Hi folks,
Fortunately I've not had much necessity to post here for help. However, that's now change.
I am looking for suggestions on:
1) What might be the cause of an issue with my N4
2) What I might be able to do about it.
Here's the background:
My N4 was working fine. Stock device, 4.4.2, no rooting, etc.
The other day it spontaneously turned off. I was not able to turn it back on. "Google" would appear on the screen, but a few seconds later would vanish and device was off again.
I did figure out I could turn it on (most of the time) when it was plugged into a power source. But detaching from that power source (whilst it was running) would result in it turning off within a couple of seconds at most.
I managed to back up most of my data, whilst having it plugged in and turned on.
A few days later device tells me there's a 4.4.3 update. I update it.
Issue remains.
I then try to initiate a factory reset.
Device reboots during that process. But fails to restart.
I could no longer restart it whether plugged in or not.
It can sit in bootloader mode without being plugged in, for as long as it takes to run the battery down.
It can't be in recovery mode without ext power.
I load the TWRP recovery image. That is on and working fine.
I can access the device with fastboot command (via Windows 7)... which is how I got the TWRP image on there.
In recovery mode the device is not detected by windows, and adp command can't see the device.
This is about where I have come unstuck. I was attempting to install a clean Android 4.4.3 image onto the device. But I can't get ADB access to it. Tried on a Mac and a Windows 7 PC.
UPDATE: I did manage to complete instructions for installing new Android 4.4.3 image over fastboot mode. But even after completing the steps successfully, device won't start. Just "Google" flashes up, and devices stops after few seconds.
HARDWARE FAILURE?: It's possible this whole issue is hardware related and I'll have to ditch the device. If that likely? I've seen some people mentioning similar issues, which they resolved by replacing the USB port board. Is that likely to cause this kind of issue?
Does some kind person have any suggestions on steps I can from here?
I'd really like to recover this beast... it's my first and only smart phone, and would hate to drop to a cheap replacement cell phone for the foreseeable future.
Thank you...
Somehow my title was blank (just a [Q]). Might explain why I got no replies so far :silly:
Updated.
If its happening even after a full reset and flashing of the factory image, that most likely means it is a hardware issue, maybe the battery. You can try changing it yourself or getting someone else to do it. This is what I think the issue is.
lolcakes203 said:
If its happening even after a full reset and flashing of the factory image, that most likely means it is a hardware issue, maybe the battery. You can try changing it yourself or getting someone else to do it. This is what I think the issue is.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi there,
Thanks.
Regarding the battery... I had considered that. Although the battery was working fine right up to the time the N4 started having issues. Even during the issues... I could charge and discharge the battery as per normal. I tested this by discharging it by leaving the N4 in bootloader mode, and unplugged. After about 12 hours it would discharge completely. I was then able to charge it up, as per normal.
So that had me thinking it was not likely the battery at fault. What are your thoughts?
Very strange situation here. It seems somehow that booting into android causes some sort of power delivery issue and that results in the phone shutting down. I don't understand how that power delivery issue can exist within the android os but not within the bootloader if it was a hardware issue, especially after flashing the full factory image. I'm not sure, but I would still bet it a hardware issue, although perhaps not the battery.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using XDA Free mobile app
It sounds like the battery to me, running in bootloader mode requires nowhere near the current that the full OS does.
DrFredPhD said:
It sounds like the battery to me, running in bootloader mode requires nowhere near the current that the full OS does.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I apologise for taking so long to respond. I don't seem to be getting notifications. Will check into that.
With regard to the battery... When the phone is fully charged (and it was just like normal... prior to me toasting the OS in an attempt to refresh the device, AND it charges normally by plugging it in when turned off or in BL mode), it takes perhaps 12 hours or more to discharge, with the screen on permanently, whilst I leave it in BL mode. So if the battery is the issue, it's certainly got nothing to do with the battery being able to receive and take a charge. That happens absolutely per normal.
What I am wondering, however, if perhaps the USB board could be faulty? I actually replaced the USB board a month or two ago, as the connector on the original one died and Google refused to repair it on warranty because there was a crack on the back glass. The replacement is an LG part. I am wondering if there might be something in that logic of that board that is screwing up... such that when the cable is unplugged the device somehow "thinks" it is plugged in and thus in charge mode, rather than drawing from the battery. I am not sure where the logic for the device to determine whether to draw current from battery or USB resides. But is it feasible that this might be going on?
I'd love to revive this little brick back to smart-phone status.
Hello everyone!
My parents contacted me asking for help with some phone issues that I thought would be minor but this is now something I have to submit to you guys because I just don't know how to tackle this issue;
I've got an unmodified, completely stock AT&T Samsung Galaxy S4 that has been owned since launch. My parents were initially complaining about how the phone stopped charging and wouldn't turn on. I thought, "Easy, dead battery, it's been 3 years so how could it not? It might not be delivering enough voltage for the SoC..." but i'm not sure that's the full story which is why I want your guys' opinion since this place is a wealth of knowledge.
