Hi everyone,
Am I the only one being shocked about the available data being 52.7Go, from (roughly) 59.3Go total ?
I know there might be some roms out there, CM13 and so on, but I remember repartitionning my i9100 or that old HP Touchpad to much, much smaller partitions in order to grab some space.
- Since the ZIP is around 2.2Go, let's go around 3.5Go for caching purposes : that would be 3Go won for free. And even much much more, since a 350Mo CM13 is the size the OS should take. 2200Mo for the system, for real?
So, my question is : Does somebody has the time to explain why there are so few repartition tools around for most devices (of what's I've seen/looked, seems to be about the tools/bootloaders/drivers being open enough), and if we might see that for the Axon 7 someday? I'm a freak for wasted space.
Thanks
There are so few tools in general, because if someone messes that up, there very often isn't a way to fix the phone. How many people mess up a simple flash of their phone, much less handle repartitioning their entire device?
And they can't just size the partitions to the current size, esp. for system. They have to leave space for future upgrades to allow for size upgrades. Plus, there are a lot of different partitions on the phone (32, most are small) for the various system parts that also leave some expansion room. System does seem to have to have some wasted space being sized at 6 GB but only using 3.8. But that does leave plenty of room for future system updates (and the Chinese system image is around 4.6 GB).
Companies don't often ship all of those partition images as they are usually low level factory things or phone specific. So people would have to know how to make a full backup of those and restore them.
Related
sorry if this seems a silly question but im after a bit of advice. its regarding storage space left on my unit. as it stands i have left-
device
free storage 83.97 mb
free program 165.47 mb
sd card
free memory 113.67
i have'nt got that much installed on my phone and what i have i try to keep on the sd card but i see i'v used nearly half of the total storage and program space available on my unit, should i be worried or in reality have i still got plenty left?.are there any programes that i can use to tidy up any files im not using or im aware of.
as you can probably tell im pretty new to wm (i'v always had the se/nokia type phones but i love my hd2) so any advice is welcome.cheers.....
As a matter of fact, the stock ROM is not very generous with memory (except maybe RAM).
This might be one of the major reasons why many people prefer "custom ROMs", which can be found here at xda.
Almost all of those custom ROMs offer more memory space, because all the
"bloatware" has been removed. In some cases even more stringent, as even
"unnecessary" language files are no longer existing.
It will strongly depend on your personal needs and way of usage if you run out of memory (or get tight).
with 83 odd meg of internal storage capacity left you are still in a pretty healthy state.
its maybe time to start reading up on all the different roms. thanks for the advice guys.
Hello.
Right now I am on Cyanogen 4.2.15.1.
The biggest problem of G1 is imho lack of memory. I did every possible hack to make more memory available to my phone. I use compcache, 10mb hack etc..
I also tried swap, but it has been giving me some troubles and I find my phone working better without it.
I see everybody switching to 2.x roms and of course it makes me want to switch too although my phone runs pretty fine as it is now. But I would switch if I am convinced that things will improve. So here come the questions:
Did you experienced speed improvement by switching or it just runs the same/slower? (I am only interested in answers of G1 users as this is somehow a bit specific phone with the lack of memory)
My second question rose from my concerns of memory too. To use 2.x roms, one has to use DangerSPL, right? I am not sure about this, but I got the impression, that this one moves some of the memory from application runtime to rom space, so we can fit larger roms in. Does that mean, that in the end this rom has less operational memory for itself? Because that would be the exact opposite thing to what I want to do.
Thanks for the answers.
You as many others are confusing persistent storage with ram.
Ram is fast but will not store data over a reboot.. the amount of ram on the dream remains the same regardless of the spl/radio/rom (with maybe an exception of the 10mb hack that borrows 8mb from video ram for general use)
The persistent storage slow and is what danger spl changes.. this is the equivalent of your hard drive on a computer.
In the case of danger spl it significantly reduces the temporary space (cache) and increases both the core system storage (system) and the user space storage (data) this allows more on internal phone storage instead of the sdcard, having your core apps not using apps2sd is likely to increase perceived speed.
