Related
I have rooted other devices, and I understand the benefits...but there is a bit of a pain. Once you root your device, the way I understand it, you need to wait for an OTA update to be made available via a developer here. Now that usually happens pretty quickly, so that's not the issue. However, usually when you get an update OTA, you don't have to reinstall all your apps again, set up your screens, etc. When you take an update from here, you usually do need to reinstall everything.
If I want to avoid that, and let OTAs happen as they should, is there an easy and right way for me to get Titanium Backup to restore but keep that ability? Do I unlock the bootloader and root, then unroot but leave the bootloader unlocked? It isn't clear, and there seems a lot of noise when people ask, about what you can do that would still allow OTAs. Some seem to say you can take them, others suggest you can't. I have searched, and it is confusing. I would love to know if someone really knows, or could cite a post or article that I may have missed. I know I could loose root in that process, I get that risk. I just want to understand my options.
It is, as an aside, so painful that Android has not properly dealt with backup and restore and migrating apps/data from one device to another in the OS. That seems such a gaping hole that Apple has filed, and one big reason (not always the only one) I seem to end up rooting a device right away. I suspect I would root eventually, but probably wait a bit except for this.
Thanks
RoboCuz said:
I have rooted other devices, and I understand the benefits...but there is a bit of a pain. Once you root your device, the way I understand it, you need to wait for an OTA update to be made available via a developer here. Now that usually happens pretty quickly, so that's not the issue. However, usually when you get an update OTA, you don't have to reinstall all your apps again, set up your screens, etc. When you take an update from here, you usually do need to reinstall everything.
If I want to avoid that, and let OTAs happen as they should, is there an easy and right way for me to get Titanium Backup to restore but keep that ability? Do I unlock the bootloader and root, then unroot but leave the bootloader unlocked? It isn't clear, and there seems a lot of noise when people ask, about what you can do that would still allow OTAs. Some seem to say you can take them, others suggest you can't. I have searched, and it is confusing. I would love to know if someone really knows, or could cite a post or article that I may have missed. I know I could loose root in that process, I get that risk. I just want to understand my options.
It is, as an aside, so painful that Android has not properly dealt with backup and restore and migrating apps/data from one device to another in the OS. That seems such a gaping hole that Apple has filed, and one big reason (not always the only one) I seem to end up rooting a device right away. I suspect I would root eventually, but probably wait a bit except for this.
Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why not just unroot get the OTA and reboot? It's so easy with the toolkit you could even relock and unlock at the same time if necessary
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2
That's a good idea...I guess I hadn't thought of that...but unlocking and relocking would wipe the device, no? If I am going to wipe the device to get the OTA, then I would just proceed through the "normal" way of waiting for someone to release the update in a ROM and flash it. I would just like, in some way, to treat this device like an appliance, and not worry about OTAs bricking my phone, or needing to reinstall everything to get the latest...I just want to start off restoring some of my apps from another device, and then (maybe) just let the updates take their course. I know I could change my mind later and start ROMing, but I just wanted to understand my options....I know I wipe the device when I unlock, so assumed that would happen each time. And I wasn't sure if I needed to unlock to JUST get root, if I am not planning on flashing ROMs. And can I just root,and then use OTA rootkeeper if necessary, and allow updates?
So I guess the questions are:
- Do I need to unlock to root?
- Once I have done what I need to use Titanium (unlock and root or just root), can I take an OTA update, or do I need to undo some or all?
- If I undo some or all, will that incur a wipe?
I think I figured this out...I found the manual for the Nexus Root Toolkit (www.wugfresh.com/dev/nexus-root-toolkit/), and that spells out a LOT of really clear information.
I think I would:
- unlock
- root and install CWM
- use Titanium, etc.
Later, if an OTA comes out I want to allow:
- probably do full CWM backup
- flash stock recovery
- install and run OTA Rootkeeper
- allow the OTA, knowing I might loose root
- reflash CWM
I think this shouldn't cause any issues. This assumes I am basically running stock, and just using root for backup/restore app stuff with Titanium and maybe Root Explorer.
Make sense?
I'm about to take my baby steps and root my Nexus 4 for the first time. I've read the sticky's and have a good idea of what I'd be doing, but I don't see much in the way of backing things up before root and as I understand, rooting wipes your data. Can anyone help me on this or at least better understand what I should do?
I'm also having difficulty understanding the whole bootloader and custom recovery too but not too much trouble. I'd just like to know how to install a custom recovery and how much risk I'm at of messing up my bootloader.
PGvossman said:
I'm about to take my baby steps and root my Nexus 4 for the first time. I've read the sticky's and have a good idea of what I'd be doing, but I don't see much in the way of backing things up before root and as I understand, rooting wipes your data. Can anyone help me on this or at least better understand what I should do?
I'm also having difficulty understanding the whole bootloader and custom recovery too but not too much trouble. I'd just like to know how to install a custom recovery and how much risk I'm at of messing up my bootloader.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Rooting does not wipe data, the unlocking process does. There is no really good way to backup everything prior to unlokcing, you could use My Backup but you should really use the Pro version which is $4.99 (Many people swear by it for unrooted phones, I have no real experience with it). Wugfresh's toolkit has a backup and restore when doing unlock, but honestly, it messed up my phone and I had to factory default anyways.
As long as you are syncing stuff to Google (contacts, pictures, videos, etc), have Android Backup& Restore enabled (handles apps and common system settings), SMS Backup & Restore (text and pix messages), and you pull of the other files you want, there is no real need to backup at all. I swap ROMs all the time, and this is all I do to go from one ROM to another.
As far as the actual rooting process, ie. flashing SuperSU, there is no need to backup prior to that... all that is going to do is add a few files in some system directories and that's it.
