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All features, full flexibility, no bloat -- one simple solution!
On the one hand, it is frequently being suggested to build into Lineage various apps and features. Most of these suggestions are required by some users only, would bloat the core ROM, or have other downsides. On the other hand, these apps and features are usually already implemented somewhere, most users want incremental updates and many would prefer a fully-featured ROM without GApps installed.
To satisfy those wishes and yet avoid the downsides, I suggest simply supporting F-Droid and microG instead:
Idea outline:
Provide API for and build in F-Droid Privileged Extension
Thus have a Store, with automatic updates, and all bells and whistles
Ship with (rebranded fork of) F-Droid pre-installed and a custom LineageOS repository pre-configured (like Guardian Project in F-Droid)
Add AOSP apps, Lineage apps and Lineage-specific versions / branches of apps to LineageOS repository
Use "unstable update" marker in F-Droid to beta test new versions, e.g. of launcher, locker, ...
For additional, bloating apps and features, have users install what's already there (for instance, Location Services: UnifiedNLP with LocalWifiNlpBackend)
Add to Lineage Wiki a curated list of well-tested app suggestions for basic tasks (for instance, WebDAV: DAVdroid, Tasker, Etar, ...).
Key Advantages:
Developer effort most efficiently used
Faster time to market, because much is already implemented
Higher quality, less bloat, more features by referring users to existing apps and joining efforts
Easier innovation, because versions of pre-installed / system apps are publishable like regular apps
Developers happy, because LineageOS is clean at its core
Enthusiasts happy, because they can built on a minimal ROM
End Users happy, because they can easily use ROM, using curated list of apps
Regular, normal app updates for all system apps and pre-installed apps through Lineage repository
Does not prevent using GApps, but improves life without
Major step towards fully featured ROM, and yet without any proprietary apps or services
For good reasons, it's what Google does, it's what GNU/Linux distributions do.
One framework will solve most problems, provide most features ever suggested.
This will make everybody happy.
tldr
Bump!!!!
1, 2, 3 - Fully agree. If I had a proper Play Store alternative I wouldn't need Gapps at all.
4 - Essential in what way? I'd say its best to have only AOSP apps and to let every user download the apps he uses.
There would be practically no bloatware available and the ROM would truly give users the best choices.
8 - Additional preinstalled apps? Rather not.
9 - Rather AOSP mail. Someone might not want to use K-9, but for those who do they can always download it.
10 - Same as 9, avoid preinstalling apps that are already provided by AOSP.
11 - Eleven is OK for me, but still I find it somehow way underpowered. I really miss Apollo from early CM days...
14, 15 - I agree on ROM type. Allow users to select nightly, weekly or stable update channel through settings. Regarding basic preloaded apps, it would be OK only by means of AROMA installer where you could choose which ones you actually want/need.
Cheers!
In this thread it is being suggested to build into Lineage various Launchers, Themes, Widgets, Apps, WebDAV support, et cetera. As a contrasting response to that, I suggest simply supporting F-Droid and microG instead. A Lineage repository for F-Droid could include all AOSP apps; F-Droids own repository would supplement this.
It appears to me, almost everything which has been popularly requested would thereby be solved.
dj_chapz said:
4 - Essential in what way? I'd say its best to have only AOSP apps and to let every user download the apps he uses.
There would be practically no bloatware available and the ROM would truly give users the best choices.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Here, "essential" refers to, more or less, what's needed to install other apps (launcher, browser, file manager),
but could be thought of as to include functions, which were typical for feature phones, too (basic messenger, dailer, calendar).
dj_chapz said:
8 - Additional preinstalled apps? Rather not.
9 - Rather AOSP mail. Someone might not want to use K-9, but for those who do they can always download it.
10 - Same as 9, avoid preinstalling apps that are already provided by AOSP.
11 - Eleven is OK for me, but still I find it somehow way underpowered. I really miss Apollo from early CM days...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
These were just written-out to illustrate what would be possible.
I'll adjust the original post for clarity.
