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Hello friends. As everyone aware, Motorola cameras are usually infamous for delivering poor pictures whereas I have been using Motorola phones since long time and somehow found them better than the competitors in terms of delivering details in the pictures. Motorola usually applies very minor software filtering into the images which results into grainy pictures but at the same time, those pictures retain as much as possible details. Reason behind grain/noise is the tinny sensor.
Have been experimenting a lot on my Moto X camera since I bought it. Today I tested something different and that was lowering the resolution at the time of shooting. And the results were surprisingly positive.
The magic is, just download any other camera app which allows shooting in lower resolution like 8MP or 5MP. The software filtering algorithm applied by the camera software is not suitable for the 13MP pictures. Whereas it does magic on the 8MP or 5MP pictures. The pictures captured at 13MP come up with lot of artifacts and noise around edges of the objects. But if pictures are taken in lower resolution then they come out very nicely, the ugly artifacts are just gone and noise is also reduced.
Now those who are thinking that we will be loosing out data or details if we shoot in lower resolution then let me assure that it won't matter, atleast not in 99.99% cases. You won't be loosing any significant detail from the picture, rather the lower resolution will make pictures more desirable to store or print, they will be more cleaner and smaller in size to store.
If pictures would have been taken in some DSLR or any other camera having decent size sensor then capturing lower resolution images would have definitely caused in loss of details but it won't matter in the mobile camera, atleast not in the current generation mobile cameras.
I found 5MP more cleaner but 8MP is best compromise if anyone is doubtful about loosing out details over 13MP.
13MP = 3120 X 4160 pixles = 15.6 X 20.8 inches @ 200dpi print size
8MP = 2448 X 3264 pixels = 12.24 X 16.32 inches @ 200dpi print size
5 MP = 1944 X 2592 pixels = 9.72 X 12.96 inches @ 200dpi print size
So even if you capture 5MP picture, there is still more than enough data for a print around A4 paper size.
Now important notes:
1. Capturing images at 13MP and downsizing them into 8MP or 5MP in the image editor will not fix the issue because the internal software algorithm is applied at the time shooting and that is not suitable for the 13MP resolution, even if we use any 3rd party app. So capturing images in 13MP mode and downsizing them into 8MP/5Mp is not same as shooting in 8MP/5MP modes in case of Moto X. Results are different.
2. Stock camera app doesn't support low resolution captures. No, that 9.7 widescreen mode is not low resolution, that just crops the edges. You will have to download any other app for low resolution captures. Just set the 8MP or 5MP resolution in the camera app and shoot pictures, but it should 4:3 format, if you are interested in 16:9 ratio format then you will have to set the resolution accordingly which will be more lower.
To name a few good apps : Best is : Modified Motorola stock camera app which is usually named as Camera+, can be found on XDA. You can also control the noise filtering in the app if want more details at the cost of additional colorful grain. Others are - Google Camera, Open camera, A Better Camera (Night mode of this app is really wonderful, use it for low light shooting) etc.
These are 100% crops from a daylight capture. EXIF : 1/40Sec, ISO-50
Download them and zoom out and try to notice details and the ugly artifacts:
13MP
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8MP
5MP
---------------------------------
These are crops from the same shot but upsized to 400% to magnify the pixel level details. Ugly artifacts ruining the image details can be noticed in the 13MP captures:
13MP
8MP
5 MP
-----------------------------------
These are crops form the same image but upsized to +400% to magnify the pixel level details:
13MP
8MP
5MP
----------------------------
These are low light shots of an advertisement in a magazine. Source of light was one CFL and window covered with blinds. Exif details : 1/33 sec, ISO-320.
100% crops:
13MP
8MP
5MP
------------------------------------
These are crops form the same image but upsized to +400% to magnify the pixel level details:
13MP
8MP
5MP
-------------------------------
Here is another shot. EXIF : 1/33 sec, ISO-500
100% crop.
13MP
8MP
5MP
Now you must understand why Apple is still giving only 8MP camera? Because anything over that is just plain marketing gimmick, nothing more than that and needlessly occupies extra space in the storage. Mobile phone camera sensors are very tinny in size thus they are not worth to push to capture anything over 5-8MP yet. I have seen pictures taken from the likes of Galaxy S5, S6 and Sony flagships and they were nowhere near to any true high resolution image. Their software are much more aggressive which clean up the noise and bump up the sharpness at edges more aggressively but at the same they end up eating lot of details and leave the water-painting kind of ugly effects all over the images. Thankfully such aggressive filtering is not applied by Motorola, atleast not in the daylight shots.
