Related
Hello friends,
So I just got my Note 4 and i'm wondering how long should I keep it in charge for the first time? And should I drain it on first use or charge it when it's at let's say 20%??
Thanks in advance.
14 hrs, dont drain, battery should be between 20-80% before charging in normal use, fast charge off.
@zurkx
Thanks for the reply.
Are you sure about the 14 hours??? I thought Li-ion batteries don't need that long of a charging time !!!
XeroHertZ said:
@zurkxAre you sure about the 14 hours??? I thought Li-ion batteries don't need that long of a charging time !!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please happily ignore that "advices".
Use Fast charge, charging takes exactly till the battery is full, that's about 1,5 hours for a full charge.
I don't see ANY sense in charging a LiIo battery "fuller than full", just impossible nonsense.
LiIo batteries suffer of aging, slightly increased by the number of charges, highly (!) increased by overheating, not of any memory effects.
There is NO "breaking in" of the Note 4s battery, amperage of fast charge doesn't come even near the safety limits, won't cause quick degradation or overheating.
So just don't listen go the immortal myths and "ancient wisdom" propagated by people not aware of the fact that battery technology indeed changed over the decades.
Chefproll said:
Please happily ignore that "advices".
Use Fast charge, charging takes exactly till the battery is full, that's about 1,5 hours for a full charge.
I don't see ANY sense in charging a LiIo battery "fuller than full", just impossible nonsense.
LiIo batteries suffer of aging, slightly increased by the number of charges, highly (!) increased by overheating, not of any memory effects.
There is NO "breaking in" of the Note 4s battery, amperage of fast charge doesn't come even near the safety limits, won't cause quick degradation or overheating.
So just don't listen go the immortal myths and "ancient wisdom" propagated by people not aware of the fact that battery technology indeed changed over the decades.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks Chefprol.I have done some research on charging the battery and have come to a conclusion that once it's charged I can use it straight away but and then drain it to 18 to 20% then charge it fully.
Chefproll said:
Please happily ignore that "advices".
Use Fast charge, charging takes exactly till the battery is full, that's about 1,5 hours for a full charge.
I don't see ANY sense in charging a LiIo battery "fuller than full", just impossible nonsense.
LiIo batteries suffer of aging, slightly increased by the number of charges, highly (!) increased by overheating, not of any memory effects.
There is NO "breaking in" of the Note 4s battery, amperage of fast charge doesn't come even near the safety limits, won't cause quick degradation or overheating.
So just don't listen go the immortal myths and "ancient wisdom" propagated by people not aware of the fact that battery technology indeed changed over the decades.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks ! i tought it would be a old myth to first drain the batery and then fully load it but as far as i know its only with old phones and mp3 players and such.
hope i will get my note 4 today ! waiting for it since monday
Fast Charge is not really a useful feature for me, it just hurts the battery more in the long run
what about the thoughts on conditioning the battery?
Sent from my SM-N910C using XDA Free mobile app
There's no need to condition the battery, its a lithium battery.
If you're having battery drain issues I would suggest you clear your data cache.
ddaharu said:
what about the thoughts on conditioning the battery?
Sent from my SM-N910C using XDA Free mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
this is the same guy making up stuff about the note 4 GPS being bad.
dont listen to fools.
First charge needs to be 14 hours to trickle charge the battery to full and make sure the meter is calibrated to a full battery.
fast charge does reduce battery life since it charges at higher voltage and amperage. any battery gets damaged a little by that. best is a slow charge (preferably Qi) at a normal charging voltage. Slower the better for longer battery life. if you want convenience over battery life then by all means fast charge and mess it up and replace after 2-3 years.
Who's post are you referring to?
zurkx said:
this is the same guy making up stuff about the note 4 GPS being bad.
dont listen to fools.
First charge needs to be 14 hours to trickle charge the battery to full and make sure the meter is calibrated to a full battery.
fast charge does reduce battery life since it charges at higher voltage and amperage. any battery gets damaged a little by that. best is a slow charge (preferably Qi) at a normal charging voltage. Slower the better for longer battery life. if you want convenience over battery life then by all means fast charge and mess it up and replace after 2-3 years.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
arjun90 said:
Who's post are you referring to?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's mine. That guy already bumped into me a while ago, now it's time for his revenge.
I'll care for that, now...
---------- Post added at 02:09 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:32 PM ----------
zurkx said:
this is the same guy making up stuff about the note 4 GPS being bad.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So here we go; you asked for it...