Anybody can fork it and add their ideas. Some people do not want to support fdroid. Keep it clean + gapps.
goorek said:
Anybody can fork it and add their ideas. Some people do not want to support fdroid. Keep it clean + gapps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Even if F-droid wasn't preinstalled, could be a Lineage repo for it?
LineageOS IMHO should really seek to become the ROM for professional PIM, self-employed, small-business or even big-business device users which seek to avoid GApps and rely on a clean slim ROM. So I like many of grefnab's ideas but currently have no clear idea what the stakeholders of LineageOS have as main goals for the midterm.
Having everything App based in an "FOSS App Package" (as GApps and commercial/device App replacement) with advanced support by LineageOS and/or other main CustomROMs would be geat. See my post in What features would you like to see in Lineage that CM didn't have?
support 1-3
I really hope that this thread will get recognition. I really like the idea of having priviliged F-Droid build into the ROM.
That would make everything much easier.
I fully support the three first points
Provide API for and build in F-Droid Privileged Extensio
Thus have a Store, with automatic updates, and all bells and whistles
Ship with F-Droid pre-installed and a custom LineageOS repository (like Guardian Project) pre-configured
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The rest is nice but I would put emphasis on the first three points. They seem like a real advantage to have.
Rephrased some sentences to clarify
This seems like a very good idea to me :good:
I mean it is basically the same procedure Google has in place to keep its apps up-to-date without people having to update their firmwares. Being able to update the apps independently from the rom would be a huge benefit in my opinion. While I don't use gapps on my phone at all, I understand, that some people find it essential. Therefore it would be a bad idea if this interfered with installing gapps in any way.
herrritschwumm said:
While I don't use gapps on my phone at all, I understand, that some people find it essential. Therefore it would be a bad idea if this interfered with installing gapps in any way.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This would not prevent installing GApps, it would simplify and improve usage without them, though.
+1 for having LOS F-droid repo and bundling F-droid and having fewer other preinstalled apps.
I think this thread is a very good idea!
Just a clarification on technicalities:
microG kinda requires signature spoofing. More specifically MicroG effectively has two principal frameworks inside -- location services and GCM. Location services would work regardless, but iirc for GCM to work properly the ROM itself would need a signature spoofing support. All other ways to enable spoofing employing needlepatch or whatever are ridiculously impractical and one cannot expect normal users to bother with them.
I have two phones (OP1 and OP3) and for both the choice is of exactly ONE custom rom only (based on LineageOS14.1) with a spoofing patch. Therefore applying spoofing patch into the main code base would be great. However the caveat here is that any app or framework like SafetyNET would most likely stop working. Since the developers decided to push for compatibility, I seriously doubt that they would implement signature spoofing.
They could try to implement the patch in a flashable zip like with root but I don't know if it is possible.
fully agree for spoofing support since we are out ot cm
Sent from my Nexus 5 CAF using Tapatalk
I would like to see signature spoofing built into lineageOS or an optional flashible zip, too. But right now a flashible zip could take a long time to flash. See: https://github.com/microg/android_packages_apps_GmsCore/issues/196
Sounds great.
dj_chapz said:
If I had a proper Play Store alternative I wouldn't need Gapps at all.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You could try Yalp Store, it's there in the F-Droid repository.
@grefnab: My flashable zip help those that want to automatically without any effort: remove GApps, install microG and F-Droid Privileged Extension.
1plus said:
Just a clarification on technicalities:
microG kinda requires signature spoofing. More specifically MicroG effectively has two principal frameworks inside -- location services and GCM. Location services would work regardless, but iirc for GCM to work properly the ROM itself would need a signature spoofing support. All other ways to enable spoofing employing needlepatch or whatever are ridiculously impractical and one cannot expect normal users to bother with them.
However the caveat here is that any app or framework like SafetyNET would most likely stop working. Since the developers decided to push for compatibility, I seriously doubt that they would implement signature spoofing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Tingle is very easy to use, if you find something impratical just tell me.
SafetyNet do pass for me.
I'm trying to build a phone that has no Google hooks in it at all. No tracking, no storing of my data, etc...
I've taken my old Nexus 4, installed the TeamWin recovery tool, and got it setup with LineageOS "Mako" 14.(whatever was the latest available last night). My phone "should be" rooted, I installed the "superuser mode" called out at the end of the LineageOS install instructions... but I'm not sure how to test that to find out.
