Database Users

Is HSDPA/UMTS band a software issue?

Hi guys, I don't know if this is a basic question but I have to ask it since I haven't find an answer yet...
Can I modify the HSDPA/UMTS band via ROM or SPL update?
I bougth a HTC T-mobile myTouch (1700/2100 MHz bands, UMTS/HSDPA) but later I realized that here in CHILE my provider uses the 850/1900 band for 3g .
So, can I do somethig to make it work here or is it a matter of hardware?
Thanks

birutilla said:
Hi guys, I don't know if this is a basic question but I have to ask it since I haven't find an answer yet...
Can I modify the HSDPA/UMTS band via ROM or SPL update?
I bougth a HTC T-mobile myTouch (1700/2100 MHz bands, UMTS/HSDPA) but later I realized that here in CHILE my provider uses the 850/1900 band for 3g .
So, can I do somethig to make it work here or is it a matter of hardware?
Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No you cant change ur radio bands with software, its a hardware issue and im afraid your stuck with what you got, even flashing a new radio wont change things . . . sorry

it's too different versions of the qualcomm cpu's which makes the band difference
it's hardcoded inside the cpu

You should have bought the Canadian/Rogers version of the phone.
Fvcking HTC builds 3 versions of the phone (mytouch, rest of world, Canada) and people like you and me get fvcked. We have to pay an extra $150 to get the canadian version.
Let it be a lesson: do NOT buy HTC! Acer, Dell, Apple ... they all build phones that work everywhere. NOT HTC.

Rudegar said:
it's too different versions of the qualcomm cpu's which makes the band difference
it's hardcoded inside the cpu
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually the CPU (Qualcomm MSM7201a) is capable of supporting five different UMTS frequency bands, however only three at once. Those bands again are indeed preset by the built-in RF chips, so there is no chance of changing frequencies.
Here's the datasheet of the MSM7200 (identical to the MSM7201a in terms of RF support) with an overview of possible RF chip configurations at the bottom of page 3: http://www.ent.eet-china.com/PDF/2007FEB/DTCOL_2007FEB15_AVDE_RFR_AN_01.pdf

inquisitor said:
Actually the CPU (Qualcomm MSM7201a) is capable of supporting five different UMTS frequency bands, however only three at once. Those bands again are indeed preset by the built-in RF chips, so there is no chance of changing frequencies.
Here's the datasheet of the MSM7200 (identical to the MSM7201a in terms of RF support) with an overview of possible RF chip configurations at the bottom of page 3: http://www.ent.eet-china.com/PDF/2007FEB/DTCOL_2007FEB15_AVDE_RFR_AN_01.pdf
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Whether a specific band is supported or not in a particular RF topology also depends on the type of RF amplifiers coupled with the baseband IC. Traditionally HTC has been using universal amplifiers for 2G/2.5G hence all recent phones support GSM/GPRS/EDGE on any frequencies. Due to Qualcomm vs. Broadcomm patent lawsuits, they had to stop using universal amplifiers for 3G around 2006, hence most modern phones only support WCDMA/UMTS frequencies that they have individual amplifiers for.
I think it's not HTC specific, any vendors using Qualcomm MSM basebands are doing this as well. So the bottomline is - in most cases it's a hardware issue. In some rare cases (when universal or multi-frequency WCDMA amplifier is installed) frequencies are disabled in software. I can't recall any HTC device that would have this kind of software only limitation.

Wow Very informational posts
Thanks Guys!!!
Hey I'm an old (ancient pre-Intel <BG>) micro hacker
but fairly new to phones. I'm currently very happy with
my cooked AT&T Pure/TopAz with the Tess Leo 1 Rom
I've had most every model of HP IpAQ upto the 4700s
So the PPC side is pretty comfortable for me.
I'm an old programmer with EE background
But really ready to try and get my teeth into the radio side
of phones just trying to understand enough to make some
resonable qualitative and quantitative benchmarks on some these radios
Maybe more to the point is understand if so and so's great looking nice
new task bar should and is properly displaying "3G" or "H" or ?)
But its been hard sorting the Euro vs US and GSM vs CMRS
Phone info.
Can anyone suggest a good "newbie guide" ? or any source of info
(I kinda hate the term "for dummies" but.... )
to the radio end, signal strength, band, networks etc ?
Sorry if this has been asked a million times or its only "two posts" away
but the amount of info here is great! but the s/n is NOT so great <BG>
Thanks Alot
Kenn Lynch
Hey is there a spell checker in this xda forum?
my apologies
I love my phone