My critism about the Note 4 refers to it's GPS receiver, which is "deaf" compared to the competition and shows frequent signal drops.
More here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/note-4/general/gps-close-to-unusable-t2948602
dont listen to fools.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Indeed - have a look:
First charge needs to be 14 hours to trickle charge the battery to full and make sure the meter is calibrated to a full battery.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I already advised to realize this is 2014 battery technology, not the ancient batteries of the past.
Short: There is no "trickle charge" with Lithium-Ion-batteries.
See this: http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/charging_lithium_ion_batteries - quote: "The difference lies in a higher voltage per cell, tighter voltage tolerance and the absence of trickle or float charge at full charge."
fast charge does reduce battery life since it charges at higher voltage and amperage. any battery gets damaged a little by that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Quote: "The charge rate of a typical consumer Li-ion battery is between 0.5 and 1C in Stage 1, and the charge time is about three hours. Manufacturers recommend charging the 18650 cell at 0.8C or less."
"C" is the capacity, 3220 mAh with our Note 4's battery. So we're save to charge with a current (milliamperes, "mA") of up to 3220 mA - if we follow the manufacturer's advice for the older type of batteries of that kind (18650 is an old warrior in the field), there's still 2576 A left.
So what does our fast charge supply deliver ? Look at it's ratings: 5 V, 2 A (2000 mA).
So even fast charge is far below the limits - our real limit is 3220 mA, but fast charging just uses 2000 mA.
Sound and safe.
Wonder about me highlighting "higher voltage" in zurkx's highly elaborate statement in red ? - Answer is above: The voltage does NOT change, it is NOT higher. Of course not !
The worst enemies of LiIon batteries are heat and age.
Heat is generated by a) placing the device at a hot spot (like behind the car's windscreen or in bright sunlight), b) by using demanding features like 4K video recording or highend games, c) by charging .
a) Your call. Just don't let your Note get hot. Overheating destroys your battery in no time. We're lucky we've got an exchangeable battery - so nothing to really worry about.
b) Your call. See a).
c) Charging produces some heat, especially on the "last mile", when the battery is "almost full", because the battery is a bit reluctant of getting charged up to the brim. So more heat is generated in that last phase. It's not much, won't reach the safety limits. It just can't, because the build-in charging circuits limits the current if heat gets up.
By the way: That integrated charging circuits are propped with safety measures, checking charge, condition, temperature and the like.
So even if you hook up a charger capable of providing 20 whopping amperes, the circuits just won't let that happen.
There is no way of providing the battery too much current; it's automatically limited.
best is a slow charge (preferably Qi) at a normal charging voltage. Slower the better for longer battery life.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Again; welcome to the 21st century. We don't need any slow charge. It's the opposite.
Charging right slow has the danger that apps on the phone draw more power than the charge provides. That may drain your battery instead of filling it.
Plus: If you hook up the charger for long, it will be recharged (charge gets "topped off") frequenly. And every new charging attempt has a slightly negative impact on the battery's life; it's like wearing it a bit down. - Charge often, reduce your battery's life. That damage is tiny, by the way. But it is there, so hooking up your charger for many hours slowly kills your battery.
Now for the aging:
if you want convenience over battery life then by all means fast charge and mess it up and replace after 2-3 years.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LiIon battery ARE AGING, up from the time of manufacture.
You all know that: You charge a device like you're told by the instructions - but after 1 to 3 years you notice a severe drop of usage time, a drop of capacity.
That's aging.
NOTHING you can do against that but buying a new battery.
So your battery will lose it's capacity over time; if you use it or not. You all know that, you all experienced that.
With the Note 4, we can happily buy a new battery if the old one runs out; it's that simple. But as a normal Li Ion battery reaches it's shelf live after 2 or 3 years anyway, there's NO (!) need of burdening it and you with slow charge. The results are exactly the same, with the difference that you save precious time with fast charging.
And now allow me quoting again:
dont listen to fools.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have a nice day, all of you except one.
youre completely wrong.
