Database Users

IDEA: Use your PPC as a wireless optical mouse for your PC?

I just bought a new Logitech mouse with tons of customizable buttons on it, and it got me thinking...what if you could use your PPC as a mouse for your PC? That would be the ultimate in customizability!! Think of it...not only would you have a bunch of hard buttons to play with, but you could also have a customized screen for whichever app has the focus on your PC!
I am nowhere near advanced enough to do this, nor do I know if it's even possible...just throwing it out there as an idea for whoever wants to take up the challenge. I figure it could work on most devices because the camera and flash LED are on the opposite side from the screen and buttons, and BT could be the wireless link. Heck, for that amount of customizability in a mouse I'd even settle for a wired USB version :wink:.
Well enough fantasizing for today...

you're talking about using the camera as the optical sensor?
you'd need it on a special mouse mat that emits light of some kind, and I doubt the feedback would be quick enough.
and i wouldn't fancy pushing my expensive xda around on the desk like a mouse.

Right, I was thinking of the camera as the optical sensor, and the flash LED as the light source. I have a XV6700/Apache, and when I turn on the camera and the flash and set it down on my desk, the screen isn't completely dark because the camera isn't flush against the surface...there's still enough space for light from the LED to reach the lens. Obviously this would vary from device to device...but even in cases where it's completely dark, you could put the "mouse" on top of a few mm of clear plastic or plexiglas to give the LED enough room to bounce the light over. Actually, this option might be desirable as it would address your concern about pushing your device around and getting scratches on it.
In fact, now that I'm thinking about it, using plastic/plexiglas might be better for battery life too. Instead of having the flash stay on all the time, the "mouse" could use the ambient room light to detect initial movement, which in turn would trigger a "wake event" for the flash, and then obviously the flash could be timed to turn off after so many seconds of being idle.
I know speed would likely be an issue as far as feedback goes. Sure, it wouldn't be as quick as my new Logitech laser mouse, but in video mode the camera (at least on the Apache) can go up to 19 fps...so perhaps it would be doable. Obviously you're not going to use Photoshop or play Quake with the thing . I was just thinking added convenience for everyday usage.

well all optical mice i've used have gon crazy on shiny surfaces
their cams are even made directly for this purpos
so i would think using the pda as a mouse would mean it would go even more crazy on a shiny surface
try search i recall posts about this in the past

Issues
light souce: prolong usage of you flash is bad. The life span of the flash may be different for different devices, but I'm pretty sure HTC doesn't give you a nice LED flash to be used for more than 30 seconds per usage. There are reports of 'dying' flash after using it as flashlight.
camera (major issue): phone camera is a fix lense camera (there are a few new Nokia/Sony model that arent). Such camera is not able to take clear picture of close distance object. Try taking a picture of something at a range of 3 inches , at best possible light condition. You won't get a decent picture. Even high tech digital camera is not able to take any picture of any object that is in range of less than 3 inches (even with Macro e.g. the flower, mode on). You can't do much 'mous-ing' with blur images.
It is a good idea though.

just an idea, but what about just using it as a touch pad??
dahquim

Very expensive mouse :lol:
Just get an optical RF mouse.. so much cheaper..
Come to think of it, better get a bluetooth mouse that you can use with both your PC and PPC!

Hmm, I don't know. I just imagined a Universal used as a mouse. Not a pretty picture.
Any way, as for the touch pad idea, it's fairly easy to implement, but it doesn't have the resolution to handle even blow average PC screen which is 800x600 pixels.

hanmin said:
Even high tech digital camera is not able to take any picture of any object that is in range of less than 3 inches (even with Macro e.g. the flower, mode on). You can't do much 'mous-ing' with blur images.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OK, so let's say you have a clear glass desk and you attach a board underneath it at a distance of 3 inches so it can focus... j/k
levenum said:
as for the touch pad idea, it's fairly easy to implement, but it doesn't have the resolution to handle even blow average PC screen which is 800x600 pixels.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think dahquim meant "touch pad" to mean "tablet PC" or a remote touch-screen clone of your PC monitor (you can do that with LogMeIn). I think he meant simply losing the "mouse" functionality and keeping the ability to have the device's screen display "soft buttons" that could execute commands and that would change depending on whichever app has the focus on your PC. That would somewhat relieve one of having to remember different keyboard shortcuts for each different PC app you use. Same idea as the Optimus Keyboard but on a smaller scale.