Would have loved if Motorola had provided Camera 2 API support, that would have given more RAW data. If no than atleast different resolution modes should have been supported in the stock camera app. Let's ask Motorola to do that, let's shoot emails to them
Request to moderators - please don't merge this thread with other existing camera threads.
If anyone else have more tips to improve picture quality then please share here.
Hope this thread helps :good:
***************************************************
***************************************************
UPDATE
Adding more samples:
Blind test:
100% crop
400% magnified of the crop
More details about the above crops:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=61549911&postcount=42
More posts with better samples and tests:
1. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=61552083&postcount=43
2. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=61553750&postcount=44
Answers: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=61566883&postcount=52
Will try to implement these great tips. Have you tried to use Camera 360 Paid version too? I was actually able to tweak some shutter speed in it. Had i understood more about it, it would have really helped a lot. Its only problem is that the app keeps running in the background causing huge useless battery drain.
I love Stock Android on the Moto X 2014 ?
grubber24 said:
Will try to implement these great tips. Have you tried to use Camera 360 Paid version too? I was actually able to tweak some shutter speed in it. Had i understood more about it, it would have really helped a lot. Its only problem is that the app keeps running in the background causing huge useless battery drain.
I love Stock Android on the Moto X 2014
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually there is some sort of internal software filtering which is applied at the time of shot capturing which you cant bypass unless the phone has got unlocked RAW shooting capabilities which Moto X hasn't got yet. So the damage is already done at the time of capturing itself which can't be reversed. The effective solution is to shoot in 8MP/5MP mode. If you have better camera app then it will be able to do more betterment since we are minimizing the internal damages caused by the flawed internal filtering in the firmware.
Please see the samples attached by me at 100%, you will get what I mean.
Ehhh the samples don't look very good. Best advice is to take pics at highest resolution and use imagenomic noiseware.
seabass950 said:
Ehhh the samples don't look very good.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Obviously, I did not capture the shots to submit into some photo contest, I was emphasizing on something different which I have explained in detail in the opening post. Whatever I have posted are cropped portions of the full resolution images
Best advice is to take pics at highest resolution and use imagenomic noiseware.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Noise removal tools will do magics if you apply them on 8MP/5MP shots instead of the 13MP. The max possible resolution is actually spoiling the pictures in the case of MotoX. It adds hell lot of artifacts in the 13MP pictures, thats what I meant by this post. To make things more clear, its not like typical downsizing to reduce the noise. Infact downsizing the 13MP shots into 8MP or 5MP won't reduce the artifacts, those will remain there but capturing the images directly into the 8MP/5MP modes yielding much different and better results.
Please test yourself if you don't believe me.
EDIT:
All of the images I posted were unedited except resizing and cropping.
Here is one comparo which shows the terrible artifacts ruining the pictures and they exist only in the 13MP shots:
400% upsized version:
See this image shot from the stock moto camera at 13mp with manual focus and manual exposure. Just added my signature in it! I think the camera app did pretty awesome in just a flash and macro mode even in low light! Surprisingly!
Here are crops from the few test shots I captured in 8MP mode today, no other editing except cropping.
Pictures are coming out much more clearer, no ugly artifacts, no need for any post processing to clean out the noise now.
Post processing has become a breeze now, earlier artifact were coming in the way of post processing if I wanted to add some effects or wanted to add more sharpness in the pictures.
Tl/Dr: use Google Camera at 5 or 8 mp, pictures automatically become better?
chrisrozon said:
Tl/Dr: use Google Camera at 5 or 8 mp, pictures automatically become better?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes. Try yourself to belive it.
Shoot few different light condition shots at 13MP, 8MP and 5MP then see yourself the difference by zooming into the pictures, probably on computer monitor. You will find ugly artifacts only in the 13MP mode which won't be in the other two modes.
So true about megapixels not mattering much.
Here is a "famous" article from 2008 when the megapixel wars started in earnest. It was wriiten about DSLR's but applies here as well.
Interesting read if you like this kind of stuff:
http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/mpmyth.htm
I'm using HTC Camera for a while now and after this thread I realize that the highest resolution from the app is 9.7MP.
With the best autofocus I've ever seen, this camera is the best.
I just did some limited testing of 13mp vs 5mp. Low light shooting a group of objects, some with text on them. 5mp definitely better. Object borders less blurred. Text easier to read in 5mp. I used the debug settings in the stock camera. Made accessible w/ the xposed module known as "moto checkbox"
Julianocas said:
I'm using HTC Camera for a while now and after this thread I realize that the highest resolution from the app is 9.7MP.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is widescreen mode which is there in the stock camera app as well. Read the point number "2" in my opening post for detailed explanation. You will have to shoot in median (3840X2160 mode to get 8MP equivalent quality.