Since the memory (ram) is unchanged and the new kernels are better at memory management there is potential for newer versions to support more tasks at the same time than the older versions. (We are not there yet but cm-5.0.8-test4 and cm-4.2.15.1 seem similar in behavior in terms of what can be done with the ram avalible)
As for upgrading that's your choice.. in general on the dream anyway I don't recommend going to cm5.0.7 and related roms if you have not already done so.. and I never recommend a test version if you are not looking to be a tester. So I'd wait till cm5.0.8 final and related roms are pushed if you feel it's time to upgrade.
Otherwise if you are on a stable 1.6 rom that fills your needs and want to keep a very stable phone.. there is no need to rush the upgrade.. at some point you will find something that requires you to upgrade to 2.1 and will be glad it exists as it will improve the usefulness of the phone.. and I'm sure the stability of 2.1 will only improve over time.
Thank you for your answer.
I of course understand the difference between ram and persistent storage (rom?). The information I missed is that the additional memory is taken from the cache. Someone somwhere here posted something that implied that it reduces ram. Hackery!
Thank you for clearing that up. What are consequences of having less cache? Is this not a problem then?
You got my point with stable 1.6. I do not want to flash new rom every week and prefer stable working phone. The ONLY thing I was hoping for is the better memory management and maybe the whole rom footprint in ram, leaving more room for apps instead of system. I am running apps2sd but I think the main source of sluggishness of my phone is that apps are too often removed from ram by dalvik.
So I was hoping for something like " Yep, 2.1 is 50mb in ram instead of 80mb of 1.6 and you will have more free memory." That would make me switch. Having the same amount or even less makes no sense for me. I see no killer 2.x feature that I need to have so far.
Same amount of ram with both spls as I said. No 10mb hack on cm5 because the gpu is used for system operations
Cache is mounted as /cache and as I said contains temporary and cached data.. As designed its intended as a staging area, which will usually persist across reboots but may not under certain situations.
No performance impact ought to exist due to the resize. If too many things are attempted to be saved here you will get out of disk space errors.. but 30mb is plenty for the staging operations required by the system during normal operation.
As you may know: Linux never has "free" memory.. but reclaimable memory.. the reason for thus is anything read from persistent media is put into "disk cache" in case its needed again.. if the memory is needed for something else it will be freed at no/little cost, but if the cached files are needed they wont be reloaded thus saving the time reading disks/SD/flash.
(Thus why devs cringe when people show the output of free.. 'cat /proc/meminfo' will give full detailed breakdown of memory use if you qknow how to read it)
I am Linux guy myself, so I know how it manages the memory. Anyway, 10mb hack was a huge thing for me, can not live without it.
That pretty much means I am staying and 1.6, thank you for your time.
I have the TMOUSA version, but I think this question would apply to all versions, and in fact to other phones as well.
I was just re-reading the excellent guide to storage card optimization by the great Windows Mobile guru (and XDA member) who writes under the name Menneisys:
http://www.smartphonemag.com/cms/forum/topic/17921?&TOPIC_ID=17921
That article was written a few years ago, though, with older WM versions, and older storage cards.
I am wondering if the info is still relevant, to a new phone like the HD2, with WM 6.5 and Sense, and the newer storage cards?
The 16MB storage card that comes with the HD2, although the newer SDHC type, is only Class 2, therefore relatively slow, compared to Class 4 and Class 6 cards. I am wondering if using any of the tweaks suggested in the article by Menneisys would speed up the card.
For instance, changing from FAT32 to FAT16? (FAT16 is really ancient now though, don't know if it would work well at all on newer cards and devices.)
Eliminating the FAT backup?
Also, by changing to a larger cluster size? (Which of course, would reduce the storage space, by adding more slack. But would it speed up the card's performance enough to make it worth it?)
Of course defragmentation is always a good idea, with any disk or card, old or new. That part of his advice is not in question, then or now.
But I am wondering about the other stuff--like changing to FAT16, eliminating the FAT backup, and changing the cluster size?
Anyone know? (Menneisys, are you reading? Others?)
Thank you.
well, without reading the link, (i'll save that till the kids are in bed) i can say that fat16 can't address 16gb, however re the cluster size, yes, that can deff help, especially if you have lots of fairly large files. if your card is mostly music images and video, then you can deff benefit from setting the size as large as it will go. it does mean tiny files will take up a whole block, of course, but if its mostly big files then go for it.
samsamuel said:
well, without reading the link, (i'll save that till the kids are in bed) i can say that fat16 can't address 16gb, however re the cluster size, yes, that can deff help, especially if you have lots of fairly large files. if your card is mostly music images and video, then you can deff benefit from setting the size as large as it will go. it does mean tiny files will take up a whole block, of course, but if its mostly big files then go for it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Very interesting article. Yes, do read it when you have a chance.