The QuickCharge tech charges at higher VOLTAGE and AMPERAGE.
http://www.androidauthority.com/quick-charge-explained-563838/
Quick Charge 2.0
Voltages 5v 5v / 9v / 12v
Max Current 2A 3A
Snapdragon 200, 400, 410, 615, 800, 801, 805
The rest is just BS as usual. You have no idea what youre talking about. Dumping 9V (Samsung Note 4 AFC) into a 5V battery makes it charge hotter and faster and degrades it significantly. After two weeks of fast charge i lost a small chunk off the top of my brand new battery.
just bad advice as usual.
zurkx said:
youre completely wrong.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, indeed. I was completely wrong by believing you'd understand some simple things.
In fact, I am not sure if I should take your statements for serious or just for a joke.
The QuickCharge tech charges at higher VOLTAGE and AMPERAGE.
Voltages 5v 5v / 9v / 12v
Max Current 2A 3A
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So you REALLY believe that changes of the output voltage of the POWER SUPPLY lead to the BATTERY charged with more volts ?
You can't be serious. That's technically impossible.
Let's put it easy:
If you insert your power supply into a 110 V receptacle in the USA, you get 5 V output.
So according to your "logic", using the same power supply in Europe (230 V) increases the voltage to 10 V ?
No. Just NO.
That higher POWER SUPPLY voltage is used for fulfilling the rule W = V * A (Watt = Volt * Ampere); just to be able to squeeze more power through the power supply's cable.
In the Note 4 and in the charging circuit, that voltage OF COURSE will be regulated down to the regular charging voltage - just with the benefit to carry more amperes.
So the CHARGING VOLTAGE stays the same; it does NOT follow the voltage supplied by the POWER SUPPLY. It never does.
So fast charging does NOT (read that: NOT !) increase the charging voltage. It cannot.
Got that now ? - Or do I need to put it ever more simple ?
It does not help using swearing words like "fool" or "bull****".
But it could help just saying: "Oh, sorry, I was wrong. - My apologies."
Make yourself at home with the basics of lithium ion and charging technology. THEN speak up.
Ah, overlooked something:
After two weeks of fast charge i lost a small chunk off the top of my brand new battery.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1) Hope that chunk fell somewhere you were able to pick it up again.
2) How to you KNOW that ? I expect a detailled description about how you did the magic of finding out that your battery doesn't charge to 100 %.
3) If you KNEW that fast charging would kill your battery, wise man - why did you allegedly use the feature ? - Sorry, man... Your statements are not very trustworthy. I guess you never used that feature, just say so to strengthen your shaky point of view. Please don't mess with a perception psychologist.
4) If your battery really suffered, that might be due to your highly acclaimed and absolutely pointless 14-hours-charging-marathons, causing a permanent charge on/charge off cycle, weakening your battery.
So please just stop bashing a real useful feature of the Note 4. If you just love waiting ages for batteries to charge - your preference. But please stop spreading false facts about things you very obviously are not at home with.
And a last thing which might stop that aimless harassing fire of yours: I am HAM, a licenced amateur radio operator, holding the highest German licence class. These are the people who know a bit about volts and amperes.
how hard is it for you to understand that quickcharge 2.0 outputs higher VOLTAGE and AMPERAGE to charge the battery ? The charger charges the BATTERY AT 9V 1.67A up to 50% and then switches over to the regular 5V 2A charge rate. INPUT VOLTAGE (110V or 230V) has nothing to do with OUTPUT VOLTAGE. It charges the battery at 9V REGARDLESS of INPUT VOLTAGE.
edit:
also it has nothing to do with the cable. you must be crazy if you think a cable issue exists whether you transfer 15W or 10W across it. the cable is rated for well beyond that. the reason for the higher voltage is that modern lithium ions can accept high voltage charge rates with limited damage at low amperage. the reason they cut it off at 50% is the battery would be severely damaged if you tried to charge it to 100% and overshot. so yes quickcharge 2.0 really does charge your battery at a higher voltage than it was designed to be charged at. and no they dont have a magical transformer on your phone to go from 9V to 5V. otherwise they would be using it all the time and fast charge 9V to 100%. the wall plug is the only thing which has a transformer and the phone uses what it gets from there. they arent going to build half of another wall plug (9V DC-DC) and stuff it into the phone. it would generate heat and add bulk. Instead the PMIC "spikes" the battery with higher voltage and keeps it roughly constant (load modulation) by communicating with the quickcharge 2.0 AFC on the other end.
Hopeless.