CUBENSIS said:
I just did some limited testing of 13mp vs 5mp. Low light shooting a group of objects, some with text on them. 5mp definitely better. Object borders less blurred. Text easier to read in 5mp. I used the debug settings in the stock camera. Made accessible w/ the xposed module known as "moto checkbox"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If using xposed then you must also see few options for noise filtering? If so then see if there is chcekbox for QC denoise or similar, if it is then turn it off. Now you can get more details in the 13MP but pictures will be grainy/noisy, especially in lowlight situations.
So if one wants decent quality pictures straight out of the camera then better to shoot in 5MP or 8MP resolutions.
Great work indeed jacky !!! You seem tonknow your images well and how to capture em .. way to go mate .
All the best
Sent from my SM-N900P using Tapatalk
any way to fix the focus issue of the camera? i believe i'm not the only one facing issues while attempting to take macro shots not that it really matters much to me.. hardly use the camera but yeah. this phone would've been a lot more popular if the camera was on par with the rest!
bellick said:
any way to fix the focus issue of the camera? i believe i'm not the only one facing issues while attempting to take macro shots not that it really matters much to me.. hardly use the camera but yeah. this phone would've been a lot more popular if the camera was on par with the rest!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Believe me, this is one of the best cellphone camera I've come across. so far.
Have a look at these macro shots I posted earlier after following the majors I posted in the opening post: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=61501824&postcount=7
About the focusing issue, have you tried enabling manual focus and turning off Auto HDR off? Also try out some other apps, please go thorough my opening post for hints on apps and other tips.
Only hardware problem this phone has got is that the lens is little bit misaligned at one corner so around 15-20% portion in that area always comes out blurred. Though most of other cellphone cameras also don't have perfect lenses all around the corners.
Thanks a lot for all the great analysis done! The study done by you should be forwarded to motorola for analysis and improvement! Now i am really getting great macro shots from the camera which i can boast about. Just one question, have u tried to revert back to earlier camera versions and done this analysis?
I love Stock Android on the Moto X 2014 ?
grubber24 said:
Thanks a lot for all the great analysis done! The study done by you should be forwarded to motorola for analysis and improvement!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, I had spent whole day yesterday on the analysis and thread post, rather have been experimenting a lot since I bought the phone and almost tried all the good camera apps available in the market. Reason was it was getting hard to digest for me that my previous 8MP Motorola phone was delivering better results than the 13MP of MotoX which is from the 3 years old generation compared to the MotoX which has got one of the best sensor.
grubber24 said:
have u tried to revert back to earlier camera versions and done this analysis?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have lot of pictures captured from different stock camera app versions in different Android firmwares since Kitkat to 5.1 and all of those were captured in 13MP mode and all of them have ugly artifacts. I always thought to resize all of my MotoX captures into half but that downsizing also didn't help.
Only wish that the idea of capturing the photos in the low resolution would have come earlier in my mind, I would have had all of my previous captures in this new found better quality.
Now I am not using the stock app since it doesn't allow changing the resolution. Only wish we could set other app of our liking as default which can be launched using voice command and twist wrist gesture.
Jack Sparrow xda said:
Yeah, I had spent whole day yesterday on the analysis and thread post, rather have been experimenting a lot since I bought the phone and almost tried all the good camera apps available in the market. Reason was it was getting hard to digest for me that my previous 8MP Motorola phone was delivering better results than the 13MP of MotoX which is from the 3 years old generation compared to the MotoX which has got one of the best sensor.
I have lot of pictures captured from different stock camera app versions in different Android firmwares since Kitkat to 5.1 and all of those pictures have ugly artifacts. I always thought to resize all of my MotoX captures into half but that downsizing also didn't help. Only wish that the idea of capturing the photos in the low resolution would have come earlier in my mind, I would have had all of my previous captures in this new found better quality.
Now I am not using the stock app since it doesn't allow changing in resolution. Only wish we could set other app of our liking as default which can be launched using voice command and twist wrist gesture.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I loaded the xposed moto checkbox module and with the dev options for camera turned on you can change picture size to:
4160x2340
3840x2160
3264x1836
2592x1458
1920x1080
1280x720
Would this not work for the methods your recommending? Or am I missing something?
adm1jtg said:
I loaded the xposed moto checkbox module and with the dev options for camera turned on you can change picture size to:
4160x2340
3840x2160
3264x1836
2592x1458
1920x1080
1280x720
Would this not work for the methods your recommending? Or am I missing something?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That will definitely work, just make sure that you are capturing in 5MP/4:3 ratio or 8MP/4:3 ratio, not the 9.7MP/16:9 ratio mode. Please see my post number 13.
grubber24 said:
Thanks a lot for all the great analysis done! The study done by you should be forwarded to motorola for analysis and improvement!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If we can reach to Motorola then I have more ideas to share with them, but that looks highly unlikely. They look least interested in the camera, look at the terrible picture quality 20MP camera of Moto Droid Turbo produces. And hopes are more down after knowing that the company is now owned by new Chinese parent Lenovo.