if you are on a pc most internet browsers these days got their own spellchecker

Spell check thanks
You know its amazing what some people consider "most" Web Browsers
I was thinking "largest" web browser (Internet Explorer 8.XX on XP)
Spell checking is not natively included, so all my checking has been with
local docs or remotely using the web pages own checker for web based mail and forums.
So I started thinking no wonder this guys name starts with "Rude"
But I looked around and there is a free plug-in for IE called ieSpell.
I seldom bother with the other browsers so I can't say if
spell checking is included right "out of the box" in them either.
but I just installed ieSpell here and it hyphenated "plug-in" nice and easy
Thanks
when you are right you are right
Guess you can teach and old dog <BG>
KJL

use all 700MHZ lte phones on any network

OK, we all know about Verizon using lower spectrum and AT&T using upper spectrum of 700MHZ but i could never understand how HARDWARE WISE they can make a radio that would only support such a thing, I am under impression that it is the software optimized for using either upper or lower spectrum and if block the other half. I just read how flashing correct radio enabled AT&T GALAXY NOTE to be used on t-mobile, i am not an expert nor i have resources, but has anyone attempted to flash verizon radio on at&t phone or vice versa and see if phone is actually capable of running on both networks? Please explain me if there is any flow in my understanding or is it actually feasible? would be great to break monopoly of at&t and Verizon over their LTE phones even though they utilize same 700MHZ band.

nakamoniel said:
OK, we all know about Verizon using lower spectrum and AT&T using upper spectrum of 700MHZ but i could never understand how HARDWARE WISE they can make a radio that would only support such a thing, I am under impression that it is the software optimized for using either upper or lower spectrum and if block the other half. I just read how flashing correct radio enabled AT&T GALAXY NOTE to be used on t-mobile, i am not an expert nor i have resources, but has anyone attempted to flash verizon radio on at&t phone or vice versa and see if phone is actually capable of running on both networks? Please explain me if there is any flow in my understanding or is it actually feasible? would be great to break monopoly of at&t and Verizon over their LTE phones even though they utilize same 700MHZ band.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Certain chipsets with an integrated radio/modem support multiple bands. Like you said, in the case of the Note, XDA devs were able to flash a different modem that told the radio to tune to a different frequency that it supported. Same with the Skyrocket, and, if the T-Mobile SII had an LTE mode, that would have worked too. But not all chipsets can do multiple frequencies on one chip.

Well you'll have a problem of dealing with a CDMA phone trying to run on a GSM network primarily. I think Verizon's system has to verify you're on their primary CDMA network then allow you to connect to their LTE network. Where as an AT&T phone would just connect you to their GSM and then it bumps up to LTE. My speculation is that if you connect a Verizon World Phone with LTE on AT&T with the correct radio it MIGHT work. But it won't work the other way around as AT&T's phones don't have CDMA (which is used to verify and connect you to the LTE network)

ChpStcksRlz said:
Well you'll have a problem of dealing with a CDMA phone trying to run on a GSM network primarily. I think Verizon's system has to verify you're on their primary CDMA network then allow you to connect to their LTE network. Where as an AT&T phone would just connect you to their GSM and then it bumps up to LTE. My speculation is that if you connect a Verizon World Phone with LTE on AT&T with the correct radio it MIGHT work. But it won't work the other way around as AT&T's phones don't have CDMA (which is used to verify and connect you to the LTE network)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You will never get a CDMA phone to work on a GSM network or vice versa (aside from global CDMA phones with SIM slots for GSM roaming). LTE phones on Verizon use a their own authentication that's separate from their CDMA-only 3G phones. With the LTE phones, there is no ESN/MEID associated with the device; it's the SIM that is authenticated and then the phone attached to it can use it to transmit and receive data, texts, and calls.
But that's besides the fact; CDMA and GSM are more than just frequencies; they're two different methods on how a phone communicates with towers. CDMA is Code Division Multiple Access, and GSM is based off of TDMA, which is Time Divided Multiple Access. It's kind of like saying, because two people are Chinese, they will both speak one dialect, which in fact there are two; Mandarin (GSM) and Cantonese (CDMA) which are similar but different.