I just love these battery threads, there's always some muppet who says the battery needs conditioning and must first be charged for a suitably ridiculous length of time. When it's charged it's charged, lithium batteries have no memory effect so the idea of conditioning them is moronic
Sent from my SM-N910F using XDA Free mobile app
yes they have no memory effect. why ? because you say so.
other people believe otherwise because they actually test things out for themselves :
http://www.psi.ch/media/memory-effect-now-also-found-in-lithium-ion-batteries
http://pocketnow.com/2013/05/03/li-ion-batteries-memory-effect
http://www.nature.com/nmat/journal/v12/n6/full/nmat3623.html
no need to keep it for 14 hours, as they said in the catalog you only need to charge it till it's full, then unplug the charger.
Hello again !
After all cooled down a bit, here's some more information about that dreaded HIGH VOLTAGE fast charging uses which seemingly makes some of you wet your pants.
First, there's an experiment you can do yourself. You don't need to do - but it's quite impressive and gives you some proof of the things I say.
Get two 9 V batteries; the small rectangle ones we all know. Connect the positive contact of the first battery with the negative contact of the second. Thus you get an 18 volts DC power source.
Get a thin, isolated wire, short-circuit the open contacts with the wire. Wait.
Nothing special will happen, maybe the wire will get a little warm - and your batteries will eventually die.
(If you use a VERY thing wires, it might heat up.)
Now take a length of the same wire, do the same using your car's battery (12 – 13.8 V DC).
WARNING !
1) Take the battery out of the car, set it on solid ground with nothing combustible near !!! Do NOT try this with the battery still in the car !!!
2) Use pliers to connect the wire with the battery contacts !!!
3) Do that OUTDOORS !!!
Short-circuit the battery contacts using the pliers with the wire.
You don't need to wait. The cable will turn into a smoking, burning, white-hot thing in an instant.
Huh ? - We've got 18 V with just nothing happening, we've got just 12 V wreaking instant havoc and destruction !?
Amperage is the key !
Voltage alone does not cause the destruction, it's the amperage.
9 V batteries cannot provide sufficient amperes for killing the wire; 12 V car batteries do.
Short: High amperage kills wires, high voltage doesn't.
So back to our topic...
To fast charge our Note 4's battery, we need power, watts. But the tiny wires in the Note 4 can't withstand a high wattage; they would heat up like the wire connected to the 12 V car battery.
So Samsung uses a little trick, according to Ohm's law: W = V * A, W is watts, V is volts, A is amperes.
So we can achieve a high wattage by EITHER using a higher voltage OR a higher amperage.
Higher amperage does not work because it will kill the tiny wires in the Note.
So Samsung raised the voltage for carrying more watts from the power supply via the internal Note 4's cabling to the charging circuit.
That higher voltage gets transformed down to the normal charging voltage at the charging circuit.
Your battery is charged with the usual voltage, but with the benefits of a higher amperage.
That's all the magic: That higher voltage is used to carry more wattage to the charging circuit, but not beyond. Nothing else.
And that's why it does not harm your battery; charging voltage will not change - your battery just gets charged faster, always monitored by the charging circuit which will lower the charge accordingly if needed, so your battery will always be safe. That's why the "last mile" (charge from about 92 % to 100 %) takes more time to charge - because the charging circuit automatically lowers the charge to protect your battery.
So don't be afraid of that higher voltage; it never reaches your battery, it is just a means for transferring higher wattage via tiny wires.
Note: You ever wondered why Europeans use 230 V instead of 110 V ? - That's the reason. Being able to carry more watts over regular power lines without risking the wires heating up too much. It's not a means of destruction, it's the opposite.
I installed ampere from the play store and monitored the charge rate both with with the supplied N6p charger and also my old anker 5 port which maxes out around 2.1 amps per port. The results, if accurate, were telling.
I started with the N6p around 60% full. Both chargers consistently varied up and down during the charge mostly between 1 and 2 amps with only the anker going briefly to about 2.1.
Frankly I expected the stock charger (and cable) to put out considerably more but I would say, without averaging software, that they were roughly the same if not the anker putting out a bit more than the stock.
Is there anything I'm missing needed to kick in the 3 amp mode on the charge process?
I thought charging rate slowed as battery got closer to full?
nrfitchett4 said:
I thought charging rate slowed as battery got closer to full?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I started at 60%. It should ramp up at that level. It should scale back at 80 or 90%.
Didn't the nexus 6 do turbo charging to 67% or around there then it slowed to 90% and then charged even more slowly to 100%? I don't know what the battery % thresholds are for charging on the 6P but to be safe I would check at a lower percentage than 60.
