Database Users

Camera Help?!

Hey fellow Z1 owners. I have a question about the camera and maybe I am doing it completely wrong. I noticed that when I take pictures, they don't really come out that sharp, in superior auto or full manual. Below is an example.
As you can see on my dog's body, the fur looks like a flat, smudgy mess while in real life those are each individual hairs. Is it something to do with the camera software and pixel binning or is it my crap photo skills?
When I compare some of the pictures taken with my Nexus 5, I notice that the hairs can easily be defined and pictures are generally less noisy. Any help or insite would be appreciated. Running .290.

This picture is from the Nexus 5. As you can see, more detail and less noise. This is mindboggling to me.

The picture looks fine to me. It has that distinct "Sony" skin smoothing effect.
I assume that the lighting conditions are less than optimal? It could just be the aggressive image processing from Sony. Did you try a different camera app?

More the ISO is, more you will have this "effect".

hcloud said:
The picture looks fine to me. It has that distinct "Sony" skin smoothing effect.
I assume that the lighting conditions are less than optimal? It could just be the aggressive image processing from Sony. Did you try a different camera app?
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The lighting conditions arent "optimal' but they certainly arent LOW light. I noticed a lot of pictures have this smoothing effect reducing detail. Will a different app help this at all?

Try to take pictures on manual 8mp. 4x3 and use landscape as seen that helps me in some conditions
And don't use auto mode results won't be that good
sent from my 6903 using tapatalk
---------- Post added at 07:35 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:27 PM ----------
20 mp. Manual :
8mp. Manual scene:lanscape
Auto:
The 8mp landscape's colours do look most like the original
sent from my 6903 using tapatalk

izzet3838 said:
Try to take pictures on manual 8mp. 4x3 and use landscape as seen that helps me in some conditions
And don't use auto mode results won't be that good
sent from my 6903 using tapatalk
---------- Post added at 07:35 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:27 PM ----------
20 mp. Manual :
8mp. Manual scene:lanscape
Auto:
The 8mp landscape's colours do look most like the original
sent from my 6903 using tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Can you put them up on dropbox or flickr where we can examine the exifs.

,......

Camera issues. What's the point of OIS if...

Ok, let me try to explain.
On all my previous phones with OIS, I would set the ISO at 200 and leave it at that permanently. That way the night shots wouldn't be full of noise and the camera would adjust its shutter speed to get the most light.
One of the benefits of OIS is a "floating lens" so it should have a longer shutter speed with not as much blur as a camera without it. My problem with this camera is it still bumps up the ISO to extremely high levels in normal and IA mode, thus giving tons of noise in low light shots. Usually this is solved by setting the ISO at 200 and "forcing" it to have a longer shutter, but the problem with this camera is it doesn't. At 200 ISO, the low light pics should come out close to what you actually see with your eyes (as it did on my previous phones, like the lumia line) but it doesn't. It's WAY TOO DARK. It seems like it keeps the same shutter speed it would use even if it had 1600 ISO.
Do any of the camera mods fix this issue instead of just adding features like 4k video? I might root my phone if they fix this.

Workaround to increase Camera Photo quality

I am aware that our Mix uses a 1/3.06" 16MP Omnivision Sensor with a Pixel size of the measly 1um. But the Huawei Mate 9 has a similar sized sensor (1/2.9" 12MP sensor with a pixel size of approx. 1.25um.) and shoots really great pics. Obviously Huawei may have used a latest generation Sony sensor with Leica's optics which will blow the Omnivision away. Even the cheapest Sony sensor would outperform an Omnivision any day.
My question is, will shooting images at a lower resolution like 12MP on the Mix give us better results? I'm not expecting Mate 9 like results as the phone's camera was never a priority when I bought this device. But would this help reduce noise or give us better results compared to shooting at 16MP? I am noticing lower noise when shooting at 13MP on Open camera compared to shooting at 16MP.
Does shooting at a lower resolution increase the Pixel size from 1um? Or is it strictly something to do with the sensor? Does the sensor behave the same either way and are we just getting cropped images when shooting at lower resolutions?
I've read in a few places that the sensor is fully utilized regardless but shooting at lower resolutions can reduce noise. If I can at least get half decent 12MP images compared to noisy unreliable 16MP ones, I wouldn't mind shooting at lower resolutions. Of course I am not expecting ground breaking image quality.
Some older Sony phones like the Xperia Z2 used to have a default mode which clicked images at 8MP even though the effective sensor resolution was 21MP. Sony claimed that the lower resolution gave batter images especially lesser noise. I am referring to something like this.
Hope someone can explain this.