touchpad.. ?
Touchpad idea is nice - it could work just like touchpads on laptop; ie. moving finger on mobile device screen causes mouse cursor to move on PC screen, tapping mobile device screen causes mouse click.... who'll implement this ? ;-)

hanmin said:
Issues
light souce: prolong usage of you flash is bad. The life span of the flash may be different for different devices, but I'm pretty sure HTC doesn't give you a nice LED flash to be used for more than 30 seconds per usage. There are reports of 'dying' flash after using it as flashlight.
camera (major issue): phone camera is a fix lense camera (there are a few new Nokia/Sony model that arent). Such camera is not able to take clear picture of close distance object. Try taking a picture of something at a range of 3 inches , at best possible light condition. You won't get a decent picture. Even high tech digital camera is not able to take any picture of any object that is in range of less than 3 inches (even with Macro e.g. the flower, mode on). You can't do much 'mous-ing' with blur images.
It is a good idea though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hanmin was right pointing these issues. i'll add some more, from a developer's point of view:
-so you want to have this as a wireless device: think of the power consumption: on one hand you need the camera to be on, with the led, and also a wireless connection for transmitting the data like BT or WiFi.. The baterry wont last long
-even if we cant get the camera to focus at nearly 1-2mm, we could still detect movement of some kind (so the idea would work..in a way or another :roll: ). but please note: there are tens of types of devices, you cant get to make the trick for all.
-it wouldnt be very precise: did you even tried to create an icon? you need to tap over the right pixel, do you think it will work with this?
-ok so you're a fanatic gamer : poor device and poor you, on one hand you'll ruing the device, on the other you'll go nuts because... : slow reaction times, low accuracy...
I see that you've thought about the idea of creating a touchpad out of the pocketpcs. I worked on such a project once. It was indeed interesting. The only problem was that: (issues again)
-the screen is not so sensitive to finger pressure as a touchpad is
-you'll mostly have to use the stilus
But at least this approach is functional.
Regards,
Radu

Yes was thinking more the "set of buttons on [email protected] that let you do quick and easy thinkgs to whatever program your using.
For example, how about being able to switch virtual desktops or having a list of programs on the ppc screen that you switch between... a la Alt-Tab??
just ideas, but of course would be completely customisable (macro buttons)
dahquim

Looks like this guy got the concept up and running on his Nokia...
http://www.pyrofersprojects.com/nokiamouse.php

What is G-Sensor?

i couldnt find a thread that explains exactly what it was... is it hardware or software...

hardware. I think its a type of accelerometer.

my wife is also interested in this.

so my phone wouldnt have it then.. doesnt the camera have some kinda sensor like it in it?

your wife needs to get a diamond or touch pro...
andason said:
my wife is also interested in this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

gotvitamink said:
hardware. I think its a type of accelerometer.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As far as I know it IS an accelerometer. Same thing I would say. Don't have much knowledge, but it's basically the same technology the iPhone uses. It can detect how you're holding your phone. Yes, you could use your front camera on your phone as a accelerometer and it's been asked before, but no one attempted to do so since it would consume too much battery.

Kraize92 said:
As far as I know it IS an accelerometer. Same thing I would say. Don't have much knowledge, but it's basically the same technology the iPhone uses. It can detect how you're holding your phone. Yes, you could use your front camera on your phone as a accelerometer and it's been asked before, but no one attempted to do so since it would consume too much battery.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yea i wasn't really sure if it differed from an accelerometer. I used google and wikipedia and i couldn't find anything on G-sensor, and I didn't find G-sensor under the accelerometer wikipedia entry.
but yea, basically the technology that iPhone uses.

someone should do it...

its an accelerometer which is hardware to do what the iphone does where when u turn it to its side its screen also changes to the sideways orientation.

It detects which way the phone is facing and can detect acceleration in 3 axis.

petard said:
It detects which way the phone is facing and can detect acceleration in 3 axis.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah, there is the more technical answer. It can detect movement. Basically you use the 3 axis which detects movement in all directions. You tilt left and right and you tilt up and down. I knew that just didn't know the technical meaning lol.

In most cases the G-Sensor is simply a small metal ball laying in a tub with several contacts. When you turn or move your phone, the ball moves also, connecting some of these contacts to anothers. So the phone can figure out how you hold it (portrait or landscape, upside down etc.) and can switch the screen or perform different actions. Its called G-Sensor because the ball is driven by G-Force.

