empty to full.
If you just charge 1000 times from 50% empty to full it counts for 500 cycles!
So,
don't worry, let it stay in the cradle if you like
There are 500 opinions about that but believe, as I wrote is correct.
Theo
Yes, what I said wasn't exact science and I used 1000 cycles as an example, but from what I've read it is better to let the battery drain to less than 50% and then charge it full rather than charge 5% at a time. My previous post was meant to illustrate this.
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geenome said:
You should always let the battery run down completely some times maybe once a week.
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That's a load of crap, no offense... Lithium batteries have no memory effect and have absolutely no need to be completely discharged, that's a ancient thing from the time of nickel-metal hybrid batteries. The only actual reason for full charge cycles is to calibrate the device for that exact battery.
Keeping a lithium-ion battery in a charger most of the time will wear the battery down faster than getting it drain more and then charging it. Keeping the battery almost fully loaded/in a constant loading state wears the battery capacity by approximately 20% a year (can't recall the source/study just now)(EDIT: and my personal experience is that the battery capacity will wear that much anyway, no matter how you use it). The life-cycle of phones these days are roughly two years nowadays so IMO you can keep it in a cradle with no worries, if you wish. And lets face it, a new battery after a year of usage won't be that big an investment after all.
To add to the above post, running down a lithium battery completely does more damage than benefit. This is almost impossible though with normal use as the phone shuts down long before the battery is completely empty

[Q] first charge?

do i drain the battery before first charge? is it really necessary to do overnight first charge or 3-4 hour full charge will do? need to take extra care since it is non removable.
I know that's really un-educated but I'm not sure about those things as well ... is it good to drain it first and then recharge it, or recharge it at the beginning .. and is it bad when you take it off the charger in the middle of the process?
I know it depends on battery type. And actually what would make sense is just following the manual. Why shouldn't the manufacturer know?
Anyway, anyone with some knowledge on that, please help!
Nearly all cell phones use Lithium-based batteries, which should not be drained before charging. The "drain before charge" thing only applies to nickel cadmium batteries.
You should charge your phone battery as often as possible. It's better for the battery to go from 100% to 80% five times than to go from 100% to 0% once.
I have read several articles that state it is BAD to completely drain a lithium polymer battery so I plan to just keep it charged as usual.
Bronk93 said:
I have read several articles that state it is BAD to completely drain a lithium polymer battery so I plan to just keep it charged as usual.
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I've heard the same info too where it'll damage the battery by draining it completely. Although, I heard that power management on devices sometimes need to be calibrated by taking the lithium battery to near 0%...it's that way on my macbook pro...not sure about phones.

New battery, how to "initialize" it?

Hi everyone, i've ordered a new battery (Polarcell 2900mah) and i should receive it this week...i saw somewhere that android does not really read the battery percentage, but instead estimate it. I also read about battery recalibration or initialization which is fundamental for android to proper estimate the actual power contained in the battery, but i'm a little bit confused anyway...since i want my new battery to work proper and last as long as it could, do someone among you know about this fact? Is there any guide? I can't find anything.
P.S. i have a I9505 (jfltexx) and i'm actually on RR v5.6.3...so android 6.0.1
That is complete BS.
I never "calibrated" mine.
PS: most calibration apps do the same thing, and that is to delete a file that has no connection with the battery percentage. This was stated by a Google engineer.
Batteries should come charged at 50%
That's the perfect storage charge.
If there was any calibration method, then it would be: let it discharge completely, then recharge it to 100%.
Another note, valid for Li-on batteries: The deeper the discharge the shorter its life will be. In other words, if you let it discharge as low as 20%, or lower, every day, the battery life (before it needs replacing again) will be shorter.
Another thing: Leaving the battery at 100% charge for extended periods can also damage its ability to hold a charge for a longer time.
GDReaper said:
That is complete BS.
I never "calibrated" mine.