@satishp did a search on dpreview.com
https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/2995010
The 2nd reply sums it up pretty well.
The answer to your question is no, reducing the resolution will not increase your image quality. The sensor always takes full-resolution image. Reducing resolution is a post-processing function and is no different than reducing resolution on the computer. Note that there are a few cameras with special low-resolution modes that are supposed to improve either the image or performance in certain ways. But when you have these modes you know it because they’re selling features of the camera.
There is now a significant amount of information available publically demonstrating that image quality depends on sensor size and sensor efficiency only. The number of pixels doesn’t matter. When printed at the same print size, images from the same sized sensor exhibit the same amount of noise regardless of resolution.

Thorin78 said:
@satishp did a search on dpreview.com
https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/2995010
The 2nd reply sums it up pretty well.
The answer to your question is no, reducing the resolution will not increase your image quality. The sensor always takes full-resolution image. Reducing resolution is a post-processing function and is no different than reducing resolution on the computer. Note that there are a few cameras with special low-resolution modes that are supposed to improve either the image or performance in certain ways. But when you have these modes you know it because they’re selling features of the camera.
There is now a significant amount of information available publically demonstrating that image quality depends on sensor size and sensor efficiency only. The number of pixels doesn’t matter. When printed at the same print size, images from the same sized sensor exhibit the same amount of noise regardless of resolution.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for clearing this! So it may have been placebo that the images shot at 12MP seemed to be less noisy to me. Lol!
I use Open Camera which seems to produce brighter images compared to the stock camera. I'm sure these 3rd party apps aren't magically making the sensor capture more light compared to the stock app. I've noticed that these apps automatically crank up the display brightness to max as soon as they are launched. There may also be some real-time processing involved which makes the images appear brighter and slightly better compared to the stock app.
I am considering getting the Sony Alpha QX1 (with inter-changeable lenses) or the older QX100 which would make the Mix perfect! These lens style cameras attach to the phone and transfer images directly to the phone via NFC pairing. Just wondering whether the mix is too wide for the bracket on the lenses. The QX1 has the same APS-C sensor utilized on some of Sony's Alpha range and the QX100 has the 1" BSI sensor used on the RX100II. Only downside is that none of them can do 4K video.
Thanks again! Cheers!

satishp said:
I am considering getting the Sony Alpha QX1 (with inter-changeable lenses) or the older QX100 which would make the Mix perfect! These lens style cameras attach to the phone and transfer images directly to the phone via NFC pairing. Just wondering whether the mix is too wide for the bracket on the lenses. The QX1 has the same APS-C sensor utilized on some of Sony's Alpha range and the QX100 has the 1" BSI sensor used on the RX100II. Only downside is that none of them can do 4K video.
Thanks again! Cheers!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You will need this - https://www.amazon.com/SPA-TA1-Tabl...UTF8&qid=1483946210&sr=8-2&keywords=qx+tablet
The smallest one should work perfectly with the phone. I had the QX-100 and it didn't fit the note 4 out of the box.

emann56 said:
You will need this - https://www.amazon.com/SPA-TA1-Tabl...UTF8&qid=1483946210&sr=8-2&keywords=qx+tablet
The smallest one should work perfectly with the phone. I had the QX-100 and it didn't fit the note 4 out of the box.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Seems to be quite expensive just for an attachment. If it didn't fit the Note 4, it most definitely won't fit the Mix. So I guess that attachment is a must and when you add the price of the QX1's body + Lens + the attachment, it doesn't seem to be worth it. Ofcourse, the images would blow away even the best of mobile cameras.
Only if it was priced right!

