Database Users

All about BlueTooth

Hi, as we'll all end up with an xda2, and they seem set to have built in Buetooth. I thought a thread all about the possitive applications for Bluetooth would be useful.
Can we steer away from the 'why can't it just have wifi' argument and actually discuss uses for bluetooth.
My thoughts are...
Bt gps mouse for the car would be fantastic. allowing you to pass the xda around the car and still have it picking up a signal. even take it outside the car when stopped to plan the rest of your route.
I have a broadband internet connection at home, running from a dedicated server machine, by Bt'ing the server i'll be able to wirelessly surf the net anywhere in my house, that would rock! internet based voice comms in my mobile. guess you could also Bt activesync if you really felt the need, but i tend to charge it at the same time so i'll stilll be plugging a cable in.
Bt headsets could be good. driving along the road and your phone rings etc...
Guess you could Bt contacts and appointments etc
Bt games could be interesting, think theres a worms clone called snails that already does this.
Does anyone know if it'll be able to connect to more than one Bt device at a time? say a gps system and a headset? or my server machine and a headset? Can anyone think of Bt uses that i've overlooked

i hope your house's not so big do not forget BTs range does not go over 10 meters and BT is much more subject to interferences frequencies with other devices than 802.b or g protocol. Even more BT max speed theorically is 2 Mbps, whereas wifi 802.11b is 10 and 802.11g is 54
i guess THAT makes the difference too
BT is more secure ok but within a very limited range and brandwidth, perfect for headsets

You can use multiple devices. BT effectively doesn't even give the full 10-meter specified range (unless it is Class II, 100 meter spec). It is very slow with an effective throughput around 700k. It is fantastic for headsets, and still much faster than GPRS. The GPS thing makes me laugh though...both devices need power, so why not just cable them together?!?

accessing internet via satelite

I am curious to know as I use my pda for the main purpuse of road navigation but would like to know if also I can access the internet through the gps receiver.

Sorry but that cannot be done, the gps receiver is a receiver only unless its bluetooth in which case it receives the gps signals and transmits them over bluetooth to the phone/pda, it has no capability of satellite communication for internet.

if the gps satelite had access to the internet and would send data and the gsp module had support for recieving data i guess it could be don
but since gps was invented by the us army and they still use it i doubt they would add too much internet support in that system
also it would be a bad thing for all people who were using gps when the whole system would crawl to a halt when little timmy were downloading powerranger mpg's

It couldn't work, how would the satellite receive the page request? To do this, the GPS module would have to be a transceiver...which it isn't.
I guess for this to be possible, you need a satellite chip like in a sat. phone....I wonder if anyone will produce one to go in a CF slot anytime soon? Would be pretty cool!
Ben

A GPS Receiver mainly receives clocking signals from different sattellites and calculates your position based on the timedrift between the different clock feeds.
These clockfeeds are actually broadcasted on a singal transponder and single channel for each sattellite... in other words, everyone receives the same stream... so no luck there
Regardless of that fact, a GPS receiver is usually pretty dump and doesnt have the brain to maintain Layer 2 (let alone 3) cohesion for a data stream.
Anyways... my 2c

bluetooth around my whole house???

is it possible to get bluetooth relayed from my main computer all around my house so that i have wireless internet for my xda2?
something like a relayer of some description.
oh and is it possible to do this cheaply.. if not il go for wifi lol.

Yes
Yes, I use this all the time. I'd recommend getting a Bluetooth 100m adaptor. Connect via BT Activesync.

I would recommend wifi rather than bluetooth for networking in the house. It is much faster and far more stable and doesnt need line of sight.

i have a 100m connector for my pc. but my pda can only do 10m... so can i relay something in my room just to get the extra 10m or something? if so how?

bluetooth isn't line of sight either.
if you have the 100m repeater, it shouldn't matter how far the pda can see, the 100m repeater should get the signal into your room or wherever. only one of the devices needs to be strong, not both.
im not sure why its not working

the xda series bluetooth is only 10m
so as far as i know having a 100m bluetooth dongle dont help
because both ends have to be cetified for 100m for it to have a
range of 100m
maybe some repeater would work
of cause it would prob be more expensive then going wifi
also i find bluetooth slow

cruisin-thru said:
I would recommend wifi rather than bluetooth for networking in the house. It is much faster and far more stable and doesnt need line of sight.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bluetooth doesn't need line of sight either. Performance varies, but is actually better than WiFi in some circumstances. It does not matter that your device can only handle 10m, a 100m dongle will still transmit faster to a further distance, in my experience.