PS: most calibration apps do the same thing, and that is to delete a file that has no connection with the battery percentage. This was stated by a Google engineer.
Batteries should come charged at 50%
That's the perfect storage charge.
If there was any calibration method, then it would be: let it discharge completely, then recharge it to 100%.
Another note, valid for Li-on batteries: The deeper the discharge the shorter its life will be. In other words, if you let it discharge as low as 20%, or lower, every day, the battery life (before it needs replacing again) will be shorter.
Another thing: Leaving the battery at 100% charge for extended periods can also damage its ability to hold a charge for a longer time.
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I'm not talking about fabulous apps which do magic things...i mean, as i read, there should be some cycles of charge and discharge which nave to be done, not for the battery, but for android, in order to really manage the power in the battery, without those 20% from 100% to 80% dropping like stones. Sorry for my bad english, i hope i explained myself.
Guarino95 said:
I'm not talking about fabulous apps which do magic things...i mean, as i read, there should be some cycles of charge and discharge which nave to be done, not for the battery, but for android, in order to really manage the power in the battery, without those 20% from 100% to 80% dropping like stones. Sorry for my bad english, i hope i explained myself.
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No it's complete crap. Android does that perfectly fine. There is really nothing you need to do.
That only applied to phones 4 years ago. You never need to calibrate it anymore.
Guarino95 said:
I'm not talking about fabulous apps which do magic things...i mean, as i read, there should be some cycles of charge and discharge which nave to be done, not for the battery, but for android, in order to really manage the power in the battery, without those 20% from 100% to 80% dropping like stones. Sorry for my bad english, i hope i explained myself.
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As I said, I never calibrated mine and it works.
That whole "Let it discharge completely and then charge it over night" is just a left-over from the old batteries. Those new kind of batteries don't need that.
Those batteries aren't ment to stay at full charge all the time. That is the reason for the fast drop. Mine drops for 100% to 99% in the first 5 minutes. And it drops like that until it stabilizes at around 94%.
The moment your battery needs calibration is when the phone shows 30% left and it suddenly turns off. That means it shows a wrong percentage, or that the battery needs to be replaced.
OK, then i'll just swap that battery and use the phone normally...thank you all
lithium batteries don't want to be left fully charged or fully discharged for too long. it damages the poles if that's the right way to say it. so outside of that just follow what your new battery makers recommendations

New s7 battery conditioning

Hey guys, I recieve my s7 edge today, whats the best way to condition the new phones battery? Some use what it has until its low to recharge until 100 others leave phone off and charge to 100 at start, whats the best result for a good healthy battery?,
Thanks
Lithium ion batteries have come a long way. There is no "memory effect" and conditioning is probably not really all that necessary. If I were you I'd just give it a charge to 100 and use as normal. Might have high drain for the first few days/charge cycles.
Remember that with Li-Ion batteries a "charge cycle" is one complete cycle from 0% to 100%. So by charging when it's at 50% you're only using up one half of a "rated charge cycle" - Battery conditioning shouldn't really be required with modern lithium ion batteries.
Battery conditioning isn't necessary but charging fully and depleting fully will help the phones software learn the battery capacity and give the most accurate percentage remaining reading. I'd say do this a couple times after you first get the phone
gaff15 said:
Battery conditioning isn't necessary but charging fully and depleting fully will help the phones software learn the battery capacity and give the most accurate percentage remaining reading. I'd say do this a couple times after you first get the phone
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This makes sense I guess. But wouldn't the battery percentage remaining be based on the voltage in the battery at a given moment? I wouldn't think the phone would need to "learn" that.
Afaik. It's actually bad to discharge li-ion and li-po batteries down low. I think it's better for battery health to recharge around 50% for instance than waiting until 0%.
Xileforce said:
Afaik. It's actually bad to discharge li-ion and li-po batteries down low. I think it's better for battery health to recharge around 50% for instance than waiting until 0%.