Things that are known:
When you charge the phone, the basic "battery charging indicator" that is shown when Android is not booted into or powered on freezes, or sometimes does not detect a battery so does not even turn on. Doing battery pulls seems to change how the phone responds. This is what my parents were experiencing. I thought, either dead battery, dead micro-USB cable, AC adapter, or charging circuit within the phone. Since this was obviously a big job, I took the phone back home for this weekend to play with and now this is what i'm experiencing.
So I got the phone to charge using one of my AC adapters for some reason, despite using the supposed broken charging cable to transfer data successfully without corruption using my own phone (LG G2) to confirm if it was just the cable. So now the SGS4 has a battery that is 100% charged, I turn on the phone and tried various methods to get the phone to boot successfully back into android. The first obvious one was to boot into safe mode using PWR, letting go of PWR, and then pressing VOL UP. It booted ONCE or TWICE successfully into safe mode into android, it shut off after 5 seconds being into the system due to low battery. This was BEFORE I was able to successfully charge the battery to 100% with my AC adapter but has failed to boot since.
Now since I've been failing to get into safe mode as when I boot the phone up, the phone freezes or has graphical glitches at the Samsung post/splash logo as seen here:
After some desperation, I considered using KIES/Odin to reflash, but mostly I tried going into download mode to see if the phone would even go into it by doing PWR + VOL DOWN. It did get into download mode but it froze/restarted forcing a battery pull and ever since then I keep getting occasional error messages such as "System software not authorized by AT&T has been found on your phone.", or this screen with a Samsung logo and an open padlock. I notice sometimes that when I'm at this open padlock screen, it sometimes begins to boot into the system but quickly freezes when it plays the boot jingle:
At any rate, I ordered a new battery but I fear this might be EMMC corruption or just something I don't quite understand. The phone has valuable information that I have to recover despite my parents CANCELLING a backup of the phone, they failed to heed my due diligence and are now freaking out about the data (photos, contacts, etc). I just need the phone to boot so I can make a nandroid backup, export the contacts, transfer media off the phone and wipe this thing and start anew. However i've already let them know that it might not be possible. The most important thing is to get this thing out of this soft-brick?
Please help because I have no idea where to steer this ship from here on out aside from waiting to receive that new battery and hope these instability issues are caused by low voltage. I had an SGS2 which had the crazy EMMC bug so I'm hoping its not EMMC corruption.
Thanks for your time everyone! I'll update this thread to reflect new information as I play around with the phone.
Edit: Here is a video, I go through a lot of the same information posted in this thread but here it is.
https://youtu.be/EXUKU68CyQQ
Possible loose connection inside the phone? Was the phone every bumped, dropped, or exposed to moisture?
audit13 said:
Possible loose connection inside the phone? Was the phone every bumped, dropped, or exposed to moisture?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not that I know of. I'm going to check the water damage stickers if I can to ensure that's not the case but i've been told it was sudden. It had been dropped once before but had been working fine for quite some time up until recently.
Maybe the effects of the drop and manifesting themselves now?
Hey guys I have a bit of a dilemma. I have a verizon note 3 that has the bootloader unlocked by me. It's rooted with Temasek's CM13 Rom. My only issue is that I am having problems charging my phone whether it is turned on or off. I have replaced the battery recently in hopes to troubleshoot and solve my problem but came to no avail. When turned on and plugged in it shows the icon in the top right with the lightning bolt to indicate it is charging however it seems to drain still and will eventually turn itself off. If I try to charge it when it is turned off it just vibrates every 1-2 seconds repeatedly. I have replaced the charger cable and block with a brand new one from the store as well. Any help is appreciated.
Try the following and report your results.
1) Pull the battery with nothing plugged in to the USB port. Put the new battery into the phone. While watching the screen carefully, plug the ORIGINAL charger and ORIGINAL cable in to the phone.
Do you see:
(A) Nothing at all
(B) A battery charging animation, or
(C) A static battery icon graphic followed by a brief appearance of the Knox message "Knox Warranty: kernel"
Hopefully the answer is (A) or (B). If not you might have a chicken-vs-egg problem getting your battery to charge.
Answer these questions:
2) Is the original charger the OEM (Samsung) 2A Wall-wart charger, or something else?
3) Perchance was the new charger identified as "Apple Compatible" or "For iPhone", or similar?
4) Are you able to use both cables (old & new) for data connections to a PC (testing with some other devices that can exchange data)
5) What are the rated charging capacities of the old & new chargers? 2 Amps?
The business about Apple compatible chargers is that Apple intentionally violated parts of the USB specification (to suit it's own needs) that detail how devices are supposed to interpret signals on the 4 wires of a USB 2.0 connector during initialization. So a lot of "Apple compatible" chargers produce out-of-spec signals during initialization, and many Android devices will conclude that those chargers can only provide 500 mA of current. So even if they are rated at 2A, the charge controller in the device won't pull anything more than 500 mA.