Yes, probably SDHC cards did not exist at the time of the article, nothing larger than 2 GB. So, sounds like the FAT16 option is out for current cards.
Do you know if that option of formatting a card with "no FAT backup" still makes sense on current cards? Is it a risky thing to do?
Regarding the cluster size-- most of us probably have both small and large files, not only one or the other. So, it is a trade-off between speed and storage space. What cluster size do you think is a good balance between the two?
never read anything about fat backup, so i couldn't say. as for block size, i use 16k on a 2gb card, which has 1gb of music and about 300meg images.
i would say the lost space is negligible on sdcards, even if you have a thousand 1k files, you only waste 16meg, so that's maybe 1/2 an mp3 album,, its only really an issue when dealing with hundreds of gig hard disks with tens of thousands of tiny system and program files. (just checked mine, theres only 250 files smaller than 32k, and only 120 less than 5k)
course, its a matter of preference, and i'm sure there are loads of people will say i'm wasting space and should be disowned from the community,, hehe
samsamuel said:
never read anything about fat backup, so i couldn't say. as for block size, i use 16k on a 2gb card, which has 1gb of music and about 300meg images.
i would say the lost space is negligible on sdcards, even if you have a thousand 1k files, you only waste 16meg, so that's maybe 1/2 an mp3 album,, its only really an issue when dealing with hundreds of gig hard disks with tens of thousands of tiny system and program files. (just checked mine, theres only 250 files smaller than 32k, and only 120 less than 5k)
course, its a matter of preference, and i'm sure there are loads of people will say i'm wasting space and should be disowned from the community,, hehe
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Read the Menneisys article, and he says it makes the card run a lot faster, to eliminate the FAT backup. (Something you can do with SK Tools.)
However, I would wonder if that would make the card less stable, more prone to data loss. Or, even whether a non-standard cluster size might make the card more flaky?
does wm 6.5 support exfat?
using 16G thumbdrive on win 7, exfat is wayyyy faster than ntfs.
I used the 8GB card at the beginning, switched then to a 16GB card class 6 and then to 32 GB class 2 and din´t find the slightest dfifference in speed, neither when recording videos with the cam in max resolution.
me said:
Read the Menneisys article, and he says it makes the card run a lot faster, to eliminate the FAT backup. (Something you can do with SK Tools.)
However, I would wonder if that would make the card less stable, more prone to data loss. Or, even whether a non-standard cluster size might make the card more flaky?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lets take a step back and think about what the FAT backup is. i believe it is another table that mirrors the contents of the primary table. essentially, it can be used to recover your file system table in case the primary backup is corrupted/lost. now lets think about WHEN this table is read. to the best of my knowledge, the backup is read ONLY if the primary is found to be corrupted. similarly, the backup is UPDATED/WRITTEN only when the primary is UPDATED/WRITTEN.
thus, any speed gain due to disabling the backup should be seen in WRITE operations ONLY. read speed should be not be affected by that tweak. i could be wrong though!
if i am correct, then try disabling the backup if you desire write speed. however, you will lose some of the "robustness" of the file system. and FAT (and its variants like FAT12, FAT16, FAT32) are already fairly fragile file systems.
regarding cluster sizes, a smaller cluster size means LESS wastage when having many SMALL files. a larger cluster size means MORE wastage when having many SMALL files. however, a smaller cluster size means MORE clusters to address, which means a LARGER allocation table, which means MORE TIME spent looking up/updating the table's contents. conversely, a larger cluster size means LESS clusters to address, which means a SMALLER allocation table, which means LESS TIME spent looking up/updating the table's contents. so the sweet spot would be somewhere in the middle. HOWEVER, most modern operating systems load the allocation table in MEMORY so i imagine the speed gain would be negligible. the fact that the table is managed in memory and periodically updated back to the disk is the reason behind most corruptions in a non-journaling file system like FAT.
i've over simplified things a bit, but it should give you an idea of what kind of gains to expect by such tweaking (i.e. little to none in my opinion!).
Again, I'd suggest reading the Menneisys article.