No issues with install or use. Seems to work well so far.
However, what is the best way to get apps installed on the phone, now? I've found a few available via .apk download, but it seems I have to download the .apk file to my PC and then adb push it across. The native web browser and Firefox both seem to choke on the download link... and most apps don't seem available this way.
Amazon's app store sucks so bad it doesn't even have Amazon's Shopping app for phones (just for tablets).
I've found a few third-party type app stores (APKpure, being one), but I have no idea if they are trustworthy, and the apps all seem several versions behind Google's app store. Also, they don't seem to support paid apps, so you can't buy the Pro features of apps you like.
Any advice? Thanks in advance!
bigfatguy said:
I'm trying to build a phone that has no Google hooks in it at all. No tracking, no storing of my data, etc...
I've taken my old Nexus 4, installed the TeamWin recovery tool, and got it setup with LineageOS "Mako" 14.(whatever was the latest available last night). My phone "should be" rooted, I installed the "superuser mode" called out at the end of the LineageOS install instructions... but I'm not sure how to test that to find out.
No issues with install or use. Seems to work well so far.
However, what is the best way to get apps installed on the phone, now? I've found a few available via .apk download, but it seems I have to download the .apk file to my PC and then adb push it across. The native web browser and Firefox both seem to choke on the download link... and most apps don't seem available this way.
Amazon's app store sucks so bad it doesn't even have Amazon's Shopping app for phones (just for tablets).
I've found a few third-party type app stores (APKpure, being one), but I have no idea if they are trustworthy, and the apps all seem several versions behind Google's app store. Also, they don't seem to support paid apps, so you can't buy the Pro features of apps you like.
Any advice? Thanks in advance!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I suspect the reason why you can't find paid apps on these stores is because most devs rely on the play store's license verification mechanisms to manage these transactions. If that's what you want, you'll have to give in to Big Brother. Well, Big Brother Google anyway, since I guess you have no problem with Big Brother Amazon except for its poor app selection. F-Droid probably has the best reputation among alternative app stores but again, you'll only find free versions there.
I'm not sure why you're having trouble downloading apks directly to your phone. I do it with Firefox all the time. Make sure your browser app has permission to access your phone's storage.
As for how to test root access, download a root checker app. You'll find them in pretty much any store or app source you decide to use.
This might help you: https://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile/android-app-stores/2/
ApkMirror is also a reputable site: https://www.apkmirror.com/
TheSt33v said:
I suspect the reason why you can't find paid apps on these stores is because most devs rely on the play store's license verification mechanisms to manage these transactions. If that's what you want, you'll have to give in to Big Brother. Well, Big Brother Google anyway, since I guess you have no problem with Big Brother Amazon except for its poor app selection. F-Droid probably has the best reputation among alternative app stores but again, you'll only find free versions there.
I'm not sure why you're having trouble downloading apks directly to your phone. I do it with Firefox all the time. Make sure your browser app has permission to access your phone's storage.
As for how to test root access, download a root checker app. You'll find them in pretty much any store or app source you decide to use.
This might help you: https://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile/android-app-stores/2/
ApkMirror is also a reputable site: https://www.apkmirror.com/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
F-Droid
F-Droid for open source apps and than Yalp-Store for "standard" apps. Using MicroG LineageOS 14.1 on a Moto Z Play.
albatros_1994 said:
F-Droid for open source apps and than Yalp-Store for "standard" apps. Using MicroG LineageOS 14.1 on a Moto Z Play.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1
Using F-Droid and Yalp Store on my LG G6 running LineageOS 14.1 microG without problems. You can use Aurora Store too (Yalp Store fork with Material UI).
Hi, I am looking to move away from Google and Gapps and trying to work out what is the best way to do it on a Redmi Note 7.
I have already install OrangeFox recovery and have been reading about LineageOS+MicroG for this purpose. Would like to hear comments/suggestions from anyone who has gone down this path.
Many thanks.