The greatest thing about a Nexus device is it's ability to be modified... and within normal means it is virtually unbrickable, so give it a shot, and if you screw it up ask for help, thousands of people here have done it and can help, and if you still can't figure out a problem just restore the Google system images and whoalla... your phone is back to out of box condition.
You are able to root and unlock without wiping any data. Just check out my guide (the link is in the stickies, too)
mihahn said:
You are able to root and unlock without wiping any data. Just check out my guide (the link is in the stickies, too)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I opened your links but they all seem to be about Xperia devices.
I don't quite understand. Isn't the unlocking process needed to root the phone, thereby loosing all the data?
easy
before rooting, you hav to unlock bootloader and it wipes your all pics videos etc so better backup in your pc and thn try root. foloow guide ,its easy, or search on youtube for videos...
parveen75 said:
before rooting, you hav to unlock bootloader and it wipes your all pics videos etc so better backup in your pc and thn try root. foloow guide ,its easy, or search on youtube for videos...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OK I guess that makes sense. Does that include phone contacts, SMS and passwords?
And I suppose my final question is the danger of the bootloader. Is it possible for a newbie like myself to ruin something accidentally?
PGvossman said:
I opened your links but they all seem to be about Xperia devices.
I don't quite understand. Isn't the unlocking process needed to root the phone, thereby loosing all the data?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah I meant the one in the stickies here, I'll add the guide to my signature later
But I meant this guide. It'll root before unlocking the bootloader and you are able to unlock without wiping then. Check it out
PGvossman said:
OK I guess that makes sense. Does that include phone contacts, SMS and passwords?
And I suppose my final question is the danger of the bootloader. Is it possible for a newbie like myself to ruin something accidentally?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I m also a newbie earlier . lol.. Only follow guide corectly for rooting.. U wl b good to go
Sent from my Nexus 4 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
mihahn said:
Yeah I meant the one in the stickies here, I'll add the guide to my signature later
But I meant this guide. It'll root before unlocking the bootloader and you are able to unlock without wiping then. Check it out
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks. Where does the whole custom recovery and such come into play on this though?
PGvossman said:
Thanks. Where does the whole custom recovery and such come into play on this though?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not necessary to flash the recovery, but you may flash it if you want to and if you need it
Couple ways to do a backup without root.
Use adb,
eg. adb backup -all -apk -nosystem
Then pull files you want to backup
eg. adb pull /sdcard/
Or use helium app available from play store which is basically a gui for the adb backup command.
Thanks. I notice the -nosystem command, does that mean it won't back up system details?
I suppose my final question is Windows 8 support. I saw a thread a while back when you have to do something extra for the drivers and I can't seem to see it in the sticky threads.
I wanted to share two things with you guys here in Tablet z forum:
1- First of all, @zxz0O0 has developed a code based on the CVE-2015-1805 vulnerability that gives temporary root access to a select range of devices (including Tablet Z4). Let me try to explain in my words what that means. A full blown root gives permanent read/write access to /system and /data partitions. On an unrooted Tablet Z4 you only have read access to /system and no access to /data. With this root, you will be able to have a temporary terminal or adb session that gives you read access to /system and read/write access to /data. Why not write access to /system? Because Sony runs a service called RIC on Xperia devices that makes it impossible to mount /system as writable. In the past this would be patched by modifying the system partition. But in the recent Kernels sony has implemented a mechanism (dm-verity) which checks /system and if it is modified the device does not boot. So even if this (or any other) root method gave you the ability to write in /system you could not use it because your device would not restart the next time you turn it off. The solution would be to patch the kernel which requires an unlocked bootloader. IF you unlock your bootloader you lose your TA partition permanently which includes some of the Xperia features and licenses that have to do with image processing and some DRM. So a lot of us do not want to unlock the bootloader.
Then what good is this new root method? Since it gives you read access to the system partitions you can use this method to back up your TA partition. The idea is that if you ever unlock your bootloader you may be able to use this TA back up to return the system to its original state if you ever decide to relock it. Another benefit is that tools like Titanium back up which require access to the /data partition can now function (in a limited sense) although someone has to work out the details of that.
To download the pack that allows backup and restore of the TA partition go to http://forum.xda-developers.com/crossdevice-dev/sony/iovyroot-temp-root-tool-t3349597
After you create the backup, you can unlock the bootloader, and use your TA backup and the procedure outlined here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/xperia-z5/development/root-automatic-repack-stock-kernel-dm-t3301605 to create a csutom kernel that uses all the good stuff in the TA backup and emulates an environment where your tablet behaves like one with an unlocked bootloader. The camera denoising algorithm and all other Sony proprietary software which would be disabled after unlocking the bootloader should work.
If you want to return the tablet to its unlocked condition you will need this TA backup. Some explanation about retrieving the TA partition from this backup, if you unlock the bootloader and decide to relock it, is given here http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=66142823&postcount=16 and methods to do so are outlined at: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=66158970&postcount=68
Note that to use this root you need to downgrade to lollipop (preferably version 28.0.A.8.260)
I have explained procedures to use the above tools here http://forum.xda-developers.com/z4-tablet/general/guide-safe-bootloader-unlock-restore-t3362391 at length.
2- Now, here is the use I have found for this temporary root: I was always bothered by the fact that not only I could not (easily) get the 17 hour advertised on-screen use out of my tablet, the standby power consumption was always too much. Whereas I could optimize my other (rooted) devices to only drain 1-2% a day in standby, tablet Z4 seems to settle for nothing less that 5-10% a day in standby. This is what you can do to get excellent standby power from your tablet:
A) Say goodbye to your google apps (with the exception of Chrome and Maps) and other marginally advantageous apps. They wake your device up all the time when it is supposed be sleeping and endlessly chat with google servers even if you turn all the communications off in the google settings. So disable all of the apps listed in the attached pictures , plus lifelog,via settings. Don't complain about not being able to use the gmail or youtube apps. Other great replacements exist. Leave "Google App" active if you use the voice search or voice typing feature. Also uninstall the pre-loaded apps that you aren't using like facebook (which is cancer for any phone), Lifelog, Privilege, spotify, etc.
