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I'm new to WM5 having previously had a Blue Angel running 2003SE; so far I like my new toy by am wondering about the pros and cons regrading where to install applications Storage Card versus Main Memory. Obviously, installing on Storage card keeps memory free - this is a good thing, but will applications run slower from storage card?
What expereinace can you share regarding thsi?
Thanks
Chris
In WM2003, internal storage ROM is only used to store a backup of the OS and vendor extensions, and is only read during hard resets. Volatile RAM is used to store the OS, files, and applications during regular use (unless they are installed on the SD card), and so their storage must compete with the RAM needed for running programs.
WM5 changes everything -- with WM5, the OS, applications and files always get stored in a nonvolatile storage, be it internal or external, and this is separate from the RAM. Thus battery loss does not cause you to lose installed applications or files. RAM is totally available for running programs, and is not used to store files which are rarely used. There is no more competition for RAM between stored files and running programs.
The WM5 OS and applications running in the background will always use a certain amount of the 64 MB of RAM. You can free it up by removing unnecessary applications. You can also free up the non-volatile storage space by removing vendor extensions and cleaning up temporary files. See this thread, and search for "0506" in re: O2 XDA Exec ROM.
As I have not received my XDA Exec yet, I cannot comment on the speed differences between using internal storage and SD storage. Obviously both are slower than running programs stored in RAM, and depend on the speed on the storage card. But the difference between installing on a SD card and installing in the "default location" is less in WM5 than in WM2003. Installing in the default location won't reduce your available RAM, for example.
I'm sure others have opinions on how best to optimize memory.
thanks for the answer. I posed the question because I pretty much ran out of memory on my device. I have installed in Corporate mode, so don't have O2 active etc. I have just done a hard reset & will now install everything on my storage card just to see what happens
I have had a few WM5 devices. Basically install everything on a removable card. Only install on the internal storage utilities that you are likely to keep around and restrict this to a minimum and small things, like vbar, TRE, etc.
The disadvantage of course is that if you swap SD cards then you can't run applications until you put back in the card installed. I never have this problem as I have only 1gb card permanently in the system. I will shortly be upgrading to a 4gb card (as they are not around £100) which means this is less of a problem. Although note that in the current version of the xda exec's software the camera refuses to write to a 4gb card unless at least 2gb is full.
rgds
I too have a 1Gb card with a 4Gb on order. I'm not very bothered about the camera, but I have read about the 2Gb problem. Hopefully someone will fix this little bug, but until then I can save photos to main memory and then move them about
As a guide I install everything to a SD Card unless it's a today screen plugin or sync's in some way...
that's excatly my thought too - only things which have a today plugin go on the main memory; everything else to SD card - seems to work fine
Where do you guys usually install your apps to? Are there any benefits in installing to the Storage Card vs. installing in the internal memory of the phone?
Is the phone faster if all apps are installed on the storage card?
some apps definitely would not respond well if you install it in the storage card, especially if the app needs to 'wake up' from the power standby, due to the battery saving mode for external storage.
with X1, the phone storage is plenty that it doesn't make any difference for you to install in phone storage versus external. Upon fresh hardreset, my phone would have at least 204MB after deleting away the demo videos, etc. And this is standard ROM, not custom ROM.
Tri3Dent said:
Where do you guys usually install your apps to? Are there any benefits in installing to the Storage Card vs. installing in the internal memory of the phone?
Is the phone faster if all apps are installed on the storage card?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The truth is that it is "horses for courses"
If you regard the device as a phone with a bit of residual computer capability, then 300Mb of Storage will last a lifetime
If you regard it as a computer with a phone segment attached, then use the SD card for everything you can. The tnyynt SD tweak for speeding card access is brilliant to the point where I am unable to tell the practical difference between Storage and card use.