Similarly, there's all sorts of counterfeit junk being sold, even USB cables. I bought a "USB 3.0" cable in a box that appeared to be Samsung's from Fry's electronics. Despite it having blue connector inserts, it didn't even have any D+ or D- connections. It was neither USB 3.0 nor even a data cable - it couldn't even be used for charging beyond 500mA (because of the missing D+/D- connections). If you can use the cable for communication, at least you know that all four wires are present.
The amount of current that gets pushed into a handset battery during charging is typically controlled by a charge controller chip that sits either on the motherboard or on the (replaceable) USB connector daughterboard and the battery, and also watches transitions taking place on the D+/D- lines shortly after plug-in. (The external charger is just a dumb power supply rated to provide 5v up to whatever it's maximum current draw is before the voltage collapses... unless it is an Apple charger, and then it wiggles the D+/D- lines around inappropriately, confusing any device you plug them into that actually follows the USB spec, aka all Android devices)
Were it not for some certain odd behaviors that the Samsung bootloader engages in when there is an unsigned boot image flashed to the device, the scenario I'd be most likely to suspect is the following:
That you have a bad charge controller chip and you need to replace the USB connector interface. (IIRC, I think the charge controller chip might be on the connector module behind a flex connector, but I can't remember).
Sorry for all the questions - just trying to eliminate possibilities which could be interfering with your debugging.
https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Samsung+Galaxy+Note+3+Teardown/19209
1: Nothing at all.
2: The original charger is a verizon 2.1A micro-usb charger that I bought from a direct verizon store.
3: No it is a Samsung usb3.0 charger directly made for the galaxy note 3 from verizon. Guy pulled it out of the box for a old note 3 he had sold out of the store and the customer already had a charger.
4: Yes I can use both on a galaxy s5. The old charger is a micro-usb and the new is a usb3.0. They charge and transfer data through both cables to the S5.
5: Old charger: 2.1A New charger: 5.3v=2.0A
I have replaced the charging port before on this same phone because my charger would only work being held a certain position and that fixed my issue. However now it won't charge hardly at all. Some time I can get lucky if I leave it overnight but not always. It's temperamental. But I honestly thought it would be a software issue considering it doesn't do anything. When it does do something the battery logo will come up but will not animate, it will remain static and then disappear forcing the phone to turn on and will slowly charge.
Captain Skeet said:
1: Nothing at all.
2: The original charger is a verizon 2.1A micro-usb charger that I bought from a direct verizon store.
3: No it is a Samsung usb3.0 charger directly made for the galaxy note 3 from verizon. Guy pulled it out of the box for a old note 3 he had sold out of the store and the customer already had a charger.
4: Yes I can use both on a galaxy s5. The old charger is a micro-usb and the new is a usb3.0. They charge and transfer data through both cables to the S5.
5: Old charger: 2.1A New charger: 5.3v=2.0A
I have replaced the charging port before on this same phone because my charger would only work being held a certain position and that fixed my issue. However now it won't charge hardly at all. Some time I can get lucky if I leave it overnight but not always. It's temperamental.
But I honestly thought it would be a software issue considering it doesn't do anything. When it does do something the battery logo will come up but will not animate, it will remain static and then disappear forcing the phone to turn on and will slowly charge.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
TL;DR Maybe it is a software issue.
There is something subtle that happens when an unsigned boot image is in the boot partition. This is going to sound kind of strange, but it appears that in some conditions where you would expect the phone to be off, when the bootloader detects an unsigned boot image, it will start the kernel up in some kind of software prison where the kernel is actually running, but unable to complete the normal boot. (See this thread, posts #483-#494 where @Zzim posted a very similar set of observations to yours - again with CM13.)
Just now I repeated this experiment - flashed a unsigned image into boot and observed what happens plugging to either a charger or a PC, and then flashing a signed image into boot, and observing what happens in the same circumstance (in each case plugging done after a battery pull & replacement)
Unsigned boot image: Pull battery, replace battery. Plug an active device such as a PC or a dumb charger into the phone. A STATIC battery icon image appears - not an animation - and then a few seconds later you'll see "Set Warranty Bit: kernel" appear momentarily on the screen. If it's a PC you are plugged into, 15-16 seconds later the USB device port changes to a VID/PID device which is exactly the same as the device ID used during a normal boot. But the screen stays dark - the boot never completes! (I don't know if many minutes or hours later the USB device disappears.) That 15-16 second interval is also exactly the amount of time it normally takes for the boot process to be reaching the spot where it is setting up the USB port.
Signed boot image:: Same as above - Pull battery, replace battery, Plug in PC. A battery ANIMATION appears, no Knox message (expected) but also this: with a PC you are plugged into, no USB activity.