B) In settings under wifi open the advance menu turn off both "network notification" and "scanning always available", and change "keep wifi on" to "only when plugged in"
C) Under "power management" in settings, activate stamina mode and extended standby (no need to activate extended usage).
D) Finally (and here is where the temp root becomes useful) extract the file "iovyroot" from the file in the above link and put it in your adb directory. Open a command terminal and type:
Code:
adb push root\iovyroot /data/local/tmp/iovyroot
adb shell chmod 777 /data/local/tmp/iovyroot
adb shell
This gives you an android terminal shell. Continue with the following:
Code:
/data/local/tmp/iovyroot
pm disable com.sonyericsson.idd.agent
pm disable com.sonymobile.entrance
pm disable com.sonyericsson.updatecenter
pm disable com.sonymobile.anondata
pm disable com.dsi.ant.server
pm disable com.sonymobile.gmailreaderservice
pm disable com.sonymobile.googleanalyticsproxy
pm disable com.sonymobile.mx.android
pm disable com.sonymobile.enterprise.service
pm disable com.sonymobile.synchub
pm disable com.sonymobile.phoneusage
That is it. You just disabled the update service and a bunch of other things and extended your standby battery life. These settings will survive a reboot.
Let me know how it works out for you. If you find other creative uses for this temp root share here.
This is the BEST and probably the most right to the real point post ive ever readed in this particular forum since I joined....
Forgive me if I say I have had lost the faith on sony's z4t development here... It's a real pleasure to know there's still ppl working on what I think should be the right development direction on gettin' control of our loved devices, instead of breaking them and throw a lot of expensive features to the flush.
Thanks again mate to share it.
Interesting, if I downgrade do I also lose my Marshmallow data and settings (i.e. is it the same as factory reset?)
BTW Finally this tablet becomes viable, almost a year after its release...
Stevethegreat said:
Interesting, if I downgrade do I also lose my Marshmallow data and settings (i.e. is it the same as factory reset?)
BTW Finally this tablet becomes viable, almost a year after its release...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you want to have a stable system you will need to overwrite the user data which means you will lose your apps and settings and possibly (depending on how you flash) your internal storage so make a back up.
In general application data of Android firmware are not downward compatible with older versions.
Hmm, but if you can also temp root then you can backup everything using TitaniumBackup anyway before unlocking.
So if I understand this right, if you can back up TA we can infact unlock the bootloader now with no loss of DRM ?
So can now actually get full root based on that ?
najoor said:
If you want to have a stable system you will need to overwrite the user data which means you will lose your apps and settings and possibly (depending on how you flash) your internal storage so make a back up.
In general application data of Android firmware are not downward compatible with older versions.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I will only downgrade to get a TA Backup, so stability is not an issue to me (after the TA Backup, I'll go back to MM and probably unlock it).
My only issue would be if downgrading would actually harm my data and/or my capacity to get the TA backup properly (if I'm not wipe first I mean).
Stevethegreat said:
I will only downgrade to get a TA Backup, so stability is not an issue to me (after the TA Backup, I'll go back to MM and probably unlock it).
My only issue would be if downgrading would actually harm my data and/or my capacity to get the TA backup properly (if I'm not wipe first I mean).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think it will affect the TA back up process by it may harm you application data (not your sdcard data). The reason is that on every reboot android cleans up the) /data partition as much as it can (for example if it sees that an app has been uninstall but it has left some data behind). I'm doing so lollipop may corrupt some of your marshmallow data,
Why don't you take a backup of your data before a downgrade and the restore them later? The tablet itself has a utility to do it and I hear Helium is a tool that backs up your app data without the need for root.
najoor said:
I don't think it will affect the TA back up process by it may harm you application data (not your sdcard data). The reason is that on every reboot android cleans up the) /data partition as much as it can (for example if it sees that an app has been uninstall but it has left some data behind). I'm doing so lollipop may corrupt some of your marshmallow data,
Why don't you take a backup of your data before a downgrade and the restore them later? The tablet itself has a utility to do it and I hear Helium is a tool that backs up your app data without the need for root.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Mostly to save time as I have too much data. I though to do it like this
Downgrade to Lollipop -> Use the Exploit -> TA Backup -> Upgrade back to Marshmallow.
In principle everything should have had worked as by the end of it I would be back to Marshmallow (I would not linger into Lollipop). But now that you're telling me that lollipop may corrupt my data permanently I have second thoughts.
I thought, that my data would not work well on Lollipop, but that wouldn't matter to me; but now you're telling me that they won't work when I'll back in Marshmallow too, which is a totally different beast. Am I understanding you correctly?
Does everyone need to downgrade tho?
Once we have the TA partition available to restore, once its made available online surely everyone else can just restore the same one?
Or is the key unique?
Kinda assuming here that all the stuff that needs the TA partition will work with an unlocked bootloader, or does it have to be locked to be usable again?
Edit: Can we restore TA partition after unlocking bootloader?
Yes but this will also relock the bootloader.
Bugger
Ultimately never rooted my device for fear of losing something (that I will never use anyway!)
DRM Keys are unique, in fact that's the whole point of TA backups.
Also there's a talk (on the other thread) of a tool that would merge your particular keys with a particular custom kernel.
That way you'd keep all Sony Exclusive features, but also be able to make use of root apps. It would be great if such a tool becomes usable with AndroPlus Kernel...