I use mine as a work computer with a phone attached. My 16Gb card is already 55% full (ie. just under 9Gb of data and programs) - this cannot fit in Storage.
man what kind of programs and data that you have that takes over 8 gigs on your phone.
music and videos i can understand, programs and data???? i got a 4 gig card and the only program that i have that takes up 1 gig is the maps for tomtom 7.910
hopefully the 32 gig card will be compatable with the x1 in the near future.
c_legaspi said:
man what kind of programs and data that you have that takes over 8 gigs on your phone.
music and videos i can understand, programs and data???? i got a 4 gig card and the only program that i have that takes up 1 gig is the maps for tomtom 7.910
hopefully the 32 gig card will be compatable with the x1 in the near future.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OK, well 1) as I said, my device is used as a computer with a phone segment attached, so having >8Gb "on my phone" is not really accurate. I have >8Gb on my card (ie. HDD) and growing
2) Music and video ?? None of them, I use hifi and TV for those when I'm home
3) I use the device for geological/geotechnical mapping on a world-wide basis, together with CAD/3D modeling of collected and supplied data. So high-level topo data, drillhole data, outcrop data, survey data, engineering constraints, zillions of reference reports etc etc + the slew of large programs needed to run these data collections
So for me, smaller, faster ROM = better and better
4) you bet I'm hanging out for the 32Gb cards
problem with having too little phone storage is some program use storage as temp
currently i have about 40gb storage free but still
the comic book reader crash often because the .net program in question
unzip the whole comic to some temp dir in phone storage
when it operates and apparently the comic use more then 40gb
would be easy for the programmer to fix so it didn't unzip all or did it to
the sd card but..
I put pretty much all programs that can be installed onto the card on the card... I also have shedloads of files on there mainly for language learning (I am learning Chinese and also have some Russian stuff)... from 16gb I am down to 7.7 and thats only cos I deleted a few tv shows from China...
PS I am reposting this due to the deletion bug thing... I did have a longer post but cant remeber all my witty reply...
flip a coin
Hello,
Can someone elaborate on what is meant by Storage memory and Program memory?
I would expect storage to be My Docs and Programs to be Windows and so on. I ask since my Storage allocation is two thirds full and all my docs on the device is empty. I use the SD card for that.
Cheers.
rphillip said:
Hello,
Can someone elaborate on what is meant by Storage memory and Program memory?
I would expect storage to be My Docs and Programs to be Windows and so on. I ask since my Storage allocation is two thirds full and all my docs on the device is empty. I use the SD card for that.
Cheers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
-Storage memory is memory used for saving files on you're phone, extention is you're memory card (micro SD).
-Program memory, is like the RAM-memory on you're PC, this is used when running programmes, watching movies-pictures...
Thanks. Well there are two storage areas. "Main" and "Storage Card". My query is for "Main". Within this there is "Storage" and "Program".
I would like to know what is used for what so I can look in a specific area and delete stuff I don't need. Like I said "Storage" seems rather full but I do not store anything on the phone itself. I use the storage card which does not present a problem.
In the storage info on the settings tab, under device it shows "storage" which is like your hard drive, and "program" which is like your RAM. Obviously, you don't actually have a hard drive. It's just an example
There's certain stuff that gets cached on the internal storage, and this can obviously bump up the space that's used (there's threads on here for cleaning/moving these things). Then there's the other culprit - Marketplace. If you've installed stuff from there, it's on internet memory, not your storage card. Also, do you install software to the device, or to the storage card? I only put essential stuff on the device, and stuff that I can live without on the storage card.
Just thoughts and suggestions.
johncmolyneux said:
In the storage info on the settings tab, under device it shows "storage" which is like your hard drive, and "program" which is like your RAM. Obviously, you don't actually have a hard drive. It's just an example
There's certain stuff that gets cached on the internal storage, and this can obviously bump up the space that's used (there's threads on here for cleaning/moving these things). Then there's the other culprit - Marketplace. If you've installed stuff from there, it's on internet memory, not your storage card. Also, do you install software to the device, or to the storage card? I only put essential stuff on the device, and stuff that I can live without on the storage card.
