In many of the old threads here I see recommendations about underclocking the CPU in the NST, usually with either SetCPU or No-Frills CPU Control.
Has anyone ever actually been able to get a max_freq that's lower than 800MHz (or 1000MHz with guevor's kernels), though? I never have. The setting sticks and the correct value is written to /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_max_freq (which you can also do manually from a terminal emu or adb), but the setting seems to have no effect. ./stats/time_in_state or the current freq still show that higher frequencies are used just as much. Oddly enough, increasing the scaling_min_freq does work, though I don't want to do that.
I even tried modifying the init.rc and setting a lower max_freq there, but still no luck.
Am I the only one that has this issue? Maybe it's some kind of conflict with another setting I use or something?
I'd really like to be able to use guevor's 166 kernel, but I don't want the 1000MHz overclock, since it definitely drains the battery faster when you're doing anything other than reading. Alternately, does anyone know if there's another kernel out there that works with both NoRefresh and Fastmode2, but doesn't have the overclock?
SweaterFish said:
Has anyone ever actually been able to get a max_freq that's lower than 800MHz (or 1000MHz with guevor's kernels), though? I never have.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Back in the day I did use No Frills CPU Control and I seem to recall being able to reduce clocking and have that persist. But that was many years and quite a few grey cells ago.
SweaterFish said:
I'd really like to be able to use guevor's 166 kernel, but I don't want the 1000MHz overclock, since it definitely drains the battery faster when you're doing anything other than reading. Alternately, does anyone know if there's another kernel out there that works with both NoRefresh and Fastmode2, but doesn't have the overclock?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I know I certainly had the CPU down to 800MHz, never at 1GHz. All the FastMode compatible kernels are overclocked and only 166 is able to run NoRefresh (which doesn't actually require any kernel modification, although multi-touch is nice to have with it) and FastMode (not at the same time, of course).
nmyshkin said:
I know I certainly had the CPU down to 800MHz, never at 1GHz.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hm, odd. Did you ever actually confirm that the CPU didn't run at 1000MHz by looking at the time_in_state stats?
I've never been able to underclock with any kernel. My system is based on fw1.2.1 rooted with NookManager, with many small modifications and all the stock apps removed, but I don't see why any of that would affect the CPU max freq, especially in a way that would still have the min freq setting work.
The best I've been able to do is adjust the scaling governor settings to make it less likely to step up, but that doesn't work all that well.
SweaterFish said:
Hm, odd. Did you ever actually confirm that the CPU didn't run at 1000MHz by looking at the time_in_state stats?
I've never been able to underclock with any kernel. My system is based on fw1.2.1 rooted with NookManager, with many small modifications and all the stock apps removed, but I don't see why any of that would affect the CPU max freq, especially in a way that would still have the min freq setting work.
The best I've been able to do is adjust the scaling governor settings to make it less likely to step up, but that doesn't work all that well.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did not get as technical as you. It's been a long time since I used one of those kernels and I only recall that there were a bunch of arcane settings in the CPU governor app which I did not fully understand but set according to some list somewhere.
As far as the app was concerned, the CPU freq was under control. Whether that was actually the case or not was beyond my pay grade.
What it comes down to is how important is FastMode to you? I personally found the ghosting intolerable. It's certainly not for reading as the fine image quality is so degraded by the dithering. In the end, USB Audio and NoRefresh were more important to me and there is no kernel that supports both of the enhanced display modes and USB host. So I didn't have to deal with the overclocking issue.
FastMode and NoRefresh have different uses, in my opinion. FastMode is nice because it keeps working even when you change apps. I use it mostly to reduce the amount of screen flashing when I'm doing things like moving files around. NoRefresh would be worse than the regular behavior since it would keep disabling.
Overall, I'd prefer to be able to use both even if it means more battery drain in some cases, which is what I've been doing for years.
I was just curious if other people had this issue or not since I've never seen anyone else mention it. The time_in_state stats are shown in both No-Frills and SetCPU and I figured most people would look at them if they were trying to adjust the freqs.