ASCIIker said:
lets take a step back and think about what the FAT backup is. i believe it is another table that mirrors the contents of the primary table. essentially, it can be used to recover your file system table in case the primary backup is corrupted/lost. now lets think about WHEN this table is read. to the best of my knowledge, the backup is read ONLY if the primary is found to be corrupted. similarly, the backup is UPDATED/WRITTEN only when the primary is UPDATED/WRITTEN.
thus, any speed gain due to disabling the backup should be seen in WRITE operations ONLY. read speed should be not be affected by that tweak. i could be wrong though!
if i am correct, then try disabling the backup if you desire write speed. however, you will lose some of the "robustness" of the file system. and FAT (and its variants like FAT12, FAT16, FAT32) are already fairly fragile file systems.
regarding cluster sizes, a smaller cluster size means LESS wastage when having many SMALL files. a larger cluster size means MORE wastage when having many SMALL files. however, a smaller cluster size means MORE clusters to address, which means a LARGER allocation table, which means MORE TIME spent looking up/updating the table's contents. conversely, a larger cluster size means LESS clusters to address, which means a SMALLER allocation table, which means LESS TIME spent looking up/updating the table's contents. so the sweet spot would be somewhere in the middle. HOWEVER, most modern operating systems load the allocation table in MEMORY so i imagine the speed gain would be negligible. the fact that the table is managed in memory and periodically updated back to the disk is the reason behind most corruptions in a non-journaling file system like FAT.
i've over simplified things a bit, but it should give you an idea of what kind of gains to expect by such tweaking (i.e. little to none in my opinion!).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
These tests might be of some interest to you.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=756781&highlight=card+speed+test
Hi folks,
I've had a look on this site and on the web in general, but can't find anything that answers my question.
I have a Samsung Omnia 7 which now reports 4.39GB in reserved space. It seems to have gone from about 2GB when I first got the phone, it's varied slightly on a day-by-day basis, but seems to have had two occasions when it's jumped up by about 1GB each time to get to the current figure.
I figure that the reserved space is due to the apps I have installed. And it seems likely that a minority of the apps have chewed up a large amount of space (perhaps the 80/20 rule).
I've read that to reclaim this space I need to do a factory reset, but that sounds like overkill.
So, is there any way to determine what space each app is using so I can remove unused, wasteful apps?
Otherwise, if I do a factory reset, reconfigure the phone, and reinstall my apps, I'd really hate to find that memory has reduced, but then jumps up when I actually run my apps.
If I have to do the factory reset, is there a walk-through or best practice for doing so?
Cheers.
James.
In marketplace you can see the files sizes of the installation package of each software. This is not exactly the space of software but this will surely help you.
Reserved Space
Hi
If you launch Zune software (assuming you have windows) you can adjust the space reserved;
Go to sync options
Reserved space ad adjust the slider to something more in line with what you need
Hope this helps
Hello,
I read in somewhere thant if you conect the phone in various pc`s with zune, this space reserved is increased :-(
Hello -
This issue has been bugging me for a long time. I'm seeking some general information about the Optimus-T (LG P509) and Android design as a whole. My phone is not the latest and greatest and I've resisted rooting. Maybe this pushes me in that direction. But I need to come to a better understanding of what's going on and how things work in general. Hopefully one of you experts can give some advice.
Memory questions: I keep running low on memory in the device which provides for many goofy results when used. I've moved as many apps as possible to the 16gB SD card. The card has a lot of music on it with 3.2 gB remaining - plays great. Android Assistant reports the following memory compliment relevant to my question:
Memory Info(RAM) Used: 247.75mB
Free: 170.41mB
Total Memory: 418.53 mB
Phone Space Info(ROM)
Used: 157.45mB
Free: 42.05mB
Total Space: 199.5mB
Observations: As I watch the display, the RAM values shift slightly around depending on what the phone is doing at that moment. The values don't fluctuate too wildly at least not from what I observe. I get that part. But... when Phone Space(ROM) drops to the low 20mB level, the device slows to a crawl, often reboots, browser stops and drops back to the home page; all with no error notification. I clear the caches two-three times daily which will raise the ROM value but only by the amount of cache released. I found that keeping around 40mB in ROM provides smooth trouble-free operation. Here's the question: Why is ROM even involved in supporting program code/data operations like this? I've always assumed that ROM (Read Only Memory) by definition is static in nature and thus shouldn't change. Here in Android-land apparently things may not be the same as I understand. So I'm forced into uninstalling some really useful programs (ie Google+) that I like in order to bring the ROM value around the 40mB threshold. I know memory has a finite limit. I don't understand why ROM is even involved and thus why it "flexes". Can someone explain, please?