The other day I wrote an article about camera applications, questioning if one is really better than another (full article here). Since my blog doesn't get many viewers I figured it might be helpful to post my results here as well for more coverage. I try to prove that various camera apps aren't necessarily better than others. I did one test using six different camera apps or settings, shooting from exactly the same spot pointing at my Arduino. I'm not yet telling you which photo belongs to which camera app as I want to find out from you if there is any noticeable difference between the following, in no particular order:
Superior Auto mode from Sony devices @ 8MP
Manual mode from Sony devices @ 20MP, ISO-50
Google Camera @ 20 MP
Camera FV-5 @ 20MP
Camera FV-5 @ 20MP, Night mode (exposure "long")
Open Camera @ 20MP
<.PNG COMPARISON>
Please do NOT vote on the poll if there is no one photo that looks significantly better
Let me know what you think!
@Hermantje
Did you try Vignette ?
It's one of my favorite camera app :3
For me,
1. Camera FV-5> very good at long exposure + tripod, because Sony stock camera can't do this. . .
Exposure Bracket very useful too, and Sony can't do this too. . .
2. Google camera> only for photosphere, because we can't modify ISO value and EV.
I wish Sony stock camera have this feature xD
3. Vignette> actually it's like Creative Effect but with more useful focus, effect, filter etc.
Please correct me if I'm wrong :3
Yenkazu said:
@Hermantje
Did you try Vignette ?
It's one of my favorite camera app :3
For me,
1. Camera FV-5> very good at long exposure + tripod, because Sony stock camera can't do this. . .
Exposure Bracket very useful too, and Sony can't do this too. . .
2. Google camera> only for photosphere, because we can't modify ISO value and EV.
I wish Sony stock camera have this feature xD
3. Vignette> actually it's like Creative Effect but with more useful focus, effect, filter etc.
Please correct me if I'm wrong :3
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I couldn't agree more on points 1 and 2
I haven't tried Vignette yet. But that's because I want my photos to look natural, and if I want effects then I always add them after the fact with Snapseed or Photoshop on PC.
Hermantje said:
I couldn't agree more on points 1 and 2
I haven't tried Vignette yet. But that's because I want my photos to look natural, and if I want effects then I always add them after the fact with Snapseed or Photoshop on PC.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please try it xD
I'm using Vignette not because filter or any effect it's offer, but because focus, detail and colours.
And I dont like edit/filter photos, I like natural photo, just like you xD
Sometimes, Vignette give more details and accurate colours vs Sony Stock Camera.
Noise still there, but still acceptable.
Btw, I'm used Superfine Quality + 8 MP on Vignette so the photo size 10++ MB xD
Still jpeg, cannot beat png offered by FV-5 :3
I didn't think 20 MP it's "usable" xD
What your opinion about 20 MP ?
Yenkazu said:
Please try it xD
I'm using Vignette not because filter or any effect it's offer, but because focus, detail and colours.
And I dont like edit/filter photos, I like natural photo, just like you xD
Sometimes, Vignette give more details and accurate colours vs Sony Stock Camera.
Noise still there, but still acceptable.
Btw, I'm used Superfine Quality + 8 MP on Vignette so the photo size 10++ MB xD
Still jpeg, cannot beat png offered by FV-5 :3
I didn't think 20 MP it's "usable" xD
What your opinion about 20 MP ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm always using 20MP just because of the idea of otherwise throwing away data and... just because I can. But I don't always find it useful. I only really find it useful when using Camera FV-5's night mode or when shooting at ISO-50 in daylight in the stock app. For quick snaps I do use Superior Auto just because of its simplicity, and then of course it's at 8MP. I should give Vignette a try, then :good:
Hermantje said:
I'm always using 20MP just because of the idea of otherwise throwing away data and... just because I can. But I don't always find it useful. I only really find it useful when using Camera FV-5's night mode or when shooting at ISO-50 in daylight in the stock app. For quick snaps I do use Superior Auto just because of its simplicity, and then of course it's at 8MP. I should give Vignette a try, then :good:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wew. . .