Related
Well? I would find out for myself, but I cannot buy nexus yet.
Also, does the keyboard have multitouch?
Nexus One scales the cpu frequency from 245MHz to 998MHz based on cpu load using the standard Linux cpufreq support. You don't actually need root access to see this, as the cpufreq status and stats are readable from userspace by anyone.
Of course most of the time the CPU is completely powered down (including much of the time when the screen is on)... otherwise battery life would be pretty bad...
Sounds a little like how the tegra works
swetland said:
Nexus One scales the cpu frequency from 245MHz to 998MHz based on cpu load using the standard Linux cpufreq support. You don't actually need root access to see this, as the cpufreq status and stats are readable from userspace by anyone.
Of course most of the time the CPU is completely powered down (including much of the time when the screen is on)... otherwise battery life would be pretty bad...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
this man wins, thread over... people need to stop asking...
you dont advertise 1ghz speeds and underclock without expecting a fat lawsuit and google isnt trying to make any enemies (no multitouch?) lol
I wanted to explain black screen issue many folks are encountering with overclocked kernels. The root cause is that voltages at higher clock speeds are not high enough to get the screen to turn on. In other words, if your screen is off and your phone scales beyond 800Mhz, the phone does not have enough power to turn the screen on. You'll almost always scale to the max the moment you hit that power button.
There are a few ways to prevent this from happening (from best to worst):
Create a "screen off" profile in SetCPU to restrict the clock to 800Mhz or below when the screen is off. I think it's obvious why this works. At the same time, a lot of people already do this, which explains why everyone hasn't been having the problem.
Use the conservative governor. Because it scales more gradually, it won't immediately jump past 800Mhz when you attempt to power the screen. There is still a chance of encountering the issue if you attempt to turn on the screen if the device has been busy for a while.
Increase voltages in the kernel. I started experimenting with this before I decided to come here and recommend the first two options. To get the screen to reliably turn on at higher clock speeds, we'd have to raise the voltages substantially. So we'd end up with more risk of damaging components, degraded battery performance and so on. Once the screen is on, the cpu does not actually need more power than it's being given in today's frequency tables. Thus, we'd effectively be increasing power consumption all the time to deal with a need for more power at screen on. Clearly a bad idea.
Unless you're using SetCPU profiles (or equivalent) or the conservative frequency governor, you're going to get black screens. Cyanogen, Pershoot, Evil's and my kernels all use roughly the same voltages, so you're going to need to apply this solution regardless.
There you have it.
*Applauds*
I bow down to your wisdom, sir!
Can you explain why this doesn't happen to me when I'm on CM 6.1.1 ROM?
With setcpu settings at 1209/368 (ondemand scaling, no profiles) I have black screens on Virtuous but neveron Cyanogen's mods.
rgl12miami said:
Can you explain why this doesn't happens to me when I'm on CM 6.1.1 ROM?
With setcpu settings at 1200/300 I have black screens on Virtuous but never
on Cyanogen's mods.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'd have to do more testing to confirm but I would guess more load is generated (events triggered) with Sense ROMs at the time of wake, causing the ondemand governor to scale up to nearly max more rapidly than CM.
There's a simple way to see if it'll ever happen on CM. Set your governor to "performance", with clock speed above 1Ghz. Turn off the screen and see if it fails to turn after a few attempts at toggling it on and off.
I did what you suggested about 30 times and no one has failed. It's a shame,
because I do really love your ROM: speed is incredible. But what bothers me
the most is when the alarm sounds or I receive a call and the screen refuse to
lighten up. I will keep an eye on your rom and for sure I will be back on it soon.
Great job! The best sense rom i've ever seen.
Thanks for this. Works perfectly on my Stock SenseUI ROM with virtuous kernel
Thanks! That explains why the issue hasn't been happening since I set my profile to conservative. That was probably the most annoying issue since I got my G2.
I bet the fact that every cpu is different would also explain why it happens to some and not others.