It seems a little weird, but its almost as if the bootloader is executing the kernel, but in a way that it's ramdisk has been spoofed or something so that init() never does anything meaningful. Rather suprising but maybe the kernel actually needs to be alive to control the charge control chip? Or produce a battery animation? That sure seems extreme.
Anyway, my experience is that the temasek/CM13 kernel eats through a lot of battery compared to stock kernels. If this phenomenon is still taking place when you plug to a charger and the charge controller isn't working very well, I suppose that could prevent you from gaining any charge on the battery. But I wouldn't expect even that to be chewing through 2A* ~3v ( = 6W) of power in that state, so there must be something else going on. OTOH, if the non-stock kernel messes with the charge controller somehow, then this mechanism potentially *could* interfere with charging.
I tried booting my phone plugged in to the USB charger but with no battery present, thinking, "well, maybe as an experiment he could restore a stock kernel termporarily using a custom recovery". But no joy, phone does nothing.
If both your batteries are so completely discharged that the phone isn't going to do anything, it would seem you are going to need to figure out how to get one of those batteries charged with enough juice so you could boot TWRP and put a stock boot.img in the boot partition. Seems like you need a friend with a Note 3 or a battery store that can juice up your battery enough to flash a stock ROM. Or there's this: boot into TWRP instead of your ROM (& temasek's kernel) and see if it starts gaining charge more rapidly than if temasek/CM13 was booted.
I've only had some older versions of (temasek) CM13 on my phone, so I can't vouch for recent stuff, but I will say that even though it ate up battery, it never caused me to lose charge while the ROM was up and running and the phone was plugged in to a 2A Samsung OEM wall-wart. (I would think that also your phone would get really HOT if it was really getting 2A of current and still could not keep the battery charged)
Which exact version of CM13 were you one when this started happening? I sort of remember someone over there reporting "massive" battery usage for a recent build.
.
Honestly it has done this since I can remember being on Temasek's CM13. But I have been using it since it was released. I never noticed it until recently because my old battery I've had since the note 3 was released did have some major drain issues. But my new battery on the updated build (OTA) has been pretty decent battery life....just won't charge when plugged in. CM13 is the only rom I use and is on my only phone unfortunately but If I have to start from square one I won't hesitate to if does solve my charge issues. I can usually get my phone to boot to download mode after 15-20 tries. And it usually won't turn off in download mode. So if you have a theory/hypothesis you would like to test that won't brick my phone then i will be more than happy to try/test. Maybe if others have the same issue then we can resolve it for others before they throw their phone in a lake because it won't charge lol.
Captain Skeet said:
Honestly it has done this since I can remember being on Temasek's CM13. But I have been using it since it was released. I never noticed it until recently because my old battery I've had since the note 3 was released did have some major drain issues. But my new battery on the updated build (OTA) has been pretty decent battery life....just won't charge when plugged in. CM13 is the only rom I use and is on my only phone unfortunately but If I have to start from square one I won't hesitate to if does solve my charge issues. I can usually get my phone to boot to download mode after 15-20 tries. And it usually won't turn off in download mode. So if you have a theory/hypothesis you would like to test that won't brick my phone then i will be more than happy to try/test. Maybe if others have the same issue then we can resolve it for others before they throw their phone in a lake because it won't charge lol.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wouldn't risk flashing anything with a poorly charged battery, even if you can get to the Odin screen.
I'd figure out some way to get both of your batteries charged about 25% or so - got a friend with a different Note 3? I suppose you could even take your battery in to a VZW retail store, give them a sob story about how you are not sure if your phone is dead or not, could you please charge this for me just a little bit so I can find out if it's my phone or my charger? Or something like that - get creative.
If you are comfortable with electronics, a 5v supply and two 1/4 watt 22 ohm resistors in parallel ( == 1/2 watt 11 ohm resistor) would safely add charge to a discharged NiMH battery at about 180 mA while not exceeding the thermal rating of the resistors, or creating a dangerous situation by charging with too much current. (When discharged, NiMH batteries are about 3v. So: (5v-3v)/(11ohms) = 0.18 amp. P = I^2*R = (0.18)^2 * 11 = 0.36 Watts). Or you could use a different phone with a similar battery size and get creative by insulating the battery terminals of the battery that fits, tape two wires to your battery, and stick the other ends of those two wires in the little spring contacts of the other phone. Obviously you need to be absolutely sure you are observing the correct polarity here and making sure that nothing is going to come loose and create a short. (A battery meter/DMM helps here making sure you are not doing something stupid)
Then stick a partially charged battery in your phone, boot to TWRP, put it on the charger, and see if the charge % is going up or down. That's a different kernel, so if the fault is with the temasek/CM13 kernel, presumably you will get more rapid charging when TWRP is running. I think it displays battery percentage right on the main screen. Or if you wanted you could restore a stock ROM. (Not the whole thing including bootloader! Just boot, system, and cache. Remember that with an unlocked bootloader you can flash whatver ROM components you want in Odin in the AP slots)
When I ran the charger tests just now, I made a TWRP backup of my boot partition (only), and manually flashed an older sprint kernel into my boot partition
Code:
dd of=/dev/block/mmcblk0p14 if=/sdcard/bkup/0407-hltespr.img
and then ran my testing experiments making sure to avoid accidentally booting up the main ROM (so that the mis-matched kernel couldn't bollux anything in /data up). When done testing, I just restored the TWRP backup that only had the boot paritition in it.