Well from experience and having spent quite a bit of money on setting up bluetooth networks in my home...it sucks bigtime. I now have wireless and have never had a problem.
Rudegear, yes you are correct, although it doesnt sound logical it makes no difference whether you have a 100 mtr adaptor on your desktop, if your phone does only 10 meters it will struggle. I had a 100 meter usb dongle but lost signal in the next bedromm.
The reason I mentioned line of sight is because the signal seems to be drastically reduced when it has travelled through a wall, whereas if it is in the same room it will be ok. WiFi is designed for fast data connection over distance while bluetooth is a low power application that has relatively low data speeds.

i think if i put a usb 100 m in a room upstairs aswell then itl work... i have a crappy comp tht i cud use but is it worth doing... i mean its another £20.. i probably will.. thx fr the help.

WIFI v Bluetooth
We have both running, and my wife and i both using simultaneously the XDAII, we measured manually the speed between, and WIFI was marginally better.
We were both in the room next door. However, we do get better distance from the WIFI rather than the bluetooth.
Both were centralised to the house, and both at the same height (about 1.6m high), and all can reach around the house. Few houses get over 20mx20m, so if you centralise either or, you can get around it easy enough with adequate coverage.
WIFI is generally better as most routers and WIFI units can handle multiple simultaneous access, where as bluetooth struggles.

would bluetooth not loose connection speed as the range inc much more then wifi would ?
the watt they send are much much lower

Hi Aidwe,
I just installed a Bluetooth Access Point DBT-900AP from D-Link (euro 50).
Bluetooth-to-LAN Access Point
Connect it somewhere to your internet router/modem/switch via Ethernet.
The box will get an IP-adress and via Bluetooth PAN-profile, you will have internet access throughout the house (circle of +- 10 mtr. around the access point).
My only problem: the Magician (T-Mobile MDA Compact) doesn't support the bluetooth protocol standard, but out of the box XDA's with the Bluetooth Manager will work.
www.dlink.de
http://www.ameinfo.com/44944.html
Greetings Ben...
P.S. no info about the DBT-900 on www.dlink.com !

not sure about the bluetooth stack on universal but himalaya default ms bluetooth stack dont support PAN

Any PPC with 100 meters bluetooth?(or CF card)
Any PPC with 100 meters bluetooth?(or CF card)

Linking 5 cars via tether for streaming

Wud up doh ladies.
Heres my predicament, my buds and i are driving up to daytona for SBN (spring break nationals, a bass competition) and were basically driving in a caravan.
Each car has at least 5000 rms and up to 15000 rms. (watts)
What we thought would be epic was for me to be djing off of a laptop on the way there, connected via ustream and all 5 cars tuning in to my stream allowing us to play the exact same songs at the exact same time from the 5 vehicles making you be able to hear us from a mile or so away
Predicament. To my knowledge, we have an ipad with ability to tether and nothing else as or right now considering i havent really looked too far into it.
However, We do have a power converter in one of the vehicles allowing us to use a wall outlet essentially.
I was entertaining the idea to have a router connected and to be streaming via a shoutcast server over LAN but im unaware of any app that allows you to tune into shoutcast radios being broadcast over a lan on itouch or ipad or iphone or android for that matter. I am aware that winamp allows you to plug in your listening IP but i have never tested it to work over lan nor on an android and i dont believe its on iphone etc.
So my alternative was to leech internet off the ipad, but if the caravan is 5 cars long, will all cars be able to reach the signal from the ONE ipad, and will that ipad have enough bandwidth to have me dj (upstream, upload) and 5 devices stream (downstream, download). Audio will be streamed at 48kbps if i remember correctly so the bandwidth required ISNT massive however over 5 devices i believe it might be an issue.
if the bandwidth is sufficent i was entertaining the ability to attempt to use the ipad as a WAP (Wireless access point) connected via the router then have an antenna from the router on the roof of the car to boost distance you can pick up the signal from.
WTB ANSWERS, i have 3 weeks to get this to happen

I doubt very seriously the wifi antenna in the iPad is capable of handling this sort of abuse.
You might be able to do it with a laptop and a wireless AP in infrastructure mode and have multiple clients connect to that system.