Nice, had all but given up hope of being able to unlock my Z4 so that sounds promising!
I am looking for a high-end tablet and it seemed the Z4 Tablet was the best one for me over the Pixel C and even the iPad Air 2..though I did consider the budget Nvidia Shield K1 also.
The next thing I did was see if the bootloader could be unlocked and custom ROMs installed as I really hate the Sony UI that I have experienced with my sisters M2, and I never stick to the stock ROM in any of my phones. I just love knowing and doing customising!!
..Unfortunately, it seems like I will be stuck with it so I may have to look for another brand now
D0MINO said:
I am looking for a high-end tablet and it seemed the Z4 Tablet was the best one for me over the Pixel C and even the iPad Air 2..though I did consider the budget Nvidia Shield K1 also.
The next thing I did was see if the bootloader could be unlocked and custom ROMs installed as I really hate the Sony UI that I have experienced with my sisters M2, and I never stick to the stock ROM in any of my phones. I just love knowing and doing customising!!
..Unfortunately, it seems like I will be stuck with it so I may have to look for another brand now
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't know how you got that impression, since the whole point of the OP and the links I posted with it is that you will not be stuck with the stock firmware.
So to summarize the points mentioned in the OP:
As of today, the following is possible with a tablet Z4:
1- The TA partition can be backed up.
2- The booloader can be unlocked.
3- The unlocking is reversible with the help of the backed up TA pertition
4- When the bootloader is unlocked a custom kernel can be flashed (currently one is posted in the Z4 forum courtesy of @AndroPlus).
5- When the bootloader is unlocked the stick Kernel can be patched to retrieve the Xperia proprietary facilities that are lost to the unlocking process (courtesy of @tobias.waldvogel).
6- When the bootloader is unlocked /system can be fully modified. That means flashing completely custom ROMs.
So you can either make your own modification to the system, or wait for someone to make a ROM. In light of the above possibilities it is only a matter of time before customs ROMs start to pop up.
By the way, to the extent that the stock firmware is customizable without unlocking the bootloader, it is actually a good ROM and you can change a lot of things from the general appearance to the default launcher.
PS: Tablet Z4 is my second Sony tablet and the third Sony mobile device and I have about 10 of this kind of devices at any given time. The other android devices are miles behind in terms of elegance and manufacturing quality. There is just something about a Sony device that is unique and unmatched.
Can anyone confirm how to re-lock the bootloader once unlocked?
I would say:
1. Flash a stock firmware (the lollipop version that you used to backup the TA partition).
2. Use the iovyroot temp root batch tarestore to restore your TA partition.
3. Reboot and that's it: you are back to unlocked bootloader unrooted original drm included stock firmware.
Anyone already tried?
Thank you.
I unlocked the bootloader and rooted the device SGP771.
Bevor that, i backed up the TA.
Then i flashed the androplus kernel.
Everything works great.
But you cannot modify androplus kernel with that tool. That means DRM restore is only possible on stock rom.
When you restore TA to stock rom, your bootloader will be in a lockes status again and there is no more root. Too bad
odicamillo said:
Can anyone confirm how to re-lock the bootloader once unlocked?
I would say:
1. Flash a stock firmware (the lollipop version that you used to backup the TA partition).
2. Use the iovyroot temp root batch tarestore to restore your TA partition.
3. Reboot and that's it: you are back to unlocked bootloader unrooted original drm included stock firmware.
Anyone already tried?
Thank you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Can ta be restored on any fw like marshmallow or can it only be restored on the fw that you backed it up from?
This looks very promising, thanks OP.
Has anyone else managed to get it to work as described?
Thanks in advance
najoor said:
I don't know how you got that impression, since the whole point of the OP and the links I posted with it is that you will not be stuck with the stock firmware.
So to summarize the points mentioned in the OP:
As of today, the following is possible with a tablet Z4:
1- The TA partition can be backed up.
2- The booloader can be unlocked.
3- The unlocking is reversible with the help of the backed up TA pertition
4- When the bootloader is unlocked a custom kernel can be flashed (currently one is posted in the Z4 forum courtesy of @AndroPlus).
5- When the bootloader is unlocked the stick Kernel can be patched to retrieve the Xperia proprietary facilities that are lost to the unlocking process (courtesy of @tobias.waldvogel).
6- When the bootloader is unlocked /system can be fully modified. That means flashing completely custom ROMs.
So you can either make your own modification to the system, or wait for someone to make a ROM. In light of the above possibilities it is only a matter of time before customs ROMs start to pop up.
By the way, to the extent that the stock firmware is customizable without unlocking the bootloader, it is actually a good ROM and you can change a lot of things from the general appearance to the default launcher.
PS: Tablet Z4 is my second Sony tablet and the third Sony mobile device and I have about 10 of this kind of devices at any given time. The other android devices are miles behind in terms of elegance and manufacturing quality. There is just something about a Sony device that is unique and unmatched.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dear najoor,
are you telling us that, now, we can unlock a z4 tablet which has the "rooting status: Bootloader unlock allowed: NO" , in the service info/configuration area ?!?
if it is the case, i would be delighted to know how to proceed step by step, as i would love to install a lineage rooted custom rom on it (it is the SGP771 one,with phone capability)!!!
thank you
kind regards from France
retikulatus said:
Dear najoor,
are you telling us that, now, we can unlock a z4 tablet which has the "rooting status: Bootloader unlock allowed: NO" , in the service info/configuration area ?!?
if it is the case, i would be delighted to know how to proceed step by step, as i would love to install a lineage rooted custom rom on it (it is the SGP771 one,with phone capability)!!!
thank you
kind regards from France
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unfortunately if that is the case you cannot unlock the bootloader.