__NBH__ said:
Didn't the nexus 6 do turbo charging to 67% or around there then it slowed to 90% and then charged even more slowly to 100%? I don't know what the battery % thresholds are for charging on the 6P but to be safe I would check at a lower percentage than 60.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'll do that and report back. I never had a nexus 6. I'm surprised the curve is that low but I believe you.
i checked mine, with my Anker 5-port, and it did change.
At 95% it was putting out 640ma, at 99% it was down to 300ma. So it's defintely going more slowly when it gets nearer to 100%.
I'm going to try and drain it down again and do more tests lower down the scale. I'm frankly very disappointed with the speed of the fast charge. Perhaps it's because I'm coming from an S6, and that did charge a lot faster.
Perhaps Qualcomm does indeed have the better system.
There are now two very similar threads so I apologize for the duplicate posts.
Ok, I started charging with the stock 6p charger at 26%. I'm now at 74%. This charger does not ramp up in a linear fashion like other lithium-ion chargers that I'm familiar with. It's constantly ramping up and down over and over. The highest it's achieved was 2.8 amps for a few seconds and I would guess it may be averaging maybe 1 to 1.5 amps.
I'm wondering if it's even working to spec. Seems to me it ought to slowly ramp up to 3 amps, hold it, and then slowly ramp down at about 90%.
Anyone else monitored their charge rate?
It took about 90 mins to go from 26% to 93%.
NCguy said:
There are now two very similar threads so I apologize for the duplicate posts.
Ok, I started charging with the stock 6p charger at 26%. I'm now at 74%. This charger does not ramp up in a linear fashion like other lithium-ion chargers that I'm familiar with. It's constantly ramping up and down over and over. The highest it's achieved was 2.8 amps for a few seconds and I would guess it may be averaging maybe 1 to 1.5 amps.
I'm wondering if it's even working to spec. Seems to me it ought to slowly ramp up to 3 amps, hold it, and then slowly ramp down at about 90%.
Anyone else monitored their charge rate?
It took about 90 mins to go from 26% to 93%.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't have 6p, but i tested with my 5x, when before 30%, it could reach 2.6 amps and drops to 1 amps(sometimes even 0.5 amps), dancing back and forth till it reachs 30%, it stables at around 1.8 amps, and slows down when getting close to full charge, takes about 1.5 hours for a full charge, anyone could share how long a full charge needed for Nexus 6p?
The dancing back and forth is very odd. At first I thought the regulator could be adjusting for battery heat but I never saw the temps vary that much.
NCguy said:
The dancing back and forth is very odd. At first I thought the regulator could be adjusting for battery heat but I never saw the temps vary that much.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not for battery heat? The phone itself is not heat at all, but maybe the battery is heat inside, do you have any app that could monitor the temperature of the battery?
feihu989 said:
It's not for battery heat? The phone itself is not heat at all, but maybe the battery is heat inside, do you have any app that could monitor the temperature of the battery?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I use Ampere. It monitors the current charge rate and a lot of other things including temperature. It doesn't say which temperature but I'm assuming it's probably battery. If not there are probably hundreds of apps that display the battery temp. Systempanel is another app I happen to use that specifically shows battery temp.
Is there a way to turn off the fast charging?
Just use a charger that doesn't provide quick charge.
XblackdemonX said:
Just use a charger that doesn't provide quick charge.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ok, so if I use a htc one m7 charger, does it works?
Why would you want to turn off the feature?
ipmanwck said:
Why would you want to turn off the feature?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To have more charge and discharge cycles, so as to have a battery that lasts for a longer time, in terms of age of the battery.
It would be nice an option to disable it, like in the SGS7. Especially for the people like me that charge the phone at night and doesn't need quick charge.
Enviado desde mi ZTE A2017G mediante Tapatalk
kutavyz said:
It would be nice an option to disable it, like in the SGS7. Especially for the people like me that charge the phone at night and doesn't need quick charge.
Enviado desde mi ZTE A2017G mediante Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why not just use a charger without quickcharge, e. g. 2A output or even 1A if you prefer? Very simple solution!
icaros1530 said:
Why not just use a charger without quickcharge, e. g. 2A output or even 1A if you prefer? Very simple solution!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is what I'm doing now. I'm using my girlfriend charger, but my car charger is QC, and I don't always want to use it and I'm not want to have two chargers in the car...