I'm prefered 8 MP because the details :3
20MP "awesome", but the ISO limit only 800 (if I remember correctly), of course it's useful for daylight then xD
But sometimes, using 20 MP make me think, the details it's enough or not. . .
So I decided used 8 MP, 20 MP for "rare" situation then :3
Thanks for your feedback
Btw, what your current OS right now ?
I'm on L .270, the HDR on the stock camera awful vs in KK
Yesterday, I'm trying used HDR and the photo look very bad, I dunno why xD
Maybe I'm wrong, but if you on L .270, you should try the HDR
And did you know, only Sony Stock Camera can control the ISO ?
I'm trying set the ISO on Camera FV-5 but it's still automatic. . .
-______-
Yenkazu said:
Wew. . .
I'm prefered 8 MP because the details :3
20MP "awesome", but the ISO limit only 800 (if I remember correctly), of course it's useful for daylight then xD
But sometimes, using 20 MP make me think, the details it's enough or not. . .
So I decided used 8 MP, 20 MP for "rare" situation then :3
Thanks for your feedback
Btw, what your current OS right now ?
I'm on L .270, the HDR on the stock camera awful vs in KK
Yesterday, I'm trying used HDR and the photo look very bad, I dunno why xD
Maybe I'm wrong, but if you on L .270, you should try the HDR
And did you know, only Sony Stock Camera can control the ISO ?
I'm trying set the ISO on Camera FV-5 but it's still automatic. . .
-______-
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm currently on .242, rooted. I never use HDR though, generally not a fan of the effect it creates. I would recommend most people to just shoot at 8MP. You save a lot of memory that way
Hermantje said:
I'm currently on .242, rooted. I never use HDR though, generally not a fan of the effect it creates. I would recommend most people to just shoot at 8MP. You save a lot of memory that way
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why not updated to .270 ?
HDR on Kitkat works very well :3
Maybe something wrong with my settings :/
I agree, save a lot of memory + fast rendering photo :3
Yenkazu said:
Why not updated to .270 ?
HDR on Kitkat works very well :3
Maybe something wrong with my settings :/
I agree, save a lot of memory + fast rendering photo :3
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Because I'm waiting for a 5.1 update. If I update, I'm losing root (well I don't know if there's a way to install the update while keeping root) so I'll have to root again, reinstall every app... it's just too much work for me with a minor update :silly:
Hermantje said:
Because I'm waiting for a 5.1 update. If I update, I'm losing root (well I don't know if there's a way to install the update while keeping root) so I'll have to root again, reinstall every app... it's just too much work for me with a minor update :silly:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah, you can used pre-rooted zip :3
But you need recovery for flash that zip.
Back to topic, it's seem HDR on L kinda weird, the ISO is the culprit. . .
If I set the ISO 50, the effect good, but not really good compared in KK, so I will left HDR in L. . .
In KK, if I set ISO auto, the effect really nice, but not in L.
And many photo editor app can do that (HDR), I guess it's not really matter then xD
Just a reminder: the poll closes within a week. I will have interpreted the results by then, but in the meantime: the more votes the better! :laugh:
All shots taken with HDR on at max resolution possible, no other alterations. Will add as I get the chance. Love to hear thoughts.
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B2rIwjmi9goAWTJkbzF0QUEzZXc?usp=sharing
Looks good... Pixel is overrated, but yes... Software specs are much nicer then the mate !
Hardware + mate
Software + pixel
It's interesting too see how each interprets colors. The pixel lightens every photo and can at times add colors that are not true. At the same time it takes a "nicer" looking photo in most regards when it does not add that odd haze or noise. I'm going to enjoy making a low light comparison.
i can't see the image at all?
OnimushaPooh said:
i can't see the image at all?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Use the link, there are 2 folders
pieman13 said:
Use the link, there are 2 folders
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't see the photo either in any of the 2 folders
Danbarizer said:
I don't see the photo either in any of the 2 folders
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Strange, they were there before, I will re upload
Should be back now
What really surprising is how close they are - nearly indistinguishable. I've noticed the XL gives just a hair of more detail
pieman13 said:
All shots taken with HDR on at max resolution possible, no other alterations. Will add as I get the chance. Love to hear thoughts.
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B2rIwjmi9goAWTJkbzF0QUEzZXc?usp=sharing
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Was the Pixel XL set to HDR+ Auto, or HDR+ On?
The Mate 9 looks like it was set to 12 MP, not 20 MP - don't know if this would have made a difference. And it was shot in HDR mode for every shot?
(Edit: now I see that the Mate 9 can only do 12 MP in HDR)
I plan on doing a comparison as well with my XL and V20, various modes, etc.
Nitemare3219 said:
Was the Pixel XL set to HDR+ Auto, or HDR+ On?