I am just curious, why does yours look like that? Do you have myXperia or some other find-my-phone service activated on your phone?
najoor said:
Unfortunately if that is the case you cannot unlock the bootloader.
I am just curious, why does yours look like that? Do you have myXperia or some other find-my-phone service activated on your phone?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the fast reply even if you ruined my hopes
no, i don't think i have myXperia , i checked on my apps and find nothing.
Since i had display issues with my tab s (sm-t800), i tried the z4 tablet for its LCD screen instead of the super amoled of samsung...
My bootloader was already locked when i purchased it, i updated it thinking it will change that but unfortunatly that did nothing.
It wasn't a new one though, perhaps the previews owner messed up with it and got its bootloader locked :/
Because it is some kind of lotery to have a bootloader unlockable with sony, i will wait patiently until samsumg release its 16:9/10 tab s4: imho, the tab s3 actual 4:3 format is a nonsense....
Thank you again
Kind regards from France
Hello everyone,
My Moto X Pure edition is on the way on the mail. I'm already excited to root it and get twrp on it. However, I believe the phone will come with android lollipop installed, and I should get an option for an OTA update for android 6.0.
My question is: Should I root my phone and install twrp BEFORE receiving the update, or after? I plan to use WinDroid Toolkit to root my phone and install twrp (seems to be the easiest way) so have any of you done it while having 6.0 already installed?
Your phone will most likely arrive with 6.0 pre-installed on it. You can't take an OTA with TWRP installed. I can't answer the WinDroid question.
Edit: It will most likely come with 6.0 already assuming you purchased it from Motorola.
quakeaz said:
Your phone will most likely arrive with 6.0 pre-installed on it. You can't take an OTA with TWRP installed. I can't answer the WinDroid question.
Edit: It will most likely come with 6.0 already assuming you purchased it from Motorola.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks a lot for your help! It's good that the phone will most likely come with MM. Does Motorola also offer an OTA update to 6.0.1?
I wanted to flash a pre-rooted stock-based ROM because I thought it would be easier to get root. Although, my preference really would be to get the stock update, then just root that. The only reason I wanted to flash an already rooted ROM was because it seems kind of tricky to root it haha. Is the systemless root by ivcarlos the easiest way to root MM? Or have you perhaps found another way to root it on MM?
Additionally, just to make sure before I go on with anything: I should first let the clean phone upgrade to android 6.0.1, AFTER that I should unlock the bootloader, followed by installing TWRP and root, correct? @vertigo_2_20
Thank you for any help you can give me!
Henryy97 said:
Thanks a lot for your help! It's good that the phone will most likely come with MM. Does Motorola also offer an OTA update to 6.0.1?
I wanted to flash a pre-rooted stock-based ROM because I thought it would be easier to get root. Although, my preference really would be to get the stock update, then just root that. The only reason I wanted to flash an already rooted ROM was because it seems kind of tricky to root it haha. Is the systemless root by ivcarlos the easiest way to root MM? Or have you perhaps found another way to root it on MM?
Additionally, just to make sure before I go on with anything: I should first let the clean phone upgrade to android 6.0.1, AFTER that I should unlock the bootloader, followed by installing TWRP and root, correct? @vertigo_2_20
Thank you for any help you can give me!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
IIRC, that's how I did it (OTA 6.0.1 > unlock bootloader > flash TWRP > root), though I did miss some things along the way that I only found out about after the fact, so I've included warnings about those thing here. Before I rooted, I read the following (and a LOT more, but these are the primary ones I based how I did it on):
ivcarlos' method, which you mentioned
And this, which is what I followed for rooting, though I don't remember why. I also had to use 2.62-3 as mentioned in the instructions vs 2.65 which is mentioned at the end as verified working, since it didn't work for me.
I ran across this as well, probably when 2.65 didn't work, and there's some good tidbits in there, worth reading through.
I also found this, but only after I finished rooting with the other method, and I didn't have the time to mess with it. I don't know enough to say whether it's really a better method or not, but something worth checking out if you have the time.
Just make sure you backup anything you want to keep (phone log, texts, pictures, etc) before unlocking the bootloader. I recommend SMS Backup & Restore with Titanium Backup as a secondary backup. Then, use fastboot to back up your recovery before flashing TWRP (I didn't know to do this until too late). Also, make sure you back up your /system and /boot partitions (don't need /data, since you're dealing with a freshly wiped phone from unlocking the bootloader, so nothing there to back up) with TWRP (and store the backups on the external SD card and/or your computer) as soon as you get TWRP flashed, before you do anything else.
Remember, anything you do that modifies /system can potentially break the "systemless" aspect of this root, thereby breaking Android Pay as well as the ability to receive OTA updates. Examples of things that might do this are AdAway (there's apparently a systemless file that needs to be flashed before installing it, which I didn't realize until too late, so mine may be broken already) and battery apps like GSam and BetterBatteryStats. I've yet to get an answer on if these really do break it, though. One that definitely will is Xposed, but I just found there's a systemless version, so when I get time I plan on trying that out. I think even if you do break it you can just a) reflash your backup (/recovery, /boot, & /system) then take an OTA and reflash TWRP and re-root, or b) flash the updated partitions from the OTA then reflash recovery and re-root. Of course, any of those things that changed /system (AdAway, Xposed, battery apps, etc), will probably be broken by this, and I believe they're supposed to be uninstalled first and reinstalled after.