Again every cpu is different, but here is my settings for screen off. Min 245 max 245. I started min 245 max 368, dropped max down and no adverse effects and great bat life. I have no blackscreen/wakeup issuses. I've been using setcpu to save battery since before the first oc module/kernel.
Would def test kernel that drops below 245 and/or uv it greatly.
fastludeh22 said:
I bet the fact that every cpu is different would also explain why it happens to some and not others.
Again every cpu is different, but here is my settings for screen off. Min 245 max 245. I started min 245 max 368, dropped max down and no adverse effects and great bat life. I have no blackscreen/wakeup issuses. I've been using setcpu to save battery since before the first oc module/kernel.
Would def test kernel that drops below 245 and/or uv it greatly.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What do you mean that every CPU is different? At the hardware, firmware, software level?
gee one said:
What do you mean that every CPU is different? At the hardware, firmware, software level?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think he means every cpu handle overclocking differently, for example ive been very unlucky and my cpu cant handle anything above 1.1 Ghz and it crashes if i set it up any higher but lots of people running theirs at 1.8 and they are stable
its just like overclocking PCs every cpu handle overclocking differently even if they have the exact same spec.
I'm bumping this due to how useful this information is and how often the issue still comes up.
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA App
rmk40 said:
I wanted to explain black screen issue many folks are encountering with overclocked kernels. The root cause is that voltages at higher clock speeds are not high enough to get the screen to turn on. In other words, if your screen is off and your phone scales beyond 800Mhz, the phone does not have enough power to turn the screen on. You'll almost always scale to the max the moment you hit that power button.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't understand why I don't encounter this issue at all with AOSP ROMs. Is there an obvious reason I'm missing?
poochie2 said:
I don't understand why I don't encounter this issue at all with AOSP ROMs. Is there an obvious reason I'm missing?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This was the first question asked (see the fourth post). Here's the OP's theory...
rmk40 said:
I'd have to do more testing to confirm but I would guess more load is generated (events triggered) with Sense ROMs at the time of wake, causing the ondemand governor to scale up to nearly max more rapidly than CM.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I haven't seen this issue before either.
ianmcquinn said:
This was the first question asked (see the fourth post).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My bad, I missed that.
For those of you on CM7 (preferably RC2 or later nightlies), are you using SetCPU or the built in CMSettings CPU manager? Which is giving you better performance/battery life?
I can't help but think that the built in CM Settings CPU tuner is going to be conflicting with my SetCPU profiles.
Been using nightlies since #30 or so, and I currently run SetCPU with a normal profile, a screen off profile, and a profile for <10% battery and haven't touched CMSettings' CPU manager.
I'm contemplating just uninstalling SetCPU for a day or two and seeing what a 1017max / 245min Ondemand or Powersave governor via CMSettings ends up doing to my battery life considering there will be no screen off profile.
Any thoughts?
I dumped setCPU after a lot of testing (and even bought it on market)
I'm finding I'm much happier using inbuilt CPU settings. I think battery life is the same but performance is better due to the fact that SetCPU would sometimes get stuck in my screen-off profile when turned on causing the phone to be really slow.
I recomend uninstalling setCPU, set your ONDEMAND governor with ~1Ghz and run it... You'll find your battery about the same but much less hassle.
I have yet to try that, I somewhat feel obligated to use SetCPU since I purchased it lol. But it probably won't be the last time I waste money at the market.
Neither. CPU tuner works best for me.
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA Premium App
Utorrent76 said:
Neither. CPU tuner works best for me.
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA Premium App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
its the same thing :facepalm:
Try the inbuilt one... I think its way easier
I've been wondering about this too. I don't quite understand how it works. Can I just set the frequency higher till a certain point without changing the voltage and get the same battery life?
What's the best way of doing this? Just change the clock speed or do I need to change something else or update the kernel?
Whatever you tell SetCPU to do, you'll see the same settings mirrored in the CM settings.