Enviado desde mi ZTE A2017G mediante Tapatalk
kutavyz said:
This is what I'm doing now. I'm using my girlfriend charger, but my car charger is QC, and I don't always want to use it and I'm not want to have two chargers in the car...
Enviado desde mi ZTE A2017G mediante Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Okay, that makes sense! We better get an option to turn it off then.
I noticed the Axon charging current drops off somewhere above 90-95% capacity. Using the app Ampere and with the Axon's included QC3.0 charger, the phone will charge at a current of ~3A when the battery is below ~80-90%, and then when the charge capacity is above that, the charge current drops to around 0.3A for a slower charge up to full capacity. The charge current may even drop lower but I haven't observed Ampere like a hawk when charging.
I'm curious what's causing that smart charge current drop: the phone or the in box QC3.0 charger. If it's the phone, then using an older charger with a max output of 2-2.5A may be ideal for battery longevity. If the Axon battery is truly 3250mAh, then with a preferred C-rate of say 0.7C (I've seen recommended C-rates from 0.5C to 0.8C), we get 2275mA as the ideal constant charge current. If the phone also drops the charge current of this older charger when capacity is nearing full then it would certainly be better than using the QC3.0 charger.
However, if all of this fluctuating charge current is controlled by the QC3.0 charger itself, then it might be the better charger option versus one with a lower rated current output. The OP on this thread should test both out with Ampere and share the results.
Some good reading:
What is C-rate?
How to prolong li-ion batteries
Bucatino said:
To have more charge and discharge cycles, so as to have a battery that lasts for a longer time, in terms of age of the battery.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Quick charge rates are designed around the capability of the battery. I have extensive experience with system design around rechargeable cells of all major chemistries, and the large batteries currently used in phones can be charged at much higher rates simply because there is more surface area (more mAh) that in older phones. Quick Charge will never charge at a rate unsafe for your battery. Your battery is more likely to fail from simply age or damage due to a drop as opposed to quick charging.
The bigger the battery, the higher the acceptable charging current. At over 3000 mAh, the Axon 7 battery can safely be charged at a very high current.
jswede said:
the large batteries currently used in phones can be charged at much higher rates simply because there is more surface area (more mAh) that in older phones. Quick Charge will never charge at a rate unsafe for your battery. Your battery is more likely to fail from simply age or damage due to a drop as opposed to quick charging.
The bigger the battery, the higher the acceptable charging current. At over 3000 mAh, the Axon 7 battery can safely be charged at a very high current.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Absolutely correct, like my previous post, but not an answer to the question asked. I agree that since the capacity is high at 3250mAh, a constant C-rate of 1.0C (up to 3250mA charge current) is safe. However the question is not about safety, but longevity of performance.
Lowering the charging C-rate to 0.5-0.8C could potentially mean the difference of good battery capacity performance for 1 year versus 1.5-2 years.
With Ampere I've observed the charge current on the Axon with QC3.0 charger as high as 3200mAh. At 1C, that's perfectly safe, but less than ideal for battery longevity. We're simply looking for an alternative at a lower C-rate of 0.5-0.8C.
jlomein said:
Absolutely correct, like my previous post, but not an answer to the question asked. I agree that since the capacity is high at 3250mAh, a constant C-rate of 1.0C (up to 3250mA charge current) is safe. However the question is not about safety, but longevity of performance.
Lowering the charging C-rate to 0.5-0.8C could potentially mean the difference of good battery capacity performance for 1 year versus 1.5-2 years.
With Ampere I've observed the charge current on the Axon with QC3.0 charger as high as 3200mAh. At 1C, that's perfectly safe, but less than ideal for battery longevity. We're simply looking for an alternative at a lower C-rate of 0.5-0.8C.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So, is better a 5V- 1A than the original QC of axon?
I charge it in the night when i sleep, and I don't need a quick charge during the day.
Bucatino said:
So, is better a 5V- 1A than the original QC of axon?
I charge it in the night when i sleep, and I don't need a quick charge during the day.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Explained In short and ELI5.
If you charge ~300( charge cycles) times with the QC3 you will lose ~10% battery capacity.
10% off 3250mah is 325mah.
So roughly (depending on usage) after a year you will lose 325mah from your battery.
If you charge slow it is prolonged.
celoxocis said:
Explained In short and ELI5.
If you charge ~300( charge cycles) times with the QC3 you will lose ~10% battery capacity.
10% off 3250mah is 325mah.