Anyway, you get the idea. If it really is temasek/CM13 that is causing the problem, then temporarily putting a stock boot.img into your boot partition will give a different charging result.
But at the moment you have a chicken-vs-egg problem: you can't get the temasek/CM13 boot image off the phone (even temporarily) until you get a little charge on a battery first. I think that means you need to get one battery charged a little bit using some other device.
.
I managed to get a charge on my device somehow; (55% so far) . It seems that with CM13 Build for Hlte has changed the "Offline charging" images to be modified. I searched the rom thread and seen your theory about the device not fully turning off and being in a weird state. It seems users are having similar effects and it is different per user. What I have found (may not be 100%) is if you take the battery out, unplug it and put the battery back in, then go to download mode as if you were going to flash something through odin then press and hold the power button - it turns the my phone off and then shows static image with "Set Warranty Bit: kernel" on top then disappears. Supposedly (guess) that means it is charging offline (turned off). However I wish I could change it so it would pulse the top light or show an animation when the home button is pressed or something.
Just seen where you were the one explaining the process happening in the CM13 thread..It is exactly the same issue.
Captain Skeet said:
I managed to get a charge on my device somehow; (55% so far) . It seems that with CM13 Build for Hlte has changed the "Offline charging" images to be modified. I searched the rom thread and seen your theory about the device not fully turning off and being in a weird state. It seems users are having similar effects and it is different per user. What I have found (may not be 100%) is if you take the battery out, unplug it and put the battery back in, then go to download mode as if you were going to flash something through odin then press and hold the power button - it turns the my phone off and then shows static image with "Set Warranty Bit: kernel" on top then disappears. Supposedly (guess) that means it is charging offline (turned off). However I wish I could change it so it would pulse the top light or show an animation when the home button is pressed or something.
Just seen where you were the one explaining the process happening in the CM13 thread..It is exactly the same issue.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When you see that "Set Warranty Bit: kernel" message, that means that the Bootloader is very likely starting the kernel up (especially likely when you notice USB activity 15-20 seconds later). On my phone - which has a much much older MJ7 bootloader, every time you unplug the charger and then re-plug that charger, that "Set Warranty Bit: kernel" message re-appears. Even though the phone is supposedly "off"
I suppose it is possible that the Signed, stock kernels get started up in exactly the same fashion. You don't see any warning message on the screen because the stock kernel is signed, so the screen just stays dark and it appears that nothing is happening other than maybe a brief battery charging animation. OTOH, it's a little odd that there is no USB activity after a delay in that case.
It's pretty counter-intuitive. You would want the phone to charge as fast as possible when it is "off", so using the minimum amount of power would help that. And there's no way that a modern Linux kernel with several million lines of code is needed to paint a simple animation on a screen or charge a battery - the bootloader is more than capable of that. (The Code Aurora LK "LittleKernel" bootloader from which a lot of these vendors have derived their proprietary bootloaders is actually a tiny operating system capable of running multiple threads simultaneously as separate "apps".)
These phones appear as if there is always something going on even when they are "off". I built one of those UART jigs to be able to see kernel messages before init() even is launched. If I yank the battery, replace the battery, and then plug that thing in to the USB port.... the phone boots immediately without me touching anything else.
You are not on 10.4 are you? There was a user over there that was saying that the battery usage was quite high...
Yes I'm on 10.4. My battery drain isn't really high surprisingly it just doesn't charge usually when the battery is below 20%. If I plug it up to the wall it has the lightning bolt and says it's charging however if I leave it alone and come back then it has a lower percentage on the battery than when I plugged it up. And I just checked your twrp method and it seems to charge my phone when not in the rom as well. The rom thread OP posted another kernel version of the one that comes with the rom in the thread. Original is v1.86 and new version is v2.05. Maybe it has some changes that might help?
http://temasek.rajasthanautoworks.in/Samsung Galaxy Note 3 - HLTE/CM13.0/Kernel/
My girlfriends note 3 is gOing through these same exact issues, she needs something stable so I'm going to put her back on Alliance, I will try a fresh restore and flash alliance.
Currently going from 10.4 to alliance battery drain is still present.
VJmac15 said:
My girlfriends note 3 is gOing through these same exact issues, she needs something stable so I'm going to put her back on Alliance, I will try a fresh restore and flash alliance.