I say setCPU cuz as battery gets lower... I have my CPU speed lower also. Basically, 15% battery lasts me forever :] lol
Sent from my T-Mobile G2
DJAeroX26 said:
I say setCPU cuz as battery gets lower... I have my CPU speed lower also. Basically, 15% battery lasts me forever :] lol
Sent from my T-Mobile G2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Definitely. This is the one thing I like about SetCPU is having the 10% and 5% profiles so that I can get the last few % to last forever if I need it. Although in normal day-to-day use I'm never pushing it below 20%.
ScooterG said:
Whatever you tell SetCPU to do, you'll see the same settings mirrored in the CM settings.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea I see this, as far as the governor changing etc.. This is why I'm wondering if it would be easier on my phone to just run only the CM Settings one.
I notice that every 5th or so time I unlock the phone, there is an obvious lag switching from the screen off profile, and my unlock sliders jitter around and it takes 4-5 tries to unlock the phone. I think this is probably partially due to both settings switching over trying to change.
I think I might try backing up and uninstalling SetCPU for tomorrow to see how it goes.
colonelcack said:
I've been wondering about this too. I don't quite understand how it works. Can I just set the frequency higher till a certain point without changing the voltage and get the same battery life?
What's the best way of doing this? Just change the clock speed or do I need to change something else or update the kernel?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've read on here that overclocking the Vision's CPU up to 1 GHz requires no over-volting, and in theory should not affect battery life (but not sure exactly where that information originates from). But there has been lots of debate on these forums on whether the SetCPU app helps or hurts battery life depending on screen-off profiles (underclocking to save battery) or its constant polling of the CPU clock (possibly killing the battery faster).
A kernel that supports overclocking is already part of the CM ROM. If you are on CM, you can just adjust the clock speed under Settings>CM Settings>Performance>CPU settings. Or set the CPU clock using an app like SetCPU. Choosing one method over the other is what is being asked/debated here. If you are on the stock ROM, you need to be rooted, flash a custom kernel that supports overclocking, then install an app such as SetCPU or CPU Tuner to set the CPU clock to your liking.
redpoint73 said:
I've read on here that overclocking the Vision's CPU up to 1 GHz requires no over-volting, and in theory should not affect battery life (but not sure exactly where that information originates from). But there has been lots of debate on these forums on whether the SetCPU app helps or hurts battery life depending on screen-off profiles (underclocking to save battery) or its constant polling of the CPU clock (possibly killing the battery faster).
A kernel that supports overclocking is already part of the CM ROM. If you are on CM, you can just adjust the clock speed under Settings>CM Settings>Performance>CPU settings. Or set the CPU clock using an app like SetCPU. Choosing one method over the other is what is being asked/debated here. If you are on the stock ROM, you need to be rooted, flash a custom kernel that supports overclocking, then install an app such as SetCPU or CPU Tuner to set the CPU clock to your liking.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not sure about CM's kernel with the over-volting but I do know that Pershoots kernel can be overclocked to 979mhz without over-volting (Pershoot told me himself).
At 1.8Ghz, I find the temp settings in SetCPU very useful.
Vision rooted, booted and scooted
Daughain said:
At 1.8Ghz, I find the temp settings in SetCPU very useful.
Vision rooted, booted and scooted
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well obviously.... But why the hell would you ever need to be running at 1.8ghz? The fact that you are always using a temp-specific profile method should show you that consistent 1.8ghz isn't good for the phone...
Okay so I uninstalled SetCPU last night and I'm going to run just the CM Settings CPU manager all day to see how it goes. Running like this:
ONDEMAND governor
Min CPU: 245 mhz
Max CPU: 1017 mhz
On nightly #19 also.
Okay so its midnight almost, and I'm at 13hrs unplugged and 52% battery still. Pretty general/light use, phone is just as snappy and the lack of a screen off profile doesn't seem to effect battery at all. Liking it so far! very interesting to see the screen off profile not mattering much.