Product F(RED) said:
You will never get a CDMA phone to work on a GSM network or vice versa (aside from global CDMA phones with SIM slots for GSM roaming). LTE phones on Verizon use a their own authentication that's separate from their CDMA-only 3G phones. With the LTE phones, there is no ESN/MEID associated with the device; it's the SIM that is authenticated and then the phone attached to it can use it to transmit and receive data, texts, and calls.
But that's besides the fact; CDMA and GSM are more than just frequencies; they're two different methods on how a phone communicates with towers. CDMA is Code Division Multiple Access, and GSM is based off of TDMA, which is Time Divided Multiple Access. It's kind of like saying, because two people are Chinese, they will both speak one dialect, which in fact there are two; Mandarin (GSM) and Cantonese (CDMA) which are similar but different.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
some CDMA+LTE devices can be used with other carriers even with the different authentication, carriers that barely have 1X cdma coverage. the conversion of the MEID to pESN is done with a different method that is of course if the DEC MEID can be retrieved, not the HEX MEID.

nakamoniel said:
OK, we all know about Verizon using lower spectrum and AT&T using upper spectrum of 700MHZ but i could never understand how HARDWARE WISE they can make a radio that would only support such a thing, I am under impression that it is the software optimized for using either upper or lower spectrum and if block the other half. I just read how flashing correct radio enabled AT&T GALAXY NOTE to be used on t-mobile, i am not an expert nor i have resources, but has anyone attempted to flash verizon radio on at&t phone or vice versa and see if phone is actually capable of running on both networks? Please explain me if there is any flow in my understanding or is it actually feasible? would be great to break monopoly of at&t and Verizon over their LTE phones even though they utilize same 700MHZ band.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hardware wise it's damn easy to make a radio that doesn't support the upper/lower part of the band - just use a narrower frontend filter.
In fact, doing the opposite is hard - having wideband support without compromising the performance of your bands of primary interest is extremely difficult. Filtering out the "don't care" part of the 700 MHz band can improve RF performance in the "do care" part.
Product F(RED) said:
Certain chipsets with an integrated radio/modem support multiple bands. Like you said, in the case of the Note, XDA devs were able to flash a different modem that told the radio to tune to a different frequency that it supported. Same with the Skyrocket, and, if the T-Mobile SII had an LTE mode, that would have worked too. But not all chipsets can do multiple frequencies on one chip.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, they didn't do anything to tune a different frequency. AT&T also uses AWS1700 for LTE - all they did was change modulation mode for an already supported band.

EVDO logins does not need to verify the ESN/MEID.
See http://shadowmite.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=3319
not sure about LTE

I see thread being carried away in different direction, I understand how it used to be completely ESN based, but trust me on new LTE phones it doesnt matter, i have popped sim card into many lte devices without registering with verizon what so ever, Also both at&t and verizon phones have hardware radio built in that supports 700MHZ so that is out of question as well, Hence I would like to draw attention of everyone specially DEV's, to target the real question, is it software based solution where they have tuned radio only to support perticular upper or lower band making them carrier specific? and if so flashing verizon radio on at&t phone or at&t radio on verizon phone make it compatible with each other? IF ANYONE OUT THERE WITH RESOURCES AND knowledge of radios can try this theory, it would open infinite gates of new possibilities ( AND GIVE US ALL AN OPPORTUNITY TO SCALE UP OUR LOVE-HATE RELATIONSHIP WITH ATT-VERIZON BASTARD ).
p.s. I appreciate sharing your concerns/understanding anyways, not trying to underscore your comments, just trying to get things moving in right direction.