What is G-Sensor ?
A G sensor is usually an accelerometer. It measures the forces that act on it during changes in velocity. The wiki article below has more details.
Source(s):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accelerometer

Dennis78 said:
In most cases the G-Sensor is simply a small metal ball laying in a tub with several contacts. When you turn or move your phone, the ball moves also, connecting some of these contacts to anothers. So the phone can figure out how you hold it (portrait or landscape, upside down etc.) and can switch the screen or perform different actions. Its called G-Sensor because the ball is driven by G-Force.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
False. It's a three (and probably sometimes two) axis MEMS accelerometer - there are a few companies making those, but probably the most popular ones are analog devices' ADXL series. Similar device sits in wiimote (just as a secondary motion detection system, the more accurate one is camera+sensor bar).
Because these chips became really cheap recently, and are way more accurate, reliable, and robust than any mechanical sensors (in the same price ans size range), they're being shoved in every possible device You can find them in digital cameras (used to recognize if the photo is portrait or landscape and tag it accordingly), in hard drives (to detect mechanical shocks and protect the hdd by parking its head), in laptops (usually same as above plus to detect when the computer is falling down or other dangerous situations and protect the hard drives), in cell phones (you probably know this one's uses), in toys, portable media players, and lots of other stuff.
It detects which way the phone is facing and can detect acceleration in 3 axis.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A more precise answer is that it detects acceleration in three axes, and from these values phone's orientation can be calculated.
[MORE DETAILED EXPLANATION]
It's rather simple - when the phone is normally handled (it's not free falling and it's not being waved around), the dominant acceleration detected by the accelerometer is the gravitational acceleration (-9.81m/s^2 in vertical axis). So, if most of the time acceleration detected along the vertical axis of the phone is bigger than one detected along horizontal axis, the phone is being held in landscape position. If the situation is reversed, it's held in portrait orientation. If the acceleration is largest in the third axis (tangent to the screen), it means that the phone is being held nearly horizontally or it's lying on some surface - better not change screen orientation then
But as i said - it's only true when the dominant acceleration is the gravitational one - the sensor can't tell it from other sources of acceleration like waving the phone around. If you run one of the g-sensor games or demos and try quickly moving the phone around the desk (keeping it horizontal at all times), you'll see that the game will interpret this movement as tilting the phone.
[/MORE DETAILED EXPLANATION]
And by the way, why is this thread in development and hacking?

mr_deimos said:
False. It's a three (and probably sometimes two) axis MEMS accelerometer - there are a few companies making those, but probably the most popular ones are analog devices' ADXL series. Similar device sits in wiimote (just as a secondary motion detection system, the more accurate one is camera+sensor bar).
Because these chips became really cheap recently, and are way more accurate, reliable, and robust than any mechanical sensors (in the same price ans size range), they're being shoved in every possible device You can find them in digital cameras (used to recognize if the photo is portrait or landscape and tag it accordingly), in hard drives (to detect mechanical shocks and protect the hdd by parking its head), in laptops (usually same as above plus to detect when the computer is falling down or other dangerous situations and protect the hard drives), in cell phones (you probably know this one's uses), in toys, portable media players, and lots of other stuff.
A more precise answer is that it detects acceleration in three axes, and from these values phone's orientation can be calculated.
[MORE DETAILED EXPLANATION]
It's rather simple - when the phone is normally handled (it's not free falling and it's not being waved around), the dominant acceleration detected by the accelerometer is the gravitational acceleration (-9.81m/s^2 in vertical axis). So, if most of the time acceleration detected along the vertical axis of the phone is bigger than one detected along horizontal axis, the phone is being held in landscape position. If the situation is reversed, it's held in portrait orientation. If the acceleration is largest in the third axis (tangent to the screen), it means that the phone is being held nearly horizontally or it's lying on some surface - better not change screen orientation then
But as i said - it's only true when the dominant acceleration is the gravitational one - the sensor can't tell it from other sources of acceleration like waving the phone around. If you run one of the g-sensor games or demos and try quickly moving the phone around the desk (keeping it horizontal at all times), you'll see that the game will interpret this movement as tilting the phone.
[/MORE DETAILED EXPLANATION]
And by the way, why is this thread in development and hacking?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How do you know this surplus of information? Was it from an engineering school / article / books / or phone dissection? How do you know this?