Just thoughts and suggestions.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah ok that explains a little then. I have been installing cabs to the device.
Do not understand; my total storage memory is 181,23MB, in use is 175,21MB, but when I check in explorer, there is only 89MB in use. What am I missing here??
Also, what does it mean program storage - total space 336,97MB?
Flash size 512MB, RAM size 448MB, what is the difference?
Its rather more complex than it ought to be, and HTC are being a little 'economical' with the truth!
It has 512MB of total storage, of which about 175MB is taken up by the ROM image. This leaves the 337MB you see reported. Of this, about 150MB is taken up by the HTC Sense system, then another chunk by the video memory leaving around 135MB free to the user. The new 'Light' custom ROMs without HTC Sense have over 300MB free to the user.
The 448MB RAM is just that- same as a PCs RAM. Even after loading the OS on startup there is ample ROM left for pretty much any eventuality!
why is the storage capacity is diffrent from devic to other?
for ex. my device has 141 MB and my friende device has 190 MB
the ammount of storage memory shown as 'free' depends on the size of the rom you are using, and also what programs you have installed to the phone memory,
He means the storage memory not the program memory ... we want to know the internal memory storage capcity of the Leo !! so we can judge where to install app and games, in device mem or SD mem ... any answer
lol, oh is THAT what he meant, oh, ok.
Right, well the storage memory is 512meg, however a good chunk of that is taken up by the ROM when it installs, and roms are different sizes (anywhere from 175 - 250 meg) .
Also, when you install an app, and choose to install to device instead of sd card, it installs into whatever is left over after the rom has been installed. .
And that is why the 'storage' memory shows around 250 or so total before adding programs.
Clever ****.
thanks but I can't keep on with your sophisticated info about the total storage capcity of the device ... let me tell u what mine is : when I go to settings, then SD card and Phone storage, the Total storage is 194.55 from the first day of using it ... now after about 1 week, I installed a huge amount of apps, themes and games in dev memo and SD card memo, the total storage is the same ... ? but my colleagues total storage capcity is different ( ex 140 MB ) ... shouldn't be the same total capcity in all the devices ? keeping in mind that we have different roms in each our 3 devices ...
Thanks for your help
the total storage memory of a blank hd2 is 512 megabytes. when you load the rom and it installs windows and any programs and extras (facebook app, the example photos and music, etcetera) they all go into that 512 megabytes. whatever is left is the available storage memory.this is then used for programs you instal (ignore storage card) your contacts, temporary files, everything. if you get two completely untouched t mobile hd2s and compare the total storage they should be just about identical, but that will probably be different to an untouched o2 hd2.
when chefs cook roms they often take out lots of stuff.(the photos for instance) so a t mobile phone that has been flashed with a new rom will have a different total storage than thee original.
most people haver roughly 200 to 300(broadly speaking) megabytes storage available.
is there a way to change the internal storage?
I think depend on ROM that you use. Each ROM not same free space.
OK guys..pardon my stupidity..i have read up on similar thread with similar situation but the thing is i do not know what is the best way to do it..i install the cleartemp but it's not working...i deleted my IE/Opera cache but i am still running on low memory..i wonder what is the best and simplest way to do it?other then hard reset thou...this phone is new to me and it's running on low memory already..my apps are install in my SD so i guess that wasn't an issue..SO! how do i free my phone memory?basically i use my phone to surf net..using IE..other then that would be youtube..need help!
yohliying said:
OK guys..pardon my stupidity..i have read up on similar thread with similar situation but the thing is i do not know what is the best way to do it..i install the cleartemp but it's not working...i deleted my IE/Opera cache but i am still running on low memory..i wonder what is the best and simplest way to do it?other then hard reset thou...this phone is new to me and it's running on low memory already..my apps are install in my SD so i guess that wasn't an issue..SO! how do i free my phone memory?basically i use my phone to surf net..using IE..other then that would be youtube..need help!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
how 'low' is 'low memory'?
rp-x1 said:
how 'low' is 'low memory'?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And which memory because you are talking about installing apps when that has nothing directly to do with operating memory.