Thanks, its kind of answer I was looking for to verify my doubt on whether it would be possible by software tweak to enable phones work on other networks, however my speculation is that there is a huge probability that some MODELS did not bother making this changes (e.g. motorola since they do not produce phones for at&t anyways or quite oppositely HTC which makes LTE phone for both att & verizon) and simply had software tweaks in place to avoid phones on other networks, IF SO it should be as simple of radio files swap as what other guy did to samsung tab. Please correct me if i am still wrong.
Entropy512 said:
Hardware wise it's damn easy to make a radio that doesn't support the upper/lower part of the band - just use a narrower front end filter.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

nakamoniel said:
Thanks, its kind of answer I was looking for to verify my doubt on whether it would be possible by software tweak to enable phones work on other networks, however my speculation is that there is a huge probability that some MODELS did not bother making this changes (e.g. motorola since they do not produce phones for at&t anyways or quite oppositely HTC which makes LTE phone for both att & verizon) and simply had software tweaks in place to avoid phones on other networks, IF SO it should be as simple of radio files swap as what other guy did to samsung tab. Please correct me if i am still wrong.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Samsung tab? Are you talking about the AT&T Galaxy Note? In that case, that was changing modulation modes in the same band. (AT&T also uses the 1700 MHz AWS band for LTE. So it's easy to just change that over to HSPA+ for T-Mo compatibility.)
I would not be surprised if Moto has narrower frontent filters, that may be part of the secret to their supposedly superior radio performance. (Rejecting unnecessary bands can greatly improve reception of the bands you care about.)

[Q] SM-G900F (belgium) 4G possibility in USA?

Hi guys, i have an S5 bought unlocked in belgium, europe. I had 4G in europe but in the United States it only receives H+. I checked the supported bandwidths with tmobile usa, two of the bands tmobile uses are in fact also supported by my phone (1800 & 1900) yet still it doesnt work. APN setting are already checked and confirmed correct. Sim card is brand new.
Since it still doesn't work, is there a way to flash a USA rom or upgrade something technical so i can get 4G? I would hate to have to buy a new phone again, i just bought this 4weeks ago thinking it would work globally
Thanks again for recommending the best possible option for me at this point...

Most of your questions here were posed and answered in your other thread.
Your 900F model phone is intended for use in a different country. TMobile uses a 900T model. The main difference between the two is that they support a different set of frequency bands. So just like roaming you could use your 900F phone on TMB, but there will be gaps in coverage. You will be subject to more congestion and dropped calls. And in smaller centers where a limited number of frequencies are in use, you may have no coverage at all.
If you never get LTE in a major center on your unlocked 900F, the first thing to check is that you have a LTE capable SIM and that your carrier i.e. TMB has provisioned your account for LTE. And try installing the latest version of firmware for your phone.
No, you cannot simply flash a 900T firmware onto a 900F and have it transform into the other model. By design, Samsung doesn't allow this (to sell more phones and deter carrier churn). There is a hack to add the AWS band to some models. And several threads endeavoring to expand upon that. However they are nascent and would be best described as experimental, dangerous (a good chance of damaging your phone) and with uncertain results as of this date.
Unless you want to put your phone at risk to be a guinea pig, your options are to live with the imperfect coverage or buy a 900T model.
If you want to take a risk, then have a look at this thread. And here. Basically you could use QPST or mzTools 1.21.a to format an edit NV_RF_BC_CONFIG_l to enable additional LTE bands. Enable the parameters with QXDM, then do the actual write with QPST. And /or try writing a raw image of an LTE enabled variant e.g. 900T baseband to your 900F modem partition with the dd utility. This is experimental. It may do what you want or it may brick your phone.
.

ignore - double post

4G 900F in USA
Oké so turns out i am getting 4G just not LTE because of the state i am in. Thanks for trying but what i initially said was correct all S5s are global capable of 4G, just state dependant on the LTE band...

fffft said:
There is a hack to add the AWS band to some models. And several threads endeavoring to expand upon that. However they are nascent and would be best described as experimental, dangerous (a good chance of damaging your phone) and with uncertain results as of this date..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's not quite true. The chance of damaging the phone is extremely small if you follow the instructions.
The thread to unlock all GSM and LTE bands is here.