I wouldn't doubt if I've screwed something up, so hopefully somebody can correct me on anything I did, as well as provide more information regarding the breaking of systemless.
vertigo_2_20 said:
IIRC, that's how I did it (OTA 6.0.1 > unlock bootloader > flash TWRP > root), though I did miss some things along the way that I only found out about after the fact, so I've included warnings about those thing here. Before I rooted, I read the following (and a LOT more, but these are the primary ones I based how I did it on):
ivcarlos' method, which you mentioned
And this, which is what I followed for rooting, though I don't remember why. I also had to use 2.62-3 as mentioned in the instructions vs 2.65 which is mentioned at the end as verified working, since it didn't work for me.
I ran across this as well, probably when 2.65 didn't work, and there's some good tidbits in there, worth reading through.
I also found this, but only after I finished rooting with the other method, and I didn't have the time to mess with it. I don't know enough to say whether it's really a better method or not, but something worth checking out if you have the time.
Just make sure you backup anything you want to keep (phone log, texts, pictures, etc) before unlocking the bootloader. I recommend SMS Backup & Restore with Titanium Backup as a secondary backup. Then, use fastboot to back up your recovery before flashing TWRP (I didn't know to do this until too late). Also, make sure you back up your /system and /boot partitions (don't need /data, since you're dealing with a freshly wiped phone from unlocking the bootloader, so nothing there to back up) with TWRP (and store the backups on the external SD card and/or your computer) as soon as you get TWRP flashed, before you do anything else.
Remember, anything you do that modifies /system can potentially break the "systemless" aspect of this root, thereby breaking Android Pay as well as the ability to receive OTA updates. Examples of things that might do this are AdAway (there's apparently a systemless file that needs to be flashed before installing it, which I didn't realize until too late, so mine may be broken already) and battery apps like GSam and BetterBatteryStats. I've yet to get an answer on if these really do break it, though. One that definitely will is Xposed, but I just found there's a systemless version, so when I get time I plan on trying that out. I think even if you do break it you can just a) reflash your backup (/recovery, /boot, & /system) then take an OTA and reflash TWRP and re-root, or b) flash the updated partitions from the OTA then reflash recovery and re-root. Of course, any of those things that changed /system (AdAway, Xposed, battery apps, etc), will probably be broken by this, and I believe they're supposed to be uninstalled first and reinstalled after.
I wouldn't doubt if I've screwed something up, so hopefully somebody can correct me on anything I did, as well as provide more information regarding the breaking of systemless.
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Thank you for your reply! I'll read the links you sent me, although from what I can see the "root done right" is for the nexus 6, and if it works for the moto x pure it doesn't seem to be overall that much beneficial over the systemless root.
What exactly is the effect of breaking the "systemless" aspect of the root? For example, if I install AdAway, what will happen? I didn't really get that from your post.
Perhaps after all this process, I'll write a how-to guide, heh
So according to your experience, SUPERSU 2.62-3 is the adequate version to use for android 6.0.1?
Thanks again!
Henryy97 said:
Thank you for your reply! I'll read the links you sent me, although from what I can see the "root done right" is for the nexus 6, and if it works for the moto x pure it doesn't seem to be overall that much beneficial over the systemless root.
What exactly is the effect of breaking the "systemless" aspect of the root? For example, if I install AdAway, what will happen? I didn't really get that from your post.
Perhaps after all this process, I'll write a how-to guide, heh
So according to your experience, SUPERSU 2.62-3 is the adequate version to use for android 6.0.1?
Thanks again!
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My understanding is that breaking it will render Android Pay inoperable and will make it so you can't take an OTA, though as I mentioned, it seems you still can by reverting back, it's just a LOT more work. But again, as I said, I'm not completely sure and I haven't been able to get an answer.
As for the supersu version, it doesn't really matter, because you'll just update it once you're rooted and booted into the OS. I just found that, despite what that post said, 2.65 did not work for me, so I had to flash 2.62-3 which did. Not a big deal, was just a little frustrating and scary when 2.65 didn't work because I was worried that I broke something and that the method wasn't going to work.
Edit: Good catch BTW on the link having to do with the Nexus. I didn't even look at what sub-forum it was in. At least it's one less thing to worry about for now, though I do hope it spreads to more devices, because we could always use more, not to mention better (assuming it is) ways of doing things.
vertigo_2_20 said:
My understanding is that breaking it will render Android Pay inoperable and will make it so you can't take an OTA, though as I mentioned, it seems you still can by reverting back, it's just a LOT more work. But again, as I said, I'm not completely sure and I haven't been able to get an answer.
As for the supersu version, it doesn't really matter, because you'll just update it once you're rooted and booted into the OS. I just found that, despite what that post said, 2.65 did not work for me, so I had to flash 2.62-3 which did. Not a big deal, was just a little frustrating and scary when 2.65 didn't work because I was worried that I broke something and that the method wasn't going to work.
Edit: Good catch BTW on the link having to do with the Nexus. I didn't even look at what sub-forum it was in. At least it's one less thing to worry about for now, though I do hope it spreads to more devices, because we could always use more, not to mention better (assuming it is) ways of doing things.
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Thanks. I am aware that you can revert back to lollipop, and do the update from there whenever you want to update to a newer OTA MM update. However, my real question is, what does it mean to break the systemless aspect? I know that it will prevent further OTA updates, but will xposed work as it should, etc? If I am rooting my device, it's really to get xposed. So, if it means that I must revert to an unrooted stock rom everytime I wanna update, then so be it. I just want to make sure that breaking the systemless root aspect will not make the ROM unstable. Will it?
Henryy97 said:
Thanks. I am aware that you can revert back to lollipop, and do the update from there whenever you want to update to a newer OTA MM update. However, my real question is, what does it mean to break the systemless aspect? I know that it will prevent further OTA updates, but will xposed work as it should, etc? If I am rooting my device, it's really to get xposed. So, if it means that I must revert to an unrooted stock rom everytime I wanna update, then so be it. I just want to make sure that breaking the systemless root aspect will not make the ROM unstable. Will it?