Even I am also looking forward on doing the same, just did in my galaxy note 3 where I installed lineage OS 16 and MicroG for the essential google services required by apps to run properly, I use only web applications except for WhatsApp, shifted to signal as my primary messenger application, F-Droid is my source of open-source apps. I guess privacy is your concern, right? Developers kindly assist on the same
SunilNair2020 said:
I installed lineage OS 16 and MicroG for the essential google services required by apps to run properly
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did a bit a research on this and found that installing MicroG requires signature spoofing be enabled on the ROM which I understand is a major security issue - this is supposed to be the reason why LineageOS do not include MicroG in their builds.
I'm using an old Zenfone 2 Laser (snapdragon 410 version) with an old LAOS MicroG 14.1 (Android 7), without those massive Google Services the phone seems to be faster than my Redmi Note 7 (no joke, it's incredible), it has f-droid preinstalled as main store and MicroG Manager, all apps works fine, the only problem is Gmail (need to use the browser version, i don't know how to set the stock email app), i really need a Google free rom on this Note 7 too
N1ck474 said:
I'm using an old Zenfone 2 Laser (snapdragon 410 version) with an old LAOS MicroG 14.1 (Android 7), without those massive Google Services the phone seems to be faster than my Redmi Note 7 (no joke, it's incredible), it has f-droid preinstalled as main store and MicroG Manager, all apps works fine, the only problem is Gmail (need to use the browser version, i don't know how to set the stock email app), i really need a Google free rom on this Note 7 too
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
According to the previous comment, upon doing some research app signatures are important for apps to work safely and without malicious code being embedded, so is there any option for using lineage OS without neither Gapps nor MicroG? Also is there any option to backup contacts in the absence of google services? Thanks again !
SunilNair2020 said:
According to the previous comment, upon doing some research app signatures are important for apps to work safely and without malicious code being embedded, so is there any option for using lineage OS without neither Gapps nor MicroG? Also is there any option to backup contacts in the absence of google services? Thanks again !
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't know about contacts, with MicroG they syncs normally like a Google enabled phone, i don't actually know what this problem with signatures is (i use the Zefone as secodary phone without a SIM or important personal data), i think you need to upload all of your contacts on a Cloud (OneDrive, Drive etc) then redownload them as ICS or Calendar data on your Google-Free ROM, if you have less than 200 contacts and a modern SIM you save all of them on the SIM Card without problems.
N1ck474 said:
I don't know about contacts, with MicroG they syncs normally like a Google enabled phone, i don't actually know what this problem with signatures is (i use the Zefone as secodary phone without a SIM or important personal data), i think you need to upload all of your contacts on a Cloud (OneDrive, Drive etc) then redownload them as ICS or Calendar data on your Google-Free ROM, if you have less than 200 contacts and a modern SIM you save all of them on the SIM Card without problems.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't prefer using cloud storage as it involves storing data somewhere we don't have access to...any other alternatives? Thanks again ?
SunilNair2020 said:
I don't prefer using cloud storage as it involves storing data somewhere we don't have access to...any other alternatives? Thanks again ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't know, you can actually export your contacts locally as ICS/Calendar file on an SD Card or locally (on a PC or Hard Disk), at least, i think so, never done that
SunilNair2020 said:
According to the previous comment, upon doing some research app signatures are important for apps to work safely and without malicious code being embedded, so is there any option for using lineage OS without neither Gapps nor MicroG? Also is there any option to backup contacts in the absence of google services? Thanks again !
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am not 100% sure about this but I feel if the app is widely used and no security issues have been uncovered then using it via MicroG might not be a major issue. Perhaps, someone with more experience can comment on this?
I once went on a full on no google mission.
- Lineage, no gapps, not even micro g
- apps were mostly, if not all, from fdroid
- colud (storage, backup, notes) I used nextcloud, also used mega
- davx for contacts
- search engine - startpage or sometimes DDG
- email from proton
- youtube, which unfortunately doesn't have any alternative, I used newpipe.
I'm pretty sure here I forgot a thing or two, but this was mostly it.