Installing on mem card doesn't "save" anything in this regard.
I'm also low on Storage-mem on the phone - even though I install programs on the memorycard whenever possible (and of course put my pictures, music and videos on the mem-card as well!).
I have 177mb free Program-memory on the phone but only 9.3mb storage-mem.
This makes programs such as the YouTube-app very unhappy as it seems to only be able to cache to internal storage-memory :-(
On older versions of WM you could change how the phone used it's internal memory with a slider in settings.
The phone also seemed to adjust this automatically as it became necessary.
Now however it seems that this possibility is gone (both manual and automatic adjustment).
I hope it is only my ignorance speaking so here's hoping that someone has a solution to this problem (fingers crossed)
trondkk said:
I'm also low on Storage-mem on the phone - even though I install programs on the memorycard whenever possible (and of course put my pictures, music and videos on the mem-card as well!).
I have 177mb free Program-memory on the phone but only 9.3mb storage-mem.
This makes programs such as the YouTube-app very unhappy as it seems to only be able to cache to internal storage-memory :-(
On older versions of WM you could change how the phone used it's internal memory with a slider in settings.
The phone also seemed to adjust this automatically as it became necessary.
Now however it seems that this possibility is gone (both manual and automatic adjustment).
I hope it is only my ignorance speaking so here's hoping that someone has a solution to this problem (fingers crossed)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you have used up storage mem then that's it but what have you installed to use it.
Mine shows 152Mb storage and 252Mb program memory free. 27 apps installed and everything running fine.
Do you install a lot of application from the Marketplace? If so, this defaults to install on internal memory
I have exactly the same issue, and it's very frustrating. Pretty crazy really as I can't use the phone for anything that uses device storage. No youtube, no media busy web pages and some apps refuse to run smoothly, or at all.
Like you, I'm always having to delete Opera & IE's cache files just to keep the phone functioning! I've also deleted all my Co-Pilot files on the card and the device - this helped a little and gave me another 5 or 6 MB of device space.
With all cache's cleared and around 30 programs installed (all on the card) I now only have 7.8MB of free device storage, which disappears within a few minutes when using Opera.
Out of the 336MB of program storage I have filled 153MB with 182MB free - I wish I could control how much memory is allocated to the program memory and device memory.
Very strange...I have any large applications like games, copliot etc installed on my SD card, only small apps on my internal memory...
Total storage: 200.15MB
Used storage: 119.99MB
Free storage: 80.16MB
Total program: 336.93MB
Used program: 170.54MB
Free profram: 166.89MB
i have a 16 meg Ram Disk (see the 'ram disk' thread ) and my system temp folders and caches, plus opera cache have been moved to it. Opera now runs really fast, and the cache is no longer taking up the storage memory, plus when you soft reset it clears out the cache too.
chronicle said:
I have exactly the same issue, and it's very frustrating. Pretty crazy really as I can't use the phone for anything that uses device storage. No youtube, no media busy web pages and some apps refuse to run smoothly, or at all.
Like you, I'm always having to delete Opera & IE's cache files just to keep the phone functioning! I've also deleted all my Co-Pilot files on the card and the device - this helped a little and gave me another 5 or 6 MB of device space.
With all cache's cleared and around 30 programs installed (all on the card) I now only have 7.8MB of free device storage, which disappears within a few minutes when using Opera.
Out of the 336MB of program storage I have filled 153MB with 182MB free - I wish I could control how much memory is allocated to the program memory and device memory.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
.
Wow thats so confusing!
Just tell us
Storage memory (where the apps are installed)
Program memory (where the apps and OS run)
You should have plenty of mem to install ail your apps and run them without a problem.
Try installing them all to phone because you have enough mem
pa49 said:
.
Wow thats so confusing!
Just tell us
Storage memory (where the apps are installed)
Program memory (where the apps and OS run)
You should have plenty of mem to install ail your apps and run them without a problem.