SetCPU for me. I like to have a temperature and charging profile, to prevent the phone from overheating. Even at 1ghz the possibility exists, nice to have a backup incase.
I'm thinking set cpu conflicting with the cm built in caused my ****ty running problems. I have not used setcpu since and been good so far
Sent from prison
tackleberry said:
I'm thinking set cpu conflicting with the cm built in caused my ****ty running problems. I have not used setcpu since and been good so far
Sent from prison
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
With multiple tries... If you change the settings on one, it cancels the settings on the other... Maybe it's because you had set on boot enabled on both?
im going to run the CM tuner and uninstall Setcpu and see how it runs. i never thought about this but i do get that lag when i turn my screen on sometimes. im gonna miss having the profiles but ill see how it runs over the coarse of a couple days.
Is this possible on Androids (mostly, this phone?) Before this I had a windows phone and I had a software where I could set a minimum and maximum cpu clock rate.. and then it will overclock dynamically as needed! If you are running a game and it needs more power, it will overclock it while the game is running.. dynamically without you having to change the clock-rate manually.
This will solve battery life problems when overclocking to 1.8ghz. There is no need for it to be draining the battery at 1.8ghz if you are only texting and probably even a 200mhz cpu can do that lol
Hope what I said makes sense.
it's easily done by installing Setcpu,provided that your phone has been rooted and kernel modded to allow overclocking.
Sent from my IDEOS X5
Actually it is already done in stock ROM without root, setCPU provides a way to change the default way of handling the CPU frequencies and governors.
The stock ROM comes right out of the factory can do "cpu stepping" itself, just like the intel "Speedstep" thing. But the factory powersaving profile (or if you wish to call the scaling) might not match our taste. Then there it comes the apps called Setcpu which enhances the cpu stepping behavior according to our preference. The enhancement considers the frequency of sampling cpu load, thresholds modifications, and other considerations.
In Setcpu, we can accord one of the following scaling setting that suits our taste. From my experience, each scaling setting behaves as follows:
ondemand - runs at Min or at Max (eg. 200 MHz or 1200 MHz)
interactive - adjusts frequencies according to the real load
conservative - behaves like "interactive" but incline to power saving
performance - always runs at Max
powersave - always runs at Min
userspace - disables Setcpu scaling and uses stock scaling
smartass - behaves like "interactive" but always runs at Min when LCD screen is off
And again, the phone must be rooted and kernel modded for Setcpu to work properly.
I've been using setcpu with conservative. I like conservative because it gives you a lot of control over the throttling of the cpu. It seems to work pretty good.
Are you getting any benefit from overclocking to 1.8GHz? I also overclocked to 1.8GHz, but I didn't see any noticeable improvement past 1.0-1.2GHz.
I like to use interactive Cox I enjoy the fast sampling rate and hence the high responsiveness.
Sent from my IDEOS X5
Personally I have not tried overclocking yet.. still need to update the kernel, but I'm afraid it might get unstable.
Didn't know that CPU could do it dynamically using different profiles.
Thanks all for the help
Tcm9669 said:
Is this possible on Androids (mostly, this phone?) Before this I had a windows phone and I had a software where I could set a minimum and maximum cpu clock rate.. and then it will overclock dynamically as needed! If you are running a game and it needs more power, it will overclock it while the game is running.. dynamically without you having to change the clock-rate manually.
This will solve battery life problems when overclocking to 1.8ghz. There is no need for it to be draining the battery at 1.8ghz if you are only texting and probably even a 200mhz cpu can do that lol
Hope what I said makes sense.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have setcpu but the x5 is not listed....??
After reading through the Thread for the Pre Release of FuguMod Ultra in the development section of this forum I thought I would post some info up for people who are wondering why it doesn't work with their phone, and just some general info on overclocking.
- First off, not all phones will be able to run at 1366MHz. Every CPU made has a range of freuqencies it will work at, and it is different for every single one. So some may be able to handle 1366MHz and above, others may max out at 900MHz. If you are getting black screens, freezes, or random behaviour, then your CPU doesn't like the frequency you have it at, try a lower frequency.