Look at the amount of available RAM above. Why doesn't the phone use this RAM for program code/data execution? Because I approach this from a Windows/PC background here, perhaps that's what's throwing me off. Still, it's got ample RAM that looks to be unused for the most part. Is there a command or setting (I've looked all over the place) to demand the phone use RAM over ROM? If it did that, I'd have plenty of space and no problem at all.
Given the above, if I stuck having to deal with low ROM, do any of you know if additional ROM/RAM can be added gaining more "Phone Space"? I'm not talking about the SD card; I'm talking about the base memory populated inside the device that serves as that valuable "Phone Space" referred to above?
I'd really appreciate a answer to this. Thank you for your time and any advice.
H
Hoibb said:
Hello -
This issue has been bugging me for a long time. I'm seeking some general information about the Optimus-T (LG P509) and Android design as a whole. My phone is not the latest and greatest and I've resisted rooting. Maybe this pushes me in that direction. But I need to come to a better understanding of what's going on and how things work in general. Hopefully one of you experts can give some advice.
Memory questions: I keep running low on memory in the device which provides for many goofy results when used. I've moved as many apps as possible to the 16gB SD card. The card has a lot of music on it with 3.2 gB remaining - plays great. Android Assistant reports the following memory compliment relevant to my question:
Memory Info(RAM) Used: 247.75mB
Free: 170.41mB
Total Memory: 418.53 mB
Phone Space Info(ROM)
Used: 157.45mB
Free: 42.05mB
Total Space: 199.5mB
Observations: As I watch the display, the RAM values shift slightly around depending on what the phone is doing at that moment. The values don't fluctuate too wildly at least not from what I observe. I get that part. But... when Phone Space(ROM) drops to the low 20mB level, the device slows to a crawl, often reboots, browser stops and drops back to the home page; all with no error notification. I clear the caches two-three times daily which will raise the ROM value but only by the amount of cache released. I found that keeping around 40mB in ROM provides smooth trouble-free operation. Here's the question: Why is ROM even involved in supporting program code/data operations like this? I've always assumed that ROM (Read Only Memory) by definition is static in nature and thus shouldn't change. Here in Android-land apparently things may not be the same as I understand. So I'm forced into uninstalling some really useful programs (ie Google+) that I like in order to bring the ROM value around the 40mB threshold. I know memory has a finite limit. I don't understand why ROM is even involved and thus why it "flexes". Can someone explain, please?
Look at the amount of available RAM above. Why doesn't the phone use this RAM for program code/data execution? Because I approach this from a Windows/PC background here, perhaps that's what's throwing me off. Still, it's got ample RAM that looks to be unused for the most part. Is there a command or setting (I've looked all over the place) to demand the phone use RAM over ROM? If it did that, I'd have plenty of space and no problem at all.
Given the above, if I stuck having to deal with low ROM, do any of you know if additional ROM/RAM can be added gaining more "Phone Space"? I'm not talking about the SD card; I'm talking about the base memory populated inside the device that serves as that valuable "Phone Space" referred to above?
I'd really appreciate a answer to this. Thank you for your time and any advice.
H
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In answer to your question, I'd like to say that it's just one of those things you'll have to go with(Let me assure you I hate it as much as you do)
Android phones need at least 30~40 MB free space in internal memory to function smoothly...maybe that's just the way they are programmed. That's the reason why phones today come with much higher internal memory...and no, there's no way to make the ram to be used instead or to increase the internal memory. In short-you'll just have to install less apps...or if you root your phone you can try App2SD scripts
Sent from my LG P500 using XDA Premium
Press thanks button if I helped you
Thank you.
So again, I have to change my thinking about how "ROM" here is designed and implemented. ROM (in a PC for example) is certainly used but not in the same way with the same characteristics as used in Android-ville.
And so this tells me, rooting is the last hope for gaining back critical internal (ROM) space so I can have more apps. Again, right now in stock mode, App2SD reports that no further apps can be moved to the card.