Currently going from 10.4 to alliance battery drain is still present.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It seems to be a current issue after being unlocked. Either put the phone in download mode then press the power button it should restart the phone in the off status and should charge. Or put it in recovery mode in twrp and it should charge that way as well.
Captain Skeet said:
Yes I'm on 10.4. My battery drain isn't really high surprisingly it just doesn't charge usually when the battery is below 20%. If I plug it up to the wall it has the lightning bolt and says it's charging however if I leave it alone and come back then it has a lower percentage on the battery than when I plugged it up. And I just checked your twrp method and it seems to charge my phone when not in the rom as well. The rom thread OP posted another kernel version of the one that comes with the rom in the thread. Original is v1.86 and new version is v2.05. Maybe it has some changes that might help?
http://temasek.rajasthanautoworks.in/Samsung Galaxy Note 3 - HLTE/CM13.0/Kernel/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dunno but your test of the TWRP kernel vs. the temasek kernel seems like a smoking gun, so it's probably worthwhile to investigate. I thought I remembered someone saying they swapped kernels for lean kernel but I couldn't find that post, so I'm not sure what I remembered.
Trying to run a simple test over here (unpack and repack a stock kernel to break the Sammy signature - see if the observable behavior has nothing to do with signing and is all about the kernel) but I'm mucking it up... need sleep.
lates
Better Information About Battery Charge Animation on unlocked Phones
@Zzim @VJmac15 @Captain Skeet
I have some unambiguous clarifying information now about the "battery charge animation" when the phone is supposedly in an "off" state but plugged to a charger. Read on.
I took a stock (MJ7) boot image and unpacked it, and then simply repacked it, and flashed it to the boot partition in my (MJ7-firmware) SM-N900V.
Because there are very slight differences in "cpio" and libgz from linux release to release, this has the effect of making very tiny differences in the re-packed ramdisk image - enough that the Samsung signature is now broken, but likely nothing different at all from a functional perspective with the stock kernel or ramdisk (The kernel itself and it's device tree are bit-for-bit identical).
So what do it observe when I turn the device "off" and then plug to a dumb charger? The exact same stock "battery charge animation" that you would see on a retail device with a locked bootloader - plus one additional detail: that "Warranty bit set: kernel" message on the screen. After the battery animation runs for a while, the screen goes dark and the LED lights up according to charging state (red=charging, blue=charged, etc).
So the implication here is quite clear: the "off state" charging behavior you get depends on the kernel you have installed, and there is no difference in animations between signed and unsigned versions of the same stock kernel+ramdisk. An unlocked bootloader gives the same animations and LED illuminations as pure stock - so long as you are using a stock kernel.
Before I thought this was the bootloader running the (battery animation) show; but now I am beginning to believe that the bootloader fires up the kernel in some sort of jail when you plug power to the device. So if you are using a kernel that defaults to using a lot of power in it's idle state, (especially if it uses "init" to tweak into place battery savings) it's not going to charge as well as a less hungry kernel does - even when the device is supposed to be "off". It's even possible that the kernel could use more power when in this curious "off " state than when the ROM was running! (For instance, if the kernel developer decided "I'm gonna make this thing boot fast by setting the governor to performance; I'll reset it back to "interactive" with init in the late boot")
I watched the stock boot (MJ7) carefully, and realized that I couldn't conclude anything from USB behavior, as the MJ7 stock boot doesn't do anything with USB until well after init() has started running. I guess that the "jail" the bootloader creates for the kernel is probably a dummy ramdisk, perhaps including a very thin "init" program. That would explain why USB activity is seen with CM13 in this case, but not with the stock kernel. In the stock ROM that happens late in the boot after init has begun running, whereas the CM13 kernel fiddles with the USB interface before init is started.
Based on the evidence we have, I think this suggests that even with 100% stock retail devices & locked bootloaders, the same thing is going on - it's just not easily noticed because there is no on-screen activity other than that battery charge animation.. (It could be detected perhaps with an EMI sniffer or something)
So anyway - are the missing animations the fault of the kernel? Yeah, looks that way. Is it possible that the charging rate you get when the device is supposed to be "off" depends on the boot image kernel? Yeah, sure looks that way.
cheers
Amazing. Thank you for your investigation work detective. lol At least now we know it has nothing to do with signed or unsigned but more rather what kernel you have. Thanks for all your help man. If you ever need help with mimicking an issue you have shoot me a pm and I'll be more than happy to use my device to troubleshoot the same issue.
bftb0 said:
@Zzim @VJmac15 @Captain Skeet
I have some unambiguous clarifying information now about the "battery charge animation" when the phone is supposedly in an "off" state but plugged to a charger. Read on.
I took a stock (MJ7) boot image and unpacked it, and then simply repacked it, and flashed it to the boot partition in my (MJ7-firmware) SM-N900V.