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The 50% mark is an old(and still good) rule of thumb primarily for lead acid batteries.
Leaving these batteries in a discharged state can be bad for them, but in normal usage even a discharge to 0% is fine if followed shortly by a charge cycle. These devices have a low voltage cutoff which is what shuts the phone down and protects the battery from over discharge and damage. Bottom line is use and charge it however you like, the only thing that may change is the time it takes the software to learn your discharge profile and show accurate stats.
Ashevar said:
The 50% mark is an old(and still good) rule of thumb primarily for lead acid batteries.
Leaving these batteries in a discharged state can be bad for them, but in normal usage even a discharge to 0% is fine if followed shortly by a charge cycle. These devices have a low voltage cutoff which is what shuts the phone down and protects the battery from over discharge and damage. Bottom line is use and charge it however you like, the only thing that may change is the time it takes the software to learn your discharge profile and show accurate stats.
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This makes sense. The article I read awhile back was likely referring to non smart charging systems, such as a battery pack. It makes sense that an integrated solution such as a phone would regulate that to maintain battery health.
There are three things that are very bad for Li batteries. 1: overcharging. 2: completely draining. 3: overheating. Li batteries are happiest, and will last the longest, if never cycled above 75% or below 25%. Cars like the Tesla actually show 100% charge when the battery pack is only about 75% charged, and show the battery as depleted well above 0% charge. Then again, the battery pack for a Tesla costs a lot more than a phone.
#1 shouldn't be a problem in any modern device. The circuitry in the battery will tell the phone when to shut down charging to prevent overcharge. #3 can be a problem. If you're charging the battery simultaneously with high battery draining phone usage (e.g., GPS and Nav) phones can get very hot. In fact, I've had my phone stop charging and display a warning when I was navigating and charging the phone wirelessly at the same time. If you're using GPS on a long trip, you almost have to charge it while in use, but might want to avoid wireless or fast chargers. Wireless chargers and fast chargers generate more heat.
#2 is up to you. Repeatedly discharging the battery to single digits will reduce it's lifespan. I try to recharge before 25% but if I get into a situation where I can't I don't obsess over it. I don't worry too much about charging to 100%. I suspect that, like Tesla, 100% is probably not really 100%. The battery manufacturers are likely to leave a little safety margin in there to ensure batteries can't overheat and catch fire.
meyerweb said:
There are three things that are very bad for Li batteries. 1: overcharging. 2: completely draining. 3: overheating. Li batteries are happiest, and will last the longest, if never cycled above 75% or below 25%. Cars like the Tesla actually show 100% charge when the battery pack is only about 75% charged, and show the battery as depleted well above 0% charge. Then again, the battery pack for a Tesla costs a lot more than a phone.
#1 shouldn't be a problem in any modern device. The circuitry in the battery will tell the phone when to shut down charging to prevent overcharge. #3 can be a problem. If you're charging the battery simultaneously with high battery draining phone usage (e.g., GPS and Nav) phones can get very hot. In fact, I've had my phone stop charging and display a warning when I was navigating and charging the phone wirelessly at the same time. If you're using GPS on a long trip, you almost have to charge it while in use, but might want to avoid wireless or fast chargers. Wireless chargers and fast chargers generate more heat.
#2 is up to you. Repeatedly discharging the battery to single digits will reduce it's lifespan. I try to recharge before 25% but if I get into a situation where I can't I don't obsess over it. I don't worry too much about charging to 100%. I suspect that, like Tesla, 100% is probably not really 100%. The battery manufacturers are likely to leave a little safety margin in there to ensure batteries can't overheat and catch fire.
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#1 -> Could be a problem. Manufacturers can set the 100% mark at higher voltage to make it look like it has more capacity while sacrificing longevity, just enough to get through the 1 year warranty period. (Lot of powerbanks do this!) Users have no control of this ceiling. Charging to 80% and letting it cycle below that probably keeps the battery much healthier than keeping it plugged overnight at 100%.