Regizzle said:
Wud up doh ladies.
Heres my predicament, my buds and i are driving up to daytona for SBN (spring break nationals, a bass competition) and were basically driving in a caravan.
Each car has at least 5000 rms and up to 15000 rms. (watts)
What we thought would be epic was for me to be djing off of a laptop on the way there, connected via ustream and all 5 cars tuning in to my stream allowing us to play the exact same songs at the exact same time from the 5 vehicles making you be able to hear us from a mile or so away
Predicament. To my knowledge, we have an ipad with ability to tether and nothing else as or right now considering i havent really looked too far into it.
However, We do have a power converter in one of the vehicles allowing us to use a wall outlet essentially.
I was entertaining the idea to have a router connected and to be streaming via a shoutcast server over LAN but im unaware of any app that allows you to tune into shoutcast radios being broadcast over a lan on itouch or ipad or iphone or android for that matter. I am aware that winamp allows you to plug in your listening IP but i have never tested it to work over lan nor on an android and i dont believe its on iphone etc.
So my alternative was to leech internet off the ipad, but if the caravan is 5 cars long, will all cars be able to reach the signal from the ONE ipad, and will that ipad have enough bandwidth to have me dj (upstream, upload) and 5 devices stream (downstream, download). Audio will be streamed at 48kbps if i remember correctly so the bandwidth required ISNT massive however over 5 devices i believe it might be an issue.
if the bandwidth is sufficent i was entertaining the ability to attempt to use the ipad as a WAP (Wireless access point) connected via the router then have an antenna from the router on the roof of the car to boost distance you can pick up the signal from.
WTB ANSWERS, i have 3 weeks to get this to happen
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sounds like a pretty sweet idea dude! If I were in your shoes, I would create a powerful, rolling, WiFi LAN. Here's how I would do it:
Here's what you would need:
VLC (it's free)
A really powerful wireless router with external antenna's
Make sure the laptop you're going to be performing the broadcast from has its own wired network adapter
What you would do:
Connect your laptop up to the WAN port of the wireless router (the same port that you would normally connect your Cable Modem/DSL/FiOS). This is because you want your laptop to be set up as the default gateway for that LAN.
I would perform the broadcast from the middle car in the caravan for the best signal to the rest of the vehicles, possibly even use external antenna's (like, external to the car itself, not just the router) for the best possible signal quality.
Set up a local VLC streaming server on the laptop. This way you can make the stream much higher bandwidth and higher quality. Everyone can tune into with their own VLC client's, whether on other laptops, or iOS/Android devices with VLC.
Done correctly, this setup won't even require an internet connection, as everything will be done via the local network. That said, if the broadcasting laptop has a mobile connection tethered up to it, then everyone can benefit from that if they wanted to.
Overall, the mobile WLAN idea, in conjunction with a local VLC broadcast, will afford you the best audio quality along with the highest degree of reliability, as you won't need to worry about dead spots in the mobile coverage. Also, this method will yield the lowest latency (because they'd all be on the same local network), so for everyone in the caravan, their stereo's will more likely be playing the same thing at the same time as opposed to everyone playing the same thing, but all at different parts depending on their cellular network conditions.
What do you think?

Will the router do it? Unless it's a real piece of junk, yes. (And by junk I don't mean something selling new for $19.99, I mean something real cheap. Even a $20 router should handle 5 audio streams without waking up.)
Will the idea work? Not the way you want. There will be a delay of up to a few seconds between the streams to each car. All the cars can hear the same song at (within a couple of seconds at most) the same time. But close enough that there's no echo? No.
Connect a computer's web browser to a web audio source (police scanner, or anything else where the source doesn't start by your connecting to it, like a podcast will). Connect your phone to the same source (using its browser). Notice that there's a delay between them.
Nothing you can do about it - that's just how streaming works these days. Maybe for SBN 2025.