So roughly (depending on usage) after a year you will lose 325mah from your battery.
If you charge slow it is prolonged.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ok, I want to use this phone for 2/3 years =)
I was looking for modules to enable quick charge for Mi A1, but all I found was the mistake Xiaomi made during Oreo beta. Is there any modules to enable quick charge for Mi A1, or someone to develop a module using magisk? I've installed Magisk Manager to install Gcam, that's what made me curious. Correct me if I'm wrong in any statement!
Quick charge is generally not a good idea because it lowers the lifespan of the li-ion battery. The stock 10W (2A) charger will charge the battery at 1.5C rate which is already above the recommended standard 1C.
If you are referring to the Qualcomm's Quick charge technology... No.... Except for the obvious kernel and android changes there are also several hardware changes that need to be done for it to be enabled. Also given that 625 is with QC3 you won't really notice that much of a decrease of charging time. We still have pretty good charging times and given that the battery is only 3K it is really not that much of a deal. In the end you'll have 10-15min faster charging. Also at the end of the charging cycle (around 90%) QC is lowered to an ordinary charging, so for small batteries like ours it doesn't really have that much of a use. Also given that our battery is not easily changeable, QC and all types of faster charging lowers the lifespan of the battery significantly and it can go down in less than two years. If it is subjected to regular higher temperatures(>40 degrees Celsius it will start to form copper inside of the battery and will increase its self discharge significantly) it will go down in an less than an year.
Some custom kernels - like moun kernel - have fast charge enabled.
Speed up is not rly high.
Roadwuzel said:
Some custom kernels - like moun kernel - have fast charge enabled.
Speed up is not rly high.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks, I'll look into it!
Quick Charge cannot be enabled( or shouldn't be ) on MI A1
Firstly let me clarify, I'm using RR ROM which has Moun Kernel by default, it has USB Fast Charge which is not to be confused with Qcom Quick Charge because it means it will Fast Charge( @10watts ) when on USB, that is plugged on a computer. On Stock ROM it charges very slowly when on USB.
Talking about Qcom Quick Charge, though sd 625 supports it, other hardware such as the battery isnt built to support higher voltages which can potentially damage the phone.
So no Quick Charge on MI A1
barrack1 said:
Quick charge is generally not a good idea because it lowers the lifespan of the li-ion battery. The stock 10W (2A) charger will charge the battery at 1.5C rate which is already above the recommended standard 1C.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
MiA1 has 3000mAh and supplied [email protected] charger gives 2A only! (I actually do get 2A charging up to 80% SoC).
Therefore, the MiA1 charging is at 2/3 = 0.67C and NOT 1.5C as you state.
For 0.67C, the time for 70% charging is 0.70/0.67 = 1.045hr = 63mins, which I'm getting in practice.
For 1.5C, 70% charging will be in 0.70/1.5 = 28mins!! Not just possible. Nobody, who tried fast charging using higher than 10W charger, has reported anywhere except slight decrease in charging time (for 70% charge).
The LiPo Battery in MiA1 is BN31. There may be a max charging current limitation circuit in BN31. I read somewhere (lost the reference, unable to find again) that 2.2A is the max limit.
In that case we get 0.73C and time for 70% charge will be 0.7/0.73 = 58mins. This HAS been reported using [email protected] at 3A. (BN31 allowing only 2.2A).
Add on Update:
There is one report on slightly faster charging of BN31. The max charging current is estimated to be 2.485A that is at 0.828C.
MiA1 got 0-100% charged in 92mins using One Plus' Dash Charger (not the charger provided which charges at 0.67). This is reported by TelecomTalk.
This is 24% faster than normal.
manabsac said:
MiA1 has 3000mAh and supplied [email protected] charger gives 2A only! (I actually do get 2A charging up to 80% SoC).
Therefore, the MiA1 charging is at 2/3 = 0.67C and NOT 1.5C as you state.
For 0.67C, the time for 70% charging is 0.70/0.67 = 1.045hr = 63mins, which I'm getting in practice.
For 1.5C, 70% charging will be in 0.70/1.5 = 28mins!! Not just possible. Nobody, who tried fast charging using higher than 10W charger, has reported anywhere except slight decrease in charging time (for 70% charge).
The LiPo Battery in MiA1 is BN31. There may be a max charging current limitation circuit in BN31. I read somewhere (lost the reference, unable to find again) that 2.2A is the max limit.