There's an app called AccuBattery on playstore that people might want to check out. It's basically an alarm that turns on when the battery is at desired % level. It also cites real research papers so I would trust what they are doing.
I used to have a long post with a detailed technical explanation but lost it.
Anyway the gist is, basically, batteries work by ion movement, and like a machine, these ions wear out over time due to use. And similar to machines, heavy use wears them out more. You're more likely to break an engine by running it for 1 day at max rev, than running it over a month at half capacity. The smaller the depth of discharge, the lower the wear. Lab tests have concluded that when you constantly discharge from 100 to 0, it allows you betwrrn 300-500 charge cycles before it starts to break down and not hold charges. More specifically, when you reach that magic number your battery can only hold 75% of it's original charge. That's typically 1-2 years of use if you charge once a day. And heavy abusers charge more than once a day, so that decreases the time span to however many weeks it takes them to reach 500 charge cycles. Now, the increase in charge cycles is exponential, not arithmetical. So a depth of discharge to 50 before recharging will not give you 600-1000 charges. Rather it will give you 1200-1500 charge cycles. Mathematically, draining a 3600mah to zero for 300 charges gives you 1080000mah to burn through however short your battery life will be. On the other hand, using only 50% of the battery before recharging gives you 2160000mah to burn through before it expires after at least 1200 charge cycles. In other words, it stored twice more power for you to use. If you say, charge once every 24hrs, going always from 100 to 0 gives you at least 300 days. Recharging twice a day at 50% gives your battery at least 600 days of use before battery capacity deteriorates noticeably. Discharging to 75% before recharging actually gives you 2000-2500 charge cycles, making it even longer. Basically the point is, always plug the phone in when given the chance. Don't wait for 50%, or whatever. 40% is an arbitrary number actually, not sure why it's chosen. Also, this is why one of the choices to auto activate power saving in the S7 is at 50%, so that it keeps the battery up as close to 50% as possible when you get the chance to plug in.
As for charging to 80%, this is because partial charge is better than full charge for lithium ion batteries. The ions are placed on stress to hold charges. Maximum stress is at 100% charge. And like everything else, stuff tends to break more. So not running it to 100% all the time will reduce overall stress experienced and increase the time before deterioration occurs. Personally I charge to 90%, and discharge to 40% or above. That's a 50% depth of charge, so that's good for up to 1500 charge cycles, plus whatever number of cycles the decrease in max stress gives me.
However, note that environmental temperatures also play a role in battery longevity.
Sent from my Galaxy S7 Edge Duos via Tapatalk
just use the dang phone...
cri[LIST=1 said:
[/LIST]s_epic;65635276]Hey guys, I recieve my s7 edge today, whats the best way to condition the new phones battery? Some use what it has until its low to recharge until 100 others leave phone off and charge to 100 at start, whats the best result for a good healthy battery?,
Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's actually a perfect way to ruin your battery on purpose!
Just do these things and Don't worry a lot. And remember, when it does die it's not your fault, it's kind of a problem with Lion batteries!
1. Try to keep the battery between 40-80% or 20-40%. But don't worry if tou can't. Saying this in case you're staying at home all day.
2.Keep the heat away from it!!! This one is important
3. Try to discharge it at a lower rate but don't let that get in the way of you enjoying your device.
4. Try not to discharge below 8% at all. But try to not discharge it below 15-20% unless you have important things to do.
5. don't keep it topped of for a long time (like constant going 90-100%, this is damaging) and don't keep it at 100% for long! (For example turning it off and stop using it for a week, or keeping it plugged for a few days)
If you're storing it keep it at 40% (3.8-3.75V) and try to drain it once in a while. (Unlikely to happen with a phone specially one without a removable battery )
I really do hope someone invents a new type of battery. Lipos are anoyying
Simple you don't need too lol
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