..

fffft said:
It is true when I'm not quoted out of context. And especially funny that you link to that particular thread to .. prove me wrong?
You didn't realize that the thread you linked to was also authored by me. Funny stuff.
.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How exactly is that out of context? What important piece of information did I leave out to distort your words? Call bs on that. But yeah I didn't notice that it was your thread I linked to , good job on that thread. :good:

SM-N910K stuck on 3G in Brazil

Ok, so i ordered a SM-N910U from 28mobile.com, and they sent me a carrier branded SM-n910K, which by its specifications should work with Brazilian LTE (band 7 - 2600). However I am stuck on 3g. I was wondering if maybe the whole internet is wrong and this device doesnt support this band, or maybe its some sort of carrier lock. Also, how do i disable the awful branding, will flash a different firmware work and which do i flash?
Thanks

repl0id said:
Ok, so i ordered a SM-N910U from 28mobile.com, and they sent me a carrier branded SM-n910K, which by its specifications should work with Brazilian LTE (band 7 - 2600). However I am stuck on 3g. I was wondering if maybe the whole internet is wrong and this device doesnt support this band, or maybe its some sort of carrier lock. Also, how do i disable the awful branding, will flash a different firmware work and which do i flash?Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1) check frequencies that U model supports @ samsung website (its asian/hong kong, right? those miss some frequencieos)
2) check which frequencies are used for 4g by your brazilian telco.
3) compare.
if frequencies match, you might want to try:
1) getting a new sim that is surely 4g-capable
2) getting an iphone nano-sim. this is crazy, but for many users in russian forums that has solved 4g connectivity issues with one telco.
3) making sure your plan supports 4g
4) ensure you have 4g coverage.

lisbon2004 said:
1) check frequencies that U model supports @ samsung website (its asian/hong kong, right? those miss some frequencieos)
2) check which frequencies are used for 4g by your brazilian telco.
3) compare.
if frequencies match, you might want to try:
1) getting a new sim that is surely 4g-capable
2) getting an iphone nano-sim. this is crazy, but for many users in russian forums that has solved 4g connectivity issues with one telco.
3) making sure your plan supports 4g
4) ensure you have 4g coverage.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1) Sim is 4g
2)will try
3) IT does
4) I do
Is the SM-N910U the same as the SM-N910K as far as LTE bands go? I dont get it, they are both supposed to support Band 7 - 2600MHZ, which is the one we have over here. What about flashing a different firmware? I've been trying with odin, to no success.

They do support that frequency so it's probably something to do with your sim card or carrier?
And 28mobile told me I was receiving one model only to get the k model like you. Wasn't happy. The updates for firmwares are slow

lawtq said:
They do support that frequency so it's probably something to do with your sim card or carrier?
And 28mobile told me I was receiving one model only to get the k model like you. Wasn't happy. The updates for firmwares are slow
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, I am on a LTE plan, tried 3 different sims already, they are all stuck on 3G...And all our carriers have the same band, which is 7...So it's not the sim or the carrier...its the phone. I bet that there's some sort of lock going on, since all roaming options are grayed out (the phone is not stuck on roaming, however). I am trying to flash any other model's firmware, like U, C and even S, but odin always fails when trying.

repl0id said:
Ok, so i ordered a SM-N910U from 28mobile.com, and they sent me a carrier branded SM-n910K, which by its specifications should work with Brazilian LTE (band 7 - 2600). However I am stuck on 3g. I was wondering if maybe the whole internet is wrong and this device doesnt support this band, or maybe its some sort of carrier lock. Also, how do i disable the awful branding, will flash a different firmware work and which do i flash?
Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When you ordered the "U"-model, and got a branded "K"-model, I would complain to the shop you bought it and demand a swap to the model you ordered!