I was happy with my privacy though, peace of mind you know. But the experience was horrible for me, a lot of time needs to be invested for maintenance, you'll see. I was still okay with it, because I had the time for all that. But I had to sacrifice, due to lack of time to handle and keeping track of every single thing, wheather it was working or not as per my needs!!
If you have that much time, and a will to do a thing or two manually than you should go for it.
Well, imho the best way to keep your privacy AND to be able to receive push notifications and download apps from google app store (via aurora store) without the need of a google account is to install an rom which supports signature spoofing (for example crDroid, AICP, ...) or a rom that already has microg included (https://download.lineage.microg.org/lavender/ )
LOS for microg purely supports signature spoofing for the MicroG components/apps (gmscore, fakestore, ..), so imho there isn't any security issue
ssaikia3 said:
I once went on a full on no google mission.
.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks very much for sharing your experience - this is exactly the sort of information I was after.
Currently, I use NoRootFirewall to block all traffic generated by Playstore Services which helps me stop Playstore Services updates. The downside is it affects apps reliant on Playstore Services such as Gmail etc. This is not a problem as I switched to my phones native email client which handles mail without any issues. Skype complained and wanted me to update Playstore Services but I continued on and was able to make a call without obvious problems. If I have to install an app, obviously I need to enable Playstore Services but once I install the app I could block Playstore Services once again. In a sense, this gives me the option of continuing on like this but was thinking of LineageOS for MicroG may be a better alternative. Would like to hear your views on this.
Many thanks
2faraway2 said:
Well, imho the best way to keep your privacy AND to be able to receive push notifications and download apps from google app store (via aurora store) without the need of a google account is to install an rom which supports signature spoofing (for example crDroid, AICP, ...) or a rom that already has microg included (https://download.lineage.microg.org/lavender/ )
LOS for microg purely supports signature spoofing for the MicroG components/apps (gmscore, fakestore, ..), so imho there isn't any security issue
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did more reading about LOS for MicroG last night, in particular this one https://blogs.fsfe.org/larma/2016/microg-signature-spoofing-security/ - while I still haven't got my head around all the security issues, I feel a lot more comfortable about them now.
Many thanks for your comment.
Hallo!
I've recently heard about ROMS,degoogling your Phone etc. and I bought this S10+ Phone. Is there a safe was to delete all bloatware,google Software and so on?
I've heard about GrapheneOS but unfortunately it's only for google devices so I was wondering what kind of solutions exist for this case. There are also phones with hardware kill switches but I'm a little bit skeptical about them.
Please tell me everything you know about this or the best pages to get an idea how to do so. I will be forever grateful
Science
This might help you:
Galaxy S10/S10+ Debloat / bloatware removal list
Please see my original post from the Galaxy S8 to see the XDA article on how to do this. https://forum.xda-developers.com/galaxy-s8/how-to/s8-debloat-bloatware-thread-t3669009 New phone, new list! I've compiled a list of most of the bloatware...
forum.xda-developers.com
I feel you. The only google crap I (want to) use is Gmail and occasionally gmaps.
Unfortunately all of Android is created to serve its master... how can you separate the two?
Lol, Apple?
Proof that unlimited power corrupts ultimately.
Thanks for your replys. I will try it out
I've been using this for 3 years.
Home - Package Disabler
The only NON-root solution that let’s you disable any unwanted packages that come pre-installed / installed with your phone / tablet.
www.packagedisabler.com
Karma Firewall (Playstore) stops the leaks and reduces battery drain by shutting Google, Samsung, etc up.
sciencebitches said:
Hallo!
I've recently heard about ROMS,degoogling your Phone etc. and I bought this S10+ Phone. Is there a safe was to delete all bloatware,google Software and so on?
I've heard about GrapheneOS but unfortunately it's only for google devices so I was wondering what kind of solutions exist for this case. There are also phones with hardware kill switches but I'm a little bit skeptical about them.
Please tell me everything you know about this or the best pages to get an idea how to do so. I will be forever grateful
Science
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If your s10+ is using an exynos cpu you can install lineage os. Lineage won't work on the snapdragon variants
sciencebitches said:
Hallo!
I've recently heard about ROMS,degoogling your Phone etc. and I bought this S10+ Phone. Is there a safe was to delete all bloatware,google Software and so on?