In that case we get 0.73C and time for 70% charge will be 0.7/0.73 = 58mins. This HAS been reported using [email protected] at 3A. (BN31 allowing only 2.2A).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're right that the stock charging rate is 0.67C which is a very moderate charging rate. No idea why the battery still heats up noticeably sometimes during charging. There was a change in the charging icon I think for the Oreo update which gave the erroneous impression that fast charging (>10W) was supported and people started (wrongly) reporting decreased charging times fueling the myth.
Anyone facing heating issue while charging with stock charger? Is it only me or anyone else facing the same ?
Temperature goes upto 45°c ..is it normal ?
hk96 said:
Anyone facing heating issue while charging with stock charger? Is it only me or anyone else facing the same ?
Temperature goes upto 45°c ..is it normal ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i'm using the default charger (out of box, 5V 2A) on RN7 (chinese rom), battery doesnt heat up as the app (AccuBattery) saying temperature upto 36 or 37 C, once i seen shooted at 39 C (max)
but in any case phone was slightly heated on top from behind (adjacent to back camera), i think it may be due to processor but the battery temperature was fine
shahm64m said:
i'm using the default charger (out of box, 5V 2A) on RN7 (chinese rom), battery doesnt heat up as the app (AccuBattery) saying temperature upto 36 or 37 C, once i seen shooted at 39 C (max)
but in any case phone was slightly heated on top from behind (adjacent to back camera), i think it may be due to processor but the battery temperature was fine
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Battery temp depends on ambient temp too. It's about 36°c ambient here. So may be that's the reason for heating.
hk96 said:
Battery temp depends on ambient temp too. It's about 36°c ambient here. So may be that's the reason for heating.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i think it is not normal if ambient is 36 and on charging battery temp goes upto 45, you can also check different phones with different chargers
or you can try charging your phone via laptop/PC, it will slow charge the device but you will see the temperature rise of battery be negligible
keep in mind that charger as well as charging cable both may contribute in heating up of phone
by the way which charger are you using?
just for information (not related to thread) you can visit the website regarding temperature and battery life
https://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries
shahm64m said:
i think it is not normal if ambient is 36 and on charging battery temp goes upto 45, you can also check different phones with different chargers
or you can try charging your phone via laptop/PC, it will slow charge the device but you will see the temperature rise of battery be negligible
keep in mind that charger as well as charging cable both may contribute in heating up of phone
by the way which charger are you using?
just for information (not related to thread) you can visit the website regarding temperature and battery life
https://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for Ur reply.
Yeah, for high ambient it's ok to have high temp. I thought the same.
I am using charger that came with the box.
Saw many people complaining about the same. So thought of creating this thread.
hk96 said:
Thanks for Ur reply.
Yeah, for high ambient it's ok to have high temp. I thought the same.
I am using charger that came with the box.
Saw many people complaining about the same. So thought of creating this thread.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
keep in mind that im using chinese rom (comes with the mobile), lucky me my mobile dont get heat up, same is the case with my friend we purchased the same RN7 chinese and both got lucky because mobile isnt heating while charging, although im thinking to purchase QC4 charger but don't know will it improves battery life (cycle) or degrade it at the cost of fast cahrging
shahm64m said:
keep in mind that im using chinese rom (comes with the mobile), lucky me my mobile dont get heat up, same is the case with my friend we purchased the same RN7 chinese and both got lucky because mobile isnt heating while charging, although im thinking to purchase QC4 charger but don't know will it improves battery life (cycle) or degrade it at the cost of fast cahrging
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A custom kernel could be a solution for heating, or just charge at lower amps.
Reg. Qc4 make sure u charge in an AC room ?lol
hk96 said:
A custom kernel could be a solution for heating, or just charge at lower amps.
Reg. Qc4 make sure u charge in an AC room lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I dont think QC 4 require AC room, as my friend owns vivo v15pro with fast charging (5V, 4A). no heating issues, im concerned because RN7 is a budget phone and normally budget phones dont offer QC3 or QC4/+
shahm64m said:
I dont think QC 4 require AC room, as my friend owns vivo v15pro with fast charging (5V, 4A). no heating issues, im concerned because RN7 is a budget phone and normally budget phones dont offer QC3 or QC4/+
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Redmi note 7 is QC 4 certified by qualcomm.
See image attached.
thanks for the reply, i am still confuse because of the budget phone, i will try QC4 charger sometime later, let see what happens