I do like this device a lot. It's small, compact and feature rich for what I need. There's lots of good advice on here about the rooting process. It's just "scary" territory as I enter this not knowing if I can avoid the brick.
Thanks again.
H
Hoibb said:
Thank you.
So again, I have to change my thinking about how "ROM" here is designed and implemented. ROM (in a PC for example) is certainly used but not in the same way with the same characteristics as used in Android-ville.
And so this tells me, rooting is the last hope for gaining back critical internal (ROM) space so I can have more apps. Again, right now in stock mode, App2SD reports that no further apps can be moved to the card.
I do like this device a lot. It's small, compact and feature rich for what I need. There's lots of good advice on here about the rooting process. It's just "scary" territory as I enter this not knowing if I can avoid the brick.
Thanks again.
H
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Rooting your device is actually the easy part, it's possible but unlikely that you will brick it, I had the same thoughts when I done my O1 P500, but now I'm rooted I wouldn't ever go back... I used superoneclick & that had the option to Unroot, I am not sure on other applications because I haven't used them. Basically follow the instructions right down to the letter (re-read or do it when you're wide awake so you don't miss anything), but in my own personal experience rooting it was easy.
Once rooted download the app called "Root Checker Basic" from android market, it should come back saying "This device has root access".
Once rooted you can do so much more, run apps that require root, backup your entire android system, and alot more.
Hope my info helped you, but in all honesty rooting is up to you, don't let anyone else make that choice for you, but just as a side note, rooting will void your warranty then again it's reversible.
Everything written here is based on my own experience and is only intended as a guide.
Hoibb said:
Hello -
This issue has been bugging me for a long time. I'm seeking some general information about the Optimus-T (LG P509) and Android design as a whole. My phone is not the latest and greatest and I've resisted rooting. Maybe this pushes me in that direction. But I need to come to a better understanding of what's going on and how things work in general. Hopefully one of you experts can give some advice.
Memory questions: I keep running low on memory in the device which provides for many goofy results when used. I've moved as many apps as possible to the 16gB SD card. The card has a lot of music on it with 3.2 gB remaining - plays great. Android Assistant reports the following memory compliment relevant to my question:
Memory Info(RAM) Used: 247.75mB
Free: 170.41mB
Total Memory: 418.53 mB
Phone Space Info(ROM)
Used: 157.45mB
Free: 42.05mB
Total Space: 199.5mB
Observations: As I watch the display, the RAM values shift slightly around depending on what the phone is doing at that moment. The values don't fluctuate too wildly at least not from what I observe. I get that part. But... when Phone Space(ROM) drops to the low 20mB level, the device slows to a crawl, often reboots, browser stops and drops back to the home page; all with no error notification. I clear the caches two-three times daily which will raise the ROM value but only by the amount of cache released. I found that keeping around 40mB in ROM provides smooth trouble-free operation. Here's the question: Why is ROM even involved in supporting program code/data operations like this? I've always assumed that ROM (Read Only Memory) by definition is static in nature and thus shouldn't change. Here in Android-land apparently things may not be the same as I understand. So I'm forced into uninstalling some really useful programs (ie Google+) that I like in order to bring the ROM value around the 40mB threshold. I know memory has a finite limit. I don't understand why ROM is even involved and thus why it "flexes". Can someone explain, please?
Look at the amount of available RAM above. Why doesn't the phone use this RAM for program code/data execution? Because I approach this from a Windows/PC background here, perhaps that's what's throwing me off. Still, it's got ample RAM that looks to be unused for the most part. Is there a command or setting (I've looked all over the place) to demand the phone use RAM over ROM? If it did that, I'd have plenty of space and no problem at all.
Given the above, if I stuck having to deal with low ROM, do any of you know if additional ROM/RAM can be added gaining more "Phone Space"? I'm not talking about the SD card; I'm talking about the base memory populated inside the device that serves as that valuable "Phone Space" referred to above?
I'd really appreciate a answer to this. Thank you for your time and any advice.
H
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
GET ADB ON YOUR COMPUTER( GOOGLE IT)
TYPE
ADB SHELL
SetInstallLocation 2
U WILL BEABLE TO MOVE MOST APPS TO SD WITHOUT ROOTING
From the instructions I've googled, it's not clear - do I move them using the phone or do I move them via the computer?
H