I've heard about GrapheneOS but unfortunately it's only for google devices so I was wondering what kind of solutions exist for this case. There are also phones with hardware kill switches but I'm a little bit skeptical about them.
Please tell me everything you know about this or the best pages to get an idea how to do so. I will be forever grateful
Science
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi there sciencebitches,
I realize your original post was from 2020 and its now March 2023 so maybe this is not something your interested in anymore... maybe you have a new phone, etc. But....
The Samsung phones that are sold in North America (either Canada or US) have locked bootloaders that cannot be unlocked. So you are stuck flashing Samsung firmware that is digitaly signed by Samsung.
However, if you get an international model then you can unlock the bootloader and load custom firmware. You have a couple of choices.
LineageOSWhen loading LineageOS, you can choose to load it with or without GApps. Loading it with GApps gives you all the same Google stuff, a library known as Google Play Services, as on normal Android. Loading LineageOS without GApps gives you no Google stuff whatsoever. This is what I am running on my SM-G975F – LineageOS without GApps.
LineageOS for microGThis gives you LineageOS with a substitute library called MicroG. The MicroG library is a reimplementation of the Google Play Services that some (a lot?) of Android apps require. So, if you need to use some apps that require Google Play Services but don’t want to be overrun with Google again, then MicroG is recommended. With “pure LineageOS” (sans GApps) you get no Google Play Services whatsoever.
/e/OSThis is another implementation of LineageOS with MicroG. It is fairly polished but tries to look like iOS and so feels somewhat un-Android like. I have no first-hand experience with /e/OS.
GrapheneOS and Calyx OSThere is also GrapheneOS and Calyx OS but I have no experience with those either. My understanding is they are along the same lines. I think that GrapheneOS comes with no Google Play Services and no MicroG (i.e. like “pure” LineageOS) but gives you the option of installing real Google Play Services (not MicroG) as a normal app as opposed to as a system app.
If you live in Canada I can help you get an international phone that you can install LineageOS or one of the others listed here.
Best regards,
The Fish
Hello Community,
I have a weird one here - hoping someone can help -
Couple months back I bought myself an OnePlus6T phone and came here for help to successfully install LineageOS onto it. I would say it was the most fun but challenging install that I have performed but with your help, I was able to do so - Thanks.
Phone has been running great under LineageOS with excellent battery life. Been using F-Droid / Aurora Store when needed (mostly for work related Apps). Lately I got into a game that is similar to Pokemon GO and ran into an issue. The game was installed from apkpure since it was not found with Aurora Store.
The game works just fine. Boots up and able to play the game, walking around interacting with the environment. Except for some of the items in game are not clickable. Reached out to their support and with some troubleshooting, couldnt figure out the issue. Nobody has claimed this same issue. Same version that is the most recent. Since I still had my old phone, I installed the game on there (via Google Play Store) and it worked 100%. This phone is officially on Tmobile OS, believe Android 10.
So it had me thinking of what was different between the two devices. Obs the OS's are different, but the main factor that I couold think of was that when I installed LIneageOS on the OnePlus6t, i didnt install Google Play Services along with. Grabbed an apk of it, updated it and the game is still acting the same - cant interact with some of the objects in game. Through phone activity, I do get the notification pop stating "Google Play Services has crash" with two options, close app and app info.
Overview :
Objective / Issue - Geolocation game works but not 100% since some of the objects in game are not working, most are
Tmobile Phone - Running Official Android 10 - game installed from Play Store - works 100%
OnePlus6T Phone - Running LineageOS 18.1 - game installed manually, boot and runs but not all objects are intractable
Questions - Can i install Google Play Services separately through TWRP?
Which version would I install? Is there a slim down version of Google Play Services to only install the service and nothing else?
Is there a way to fully, and I mean Fully backup my data for a factory reset so i can install Google Play Services?
Would installing Lineage MircoG be a possible solution?
I know its a strange issue / request but hopefully a simple solution. Not sure if I can just install Google Play Services through TWRP and that would work but that would be the simplest and I wouldnt lose any data
Any help would be greatly appreciation,
Thanks,