With encoding and decoding of digital audio streams, signal quality, et cetera.. you'll find it hard to achieve a truly synchronized stream. With new ATSC broadcast standards, even television sets in my household are off-sync; there is an echo.
Here's where analog synchronization comes in. It might seem very old-fashioned, but you could use an FM transmitter for this. I don't know much about them, but be aware of FCC regulations here in the states. You'll need a fairly high-power one and an omnidirectional antenna. Plan on a nice big investment, too!
Some cons to an FM transmitter:
1. Reliability: it's RARE that you'll find a vacant station in a metro area. Broadcasting over live stations is illegal, and requires a LOT more power than you can get in a portable FM transmitter.
2. Security: the music stream is unprotected. Just about anyone nearby could pick up your station and use YOUR tunes.
3. Vulnerability: it's possible that someone else could bring a more powerful FM transmitter, and broadcast Justin Bieber to your five vehicles (yikes!)

It'd probably be easier to store local copies of the music in each vehicle and use a network connection to handle synchronizing hitting the "Play" buttons.
But you'd probably have to write a whole new application.

dfc849 said:
With encoding and decoding of digital audio streams, signal quality, et cetera.. you'll find it hard to achieve a truly synchronized stream. With new ATSC broadcast standards, even television sets in my household are off-sync; there is an echo.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ya, anything that encodes and decodes is very likely to do it at a slightly different rate, so synchronization would be very difficult. Even if you could get them started at the same time, they will probably slip out of sync after some time, too. This goes for the idea of just pushing "play" at the same time. Music playing at slightly different rates may sound the same to us, but will shortly fall out of sync.
dfc849 said:
Some cons to an FM transmitter:
1. Reliability: it's RARE that you'll find a vacant station in a metro area. Broadcasting over live stations is illegal, and requires a LOT more power than you can get in a portable FM transmitter.
2. Security: the music stream is unprotected. Just about anyone nearby could pick up your station and use YOUR tunes.
3. Vulnerability: it's possible that someone else could bring a more powerful FM transmitter, and broadcast Justin Bieber to your five vehicles (yikes!)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
On the other hand, to broadcast only a few hundred feet you could probably get something at a computer store that would handle it. I know I picked up a $10 FM transmitter meant for iPods and CD players to connect them to a car stereo. It transmits from my computer to my stereo about 50ft away with no problem, though I haven't tested the limits. It would be easy enough to just plug it into your DJ machine and set all the cars to the same radio station. You could try sticking it to the top of the car and see how far away the other cars still get a clear signal. If it's not enough, you could probably pop it open and extend the antenna a little and get better range.

Where are you driving UP from? Cuba? All of that for a 4 hour trip if you are as far South as Miami?

xpather that
Cool idea

i'd go with analog, i.e. FM transmitter

You ought to have good line of sight on the other members of your caravan.. While I'd recommend keeping the DJ in the center of the pack, even if all five cars were strung along you ought to get good signal from front to back. Just don't get too separated (finding ways to manage that is half the fun of caravaning).
I'll echo what was said above and recommend you preload your songs on all the devices. Streaming synchronized audio is simply impractical. *Playing* all the songs at the same times might be more doable. Maybe. Your mileage may vary, etc etc.

How to use 2 realtime devices via odb2 port

Hi, I have an issue related to odb2 that need your help guys,.
Currently, I have a HUD to show the speed and battery of car. I also have an ELM327 running by Torque app which help me keep track with many technical data realtime. All 2 devices are connected to the odb split wires.
The problem is when i use both device, only the elm327 show data via Torque app. The HUD only works if only I close the app Torque. It means each time I could only use 1 device. I even changed many type of device either many type of odb split wires but no use.
I would be grateful and appreciate your support to solve my issue.
Rgds,

I don't know if this feasible and as i am thinking it whatever connects uses a connection with specific baud rate and a standard like in the old days we had dialup modems.... that times you wasn't able to put 2 modems in the sane line, but maybe im wrong.