The Mate 9 looks like it was set to 12 MP, not 20 MP - don't know if this would have made a difference. And it was shot in HDR mode for every shot?
(Edit: now I see that the Mate 9 can only do 12 MP in HDR)
I plan on doing a comparison as well with my XL and V20, various modes, etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Pixel was hdr on as I find it produces the best shots, however sometimes in low light situations, auto is best.
Funk2641 said:
What really surprising is how close they are - nearly indistinguishable. I've noticed the XL gives just a hair of more detail
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And more color saturation although it's not always welcome.
Sometimes I prefer the pixel and other times the mate gives the better shot. If I were cropping photos though, the pixel wins hands down. I also feel the mate has a more accurate focal point.
pieman13 said:
Pixel was hdr on as I find it produces the best shots, however sometimes in low light situations, auto is best.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Great to hear! Most people don't know this.
pieman13 said:
Sometimes I prefer the pixel and other times the mate gives the better shot. If I were cropping photos though, the pixel wins hands down. I also feel the mate has a more accurate focal point.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'd like to see if setting the Mate 9 to 20 MP would give it more detail than the Pixel. I'm also really curious if the 2X zoom on the Mate 9 is better than just a straight crop of the same area. Need a comparison of that! I'll do some this weekend myself.
I could be wrong but I thought the mate 9 20mp was reserved for black and white lens only.
pieman13 said:
I could be wrong but I thought the mate 9 20mp was reserved for black and white lens only.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nope. Go to regular Photo mode, and 20 MP is an option. It actually saves in 20 MP resolution and all. It is supposed to get the detail from the 20 MP sensor, then color fill with the RGB sensor.
Ok, I did use that when shooting. I just thought it was reserved for the b&w only.
pieman13 said:
Ok, I did use that when shooting. I just thought it was reserved for the b&w only.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is unavailable in HDR mode though, only 12 MP is available there. So no 20 MP shots are in your album right now.
pieman13 said:
All shots taken with HDR on at max resolution possible, no other alterations. Will add as I get the chance. Love to hear thoughts.
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B2rIwjmi9goAWTJkbzF0QUEzZXc?usp=sharing
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not so much difference from where I stand, as those are static scenes in relativelly "good" lighting conditions. We would see more references in lower light (street at night, forest in night) and with moving objects like kids, pets. Only difference I have noticed in attached photos is a tiny bit more details and much more noise in Google Pixel photos. Also post processing is different, with Pixel producing brighter images. But nothing that couldn't be reproduced on Mate 9 using manual post processing. At least in attached photos.
D1G1TE said:
Not so much difference from where I stand, as those are static scenes in relativelly "good" lighting conditions. We would see more references in lower light (street at night, forest in night) and with moving objects like kids, pets. Only difference I have noticed in attached photos is a tiny bit more details and much more noise in Google Pixel photos. Also post processing is different, with Pixel producing brighter images. But nothing that couldn't be reproduced on Mate 9 using manual post processing. At least in attached photos.
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Agree completely. It was very cloudy that day and you can see the difference in the depth of the clouds. I plan on taking some night shots soon. But the pixel has an amount of noise in its photos that I find rather unpleasant.
I am aware that our Mix uses a 1/3.06" 16MP Omnivision Sensor with a Pixel size of the measly 1um. But the Huawei Mate 9 has a similar sized sensor (1/2.9" 12MP sensor with a pixel size of approx. 1.25um.) and shoots really great pics. Obviously Huawei may have used a latest generation Sony sensor with Leica's optics which will blow the Omnivision away. Even the cheapest Sony sensor would outperform an Omnivision any day.
My question is, will shooting images at a lower resolution like 12MP on the Mix give us better results? I'm not expecting Mate 9 like results as the phone's camera was never a priority when I bought this device. But would this help reduce noise or give us better results compared to shooting at 16MP? I am noticing lower noise when shooting at 13MP on Open camera compared to shooting at 16MP.
Does shooting at a lower resolution increase the Pixel size from 1um? Or is it strictly something to do with the sensor? Does the sensor behave the same either way and are we just getting cropped images when shooting at lower resolutions?
I've read in a few places that the sensor is fully utilized regardless but shooting at lower resolutions can reduce noise. If I can at least get half decent 12MP images compared to noisy unreliable 16MP ones, I wouldn't mind shooting at lower resolutions. Of course I am not expecting ground breaking image quality.
Some older Sony phones like the Xperia Z2 used to have a default mode which clicked images at 8MP even though the effective sensor resolution was 21MP. Sony claimed that the lower resolution gave batter images especially lesser noise. I am referring to something like this.