Try installing them all to phone because you have enough mem
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have since day 1 installed all my programs to the memory card apart from a couple of programs and hotfixes which I though would be smarter if I installed to the device - but these are tiny. I have also set my marketplace to default to the memory card and removed all co-pilot files and set all podcasts to the microSD too.
Total Storage: 200.27
Used Storage: 191.48
Free Storage: 8.79 (whohooo, that's much bigger than normal!)
Total Program: 336.93
Used Program: 143.89
Free Program: 192.93
SD Card: Over 2GB's free
I really have no idea what's using all my internal storage.
Yep - that's about the same for me.
Only a few apps are installed directly on the phone (the ones that install without letting the user decide where they want them) so what's hogging my phone-storage is beyond me...
But I really don't need close to 200 mb of program-memory, is there really no way to use some of this memory for storage - as was possible with earlier versions of WM?
Have you tried importing to PC, such as pictures and other things, using Windows Mobile Centre?
chronicle said:
I have since day 1 installed all my programs to the memory card apart from a couple of programs and hotfixes which I though would be smarter if I installed to the device - but these are tiny. I have also set my marketplace to default to the memory card and removed all co-pilot files and set all podcasts to the microSD too.
Total Storage: 200.27
Used Storage: 191.48
Free Storage: 8.79 (whohooo, that's much bigger than normal!)
Total Program: 336.93
Used Program: 143.89
Free Program: 192.93
SD Card: Over 2GB's free
I really have no idea what's using all my internal storage.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes but why? Storage mem is there for, well, storage. So why not use it?
pa49 said:
Yes but why? Storage mem is there for, well, storage. So why not use it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can't help but think that you've missed the point - when the storage memory is full the phone ceases to function properly!
It uses this area of storage for the cache files for the browser and for applications such as you tube. When I start the youtube app, if it opens at all, it will say 'Critically low on system memory...etc' and shut down after playing a few seconds. If I have many tabs open in opera the same memory problem occurs.
The 'Device Storage' partition is full (with what I don't know) whilst the 'Device Program' partition is almost empty. We have no control over what sizes those partitions are. Maybe i've got it all wrong but either way it's really limiting the usefulness of the phone.
trondkk said:
But I really don't need close to 200 mb of program-memory, is there really no way to use some of this memory for storage - as was possible with earlier versions of WM?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes there is. as I mentioned in post 9, I use a ram disk for my temp files and cache. lives in program memory but shows up as a (fast) memory card.
search for the ram disk thread.
also, as regards figuring out what is taking up all the space, use a file manager (don't forget to unhide all files) and search for everything over....say....1 meg.
chronicle said:
I can't help but think that you've missed the point - when the storage memory is full the phone ceases to function properly!
It uses this area of storage for the cache files for the browser and for applications such as you tube. When I start the youtube app, if it opens at all, it will say 'Critically low on system memory...etc' and shut down after playing a few seconds. If I have many tabs open in opera the same memory problem occurs.
The 'Device Storage' partition is full (with what I don't know) whilst the 'Device Program' partition is almost empty. We have no control over what sizes those partitions are. Maybe i've got it all wrong but either way it's really limiting the usefulness of the phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No I haven't missed the point, I just don't get the problem and I'm trying to figure out why not?
And that would help you. Something is causing certain phones to behave this way. I use youtube and opera and never have to clear out anything.
I currently have 36 apps showing on my start menu screen and memory is showing as Storage 152.13 Mb free and program 313.80 Mb free.
I run Titanium (not manilla UI) and I have LeoLite ROM installed.
Something in that setup is causing the phone to respond differently!
Duplicate post
u can do these things
1. instal darkcab catcher----on this website...moves all the programs to external storage
2. moves ur htc album cache and opera cache to external storage
hash1234 said:
u can do these things
1. instal darkcab catcher----on this website...moves all the programs to external storage
2. moves ur htc album cache and opera cache to external storage
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I might be a little bit stupid, but on what website can I find darkcab catcher?