I have the QX-30, the tablet mount is a must unless you plan on not attaching it to the phone. It makes the overall portability not so great, you're probably better off just getting a full blown dedicated camera but the QX-1 might be good, just make sure to buy one of the lenses otherwise you can't do anything, the SELP1650 might be decent I think.
Also if you're thinking of getting the swiveling rotation mount, don't bother, it's not compatible with the tablet mount.

For those who haven't tried RAW capture yet, stock camera works perfectly fine after activating the camera2 api. Just thought I should mention that since it's not such an uncommon issue.

Camera
benziii said:
For those who haven't tried RAW capture yet, stock camera works perfectly fine after activating the camera2 api. Just thought I should mention that since it's not such an uncommon issue.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How do you do that. please give us instructions on how to.

jaime4272 said:
How do you do that. please give us instructions on how to.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Add the line "persist.camera.HAL3.enabled=1" at the end of your build.prop, then reboot. It goes without saying you either need a build.prop editor or like me, just use the text editor that comes with Root explorer for example. Next get a camera app that supports RAW, like Open camera or Manual camera.
[Edit] Remember to mount as read/write when you are in system folder, or your changes won't stick. Our build.prop has two empty lines at the bottom, so if you have added something at an earlier time, make sure you have one empty line at the end.

benziii said:
For those who haven't tried RAW capture yet, stock camera works perfectly fine after activating the camera2 api. Just thought I should mention that since it's not such an uncommon issue.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Only for my understanding
Does it only activate RAW mode or does it increase the picture quality for ordinary mode too?

vergilbt said:
Only for my understanding
Does it only activate RAW mode or does it increase the picture quality for ordinary mode too?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is more to it than just RAW. Read up on camera2 features and what an api is. But to answer your question, no, it does not increase quality.

Apps that support raw
benziii said:
There is more to it than just RAW. Read up on camera2 features and what an api is. But to answer your question, no, it does not increase quality.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I downloaded camera FV-5 which support raw the option said that this phone does not support RAW, any idea?

jaime4272 said:
I downloaded camera FV-5 which support raw the option said that this phone does not support RAW, any idea?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Even though I know FV-5 has been praised for years, I've never bought it. I'm not a big snapper so I've often been content with manual modes on the stock cameras. But since I have recently gotten RAW capture going, I've contemplated loosely on paying for either Manual camera or Camera FV-5. All I've tried on the Mix so far, is Manual camera's compatibility app (which checks out), and taken some RAW pics with Open camera.
I'm going to check out some more apps soon.
Considering it is required for RAW capture, I reckon you have a paid version? I quickly tried the free one, and see only one instance of compatibility (under general photo settings). But there is nothing there. Do you get the message when you change picture output?

There is an option on the paid version but it's grayed out because of incompatibility, but there is

you don't improve the noise performance by taking a smaller resolution, you do that by downsizing from a large image.
I think the best method is to use a good manual setting, shoot in raw and then edit in post processing.
however I think the images aren't that reliable

I cannot Open the dng file
---------- Post added at 05:19 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:18 AM ----------
Snapseed and Lightroom cannot parse the dng File ....Amy Help?

gorillalaci said:
I cannot Open the dng file
---------- Post added at 05:19 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:18 AM ----------
Snapseed and Lightroom cannot parse the dng File ....Amy Help?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
On my desktop I use UFRaw and Gimp / Photoshop. But I haven't gotten any mobile apps to open my RAW images either. Weird.

I know this is a few months old, but I think this app needs to be better known:
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=troop.com.freedcam
Yes, it works with DNGs and can handle our Mix Camera sensor. And yes, it's 100% FREE.
Also, it comes from a XDA dev, so even more kudos for him!!

codymamak said:
I know this is a few months old, but I think this app needs to be better known:
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=troop.com.freedcam
Yes, it works with DNGs and can handle our Mix Camera sensor. And yes, it's 100% FREE.
Also, it comes from a XDA dev, so even more kudos for him!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Installed it, but crashing when try to tap to focus.. Autofocus doesnt work it self

I have it working, but I'm using the LOS 14.1 build 20.5.17 from here on XDA, not MIUI. Sorry but I didn't test stock ROM before flashing.
Also, you can contact the dev at this thread here at XDA: https://forum.xda-developers.com/android/apps-games/camera-freedcam-4-0-3-t3115548
Maybe he can help out.