- Always keep an eye on the temp of the CPU when testing overclocking, if the CPU gets too hot, and fail safes don't work, there is a chance you could fry your CPU.
- With the FuguMod Ultra kernel, you must also be aware that gpu bus frequencies have been changed, so if your phone is not happy with that it will black screen. (as bus speeds are like cpu speeds, every different device can handle different clock speeds)
- plls values have been changed, and these may cause problems on your phone.
So if you want to have a go at overclocking your phone, back it up, and then give it a go. Select a frequency, and test with something pretty cpu intensive (3d game, multiple quadrant passes) and see if there are any bugs/overheating during a 15min time period. If you notice any problems/too much heat, try a lower frequency, and try again. And if for some reason your phone doesn't like the kernel, you can reflash with your previous kernel or a new ROM as you have already backed up your data.
If you have any other questions about overclocking, feel free to post here and I will try my best to answer them.
--- Samsung G3, InDroid 4.3, FuguMod 2.4 B3 800MHz ---
How can you check the CPU temperature? I thought it was only battery temperature.
Sent from my GT-I5800 using XDA App
dilzo said:
How can you check the CPU temperature? I thought it was only battery temperature.
Sent from my GT-I5800 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The battery temp is a good representation of how hot the processor is getting as it is right next to the battery (only a thin sheet of metal seperating it) If the battery rises in temperature by a few degrees, then you can summize that the cpu is probably getting a few degrees hotter than that. I really wouldn't recommend letting the battery get above 55degrees (celcius) as this means the CPU may be getting up close to 65degrees (celcius) which is a very bad thing.
Good post.
Note that if you want to make some stress-tests, you have to put "PERFORMANCE" governor and set the max freq you want to test.
marcellusbe said:
Good post.
Note that if you want to make some stress-tests, you have to put "PERFORMANCE" governor and set the max freq you want to test.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, Very true!!
Must also say, Your kernels are pretty legendary! Waiting patiently for the offical release of your FuguMod Ultra
m not able to see time in state with both setcpu and cpuspy and it seems deep sleep is also not working.
Piyush Rawal said:
m not able to see time in state with both setcpu and cpuspy and it seems deep sleep is also not working.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How have you got your phone set up? i.e. what ROM are you using etc.
I am using stock jpq with app2sd, swap, zipalign, ramhack and stuff. Setcpu is installed with default min/max freakquency, No profiles in use and undervolt a bit.
Ok,
This may be an issue caused by XXJPQ, as it is a new release there may be some sort of conflict. Have you tried asking if anyone else has this issue in this thread? http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1132697
I haven't played around with JPQ yet so don't know what the bugs are yet.
Also, are you running a stock kernel? Have you confirmed that the phone has been rooted properly as well?
It's definitely a bug in Kernel. I tried three different roms and i wasn't able to check time in state in any of them (I am talking about fugumod ultra prerelease kernel here).
With previous versions of fugumad kernel everything is fine. So definatly a bug in kernel.
Piyush Rawal said:
It's definitely a bug in Kernel. I tried three different roms and i wasn't able to check time in state in any of them (I am talking about fugumod ultra prerelease kernel here).
With previous versions of fugumad kernel everything is fine. So definatly a bug in kernel.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok cool, I'll report the bug to the developer so that he can have a look into it. Thanks for testing and proving to the kernel.
Little bit of info some might find helpful. After some recent testing, I have found that some people might experience a black screen freeze when phone is in standby for a while with 83MHz min setting and on demand governor. I am not sure of the exact reason for this, whether it is a bug, or that the processor just doesn't like going that low for extended periods of time. If you experience this type of error, just hard reset the phone then open setcpu after phone has loaded and change the "standby" profile minimum to at least the next step up on the slider. Personally I use 223 setting as it provides a smoother lock screen animation, and no significant difference in battery drain.
Sent from my super smooth GT-I5800 using XDA App