Because there are very slight differences in "cpio" and libgz from linux release to release, this has the effect of making very tiny differences in the re-packed ramdisk image - enough that the Samsung signature is now broken, but likely nothing different at all from a functional perspective with the stock kernel or ramdisk (The kernel itself and it's device tree are bit-for-bit identical).
So what do it observe when I turn the device "off" and then plug to a dumb charger? The exact same stock "battery charge animation" that you would see on a retail device with a locked bootloader - plus one additional detail: that "Warranty bit set: kernel" message on the screen. After the battery animation runs for a while, the screen goes dark and the LED lights up according to charging state (red=charging, blue=charged, etc).
So the implication here is quite clear: the "off state" charging behavior you get depends on the kernel you have installed, and there is no difference in animations between signed and unsigned versions of the same stock kernel+ramdisk. An unlocked bootloader gives the same animations and LED illuminations as pure stock - so long as you are using a stock kernel.
Before I thought this was the bootloader running the (battery animation) show; but now I am beginning to believe that the bootloader fires up the kernel in some sort of jail when you plug power to the device. So if you are using a kernel that defaults to using a lot of power in it's idle state, (especially if it uses "init" to tweak into place battery savings) it's not going to charge as well as a less hungry kernel does - even when the device is supposed to be "off". It's even possible that the kernel could use more power when in this curious "off " state than when the ROM was running! (For instance, if the kernel developer decided "I'm gonna make this thing boot fast by setting the governor to performance; I'll reset it back to "interactive" with init in the late boot")
I watched the stock boot (MJ7) carefully, and realized that I couldn't conclude anything from USB behavior, as the MJ7 stock boot doesn't do anything with USB until well after init() has started running. I guess that the "jail" the bootloader creates for the kernel is probably a dummy ramdisk, perhaps including a very thin "init" program. That would explain why USB activity is seen with CM13 in this case, but not with the stock kernel. In the stock ROM that happens late in the boot after init has begun running, whereas the CM13 kernel fiddles with the USB interface before init is started.
Based on the evidence we have, I think this suggests that even with 100% stock retail devices & locked bootloaders, the same thing is going on - it's just not easily noticed because there is no on-screen activity other than that battery charge animation.. (It could be detected perhaps with an EMI sniffer or something)
So anyway - are the missing animations the fault of the kernel? Yeah, looks that way. Is it possible that the charging rate you get when the device is supposed to be "off" depends on the boot image kernel? Yeah, sure looks that way.
cheers
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My gf reports that the Rom change is perfect for her, said she was on her phone all day and only lost about 7% feels like a new phone. Booting into download mode then restarting seemingly fixed the issue as suggested. Thank you for your replies!
---------- Post added at 02:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:46 PM ----------
Captain Skeet said:
Amazing. Thank you for your investigation work detective. lol At least now we know it has nothing to do with signed or unsigned but more rather what kernel you have. Thanks for all your help man. If you ever need help with mimicking an issue you have shoot me a pm and I'll be more than happy to use my device to troubleshoot the same issue.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah that 10.4 kernel must've wrecked phones!
Hello everyone my brother's Ph-1 keeps shutting down right after powering up, I have tried everything from factory resetting to trying a different charger, nothing seems to work. This happened after he didn't use the phone for almost a month, it worked perfectly before.
It powers off even when on charge or connected to the laptop.
The phone doesn't stay on for more than a minute or two which means i cannot use ADB to side load an update
The phone is running Android P and the April security update patch.
Please do help me out
Thanking you
Kalasingha said:
Hello everyone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hello everyone
Kalasingha said:
Hello everyone my brother's Ph-1 keeps shutting down right after powering up, I have tried everything from factory resetting to trying a different charger, nothing seems to work. This happened after he didn't use the phone for almost a month, it worked perfectly before.
It powers off even when on charge or connected to the laptop.
The phone doesn't stay on for more than a minute or two which means i cannot use ADB to side load an update
The phone is running Android P and the April security update patch.
Please do help me out
Thanking you
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It could be corrupted though it sounds a bit like a battery issue, to me. If battery discharges too much eg it didn't shut down itself properly when battery was at a low level (they retain more charge than shown to user so it can shut down with proper procedure) & the battery ran down past it's reserve the battery may not be able to be recharged with a normal charger even though you charge it. (Thought a battery specialist could possibly revive it with a boost charge, though I've only seen these used with industrial batteries)
with a "dead battery bootloop" sometimes you can get it going by booting when connected to the charger, but you'll probably need a new battery. Maybe also try boot into safe or recovery mode when connected to Essential charger. (I'm assuming your phone not corrupted, though as you haven't given us much info about exactly what happens & what you are seeing)
IronRoo said:
It could be corrupted though it sounds a bit like a battery issue, to me. If battery discharges too much eg it didn't shut down itself properly when battery was at a low level (they retain more charge than shown to user so it can shut down with proper procedure) & the battery ran down past it's reserve the battery may not be able to be recharged with a normal charger even though you charge it. (Thought a battery specialist could possibly revive it with a boost charge, though I've only seen these used with industrial batteries)
with a "dead battery bootloop" sometimes you can get it going by booting when connected to the charger, but you'll probably need a new battery. Maybe also try boot into safe or recovery mode when connected to Essential charger. (I'm assuming your phone not corrupted, though as you haven't given us much info about exactly what happens & what you are seeing)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The phone shuts down even when in recovery or safe mode whilst connected to the charger.