Redmi Note 4 (SD and MTK) photography thread

I don't see this thread here so I might as well start one. Use this thread to show of your photography skills on the Note 4, since people insist on camera2 API all the time and we are lucky to have it.
If you're uploading multiple photos please
them so it won't be a huge post or use the attachment function.
Do share your camera app and custom settings if you can too.
Files attached used HDR for daytime while the night sky pic used ISO 1600 and 0.6s shutter speed. All taken with Open Camera. Anyone got better settings to take pictures os stars or the moon at night?

Can you please confirm that exposure settings working or not in manual mode? And what is the maximum exposure time?
---------- Post added at 10:43 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:42 PM ----------
AutumQueen92 said:
I don't see this thread here so I might as well start one. Use this thread to show of your photography skills on the Note 4, since people insist on camera2 API all the time and we are lucky to have it.
If you're uploading multiple photos please
them so it won't be a huge post or use the attachment function.
Do share your camera app and custom settings if you can too.
Files attached used HDR for daytime while the night sky pic used ISO 1600 and 0.6s shutter speed. All taken with Open Camera. Anyone got better settings to take pictures os stars or the moon at night?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Waiting for your reply.

ridershahmir said:
Can you please confirm that exposure settings working or not in manual mode? And what is the maximum exposure time?
---------- Post added at 10:43 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:42 PM ----------
Waiting for your reply.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They're all working, exposure time goes up to 0.7s

AutumQueen92 said:
They're all working, exposure time goes up to 0.7s
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Click to collapse
Can you do longer exposure and lower the ISO?

syl0n said:
Can you do longer exposure and lower the ISO?
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Click to collapse
For longer you need other camera apps, the resolution will be stuck at 2mp. You can change iso yes.

AutumQueen92 said:
For longer you need other camera apps, the resolution will be stuck at 2mp. You can change iso yes.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
By how much can you increase the exposure time in third party apps such as manual camera app or other apps?

ridershahmir said:
By how much can you increase the exposure time in third party apps such as manual camera app or other apps?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
0.7s

Nature clicks with miui 8.5 and miui 9 camera
SD625

notauseranymore said:
For longer you need other camera apps, the resolution will be stuck at 2mp. You can change iso yes.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Max resolution is at 2Mp because the long exposure is not real but through software. Many pics are taken and then combined.

Google Camera Pixel 2 Mod Arnova8G2 Version 8, all max settings.

Triple camera? More like two...

Hi guys I just found a very strange problem.
I'm on the latest dev xiaomi.eu build.
I just discovered the following.
The wide camera (48mp) does not work.
Actually if I block it with my finger, and change between ultra wide, wide or tele I can still see through camera.
It is like the 48mp camera never used...
for ultra wide, it uses the bottom camera and for 1x & 2x it uses the middle camera.
The upper camera (48mp) is never used... Pictures though are super... is this normal?
The above is if I use the default camera app.
If I use a gcam then
ultra wide is again the bottom camera
1x is the middle camera and 2x is the (48mp) wtf?
Thank you in advance!