None of these answers made much sense, so I did a google search, found the following:
http://www.dimensionengineering.com/accelerometers.htm

poetryrocksalot said:
How do you know this surplus of information? Was it from an engineering school / article / books / or phone dissection? How do you know this?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The theory of operation is actually pre-high school level stuff - basic physics (you know, Newton's laws, and theory of gravity)
And the details - caught some of these at the engineering university, some from accelerometer datasheets. I had to interface one of them to a programmable microcontroller a while ago so i needed to do some research on my own

I just got a TP2 and is a bit confused as to the working of the G-Sensor. I have calibrate it (and it is switched on), but nothing happens when I turn the phone sideways - ie turning to landscape mode. Am I missing something or need to activate it somewhere else?
Thanks

stoutseun said:
I just got a TP2 and is a bit confused as to the working of the G-Sensor. I have calibrate it (and it is switched on), but nothing happens when I turn the phone sideways - ie turning to landscape mode. Am I missing something or need to activate it somewhere else?
Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hello, try to search on your programs, you will have "G-Config", it allows you to define which applications rotate.

Thanks very much. I searched but couldn't find any G-Config anyware in All programs. Only reference is the G-Sensor in All settings\System.
EDIT: Google reveiled G-Config to be a self written app. (just downloaded) So it's not a HTC app included in the ROM?

Digital Compass tips

I thought it's worthwhile to mention that a digital compass is built-in to the Atrix and it works fairly well -- if you calibrate it. There are plenty of free apps in the android market for compasses. The one I tried and stuck with is the free Compass app from catch.com (I'm not associated with them in any way). They have an analog interface, a digital interface and a combo compass/gps interface, all for free.
A tip for calibration -- search youtube for the videos on how to wave your phone in the figure eight pattern required for calibration AND make sure you tap the button that says "Calibrate" either in the Compass app or from the phone's settings menu, but do NOT tap the button that says okay/close in the calibration pop-up menu. INSTEAD make sure your start the calibration and then wave the phone in the figure-eight pattern AND then the phone will vibrate when it is calibrated and it will clear the pop-up calibration menu by itself.
I kept tapping the calibrate button and then pressing the Okay/Close button and then trying to wave the phone around and accomplished nothing. I was always wondering why the digital compass was off by sometime 30 degrees or more.
Oh and if you really need the Compass app to be very accurate, you will need to do the calibration process at least once per day before you use it. If you calibrate and then use the compass again a week later, it's probably worth the 10 seconds to run the calibration again before your intended usage.
After correctly understanding how to do the calibration and making it stick, the Atrix now seems just as accurate as my hiking magnetic compass with the signalling mirror.
About the figure-eight pattern, it's a 3-D figure eight, NOT a flat figure eight. Watch a youtube video and you'll get the idea right away. Ignore the iPhone 3GS videos about calibrating their digital compass and waving your phone like a steering wheel -- that may work for goofy iphones but I know that doesn't work for the Atrix nor I suspect any other Android phone.

Problem: Video slowly moves to the right in 360ºV or cardboard apps.

Hi. I recently acquired some cardboard like glasses (blitzwolf) and wanted to give them a try. I really liked the experience, considering they're much cheaper than Oculus, and there's a nice offer of videos and apps already.
But after a few minutes I realized about a problem. You can move the video to the left or right just rotating your head. Mine moves slightly to the right or the left, depending on my phone's position (horizontal with the speakers on the left and home button on the right, or vice versa.) I guess the solution is to configure my phone's sensors, but I don't know how.
I recorded a of it, to make things clearer. I'm not moving my phone, so the entrance to the cave should always be up front, but you can see it rotates to the right.
I know this is my phone's problem, and not the device, but I consider this section to be the most appropriate to post it.
Appreciate it
<3

Inus said:
Hi. I recently acquired some cardboard like glasses (blitzwolf) and wanted to give them a try. I really liked the experience, considering they're much cheaper than Oculus, and there's a nice offer of videos and apps already.
But after a few minutes I realized about a problem. You can move the video to the left or right just rotating your head. Mine moves slightly to the right or the left, depending on my phone's position (horizontal with the speakers on the left and home button on the right, or vice versa.) I guess the solution is to configure my phone's sensors, but I don't know how.
I recorded a of it, to make things clearer. I'm not moving my phone, so the entrance to the cave should always be up front, but you can see it rotates to the right.
I know this is my phone's problem, and not the device, but I consider this section to be the most appropriate to post it.
Appreciate it
<3
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm also having this problem in all VR apps, you can try GPS Status & Toolbox from PlayStore to calibrate your sensors, it works for many people.
For me it seems, nothing works. All my sensors are working properly, i tested them and have no erratic readings whatsoever, compass works well too, but in Cardboard... major sensor drift. The only thing i can do for now is watching 3D movies in VR Theater with the screen locked in center.