Hope someone can explain this.
@satishp did a search on dpreview.com
https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/2995010
The 2nd reply sums it up pretty well.
The answer to your question is no, reducing the resolution will not increase your image quality. The sensor always takes full-resolution image. Reducing resolution is a post-processing function and is no different than reducing resolution on the computer. Note that there are a few cameras with special low-resolution modes that are supposed to improve either the image or performance in certain ways. But when you have these modes you know it because they’re selling features of the camera.
There is now a significant amount of information available publically demonstrating that image quality depends on sensor size and sensor efficiency only. The number of pixels doesn’t matter. When printed at the same print size, images from the same sized sensor exhibit the same amount of noise regardless of resolution.
Thorin78 said:
@satishp did a search on dpreview.com
https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/2995010
The 2nd reply sums it up pretty well.
The answer to your question is no, reducing the resolution will not increase your image quality. The sensor always takes full-resolution image. Reducing resolution is a post-processing function and is no different than reducing resolution on the computer. Note that there are a few cameras with special low-resolution modes that are supposed to improve either the image or performance in certain ways. But when you have these modes you know it because they’re selling features of the camera.
There is now a significant amount of information available publically demonstrating that image quality depends on sensor size and sensor efficiency only. The number of pixels doesn’t matter. When printed at the same print size, images from the same sized sensor exhibit the same amount of noise regardless of resolution.
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Thanks for clearing this! So it may have been placebo that the images shot at 12MP seemed to be less noisy to me. Lol!
I use Open Camera which seems to produce brighter images compared to the stock camera. I'm sure these 3rd party apps aren't magically making the sensor capture more light compared to the stock app. I've noticed that these apps automatically crank up the display brightness to max as soon as they are launched. There may also be some real-time processing involved which makes the images appear brighter and slightly better compared to the stock app.
I am considering getting the Sony Alpha QX1 (with inter-changeable lenses) or the older QX100 which would make the Mix perfect! These lens style cameras attach to the phone and transfer images directly to the phone via NFC pairing. Just wondering whether the mix is too wide for the bracket on the lenses. The QX1 has the same APS-C sensor utilized on some of Sony's Alpha range and the QX100 has the 1" BSI sensor used on the RX100II. Only downside is that none of them can do 4K video.
Thanks again! Cheers!
satishp said:
I am considering getting the Sony Alpha QX1 (with inter-changeable lenses) or the older QX100 which would make the Mix perfect! These lens style cameras attach to the phone and transfer images directly to the phone via NFC pairing. Just wondering whether the mix is too wide for the bracket on the lenses. The QX1 has the same APS-C sensor utilized on some of Sony's Alpha range and the QX100 has the 1" BSI sensor used on the RX100II. Only downside is that none of them can do 4K video.
Thanks again! Cheers!
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You will need this - https://www.amazon.com/SPA-TA1-Tabl...UTF8&qid=1483946210&sr=8-2&keywords=qx+tablet
The smallest one should work perfectly with the phone. I had the QX-100 and it didn't fit the note 4 out of the box.
emann56 said:
You will need this - https://www.amazon.com/SPA-TA1-Tabl...UTF8&qid=1483946210&sr=8-2&keywords=qx+tablet
The smallest one should work perfectly with the phone. I had the QX-100 and it didn't fit the note 4 out of the box.
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Seems to be quite expensive just for an attachment. If it didn't fit the Note 4, it most definitely won't fit the Mix. So I guess that attachment is a must and when you add the price of the QX1's body + Lens + the attachment, it doesn't seem to be worth it. Ofcourse, the images would blow away even the best of mobile cameras.
Only if it was priced right!
I have the QX-30, the tablet mount is a must unless you plan on not attaching it to the phone. It makes the overall portability not so great, you're probably better off just getting a full blown dedicated camera but the QX-1 might be good, just make sure to buy one of the lenses otherwise you can't do anything, the SELP1650 might be decent I think.
Also if you're thinking of getting the swiveling rotation mount, don't bother, it's not compatible with the tablet mount.
For those who haven't tried RAW capture yet, stock camera works perfectly fine after activating the camera2 api. Just thought I should mention that since it's not such an uncommon issue.
Camera
benziii said:
For those who haven't tried RAW capture yet, stock camera works perfectly fine after activating the camera2 api. Just thought I should mention that since it's not such an uncommon issue.
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How do you do that. please give us instructions on how to.
jaime4272 said:
How do you do that. please give us instructions on how to.
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Add the line "persist.camera.HAL3.enabled=1" at the end of your build.prop, then reboot. It goes without saying you either need a build.prop editor or like me, just use the text editor that comes with Root explorer for example. Next get a camera app that supports RAW, like Open camera or Manual camera.