Same here! Really strange..... Someone with original rom can confirm this too?
---------- Post added at 10:40 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:18 PM ----------
I've received a reply on xiaomi.eu forum:
---------- Post added at 10:42 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:40 PM ----------
I've received a reply on xiaomi.eu forum:
Yes, looks like it's normal...
In MIUI Camera app:
"top" camera is used in "Portrait" mode (= pratically same as 2x with "middle" camera).
"middle" camera is used for 48mp / 1x and 2x
"bottom" camera is used for ultra-wide / 0.6x
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

It`s because MIUI camera in auto mode uses main sensor for 2x zoom. It does not happen when you choose telephoto in pro mode. Gcam have no such "feature" it seems xd

So if we use xiaomi.eu roms then we do not have the full potential of the camera correct?
The only way to actually use the wide lens is to switch again to global?
Did you try to just replace the cam app from the global?

megam4n said:
So if we use xiaomi.eu roms then we do not have the full potential of the camera correct?
The only way to actually use the wide lens is to switch again to global?
Did you try to just replace the cam app from the global?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It`s the same. I am on official global and i confirmed this. It seems it`s intended to be this way by Xiaomi. Also i really doubt you lose much camera potential. Telephoto lens sucks and i wish it to disappear. Waste of space IMO.

Yes I agree with you but from what it seems
It uses the supposedly telephoto for normal and in portrait the 48mp as telephoto.
So we do not actually take pictures with the actual wide... Or the wide is actually the middle cam and they put the 48mp letter to the telephoto?
I'm bloody confused hahaha

They are
Top: 8MP x2
Middle: 48MP x1
Bottom: 13MP x0.6
Letters and colored circle are misleading.

Honestly i only use 1, the main sensor.
The rest are way lower quality sensor.

8MP telephoto is still more detailed than zoom into a 48MP shot.

sanoayyk said:
They are
Top: 8MP x2
Middle: 48MP x1
Bottom: 13MP x0.6
Letters and colored circle are misleading.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you, but as I understand it actually uses the middle also when we press the x2 button.
The only way to use the actual telephoto is through the pro settings.
Pupet_Master said:
Honestly i only use 1, the main sensor.
The rest are way lower quality sensor.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I also only use the main sensor and sometimes the ultrawide.
sanoayyk said:
8MP telephoto is still more detailed than zoom into a 48MP shot.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Probably you are right. I never take zoomed photos though so I can't really say.

sanoayyk said:
They are
Top: 8MP x2
Middle: 48MP x1
Bottom: 13MP x0.6
Letters and colored circle are misleading.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Absolutely right!
It's very funny to read in some test articles for 9T that the top sensor is the Sony with 48MP.
It's also very astonishing that Xiaomi tries to let people think the upper camera is the flagship by printing 48MP next to it and paint the upper glas-ring in pretty red color (for the black model).
With global rom and stock camera app the behavior is like that:
In Auto-Photo mode:
0.6 - 0.9 Bottom Super-Wide-Lens
1.0 - 1.9 Middle 48MP Sony Wide-Lens
2.0 - max Top Tele-Lens
You can see the change of lens and also the change of color in the fiewfinder by zooming with 2 fingers from 1.9 to 2.0
In Pro-Mode:
If you choose Main-Sensor (Middle Sony Wide-Lens) you can zoom to max without switching to Tele-Lens.
In Portrait-Mode:
The top Tele-Lens is used for the picture and the middle Main-Lens is for bokeh-effect.
You can test it by taking a portrait-mode picture while putting your finger on the middle lens. Result will be a portrait picture without bokeh-effect.

Did a few tests with gcam/stock camera, to analyze the "usefulness" of the 8mp telephoto compared to main 48mp one, in a static and detailed scene
comparing a 8mp with a 12mp "resized" to match zoom size = 8MP is MUCH better and more detailed
comparing a 8mp with a 12mp zoomed 2x in camera to match zoom size = 8MP is MUCH better and more detailed
comparing a 8mp with a 48mp "resized" to match zoom size = 8MP is still better and more detailed
comparing a 8mp with a 48mp "resized" RAW to match zoom size = 8MP is still better, the raw one is "90%" there
so the 8MP tele camera is super useful and provide better image than any method of zooming the 48MP, unless you are taking 48MP RAW all the time. If you are using JPG, the telephoto is amazing. That's why the stock camera use the telephoto when zooming in good light conditions, but switch to the main camera when there is less light (it is better to have a less detailed and cleaner image than more detailed and noisier one, and the telephoto is very noisy in low light)
if anyone want it, i can provide 100% crop samples.