It does sometimes fully boot up and then shutdowns, but mostly shuts down while still on the essential logo.
If I may ask what do you mean by the phone might be corrupt?
Can one month of non usage cause the battery to die out?
Kalasingha said:
The phone shuts down even when in recovery or safe mode whilst connected to the charger.
It does sometimes fully boot up and then shutdowns, but mostly shuts down while still on the essential logo.
If I may ask what do you mean by the phone might be corrupt?
Can one month of non usage cause the battery to die out?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
by corrupt I mean some data that is part of the boot process causes bootloop so it shuts down, but as your phone is shutting down at different points in boot cycle I think it's probably battery
Leaving the phone turned off unused for longish periods should not be a problem normally even with a few % left in battery. And even if left turned on it should shut itself down when battery low & be able to boot up again after a month due to the battery "reserve" capacity (but possibly a month was too long). And if it was not recharged straight away and/or rebooted multiple times the battery "reserve" could fall too low and not have enough power to start/shutdown properly (possibly causing data corruption ... though l don't know if there is some sort of fail-safe boot procedure ) Then there is a possibility there is a hardware fault with battery/phone that meant battery lost too much power.
There were some tricks ie "boost charge" you could do with removable batteries that were in "deep sleep" as shown here for example
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=TEXA7qIJ968
But they don't really work without taking your battery out (for us we might as well get a new battery when opening phone up, & there would be some risk that you damage battery as we do not know the exact charge to apply on this battery, which could cause unsafe battery) I wouldn't want to freeze my phone even though it should survive OK, as I'd be alittle concerned about long term effect on our screens small pixels (I remember the guys at popular mechanics put an old flip phone with little LCD screen in liquid nitrogen & it still worked after being warmed up!).
See https://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/low_voltage_cut_off
for more tech details
firmware issues do not cause the issue you are describing
you have a hardware problem
sounds like a bad battery to me
good news is the battery is not difficult to replace (don't listen to ifixit I am not sure what they where smoking when they did there tear down)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BCKxAQXdTJ8
don't bother with silly and wrong tricks like trying to hack the battery back to life its the wrong way todo
if the battery ever gets to that point then the battery is bad enough said
Legitsu said:
don't listen to ifixit I am not sure what they where smoking when they did there tear down
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So true! )) As much as I respect the guys from iFixit, they screwed this one up pretty badly - basically, made a tutorial on how to destroy your phone. Fixez.com did much better.
Essential PH-1 has continued to be my daily driver for almost 5 years now.
I haven't backed up the data, not even to GDrive. Yes, quite dumb. I finally found time to start to look into backing up recently, with the ADB route.
For the past 2 or 3 years, rebooting was problematic where it'd take 5+ minutes or required pressing the Power button down for a second buzz from off state, releasing it only when the animation with small circles would start. It'd then boot up to completion.
Recently, after fully charging and booting up from off state, it started showing new symptom where it'd be stuck indefinitely the Essential logo splash screen. At that time, I was still able to go into bootloader/recovery menu.
I rebooted and let it continue stuck on the Essential logo, hoping maybe it'd just take longer. After an hour, I forced it to shut down and rebooted again and put it aside to wait for it.
Within less than 2 hours, I noticed the display went blank/black.
After that, regardless of how long I press the Power button, the phone would never wake up anymore.
Plugging in the Essential OEM power adapter also does not even show the LED turning on. Can't tell if the USB port was busted or not but would be surprised if it did as charging and data transfer had always gone through a magnetic plug that's permanently plugged-in to the USB port.
Bootloader was never unlocked and, as such, also never attempted to gain root access to Android.
It was running the official Android 10 ROM from February 2020 (?).
There was no smoke or any unusual smell.
1. Is this a known/previously reported problem? I'd like to read on what others who experienced the same may have tried to resurrect.
2. If, let us say, the problem is actually with the battery, would the phone not show any signs of life when plugged-in to power adapter?
3. What are the chances some other electronics may either have slowly deteriorated or have gotten fried inside that casing?
4. If it's never powering back on, are there instructions on how to de-solder the internal storage component to try to recover the data?
5. What other possibilities can cause an Android device to not even show any signs of life?
6. Any other ideas?
Appreciate help from the community, including any pointers even if referring to a different Android device.