That's a classic VR problem for mobile devices. You could try an xposed module named, 'Gyroscope Noise Filter'. On my device there wasn't much drift, so couldn't notice any large differences, but you can give it a shot.

When it occurs, I try to stabilize my phone on a table for 10 secs and it stops, also it happened when I mess with dpi... My sensors should be good though, it have better range that a friend's phone. I guees it's a more serious issue for you.

Hey, Folks!
I had the same problem with every vr app on my G2 and I solved it!
The problem is the damn button "bulge" (0,2mm) on the backside. The phone never ever laid flat so theres was no way to calibrate the gyro correctly.
So I placed it on a 0,5 mm creditcard so the button doesn't touch the ground and calibrated the damn thing. BINGO! No movment.
I think this is adaptable to every phone. Think of the "flatness" of your phones backside. If theres a button or camera bulging out, the picture will move (probably) to the right.
Please excuse my bad english.

On an s5, dial *#0*#, then tap sensors, then gyroscope self test. Cured it for me.

The same

Inus said:
Hi. I recently acquired some cardboard like glasses (blitzwolf) and wanted to give them a try. I really liked the experience, considering they're much cheaper than Oculus, and there's a nice offer of videos and apps already.
But after a few minutes I realized about a problem. You can move the video to the left or right just rotating your head. Mine moves slightly to the right or the left, depending on my phone's position (horizontal with the speakers on the left and home button on the right, or vice versa.) I guess the solution is to configure my phone's sensors, but I don't know how.
I recorded a of it, to make things clearer. I'm not moving my phone, so the entrance to the cave should always be up front, but you can see it rotates to the right.
I know this is my phone's problem, and not the device, but I consider this section to be the most appropriate to post it.
Appreciate it
<3
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ve solved the problem. You're using an VR application like a video, for example, what you're running and hitting the phone in the other hand or something soft on all corners. As you rotate it constantly.

dwilson48625 said:
On an s5, dial *#0*#, then tap sensors, then gyroscope self test. Cured it for me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This also worked for my Samsung S7 stock. Looks like the "test" is actually a calibration/reset, not just a test.

Jumpy/Shaky screen while holding finger on my new S8

Hello,
When I scroll down/left/right in my phone and hold my finger on display, the screen automatically shakes left and right or up and down (depending on how I was scrolling my device). This also occurs while charging and while moving an icon on home-screen. I had this issue previously with Asus Zenfone 3, Samsung Galaxy J7 and a HTC Desire (dont remember the exact model though) and a similar issue with iphone 6 (which was registering that my finger was moving on home button). Is this a software problem or hardware problem and how can I fix this ? I have read on web that many people are facing this issue on various phones. but couldnt find any solution yet. Is this my screen sensitivity/touch/display driver/ battery or something else ? If anyone could suggest something, would be really helpful.
Edit: Exactly the same issue as this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxysauxJ5Yk&feature=youtu.be but mine shakes a bit less, still annoys me while playing 8 ball pool and other aiming games like angry birds, etc.
Thanks

There is an app which you can use to test your touch screen by drawing on it. You'll be able to see exactly what it's registering. From what I've seen it happens on a lot of phones with bad digitizers. Try to get a warranty replacement.

LaughingCarrot said:
There is an app which you can use to test your touch screen by drawing on it. You'll be able to see exactly what it's registering. From what I've seen it happens on a lot of phones with bad digitizers. Try to get a warranty replacement.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hello,
Sorry for delay. I went to service centre and they said that it is normal because of smooth and silky touch and slight movement of fingers. I explained him that it occurs more while charging and he had to take my phone for inspection.
Here is the correct video : https://youtu.be/PmQ2lra4RXU
My hand didnt have tremors. I agree that human hands are not 100 % stable, however, none of my other phones do it. And if my hand is shaking, then it should shake also while the phone is not charging. When I unplug my device, it stops shaking (almost stops), but when I replug it, it starts to behave weird again when I am holding finger stable. Also, this shaking will move your aim pointer in gaming and it really is annoying while play games with pointer moving.
Is it really normal that your pointer moves while your finger is stable on screen ?