[Edit] Remember to mount as read/write when you are in system folder, or your changes won't stick. Our build.prop has two empty lines at the bottom, so if you have added something at an earlier time, make sure you have one empty line at the end.
benziii said:
For those who haven't tried RAW capture yet, stock camera works perfectly fine after activating the camera2 api. Just thought I should mention that since it's not such an uncommon issue.
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Only for my understanding
Does it only activate RAW mode or does it increase the picture quality for ordinary mode too?
vergilbt said:
Only for my understanding
Does it only activate RAW mode or does it increase the picture quality for ordinary mode too?
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There is more to it than just RAW. Read up on camera2 features and what an api is. But to answer your question, no, it does not increase quality.
Apps that support raw
benziii said:
There is more to it than just RAW. Read up on camera2 features and what an api is. But to answer your question, no, it does not increase quality.
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I downloaded camera FV-5 which support raw the option said that this phone does not support RAW, any idea?
jaime4272 said:
I downloaded camera FV-5 which support raw the option said that this phone does not support RAW, any idea?
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Even though I know FV-5 has been praised for years, I've never bought it. I'm not a big snapper so I've often been content with manual modes on the stock cameras. But since I have recently gotten RAW capture going, I've contemplated loosely on paying for either Manual camera or Camera FV-5. All I've tried on the Mix so far, is Manual camera's compatibility app (which checks out), and taken some RAW pics with Open camera.
I'm going to check out some more apps soon.
Considering it is required for RAW capture, I reckon you have a paid version? I quickly tried the free one, and see only one instance of compatibility (under general photo settings). But there is nothing there. Do you get the message when you change picture output?
There is an option on the paid version but it's grayed out because of incompatibility, but there is
you don't improve the noise performance by taking a smaller resolution, you do that by downsizing from a large image.
I think the best method is to use a good manual setting, shoot in raw and then edit in post processing.
however I think the images aren't that reliable
I cannot Open the dng file
---------- Post added at 05:19 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:18 AM ----------
Snapseed and Lightroom cannot parse the dng File ....Amy Help?
gorillalaci said:
I cannot Open the dng file
---------- Post added at 05:19 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:18 AM ----------
Snapseed and Lightroom cannot parse the dng File ....Amy Help?
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On my desktop I use UFRaw and Gimp / Photoshop. But I haven't gotten any mobile apps to open my RAW images either. Weird.
I know this is a few months old, but I think this app needs to be better known:
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=troop.com.freedcam
Yes, it works with DNGs and can handle our Mix Camera sensor. And yes, it's 100% FREE.
Also, it comes from a XDA dev, so even more kudos for him!!
codymamak said:
I know this is a few months old, but I think this app needs to be better known:
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=troop.com.freedcam
Yes, it works with DNGs and can handle our Mix Camera sensor. And yes, it's 100% FREE.
Also, it comes from a XDA dev, so even more kudos for him!!
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Installed it, but crashing when try to tap to focus.. Autofocus doesnt work it self
I have it working, but I'm using the LOS 14.1 build 20.5.17 from here on XDA, not MIUI. Sorry but I didn't test stock ROM before flashing.
Also, you can contact the dev at this thread here at XDA: https://forum.xda-developers.com/android/apps-games/camera-freedcam-4-0-3-t3115548
Maybe he can help out.
Been playing around with camera resolution and I understand that while the actual sensor is 48MP OP defaults it to 12MP to "capture" more details (I think thing the 48MP setting provides better shots but that's subjective).
Now the question/issue that I have is when looking in Google Photos (gallery) the shots are being reported at various resolutions... most of the time not close to the 12MP that the sensor is supposed to capture the image at.
Regular lense, showing as 7.2MP --- 4000x1800 resolution (setting in Camera app is 12MP - 6.59mm)
Wide lense, showing 7.2MP --- 4000x1800 resolution (setting in Camera app is 12MP - 3.05mm)
Tele lense, showing 4.8MP --- 3264x1472 resolution (6.95mm)
Bokeh shots appear to be showing higher res, like 13MP.
Pictures taken from my old Pixel 2XL show consistently 12.2MP which I believe is the sensor size so I'm trying to figure out what setting may be affecting the resolution. File size are significantly smaller on the 7.2MP shots so I'm sure I'm losing some quality here.
Switch to 4:3.
You are shooting in 20:9 hence the lower resolution.
Perfect ty. I did select full looks like. Went back to 4:3 and seems to show the correct mp.
Sent from my IN2025 using Tapatalk
is there a way to fix it to provide 16:9?