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I think you'll find all the info you're looking for and more in those links. But in summary, as I said, AFAIK the only consequence is breaking OTAs. It does not prevent you from using xposed, rather xposed is one of the things that breaks it. Systemless is so called because it roots without affecting the /system partition, therefore preventing the breaking of Android Pay and allowing OTAs. Once /system is modified (unclear if at all or just beyond a point), these two will no longer function. So if you "break" the systemless root by doing stuff that modifies /system (i.e. xposed, etc), you basically now have a standard (non-systemless) root, which simply negates the benefits it provides. But as far as I could tell, systemless is the only option anyway, so you just do it since it works and it's easy, then you either are careful not to break it if Pay/OTAs are important to you, or if you don't care about those then you just do whatever you want just as if you were rooted in the traditional way. But as I said, once I get the time, I plan to try out the systemless xposed, though it may not matter since I might have already broken it, but may as well, and maybe it'll mean not having to uninstall it when it comes time to take an OTA. If you play with it and figure it out, let me know.
vertigo_2_20 said:
I think you'll find all the info you're looking for and more in those links. But in summary, as I said, AFAIK the only consequence is breaking OTAs. It does not prevent you from using xposed, rather xposed is one of the things that breaks it. Systemless is so called because it roots without affecting the /system partition, therefore preventing the breaking of Android Pay and allowing OTAs. Once /system is modified (unclear if at all or just beyond a point), these two will no longer function. So if you "break" the systemless root by doing stuff that modifies /system (i.e. xposed, etc), you basically now have a standard (non-systemless) root, which simply negates the benefits it provides. But as far as I could tell, systemless is the only option anyway, so you just do it since it works and it's easy, then you either are careful not to break it if Pay/OTAs are important to you, or if you don't care about those then you just do whatever you want just as if you were rooted in the traditional way. But as I said, once I get the time, I plan to try out the systemless xposed, though it may not matter since I might have already broken it, but may as well, and maybe it'll mean not having to uninstall it when it comes time to take an OTA. If you play with it and figure it out, let me know.
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Once again, thanks. I reached the limit of thanks I can give for today, haha. I'm reading up much more on the process, etc. Just one final question, how often do the OTA updates come on average? I always like having the latest software installed, so MAYBE I can consider having an unrooted phone.. although that will be very difficult. I love my xposed. Anyway, I guess if updates only come about once a month, then rooting is fine. Not too much of a loss. I will definitely be making a how-to guide once I'm done with all of this! (and once my device arrives)
Henryy97 said:
Once again, thanks. I reached the limit of thanks I can give for today, haha. I'm reading up much more on the process, etc. Just one final question, how often do the OTA updates come on average? I always like having the latest software installed, so MAYBE I can consider having an unrooted phone.. although that will be very difficult. I love my xposed. Anyway, I guess if updates only come about once a month, then rooting is fine. Not too much of a loss. I will definitely be making a how-to guide once I'm done with all of this! (and once my device arrives)
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I bought my phone ~5-6 months ago. When I got it, the MM update was waiting (released late last year). Probably ~2 months later, another update came through. Since then, nothing. So it looks like probably 3 maybe 4 a year. I'd rather be rooted with all the benefits than get a small update, though I'd really rather have both.
6.0.1 is not out yet although there is a reteu version posted which works great. Rooting is as simple flashing su 2.62-3 with twrp.
lafester said:
6.0.1 is not out yet although there is a reteu version posted which works great. Rooting is as simple flashing su 2.62-3 with twrp.
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I'll check it out. Do you mind sharing the link to that version just in case? I am very confused now though, because @vertigo_2_20 says he has 6.0.1, and you say you didn't get it. Perhaps location matters? Can you elaborate a little bit more?
And actually, I've just realized: I think I was looking at too many outdated posts perhaps with all the complicated root procedures such as the one by ivcarlos. The guide that amit.lohar made is very simple which is the one vertigo kindly shared in this OP. One final question @vertigo_2_20 (sorry for so many questions). Does the method by amit.lohar work for 6.0 anddd 6.0.1? I would assume so since they're pretty much very similar. What is your take on this?
I assumed I was on 6.0.1 because I received a system update after being on MM, so I don't know what else it could be. Though it does just say 6.0 in settings. Regardless, I only did it a few weeks ago, so if you're fully updated, you'll be the same as what I was. Even if not, I would think it wouldn't matter. As long as you do a back up before messing with things, worse case scenario is you screw something up and restore the backup.
Henryy97 said:
I'll check it out. Do you mind sharing the link to that version just in case? I am very confused now though, because @vertigo_2_20 says he has 6.0.1, and you say you didn't get it. Perhaps location matters? Can you elaborate a little bit more?
And actually, I've just realized: I think I was looking at too many outdated posts perhaps with all the complicated root procedures such as the one by ivcarlos. The guide that amit.lohar made is very simple which is the one vertigo kindly shared in this OP. One final question @vertigo_2_20 (sorry for so many questions). Does the method by amit.lohar work for 6.0 anddd 6.0.1? I would assume so since they're pretty much very similar. What is your take on this?
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No I don't get links for people... this forum is small and easy to read. Dev section has one pre loaded with franken and there are two threads in general.
Henryy97 said:
Once again, thanks. I reached the limit of thanks I can give for today, haha. I'm reading up much more on the process, etc. Just one final question, how often do the OTA updates come on average? I always like having the latest software installed, so MAYBE I can consider having an unrooted phone.. although that will be very difficult. I love my xposed. Anyway, I guess if updates only come about once a month, then rooting is fine. Not too much of a loss. I will definitely be making a how-to guide once I'm done with all of this! (and once my device arrives)
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Click to collapse
If receiving the OTA updates is something you really want, systemless root will allow you to get them with a lot less effort. The trick is knowing which of the apps that require root privileges will end up modifying your system. Avoid the ones that will and you can enjoy root with less work to get updates. If the only root required apps you are interested in modifies the system, then it will be a matter of what you value more.