Shall I switch A2107G to USA bands?

Hi there. I live in Canada and use A2017G. How to switch it to USA bands and is it safe to do? Or should I wait for Oreo (seems like November)?
Thanks

I think you are stuck with whatever bands that are hardcoded into the G. Probably has something to do with the baseband/radio/modem. I did find an article on XDA awhile back that claims you can add bands to your phone, but it seemed mostly suited toward Samsung. In any case, it doesn't really matter, a G model should still receive a minimum of 4G with most US carriers, but maybe not LTE. I'd imagine Canadian carriers are similar. But I do have to wonder, you live in North America, so why buy a G. The U is the variant that is designed for this region. And U has better support, ROMs, etc.

Maybe you can just flash the A2017U modem

ttkian said:
Maybe you can just flash the A2017U modem
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe you can avoid suggesting things you clearly have no idea about.
While you're at it, why don't you flash a modem from another phone?
---------- Post added at 05:53 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:51 AM ----------
evilKabab said:
Hi there. I live in Canada and use A2017G. How to switch it to USA bands and is it safe to do? Or should I wait for Oreo (seems like November)?
Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can't add bands that the phone doesn't have. By changing the daughterboard of an A2017U to an A2017's, a guy simply lost all connectivity, plain and simple. Antenna stuff is hardware stuff.
Oreo won't really add bands either

@Choose an username...: I have read other topics on XDA that say you can use QPST/QFIL to add basebands, on almost any device that has a Qualcomm CPU. But I havent tried this myself. It may just be a matter of placebo, or people wanting to believe that it works, when really nothing may be changing. You could also brick your phone during the attempt, which is part of the reason I havent tried yet.
I think that all A7s have nearly the same hardware, including the same (hardware) modem/radio, but with different basebands enabled/disabled depending on which model you have. But I have no proof of this. I will leave this to people that are willing to deeply dissect the hardware.
And then there are the modem files you can flash, which vary according to your model. I am not sure what would happen if you attempt to flash a A2017G/A2017 modem on a A2017U (or any other combo). I think the worst you will face is a loss of Internet/text/phone calls.
When I first bought my A7 I was going to get the Chinese version from AliExpress, because it has more RAM, storage, and ForceTouch. But then I realized that it doesn't have most of the basebands that my carrier (T-Mobile) supports. And you never know where most of the AE sellers get the hardware, they could be stolen, preowned, whatever. I have bought numerous 'new' items there before, but they ranged in quality, ranging from brand new to fair condition. So I thought better of it and bought a new A2017U from NewEgg, complete with ZTE's Passport warranty and 3 years SquareTrade insurance. And I'm glad I did, since a few months ago I had to make use of that warranty to get my A7 unbricked from DFU, before the tool was available.

I think only differences between A7 models are in processor i.e. bands. There are variants in SD 820.

AnonVendetta said:
... But then I realized that it doesn't have most of the basebands that my carrier (T-Mobile) supports.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We're in the same boat... My carrier using AWS bands just like T-MO. A2017G was working perfectly fine maybe missing just one band on LTE. And recently new band was introduced - LTE band 13 (700mhz), which supposed to improve indoor reception - big issue for Axon 7 and AWS. They call it 'Extended Rabge LTE.
So A2017U has that band, but A2017G doesnt. My assumption was that both phones are sharing the same hardware and bands available are controlled by software.
I clicked some numbers and got into some engineering menu where I see choices: USA Bands, Cellular 800. So I picked USA and restarted.
EPIC FAIL!
I lost 3g AWS on SIM1! Only 4G present, which is actually working fine. Just imagine phone with perfect 4G connectivity internet is flying, but you cannot place a phone call... (My carrier - Freedom Mobile doesnt have 2G GSM). I tried to switch it back - no luck
Solution - I use SIM2.

Oreo
Just installed it no OTA had to use sd card. That actually fixed SIM1 band problem. It doesnt seem I have band 13 (that is what I wanted), but connectivity seems better and switching between 3g and 4g is very fast...