Sent from my awesome phone!
That reminds me of another thing I haven't yet figured out. If /system is modified, I'm assuming the OTA will still show up and just won't install, but I wonder if it won't even show up anymore. Anyone know?
aybarrap1 said:
If receiving the OTA updates is something you really want, systemless root will allow you to get them with a lot less effort. The trick is knowing which of the apps that require root privileges will end up modifying your system. Avoid the ones that will and you can enjoy root with less work to get updates. If the only root required apps you are interested in modifies the system, then it will be a matter of what you value more.
Sent from my awesome phone!
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Click to collapse
Ahhh! I guess I'll just flash ROMS to update my phone then because I need my xposed Besides, after 6.0, if we want root, we can only get the systemless one anyway, right?
Also, I did not quite understand something about systemless root. If the root is 'systemless', then how can apps still edit the system? I've read up that after a memory wipe, the root will actually go away but what happens if I have apps that already modified the system? I just don't quite get how the apps can get into the system and modify it, if the root itself cannot do that because it is systemless. Am I getting the wrong idea here? I've read, and read, and read. I can't find an answer to that :/ According to what you have said though, if I were to get an app that modifies the system, then it would essentially *break* the systemless aspect of it, right? Therefore, it just becomes a normal root?
I feel like I'm going in circles now so I hope someone will be able to explain this for me or just point me in the right direction!
Systemless root does not mean root doesn't have access to /system, it simply means a way of gaining root access without modifying the /system partition, because if you gain root with the old methods, which DO modify /system, it breaks Android Pay and OTAs. Root still has access to modify system, hence why you have to be careful in installing apps, xposed, etc, because if they have root access, they can modify it, and if they do, your systemless root just became useless. The whole point is to NOT modify it so as to keep those certain functions intact, but it doesn't prevent you from doing so after gaining root.
vertigo_2_20 said:
Systemless root does not mean root doesn't have access to /system, it simply means a way of gaining root access without modifying the /system partition, because if you gain root with the old methods, which DO modify /system, it breaks Android Pay and OTAs. Root still has access to modify system, hence why you have to be careful in installing apps, xposed, etc, because if they have root access, they can modify it, and if they do, your systemless root just became useless. The whole point is to NOT modify it so as to keep those certain functions intact, but it doesn't prevent you from doing so after gaining root.
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My experience was rooting 5.1.1 on the new phone. I backed up at every stage. I tried a few roms, no big deal. I liked 5.1.1 better due to micro sd card usage. I stupidly allowed the OTA to attempt to install. I knew it would fail but hoped it would stop nagging. The result I did not expect was phone continually rebooting on its own, trying to complete the update. After it completed the reboot it would start to shut down and begin the reboot process again. I restored a backup and froze the Motorola Update app with Titanium Backup. Problem solved. Don't do what I did!
Why would you want to stay on L? M is so much better. Between Doze and permission control, you'll have better battery life and more privacy and security. Not to mention the increased security from having more up-to-date software. I'd recommend just taking the update.
So the new security patch bricked my 8 pro into qualcomm crash dump screen.
I have done no funny business at all, yes my bootloader is unlocked and yes I have root. But it is only for basic things like titanium backup and permission ruler. I have never done anything crazy with my phone, never even flashed a rom, my phone has been rooted for well over a year and I always install all the security patches so this was super random and I'm pissed off.
Anyways I cannot find a video about recovering the phone without erasing everything and I thought this was only necessary when you DON'T have an unlocked bootloader. I thought it was possible to flash oxygen with fastboot and it fixes the problem. But I just dont know exactly how to do this and I didnt want to screw up anything. I'm totally fine with losing root and having the bootloader locked again I just really want to save my data. Any help and I would be grateful, because at this point I'm going to work tommorow without my phone.
one way... MSM tool and ITS deleting all your files
beterman said:
one way... MSM tool and ITS deleting all your files
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wow man, this literally came from the security patch
If phone is accessible via ADB ( no bootloop ! ) then you can pull the data of interest by means of ADB-commands to a connected computer.
Look inside here:
[TOOL][ADB][WIN]Android Partitions Backupper / Cloner
Hi all, wrote a Windows CMD script that backups / clones partitions of an Android device via ADB because I wasn't content with any 3rd-party APK what claims to do this job. The backups /clones are stored on Windows computer as...
forum.xda-developers.com
Codeman785 said:
So the new security patch bricked my 8 pro into qualcomm crash dump screen.
I have done no funny business at all, yes my bootloader is unlocked and yes I have root. But it is only for basic things like titanium backup and permission ruler. I have never done anything crazy with my phone, never even flashed a rom, my phone has been rooted for well over a year and I always install all the security patches so this was super random and I'm pissed off.
Anyways I cannot find a video about recovering the phone without erasing everything and I thought this was only necessary when you DON'T have an unlocked bootloader. I thought it was possible to flash oxygen with fastboot and it fixes the problem. But I just dont know exactly how to do this and I didnt want to screw up anything. I'm totally fine with losing root and having the bootloader locked again I just really want to save my data. Any help and I would be grateful, because at this point I'm going to work tommorow without my phone.
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Click to collapse
Far as I'm aware the security patch was incremental and not a full update, seeing as you're rooted then I'd advise against installing incremental updates, when you update get the full one and pull the boot image for instances just like this.
Easiest way out of this is MSM although if you can obtain the boot image from 9.9 then you may be able to save it by booting that image / patched image.